One of the few critics out of a handful of Israel allowed to speak in the US. Most loose their jobs and are banned from most media, which is a prime example of Jewish conspiracy within the United States.
Hamas is a great government who has a lot of human rights! pshh, BS! stop blaming Israel! there are 20+ arab countrie, 800X the size of israel. get over it
To look at the big picture. We are all enslaved by the Monetary System created by Zionists. Its not an Islam vs West problem, where again, Zionist media propoganda puts it but everyone is affected. The tool used within the monetary system to cage up is Interest ! Simple as that. If we free ourselves from this monetary system, politicians will be more inclined to act for the people and not the banks etc.
Zionists are very good in twisting words and lying.
ISRAEL was the name of a Prophet.
In the Quran, the old and the new testaments is often referred to the jews with "the sons of Israel" which basically means "the offsprings of the Prophet Israel", and not " the inhabitants of a land called "israel" "!
Zionists are very good in twisting words and lying.
ISRAEL was the name of a Prophet.
In the Quran, the old and the new testaments is often referred to the jews with "the sons of Israel" which basically means "the offsprings of the Prophet Israel", and not " the inhabitants of a land called "israel" "!
Zionists are very good in twisting words and lying.
ISRAEL was the name of a Prophet.
In the Quran, the old and the new testaments is often referred to the jews with "the sons of Israel" which basically means "the offsprings of the Prophet Israel", and not " the inhabitants of a land called "israel" "!
The word "Palestine"--"Palaestina" was first used by the Roman after they defeat Judea, which was a Jewish state in Eretz Yisrael. The romans used this word to try & erase the memory of the independent Jewish kingdoms of Yisrael and Yehuda--but the truth is the name was never used by the people of the country until recent. It is very nice if the local Arab want to use this name, that's their right, but the words Yisrael, Yisraeli, etc..are much older than "Palestine", "Palestinian"
I'm afraid not, Said! Unfortunately, most of the sane people think that you're an utter prat! Ask them who they'd prefer to meet: Edward Said or the man, who cleans out the public toilets in Aberdeen, and they'd go for Wee Jock "Poo-Pong" McPlop every time.
GamZul or F O of So called zionist entity, I wondered why U R so busy False-fying things as 0% PALESTINIANS in 1880 In PALESTINE, the Country and state of Christian Jesus As Egypt is the Land of the Jewish Mosses, David, Soluman & Jacob=Isreal "My Gog be Plessed with
Yes, 0% Palestinians lived here in 1880...because the country was all part of the Ottoman Turkish empire control in these times, so the local arabs (and also most of the local jews) were Ottomans at this time. The first time that people became "Palestinians" here was 1917, and the Jews living here also was "Palestinians" at that time--but this is only because the British decided to use the name "Palestine" for their territory. But the days of "Palestine" ended in 1948.
what a load of crap. the palestinians including my own family have lived in palestine dating back from before the crusades. the zionist lie you echo no longer washes.
You have a bad reading comprehension. I never said Arabs never resided within the areas of Eretz Yisrael before 1917-- I said "Palestinians", never resided here, because the country was our officially called "Palestine" before the British took these areas from the Turk in 1917. Before that the Arabs who lived here were known by various names, whether it was their hamoula, or just Arabs, or sometimes they called themselves Syrians.
The country wasnt called Palestine officially and the people who lived here were not Palestinians. My own family has lived here for many generations. My father's generation was the only generation that was called "Palestinian" because he was born here in 1932-after the time the British named this land "Palestine" But his mother was born here when the Turks was here, and she wasn't born "Palestinian". Nobody was before 1917. "Palestinians" was just the people living here between 1917-1948!
If your family really lived here before 1917--they were not Palestinians--they were just Ottoman citizens. There was no sha3b falastini--nobody knew what that was--until the 1960s! Maybe your family was members of the Arab nation who lived here, just like my family was members of the Jewish nation who lived here, but there never was such a thing as a Palestinian People for your family to be a part of until it was invented in the 1960s.That's what I mean when I say there was no Palestinians.
"We kept the civilian bodycount very low--only about 300..."
"...I am fully in my right to shoot them dead. I don't care if this is a woman or a child."
"The civilians of Gaza should be grateful to us that we allow any food and medicine in. Truly, we are fools for not employing methodology that any sane country uses against terrorist threat...who dealt with finality against the Tamil terrorist, even though it cost many dead civilians "
"What would the Palestinians have to do for you to "trust" them with their own country?"
First, if a credible Palestinian leader can openly aknowledge that the Jewish people have a long history in the Land of Israel and a national right to self-determination, instead of only grumblingly admitting Israel exists, but wishing it go away, it can help. But failing that, they must completely renounce all terror, always, clean up the coruption in their midst, build a society of rule of law, etc.
Because israel has no legal claim to the still occupied territories, or am I mistaken?"
You are mistaken. In the case of Gaza, Israel totally relinquished control over this formerly Egyptian-occupied area to the PA, which was taken over by Hamas in Gaza. In the case of the West Bank (Yehuda & Shomron), Israel took it after being attacked by Jordan in 1967. As Jordan never controlled it as a legal sovereign power, the correct term is disputed territory.
You asked: "Do you belive that the jews are more entitled to the land then anyone else? If so, why?"
I have said, and I believe you saw where I clearly wrote that I, like most consensus opinion of Israelis, believe that there must be a 2-state solution and that Israel should make teritorial concessions to permit the local "Palestinian" Arabs to have sovereinty in there own state. Doesn't that answer your question?
"How can you consider 300 innocent lives to be a "low count?""
By any reasonable measur stick, it's a low count. Innocent civilian life lost is always lamentable, but is almost always unavoidable in war. When you compare Israel's action in Gaza last year to other recent conflicts, you see that Israel kept the civilian deathtoll on the other side low. Could it have been kept lower?...maybe--but would probably have elevated the risk and deathtoll of Israeli personnels. I can say this for fact.
vox: You quoted me saying "We kept the civilian bodycount very low--only about 300..."
It is a nasty FACT of war that civilians die. This cannot be avoided once you go to war. If you look at how we behave, compare it to other countries in armed conflicts, you see that IDF keeps the civilian bodycount LOW--look at Sri Lanka against the Tamils, look at the US Marines in Fallujah for recent examples, and these are democratic countries. For really high bodycounts, look at Arab countries and Africa.
You also quoted me--OUT OF CONTEXT (very clever deleting) saying "... I am fully in my right to shoot them dead. I don't care if this is a woman or a child" Must I paste again the rest of what I wrote? Okay: If I "order somebody to halt at a checkpoint during a combat operation, AND THEY KEEP WALKING TOWARDS ME, (emphasis added) I am fully in my right to shoot them dead. I don't care if this is a woman or a child. My life and my soldiers' lives come first.
Give me your Name Rank and Number and all details of War Crimes committed such as the one you outlined about shooting an unarmed civilian I will forward details to the Hague for possible War Criminal charges against you alongside your Zionist Der Fuhrer Benjamin Netenyahu(hopefully Goldstone will be the Prosecutor)
After all he is a Jew and a Zionist so you cannot acuse him of being "anti-semitic". Try to think of a more convincing excuse than "I was only obeying orders". LOL!!!
I never shot an unarmed civilian to my knowledge but if someone does not stop when approaching an unarmed checkpoint during a wartime situation, when an order is relayed in CLEAR ARABIC, by a native-Arabic-speaking Druze IDF soldier and keeps on advancing towards your position--the only reasonable assumption to make is that they intend to harm you, and you must eliminate this threat as quickly as possible-this has happened much in the past . Better to live and regret than be dead.
I don't believe you! Hundreds of people in Gaza have been killed many unarmed civilians waving the white flag and shot in the back. Palestinian fishermen and farmers are being killed deliberately by Israeli snipers all the time. There is a shoot to kill policy in the IDF of unarmed civilians by dehumanising all Palestinians as terrorists. You have spent at least 3 years in the IDF. Now tell me the truth even if you didn't commit war crimes you must have witnessed them or turned a blind eye.
I've never witnessed any warcrimes. I have heard second or third-hand accounts, such as the ones published in the media that you are hysterical about, about cases where civilians were killed or injured, but even with those you cannot be sure what the soldiers knew or didnt know in that moment.
So you admit you have heard about them, perhaps from your colleagues! What did you do as part of the IDF, man checkpoints, does it give you a feeling of power to humiliate people forcing them to stand for hours on end at a checkpoint preventing them going to school or hospital or work for no reason, you could kill someone with total impunity and claim like you said it was self defence.
"So you admit you have heard about them, perhaps from your colleagues!""
No I hear about them from the same source you hear about them, the Shovrim Shtika (Breaking silence) that were all over the news. A lot of 2nd, 3rd-hand stories, and upon examination nothing you can say is a real war crime--for example, the orders to stay off rooftops, because airforce will think you are a sniper and shoot. These orders were given to us too--"do not go on the roof under any circumstances. "
"What did you do as part of the IDF, man checkpoints,"
Sure I manned checpoints, I still do when I get called for reserve duty
" does it give you a feeling of power to humiliate people forcing them to stand for hours on end at a checkpoint preventing them going to school or hospital or work for no reason,"
No it give me a feeling of being bored out of my mind doing this tedioum, because I gotta be there hours on end but I know I'm doing it for a good reason, to keep murderers out of our country
"There is a shoot to kill policy in the IDF of unarmed civilians by dehumanising all Palestinians as terrorists."
Maybe if terrorists wore uniform and fought away from civilian populations, it can make our job alot easier to guarantee we only kill terrorists and never harm any innocent! You always assume as a soldier operating in a theater where you cannot easily distinguish between hostile and civilian, that people approaching you are "hostile" and take means to protect yourself and your men.
You are free to call yourself "Palestinian", but unless you were born here between 1917-1948, you can't possibly have been born in any entity called "Palestine"--that's the name the British bestowed on my country, ISRAEL, during that time. Before 1917, it was Ottoman-controlled and there was no "Palestine". My father is a Jew who was born here in 1932, so I guess he can say he was born in Palestine, but his mother was born here in 1907, so she was certainly not born in "Palestine"!
If your american passport says you're born in "Palestine" it probably means you were born here between 1917 & 1948 when the British gave the country this name --but I don't think you're so old--or maybe if you're born in Palestinian Authority-controlled areas of the West Bank/Gaza between 1993 and the present it says "Palestinian Authority"--"Palestinian Authority"--not "Palestine". It is a key difference. Palestinian Authority is a legal entity, but not a state.
But between 1967 and 1993 Arabs who hold US passports and were born in the disputed territorys--it says on their US passports--if for exampel they'r born in Ramalla, it says in the US passport --"West Bank", if they're born in Gaza, it just says "Gaza"--but not "Palestine"
Look closer at your US pasport next time, sweety-- it probably says, "Palestinian Authority", not "Palestine" unless you are lying completely.
"back during the ottoman empire, everyone was ottoman, however, the empire had its small sattes one of them was called palestine."
No. In the 500 years that the Ottoman Empire controled the land that was always historically called "Eretz Yisrael" by Jews, and only recently as "Palestine" by Arabs, they never referred to it as "Palestine", "Filastin", etc. It was part of the vilayets of Damascus, then later Saida and Beirut, and then subdivided into sanjak regions. And defintely no "state".
"before sharing what you have, you have to make sure you're NOT making things up as u go... how about u look it up okay? :) "
How about YOU look it up? There was never any state called "Palestine", nope. The British foreign rulers called our land Palestine between 1917-'48, but that was no state. The Ottoman foreign rulers never even used this word from 1517-1917. Now, I hope the local Arabs make their own state, they can call it Palestine, MickeyMouseland, whatever, just keep it out of Israel!
Pay attention. There was no "state" called "Palestine". Not in the sense of it being an independent sovereign state, nor in the sense of it even being an administrative unit of another state, such as the Ottoman state. The Ummayads briefly referred to one military district as "jund Filastin", but that was not coterminous with any state. The EUROPEANS, such as those who wrote Baedekkers guides referred to the region as "Palestine". Not the locals, neither the Jewish locals nor Arab locals.
ShmorgelBorgel, There was no state called India until modern time either. Did that mean those people in now Indian never lived there? The people who are called Palestinianins have hhistorically lived there and that's a historical fact. Only a freak would argue about that fact.
Where did you see me argue that Arabs have historically lived here for many centuries? I did argue against the counter-historical nonsense that there was a "Palestinian" state or nation here in the past and I clearly stated that I support the creation of a state for the local Arabs, to be called "Palestine" or any other funny name they fancy, as long as it does not threaten or endanger the rights of the Jews to self-determination living in sovereign Israel, which is a Jewish state.
As I said, it's peachy if the local Arabs, who never historically had an identity as "Palestinian" but adopted the term recently--want to call themselves "Palestinian" (or any other invented term)--that's just great. The local Arabs have that right to adopt that term, they even have the right to self-determination AS LONG AS as it doesn't threaten OUR country, Israel, but they don't have the right to invent history.If you want to call yourselves "Palestinian", t'fadalu, just don't make stuff up!
them all ", its was the other way around Just read N. G Finkelstien Chapter in E. Said book "Blaming the Victimes". [Z]ionism difinition is the multi-national Killing Mafia Hired & smugled by the British Army, the TRUE Founding god of the zionist colony in occuped PALESTINE. 4 Ur Lies about Population statistics go 2 the British Army records and see if any of the Milosovichs &
Karagetichs of PALESTINE were their, Like Polish Copral D.Gorien Later Ben Gurion Or shimon Perski later Peretz Or Iranians Ex MAFIA malister so-called Ex president & Mofaz the Criminals Or Ukranian Assasinators experts Barak & Olmert & The Romanian British trained in South African Aparthied Shamir, and the count-less discrimenated againist Arab
Jews (Iraqi Moroccan & Yameni & Atheopian) I could go on and on about ur crimes from Dier Yassen (254) of 1948 to GAZA the Zionist Bigest ever concentration camp Hitler is proud of, not 2 mention the 9/11 Sabra and and Shatila in Lebanon with about 3000 Palestinain Murdred and the count Less injeries and Raped women and Children Just ask lawer Micheal Cohen of Califorinia about it, not 2 mention Jenine masacare 2002 of
the Plish Sharon and Taberia Lud, Ramla Yafa (Jafa) ethnic Cleansing of 1947, read what the israeli Illan Pape book Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine, Or read the manual of racism "Jewish History " by Israel Shahak , Finally Smitism from Sam Son of Noah who lived in Iraq Befor any religion , it has nothing 2 do with Jewish or Muslims, so stop spining anti-Smitism and The holocaust like Motcarlo Casino as Norman Finkilstien Said in his book "the Holocaust Industry"
The Ugly Face of genocidal Israel, Outpost of Squatters is revealed
ISRAEL-the-SQUATTER have been slaughtering the natives of Palestine for over 60 yrs & keep inventing different ways to Blame the Victim
08-09 ISRAELI massacre slaughtered un-armed helpless civilians, more than half women & children, trapped In locked borders. 1400 slaughtered instantly, 5,500 left wounded / dying in agony
When eleven Israeli Olympians were killed by the Palestinian organization Black September in Munich 1972, Sartre opposed those in France who thought that was an intolerable scandal. That does not prevent the "reasonable academic" E. Said to declare in a interview that "Sartre, for example, was very Zionist." What about intellectual honesty, E. Said?
Golda Meir never made the quote you attribute to her--but Ben Gurion wrote part of what you wrote, but you leave out the rest--"I don't understand your optimism. Why should the Arabs make peace? If I were an Arab leader I would never make terms with Israel. That is natural: we have taken their country. Sure, God promised it to us, but what does that matter to them? Our God is not theirs. We come from Israel, it's true, but two thousand years ago, and what is that to them? "
The rest of Ben Gurion's quote--""They only see one thing: we have come here and stolen their country. Why should they accept that? They may perhaps forget in one or two generations' time, but for the moment there is no chance. So, it's simple: we have to stay strong and maintain a powerful army. Our whole policy is there. Otherwise the Arabs will wipe us out."
This only shows Ben Gurion was a great leader, with the ability to view the other side position. Sadly, Arabs don't have such empathy
Empathy? That sounds like something the former apartheid regime of South Africa would say. Empathy certainly does not apply to the Palestinians, who the Israelis routinely bulldoze their homes and make them refugees, who are treated as subhuman and inferior, have to carry id cards and wait for hours at checkpoints, live in rubble and garbage, while the israelis take their homes...empathy?
"if palestinians did a mass conversion to judaism, will the conflict end?"
Who wants them to do mass conversion to Judaism? Jews, unlike Christians or Muslims, do not arrogantly wish to impose our religion on outsiders. The conflict can end if the Arab world accepts the essential historical justice and reality of the Jewish nation to have independence in its homeland. We in turn agree for compromise and to let a small additional state for the local Arabs in addition to the 22 other Arab countrys
You said following:I don't accept the propaganda that there is an ancient Palestinian people as long as you have this idea, I do not believe I could reason with you. Shalom!
Empathy? That sounds like something the former apartheid regime of South Africa would say. Empathy certainly does not apply to the Palestinians, who the Israelis routinely bulldoze their homes and make them refugees, who are treated as subhuman and inferior, have to carry id cards and wait for hours at checkpoints, live in rubble and garbage, while the israelis take their homes...empathy?
Yeah, the BenGurion quote reflects total empathy, as well as pragmatic realism. I am from a family that is traditionally voted for Herut (Jabotinksy & Begin) but I recognise we had a great leader with BG and he got our country for us. The quote shows he recognised that the Arabs wont accept the reality of a free Jewish country in what they think is therie exclusive land and was prepared to deal with that for that time. I am of course always hoping that this attitude will change, I am optimist!
There are no differences between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. We are all part of one nation. It is only for political reasons that we carefully underline our Palestinian identity....yes, the existence of a separate Palestinian identity serves only tactical purposes. The founding of a Palestinian state is a new tool in the continuing battle against Israel. - late military commander of the PLO as well as member of the PLO Executive Council, Zuhair Muhsin
There is no legitimacy to israel. There is no ONE jewish people, Jews are from Russia, through out Europe and America. They are not a people, so they do not deserve a land. Palestinians have lived in the area for centuries. Jews are colonial imports.
We are a people, we originate from here (my own family has been here for many centuries) and we have always had a national consciousness and you have no say in the matter--simply, you and people like you don't get to decide this. The Arabs must deal with the fact and reality of a Jewish state.The Jews who don't wish to be part of the Jewish people and remain in Diaspora countries like America will intermarry and fade out of our nation-but they have the choice to live as free Jews in their land.
"Jews are from Russia, through out Europe and America. "
A plurality of Israel's Jewish population (including half of my own family) are Jews that have never left the Middle East, unlike the Ashkenazim, who are also originally from the Middle East but lived in Christian Europe for generations. But in any case, Mizrahi-Sefardi Jews like me are more than 50% of the population here. We all intend to stay here.
A majority of Jews are not native born at all. They are European imports, like most colonies.
Oh, I know you intend to stay here. Considering the way you slaughter the indigenous people, it is quite evident how committed Jews are to preserving "peace".
Actually, at this point, about 70% of our population is indeed native-born--although it is true that only about 40% of Israelis go back more than three generations. In any case, most of us indeed are from the region and only a minority of us are descended from European Jews (and even the European Jews are also from here); yet to hear people like you, all of us are from Europe. Bear in mind that the local Arab residents of our country also have diverse roots from many different lands.
Please allow me to refresh the memory of the reasers here, that as their name clearly indicates Arabs originate from Arabia, neiher from Israel nor from Philistine. Hence, they are not indigenous people in Israel but colonists. Moreover, the arab colonialism is in fact one who has not suffered decolonisation, unlike the European one, apart in the Jewish homeland. Where the kabyles, the Chaldeens or the Kurds failed but we succeeded. So much so that most African people took Zionism as a model.
"s their name clearly indicates Arabs originate from Arabia...they are not indigenous people in Israel but colonists"
With respect, I think its oversimplifying. Some of the local Arabs have ancient roots here, others not. Regardless how long they are here, or if there historcally is something called a "Palestinian People" (I beleive historicaly speaking theres no such thing), now it exists.
So, no I don't accept the propaganda that there is an ancient Palestinian people, but I accept the reality that one exists today--and I respect that many of the Arabs who live here have an attachment to the land, whether their families came here 1000 years ago, or only 70 years ago. If truly-- theyre ready to accept internally the fact that the Jewish nation has a historical tie here, that we deserve the right to our state and ^WE ARE STAYING^-- there can be peace. But it's a big IF.
You seem educated and very knowledgeable, but your logic does not add up. Im from Jordan and as of 100 years ago there were no Jordanians, and my people inhabited this land for thousands of years. So if Jordan gets occupied by a foreign entity, this foreign entity could use your logic and that there were no Jordanians 70 years ago
....The same rule applies to the Palestinians, they lived there as long as the Mizrakhim Jews and they both have equal claims to the land. What youre doing is hurting your cause, you simply cannot erase people from history!! Shalom
"What youre doing is hurting your cause, you simply cannot erase people from history!"
I dont want to erase anybody from histroy, I accept that many Arabs here have deep roots in this country-and they started to idetify as "Palestinian". What I say I disagree with is the lie that they existed as a "Palestinian nation" in the past. I am also not against them to have a state next to my Jewish state--but that state mustnt pose a threat to us. If they can prove it not a threat, then no problem!
"Palestinians have lived in the area for centuries. Jews are colonial imports."
Some of the local Arabs who reside here (who, recently, in the past few decades adopted the European word "Palestinians" as a demonym) indeed do trace their roots here 1000s of years. Many other local Arabs arrived during the Arab conquest, or from the Balkans during Turkish times, or from Zanzibar and Sudan, or from Syria and Iraq during the British Mandate. They owe their newfound national identity to Zionism.
Palestine as the NAME of a Country 'denotes' that Native Palestinians Live there. Just like America has Native Americans, and Italian Americans, Irish Americans, African Americans, there should also be Polish Palestinians, German Palestinians, African Palestinians, and Irish Palestinians... It's Still Called PALESTINE for crying out loud!! Geeze!!,
"just want them to make peace with each other." You make it sound as if each side is equally culpable. That is dishonest. One side is the oppressor, one the oppressed. One side has one of the most powerful militaries in the world, the other has no military at all.
The Jews of Germany and Nazi-occupied Europe never made demands for Germany to stop existing or to cede territorys to them. The minority population of Jews in Germany never demanded that Germany give up its German identity. The crux of the problem is that Arabs in toto deny the Jewish nation's right to continued freedom and secure borders in our own homeland, even after we have generously allocated to the local Arab community here (so called "Palestinian") some territories and self governance.
Do you think the Arabs of Gaza are poorer than Darfur refugees?! I saw some posh houses recently in Gaza a few months ago---I saw a lot of nice furniture, full-stocked kitchen. They are not doing so bad.
untill it gets bull dozed.. there are million people living in the gaza strip in which at its widest it is 16 km wide. They have no freedom of movment and are obstructed from obtaining medical and food resources via economic blockade. half there population are 15 or younger.
There will be no reason to bulldoze any Arab's house in Gaza or anywhere else if it is not a threat to an Israeli citizen, such as being used for weapons storage or for sheltering terrorists. We don't just pick Arab houses randomly to destroy them for no reason at all. I am a reservist soldier in IDF and I was participate in the Gaza operation. We invaded in December because they never stopped firing rockets on our towns and the houses we destroyed while we were there were threats to us.
Don't be so naive. Even the Haaretz newspaper says that soldiers were out of line and soldiers even made shirts depicting the advocation of killing children and babies.
Haaretz is well known for printing the most negative assessments of the country's institutions. As a result of the Haaretz "T'-shirt" story, it was investigated and they found there were a few idiots who made the T-shirts. They were disciplined. As for the more serious allegations made by Haaretz, a week before, all the soldiers who claimed that later said, well, it was 2nd-hand info, they didn't witness anything with their own eyes. In other words, bullshit.
In any war, innocents get killed. We kept the civilian bodycount very low--only about 300 in Cast Lead, which I am proud to have participated in. But if I, as an IDF combat reservist soldier order somebody to halt at a checkpoint during a combat operation, and they keep walking towards me, I am fully in my right to shoot them dead. I don't care if this is a woman or a child. My life and my soldiers' lives come first. We have had soldiers killed by suicide bombers who looked like civilians.
If they shoot rockets into our country from territories we allow them to exercise control over, such as Gaza, then they have forfeited the right to self-governance and they must be neutralised. If they show responsibility and do not threaten us, in words or deeds, we will allow them their self-rule.
I accept the gratitude of the Arab residents of Gaza that we did not do to them what their fellow Arabs would have done (look up Assad and the town of Hama). Arabs are champions at killing Arabs.
If you occupy someone else's land, oppress and humiliate the people, and starve them while surrounding them with armed forces, you forfeit the moral right to make an argument here.
About other Arabs -- i don't need to look up what other Arabs do. Look in your own backyard. The conversation is about Israeli occupation and oppression, not about Arabs.
We ceased occupying Gaza completely in 2005 and we received rockets in return. We would have no need to impose heavy sanction on them if they did not shoot rockets at their civilian neighbors here. They do not have the right to shoot rockets into our country and not expect heavy retaliation, but they are quite fortunate we not use the heavy handed tactics of their fellow Arabs. We Jews are meek and hesitate to use a same methodology as Assad did. We should not be so meek in future.
So called "ceased occupation" is a myth. People react with rockets becasue of the sanctions. The Israeali army might have left Gaza but it still caging the people like amimals. No freedom of any sort.
If they condone behaviours such as sending rockets at their neighbours, then the Arab pop. of Gaza deserves to be caged.This is beastly behaviour, and correct and proper that they suffer sanctions. The civilians of Gaza should be grateful to us that we allow any food and medicine in. Truly, we are fools for not employing methodology that any sane country uses against terrorist threat, such as Sri Lanka, who dealt with finality against the Tamil terrorist, even though it cost many dead civilians
It's sad that the same Nazi victims have become ruthless themselves. People in Gaza are paying for the Nazis' crimes....how is that fair? Rockets are a result of the occupation. Remove the occupation, rockects will stop....Very simple yet you make sound like there is more to that. You can't fool us...this is not your land.
No, it's sad that we are not ruthless. If we would use ruthless means to eliminate terrorist threat, just like any normal nation does we would win! Instead we play silly games with our enemy and worry about image. I very much admire the bravery and determination of the SriLankan military to uproot Tamil terrorist threat, even if it means some civilian dead--they do not take account of the world opinion. They are not afraid to be ruthless when necessary and we in Israel must follow their example
"People in Gaza are paying for the Nazis' crimes....how is that fair? "
Please, enough with the nonsense. They are paying for sending rockets at their neighbors and electing a government that swears to eliminate a neighboring state. That is a crime. The Jewish state and the presence of the Jewish people in its own country has nothing to do with the Nazis. My own Jewish family has lived here for multiple generations. I am a Jewish native of Eretz Yisrael and descended from Jewish natives here.
Are you Ashkenazi or Mizrachim? In another word, are you superior or inferior because of your skin color? The Zionist Movement does not treat its own people fairly so I dont expect you to have any sympathy to the Arabs. Im for the security of Israel and Im against the Palestinian violent reaction but you have to understand that this reaction is a result of a military occupation. That simply is unacceptable!
Good point. So why in the history of Israel no Israeli Prime Minister or President was from Mizrachim background. The trend has been always that the Ashkinazis control the high positions in the Israel.
I should have said PM only. The president of Israel as we all know has no power and is useless when it comes to making policies. So the majority Mizrachis never had a PM?! Strange!!
I believe that Israel underwent a dramatic change before some 13 years when Until before some 13 years it was almost the custom that someone who took part in the creation of state was elected as prime minister.Netaniyahu was elected as a first prime minister who didnt took part in the creation of the state in 1996.However the generation which established a state(mostly ashkenazi) is gone and today there is no chance that anyone who was not born in Israel will be elected as prime minister.
Not exactly so that the President has no power here-he/she can dissolve Parliament, approve treaties, call for early elections, appoint judges, issue pardons etc. In many respect it is tradition that it's"figure Head" position, but not powerless, and they can exercise their own discretion. Also, except for PM, Mizrahi have held every other important political post here like I said, defense minister, foreign minister Head of Joint chiefs, etc.
Sorry, you are showing a lot of ignorance of the political system here, because yes, it's true so far there has been no Mizrahi PM (Yitzhak Mordekhai, Amir Peretz and Shaul Mofaz came close) but the way the system works here it's not like PM holds all the power in his hands & does what he wants. He can't move without the cabinet agreeing, the right coalition, and the cabinet has a lot of parties--and Mizrahi-majority political parties like Shas have a lot of power.
While it is correct to say that in the past there were unfair relationship of askhenazi minority toward the mizrachi majority This is far from being the issue today in Israel.
These inter-group tensions had more to do with political leanings than out racism. Also, in the Old Yishuv (I am from on my father's side from Old Yishuv Jews here) the Sephardim/Mizrahim were on the top, and they discriminated against the Ashkenazim in the Turkish times. But the old-time Mizrahim also quickly became part of the Zionist establishment. The Labour MAPAI establishment in the 1950s marginalized against new immigrants of all kinds of backgrounds,
Mozhe Katzav, Yitzhak Navon, and Dalia Itzik are all Mizrahi Jews and all have served as Israeli President. So far there has not yet been a Mizrahi PM every other powerful position in Israeli politic has been held by Mizrahi/Sefardi/North Africa Jews, such as foreign minister, economic minister, defense minister, etc. We even had a Druze guy as our acting presiden
"Are you Ashkenazi or Mizrachim? In another word, are you superior or inferior because of your skin color? "
I'm both Ashkenazi and Mizrahi/Sepharadi. You also make a strong error & show ignorance when you imply that being Mizrahi or Ashkenazi has to do with the skin colour. Many my Mizrahi cousins are lighter than a lot of my Ashkenazi relatives. In fact, I know many Arabs who are very light too, even lighter than a lot of Ashkenazi in my family, so what do you mean with the skin color comment?
By the way the Joan Peters book you talk about on your site has been prooved to be a complete fraud like the Elders of the Protocols of Zion! The Zionist state is becoming more and more like the Germany of the 1930s or South Africa by in the 1980s. It is becoming more racist and violent by the day as witnessed by the recent barbaric massacre in Gaza. I am stating facts, such a country has no place in the civilized world. Just listen to the great Edward Said on this video.
I never refered to the book of joan Peters sowely I refered to the evidence accepted by all scientists that the land of Israel had less than 200 000 people from 7th century till 1800. 90% of nowday arab towns are established after 1800. ''From time immemorial'' is far from being fraud as not a single fact wrriten in is being proved to be a fraud
Dear petersz98 The european form of antisemitism is a clear reaction of offended part of european society about Jewish intelligence and abilities. this includes the sky-high numbers of Jewish scientist in all posible fields.
Joan Peters overstated her case when she attempted to show that most of the Arabs residing in Eretz Yisrael or claiming descent from them were recent 20th migrants or descendants thereof. She claimed that this applied to the majority of the Arab-speaking residents of our country. Nevertheless, although she overstated the case that almost all came in the early 20th century, many did. Many more of the local Arabs migrated here during the Ottoman period as well.
Peters maybe erred by statung that "most" of the present-day Palestinian Arabs are from 20th century migrants, a substantial amount are. Others descended from migrants during the Ottoman period, others from the Arab conquest and others have even deeper roots here. That is ok, but it also contradicts the Arab propagandist account that the local Arabs have always been here. Moreover, a substantial portion of Israeli Jews (like yours truly) also can trace their ancestry here multiple generations.
In 1880 there only 10000 Jews in Palestine. So the vast majority of Jews are very recent at least Palestinians can claim far longer ancestory than you Zionists. Now your admitting that the Peters book has serious errors like I told you. Good! We are making progress!
Where did you ever see me champion Peters' book? But your stats are wrong. In the 1880s, Jewish population in Eretz Yisrael was about 25,000 (including my ancestors) about 10% of the population. However, "Palestinian" population was zero percent, because there was no population group in Eretz Yisrael circa 1880 that identified itself as "Palestinian". Additionally, the ruling government, the Ottomans, also did not identify the area as "Palestine". You are projecting current terms onto the past.
Well, the vast majority of Jews can all trace their history here, this is well proven through genetic studies, even if they lived in Exile throughout the Middle East and Europe. Additionally, very many, such as myself can also trace unbroken residence here several centuries. On my father's side, my earliest known ancestor has been here since at least the 1300s (but we may go back further). Some clown once told me that if that's true, that makes me "Palestinian". Haha! No thank you!
"at least Palestinians can claim far longer ancestory than you Zionists."
As I said, the local Arabs who recently adopted the name Palestinian are a diverse group, with multiple origins. Some trace their ancestry here thousands of years. Others arrived during the time of the Arab conquests 1300 years ago. Others descend from Balkan and African slaves brought by the Ottomans. Some came in the 20th century, during the British mandate. My family has been here longer than many "Palestinians"
The odds are that the vast majority of Palestinians have been there far longer than you "Israelis" unless you are descended from the native Arabic Jewish community which was very tiny like I said only 10000 in 1880.
While there is no neccessery for zionist to be a Jew I believe that there is no contradiction in a self-hating elements in Jewish society as well. The same exist among many other european nation as well
I believe that there is at least three different form of antisemitism today. Each have different roots evolution and topograpgy
Well that's interesting since Arabs are semitic that means being anti-Arab is anti-semitic as well. When Ehud Barak said all Arabs are liars that is an anti-semitic statement!
"Anti Semitism" was a term invented by a German Jewhater, WIlhelm Marr (he was himself married to a Jewish woman two times, maybe thats why he developed a hatred for Jews). The term was coined solely to describe an antipathy to and objection to Jews as constituting an alien Semite factor in European lands--there was no significant Arab population in Germany in the 1th century. So it is disingenuous to apply it to Arabs.
What is the most anti-semitic and racist country in the world answer = Israel!
Palestinians and Arabs are semitic, opinion polls suggest most Israelis would not wish to live in the same street or work in the same place as an Arab. Racism in Israel is endimic in Israel against non-Askenazi Jews and Ethiopians as well. Kind of ironic isn't it as we know you Israelis love to claim that you are the victims all the time as though racism does not exist in Israel or it can be justified!
As I said, the term "anti-Semitic" was invented by a racist European Christian to describe opposition TO JEWS. Wilhelm Marr was not writing of Arabs in Germany, which had no significant Arab population in the 1800s. "Racism in Israel is endimic in Israel against non-Askenazi Jews"
Bullshit. Non-Ashkenazi Jews are majority in Israel, and Israeli cabinets in the past 30 years has mostly been composed of Mizrahi Jews. Marriages between Ashkenazi/Mizrahi are the norm here. I am a product of this.
"opinion polls suggest most Israelis would not wish to live in the same street or work in the same place as an Arab. "
Opinion polls in the UK suggest that most white Britons don't want to live and work next to blacks...except blacks in Britain don't have a history of exploding themselves in buses. Additionally, most Arabs in Israel don't particularly want Jews living in their midst either, I am not only talking of the "settlers" in places like Hebron, but even in mixed cities like Haifa/Akko.
One of the few critics out of a handful of Israel allowed to speak in the US. Most loose their jobs and are banned from most media, which is a prime example of Jewish conspiracy within the United States.
JohnnyRock2000 4 weeks ago
Great video. Thanks for sharing
ForexReviewsCentral 2 months ago
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nice video! very interesting
adelle0001 3 months ago
10:52
FRTothus 5 months ago
Hamas is a great government who has a lot of human rights! pshh, BS! stop blaming Israel! there are 20+ arab countrie, 800X the size of israel. get over it
davek381 8 months ago
@davek381 not even worthy of debate.
SolGios 7 months ago
To look at the big picture. We are all enslaved by the Monetary System created by Zionists. Its not an Islam vs West problem, where again, Zionist media propoganda puts it but everyone is affected. The tool used within the monetary system to cage up is Interest ! Simple as that. If we free ourselves from this monetary system, politicians will be more inclined to act for the people and not the banks etc.
lieberat 1 year ago
Did he give the ticket to the homeless man?
clarkycatwithcake 1 year ago
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would you like to meet a single mom online naneedj.info
ktiwanka 1 year ago
I get sad every-time I remembered that Prof. Saeed is not with us anymore.
kayb76 1 year ago 7
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KSHSamy says:
Zionists are very good in twisting words and lying.
ISRAEL was the name of a Prophet.
In the Quran, the old and the new testaments is often referred to the jews with "the sons of Israel" which basically means "the offsprings of the Prophet Israel", and not " the inhabitants of a land called "israel" "!
metallic1slim 1 year ago
After what Israel is doing to Palestinians, now who can still sympathize with their plight at the hand of Nazis.
qxw667 1 year ago
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KSHSamy says:
Zionists are very good in twisting words and lying.
ISRAEL was the name of a Prophet.
In the Quran, the old and the new testaments is often referred to the jews with "the sons of Israel" which basically means "the offsprings of the Prophet Israel", and not " the inhabitants of a land called "israel" "!
smooth197 2 years ago
i dunno why is this comment by KSHSamy hidden! It´s not a SPAM, It´s the TRUTH!!!
smooth197 2 years ago
it's so unfortunate that the Palestinians have to pay for the holocaust through the creation of Israel
ilovejajangmyun 2 years ago 44
It's a shame that your'e uneducated and use cheap propaganda to justify your agenda (instead of real facts)
orisin1 1 year ago
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Zionists are very good in twisting words and lying.
ISRAEL was the name of a Prophet.
In the Quran, the old and the new testaments is often referred to the jews with "the sons of Israel" which basically means "the offsprings of the Prophet Israel", and not " the inhabitants of a land called "israel" "!
KSHSamy 2 years ago 7
5 *
smooth197 2 years ago
Comment removed
KSHSamy 2 years ago
Comment removed
KSHSamy 2 years ago
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KSHSamy 2 years ago
Zionists argue about the term Palestine as being a newly invented term .
These sick people "forget" that the words "Palestine" and "Palestinian" are much older than "israel" and "israelian".
Shame on you, criminals.
KSHSamy 2 years ago 3
The word "Palestine"--"Palaestina" was first used by the Roman after they defeat Judea, which was a Jewish state in Eretz Yisrael. The romans used this word to try & erase the memory of the independent Jewish kingdoms of Yisrael and Yehuda--but the truth is the name was never used by the people of the country until recent. It is very nice if the local Arab want to use this name, that's their right, but the words Yisrael, Yisraeli, etc..are much older than "Palestine", "Palestinian"
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
Ya' Samy--
Shame on you for calling yourself a Muslim. Really, how can you be so ignorant--?
'Anta jahili!
Even your own book, the Quran--never mentiones this word "Palestine"--but you know which word it mentions a lot?
"Israel"!
But you say the word "Palestine" came before the word "Israel"? How come you say that?
I say this with love and respect for all good Muslims and Arabs who know the truth.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
@KSHSamy Actually they're not. Israel is a much older term, by thousands of years.
shouldberaining 1 year ago
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I'm afraid not, Said! Unfortunately, most of the sane people think that you're an utter prat! Ask them who they'd prefer to meet: Edward Said or the man, who cleans out the public toilets in Aberdeen, and they'd go for Wee Jock "Poo-Pong" McPlop every time.
GreatGrumbledook 2 years ago
us otherness
wangmaoqiao7 2 years ago
Way to go Israel on breaking many of international laws!
xtraordinarymachine0 2 years ago
GamZul or F O of So called zionist entity, I wondered why U R so busy False-fying things as 0% PALESTINIANS in 1880 In PALESTINE, the Country and state of Christian Jesus As Egypt is the Land of the Jewish Mosses, David, Soluman & Jacob=Isreal "My Gog be Plessed with
kaker4444 2 years ago
Yes, 0% Palestinians lived here in 1880...because the country was all part of the Ottoman Turkish empire control in these times, so the local arabs (and also most of the local jews) were Ottomans at this time. The first time that people became "Palestinians" here was 1917, and the Jews living here also was "Palestinians" at that time--but this is only because the British decided to use the name "Palestine" for their territory. But the days of "Palestine" ended in 1948.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
what a load of crap. the palestinians including my own family have lived in palestine dating back from before the crusades. the zionist lie you echo no longer washes.
Dvsblue 2 years ago 3
You have a bad reading comprehension. I never said Arabs never resided within the areas of Eretz Yisrael before 1917-- I said "Palestinians", never resided here, because the country was our officially called "Palestine" before the British took these areas from the Turk in 1917. Before that the Arabs who lived here were known by various names, whether it was their hamoula, or just Arabs, or sometimes they called themselves Syrians.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
The country wasnt called Palestine officially and the people who lived here were not Palestinians. My own family has lived here for many generations. My father's generation was the only generation that was called "Palestinian" because he was born here in 1932-after the time the British named this land "Palestine" But his mother was born here when the Turks was here, and she wasn't born "Palestinian". Nobody was before 1917. "Palestinians" was just the people living here between 1917-1948!
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
If your family really lived here before 1917--they were not Palestinians--they were just Ottoman citizens. There was no sha3b falastini--nobody knew what that was--until the 1960s! Maybe your family was members of the Arab nation who lived here, just like my family was members of the Jewish nation who lived here, but there never was such a thing as a Palestinian People for your family to be a part of until it was invented in the 1960s.That's what I mean when I say there was no Palestinians.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
GamZuLeToevah:
"We kept the civilian bodycount very low--only about 300..."
"...I am fully in my right to shoot them dead. I don't care if this is a woman or a child."
"The civilians of Gaza should be grateful to us that we allow any food and medicine in. Truly, we are fools for not employing methodology that any sane country uses against terrorist threat...who dealt with finality against the Tamil terrorist, even though it cost many dead civilians "
voxvoxvox 2 years ago 2
GamZuLeToevah:
I've got a couple of questions:
Do you belive that the jews are more entitled to the land then anyone else? If so, why?
How can you consider 300 innocent lives to be a "low count?"
If you show the "courage" you speak of and use the Sri-Lankan approach and kill them all, do you think that that will bring peace?
Don't you think that would rather escalate the conflict? Iran would probably have a problem with that...
voxvoxvox 2 years ago
What would the Palestinians have to do for you to "trust" them with their own country?
When the state of israel was founded it had fixed borders, right?
How do you justify the occupation?
Because israel has no legal claim to the still occupied territories, or am I mistaken?
But a two-state sollution is probably the only way to go.
How do you think Jerusalem should be divided?
voxvoxvox 2 years ago
"What would the Palestinians have to do for you to "trust" them with their own country?"
First, if a credible Palestinian leader can openly aknowledge that the Jewish people have a long history in the Land of Israel and a national right to self-determination, instead of only grumblingly admitting Israel exists, but wishing it go away, it can help. But failing that, they must completely renounce all terror, always, clean up the coruption in their midst, build a society of rule of law, etc.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
"How do you justify the occupation?
Because israel has no legal claim to the still occupied territories, or am I mistaken?"
You are mistaken. In the case of Gaza, Israel totally relinquished control over this formerly Egyptian-occupied area to the PA, which was taken over by Hamas in Gaza. In the case of the West Bank (Yehuda & Shomron), Israel took it after being attacked by Jordan in 1967. As Jordan never controlled it as a legal sovereign power, the correct term is disputed territory.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
voxvox:
You asked: "Do you belive that the jews are more entitled to the land then anyone else? If so, why?"
I have said, and I believe you saw where I clearly wrote that I, like most consensus opinion of Israelis, believe that there must be a 2-state solution and that Israel should make teritorial concessions to permit the local "Palestinian" Arabs to have sovereinty in there own state. Doesn't that answer your question?
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
"How can you consider 300 innocent lives to be a "low count?""
By any reasonable measur stick, it's a low count. Innocent civilian life lost is always lamentable, but is almost always unavoidable in war. When you compare Israel's action in Gaza last year to other recent conflicts, you see that Israel kept the civilian deathtoll on the other side low. Could it have been kept lower?...maybe--but would probably have elevated the risk and deathtoll of Israeli personnels. I can say this for fact.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
vox: You quoted me saying "We kept the civilian bodycount very low--only about 300..."
It is a nasty FACT of war that civilians die. This cannot be avoided once you go to war. If you look at how we behave, compare it to other countries in armed conflicts, you see that IDF keeps the civilian bodycount LOW--look at Sri Lanka against the Tamils, look at the US Marines in Fallujah for recent examples, and these are democratic countries. For really high bodycounts, look at Arab countries and Africa.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
You also quoted me--OUT OF CONTEXT (very clever deleting) saying "... I am fully in my right to shoot them dead. I don't care if this is a woman or a child" Must I paste again the rest of what I wrote? Okay: If I "order somebody to halt at a checkpoint during a combat operation, AND THEY KEEP WALKING TOWARDS ME, (emphasis added) I am fully in my right to shoot them dead. I don't care if this is a woman or a child. My life and my soldiers' lives come first.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
GamZuluToevah
Give me your Name Rank and Number and all details of War Crimes committed such as the one you outlined about shooting an unarmed civilian I will forward details to the Hague for possible War Criminal charges against you alongside your Zionist Der Fuhrer Benjamin Netenyahu(hopefully Goldstone will be the Prosecutor)
After all he is a Jew and a Zionist so you cannot acuse him of being "anti-semitic". Try to think of a more convincing excuse than "I was only obeying orders". LOL!!!
petersz98 2 years ago 2
@petersz98
I never shot an unarmed civilian to my knowledge but if someone does not stop when approaching an unarmed checkpoint during a wartime situation, when an order is relayed in CLEAR ARABIC, by a native-Arabic-speaking Druze IDF soldier and keeps on advancing towards your position--the only reasonable assumption to make is that they intend to harm you, and you must eliminate this threat as quickly as possible-this has happened much in the past . Better to live and regret than be dead.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
Corrected typo --I meant to type an "armed checkpoint" not "an unarmed checkpoint" in line 4
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
I don't believe you! Hundreds of people in Gaza have been killed many unarmed civilians waving the white flag and shot in the back. Palestinian fishermen and farmers are being killed deliberately by Israeli snipers all the time. There is a shoot to kill policy in the IDF of unarmed civilians by dehumanising all Palestinians as terrorists. You have spent at least 3 years in the IDF. Now tell me the truth even if you didn't commit war crimes you must have witnessed them or turned a blind eye.
petersz98 2 years ago
I've never witnessed any warcrimes. I have heard second or third-hand accounts, such as the ones published in the media that you are hysterical about, about cases where civilians were killed or injured, but even with those you cannot be sure what the soldiers knew or didnt know in that moment.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
So you admit you have heard about them, perhaps from your colleagues! What did you do as part of the IDF, man checkpoints, does it give you a feeling of power to humiliate people forcing them to stand for hours on end at a checkpoint preventing them going to school or hospital or work for no reason, you could kill someone with total impunity and claim like you said it was self defence.
petersz98 2 years ago
"So you admit you have heard about them, perhaps from your colleagues!""
No I hear about them from the same source you hear about them, the Shovrim Shtika (Breaking silence) that were all over the news. A lot of 2nd, 3rd-hand stories, and upon examination nothing you can say is a real war crime--for example, the orders to stay off rooftops, because airforce will think you are a sniper and shoot. These orders were given to us too--"do not go on the roof under any circumstances. "
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
"What did you do as part of the IDF, man checkpoints,"
Sure I manned checpoints, I still do when I get called for reserve duty
" does it give you a feeling of power to humiliate people forcing them to stand for hours on end at a checkpoint preventing them going to school or hospital or work for no reason,"
No it give me a feeling of being bored out of my mind doing this tedioum, because I gotta be there hours on end but I know I'm doing it for a good reason, to keep murderers out of our country
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
"There is a shoot to kill policy in the IDF of unarmed civilians by dehumanising all Palestinians as terrorists."
Maybe if terrorists wore uniform and fought away from civilian populations, it can make our job alot easier to guarantee we only kill terrorists and never harm any innocent! You always assume as a soldier operating in a theater where you cannot easily distinguish between hostile and civilian, that people approaching you are "hostile" and take means to protect yourself and your men.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
I AM A palestinian and i was born in my country called PALESTINE.
back during the ottoman empire, everyone was ottoman, however, the empire had its small states one of them was called palestine.
before sharing what you have, you have to make sure you're NOT making things up as u go... how about u look it up okay? :)
palixbeauty 2 years ago 4
You are free to call yourself "Palestinian", but unless you were born here between 1917-1948, you can't possibly have been born in any entity called "Palestine"--that's the name the British bestowed on my country, ISRAEL, during that time. Before 1917, it was Ottoman-controlled and there was no "Palestine". My father is a Jew who was born here in 1932, so I guess he can say he was born in Palestine, but his mother was born here in 1907, so she was certainly not born in "Palestine"!
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
do some reasearch.
ah and um my AMERICAN passport says born in "PALESTINE" :)
and i even have a palestinian passport too. now dnt u just shut up okay?
America recognizes me as a Palestinian/american .. now WHO r u to deny LOL!
oh and btw ... read my reply to the dumb person below...
~Wink! ~
palixbeauty 2 years ago 2
If your american passport says you're born in "Palestine" it probably means you were born here between 1917 & 1948 when the British gave the country this name --but I don't think you're so old--or maybe if you're born in Palestinian Authority-controlled areas of the West Bank/Gaza between 1993 and the present it says "Palestinian Authority"--"Palestinian Authority"--not "Palestine". It is a key difference. Palestinian Authority is a legal entity, but not a state.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
But between 1967 and 1993 Arabs who hold US passports and were born in the disputed territorys--it says on their US passports--if for exampel they'r born in Ramalla, it says in the US passport --"West Bank", if they're born in Gaza, it just says "Gaza"--but not "Palestine"
Look closer at your US pasport next time, sweety-- it probably says, "Palestinian Authority", not "Palestine" unless you are lying completely.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
"back during the ottoman empire, everyone was ottoman, however, the empire had its small sattes one of them was called palestine."
No. In the 500 years that the Ottoman Empire controled the land that was always historically called "Eretz Yisrael" by Jews, and only recently as "Palestine" by Arabs, they never referred to it as "Palestine", "Filastin", etc. It was part of the vilayets of Damascus, then later Saida and Beirut, and then subdivided into sanjak regions. And defintely no "state".
ShmorgelBorgel 2 years ago
"before sharing what you have, you have to make sure you're NOT making things up as u go... how about u look it up okay? :) "
How about YOU look it up? There was never any state called "Palestine", nope. The British foreign rulers called our land Palestine between 1917-'48, but that was no state. The Ottoman foreign rulers never even used this word from 1517-1917. Now, I hope the local Arabs make their own state, they can call it Palestine, MickeyMouseland, whatever, just keep it out of Israel!
ShmorgelBorgel 2 years ago
you LOUT!
how ignorant can u get huh?!
jeez! im not making things up like FOX news that u lsn to and watch history (made up shit) on...
palestine existed during and even be4 the ottoman. true everyone was ottoman but there were separate states like jerusalem/ arabia/sham/ and PALESTINE
infact look up Baedecker's famous guidebook (1876) was entitled "PALESTINE Syria"
like it or not. palestine exist we palestinians exist and u israelies go to hell ~wink! ~ :)
palixbeauty 2 years ago
Pay attention. There was no "state" called "Palestine". Not in the sense of it being an independent sovereign state, nor in the sense of it even being an administrative unit of another state, such as the Ottoman state. The Ummayads briefly referred to one military district as "jund Filastin", but that was not coterminous with any state. The EUROPEANS, such as those who wrote Baedekkers guides referred to the region as "Palestine". Not the locals, neither the Jewish locals nor Arab locals.
ShmorgelBorgel 2 years ago
ShmorgelBorgel, There was no state called India until modern time either. Did that mean those people in now Indian never lived there? The people who are called Palestinianins have hhistorically lived there and that's a historical fact. Only a freak would argue about that fact.
mingalabaa 2 years ago 31
Where did you see me argue that Arabs have historically lived here for many centuries? I did argue against the counter-historical nonsense that there was a "Palestinian" state or nation here in the past and I clearly stated that I support the creation of a state for the local Arabs, to be called "Palestine" or any other funny name they fancy, as long as it does not threaten or endanger the rights of the Jews to self-determination living in sovereign Israel, which is a Jewish state.
ShmorgelBorgel 2 years ago
Corrected typo---my first sentence should read--"Where did you see me argue that Arabs have NOT lived here for many centuries"
not "Where did you see me argue that Arabs have lived here for many centuries"
ShmorgelBorgel 2 years ago
As I said, it's peachy if the local Arabs, who never historically had an identity as "Palestinian" but adopted the term recently--want to call themselves "Palestinian" (or any other invented term)--that's just great. The local Arabs have that right to adopt that term, they even have the right to self-determination AS LONG AS as it doesn't threaten OUR country, Israel, but they don't have the right to invent history.If you want to call yourselves "Palestinian", t'fadalu, just don't make stuff up!
ShmorgelBorgel 2 years ago
ya colonization/annexing someone else's land - militarism is so sexy
xtraordinarymachine0 2 years ago
them all ", its was the other way around Just read N. G Finkelstien Chapter in E. Said book "Blaming the Victimes". [Z]ionism difinition is the multi-national Killing Mafia Hired & smugled by the British Army, the TRUE Founding god of the zionist colony in occuped PALESTINE. 4 Ur Lies about Population statistics go 2 the British Army records and see if any of the Milosovichs &
kaker4444 2 years ago
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kaker-
The first 20 years of Israeli occupation were years of relative peace & prosperity for both Israelis & Palestinians..
-Palestinian economy was robust on income from Israeli jobs & commerce.
-Free movement in both directions across the Green Line.
-Palestinians did not experience the poverty due to lost jobs
-No checkpoints
-No wall separated Jew from Arab until the Oslo Accords & the return of Arafat & the PLO to Palestine
lacarneceria613 2 years ago
Karagetichs of PALESTINE were their, Like Polish Copral D.Gorien Later Ben Gurion Or shimon Perski later Peretz Or Iranians Ex MAFIA malister so-called Ex president & Mofaz the Criminals Or Ukranian Assasinators experts Barak & Olmert & The Romanian British trained in South African Aparthied Shamir, and the count-less discrimenated againist Arab
kaker4444 2 years ago
Jews (Iraqi Moroccan & Yameni & Atheopian) I could go on and on about ur crimes from Dier Yassen (254) of 1948 to GAZA the Zionist Bigest ever concentration camp Hitler is proud of, not 2 mention the 9/11 Sabra and and Shatila in Lebanon with about 3000 Palestinain Murdred and the count Less injeries and Raped women and Children Just ask lawer Micheal Cohen of Califorinia about it, not 2 mention Jenine masacare 2002 of
kaker4444 2 years ago
the Plish Sharon and Taberia Lud, Ramla Yafa (Jafa) ethnic Cleansing of 1947, read what the israeli Illan Pape book Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine, Or read the manual of racism "Jewish History " by Israel Shahak , Finally Smitism from Sam Son of Noah who lived in Iraq Befor any religion , it has nothing 2 do with Jewish or Muslims, so stop spining anti-Smitism and The holocaust like Motcarlo Casino as Norman Finkilstien Said in his book "the Holocaust Industry"
kaker4444 2 years ago
dude, im against the injustices that have been and are commited against palestinians, but what ur talking about is fabricated bullshit.
Iker888 2 years ago
Take a breath my friend and good luck with your treatment. Best regards.
raphaeljudas 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
You must be a paid youtube liar
The Ugly Face of genocidal Israel, Outpost of Squatters is revealed
ISRAEL-the-SQUATTER have been slaughtering the natives of Palestine for over 60 yrs & keep inventing different ways to Blame the Victim
08-09 ISRAELI massacre slaughtered un-armed helpless civilians, more than half women & children, trapped In locked borders. 1400 slaughtered instantly, 5,500 left wounded / dying in agony
Never to bear children
The truth shall overcome
GENOCIDE
4aaaaa4 2 years ago
Edward Said is the voice of reason.Through your writings you will live on forever. Rest in Peace.
WhiteSeptember 2 years ago
When eleven Israeli Olympians were killed by the Palestinian organization Black September in Munich 1972, Sartre opposed those in France who thought that was an intolerable scandal. That does not prevent the "reasonable academic" E. Said to declare in a interview that "Sartre, for example, was very Zionist." What about intellectual honesty, E. Said?
raphaeljudas 2 years ago
Here are some things Israeli leaders said about the Arabs:
"We must expel Arabs and take their places." David Ben Gurion, 1937
"If I was an Arab leader I would never make peace with Israel. That is natural: we have taken their country." David Ben Gurion
Do you want more: "the only good Arab is a dead one" Golda Meir 1969
Much like the leaders above Edward Said evolved too. I encourage you to stay here on Earth.
WhiteSeptember 2 years ago
Golda Meir never made the quote you attribute to her--but Ben Gurion wrote part of what you wrote, but you leave out the rest--"I don't understand your optimism. Why should the Arabs make peace? If I were an Arab leader I would never make terms with Israel. That is natural: we have taken their country. Sure, God promised it to us, but what does that matter to them? Our God is not theirs. We come from Israel, it's true, but two thousand years ago, and what is that to them? "
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
The rest of Ben Gurion's quote--""They only see one thing: we have come here and stolen their country. Why should they accept that? They may perhaps forget in one or two generations' time, but for the moment there is no chance. So, it's simple: we have to stay strong and maintain a powerful army. Our whole policy is there. Otherwise the Arabs will wipe us out."
This only shows Ben Gurion was a great leader, with the ability to view the other side position. Sadly, Arabs don't have such empathy
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
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Empathy? That sounds like something the former apartheid regime of South Africa would say. Empathy certainly does not apply to the Palestinians, who the Israelis routinely bulldoze their homes and make them refugees, who are treated as subhuman and inferior, have to carry id cards and wait for hours at checkpoints, live in rubble and garbage, while the israelis take their homes...empathy?
bigbossman999 2 years ago
here is the thing buddy,
arabs and non arabs, muslims and non muslims, jews.. blah blah..
these are all just excuses to all wuts goin on.
if the issue is really religion (coz "homeland" crap) lets ask whos a jew? if palestinians did a mass conversion to judaism, will the conflict end?
if it was race, whats the jews race?
can a person be arab jew?
can he be persian jew?
or lets say it was really GOD's "promise"
really? could it be? a God that makes a racist promise?
hmm....
palixbeauty 2 years ago 2
"if palestinians did a mass conversion to judaism, will the conflict end?"
Who wants them to do mass conversion to Judaism? Jews, unlike Christians or Muslims, do not arrogantly wish to impose our religion on outsiders. The conflict can end if the Arab world accepts the essential historical justice and reality of the Jewish nation to have independence in its homeland. We in turn agree for compromise and to let a small additional state for the local Arabs in addition to the 22 other Arab countrys
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
The BG quote is out from context, and the Golda quote is completely fabricate.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
You said following:I don't accept the propaganda that there is an ancient Palestinian people as long as you have this idea, I do not believe I could reason with you. Shalom!
WhiteSeptember 2 years ago
Comment removed
GerevMasriaH 2 years ago
Empathy? That sounds like something the former apartheid regime of South Africa would say. Empathy certainly does not apply to the Palestinians, who the Israelis routinely bulldoze their homes and make them refugees, who are treated as subhuman and inferior, have to carry id cards and wait for hours at checkpoints, live in rubble and garbage, while the israelis take their homes...empathy?
bigbossman999 2 years ago
Yeah, the BenGurion quote reflects total empathy, as well as pragmatic realism. I am from a family that is traditionally voted for Herut (Jabotinksy & Begin) but I recognise we had a great leader with BG and he got our country for us. The quote shows he recognised that the Arabs wont accept the reality of a free Jewish country in what they think is therie exclusive land and was prepared to deal with that for that time. I am of course always hoping that this attitude will change, I am optimist!
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
There are no differences between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. We are all part of one nation. It is only for political reasons that we carefully underline our Palestinian identity....yes, the existence of a separate Palestinian identity serves only tactical purposes. The founding of a Palestinian state is a new tool in the continuing battle against Israel. - late military commander of the PLO as well as member of the PLO Executive Council, Zuhair Muhsin
SilverRedIndigo 2 years ago
There is no legitimacy to israel. There is no ONE jewish people, Jews are from Russia, through out Europe and America. They are not a people, so they do not deserve a land. Palestinians have lived in the area for centuries. Jews are colonial imports.
catsmew 2 years ago 2
We are a people, we originate from here (my own family has been here for many centuries) and we have always had a national consciousness and you have no say in the matter--simply, you and people like you don't get to decide this. The Arabs must deal with the fact and reality of a Jewish state.The Jews who don't wish to be part of the Jewish people and remain in Diaspora countries like America will intermarry and fade out of our nation-but they have the choice to live as free Jews in their land.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
@GamZuLeToevah
My friend, I admire your calm and pondered answers. כל הכבוד .רפאל
raphaeljudas 2 years ago
תודה, אחי
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
"Jews are from Russia, through out Europe and America. "
A plurality of Israel's Jewish population (including half of my own family) are Jews that have never left the Middle East, unlike the Ashkenazim, who are also originally from the Middle East but lived in Christian Europe for generations. But in any case, Mizrahi-Sefardi Jews like me are more than 50% of the population here. We all intend to stay here.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
A majority of Jews are not native born at all. They are European imports, like most colonies.
Oh, I know you intend to stay here. Considering the way you slaughter the indigenous people, it is quite evident how committed Jews are to preserving "peace".
catsmew 2 years ago
Actually, at this point, about 70% of our population is indeed native-born--although it is true that only about 40% of Israelis go back more than three generations. In any case, most of us indeed are from the region and only a minority of us are descended from European Jews (and even the European Jews are also from here); yet to hear people like you, all of us are from Europe. Bear in mind that the local Arab residents of our country also have diverse roots from many different lands.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
Please allow me to refresh the memory of the reasers here, that as their name clearly indicates Arabs originate from Arabia, neiher from Israel nor from Philistine. Hence, they are not indigenous people in Israel but colonists. Moreover, the arab colonialism is in fact one who has not suffered decolonisation, unlike the European one, apart in the Jewish homeland. Where the kabyles, the Chaldeens or the Kurds failed but we succeeded. So much so that most African people took Zionism as a model.
raphaeljudas 2 years ago
"s their name clearly indicates Arabs originate from Arabia...they are not indigenous people in Israel but colonists"
With respect, I think its oversimplifying. Some of the local Arabs have ancient roots here, others not. Regardless how long they are here, or if there historcally is something called a "Palestinian People" (I beleive historicaly speaking theres no such thing), now it exists.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
So, no I don't accept the propaganda that there is an ancient Palestinian people, but I accept the reality that one exists today--and I respect that many of the Arabs who live here have an attachment to the land, whether their families came here 1000 years ago, or only 70 years ago. If truly-- theyre ready to accept internally the fact that the Jewish nation has a historical tie here, that we deserve the right to our state and ^WE ARE STAYING^-- there can be peace. But it's a big IF.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
You seem educated and very knowledgeable, but your logic does not add up. Im from Jordan and as of 100 years ago there were no Jordanians, and my people inhabited this land for thousands of years. So if Jordan gets occupied by a foreign entity, this foreign entity could use your logic and that there were no Jordanians 70 years ago
WhiteSeptember 2 years ago
....The same rule applies to the Palestinians, they lived there as long as the Mizrakhim Jews and they both have equal claims to the land. What youre doing is hurting your cause, you simply cannot erase people from history!! Shalom
WhiteSeptember 2 years ago
"What youre doing is hurting your cause, you simply cannot erase people from history!"
I dont want to erase anybody from histroy, I accept that many Arabs here have deep roots in this country-and they started to idetify as "Palestinian". What I say I disagree with is the lie that they existed as a "Palestinian nation" in the past. I am also not against them to have a state next to my Jewish state--but that state mustnt pose a threat to us. If they can prove it not a threat, then no problem!
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
"Palestinians have lived in the area for centuries. Jews are colonial imports."
Some of the local Arabs who reside here (who, recently, in the past few decades adopted the European word "Palestinians" as a demonym) indeed do trace their roots here 1000s of years. Many other local Arabs arrived during the Arab conquest, or from the Balkans during Turkish times, or from Zanzibar and Sudan, or from Syria and Iraq during the British Mandate. They owe their newfound national identity to Zionism.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Islam is a Religion of Bloodlust and Human Sacrifice who love death that is a CATAGORCAL FACT
-Dr. Baruch De Spinoza, Legal Scholar-Harvard University
DrBaruchdeSpinoza 3 years ago
I attended this conference long ago and found it truly inspiring. Thanks for posting
AlYaqouta 3 years ago
Palestine as the NAME of a Country 'denotes' that Native Palestinians Live there. Just like America has Native Americans, and Italian Americans, Irish Americans, African Americans, there should also be Polish Palestinians, German Palestinians, African Palestinians, and Irish Palestinians... It's Still Called PALESTINE for crying out loud!! Geeze!!,
miltona635 3 years ago
Does anyone know any intelligent speakers on this issue who don't support either side?
Every video I've seen is biased In favor of either Israel or Palestine. I am looking for an unbiased opinion.
emulator900 3 years ago
Unbiased opinions favor the palis
oldjoe5 2 years ago
oldjoe5:
> Unbiased opinions favor the palis
I'd prefer listening to people who don't view it as a chess match between the two sides, but rather just want them to make peace with each other.
emulator900 2 years ago
It's hardly a chess match. It is an occupation and slaughter by a powerful militarized nation against the poorest people on the planet
oldjoe5 2 years ago 2
I said I don't want to read people who view it as a chess match.
emulator900 2 years ago
"just want them to make peace with each other." You make it sound as if each side is equally culpable. That is dishonest. One side is the oppressor, one the oppressed. One side has one of the most powerful militaries in the world, the other has no military at all.
oldjoe5 2 years ago 2
oldjoe5
> You make it sound as if each side is equally culpable
I never said that. I said I want them to make peace with each other. Stop putting words in my mouth.
emulator900 2 years ago
"I said I want them to make peace with each other"
That certainly implies that each side has equal power to do so.
Would you suggest that the Jews in Germany should have made peace with the Nazis?
oldjoe5 2 years ago 3
The Jews of Germany and Nazi-occupied Europe never made demands for Germany to stop existing or to cede territorys to them. The minority population of Jews in Germany never demanded that Germany give up its German identity. The crux of the problem is that Arabs in toto deny the Jewish nation's right to continued freedom and secure borders in our own homeland, even after we have generously allocated to the local Arab community here (so called "Palestinian") some territories and self governance.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
@GamZuLeToevah
I find your parallel has strong explanatory power.
raphaeljudas 2 years ago
Do you think the Arabs of Gaza are poorer than Darfur refugees?! I saw some posh houses recently in Gaza a few months ago---I saw a lot of nice furniture, full-stocked kitchen. They are not doing so bad.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
untill it gets bull dozed.. there are million people living in the gaza strip in which at its widest it is 16 km wide. They have no freedom of movment and are obstructed from obtaining medical and food resources via economic blockade. half there population are 15 or younger.
cexu 2 years ago
There will be no reason to bulldoze any Arab's house in Gaza or anywhere else if it is not a threat to an Israeli citizen, such as being used for weapons storage or for sheltering terrorists. We don't just pick Arab houses randomly to destroy them for no reason at all. I am a reservist soldier in IDF and I was participate in the Gaza operation. We invaded in December because they never stopped firing rockets on our towns and the houses we destroyed while we were there were threats to us.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
Don't be so naive. Even the Haaretz newspaper says that soldiers were out of line and soldiers even made shirts depicting the advocation of killing children and babies.
audiorage092 2 years ago 2
LOL, "Even" Haaretz?
Haaretz is well known for printing the most negative assessments of the country's institutions. As a result of the Haaretz "T'-shirt" story, it was investigated and they found there were a few idiots who made the T-shirts. They were disciplined. As for the more serious allegations made by Haaretz, a week before, all the soldiers who claimed that later said, well, it was 2nd-hand info, they didn't witness anything with their own eyes. In other words, bullshit.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
In any war, innocents get killed. We kept the civilian bodycount very low--only about 300 in Cast Lead, which I am proud to have participated in. But if I, as an IDF combat reservist soldier order somebody to halt at a checkpoint during a combat operation, and they keep walking towards me, I am fully in my right to shoot them dead. I don't care if this is a woman or a child. My life and my soldiers' lives come first. We have had soldiers killed by suicide bombers who looked like civilians.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
And Palestinians are fully in their right to shoot and kill invaders. Keep on, rocking.
catsmew 2 years ago
If they shoot rockets into our country from territories we allow them to exercise control over, such as Gaza, then they have forfeited the right to self-governance and they must be neutralised. If they show responsibility and do not threaten us, in words or deeds, we will allow them their self-rule.
I accept the gratitude of the Arab residents of Gaza that we did not do to them what their fellow Arabs would have done (look up Assad and the town of Hama). Arabs are champions at killing Arabs.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
If you occupy someone else's land, oppress and humiliate the people, and starve them while surrounding them with armed forces, you forfeit the moral right to make an argument here.
About other Arabs -- i don't need to look up what other Arabs do. Look in your own backyard. The conversation is about Israeli occupation and oppression, not about Arabs.
catsmew 2 years ago
We ceased occupying Gaza completely in 2005 and we received rockets in return. We would have no need to impose heavy sanction on them if they did not shoot rockets at their civilian neighbors here. They do not have the right to shoot rockets into our country and not expect heavy retaliation, but they are quite fortunate we not use the heavy handed tactics of their fellow Arabs. We Jews are meek and hesitate to use a same methodology as Assad did. We should not be so meek in future.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
So called "ceased occupation" is a myth. People react with rockets becasue of the sanctions. The Israeali army might have left Gaza but it still caging the people like amimals. No freedom of any sort.
WhiteSeptember 2 years ago
If they condone behaviours such as sending rockets at their neighbours, then the Arab pop. of Gaza deserves to be caged.This is beastly behaviour, and correct and proper that they suffer sanctions. The civilians of Gaza should be grateful to us that we allow any food and medicine in. Truly, we are fools for not employing methodology that any sane country uses against terrorist threat, such as Sri Lanka, who dealt with finality against the Tamil terrorist, even though it cost many dead civilians
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
It's sad that the same Nazi victims have become ruthless themselves. People in Gaza are paying for the Nazis' crimes....how is that fair? Rockets are a result of the occupation. Remove the occupation, rockects will stop....Very simple yet you make sound like there is more to that. You can't fool us...this is not your land.
WhiteSeptember 2 years ago 2
No, it's sad that we are not ruthless. If we would use ruthless means to eliminate terrorist threat, just like any normal nation does we would win! Instead we play silly games with our enemy and worry about image. I very much admire the bravery and determination of the SriLankan military to uproot Tamil terrorist threat, even if it means some civilian dead--they do not take account of the world opinion. They are not afraid to be ruthless when necessary and we in Israel must follow their example
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
"People in Gaza are paying for the Nazis' crimes....how is that fair? "
Please, enough with the nonsense. They are paying for sending rockets at their neighbors and electing a government that swears to eliminate a neighboring state. That is a crime. The Jewish state and the presence of the Jewish people in its own country has nothing to do with the Nazis. My own Jewish family has lived here for multiple generations. I am a Jewish native of Eretz Yisrael and descended from Jewish natives here.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
Are you Ashkenazi or Mizrachim? In another word, are you superior or inferior because of your skin color? The Zionist Movement does not treat its own people fairly so I dont expect you to have any sympathy to the Arabs. Im for the security of Israel and Im against the Palestinian violent reaction but you have to understand that this reaction is a result of a military occupation. That simply is unacceptable!
WhiteSeptember 2 years ago
WhiteSeptember Most of today Israeli Jews are mizrachim and others also have at least one mizrachim ancestors.
tomislavvajs 2 years ago
Good point. So why in the history of Israel no Israeli Prime Minister or President was from Mizrachim background. The trend has been always that the Ashkinazis control the high positions in the Israel.
WhiteSeptember 2 years ago
President Moshe katzav is a mizrachi jew.
tomislavvajs 2 years ago
I should have said PM only. The president of Israel as we all know has no power and is useless when it comes to making policies. So the majority Mizrachis never had a PM?! Strange!!
WhiteSeptember 2 years ago
I believe that Israel underwent a dramatic change before some 13 years when Until before some 13 years it was almost the custom that someone who took part in the creation of state was elected as prime minister.Netaniyahu was elected as a first prime minister who didnt took part in the creation of the state in 1996.However the generation which established a state(mostly ashkenazi) is gone and today there is no chance that anyone who was not born in Israel will be elected as prime minister.
tomislavvajs 2 years ago
Not exactly so that the President has no power here-he/she can dissolve Parliament, approve treaties, call for early elections, appoint judges, issue pardons etc. In many respect it is tradition that it's"figure Head" position, but not powerless, and they can exercise their own discretion. Also, except for PM, Mizrahi have held every other important political post here like I said, defense minister, foreign minister Head of Joint chiefs, etc.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
Sorry, you are showing a lot of ignorance of the political system here, because yes, it's true so far there has been no Mizrahi PM (Yitzhak Mordekhai, Amir Peretz and Shaul Mofaz came close) but the way the system works here it's not like PM holds all the power in his hands & does what he wants. He can't move without the cabinet agreeing, the right coalition, and the cabinet has a lot of parties--and Mizrahi-majority political parties like Shas have a lot of power.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
While it is correct to say that in the past there were unfair relationship of askhenazi minority toward the mizrachi majority This is far from being the issue today in Israel.
tomislavvajs 2 years ago
These inter-group tensions had more to do with political leanings than out racism. Also, in the Old Yishuv (I am from on my father's side from Old Yishuv Jews here) the Sephardim/Mizrahim were on the top, and they discriminated against the Ashkenazim in the Turkish times. But the old-time Mizrahim also quickly became part of the Zionist establishment. The Labour MAPAI establishment in the 1950s marginalized against new immigrants of all kinds of backgrounds,
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
Mozhe Katzav, Yitzhak Navon, and Dalia Itzik are all Mizrahi Jews and all have served as Israeli President. So far there has not yet been a Mizrahi PM every other powerful position in Israeli politic has been held by Mizrahi/Sefardi/North Africa Jews, such as foreign minister, economic minister, defense minister, etc. We even had a Druze guy as our acting presiden
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
"Are you Ashkenazi or Mizrachim? In another word, are you superior or inferior because of your skin color? "
I'm both Ashkenazi and Mizrahi/Sepharadi. You also make a strong error & show ignorance when you imply that being Mizrahi or Ashkenazi has to do with the skin colour. Many my Mizrahi cousins are lighter than a lot of my Ashkenazi relatives. In fact, I know many Arabs who are very light too, even lighter than a lot of Ashkenazi in my family, so what do you mean with the skin color comment?
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
The Zionist Third Reich must be destroyed!
petersz98 2 years ago
petersz98 you are more radical than rabbi kach was. This kind of speaking proves those who believe in Rabbi Kachane ideas.
tomislavvajs 2 years ago
By the way the Joan Peters book you talk about on your site has been prooved to be a complete fraud like the Elders of the Protocols of Zion! The Zionist state is becoming more and more like the Germany of the 1930s or South Africa by in the 1980s. It is becoming more racist and violent by the day as witnessed by the recent barbaric massacre in Gaza. I am stating facts, such a country has no place in the civilized world. Just listen to the great Edward Said on this video.
petersz98 2 years ago
I never refered to the book of joan Peters sowely I refered to the evidence accepted by all scientists that the land of Israel had less than 200 000 people from 7th century till 1800. 90% of nowday arab towns are established after 1800. ''From time immemorial'' is far from being fraud as not a single fact wrriten in is being proved to be a fraud
tomislavvajs 2 years ago
The arab-islamic propaganda mashinery is well financed and strong. this is however not changing the facts
tomislavvajs 2 years ago
Dear petersz98 The european form of antisemitism is a clear reaction of offended part of european society about Jewish intelligence and abilities. this includes the sky-high numbers of Jewish scientist in all posible fields.
tomislavvajs 2 years ago
The Joan Peters book is as much a fraud as the Elders of the Protocols of Zion so please don't beleive any nonsense this book propogates.
petersz98 2 years ago
Joan Peters overstated her case when she attempted to show that most of the Arabs residing in Eretz Yisrael or claiming descent from them were recent 20th migrants or descendants thereof. She claimed that this applied to the majority of the Arab-speaking residents of our country. Nevertheless, although she overstated the case that almost all came in the early 20th century, many did. Many more of the local Arabs migrated here during the Ottoman period as well.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
Peters maybe erred by statung that "most" of the present-day Palestinian Arabs are from 20th century migrants, a substantial amount are. Others descended from migrants during the Ottoman period, others from the Arab conquest and others have even deeper roots here. That is ok, but it also contradicts the Arab propagandist account that the local Arabs have always been here. Moreover, a substantial portion of Israeli Jews (like yours truly) also can trace their ancestry here multiple generations.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
In 1880 there only 10000 Jews in Palestine. So the vast majority of Jews are very recent at least Palestinians can claim far longer ancestory than you Zionists. Now your admitting that the Peters book has serious errors like I told you. Good! We are making progress!
petersz98 2 years ago
Where did you ever see me champion Peters' book? But your stats are wrong. In the 1880s, Jewish population in Eretz Yisrael was about 25,000 (including my ancestors) about 10% of the population. However, "Palestinian" population was zero percent, because there was no population group in Eretz Yisrael circa 1880 that identified itself as "Palestinian". Additionally, the ruling government, the Ottomans, also did not identify the area as "Palestine". You are projecting current terms onto the past.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
Well, the vast majority of Jews can all trace their history here, this is well proven through genetic studies, even if they lived in Exile throughout the Middle East and Europe. Additionally, very many, such as myself can also trace unbroken residence here several centuries. On my father's side, my earliest known ancestor has been here since at least the 1300s (but we may go back further). Some clown once told me that if that's true, that makes me "Palestinian". Haha! No thank you!
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
"at least Palestinians can claim far longer ancestory than you Zionists."
As I said, the local Arabs who recently adopted the name Palestinian are a diverse group, with multiple origins. Some trace their ancestry here thousands of years. Others arrived during the time of the Arab conquests 1300 years ago. Others descend from Balkan and African slaves brought by the Ottomans. Some came in the 20th century, during the British mandate. My family has been here longer than many "Palestinians"
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
The odds are that the vast majority of Palestinians have been there far longer than you "Israelis" unless you are descended from the native Arabic Jewish community which was very tiny like I said only 10000 in 1880.
petersz98 2 years ago
While there is no neccessery for zionist to be a Jew I believe that there is no contradiction in a self-hating elements in Jewish society as well. The same exist among many other european nation as well
I believe that there is at least three different form of antisemitism today. Each have different roots evolution and topograpgy
tomislavvajs 2 years ago
Well that's interesting since Arabs are semitic that means being anti-Arab is anti-semitic as well. When Ehud Barak said all Arabs are liars that is an anti-semitic statement!
petersz98 2 years ago
"Anti Semitism" was a term invented by a German Jewhater, WIlhelm Marr (he was himself married to a Jewish woman two times, maybe thats why he developed a hatred for Jews). The term was coined solely to describe an antipathy to and objection to Jews as constituting an alien Semite factor in European lands--there was no significant Arab population in Germany in the 1th century. So it is disingenuous to apply it to Arabs.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
GamZuluLoevah
What is the most anti-semitic and racist country in the world answer = Israel!
Palestinians and Arabs are semitic, opinion polls suggest most Israelis would not wish to live in the same street or work in the same place as an Arab. Racism in Israel is endimic in Israel against non-Askenazi Jews and Ethiopians as well. Kind of ironic isn't it as we know you Israelis love to claim that you are the victims all the time as though racism does not exist in Israel or it can be justified!
petersz98 2 years ago
As I said, the term "anti-Semitic" was invented by a racist European Christian to describe opposition TO JEWS. Wilhelm Marr was not writing of Arabs in Germany, which had no significant Arab population in the 1800s. "Racism in Israel is endimic in Israel against non-Askenazi Jews"
Bullshit. Non-Ashkenazi Jews are majority in Israel, and Israeli cabinets in the past 30 years has mostly been composed of Mizrahi Jews. Marriages between Ashkenazi/Mizrahi are the norm here. I am a product of this.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago
"opinion polls suggest most Israelis would not wish to live in the same street or work in the same place as an Arab. "
Opinion polls in the UK suggest that most white Britons don't want to live and work next to blacks...except blacks in Britain don't have a history of exploding themselves in buses. Additionally, most Arabs in Israel don't particularly want Jews living in their midst either, I am not only talking of the "settlers" in places like Hebron, but even in mixed cities like Haifa/Akko.
GamZuLeToevah 2 years ago