I figured you were using, as you say, a "somewhat 4/4 manner" for the purposes of instruction; if taught "literally," the 16th note odd time groupings within the bar/syncopations/etc. get too complicated to explain effectively to a general audience. Zappa and Vinnie came up with something really strange here! Nonetheless, as a composer (who loves writing for drumset), I found your demos, which illustrate the additive nature of odd time patterns in rock music, to be hugely informative.Thank you!
Great tutorial! However, aren't your "slow motion" demos of the first two "sections" of the 21/16 pattern (beginning at 6:55 in your video) different from what you are playing in the "up to speed" demos of the whole pattern? In the "slow motion" demos, the first two sections are 5 and 4 8th notes long, which, when combined with the 5 16ths of the 3rd section, give a total of 23 16ths. In the "up to speed" demos, the first two sections are each played with one less 16th note: 21 16ths. Com'ts?
@mattaldrich1 Very well observed! you obviously know your stuff. Basically what is happening here is that the double bass drum that happens on the first two sections actually start on the "a" of beat one both times not the 2 that I have counted. Which pushes both sections back a 1/16. Basically when teaching students this piece this has always been the easiest way of getting it across being the way it is written on paper because the sections divide there and trying to use a somewhat 4/4 manner.
Hey man, great tutorials! My record player is one of the newer ones that can't slow the record down to 16 rpm's, so I was never sure EXACTLY what Vinnie was playing. This has been amazing help.
I just checked out your MySpace page as well, and you are fantastic drummer man, really awesome!! I have like a thousand questions for you! Like Who have you studied with? What books do you recommend? Have you ever worked out the Black Page Drum solo Parts one and two and If you have PLEASE POST THEM!!!! Seriously you are a fantastic player mate!!
@breedsauce101 Thanks again! I appreciate it!. The guy I studied with the longest was a local teacher from sydney named Milan Troha he was very important in the development of correct technique. As far as books go I don't think you can go past the classic oldies such as stick control, Advanced techniques for the modern drummer and the new breed just to name a few of the standards, also play along books with cd minus drums. If I could find a chart of black page i would love to give it a try
@aussiedrumnerd Thank you for your reply! I have made more progress with this song than I ever have before thanks to your posts!! I think I was afraid of Vinnies playing, lol, and also I just couldn't get the timing right! I would be happy to send you a copy of the Black page or better yet a link to an an online forum where this guy Tom Coyne does a good break down of the piece. Just replace the DOT with an actual dot wwwDOTunitedgrooveworkersDOTcom/forum/viewtopicdDOTphp?f=12&t=1337
@aussiedrumnerd Let me know if that link works or not and if I need to, I will find another way to get a copy to you! I have so many questions, but I think I will wait till I have some spare time on my hands to work out what you have already given us all. Thank you so much, and please let me know if that link worked out for you PEACE!!
Stop now!!! You're making Vinnie jealous!!!
CityslickCaptain 2 weeks ago
I seriously hate you... you're a monster! I'd kill to have you in my band! haha
lousama 3 months ago
@lousama haha thanks mate!
aussiedrumnerd 3 months ago
4/4 + 3/16 (or 5/16). typical zappa brilliance.
wesbroadway 3 months ago
I love your york!!! thanks!! ;D
notnowjon 4 months ago
@notnowjon Thankyou! your welcome!
aussiedrumnerd 3 months ago
Which drum machine\metronome do you use in this video?
Kelesis666 4 months ago
Neat! Part 3?
knoxlobster 7 months ago
I figured you were using, as you say, a "somewhat 4/4 manner" for the purposes of instruction; if taught "literally," the 16th note odd time groupings within the bar/syncopations/etc. get too complicated to explain effectively to a general audience. Zappa and Vinnie came up with something really strange here! Nonetheless, as a composer (who loves writing for drumset), I found your demos, which illustrate the additive nature of odd time patterns in rock music, to be hugely informative.Thank you!
mattaldrich1 10 months ago
@mattaldrich1 Well Im glad! your welcome! thanks for your time!
aussiedrumnerd 9 months ago
Great tutorial! However, aren't your "slow motion" demos of the first two "sections" of the 21/16 pattern (beginning at 6:55 in your video) different from what you are playing in the "up to speed" demos of the whole pattern? In the "slow motion" demos, the first two sections are 5 and 4 8th notes long, which, when combined with the 5 16ths of the 3rd section, give a total of 23 16ths. In the "up to speed" demos, the first two sections are each played with one less 16th note: 21 16ths. Com'ts?
mattaldrich1 10 months ago
@mattaldrich1 Very well observed! you obviously know your stuff. Basically what is happening here is that the double bass drum that happens on the first two sections actually start on the "a" of beat one both times not the 2 that I have counted. Which pushes both sections back a 1/16. Basically when teaching students this piece this has always been the easiest way of getting it across being the way it is written on paper because the sections divide there and trying to use a somewhat 4/4 manner.
aussiedrumnerd 10 months ago
Loved the intro!
foutupourfoutu 11 months ago
Hey man, great tutorials! My record player is one of the newer ones that can't slow the record down to 16 rpm's, so I was never sure EXACTLY what Vinnie was playing. This has been amazing help.
rushfan89 1 year ago
@rushfan89 Thanks Glad I could help!
aussiedrumnerd 1 year ago
I just checked out your MySpace page as well, and you are fantastic drummer man, really awesome!! I have like a thousand questions for you! Like Who have you studied with? What books do you recommend? Have you ever worked out the Black Page Drum solo Parts one and two and If you have PLEASE POST THEM!!!! Seriously you are a fantastic player mate!!
breedsauce101 1 year ago
@breedsauce101 Thanks again! I appreciate it!. The guy I studied with the longest was a local teacher from sydney named Milan Troha he was very important in the development of correct technique. As far as books go I don't think you can go past the classic oldies such as stick control, Advanced techniques for the modern drummer and the new breed just to name a few of the standards, also play along books with cd minus drums. If I could find a chart of black page i would love to give it a try
aussiedrumnerd 1 year ago
@aussiedrumnerd Thank you for your reply! I have made more progress with this song than I ever have before thanks to your posts!! I think I was afraid of Vinnies playing, lol, and also I just couldn't get the timing right! I would be happy to send you a copy of the Black page or better yet a link to an an online forum where this guy Tom Coyne does a good break down of the piece. Just replace the DOT with an actual dot wwwDOTunitedgrooveworkersDOTcom/forum/viewtopicdDOTphp?f=12&t=1337
breedsauce101 1 year ago
@aussiedrumnerd Let me know if that link works or not and if I need to, I will find another way to get a copy to you! I have so many questions, but I think I will wait till I have some spare time on my hands to work out what you have already given us all. Thank you so much, and please let me know if that link worked out for you PEACE!!
breedsauce101 1 year ago
Excellent. Thanks for taking the time to make these tutorial vids, you should do more. Cheers.
EliotKrupa 1 year ago
@EliotKrupa Thanks man! If there is enough interest I will definitely do more.
aussiedrumnerd 1 year ago
Great man, thanks !!!
valbuable 1 year ago
@valbuable My pleasure!
aussiedrumnerd 1 year ago