This is a great video. I am an older, beginning violist and have the bouncing bow issue. The tip about playing upside down did help, but was not a permanent fix. What I have found to work for me is to concentrate on moving the bow with my upper deltoid (i.e. muscle on the top of the shoulder) through the beginning of the down stroke through the bounce zone while keeping the elbow somewhat elevated. On upstroke, reverse this. Please let me know if this is any help. - Chris
@savblanco Chris-- I think your description is perfect. That is exactly what has to happen. It's a really tough transition to get from the lower half of the bow past the "bounce zone" as you cleverly coined it, and then into the upper half, because each half of the bow uses different muscle combinations. I like your description. Thanks! --L
As a violin-newbee I see all of my problems are being addressed in your videos ;-) I do take lessons, but your videos are a great as they are just 'out there' and I can watch them and learn from them anytime I need to and want to. Thank you for putting these videos on YouTube!
I thought the last tip was brilliant. I would have never realized that the bounce resulted from string crossing near the balance point. Unfortunately, for double stops it is typically impossible to not cross near the point sometimes. Any tips on that? Also, I would probably add that putting vertical pressure (generally a bad idea my teacher said) on the bow also results in bouncing. Therefore, horizontal pressure/motion will help correct the mistake.
@aimson Sorry for the delayed response. I do have some suggestions for double stops....well, it's not just for double stops. Of course, try to MINIMIZE the size of your string crossings, and tilting the bow ever so slightly can really kill the bounce. I love your tip about HORIZONTAL movement rather than VERTICAL. Good point.....especially true for double stops! --L
RedDesertViolin, To fix the bouncing, use a stickier rosin and tilt your bow toward the scroll a little more even at the tip. Also, when you start a down bow stroke, start slightly higher up on the string and slide down toward the bridge. On an up bow, start closer to the bridge and slide up. You should only slide a quarter of an inch to the original part of the string that you normally play on. You can see how stickier rosin can help aid with tone production. This little trick works wonders.
@shilohpatten11 Interesting suggestion about stickier rosin! I'll have to try that!
I have a question for you: Did you mis-type when you said, "Also, when you start a down bow stroke, start slightly higher up on the string and slide down toward the bridge" Did you mean "slide down toward the fingerboard? I would appreciate if you could clarify for me....I want to understand what you are saying, because I think it might be a very helpful suggestion. --Lora
RedDesertViolin, I like how you are very analytic. I never liked people telling me "just practice" in order to fix my own problems. I've realized that music is just as much a science as it is an art. I've also realized that practice makes permanent, not perfect. Every problem anyone can have with playing music can be fixed with critical thinking. That means think before you pick up to play. if you don't then you will memorize how to do it wrong. Once again practice makes permanent not perfect.
Thank you for this well thought out and delivered video. I have been struggling with bow bounce and your tutorial has been of great help, especially the latter section where you talk about the bow being perpendicular to the string (which I read as the bridge). This made an instant reduction in my bow bounce and I was able to recreate it by being away from the perpendicular position. Keep up the good work!!
Thank you for this well thought out and delivered video. I have been struggling with bow bounce and your tutorial has been of great help, especially the latter section where you talk about the bow being perpendicular to the string (which I read as the bridge). This made an instant reduction in my bow bounce and I was able to create it by being away from the perpendicular position. Keep up the good work!!
@est101010 Hey Kevin...sorry but I know nothing about Glaesels! But, if you go to violinist . com you will find a TON of experts. I'm SURE you will get the info you need! Good Luck! --Lora
@jdsherri That's true, except that it wouldn't be quite the same, because you'd have to fight to keep your bow from falling toward the bridge. But it's not a bad idea.
I think especially for inexperienced players, anxiety (or nerves) can be a cause of the unnecessary bounce. Usually when someone is anxious (nervous), their senses are more alert (which is good). As the body tenses up (as a defense mechanism), you tend to not breathe in as much. If you were to hold in your breath, you can immediately feel your muscles tighten because of the deprivation of oxygen. So breathing deeply is also helpful to properly keep your muscles operating appropriately.
@Kirkseyyang Thanks for the breathing comment, Kirkseyyang. You are SO RIGHT. I know when I am nervous, I focus on my breathing, deep inhale, slow exhale....it calms me down instantly. And yes, shallow breathing WILL add to shaky muscles.
Also.....I recently taught a webcam lesson, and worked with the student on his bouncy bow for 15 minutes before he told me that he was extremely nervous and that his bow usually doesn't bounce! YES, nerves cause bouncing!
@RedDesertViolin No problem! From one violin player to another, I sincerely thank you for your video! Personally, I really value someone else's experience, because it teaches me about something that I haven't come across, but when (or if) situation comes, I'll be more knowledgeable and be able to effectively cope. I think that your videos like the changing strings, stretching, and bouncing bows are ones that even those studying violin performance in college can really learn from! Bravo!
Thank you for your videos! I'm returning to playing after about 25 years, and can't afford lessons just yet, and this is SO very helpful, thanks again!
i made the up side down exercise and i felt completely stupid XD but was funny and i get what you said, thank you for posting these videos you are so amazing! i wish you were my teacher! ^^
@ShadowProgs LOL! I felt pretty stupid doing it too.....but it sort of helps us to understand the difference between GRAVITY, as opposed to OUR OWN muscle effort on the bow! Here's to practicing up-side-down!
@damennix Oh, I wish you hadn't removed your comment....I just read it, and it is REALLY REALLY insightful. (about the analogy of levers, and it gets amplified at the frog) I still have a copy of the comment....I'll paste it in if you say ok.
@RedDesertViolin yes you can :) lol i deleted cuz i made a typo but i guess i didnt repost when i fixed it. (opps). i was also going to say you can hold you finger out and rest the bow near the tip and pretend to change strings, now do it close to the frog. if you do it wrong, like just lowering you bow hand, you can feel how much force you put on you finger cuz your finger is lifting the end of the bow. i practiced doing it and keeping the even pressure on my finger. idk if i explaned it well
I have dramatically reduced my Bow Bouncing. I memorize the speed at which my downward stoke bounces my Bow. I slightly angle my Bow at less than North North East . While doing my downward stoke, with my angled Bow, I drag my bow from the fingerboard to the middle or near the Bridge, depending what I want to do and the sound I want to make. When my Bow is perpendicular to the Bridge, I call it pointing to the North. I am without a Teacher and making a surgical study of the violin playing.
@Judexy22 Interesting way of describing straight/crooked bow! But it makes sense. And it sounds like you have fixed your own problem of the bouncing bow by altering the sounding point, speed, and angle. Brilliant!
I have the impression that by using my body trunk I improve a little the bouncing that I do not like. I curve my trunk back a little, trying to get my bow nearer to horizontal line rather than pulling the bow nearer to an angle towards the floor. Once this done, I straighten my body trunk again. I am trying hard as I am without a Teacher. Thanks a lot for your help.
I am in the engineering field, and I understand how important to understand the engineering part of things. You teach exactly what a Learner needs to know. Your videos already helped me improve a lot. Most of my stubborn bad habits disappeared.
LOL! You are RIGHT! (and I have NO plans to take any important school tests in the near future!) Good point though....I guess old #2's will be here forever!
@GoldenUdder Thanks for the compliment! I am realizing that this bouncing bow thing is a VERY common affliction! It takes LOTS of finesse to finally eliminate it!
Your videos are all very interesting and useful! I solved one of my problems watching your video about bow hold (the trick of lean the pinky on the outer side of the "exagon")! The bouncing bow is another one of my hateful problems, but now I'm solving it by concentrate myself to keep all the body and the shoulders particularly relaxed, but it takes some time :-D Good job! ;-)
@AHHmava Even if you can find MOMENTS where you can relax your shoulders....that will help a ton. And eventually, you can turn your relaxation from "moments" to minutes, and eventually to constant relaxation. But you will find such relief in those "moments" that it will motivate you to relax more and more. Good luck!
This is a great video. I am an older, beginning violist and have the bouncing bow issue. The tip about playing upside down did help, but was not a permanent fix. What I have found to work for me is to concentrate on moving the bow with my upper deltoid (i.e. muscle on the top of the shoulder) through the beginning of the down stroke through the bounce zone while keeping the elbow somewhat elevated. On upstroke, reverse this. Please let me know if this is any help. - Chris
savblanco 5 days ago
@savblanco Chris-- I think your description is perfect. That is exactly what has to happen. It's a really tough transition to get from the lower half of the bow past the "bounce zone" as you cleverly coined it, and then into the upper half, because each half of the bow uses different muscle combinations. I like your description. Thanks! --L
RedDesertViolin 5 days ago
As a violin-newbee I see all of my problems are being addressed in your videos ;-) I do take lessons, but your videos are a great as they are just 'out there' and I can watch them and learn from them anytime I need to and want to. Thank you for putting these videos on YouTube!
sba49 1 month ago
@sba49 Thanks for the nice compliment! I'm glad you are benefitting from them. More coming soon! --L
RedDesertViolin 3 weeks ago
Many thanks from Prague. :)
terahoubicka 1 month ago
I thought the last tip was brilliant. I would have never realized that the bounce resulted from string crossing near the balance point. Unfortunately, for double stops it is typically impossible to not cross near the point sometimes. Any tips on that? Also, I would probably add that putting vertical pressure (generally a bad idea my teacher said) on the bow also results in bouncing. Therefore, horizontal pressure/motion will help correct the mistake.
aimson 1 month ago
@aimson Sorry for the delayed response. I do have some suggestions for double stops....well, it's not just for double stops. Of course, try to MINIMIZE the size of your string crossings, and tilting the bow ever so slightly can really kill the bounce. I love your tip about HORIZONTAL movement rather than VERTICAL. Good point.....especially true for double stops! --L
RedDesertViolin 1 month ago
RedDesertViolin, To fix the bouncing, use a stickier rosin and tilt your bow toward the scroll a little more even at the tip. Also, when you start a down bow stroke, start slightly higher up on the string and slide down toward the bridge. On an up bow, start closer to the bridge and slide up. You should only slide a quarter of an inch to the original part of the string that you normally play on. You can see how stickier rosin can help aid with tone production. This little trick works wonders.
shilohpatten11 2 months ago
@shilohpatten11 Interesting suggestion about stickier rosin! I'll have to try that!
I have a question for you: Did you mis-type when you said, "Also, when you start a down bow stroke, start slightly higher up on the string and slide down toward the bridge" Did you mean "slide down toward the fingerboard? I would appreciate if you could clarify for me....I want to understand what you are saying, because I think it might be a very helpful suggestion. --Lora
RedDesertViolin 2 months ago
RedDesertViolin, I like how you are very analytic. I never liked people telling me "just practice" in order to fix my own problems. I've realized that music is just as much a science as it is an art. I've also realized that practice makes permanent, not perfect. Every problem anyone can have with playing music can be fixed with critical thinking. That means think before you pick up to play. if you don't then you will memorize how to do it wrong. Once again practice makes permanent not perfect.
shilohpatten11 2 months ago
thanks for the video :)
Luvotomy24 2 months ago
THANK YOU VERY VERY MUCH <3 it really helped me!
estilofloraxviii 2 months ago
excellent. thank you
madogblue 3 months ago
Thank you for this well thought out and delivered video. I have been struggling with bow bounce and your tutorial has been of great help, especially the latter section where you talk about the bow being perpendicular to the string (which I read as the bridge). This made an instant reduction in my bow bounce and I was able to recreate it by being away from the perpendicular position. Keep up the good work!!
Thundercatfazer 3 months ago
Thank you for this well thought out and delivered video. I have been struggling with bow bounce and your tutorial has been of great help, especially the latter section where you talk about the bow being perpendicular to the string (which I read as the bridge). This made an instant reduction in my bow bounce and I was able to create it by being away from the perpendicular position. Keep up the good work!!
Thundercatfazer 3 months ago
@Thundercatfazer Awesome! I'm so glad it helped!
RedDesertViolin 3 months ago
@RedDesertViolin
I recently recieved a Glaesel v131e4 4/4 OUTFIT Violin which was made in Germany.
I don't have a very good basis for a tonal judging.
I was wondering if you know about Glaesels and their quality.
It was mentioned that it was bought for about $1245 brand new.
Any hinters? I've watched all your vids and I've looked around.
I don't have any access to a profesional either \:
Thank you very much,
-Kevin.
est101010 3 months ago
@est101010 Hey Kevin...sorry but I know nothing about Glaesels! But, if you go to violinist . com you will find a TON of experts. I'm SURE you will get the info you need! Good Luck! --Lora
RedDesertViolin 3 months ago
I discovered that I was not holding my bow perpendicular to the string and this was causing the bounce. Thanks again :)
George
pastore0506 3 months ago
@pastore0506 Hey George--good job! (that was my personal cause of bouncing bow as well...among others, but that was the main one for me!) --L
RedDesertViolin 3 months ago
Thanks for this video. I have recently developed a problem with bow bounce but you have given me much food for thought :)
George
pastore0506 3 months ago
COULD JUST BE LAYING DOWN INSTEAD OF STANDING UPSIDE DOWN FOR THE LAST EXERCISE.
jdsherri 4 months ago
@jdsherri That's true, except that it wouldn't be quite the same, because you'd have to fight to keep your bow from falling toward the bridge. But it's not a bad idea.
RedDesertViolin 4 months ago
Thanks for your video, was quite explicit and helpful. I am inspired to go through all your videos
lsefia 5 months ago
@lsefia You're welcome. I'm glad you found it helpful.
RedDesertViolin 4 months ago
I think especially for inexperienced players, anxiety (or nerves) can be a cause of the unnecessary bounce. Usually when someone is anxious (nervous), their senses are more alert (which is good). As the body tenses up (as a defense mechanism), you tend to not breathe in as much. If you were to hold in your breath, you can immediately feel your muscles tighten because of the deprivation of oxygen. So breathing deeply is also helpful to properly keep your muscles operating appropriately.
Kirkseyyang 5 months ago
@Kirkseyyang Thanks for the breathing comment, Kirkseyyang. You are SO RIGHT. I know when I am nervous, I focus on my breathing, deep inhale, slow exhale....it calms me down instantly. And yes, shallow breathing WILL add to shaky muscles.
Also.....I recently taught a webcam lesson, and worked with the student on his bouncy bow for 15 minutes before he told me that he was extremely nervous and that his bow usually doesn't bounce! YES, nerves cause bouncing!
RedDesertViolin 5 months ago
@RedDesertViolin No problem! From one violin player to another, I sincerely thank you for your video! Personally, I really value someone else's experience, because it teaches me about something that I haven't come across, but when (or if) situation comes, I'll be more knowledgeable and be able to effectively cope. I think that your videos like the changing strings, stretching, and bouncing bows are ones that even those studying violin performance in college can really learn from! Bravo!
Kirkseyyang 5 months ago
Thank you for your videos! I'm returning to playing after about 25 years, and can't afford lessons just yet, and this is SO very helpful, thanks again!
rivergem03 5 months ago
@rivergem03 I'm glad you find them useful! I'm amazed at what people have managed to learn just from tutorials like these!
RedDesertViolin 5 months ago
i made the up side down exercise and i felt completely stupid XD but was funny and i get what you said, thank you for posting these videos you are so amazing! i wish you were my teacher! ^^
ShadowProgs 6 months ago
@ShadowProgs LOL! I felt pretty stupid doing it too.....but it sort of helps us to understand the difference between GRAVITY, as opposed to OUR OWN muscle effort on the bow! Here's to practicing up-side-down!
RedDesertViolin 6 months ago
Comment removed
damennix 6 months ago
@damennix Oh, I wish you hadn't removed your comment....I just read it, and it is REALLY REALLY insightful. (about the analogy of levers, and it gets amplified at the frog) I still have a copy of the comment....I'll paste it in if you say ok.
RedDesertViolin 6 months ago
@RedDesertViolin yes you can :) lol i deleted cuz i made a typo but i guess i didnt repost when i fixed it. (opps). i was also going to say you can hold you finger out and rest the bow near the tip and pretend to change strings, now do it close to the frog. if you do it wrong, like just lowering you bow hand, you can feel how much force you put on you finger cuz your finger is lifting the end of the bow. i practiced doing it and keeping the even pressure on my finger. idk if i explaned it well
damennix 6 months ago
I have dramatically reduced my Bow Bouncing. I memorize the speed at which my downward stoke bounces my Bow. I slightly angle my Bow at less than North North East . While doing my downward stoke, with my angled Bow, I drag my bow from the fingerboard to the middle or near the Bridge, depending what I want to do and the sound I want to make. When my Bow is perpendicular to the Bridge, I call it pointing to the North. I am without a Teacher and making a surgical study of the violin playing.
Judexy22 7 months ago
@Judexy22 Interesting way of describing straight/crooked bow! But it makes sense. And it sounds like you have fixed your own problem of the bouncing bow by altering the sounding point, speed, and angle. Brilliant!
RedDesertViolin 6 months ago
I have the impression that by using my body trunk I improve a little the bouncing that I do not like. I curve my trunk back a little, trying to get my bow nearer to horizontal line rather than pulling the bow nearer to an angle towards the floor. Once this done, I straighten my body trunk again. I am trying hard as I am without a Teacher. Thanks a lot for your help.
Hugs from Mauritius.
Judexy22 7 months ago
I am in the engineering field, and I understand how important to understand the engineering part of things. You teach exactly what a Learner needs to know. Your videos already helped me improve a lot. Most of my stubborn bad habits disappeared.
Thank you.
Judexy22 7 months ago
"Old yellow #2 that no one uses anymore"
I don't think you've taken a big important school test lately...
mario11168 8 months ago
LOL! You are RIGHT! (and I have NO plans to take any important school tests in the near future!) Good point though....I guess old #2's will be here forever!
RedDesertViolin 7 months ago
Thanks so much! i finally learned to sort of control the bounce! Like the hair by the way
GoldenUdder 8 months ago
@GoldenUdder Thanks for the compliment! I am realizing that this bouncing bow thing is a VERY common affliction! It takes LOTS of finesse to finally eliminate it!
RedDesertViolin 8 months ago
Thank you for this video . It helped me a lot
syedmushtaq123 10 months ago
Your videos are all very interesting and useful! I solved one of my problems watching your video about bow hold (the trick of lean the pinky on the outer side of the "exagon")! The bouncing bow is another one of my hateful problems, but now I'm solving it by concentrate myself to keep all the body and the shoulders particularly relaxed, but it takes some time :-D Good job! ;-)
AHHmava 10 months ago
@AHHmava Even if you can find MOMENTS where you can relax your shoulders....that will help a ton. And eventually, you can turn your relaxation from "moments" to minutes, and eventually to constant relaxation. But you will find such relief in those "moments" that it will motivate you to relax more and more. Good luck!
RedDesertViolin 10 months ago