Hey guys, I'm going to quote some scripture here. Therefore, I win all arguments against religion, ever. You might be tempted to say this is a logical fallacy, but I assure it is not. Why? Because I'm quoting biblical scripture. I win.
Where do I get my morals as an atheist? From the same place the Christian does when he or she says that marrying and have sex with 12 year old girls is wrong, because the bible does not prohibit that.
BTW, Peter in Acts did away with the "shellfish" thing i.e. food restrictions, but the "don't touch a weasel or tortuous" is still intact. It's supposed to be an equal sin or crime for a man to have sex with a man as it is to touch a turtle.
Did/does Jesus only take the sin of those who believe in him? If not then would we all not be without sin even if we don't believe in him and therefor come into heaven?
@jpindseth said [[Did/does Jesus only take the sin of those who believe in him? ]]
That's the theory, yes. And not only that, but he chose/predestined who would be saved/ask for salvation and also who would have zero chance of evading everlasting torture in hell. Apparently my doomed-to-be-tortured existence is only justified as a test for someone else who is a self-described "sheep". Appalling isn't it?
Does jesus suffer every time a human dies as long as humans exist? If the answer is: no he suffered only on the cross. That would mean that who gets into heaven has been predestined and thus god knows before he creates us whether we will be doomed or not. (which eliminates free choice).
If predestined, then it is not really a test either. We are just puppets playing out the parts god wrote for his amusement.
@jpindseth, right, there are verses saying that our fate is predestined.
Eph.1:4-5 "He hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy & without blame before him in love: Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will."
All through the gospels, Jesus says that you're not getting to heaven except through him, & in John 6, he says you're not getting to him unless the "godfather" says so.
Christians generally seem to forget: If things in the old testament are no longer accepted because of Jesus, and god changed his mind about them, IF he did change his mind about them, he is therefore NOT perfect.
Also, if we are to go along with the "but that's the old testament" argument, we can throw out Creation, the Flood, the story of Abraham and Issac, the 10 Plagues, the Exodus and the story of David and Goliath among other "magical" or "miraculous" events that occurred in that portion of the Bible. If these events don't count then why believe in God. It's like reading Harry Potter, but only if the first four books don't count. It makes no sense and the last part i irrelevant.
Paused @1:40 to address Aron's point, which I fully understand but (I've thought about it a lot recently &) my view is, morality is the criteria & not the response. Deviant behaviours can be viewed as suspention of morality or justification of immorality. The justification for immoral behaviour maybe subjective & moral suspention maybe relative to culture but, the criterium & consequences of conscious, social & intentful participents' actions remains universally recognised & thus objective.
Psalm 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good. Please study and look into the facts. God is fact deal with it the proof is within yourself. Humble your self before a holy God and he will lift you up. Swallow your pride and admit atheism has been refuted over and over again but sadly when the truth is presented people still reject it because they love their sin. Repent and come to the saviour Jesus.
@jordan7787 My atheism isn't based upon pride, just humility...humility to say I know few of not any absolute truths, particuarly in relation to the origin of existance and the existance of a God, and that I think those who do are deceitful, especially when they can offer no evidence that goes beyond the abstract, overused notions of 'the proof is within you' that you said. And atheists generally reject the concept of sin, and many things I feel should be sins e.g. gullibility, are not.
they don't realy address the basis of morality, or american morality, in this video. being shino-japanese. to me athiests and even ones of other religions still draw much of thier moral and ethical views from protestant christianity to greater or lesser degrees. this might be due to christian values being so inbedded in american culture that they have become the standard norms for all americans.
I disagree. I find that there are certian moral atributes shared amoung most people and that these are reflected in many religions. As a result what we look at is the concept that the parts of Atheist morality that parallel the better parts that Christians cherry pick from their Bible.
My moral code is a simple "Cause no more harm than your actions would prevent" This simple premise is nearly universal in and out of religions
do u really have that little respect for humanity to believe that we couldn't have figured out on our own that if we are all going to exist together in societies, then we shouldn't go around killing and stealing from each other? u don't think we could have figured out after trial and error what works and doesn't work to make a collectively civil society?
@itzahazylife no i don't. humans for the most part will do as much of the 'wrong things' as they feel they can get away with.
What do you think religions are? They are social structures created to impose and enforce social order as well as to organize the whole universe. and yes they did evolved over thousands of years, through as you put it, trail and error. religion didn't desend from the heavens rather religion asended from earth as a human creation.
The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully.
@BrightLight57 Life leads to death, accept for Jelly Fish. An atheist's morality has nothing to do with his/her lack of belief in a deity, let alone your specific idea of your religions specific deity.
@BrightLight57 Life leads to death, accept for Jelly Fish. An atheist's morality has nothing to do with his/her lack of belief in a deity, let alone your specific idea of your religions specific deity.
@BrightLight57 everything thing dies. your morality and mine are the same your just "think" yours is better and comes from a book written 2000 years ago.
@pandorachild "Little "g" has you deceived...2 Corinthians 4:4
in whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of the unbelieving, that the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should not dawn upon them.
@BrightLight57 The bible is fake, why would it have any value quoting it to me? If you are going to have a discussion with the grown ups, try to use your own words and Ideas.Or you could prove the bible isnt a fake but until then it is a book I have no respect for whatsoever. (btw using the bible to prove the bible is not acceptable as its circular logic) and who the hell is little g?
Little 'g" has you deceived...Little 'g' is the God os this world (satan). "Little "g" has you deceived...2 Corinthians 4:4
in whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of the unbelieving, that the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should not dawn upon them.
@BrightLight57 Since you like to quote things here is one.
"The further the spiritual evolution of mankind advances, the more certain it seems to me that the path to genuine religiosity does not lie through the fear of life, and the fear of death, and blind faith, but through striving after rational knowledge." - Albert Einstein
Now I tend to agree with this quote myself but like your quotes it doesn't have any bearing on whether there is or isn't a god.
Little 'g" has you deceived...Little 'g' is the God of this world (satan). "Little "g" has you deceived...2 Corinthians 4:4
in whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of the unbelieving, that the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should not dawn upon them.
By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother.
To add to Aron's shellfish statement; Leviticus also implies that the pig is the most "unclean" of animals. And since the flesh of any "unclean" animal should never be touched, nor eaten, why is it that American football seems to be real popular among many American Christians. I guess they forgot that the ball was made out of pig skin.
@dirtleg27 There are some American Muslims that play American football; aside from the TLC famed “all American Muslim” who converted for the sake of marriage. But that is not the issue here. Please know that my comment was directed toward the hypocritical nature of many Christian fundamentalists that spout quotes from Leviticus and Deuteronomy when debating morality as an example of how they cherry pick the verses.
@HotblackDesiat042 I should made a reference to that joke I made with this Muslim freaking out when a customer asked for bacon at a KFC, that's what the joke was intended for
@LucisFerre1 True. While early ones were originally made from an inflated pig's bladder, most are now made of leather. The "pigskin" slang for it still remains, yet that won't even give pause to any religious (Abrahamic) person when handling one.
@hanspeterpitsch Yes, I'm definitely joking. LOL. I'm mocking the illogical inconsistencies Christians often use regarding New and Old Testaments. If the Old Testament truly doesn't count in their view, they should leave gay people alone because that's where they are getting their biblical ammunition to attack and persecute them.
@AKSBSU said [[If the Old Testament truly doesn't count in their view, they should leave gay people alone because that's where they are getting their biblical ammunition to attack and persecute them.]]
Well, Paul in his epistles said not only that men having sex with men is a sin, but he added (out of thin air apparently) lesbianism.
I like how you two take existential ideas and try and spin then into a semantical arguments. Why not just answer the question without all the emotional pleas as to what is in the bible and just answer yes or no. Is morality inherent in any way or not. It's not rocket science you monkeys.
@romney27 I think the most fundamental questions of morality can be explained in terms of objective values, though I hesitate to formulate a strong opinion on the matter. It goes into the spheres of rationality, life as social beings, and basic humanity-specific agreement on the nature of proper behaviour, but, to me, NOT into the supernatural and chimerical. Aron's take may've gotten a little torpid once he began considering (inexplicitly) what I think are minutia of social morally
@icygood101 interpreted behaviour classification ideas and ignored the essential questions of morality. That's what I deduced he was doing, and, perhaps, why you may've thought he was "dodging the question." Humanity, as is, may develop and discard behavioural norms, but that's not likely a moral point, and if you lean towards objectivism, as do I, then it almost certainly isn't. When I said there's a lot to be said, I wasn't imagining discussing it... really, I don't think we want to.
@icygood101 I appreciate it... seems a hard way to go considering that objectively nothing exist without subjective filtering. I'm not sure if "value" is not the same as "experience". If that's true then how to circumvent the notion that there is no such thing as "objective experience"? F.E. does the grand canyon experience you looking at it? Also, isn't a large part of our intuitions inherited by our ancestors experiences? Wouldn't it be hard to escape the influence of that part evolution?
@romney27 Ah, interesting points. We can certainly know some things objectively, while, of course, being limited by the constraints on our intuitive understanding of our experiences (even then, we can rationalize things beyond ordinary mental limits to the point of virtually pure objectivity). I'm not sure what you mean by experience being equal to value-characterisation and that making it objective.. the fact that evolution has let us have such great sentient potential and the fact that
@romney27 3. Of course we have this biological lens for viewing the world; but that's life! That's any conscious experience, and, as it turns out, we are exceedingly gifted by our rationality to know how it is more adequately and objectively used (to have a fair understanding of the world and how we act in it). This is beyond the point, but I just realized what a tricky idea consciousness or its lack is and the implications this bring to other questions in philosophy, relatively. A different
@romney27 our experiences are shaped by how we use it does not detract from our reasonable appreciation of our rational and social existence, and, unless there's nothing to be appreciated in that, or unless we seriously retreat from our current evolutionary state, then I believe there're objective values in OUR experience that are pretty incontestable.
@romney27 4. discussion altogether, that. And please excuse the jumbled mess I made of replying. You read the continuation of my second reply in that first set of comments? The last two for this set of four I numbered.
Hmmm, the Bible is the source of immorality. oh uh, their morality. Ok. yeah go cheat on your wife, its fine. Kill your enemy, Curse him! Martin Luther King was against the bible. he did things the way that he felt. if he killed his enemy things would be a-ok. is this what you guys mean?
If the bible is our basis for moral code. Then how do you explain Gandhi who was of the Hindu faith?
That's the point.
You don't need the bible to be a good person. Many of the morals in the bible are only in there because that people said it was bad to kill or steal. But that is a much older moral then the bible.
The Egyptians and Babylonians had laws saying you can't do those things and at that time the Torah was not even written yet.
@thedutchman01 Ah, i see. I agree. To the video, jesus as saviour yes, why? It's simple. New testament and Old are the same just updated to a new group of believers. We don't go to heaven when we die its a major misconception. burning hell is a myth. Eye for an eye is correct but they forgot to mention the bible states only within a court of law,we could go on and on, but its foolish to say that the bible promotes anarchy. Please dont criticize the bible without real research. Ok, I'm out.
The bible indeed proclkaims eye for an eye. But thst is just extremely silly. No law-maker in western society practices law on that principle because we as a species find it morally corrupt. Just because you stole something doesnot mean your hands should be cut off. Which is basically what the bible is saying.
I think it is you who needs to study your bible better, not me, and then do some research into criminal law and in how it differs from what it says in the bibe.
Actually there are the ten commandments mentioned in the new testament. If I am not mistaken it was at the point where the rich guy asks how one can go to paradise. Also these commandments where slightly different in that there was no "you shall have no other god". I think in this case the first one was "you shall love your god". But I am not sure at the moment of the exact text. I would have to look it up.
The answer is simple! Just like our modern Government has to apply laws and regulations, control and or to protect our society. God in the Old Testament did the same thing! Without today's laws passed by our government, there would be no control and differentiation between what’s right or wrong! If there is nothing set in place to determine how an individual should conduct him or herself! When the bible (see post below!)
refers to the new laws, it is not dismissing the Ten Commandments! And Jesus does not require you to break the 1st commandment, when he says the only way to God is through him! Jesus Christ is God in the flesh! He is an extension of God. John 1: 1, in the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; (see comment blow)
without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome[a] it. It’s really simple to understand! Ask yourself this question, if God created life and the universe and he is all-powerful, then how one can begin to understand his mathematics and science with a human mind when we only are able to use roughly 20% of our brains? Get it? Just like you (refer to comment below )
can’t prove his existence through human reasoning and other human or conventional scientific methods. You can’t prove that he doesn’t exist! God states that the only way to please God is through faith. Your arguments hold no logic! You misrepresent what the bible says! Or you are just picking through and manipulating it fit your argument. it seems as if you really don’t have any real knowledge of what the bible says!
@1AD76 Your bible says, follow Jesus or be screwed, period. Is this kind of psychological blackmail the best an almighty, merciful god can do? Does this seem correct for you? If you can't even get past this simple fact, i don't understand how can you claim people don't understand your bible. About god's existence: the burden of proof is on you for making a positive claim (god exists), not on us for disbelieving a claim which hasn't made it's burden of proof.
The biggest problem people have is that they can not accept the fact that they are animals and not really much different. I do not want to pick on people who are religious but they are the worst when it comes to not accepting this fact.
Jesus was complicate in the old testament read John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The word is unanimously interpreted as Jesus.
So this guy 'TheGrandEntrance' cannot win the debate when pushed by someone of very limited intelligence (myself) and as an answer he deletes everything he said here?
This is why I dislike creationists and the like. Can't win? Just run.
That's what authoritative personalities do. Don't EVER give them any ground either, not even out of kindness or pity. They will punish your weakness with the most extreme sadism.
Now though the prophecy won't come true until the temple is restored. So why don't you try and blow up the dome of the rock so that thje temple can be restored so that armageddon can start. You are praying for the death of billions of people, and you think you are doing a good deed by that.
Take your stupid superstitions and go live in a cave near Megiddo or something.
(Oh yes. I know the story, I've actually read the bible. And I see no hidden messages)
Neither could it possibly have anything to do with how jews as a people in general are rich and therefore powerfull, and the nazi's and such.
Now ofcourse they are rich because they own many banks, and they own those because jews were not allowed to do any other work in a huge part of middle age europe.
After WW2 jews nearly demanded a state, and it had to be in Israel, and seeing as they owned nearly every bank in the US they got what they wanted.
That is your best evidence to the truth of the bible?
The people who believed in this particular religion judaism lost their homeland, then some guy among them said he had a vision of them getting it back.
Ohyeah... That's really convincing evidence.
Couldn't possibly have anything to do with trying to give people hope and a new reason to still believe in the religion or anything. No it must be a true prophecy when somebody said it and it came true.
And Leviticus also commands you to kill your nighbours for working on the sabbath, and tells you to stone your son for not listening to its parents after you beat it.
So whats your point?
Do you do that aswell?
the bible condones slavery, tells you to rape the virgins of your defeated enemies and enslave or kill the rest.
Where then did you get the 7 years from in jewish reckoning? It makes little sense to me. You are simply groping for words and meanings to explain your faith in bronze age superstitions.
There is no science in the bible, and if even the vatican can recognize this as fact, then why do you fail at it?
We will talk in 2013 when the world has not ended and god has not appeared, But I am sure you will say some stupid thing at that time to make up a new year/date.
Do these people seriously think that until 2000 years ago, our ancestors had absolutely no perception of morality, that they were waiting, in between mass-murder of their tribe, orgies and allowing monogamous gay relationships, for some obscure story about some guy on a mountain to teach them, pretty poorly I might add, how to live a moral life?
@MeBeMat There people seriously think that without the bible people would run around the street killing and raping each other...I mean , this level of stupidity is just IREAL for the 21st century.How the hell can you be that ... stupid (in lack of a better word) to actualy stand by a statement like that ?
Morality and any associated ideal is rooted entirely in the presupposition some higher power defines what is correct for human behavior.
Nature is pure war with every man against another. Fear of death is the only thing that keeps the peace, so man is civilized by the threat of violence against him for transgressions upon his neighbor.
You intellectual midgets with chicken shit lives make about as much difference as the hole I leave when I pull my hand out of a bucket of water.
To be fair, that's a not unreasonable description of the world we find ourselves in, but what I want to know is, could I really save up to £216 when I buy car insurance?
haha this people are crazy. I just wanted to ask who hardwired empathy?? People think because they have little piece of paper that tells them there studies and that they have more knowledge. Well they have a belief too its Atheist and there moral code is anything that is in your heart is fair game.
Funny how the guy in the video that seems to know so much scripture hasn't realised that Jesus is God with God the Father and the Holy Spirit. Praying to and worshiping Jesus is not going against the old testement commandment of following another god. As hard as is it is to fathom (even for chistians) is there are three persons in the one God. Read Genesis 1 verse 26: "Then God said, "Lets us make make man in OUR image, in Our likeness."
Shit eating shellfish and being a raging Homo are equal sins in God's book? Well you know what they say in for a penny in for a pound. Now where's that lobster?.....
@GedoMazou It's because those ridiculous beliefs aren't allowed to be scrutinized in America among other places, and Christianity is all the basis you need to pass laws or keep laws from being passed. Funny how we live in a nation built on secular reasoning and if all you use to make decisions is reason and you don't go to Church you'll never get voted into office.
@sk8tafrnk Ridiculous is to reject the Truth of God, being purposely mistaken by devil, and worse, there are people which consciously choose to serve him! So many people serve false gods, another humans and animals, however i see no one criticizing them, chasing that ones.
In this mad world we can worship anything, but the Only Lord...
if it's all fantasy and legend, so why atheists spend so much time trying to disprove the bible?
I do not see anyone else debating about tooth fairy and gnomes..
@GedoMazou "I do not see anyone else debating about tooth fairy and gnomes.."
Of course not, the people who believe in those things aren't holding political power trying to change laws (ending abortion for one) to reflect those beliefs. Tooth fairy and gnome believers don't try to shove their beliefs down our throats. They certainly don't advocate our DEATHS simply because we don't believe in what they do.
Unfortunately the god myth affects us all, believers and non-believers alike.
@BastEternal Oh, but i'm think that the world do that things because they hate the idea of a God, simply cuz they just wanna live in their sins, it's that simple... I know because i'm also human, when we love iniquity so we try to flee away from God, cuz we know He hates the sin and wants us not to do it, but to obey Him.
Is that bad? What about that people which offered their sons to be burned to false gods, satanists that sacrifices another person to the devil, etc?
Not, it's NOT that simple. Lack of belief in god or gods does not automatically make people want to run around and do bad things. I personally LIKE people, I LIKE when they're happy. I don't drugs and don't have promiscuous sex because I know that it's dangerous, can shorten my life, and it's against the law. I value monogamous relationships and a healthy lifestyle.
God asked abraham to sacrifice his own little boy, Isaac.
@BastEternal Ok, i'm not saying that ur doing any of that! But the people around the world does at least one of sins, everyone does, no one is perfect, neither the christians also.
God has tested the faith of Abraham, but Isaac wan't killed anyway, God has that right, He's Supreme!
And better, He's Almight, instead of use His power to destroy us, He prefer to be Merciful and wait us to repent, just to give us a very better life, now and forever.
You didn't answer the question, you just made a deplorable, immorally corrupt excuse.
Was it bad to ask abraham to sacrifice his own son? Yes or no.
And is this love?
"instead of use His power to destroy us, He prefer to be Merciful"
You obviously have not read the entire bible. Why don't you try and read the ENTIRE bible not just the little bits you agree with and the stuff you've been indoctrinated with by other believers?
@BastEternal No, it's not bad, He's our Creator, but you certainly didn't read that He do not allowed the sacrifice, just tested Abraham's loyalty... I already ready entire bible, i know that there are parts very hard to understand, but i ask you, if God is as bad as you say, why so are we all still alive? Even the atheists, satanists, and all other unbelievers, and the christians yet, cuz they sin, too...
Funny that no one here talks about the evil of satan
@GedoMazou There you go, assuming I didn't read the entire thing. Considering that this god is supposed to know the future, he already knew abraham was going to go through the motions, so he already KNEW abraham was loyal. It's STUPID. Just like Job...the man suffered for NOTHING because god already KNEW how it was going to end up.
It's STUPID. The whole IDEA is stupid.
And if you can't figure out why a bunch of atheists don't talk about the "evils of satan," you're a moron. Bye.
@GedoMazou I goof on the idea of Satan all the time as do many people I know who understand that Satan is a made up character to fear the masses into obedience. Your line though is my favorite...No, its not bad, He's our Creator. Sounds like a case of stockholm syndrome.
@momentofsciencetx So i ask you, who's is the being that satanist and freemasons worships? Certainly they create him to fear themselves to believe in... Great
@GedoMazou who is the being that satanist and free masons worship? Well I think satanist worship satan. Yet another made up character worshiped by morons. As for the free masons you just have to believe in a supreme being. So whats your point? Other than proving mine, that people are willing to believe in nonsense.
@GedoMazou "just tested Abraham's loyalty" Wheter this deity of your choice stopped abraham or not is not the issue here. What is the issue is that this story tells people that if god asks you to kill your child - you should do it.
And that's what the real deal here is. Nobody cares if he was stopped or not. The simple fact is that this dude was willing to kill his child because he believed voices in his head asked him to. And you idiots are trying to sell that as a GOOD thing.
@GedoMazou Ridiculous is to reject the Truth of Vishnu. Ridiculous is to reject the Truth of Allah. Ridiculous is to reject the Truth of Braham. Ridiculous is to reject the Truth of Tengri. Ridiculous is to reject the Truth of _______. (fill in the blank). Just because you say it, doesn't make it truth. But it is typical of most believers like yourself to use the Devil scare tactic as you did. As for atheist trying to disprove the bible, thatsalready been done by logic and common sense.
@momentofsciencetx And just because you don't wanna believe, this doesn't make it a lie...
Look, what do you think i earn for preaching the Gospel, and be offended, hated, etc? I got no money for this, no cars, houses, nothing else, physically speaking... So i use not devil tactic to scare u, that's the obvious truth of bible, which we can see in everywhere, his wills, wars, kills, drugs, rebel teens, etc.
I do it just bcuz Jesus commanded in His Gospels, cuz He wanna save everybody
@GedoMazou that's the obvious truth of bible, which we can see in everywhere, his wills, wars, kills, drugs, rebel teens, etc. proof?????????????? can i have any amount of proof that your god exist and ask you why you believe? now if its personal simply state it and ill drop it. but dont use personal reasons to try and convince people.
@GedoMazou It has nothing to do with "not wanting to believe." You are a product of geography this is why you believe what you believe. Had you grown up in a muslim country or hindu, you would be making the same arguments for those beliefs and accusing me of not wanting to believe that nonsense as well. Atheist born here or atheist born there...still an atheist. You blame problems on the devil, others blame them on the demons they believe in.
@GedoMazou your arguments are no different then those provided by people of other faiths whom I have this same discussion with. But do yourself a favor and stop with the circular logic. The Bible is truth. Ok how? Because its Gods word. How do you know its Gods word? Cause the bible says so.
@momentofsciencetx We have no reason to distrust the bible, it's historical and spiritual correct, and its prophecies are still showing to be true, many of that has been accomplished or is been fulfilled now, with no fail...
If ya look around and pay attention for what's happening now, wars, epidemics, steals, murder, vice, so many 'gods' and doctrines, etc, you have to think, something supernatural should be behind all this... There's not other reason!
@GedoMazou your gullibilty is saddening. The Quran is described by Muslims as historical and correct. Muslims claim the predictions in their Quran are coming true. Utter nonsense. you can take any basic claim and twist it to fit current events. People believe Nastradamus predictions are coming true. Again twisting basic claims to fit current events. Here is a bit of news, wars, epedemics, murder, etc. have always been a part of human history. What you are seeing is nothing new.
@GedoMazou people just like you a thousand years ago, a hundred years ago, etc made these same claims. And if something super natural is behind all these things you claim and if this "something super natural" is your god..guess what he or she or what ever you call it is a dick.
So, tell me, what's going on with the mankind? Despite of every increase in knowledge, science, human rights, globalization, release of each 'outdated' thing, like chastity, faith, hope, religion, etc, everything is going worse day after day... People gives up traditional things like that, but they never leaves war behind, even thousands years later...
@GedoMazou You are so wrong! People live longer than ever now. There is less war and torture in the world than in centuries past. We can communicate almost instantly instead of taking weeks. We've cured many diseases and eradicated one. We are smarter, bigger and stronger than our ancestors. We have modern transportation and have left the planet.
Change happens gradually. Sure, the world isn't perfect and it never will be, but it's a LOT better than it used to be and you're too blind to see.
@ciaochowbella Good, but it's inadmissible that people may make wars yet, despite of every advance of knowledge, the mankind is destroying the environment trough their voracious greed for more and more profit, youth doesn't respect parents and authorities anymore, the perversion is growing at everywhere, TV, internet... No mention about drugs, pedophilia, suicides, parricide, causeless violence, racism, and the increasing persecution of God, faith, religion, etc. May we call this 'better'?
@GedoMazou You want a perfect world. It will never happen. Disrespect and "perversion" are not necessarily bad. Drugs, pedophilia, suicide, etc. have always existed and always will.
You cannot persecute god. That's an imaginary problem. Faith is an excuse for ignorance and bigotry. Religion has caused more harm than good.
Yes, we can call this better. MUCH better. If you'd focus on the positive, you'd see it too.
@GedoMazou "Look, what do you think i earn for preaching the Gospel, and be offended, hated, etc? I got no money for this, no cars, houses, nothing else, physically speaking..."
Hey guys, I'm going to quote some scripture here. Therefore, I win all arguments against religion, ever. You might be tempted to say this is a logical fallacy, but I assure it is not. Why? Because I'm quoting biblical scripture. I win.
SoCalledSpaceAge 6 days ago
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joe744 1 month ago
@joe744 XD Please tell me you're just being sarcastic
handsup48 1 month ago
@joe744 let me illuminate you with some kind words... *ahem* fuck you
XavSch 1 month ago
Where do I get my morals as an atheist? From the same place the Christian does when he or she says that marrying and have sex with 12 year old girls is wrong, because the bible does not prohibit that.
BTW, Peter in Acts did away with the "shellfish" thing i.e. food restrictions, but the "don't touch a weasel or tortuous" is still intact. It's supposed to be an equal sin or crime for a man to have sex with a man as it is to touch a turtle.
LucisFerre1 1 month ago
Why would any one even debate the existens of the God of the bible? .. every rational person in the world can see that Aronra is God
TioPhillippe 1 month ago
I ate shellfish last week. I'm going to hell. :(
Eriance 2 months ago
Did/does Jesus only take the sin of those who believe in him? If not then would we all not be without sin even if we don't believe in him and therefor come into heaven?
jpindseth 2 months ago
@jpindseth said [[Did/does Jesus only take the sin of those who believe in him? ]]
That's the theory, yes. And not only that, but he chose/predestined who would be saved/ask for salvation and also who would have zero chance of evading everlasting torture in hell. Apparently my doomed-to-be-tortured existence is only justified as a test for someone else who is a self-described "sheep". Appalling isn't it?
LucisFerre1 1 month ago
@LucisFerre1: I have a follow up then.
Does jesus suffer every time a human dies as long as humans exist? If the answer is: no he suffered only on the cross. That would mean that who gets into heaven has been predestined and thus god knows before he creates us whether we will be doomed or not. (which eliminates free choice).
If predestined, then it is not really a test either. We are just puppets playing out the parts god wrote for his amusement.
jpindseth 1 month ago
@jpindseth, right, there are verses saying that our fate is predestined.
Eph.1:4-5 "He hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy & without blame before him in love: Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will."
All through the gospels, Jesus says that you're not getting to heaven except through him, & in John 6, he says you're not getting to him unless the "godfather" says so.
LucisFerre1 1 month ago
Christians generally seem to forget: If things in the old testament are no longer accepted because of Jesus, and god changed his mind about them, IF he did change his mind about them, he is therefore NOT perfect.
LolzAtMagicMuffins 3 months ago
I almost like AronRa more than Matt, but to be honest, these two gentleman are the best duo.
elvebrothergenju 3 months ago
AronRa reminds me of Anton LaVey...LOL
TomVodkaCollins 3 months ago
soooooo true, glad i found this
Bexdastar 3 months ago
Morality has two pathways: objective and subjective. Subjective is based on personal feeling, taste, or opinion. Objective requests moral facts.
The wrong idea here is that, because we can derive morality from society, we aren't acting on a subjective basis of morality, but we are.
"Hardwired" aren't moral facts and, still, acted upon subjectively: we are "hardwired" to have hair, but being bald is not objectively bad.
Bourtini 3 months ago
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Bourtini 3 months ago
Also, if we are to go along with the "but that's the old testament" argument, we can throw out Creation, the Flood, the story of Abraham and Issac, the 10 Plagues, the Exodus and the story of David and Goliath among other "magical" or "miraculous" events that occurred in that portion of the Bible. If these events don't count then why believe in God. It's like reading Harry Potter, but only if the first four books don't count. It makes no sense and the last part i irrelevant.
pipolwes000 3 months ago
Paused @1:40 to address Aron's point, which I fully understand but (I've thought about it a lot recently &) my view is, morality is the criteria & not the response. Deviant behaviours can be viewed as suspention of morality or justification of immorality. The justification for immoral behaviour maybe subjective & moral suspention maybe relative to culture but, the criterium & consequences of conscious, social & intentful participents' actions remains universally recognised & thus objective.
MrLittletomdj 3 months ago
Psalm 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good. Please study and look into the facts. God is fact deal with it the proof is within yourself. Humble your self before a holy God and he will lift you up. Swallow your pride and admit atheism has been refuted over and over again but sadly when the truth is presented people still reject it because they love their sin. Repent and come to the saviour Jesus.
jordan7787 4 months ago
@jordan7787 My atheism isn't based upon pride, just humility...humility to say I know few of not any absolute truths, particuarly in relation to the origin of existance and the existance of a God, and that I think those who do are deceitful, especially when they can offer no evidence that goes beyond the abstract, overused notions of 'the proof is within you' that you said. And atheists generally reject the concept of sin, and many things I feel should be sins e.g. gullibility, are not.
NativeAlternative 4 months ago
@jordan7787 You wrote: "...atheism has been refuted over and over again..."
Atheism is the rejection of baseless claims with respect to the existence of god(s). How, exactly, has it "been refuted?"
YY4Me133 3 months ago 50
@YY4Me133 It has been refuted by: closing your eyes, sticking fingers in your ears and going LALALALALA in a loud voice.
Dragonsnack73 3 months ago 7
@Dragonsnack73 Finally, a response I laughed at that was meant to be funny. :o)
YY4Me133 3 months ago
@YY4Me133 I was not trying to be funny!
Dragonsnack73 3 months ago
@Dragonsnack73 Really? Then, what were you trying to do?
YY4Me133 3 months ago
@YY4Me133 I wasn't serious about the not trying to be funny part ;)
Dragonsnack73 3 months ago
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daverowbotham 2 weeks ago
they don't realy address the basis of morality, or american morality, in this video. being shino-japanese. to me athiests and even ones of other religions still draw much of thier moral and ethical views from protestant christianity to greater or lesser degrees. this might be due to christian values being so inbedded in american culture that they have become the standard norms for all americans.
baimeng1 4 months ago
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@baimeng1
I disagree. I find that there are certian moral atributes shared amoung most people and that these are reflected in many religions. As a result what we look at is the concept that the parts of Atheist morality that parallel the better parts that Christians cherry pick from their Bible.
My moral code is a simple "Cause no more harm than your actions would prevent" This simple premise is nearly universal in and out of religions
whiteowl1415 4 months ago
@baimeng1
do u really have that little respect for humanity to believe that we couldn't have figured out on our own that if we are all going to exist together in societies, then we shouldn't go around killing and stealing from each other? u don't think we could have figured out after trial and error what works and doesn't work to make a collectively civil society?
itzahazylife 3 months ago
@itzahazylife no i don't. humans for the most part will do as much of the 'wrong things' as they feel they can get away with.
What do you think religions are? They are social structures created to impose and enforce social order as well as to organize the whole universe. and yes they did evolved over thousands of years, through as you put it, trail and error. religion didn't desend from the heavens rather religion asended from earth as a human creation.
baimeng1 3 months ago
@baimeng1
i can agree with that as long as u don't believe God had to tell us what is right or wrong..we could have figured that out on our own.
itzahazylife 3 months ago
@baimeng1 What is the moral ground of your culture like?
d007ization 3 months ago
@d007ization confucian.
baimeng1 3 months ago
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The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully.
waterandphotons1 4 months ago
The Dhammapada and Tao Te Ching wipe the FLOOR with all that tribal desert nonsense
bigredphenom 4 months ago 2
Faith without works is dead...James 2:26
BrightLight57 5 months ago
@BrightLight57 Works without faith are preferable.... Me 12:29 (pm)
wraith168 3 months ago
An atheist follows his own morality...this leads to death...simple
These people talking are so selfish...sad.
BrightLight57 5 months ago
@BrightLight57 I would submit that most people have a higher moral standard that any god, include and especially the judeo christian god.
wraith168 3 months ago
@BrightLight57 Life leads to death, accept for Jelly Fish. An atheist's morality has nothing to do with his/her lack of belief in a deity, let alone your specific idea of your religions specific deity.
Alphacaliber 3 weeks ago
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@BrightLight57 Life leads to death, accept for Jelly Fish. An atheist's morality has nothing to do with his/her lack of belief in a deity, let alone your specific idea of your religions specific deity.
Alphacaliber 3 weeks ago
An atheist follows his own morality...this leads to death...simple
BrightLight57 5 months ago
@BrightLight57 everything thing dies. your morality and mine are the same your just "think" yours is better and comes from a book written 2000 years ago.
pandorachild 5 months ago
@pandorachild "Little "g" has you deceived...2 Corinthians 4:4
in whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of the unbelieving, that the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should not dawn upon them.
BrightLight57 5 months ago
@BrightLight57 The bible is fake, why would it have any value quoting it to me? If you are going to have a discussion with the grown ups, try to use your own words and Ideas.Or you could prove the bible isnt a fake but until then it is a book I have no respect for whatsoever. (btw using the bible to prove the bible is not acceptable as its circular logic) and who the hell is little g?
pandorachild 5 months ago
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Little 'g" has you deceived...Little 'g' is the God os this world (satan). "Little "g" has you deceived...2 Corinthians 4:4
in whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of the unbelieving, that the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should not dawn upon them.
BrightLight57 5 months ago
@BrightLight57 Since you like to quote things here is one.
"The further the spiritual evolution of mankind advances, the more certain it seems to me that the path to genuine religiosity does not lie through the fear of life, and the fear of death, and blind faith, but through striving after rational knowledge." - Albert Einstein
Now I tend to agree with this quote myself but like your quotes it doesn't have any bearing on whether there is or isn't a god.
wraith168 3 months ago
@BrightLight57 Pinky, just so you know, 'god' is not a name. It's a job description.
The NAME of your deity is YHWH.
Don't be stupid AND a douche at the same time. You make it too easy to ridicule you.
ciaochowbella 5 months ago
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@ciaochowbella Read this.....
Little 'g" has you deceived...Little 'g' is the God of this world (satan). "Little "g" has you deceived...2 Corinthians 4:4
in whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of the unbelieving, that the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should not dawn upon them.
BrightLight57 5 months ago
@BrightLight57 Here's a little hint for you.
You have to give people a good reason to believe that the bible is true before quoting it means anything.
Zentz29 3 months ago
@Zentz29 1 John 3:10
By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother.
BrightLight57 3 months ago
@BrightLight57 fucking poe...
you are as bad as fundies...
Zentz29 3 months ago
@BrightLight57 No life leads to death.
wraith168 3 months ago
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@wraith168 said [[No life leads to death.]]
So, Jesus didn't exist?
LucisFerre1 1 month ago
@romney27 its to bad that they couldnt finish because that dutchman guy bailed the debate before anything could be said. XD
DownHavenFilms 5 months ago
To add to Aron's shellfish statement; Leviticus also implies that the pig is the most "unclean" of animals. And since the flesh of any "unclean" animal should never be touched, nor eaten, why is it that American football seems to be real popular among many American Christians. I guess they forgot that the ball was made out of pig skin.
HotblackDesiat042 5 months ago 24
@HotblackDesiat042 I think Muslims are the only ones that got that right
dirtleg27 3 months ago
@dirtleg27 There are some American Muslims that play American football; aside from the TLC famed “all American Muslim” who converted for the sake of marriage. But that is not the issue here. Please know that my comment was directed toward the hypocritical nature of many Christian fundamentalists that spout quotes from Leviticus and Deuteronomy when debating morality as an example of how they cherry pick the verses.
HotblackDesiat042 3 months ago
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@HotblackDesiat042 Oh yeah I knew of what your comment was about, what I said was merely a joke, not to be taken seriously.
dirtleg27 3 months ago
@HotblackDesiat042 I should made a reference to that joke I made with this Muslim freaking out when a customer asked for bacon at a KFC, that's what the joke was intended for
dirtleg27 3 months ago
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@dirtleg27 said [[I should made a reference to that joke I made with this Muslim freaking out when a customer asked for bacon at a KFC]]
.
That was a fucking hilarious video.
LucisFerre1 1 month ago
@HotblackDesiat042 said [[There are some American Muslims that play American football; ]]
.
Footballs are no longer made with pigskin.
LucisFerre1 1 month ago
@LucisFerre1 True. While early ones were originally made from an inflated pig's bladder, most are now made of leather. The "pigskin" slang for it still remains, yet that won't even give pause to any religious (Abrahamic) person when handling one.
HotblackDesiat042 1 month ago
@HotblackDesiat042 That's in the Old Testament. The Old Testament doesn't count except for discrimination against gays.
AKSBSU 2 months ago
@AKSBSU Why doesn't it count? I guess you're joking, or at least I hope
hanspeterpitsch 2 months ago
@hanspeterpitsch Yes, I'm definitely joking. LOL. I'm mocking the illogical inconsistencies Christians often use regarding New and Old Testaments. If the Old Testament truly doesn't count in their view, they should leave gay people alone because that's where they are getting their biblical ammunition to attack and persecute them.
AKSBSU 2 months ago
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@AKSBSU said [[If the Old Testament truly doesn't count in their view, they should leave gay people alone because that's where they are getting their biblical ammunition to attack and persecute them.]]
Well, Paul in his epistles said not only that men having sex with men is a sin, but he added (out of thin air apparently) lesbianism.
LucisFerre1 1 month ago
I like how you two take existential ideas and try and spin then into a semantical arguments. Why not just answer the question without all the emotional pleas as to what is in the bible and just answer yes or no. Is morality inherent in any way or not. It's not rocket science you monkeys.
romney27 5 months ago
@romney27 It's a complex issue, and going further into subjectivity, etc., there may be a lot to be said.
icygood101 5 months ago
@icygood101 then let it be said, and we can take it from there...
romney27 5 months ago
@romney27 I think the most fundamental questions of morality can be explained in terms of objective values, though I hesitate to formulate a strong opinion on the matter. It goes into the spheres of rationality, life as social beings, and basic humanity-specific agreement on the nature of proper behaviour, but, to me, NOT into the supernatural and chimerical. Aron's take may've gotten a little torpid once he began considering (inexplicitly) what I think are minutia of social morally
icygood101 4 months ago
@icygood101 interpreted behaviour classification ideas and ignored the essential questions of morality. That's what I deduced he was doing, and, perhaps, why you may've thought he was "dodging the question." Humanity, as is, may develop and discard behavioural norms, but that's not likely a moral point, and if you lean towards objectivism, as do I, then it almost certainly isn't. When I said there's a lot to be said, I wasn't imagining discussing it... really, I don't think we want to.
icygood101 4 months ago
@icygood101 I appreciate it... seems a hard way to go considering that objectively nothing exist without subjective filtering. I'm not sure if "value" is not the same as "experience". If that's true then how to circumvent the notion that there is no such thing as "objective experience"? F.E. does the grand canyon experience you looking at it? Also, isn't a large part of our intuitions inherited by our ancestors experiences? Wouldn't it be hard to escape the influence of that part evolution?
romney27 4 months ago
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icygood101 4 months ago
@romney27 Ah, interesting points. We can certainly know some things objectively, while, of course, being limited by the constraints on our intuitive understanding of our experiences (even then, we can rationalize things beyond ordinary mental limits to the point of virtually pure objectivity). I'm not sure what you mean by experience being equal to value-characterisation and that making it objective.. the fact that evolution has let us have such great sentient potential and the fact that
icygood101 4 months ago
@romney27 3. Of course we have this biological lens for viewing the world; but that's life! That's any conscious experience, and, as it turns out, we are exceedingly gifted by our rationality to know how it is more adequately and objectively used (to have a fair understanding of the world and how we act in it). This is beyond the point, but I just realized what a tricky idea consciousness or its lack is and the implications this bring to other questions in philosophy, relatively. A different
icygood101 4 months ago
@romney27 our experiences are shaped by how we use it does not detract from our reasonable appreciation of our rational and social existence, and, unless there's nothing to be appreciated in that, or unless we seriously retreat from our current evolutionary state, then I believe there're objective values in OUR experience that are pretty incontestable.
icygood101 4 months ago
@romney27 4. discussion altogether, that. And please excuse the jumbled mess I made of replying. You read the continuation of my second reply in that first set of comments? The last two for this set of four I numbered.
icygood101 4 months ago
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@thedutchman01 ok. Exodus 21:1 to chapt 22-25. And can you tell me what the overall theme of the bible is?
DecentExposureMedia 6 months ago
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DecentExposureMedia 6 months ago
Hmmm, the Bible is the source of immorality. oh uh, their morality. Ok. yeah go cheat on your wife, its fine. Kill your enemy, Curse him! Martin Luther King was against the bible. he did things the way that he felt. if he killed his enemy things would be a-ok. is this what you guys mean?
DecentExposureMedia 6 months ago
@DecentExposureMedia
If the bible is our basis for moral code. Then how do you explain Gandhi who was of the Hindu faith?
That's the point.
You don't need the bible to be a good person. Many of the morals in the bible are only in there because that people said it was bad to kill or steal. But that is a much older moral then the bible.
The Egyptians and Babylonians had laws saying you can't do those things and at that time the Torah was not even written yet.
thedutchman01 6 months ago
@thedutchman01 Ah, i see. I agree. To the video, jesus as saviour yes, why? It's simple. New testament and Old are the same just updated to a new group of believers. We don't go to heaven when we die its a major misconception. burning hell is a myth. Eye for an eye is correct but they forgot to mention the bible states only within a court of law,we could go on and on, but its foolish to say that the bible promotes anarchy. Please dont criticize the bible without real research. Ok, I'm out.
DecentExposureMedia 6 months ago
@DecentExposureMedia
The bible indeed proclkaims eye for an eye. But thst is just extremely silly. No law-maker in western society practices law on that principle because we as a species find it morally corrupt. Just because you stole something doesnot mean your hands should be cut off. Which is basically what the bible is saying.
I think it is you who needs to study your bible better, not me, and then do some research into criminal law and in how it differs from what it says in the bibe.
thedutchman01 6 months ago
Actually there are the ten commandments mentioned in the new testament. If I am not mistaken it was at the point where the rich guy asks how one can go to paradise. Also these commandments where slightly different in that there was no "you shall have no other god". I think in this case the first one was "you shall love your god". But I am not sure at the moment of the exact text. I would have to look it up.
inotaishu1 6 months ago
The answer is simple! Just like our modern Government has to apply laws and regulations, control and or to protect our society. God in the Old Testament did the same thing! Without today's laws passed by our government, there would be no control and differentiation between what’s right or wrong! If there is nothing set in place to determine how an individual should conduct him or herself! When the bible (see post below!)
1AD76 6 months ago
refers to the new laws, it is not dismissing the Ten Commandments! And Jesus does not require you to break the 1st commandment, when he says the only way to God is through him! Jesus Christ is God in the flesh! He is an extension of God. John 1: 1, in the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; (see comment blow)
1AD76 6 months ago
without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome[a] it. It’s really simple to understand! Ask yourself this question, if God created life and the universe and he is all-powerful, then how one can begin to understand his mathematics and science with a human mind when we only are able to use roughly 20% of our brains? Get it? Just like you (refer to comment below )
1AD76 6 months ago
can’t prove his existence through human reasoning and other human or conventional scientific methods. You can’t prove that he doesn’t exist! God states that the only way to please God is through faith. Your arguments hold no logic! You misrepresent what the bible says! Or you are just picking through and manipulating it fit your argument. it seems as if you really don’t have any real knowledge of what the bible says!
1AD76 6 months ago
@1AD76 Your bible says, follow Jesus or be screwed, period. Is this kind of psychological blackmail the best an almighty, merciful god can do? Does this seem correct for you? If you can't even get past this simple fact, i don't understand how can you claim people don't understand your bible. About god's existence: the burden of proof is on you for making a positive claim (god exists), not on us for disbelieving a claim which hasn't made it's burden of proof.
hellhammerz666 6 months ago
AronRa has a very resonant, beautiful voice.
noiseache 6 months ago
i'm christian i don't think that you will go out kill and rape people.
casablanca4381 6 months ago
The biggest problem people have is that they can not accept the fact that they are animals and not really much different. I do not want to pick on people who are religious but they are the worst when it comes to not accepting this fact.
Fact.
pimpymcdougall 6 months ago
@Mankey43 Yes they do, they are putting it in another angle
pochopaz7381 7 months ago
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Jesus was complicate in the old testament read John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The word is unanimously interpreted as Jesus.
sergeantrex 7 months ago
Oh great...
So this guy 'TheGrandEntrance' cannot win the debate when pushed by someone of very limited intelligence (myself) and as an answer he deletes everything he said here?
This is why I dislike creationists and the like. Can't win? Just run.
thedutchman01 8 months ago 27
@thedutchman01
Consider it a flawless victory then, brother.
federationcaptain 7 months ago
@thedutchman01 ill take that challenge... give me your best shot.
zestydude87 7 months ago
@zestydude87
Hehe :)
thedutchman01 7 months ago
@thedutchman01 exactly bro, exactly.
antoshahorosha 6 months ago
@thedutchman01 he wanted to make a... grand exit... YEAHHH!!!
FTWization 5 months ago
@FTWization
You forgot the... sunglasses. *puts on sunglasses* YEAHHH!!!
thedutchman01 5 months ago
@thedutchman01 'TheGrandEntrance' rage quit the debate because he wanted to make a... *puts on sunglasses* grand exit... YEAHHH!!!
FTWization 5 months ago
@FTWization
That was just so bad it actually made me LoL
I thank you good Sir.
thedutchman01 5 months ago
@thedutchman01
That's what authoritative personalities do. Don't EVER give them any ground either, not even out of kindness or pity. They will punish your weakness with the most extreme sadism.
Callirgos1 4 months ago
@TheGrandEntrance
Now though the prophecy won't come true until the temple is restored. So why don't you try and blow up the dome of the rock so that thje temple can be restored so that armageddon can start. You are praying for the death of billions of people, and you think you are doing a good deed by that.
Take your stupid superstitions and go live in a cave near Megiddo or something.
(Oh yes. I know the story, I've actually read the bible. And I see no hidden messages)
thedutchman01 8 months ago
@TheGrandEntrance
Neither could it possibly have anything to do with how jews as a people in general are rich and therefore powerfull, and the nazi's and such.
Now ofcourse they are rich because they own many banks, and they own those because jews were not allowed to do any other work in a huge part of middle age europe.
After WW2 jews nearly demanded a state, and it had to be in Israel, and seeing as they owned nearly every bank in the US they got what they wanted.
thedutchman01 8 months ago
@TheGrandEntrance
...
That is your best evidence to the truth of the bible?
The people who believed in this particular religion judaism lost their homeland, then some guy among them said he had a vision of them getting it back.
Ohyeah... That's really convincing evidence.
Couldn't possibly have anything to do with trying to give people hope and a new reason to still believe in the religion or anything. No it must be a true prophecy when somebody said it and it came true.
thedutchman01 8 months ago
@TheGrandEntrance
No idea. All I know for certain is that you found 2 arbitrary dates, and made them to fit your imaginary prophecies.
Anyone can do that. The first one okay. Lets take that as a starter. Then just find anything about Israel that somehow fits to make the 'math' work.
You are looking for patterns that simply are not there.
thedutchman01 8 months ago
@TheGrandEntrance
And Leviticus also commands you to kill your nighbours for working on the sabbath, and tells you to stone your son for not listening to its parents after you beat it.
So whats your point?
Do you do that aswell?
the bible condones slavery, tells you to rape the virgins of your defeated enemies and enslave or kill the rest.
Do you do that aswell?
thedutchman01 8 months ago
@TheGrandEntrance
*sigh*
Where then did you get the 7 years from in jewish reckoning? It makes little sense to me. You are simply groping for words and meanings to explain your faith in bronze age superstitions.
There is no science in the bible, and if even the vatican can recognize this as fact, then why do you fail at it?
We will talk in 2013 when the world has not ended and god has not appeared, But I am sure you will say some stupid thing at that time to make up a new year/date.
thedutchman01 8 months ago
@TheGrandEntrance
And then where did you get from 14th dec 2018 to 1st jan 2012?
And in your second of the math problem, Where did you get the 49 years to get to that date?
Picking randoms numbers is all nice and dandy when you are aiming for a certain number/date, but holds no relevance in reality.
I got a nice math problem for you. Everything is four. Explain.
thedutchman01 8 months ago
@thedutchman01
Or rather... everything = 4.
thedutchman01 8 months ago
@TheGrandEntrance
I think you just made up some numbers so that they fit your... math?
And faulty math at that.
thedutchman01 8 months ago
Amazing how these guys do not understand the bible at all
Mankey43 8 months ago
if god knows all then why change the rules when christ died?
tainted705 8 months ago
thumbs up if u think this other host looks like matt in a hippie verson
kissntellen 8 months ago
Religious people... a bunch of bullshitters
fourtywpm 9 months ago
how can people sit on moral high ground in red lobster... lmao
RaggedM88 9 months ago
Do these people seriously think that until 2000 years ago, our ancestors had absolutely no perception of morality, that they were waiting, in between mass-murder of their tribe, orgies and allowing monogamous gay relationships, for some obscure story about some guy on a mountain to teach them, pretty poorly I might add, how to live a moral life?
MeBeMat 10 months ago 28
@MeBeMat
Yes, yes they do.
newfagscanttrif0rce 10 months ago
@MeBeMat There people seriously think that without the bible people would run around the street killing and raping each other...I mean , this level of stupidity is just IREAL for the 21st century.How the hell can you be that ... stupid (in lack of a better word) to actualy stand by a statement like that ?
Zerrattul 7 months ago
Religion is not moral two UN workers were beheaded in Afganistan this week because some nut-job pastor from Florida burned a Quran.
seonidh 11 months ago
Morality = Intelligence + Empathy or imagination
Yahweigh 11 months ago
Morality and any associated ideal is rooted entirely in the presupposition some higher power defines what is correct for human behavior.
Nature is pure war with every man against another. Fear of death is the only thing that keeps the peace, so man is civilized by the threat of violence against him for transgressions upon his neighbor.
You intellectual midgets with chicken shit lives make about as much difference as the hole I leave when I pull my hand out of a bucket of water.
SirWinstoneChurchill 11 months ago
@SirWinstoneChurchill You are one inhuman immoral bitch.
ScientificBob 11 months ago
@SirWinstoneChurchill
To be fair, that's a not unreasonable description of the world we find ourselves in, but what I want to know is, could I really save up to £216 when I buy car insurance?
GjVj 11 months ago
lobsters are gay?
slowmopoke 11 months ago
haha this people are crazy. I just wanted to ask who hardwired empathy?? People think because they have little piece of paper that tells them there studies and that they have more knowledge. Well they have a belief too its Atheist and there moral code is anything that is in your heart is fair game.
1cesacaro1 11 months ago
Funny how the guy in the video that seems to know so much scripture hasn't realised that Jesus is God with God the Father and the Holy Spirit. Praying to and worshiping Jesus is not going against the old testement commandment of following another god. As hard as is it is to fathom (even for chistians) is there are three persons in the one God. Read Genesis 1 verse 26: "Then God said, "Lets us make make man in OUR image, in Our likeness."
Scott111188 11 months ago
Shit eating shellfish and being a raging Homo are equal sins in God's book? Well you know what they say in for a penny in for a pound. Now where's that lobster?.....
19822andy 1 year ago
Atheists loves to talk about God, Jesus and the bible... Funny!
GedoMazou 1 year ago
@GedoMazou It's because those ridiculous beliefs aren't allowed to be scrutinized in America among other places, and Christianity is all the basis you need to pass laws or keep laws from being passed. Funny how we live in a nation built on secular reasoning and if all you use to make decisions is reason and you don't go to Church you'll never get voted into office.
So fuck you, you stupid bitch.
sk8tafrnk 11 months ago
@sk8tafrnk Ridiculous is to reject the Truth of God, being purposely mistaken by devil, and worse, there are people which consciously choose to serve him! So many people serve false gods, another humans and animals, however i see no one criticizing them, chasing that ones.
In this mad world we can worship anything, but the Only Lord...
if it's all fantasy and legend, so why atheists spend so much time trying to disprove the bible?
I do not see anyone else debating about tooth fairy and gnomes..
GedoMazou 11 months ago
@GedoMazou "I do not see anyone else debating about tooth fairy and gnomes.."
Of course not, the people who believe in those things aren't holding political power trying to change laws (ending abortion for one) to reflect those beliefs. Tooth fairy and gnome believers don't try to shove their beliefs down our throats. They certainly don't advocate our DEATHS simply because we don't believe in what they do.
Unfortunately the god myth affects us all, believers and non-believers alike.
BastEternal 11 months ago
@BastEternal Oh, but i'm think that the world do that things because they hate the idea of a God, simply cuz they just wanna live in their sins, it's that simple... I know because i'm also human, when we love iniquity so we try to flee away from God, cuz we know He hates the sin and wants us not to do it, but to obey Him.
Is that bad? What about that people which offered their sons to be burned to false gods, satanists that sacrifices another person to the devil, etc?
GedoMazou 11 months ago
@GedoMazou
Not, it's NOT that simple. Lack of belief in god or gods does not automatically make people want to run around and do bad things. I personally LIKE people, I LIKE when they're happy. I don't drugs and don't have promiscuous sex because I know that it's dangerous, can shorten my life, and it's against the law. I value monogamous relationships and a healthy lifestyle.
God asked abraham to sacrifice his own little boy, Isaac.
IS THAT BAD?
BastEternal 11 months ago
@BastEternal Ok, i'm not saying that ur doing any of that! But the people around the world does at least one of sins, everyone does, no one is perfect, neither the christians also.
God has tested the faith of Abraham, but Isaac wan't killed anyway, God has that right, He's Supreme!
And better, He's Almight, instead of use His power to destroy us, He prefer to be Merciful and wait us to repent, just to give us a very better life, now and forever.
The world has a wrong vision of God, He's Love!
GedoMazou 11 months ago
@GedoMazou
You didn't answer the question, you just made a deplorable, immorally corrupt excuse.
Was it bad to ask abraham to sacrifice his own son? Yes or no.
And is this love?
"instead of use His power to destroy us, He prefer to be Merciful"
You obviously have not read the entire bible. Why don't you try and read the ENTIRE bible not just the little bits you agree with and the stuff you've been indoctrinated with by other believers?
BastEternal 11 months ago
@BastEternal No, it's not bad, He's our Creator, but you certainly didn't read that He do not allowed the sacrifice, just tested Abraham's loyalty... I already ready entire bible, i know that there are parts very hard to understand, but i ask you, if God is as bad as you say, why so are we all still alive? Even the atheists, satanists, and all other unbelievers, and the christians yet, cuz they sin, too...
Funny that no one here talks about the evil of satan
GedoMazou 11 months ago
@GedoMazou There you go, assuming I didn't read the entire thing. Considering that this god is supposed to know the future, he already knew abraham was going to go through the motions, so he already KNEW abraham was loyal. It's STUPID. Just like Job...the man suffered for NOTHING because god already KNEW how it was going to end up.
It's STUPID. The whole IDEA is stupid.
And if you can't figure out why a bunch of atheists don't talk about the "evils of satan," you're a moron. Bye.
BastEternal 11 months ago
@BastEternal Remember, He knows everything, otherwise God do not act like you mentioned.
If He did, we were all dead now, cuz He knows all errors we'll gonna make. also...
Note, Job just suffered bcuz of satan, don't forget it
Have a nice weekend o/
GedoMazou 11 months ago
@GedoMazou I goof on the idea of Satan all the time as do many people I know who understand that Satan is a made up character to fear the masses into obedience. Your line though is my favorite...No, its not bad, He's our Creator. Sounds like a case of stockholm syndrome.
momentofsciencetx 11 months ago
@momentofsciencetx So i ask you, who's is the being that satanist and freemasons worships? Certainly they create him to fear themselves to believe in... Great
GedoMazou 11 months ago
@GedoMazou who is the being that satanist and free masons worship? Well I think satanist worship satan. Yet another made up character worshiped by morons. As for the free masons you just have to believe in a supreme being. So whats your point? Other than proving mine, that people are willing to believe in nonsense.
momentofsciencetx 11 months ago
@GedoMazou "just tested Abraham's loyalty" Wheter this deity of your choice stopped abraham or not is not the issue here. What is the issue is that this story tells people that if god asks you to kill your child - you should do it.
And that's what the real deal here is. Nobody cares if he was stopped or not. The simple fact is that this dude was willing to kill his child because he believed voices in his head asked him to. And you idiots are trying to sell that as a GOOD thing.
ScientificBob 11 months ago
@GedoMazou "What about that people which offered their sons to be burned to false gods, satanists that sacrifices another person to the devil, etc?"
Yes, that is bad.
What those people are is irrelevant.
It is the ACT of taking life for the purpose of sacrifice that is deplorable and immoral. It doesn't matter WHO is doing it, INCLUDING your god.
Your god offered his son as a blood sacrifice, and he asked abraham to sacrifice his son. That is deplorable and certainly NOT love.
BastEternal 11 months ago
@GedoMazou Ridiculous is to reject the Truth of Vishnu. Ridiculous is to reject the Truth of Allah. Ridiculous is to reject the Truth of Braham. Ridiculous is to reject the Truth of Tengri. Ridiculous is to reject the Truth of _______. (fill in the blank). Just because you say it, doesn't make it truth. But it is typical of most believers like yourself to use the Devil scare tactic as you did. As for atheist trying to disprove the bible, thatsalready been done by logic and common sense.
momentofsciencetx 11 months ago
@momentofsciencetx And just because you don't wanna believe, this doesn't make it a lie...
Look, what do you think i earn for preaching the Gospel, and be offended, hated, etc? I got no money for this, no cars, houses, nothing else, physically speaking... So i use not devil tactic to scare u, that's the obvious truth of bible, which we can see in everywhere, his wills, wars, kills, drugs, rebel teens, etc.
I do it just bcuz Jesus commanded in His Gospels, cuz He wanna save everybody
GedoMazou 11 months ago
@GedoMazou that's the obvious truth of bible, which we can see in everywhere, his wills, wars, kills, drugs, rebel teens, etc. proof?????????????? can i have any amount of proof that your god exist and ask you why you believe? now if its personal simply state it and ill drop it. but dont use personal reasons to try and convince people.
emanrulez1 11 months ago
@GedoMazou It has nothing to do with "not wanting to believe." You are a product of geography this is why you believe what you believe. Had you grown up in a muslim country or hindu, you would be making the same arguments for those beliefs and accusing me of not wanting to believe that nonsense as well. Atheist born here or atheist born there...still an atheist. You blame problems on the devil, others blame them on the demons they believe in.
momentofsciencetx 11 months ago
@GedoMazou your arguments are no different then those provided by people of other faiths whom I have this same discussion with. But do yourself a favor and stop with the circular logic. The Bible is truth. Ok how? Because its Gods word. How do you know its Gods word? Cause the bible says so.
momentofsciencetx 11 months ago
@momentofsciencetx We have no reason to distrust the bible, it's historical and spiritual correct, and its prophecies are still showing to be true, many of that has been accomplished or is been fulfilled now, with no fail...
If ya look around and pay attention for what's happening now, wars, epidemics, steals, murder, vice, so many 'gods' and doctrines, etc, you have to think, something supernatural should be behind all this... There's not other reason!
GedoMazou 11 months ago
@GedoMazou your gullibilty is saddening. The Quran is described by Muslims as historical and correct. Muslims claim the predictions in their Quran are coming true. Utter nonsense. you can take any basic claim and twist it to fit current events. People believe Nastradamus predictions are coming true. Again twisting basic claims to fit current events. Here is a bit of news, wars, epedemics, murder, etc. have always been a part of human history. What you are seeing is nothing new.
momentofsciencetx 11 months ago
@GedoMazou people just like you a thousand years ago, a hundred years ago, etc made these same claims. And if something super natural is behind all these things you claim and if this "something super natural" is your god..guess what he or she or what ever you call it is a dick.
momentofsciencetx 11 months ago
So, tell me, what's going on with the mankind? Despite of every increase in knowledge, science, human rights, globalization, release of each 'outdated' thing, like chastity, faith, hope, religion, etc, everything is going worse day after day... People gives up traditional things like that, but they never leaves war behind, even thousands years later...
GedoMazou 11 months ago
@GedoMazou You are so wrong! People live longer than ever now. There is less war and torture in the world than in centuries past. We can communicate almost instantly instead of taking weeks. We've cured many diseases and eradicated one. We are smarter, bigger and stronger than our ancestors. We have modern transportation and have left the planet.
Change happens gradually. Sure, the world isn't perfect and it never will be, but it's a LOT better than it used to be and you're too blind to see.
ciaochowbella 10 months ago
@ciaochowbella Good, but it's inadmissible that people may make wars yet, despite of every advance of knowledge, the mankind is destroying the environment trough their voracious greed for more and more profit, youth doesn't respect parents and authorities anymore, the perversion is growing at everywhere, TV, internet... No mention about drugs, pedophilia, suicides, parricide, causeless violence, racism, and the increasing persecution of God, faith, religion, etc. May we call this 'better'?
GedoMazou 10 months ago
@GedoMazou You want a perfect world. It will never happen. Disrespect and "perversion" are not necessarily bad. Drugs, pedophilia, suicide, etc. have always existed and always will.
You cannot persecute god. That's an imaginary problem. Faith is an excuse for ignorance and bigotry. Religion has caused more harm than good.
Yes, we can call this better. MUCH better. If you'd focus on the positive, you'd see it too.
ciaochowbella 10 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@GedoMazou Do you think Jesus will return on May 21, 2011?
momentofsciencetx 10 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@GedoMazou "Look, what do you think i earn for preaching the Gospel, and be offended, hated, etc? I got no money for this, no cars, houses, nothing else, physically speaking..."
Then you'