Dennis Wholey interviews Hyon Gak Sunim - Part 1 of 3

[convanjo]

WHAT A MONK！

[cherylmalone1]

I appreciate your conversation. It is so good to see an American Monk; are there many American monks where you are?

[mettacintena]

Great interview!

[usekmmpfvoqqdx9426]

NEW::'IPAD2:'`ＦＲＥＥ';;SITES''``­`'

ＷＷＷ.ＳＯＣＩＡＬＩＰＡＤ２ＧＩＶＥＡＷＡＹＳ.ＴＫ

COPY SITE & PASTE

[jayu501]

한국 선불교의 요점을 잘 정리해 주신 현각스님께 감사드립니다.

부디 성불하시기를 기원합니다. _()_

[dtseringdorje]

Hyon Gak Sunim, you need tapasya. You need to go through fire. Pray to Christ &Buddha to give you gift of Holly Spirit. When Holly Spirit dawns upon you there will be effect. Maybe some insight into nature of reality including nature of our mind which is The Mind, The Universal Mind. Your garden has not tuckle weeds yet, that's why there is no realisation. What am I? Observe. Don't hurry. don't run arround. Focus on energy which moves this body. 100% Then you can see, you can feel it. Awakening.

[ZarathuPower]

Japanese are evil, why God didn't punish them? If God exists, they should have been punished and swallow half of the islands in earthquakes.

[iedat1]

@ZarathuPower

yahahhahahahhahaahaha

your son is laughing at your empty brain . and ashamed of having stupid father.

dont blame the god, coz your straying from virtue has noting to do with god.

it is tooted in miserable hsitry and nature of korean.

hey you unlaned koran . what are you going to teach your son. miserable slfprise , hollow vanity. and how to fablicate history?

yahahahahahahhaha

that is koreat itself. country korea is constructed on the sand of lies

[ZarathuPower]

Na Mu HoRangEee means tree and Tiger. Japanese chant Korean words "tree and tiger" asking God to save their asses. It is believed that ancient religons went over to the islands as the people from Korean penninsula migrated over to the islands in seeking their livelihood, that resulted in modern country called "Japan."

[iedat1]

@ZarathuPower

and korans who remained in tiny peninsula have been living as chan's slave.

yahahhahahhahah

hey unlaned koran. are you going to say that third class monkey chinese and korans are more sperior than us. yahahhahahha pathtic selfprse, and hollow vanity.

tell me why china and kroea are still called third class country. it has close realation to the rality in which korans and chan never get nobel prise. cant you still understand why koran never win the nobel prise. moron

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower “Some, however, did receive him (Jesus) and believed in him; so he gave them the right to become God's children. They did not become God's children by natural means, that is, by being born as the children of a human father; God himself was their Father.” John 1:12-13

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark I think that as human varies in their personalities, so does our quests for understanding God. Some people live very down to earth lives, never thinking about God, and some people want to get to the bottom og the quests like Hyun Gak Sunim. So, not everybody can become a Christian. In fact, many people go to church without believing in God; they just go church to socialize and enjoy listening to sermons.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Another interesting point. Still I believe that with all the variance among religious people, the religion in the Bible is unique. According to the Bible, it’s not matter of human quest simply because no one would know who God is by their own wisdom: “For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not come to know God, God was well-pleased through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.” (1 Corinthians 1:21)

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark Here you are pointing a drastic difference between Budhhism and Christanity. To me, Buddism is more linked in touch with human, whereas, Chrtianity is based on perspective of God. I think religion has to be simple, not too complicated. I am not downgrading Christianity for it has made contribution to human civilization both good and bad, and we still may need to keep Christianity down the road. However, all the matrialism and modern civilization need more Buddism than Christiani

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower It finally dawned on me that we are probably engaged in a never ending discussion: we are repeating some issues again and again; obviously I don’t have all the answers for you and even nor for my self. But, at the same time, I found the common ground we both stand on: We all know love is the virtue we all look for as of the first importance. You and I both really wants to see God, if there is, who really understands us and loves us no matter what.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark If there is God, i think it doesn't matter whether individuals understand him or not. After all, his is omipotent and omniscent, that he understand us even our agnostic mind. We are his creature. Everthing was created by him. It's absurd that his nature has duality. The duality has been created by men. It doesn't really matter to God whether I seek wisdom through Buddism or Bible scripture. He doesn't even care I go to church every Sunday.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower I am again so amazed by your intellegence. I am convicned you are no longer 14 years old to me. If you are, you must be very very unusally smart. In fact, I would respect you whether you are a 14 years boy or adult for your intellegence. I would have followed your opinion if I have to simply speculate my life and what is going onaround us.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower But, I believe God really wants us to know Him. Bible for example is not a book about human seeking God; rather it's a book about God seeking Human being. If the most intelligent Chimpanzee couldn’t understand even 1% of human reasoning, I believe, we have to assume that we can’t understand even 1% of what God thinks.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower That’s why the Bible says: “ God was wise and decided not to let the people of this world use their wisdom to learn about him. Instead, God chose to save only those who believe the foolish message we preach.” 1Corinthians 1:21

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower It was really nice conversation with you. I will pray for you whenever I remember you though I neve met you. Remeber God loves you; and God bless you.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark Thank you...I need many blessings. God bless you many too. I just wish you continue to be a good Christian, and tell to God that there are good people who are just stupidly stubborn, and have more mercy on them.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Dear ZaratuPower I don't you are stupid nor stubborn, rather very logical.

Only thing is God already stated Irrevocably that no one is good before HIs eyes; we all are sinners. If you are good as you said you are, you don't need God's mercy you only need His justice.  Until you acknwoledge you are sinner, God doesn't need to offer mercy. I don't mean to argue with you. God bless you.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspare If God is as loving as he claims to be, I don't need his mercy since his love is boundless. I need his mercy if his love is limited. I am imperfect and needs blessings, but I like to believe God whose love is boundless, that I don't need to do anything for him. After all, he created us, he just need our acknowledgement, not anything else. God will bless you for his love is boundless.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Dear, God’s love is boundless. Yet, God’s righteousness is also as boundless as His love. God being righteous demands justice. But, no one can meet His righteous standard; especially laws that have to do with our relationship with Him. The bible tells that the cross (meaning the death of Jesus) represents where the boundless love of God and the boundless righteous justice meet. I hope you find God the person and the truth you have been looking for, in Christ. God bless you.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark I think that creating persona of God being endlessly loving and yet justice seeking is deeply flawed in Christianity. The duality contradicts one another. God should be either justice seeking or endlessly loving. I choose the latter; we can't really transpose our views onto God. I bet all the believers or non-believers seek his mercy in light of his endless love rather than seeking themselves to be judged for their wrongdoings. God is love, that's all.

[ZarathuPower]

@ZarathuPower God's love supersede all; he would understand us going to Buddhist temple and bow to Budda for he understands our sprituality. I like to believe God as 하느님, rather than 하나님 as in Bible.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower God bless you.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower The difference between you and I is that I see such God in the Bible, but you don’t. That’s why you had to say “Buddism is more linked in touch with human” than Christianity. Whether or not Buddhism is more linked in touch with human is a matter of speculation. But, at least I agree with you that the more one religion is linked in touch with human, the closer it gets to be true religion.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Like Paul said, “What if I could prophesy and understand all secrets and all knowledge? And what if I had faith that moved mountains? I would be nothing, unless I loved others.” 1 Corinthians 13:2

Let me quote another one: 5One of them, an expert in the law, tested him with this question: (to be continued)

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower The expert in the law asked only which is the greatest commandment in the Law; yet, Jesus mentioned 2nd commandment as well as an answer because “the second is like it.” In other words, there wouldn’t be no such thing as loving God without loving others. Jesus further clarified that all the Bible is summarized in these two commandments. I believe there is simply no other philosophy or religion that claims human value as high as Christianity.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower The expert in the law asked only which is the greatest commandment in the Law; yet, Jesus mentioned 2nd commandment as well as an answer because “the second is like it.” In other words, there wouldn’t be no such thing as loving God without loving others. Jesus further clarified that all the Bible is summarized in these two commandments. I believe there is simply no other philosophy or religion that claims human value as high as Christianity.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower The Bible tells us that humans are created in the image of God while other creature ere crated according to their own kind. When I say Jesus as the Son of God died for us, human beings, I am saying human beings are so important and precious to God’s eyes. According to God, their value is as precious as His Son is.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark Human beings are so precious to God, but why he has imposition on humans? There are many people in the church, who misused that and ask people to bring money and goods resulting in corruptions. Do u know Catholic prists were imprisioned with charges of child molestations? The Christianity is hard to follow even by prists. To me, I can be comfortable going to church on a Sunday and go to a temple in the next day freely at my own discretion.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower I think God imposes on us because He cares about us just as our parents instruct and guide us. Yes, sometime they have to impose and even force us if there is some danger involved. Again, I am not Catholic that I can’t say for them. If Christianity is composed of a lot of rules of dos or donts, I would agree with you that it wouldn’t be simply hard, but impossible. The whole point that Jesus died for our sins is because God knows that nobody can satisfy His moral standard.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Another amazing observation. However, I still have to say that according to the BIble, idol worship means believing in God your imagination created. TIme will tell you whether God in the Bible or the god in your imagination is true God. Same is true when it come to the meaning of grace and belieft. You can either refer to your own udnerstanding or the Bible.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower There is a primary issue as well as second and third. The primary issue or doctrine is what defines Christianity. That is the New Testament (not in a sense of whole book) but, the new covenant, the gospel, whiich is the basis and foundation. That's why genuine fellowship is possible, where we don't try to convert people from different denomination. In fact, it's always good to have some variance or diversity as long as they keep the primary doctrine as it is.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower I agree that the problem of Christianity began with forcing others without choice given to them. Roman Emperor Constantine was a blessing in one hand because he allowed religious freedom to Christianity, but then a curse as well by introducing concept of statechurch. True Christinity involved most intimate personal relationship which require intelectual agreement at least. I grew up myself in churchgoing family, yet it took many years to realize the simple message of salvation,

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower I believe as a saying goes,” Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any more than standing in a garage makes you a car. I can tell that attending churches often may mislead you concerning what being Christian means and what Christianity is all about. Like you indicated, it may be very hard to locate a church which genuinely represent what Christ meant.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower That’s why I feel really sorry for those who once were exposed to Church culture – not necessarily Biblical Christianity - and later abandon attending Church. But, at the same time, I have to acknowledge that our church wouldn’t be so different from the ones you visited. I get some comfort often by the fact that even the primitive churches had their own share of shortcomings.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower As imperfect and flawed as churches were and are, I believe God loves them as long as they are grounded in the primary message, mainly the Gospel, which I mentioned already. I repeat again, Christianity is a religion of keeping a bunch of godly rules. The fact I like about Jesus is that He wants more than anything else, us as such.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower He is not inviting us to a lot of rules or sophisticated ideas or philosophy; He is simply inviting us to Himself:"Come to Me, all who are weary and heavy-laden, and I will give you rest.” Mat 11:28

Rick Warren, who authored ‘the purpose driven life’, once said: we don’t need friendly people, but friend. Indeed God Himslef dislikes man being alone. I don’t know how many genuine friend you have.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Jesus said less than half day before He died on the cross – after the last supper: " This is My commandment, that you love one another, just as I have loved you. Greater love has no one than this, that one lay down his life for his friends. "You are My friends if you do what I command you.” Joh 15:13 -14 Here, Jesus describes His life mission statement.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower All He did including His sacrifice was so that He may become our friends; then He asked His followers to obey His command, which is to love your brothers as Jesus did to us.

I believe if our churches today failed, we failed in this in being genuine friend to one another. (I mean by brother those who accept the love of Jesus) Jesus called His church to be a context where people really feel a sense of belonging.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Churches might have had some success in producing friendly people, but not in making friends.

Yet, I can also tell there are numberless genuine Christians out there trying to have genuine friend relationship. I believe that you also need a genuine fellowship with someone. I also believe the most genuine and even everlasting relationship is offered by Jesus. Becoming Christian means being connected to Jesus by accepting Jesus in your heart as you Lord and Savior.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Becoming Christian is not a process, but event. It’s like a birth that takes a moment. Jesus used a term “born again” because it involves a new life with spiritual faculty with which you will see or learn to see, hear, speak, think from Christ’s perspective. Dear Zarathupower, whenever I said ‘God bless you’ to you, I meant to say God bless you by allowing you to trust God, who loves you and I far beyond our understanding. God bless you.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Your said, Christanity has evoved to adapt to new norms of the societies. In certain extent, you are ture. But, you have to also acknowledge Christinity have been pioneering when it comes to human right issue - especially womand and slave issue if you study ancient civilization on how they views women and slaves.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Churche anywhere, especailly in Korea and U.S.A need to repent, including myself. Yet, again I wish you met so many nice and even sacrificial Christians. I personally know many of them.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower . Even as recently as 20 century in Korean, I as Korean can tell you how Christinity influenced the society in their way of treating women. LIke most Koreans then, my parents also got married by their parental arrangement without meeting even once before they got married. When I was child, my father didn't share dining talbe with my mom; She had to eat at the kitchen. Our family wasn't exception.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower I think the real issue here boils down to whether or not Jesus died for our sins or not. If He indeed did, then that means so many things: God is real, God loves, Sin is serious matter before God, man is so important, etc. On the other hand, if he didn’t, Christians would turn out to be the most deceived fanatic fools.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark OK, life has been beautiful to certain extent, but there are people whose lives were suck as hell. For these people who suffered, they may have wished they they were not born. To me the notion of "sin" seems to be a bargining chip for giving me a life since nothing seem to be free in the world. That means, his love for me and giving a life is "conditional." If God is omnipotent, she shouldn't have made such bargaining chips, allowing all people to live without impositions.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower It depends on. If you think our life depends on our surrounding and condition, then you would say such

I agree that our well being a lot has to do with our circumstance and conditions. And many suffer unbearable circumstances. Often our loneliness where you don’t find any who love you or who you can love, is the most miserable and unbearable circumstance.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Bible claims that people know God only as much as God reveals Himself to them. This is one of reason why the role of the Bible is so significant. If you believe you are dealing with universal laws, what you might call impersonal truth in nature, then I would agree that meditation and other similar type of quest would be probably the most proper way to search such thing.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower On the other hand, if you are dealing with personal God, who I believe more personal than we humans are, then the best way to know Him is through what He Himself has to say. I have known you only few days, for example, but I might know you more than some of your friends you have known for many years, simply because of our conversation. I can guarantee that if you simply accept ‘the message’ you would know God more than those who spent all their lives in meditation.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower My point is this, though there is variance in people’s quest for God or truth, there is only two group as far as God is concerned: those who were saved and those who not. Since Jesus claimed Himself to be “"I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me.” Why don’t you try with Jesus first; due to his absolute statement, you will find out if He is simply liar, mad, deceived, or the one He himself claimed to be.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark I don't buy that there are only two kinds of people according to God. There are people with varying degree of faith. They are all children of God. If God is love, God should embrace even those to estranged from him. If your son is a gay, would you not embrace him even though he life is out of your normal understanding?

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Many say, they are not Christians, but they respect Jesus. But, if they are intellectually honest, they have to say either, “Jesus is lunatic or deceiver, or liar” or “Jesus is indeed as He said He is.” Jesus demand your choice.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower You talked about ‘wholesome human’ I happen to believe Jesus is the wholesome human, the best example of wholesome human. I believe getting close to Him, the wholsesome human, is the best way to be a wholesome human. God bless you.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark Religon to me is like having a meal. There are many dishes to ejoy eating at restaurants; sometimes, I would like to listen to beautiful music sung by a choir at a church, but then there aer times when I want to visit buddist temple to appreciate quietness in it. I think all Korean is not 100% Christian because of its tradition has been affected by many religions. That's what I am referring to my "upbringing", many different religions have affected me.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Again all your example as your illustration concerning religion is, no matter how much you enjoy, something impersonal. Again, I repeat, the religion in the Bible is personal relationship in nature. Whether you realize it or not, we all human beings have tremendous yearning for someone who really loves us. We have yearning for eternal and meaningful life. I do believe God Himself created such yearning which only God Himself can meet.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark Human are not capable of understanding all the love that God has given us. We just appreciate his love, that's all. God should not impose his imposition unto human. He created human out of clay, and said "I like that." Why he then turn around being capricious? His love should be without any condition if he is made up of true love.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower In your life time, you will encounter a lot of friendly people; it’s good to have such people around, yet what you really need is a friend, who love you so much and even give up the most important thing in his life. That’s how much God loves you and that’s how much Jesus loves you: “For God loved the world so much that he gave his only Son, so that everyone who believes in him may not die but have eternal life” God bless you

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark I am sure I will pray to God in times of trouble for I am mortal, but that doesn't necessary mean that I will seek God if I am not motivated to do so. I think I am a type of person who can be Christian at 11:00 PM and a Buddist at 9:00 AM. And I'll kneel in front of my ancestorial tombs to bow with no apprehension on the holidays.

[iedat1]

ZarathuPower's coment

idiot#1 grabbed the bottle with the geisha's undie in it and jabbed into No,No's ass real hard. With only pant has been pulled down still wearing undie, the pressure of his undie pulled as if his ass getting ripped off. The pain that he felt was not even greater than the worst earthquake tremor he felt. No,NO could not believe that that shoddy creature idiot#1 could exert such power on him. His undie was torn and the botttle cap was stuck in No,No's ass popped loose.

[iedat1]

@ZarathuPower

that your comment shows your nasty nature . true love of god.

yahahhahahahhahh

hey you immigrant korean. what is true love. that sounds odd in your mouth.you must be reading wrong holly book . that was written by korean. that is koean bible. yahahhahah

dont worry. god in korean bilbe saves only korean. but true god in Budhhism and Christanity saves every people even if you are moron.

first of all think why your son hate you before talking about god.

[ZarathuPower]

@iedat1 No, Japan's Buddhism is copy of Korean Buddhism. You can find most of temples in Japan in mountains like Korean's temple. And you can see all the japanese monk shave their heads like Koreans. Japan learned lots of things from Korea. Without Korea, Japan would be left with lots of unlearned people.

[iedat1]

@ZarathuPower

hey ugly korean ..

yahahhahahhahahhah

where is Korean Buddhism in korea. dont be proud of inferir culure.

look around the korea. korea is entire copy of japan. korea is inferior copy of japan.

i will ask you simple questiion.

why can not korean win the nobel prise.

it means.that kora is backward country and koreans are inferior race.

hey moron sixty yearss old korean learn the fact and true hisrtrey.

that is the why your son laughs at you every day.

[ZarathuPower]

@idiot#1 What the Fu*k is "Namu Horangi Kyo"? Namu mean "tree" and "Horangi" means tiger in Korean. What the hell the followers of Namu Horani Kyo keep repeating those Korean words?

[iedat1]

@ZarathuPower

hey moron. it is nonsense that moron like you talks about god.

how many tmes are you going to let me say " think why other korean and your son disdaine you."

yaahhahahhahahhahahha

you are silier than Judas coz. your ignorance. and bad behavior disgrace honor of korea and koreans. but, in cace kora and korean have these honor.

you are the typial korean we identify . god and other race are laughing at yor omments and korea, koreans.

what is next,, unlaned korean.

[iedat1]

@ZarathuPower

if you want me to say once more.

your son disdaine your cheap brain and laughs at your ignorance.

i will explain in plain words. key immigrant koean. you are moron.

how about it.

[ZarathuPower]

I have arrivied to the conclusion of Christanity that claims God is love, God is omnipresent, omnipotent, omniscent, but God can be jealous, God can send people to hell. If God is love, how he can send people to hell? I believe in God with only love, not hate and cause destruction. The God is not logical, the God has old crankyness. The Christanity served its purpose and its usefullness still needed, but human civilization would not lead it to beyond this point.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Yes God demands our absolute love which is for our own benefits, like a marital relationship. If you love and care about your wife, you would feel jealous if your wife deviate her attention from you to other guy. If you don't feel such, I can tell you are a really good man, efven better than God. Concerning hell, it's not something God send you there, you chose yourself. Hell is simple a place or status where you don't have God. That's what you want and so there you will be.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark I believe in neither hell nore heaven. We are just passing this world like a traveller. As we pass we see trees, mountains, rivers and we die. Nobody have ever lived through death and come back alive to tell us that what there beyond the point of death. We believe in God to the extent that we are mortal and weak. When we are sick, we would seek a supernatural being whether that be God or something else. If human don't exisits, there is no point of God's presense.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower You know what? I was simply so amazed knowing just yesterday that I was dealing with 14 years of young man. Whether I agree with you or not, I am marveled at your thought and the way you put into your thinking. May God bless you. Concerning your last post, Christians believe that Jesus resurrected (not resuscitated as some claim.) You talked about many times about Paul.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Paul was, in fact, one of the most notorious persecutor of Christians until he met the resurrected Jesus on his way to Damascus to persecute the Christians there. How he got the idea of Jesus being the Son of God as the other disciples earlier believed? It was because Paul met the resurrected Jesus: "As to his divine holiness, he was shown with great power to be the Son of God by being raised from death." Romans 1:4 in the New Testament

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower The very first message of the Christian church was "Jesus rose from the dead" Of course, this wouldn't prove to you that Jesus really rose from the dead. But, those coward disciples when Jesus died on the cross - they all ran away out of fear - reappeared with so much courage and confidence proclaiming Jesus' resurrection. One may say, they discussed among themselves and came up with the story of resurreciton of Jesus. That's plausible guess. - to be continued

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower But, thing is they all died proclaming Jesus rose from the dead. It's plausible that they possibly lied, but it's not plausilbe they died for their own lie. Dear ZarathuPower, whether people believes in God or not, they recognize there is at least universal law or natural law which is beyond our understanding and often our logic.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Can you believe at the same time there is something or someone out there which or who is more person (personal for that matter) than us, who made it possible for us to have personality. Let's say nature itself created or made them come into existence. But, how about our love, our compassion, or what seems to be our intrinsic urge to demand justice, i mean, righteousness. Where did they come from? Unless what you may call universal law has personality in itself or himself.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower I believe there is out there a person who is more person than us, who is responsible for our being. Like Bible said "we were created in the image of God." You said, we are like travellers; wouldn't it be much nicer if you home to go after all these travels. Let me a quote of what Jesus said: Jesus said to her, "I am the resurrection and the life. Those who believe in me will live, even though they die. John 11:25 God bless you.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark God bless you too. If God is so understanding, I am sure that he would understand my agnostic view as well. I believe in God who would save me whether I believe in him or not, whether I follow the teachings of Budda. God's love is boundless; he doesn't discrimate anyone more than the others because his love is so boundless, that he doesn't have to count how many people believe in him, or follow him. Human imposed their discrimatory nature onto him, and bounded themselves believing.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Your logic may honestly say you are agnostic; yet if you are afraid of being alone in cemetery at night, then that probably reveals that you realize consciously or unconsciously you can’t be agnostic. Concerning God’s love, I believe He does discriminate people. Suppose you as ruler have so much love for your people and thus forgive all the criminals, I can tell your country will turn out to be the worst place to live.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark Yeah, I have to admit that there are moments that I seek the comfort of God in times of fear and difficulties like a spoiled child. However, we ,as a parent, would condamn our child because our child estrang their parents for some reason? Even, we humans, with love for our children, willing to be understanding, why would God have less understanding than we?

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Dear ZarathuPower, I can’t agree more with you. I acknowledge I would have to say the same thing as you said here if God I believe in is the kind of God you said He is. But, I believe God loves us more than our parents or we ourselves love us: “The LORD answered, "Could a mother forget a child who nurses at her breast? Could she fail to love an infant who came from her own body? Even if a mother could forget, I will never forget you.” (Isiah 49:15)

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower You also asked if our loving parent would condemn our child because our child estrange their parents for some reason. As my answer let me quote the Bible: “God loved the people of this world so much that he gave his only Son, so that everyone who has faith in him will have eternal life and never really die. God did not send his Son into the world to condemn its people. He sent him to save them! ”

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower "No one who has faith in God's Son will be condemned. But everyone who doesn't have faith in him has already been condemned for not having faith in God's only Son." John 3:16-18 Did you notice here saying "has already been condemned". It's not in future tense; if you are separate from God, you are already condemned. It's not God's inflicting condemnation upon you, but your choice to separate yourself from God in itself is condemnation. .

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower I believe true love involves righteousness which demands justice. But, the problem is no one can meet God’s righteous standard. That’s why the Bible says People need salvation because there isn’t even one righteous person before God and “All of us have been sinful; even our best actions are filthy through and through. Because of our sins we are like leaves that wither and are blown away by the wind.” (Isaiah 64:6)

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower I as Christian believe that the cross on which Jesus died is where God’s love and righteous met. Jesus took the consequence of all our iniquities and unrighteousness and thus offered the forgiveness, thus demonstrating His love: “But God has shown us how much he loves us---it was while we were still sinners that Christ died for us!” (Romans 5:8) May the love of God fill your heart.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark I don't think God created men to spend all their lives worshipping him, or thinking about him. God created us to be flexable, creating the world with justice and harnoney. We don't have to think about our sinful nature like in the Mideveal times in dark dungeon. Christanity brought civility in the civilization, but it dod also many harms..we need to adjust the way we interpret the bible.

[iedat1]

@ZarathuPower

yahahhhahahahhahahhahahhahahah­ahha

can you undersand why your chidren estrage you .justice and harnoney? yahahhahahhahha some koran says that jusus is korean . but true is that god did not give korean wisedom of fruit. no nobel prise wineer in korea proves it. yahahhahahha

hey korean woudl you tell me how to educate your chidren.it is more likley that you repeat to your chidren "koea is great. korans are great"yahahahhha

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Dear ZarathuPower, your yet another excellent point. I have to again agree with you if what you said is what is supposed to do as believer. If that is the case then, no believers wouldn’t be able to concentrate in any other things. In fact, it was God Himself who, after creating human beings, commanded to labor: “Fill the earth with people and bring it under your control. Rule over the fish in the ocean, the birds in the sky, and every animal on the earth.” Genesis 1:28

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower When I say I love my wife with all my heart, I don't mean, I think her all the time; I may forget her while working, studying, driving, etc. But, she is my reference point in my life. Indeed, I believe the same, quoting your own, “God created us to be flexible, creating the world with justice and harmony.” For the next point I have to agree and disagree: “We don't have to think about our sinful nature like in the Medieval times in dark dungeon” But, let me explain why.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower What differentiate Christians including myself from those of Medieval period, is of heaven and earth difference. I don’t want to confuse you but, let me quote two verses from the Bible which has to do with my point: “Christ has set us free! This means we are really free. Now hold on to your freedom and don't ever become slaves of the Law again…. And if you try to please God by obeying the Law, you have cut yourself off from Christ and his wonderful kindness. (Galatians 5:1,4)

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower The people in Medieval period thought that by keeping all the Laws of God they can be saved. That’s why they tried hard to earn salvation; but the Bible says “And if you try to please God by obeying the Law, you have cut yourself off from Christ and his wonderful kindness” because “ no one is put right in God's sight by doing what the Law require” (Romans 3:20)

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower God doesn’t demand our good performance. Rather, He simply wants us to trust, that is, faith in His love as demonstrated in Jesus life and death. If you really trust the Love of God, as you do about your parents, you will know the freedom Paul talked about: "Christ has set us free! This means we are really free. Now hold on to your freedom and don't ever become slaves of the Law again."

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Yet, I have to say there is such a thing as sinful nature, which I believe destroy justice and harmony. I learned through the Bible that God is love, thus He case most about personal relationship. You can safely say the Bible is manual book for relationship. Jesus summarized the whole bible in two short sentence: “Love you God and love your neighbor”

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower This is another reason why God didn’t simply create us to spend all their lives worshipping him, or thinking about him unless you understand that worshipping God involves more than ritual; it involves our life itself that honors God by loving people.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower This is another reason why God didn’t simply create us to spend all their lives worshipping him, or thinking about him. In fact the Bible teaches true worship involves more than ritual; it involves our life itself that honors God in our relationship with others. Going back to the subject, why I believe one should be conscious about our sinful nature, it destroys relationship and separate one from another, primarily from God and others as well.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Dear ZarathuPower, I guess I did a long talk, but my whole point is that God loves you. I know you are so dear to Him. He wants you. God bless you. And let’s continue in our conversation.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark Don't waste your time talking about God on me. I know you are a nice person, and you will go to heaven, but since I don't believe in heaven or hell, it has no bearing on me. I seek consolation in God sometimes, but it's due to my humanness and my upbringings. We need to teach our children that they are allright just the way they are instead imposing God unto them and make them confused. I put the blames on Christanity guiding them strary in their path to becoming wholesome human.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Whatever would be the outcome of our conversation, I wouldn't think I wasted my time. But, I am confident, one of those days, you will come to know Jesus. I simply hope that whatever I said, may work as seed planted in your heart. I wish we were living in such a perfect world that there are no need for any kind of imposing, discipline, assignment, education, and even punishment.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Unfortunately, I believe we are living in a fallen world where there is a force of evil that dominates people. The Bible claims that everybody is under the control of such evil and “everyone has sinned and is far away from God's saving presence.” (Rom 3:23) The Bible also claims “THERE IS NONE RIGHTEOUS, NOT EVEN ONE’ thus “everyone is slave to sin.” I am sure what I just quoted would sound too strong to you, or even offensive. But, I just quoted what Jesus said;

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower in fact, He went on to say further “Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever.” (John8:34,35)

I am sure you have heard a phrase ‘born again.” Why you have to be born again simply because you are very special creature of God created in the image of God; that’s why God loves you so much. Yet, you are not child of God yet until you are born again. You mentioned your upbringings;

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower I assume from your writing, you grew church going family, where you learned a lot of dos and don’ts.  But, when Jesus said “you have to be born again” it was to Nicodemus, who, as one of most famous and respected religious leader, kept all the God’s laws required. (John 3:3,5) That means even most faithful and good people still need to be born again without any exception.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower I believe that every human being is slaved by something or someone though they may claim they are their own. I also believe Jesus came along to set us free: "So if the Son makes you free, you will be free indeed.” (John 8:35) When child is under his parents care, only then they have freedom. But, you have to become God’s child to begin with by being born again:

[ZarathuPower]

The biggest drawback in Jedaism is the it never goes beyond Jewishness, thus it is isolated religion, not accepting others.

The biggest drawback of Christanity is that its releams exist not within the scope of humanness.

However, Buddhism is solely dedicated to humanness. The Western countries needs Buddism, not Christanity, nowadays badly. The civllization built on Christanity, that made people loosing touch with humanness.

[ZarathuPower]

I think Jesus is a copycat of Budhha.

[iedat1]

@ZarathuPower

yahhahahhahahhahahhah

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower But, if ask me abosolute and insurmountalbe diffenrence, I can help you. If you can accept, Buddhism was influenced by the Old Testament, you can't say by the same token, Buddihism influenced Christinity simply because it started earlier.

Rather than saying, commonly understood, why don't you say, you and some others understand, incluyding one professor you mentioned..

[nianfochan]

"He is currently the Head Teacher of the Zen hall at 500 year-old Hwa Gye Sah Temple in the Sam Gak Sahn Mountain range, outside Seoul, South Korea."

Whoooah!! A bit of inaccuracy there!

He is head teacher of Seoul International Zen Center, the Seoul branch of the Kwan Um School of Zen, an organisation with its headquarters in Providence, Rhode Island. The Center rents a couple of floors within the HwagyeSa complex, and has nothing to do with the training of Korean monks in HwagyeSa.

[barnabaspark]

It seems Hyon Gak Sunim agrees with Jesus' teaching in many things. I wish he could go all the way to agree with what Jesus said, " I am the way, the truth and the life." Knowing him, who is the truth, will make him free.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark ONe can not ignore the fact that Buddishm had been influential to the teachings of Bible. One can find many teachings of Bible that are same as what Buddha taught 1000 years before. I am not an expert but who know what had happened during this 1,000 years, Buddha teachings could have spreaded around the goble to be adopted by Saul who was an architect of Christanity.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower I am not sure where you got such idea.

But, whether you realized it or not, it was 500 years ago before Buddah that Solomon said “life is in vanity.” The Moses writing was written 1000 years earlier than Buddah.  Of course Paul lived 500 years after since Buddha. Yet, Paul’s idea was so absolutely different from Buddah. Can you give me an example why you think Buddah teaching influenced Saul? I mean just one.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark I am quite suprsied that you're talke a back sothing that is commonly understood. You can Google "simlarity between Buddhism and Christanity." I can qoute you this also,"In 1883, Max Müller, the pioneering scholar of comparative religion and orientalist, asserted in his India: What it Can Teach Us: That there are startling coincidences between Buddhism and Christianity cannot be denied, and it must likewise be admitted that Buddhism existed at least 400 years before Christianity."

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Thank you for sharing this. But, I wonder why you are surprised so much. You and I know that every religion has certain factor common; I mean it's not unusual to find similar teaching. I would like to ask just one specific example when you say startling coincidence between Buddihism and Chrisitianty. I would tell theses coincidenc can be found also between Confucianism and Christianty as well. - to be continued

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark You know that Islam and Judaism believe in same God, so they are bound to be common in many aspects, and Judaism is kind of islolated religion that have not mde many appeals to gentiles, that its worlds could have travelled far. The teachings of Jesus can draw many parallels from Buddha. The Ten Commandments of Christianity are similar to The Precepts in Buddhism. Both men based their ethical values on the "Golden Rule" of "do one to others as you wish for them to do to you". 

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Thank you for your sharing. But, again, I have to remind you of the fact that the ten commandments of Christianity were written almost 1000 years ago before Buddha. God bless you.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark I was trying bring similarities between what Jusus said vs what Buddha said rather. Jesus also said lots of things what Chinese philosopher Lao Tze has said. I don't even know whether Jesus had ever lived; Paul was a smart guy who can fool people easily. Christanity has been orchestrated by Paul to make it stand as a religion.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Wheter you believe it or not, Jesus is not the one you think he is.

If he was a great man like Buddha or Lao, he would have never said such, for example, "I am the way, the truth and the life" He didn't simply say, " I will show or teach the way." neither did say " I am a way, a truth" Rather Jesus said He is the only way, the only truth, the only life.

You can say either he never existed as you implied by saing " I don't even know wherter Jesus ahd ever lived."

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark It doesn't make sense Jesus claims to be both human and son of God. Jesus came to earth as a human, and also knowing that he is the only son of God, that to me is little wacky. He should be either a son of God or a human, not both. God is omnipotent and omniscent, why whould he has a son like that. It's too confusing for me to understand. I can't relate to a being who is not 100% human like me. I objective is to find a perfect human, not a human is God. I think Paul really messed.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower I can totally understand when you said, ”It doesn't make sense Jesus claims to be both human and son of God.” In fact, it takes God Himself to understand to understand it : Jesus said to the disciples "But who do you say that I am?" Simon Peter answered, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God." And Jesus said to him, "Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.” Matthew 16:15-17

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower In fact, John the gosple is wholly written to let people know Jesus is the Son of God: " these have been written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing you may have life in His name." John 20:31. On the other hand, in later years, John had to warn people that " For many deceivers have gone out into the world, those who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh. This is the deceiver and the antichrist. 2 John 7

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower I agree with you that it is not logical to claime Jesus to be both human and Son of God. In fact there were many in primitive stage of Christianity who gladly accepted Jesus as the Son of God, but not as human with flesh as I jsut quoted from 2 John 1:7. Why Jesus had to come in flesh as the Son of God? Here is the reason why He as the Son of God came in flesh. - to be continued

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower It was because He had to die as sacrifice for our sins: "Since the children, as he calls them, are people of flesh and blood, Jesus himself became like them and shared their human nature. He did this so that through his death he might destroy the Devil, who has the power over death" Heb 2:14 I know my point wouldn't make sense to you unless you believe in personal God who cares about our relationship with Him and others; and also there is consequence of our sins.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower By the way if you don't even know if Jesus had ever lived, what's you point your trying to compare Christianity with Buddhism..

Again, Jesus didn't say He is just a way or truth. but the only way, the only truth, the only Life. Wheter you accept Jesus or not, that's one thing. But, you wouldn't say Jesus said similar teaching with Budda or Lao.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark If Jesus had not lived, I am comparing Jusus that Paul created vs Buddha who had, in fact, lived. I am sure that Budda had lived, but I am not 100% sure that Jesus had ever lived. Unfortuately, Jesus don't had substential evidences that he had ever lived. If you take about that is religious in Jesus' teaching, they are pretty much the same.

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower Buddah, for example, didn't know if there is God or not, which means your moral foudation is not absolute, but relative; I mean, there is no absolute moral standard since there is no absolute one for sure you can hold to.. Lao didn't believe in personal God as Jesus taught, which is one of the most fundamental differences.between in their teaching.

[iedat1]

@ZarathuPower

i heard that jeasus will be reborn to be koran in future to save human kind. this koran is going to becaome god. what a laugh. accessing to the truth of universe with meditation is the ultimate goal of buddism. 曼荼羅　is chart to embody the univers, it comes from 無量説。people needed god as　absolute power that sets peopl free from sin human kind shoudleres, but jusus can not save you from ignorance.if jusus called himself god he must be koran. yahahhahah

[ZarathuPower]

@idiot#1 I don't understand Chinese. You're pretty good with Chinese. I am sure your father is very proud of your Chinese writing. BTW, Japanese budhhism is derived from Korean buddhism. Don't ever say that it came from China.ㅋㅋㅋㅋ

[iedat1]

@ZarathuPower

yhahahhahahhah

cant you still understand the fact that you are nothing but moron,.

talking about religions yahahhaha do you have intelligenc to talk about religion .

yaahhahahhahahha

are you going to wait for birth of koran jesus who could salvage you from mud of ignorance.

yhahahhahah

[barnabaspark]

@ZarathuPower One more thing, why don't you do me a favor finding out for me just one thing or two startling coincidences Max Muller talked about.

[ZarathuPower]

@barnabaspark I don't know Max M. much, I just searched to validate my stipulation and found his name. I am sure there are many examples that I can give to you. Thre is no doubts that Christianity has been influenced by Buddism. The difference is not his teaching. The difference between these two is that Budhha never claimed that his a supernatural being where as Jusus claimed that he is a son of God and rose from the death. Also, we don't know anything about Jusus' early childhood.

[iedat1]

@ZarathuPower

yahahhahhahahhahahahah

everyone dont seem to reallize that they are talking with sixty years old korean with no intelligence. there is no way that he can understand philosophy. this koran is nothing but floor clearner.

yahahhahaha

hey korean , you should not talk about issues you can not understand.

[EnvyAbomination]

Jesus is so freaking Zen, :3

[sharon7zn]

Thank you for your great teaching, Sunim.

[jx14aby]

LIstening to this guy I can only think "That monk's crazy."

[jasmace]

great!

Thank you for this series. Seung Sahn is one of my favorite teachers.

[bonez289]

I find it a little ironic that the name of this show's host is Dennis WHOLEY (which sounds like holy).

[Bigjohnnywad]

That is his name BONEHEAD!

[skysinging]

This is my first time to see I believe program and I must say Hyun Gak sunim has been nice job. I bet Dennis could probably be interested in Buddhism also.

[Perronos]

Great teaching Sunim. Thank you very much :) / Gran enseñanza Sunim. Muchas gracias :)

Namaste