i am good person but with sociopath... i act the same they do... i don't care if they get sick,i don't care if they died,something they ask me for anything that they need,i always don't help,if i know they are in the hospital i really don't care about it.. i give the person what they give me... as soon stared to change i pay back the same way.. no compation at all..
Exactly what "human wreckage" has resulted from free individuals being permitted to exchange in an open marketplace in the absence of coercion which is what takes place in an economic structure in which the power of ownership over the means of production is excercised privately (the definition of capitalism)?
Are you perhaps referring to the "human wreckage" resulting from interventions into the economy by government (socialism) - such as the current crisis and BLAMING it on capitalism?
It has nothing to do with Left/Right they just the join the group which gives them power. The believe in nothing. Irish guy on youtube has some excellent vids Labyrinth of the Psychopath. Well worth seeing.
Your idea and 100% socialsm is flawed because humans are inherently selfish. Only a minority have emapthy to the extent you speak of so we need a system that can accomodate the remaining 98%. We need a socialist capitalism like what we have now but with more socialist elements.
@1982mockingbird1982 Yes, because those 2% would never find a way to get in charge of communist systems, and such systems will always be overseen by angels who only desire to do us well, like loving parents. /taskkill -D sarcasm.exe
Bullshit. We need a system where the only way the greedy can get richer is through voluntary transaction, necessitating that they provide a product or service that people need or want. That is the free market. Your paternal angels don't exist.
I am not against all capitalism. All systems are flawed. The question in my mind is what are the most significant flaws and how do we structure society to fix them. The answer is not capitalism. The answer is not socialism. The answer is a combination of the two.
@j0hnwi11iams sociol/psychopathic/ narcissism axis speaks to MOTIVATION. people can survive as empathic in capitalism or communism. "welfare statism" / the "multi-culturalism" of "left" caused much superficiality that is the underwiring of much socio-pathology and actually was generated by the left. (the empty internal human subject who must submerge real identity to get along in the system), not to mention sublimated rage from that; happens in every system, some are worse than others.
you are absolutely correct. i guess this is why a drug war, prohibition, a welfare state, and countless wars would never happen under capitalism. thanks for setting me straight.
By the way, j0hn, I think the biggest bullshit of all your incredibly big bullshit is the fact that under "companies" on your profile you list Cisco Systems. I did a quick Google of it and unless there is a smaller company under the same name, Cisco Systems is a multinational corporation with over 65k employees and an annual revenue of $36.1 BILLION as of 2009. So for all you're ranting against the evil rich and evil corporations, it turns out you work for them. Hmm, go figure....
So call me a hypocrite for working for a big company. I design internet routers for a living and the days of inventing this stuff in your garage are long over. Companies like Cisco brought you the internet. That does not mean I am not wary of their power. It does not mean I should ignore abuses. Corporations aren't all bad. It is like government in a way, necessary, useful, but vigilance is mandatory.
"So call me a hypocrite for working for a big company."
I just did.
"Companies like Cisco brought you the internet."
Oh, so you mean these big, evil companies full of rich people that fuck over poor people actually provided the public with a good they value and like very much?! That's shocking! I thought they only did stuff like kill puppies!
"Corporations aren't all bad."
Funny how when it comes to YOUR company, you suddenly stop generalizing. Yes, I think you've fucked yourself.
I would be concerned if the company I worked for did not have significant employee ownership or if it didn't have significant competition from other companies. WE have not reached anywhere near the end game with the internet. It is easier for you to dismiss what I say as coming from a hypocrite than it is to refute the points I am making.
I've already refuted the points you have made, but the hypocrite part isn't only a bonus but also relates to your credibility. You have GENERALIZED large corporations as capitalist opportunist who do whatever they can to fatten their wallets, even if it means screwing over the common worker or the middle and lower class as a whole. Now you're making it out to be as if your company is the exception. How telling.
Speaking of not refuting, you didn't refute any of MY points in my last comment.
Because you fail to make distinctions between different types of corporation and market. I have a video explaining opening game vs end game capitalism. I complain about powerful corporations engaged in end game capitalism. I do not work for a corporation that is anywhere near the end game. We are large because of the complexity of the systems we are building. It is YOU generalizing about corporations or specifically what gripes I have about them. You've beaten a strawman, congratulations.
So now you're going to take something I said out of context to prove I'm a hypocrite because that is worth more to you than any sort of argument I might make now. That makes you narrow minded. Enjoy living in the past, Lucy.
What context? You went on a rant against the rich and powerful and large corporations. You didn't modify those things in any way to show that you were talking about certain kinds. God, you're so full of shit. Anyone can read your prior comments/our conversations and see this.
Another thing. I find it very amusing you call HTWW a sociopath. Do you even know what a sociopath is? Do you know how serious a thing that is to call someone? Do you know there is a specific criteria for someone to be considered a sociopath? According to your video, you're calling him that because he mocked TAA's story about his father getting sick, in your mind, which he (HTWW) didn't even do. You're just a desperate fool grasping at straws, trying to take everyone down with you.
To anyone who's reading, here's a look at some of the things j0hn is claiming:
-The housing market and banks were unregulated prior to the housing crash.
-The housing crash was in no way caused by artificial interest rates courtesy of the Federal Reserve.
-For some people, capitalism "doesn't work out" for them, so therefore the entire system should be changed for everyone, even though for some people, like him (which he admits), it has.
Good work, kommisar. guys like this are pretty reprobate if you ask me. Only a miracle from God could heal his mind that is so turned inward and deranged.
Thanks, Xanathar. These guys just like to stand at a pulpit and pretend like they're important. I wouldn't mind this so much if they actually spouted some credible and correct information, but all they do is preach liberal and neocon bullshit like a bunch of sheep. "Capitalism hasn't worked for a lot of people." Ugh, that kind of shit makes me sick....
And you have no interest in knowing why capitalism hasn't worked out for these people? Specifically talking about those INJURED by the health insurance industry? Just sweep them under the rug, much easier than questioning your own assumptions.
You're thinking black and white, fool. I explained the healthcare problems to you at least more than once now. When healthcare was cheap, it was unregulated in terms of costs. When it became regulated thusly, the prices went up. But I'm sure you didn't bother to figure that out.
There is nothing to figure out. If your solution for achieving lower prices is letting more people suffer, then that isn't much of a solution at all, is it? We increase demand, so where is the corresponding increase in supply? Why is the US so out of whack compared to other more socialized systems of medicine when it comes to cost?
"If your solution for achieving lower prices is letting more people suffer, then that isn't much of a solution at all, is it?"
STRAW MAN ALERT!
In regards to your healthcare questions, you seem to like asking the same things over and over, even when they've been answered. Get off your lazy ass and do your own research. I suggest listening to the likes of Peter Schiff, who actually predicted the recession 2 years ago.
He does what republicans do best, that is to generalize the case I am speaking about and portray me as advocating the principle as a universal. I want to fix health insurance, not orchestrate a socialist takeover of the economy. They fill in every blank with whatever they think paints their opposition as the most ridiculous. In simple terms, when it comes to arguments, republicans fight dirty.
"ilimunating" is such a strong word. j0hn never claimed that capitalism as a system needs to be changed for everyone, but that it needs to adapt as time goes on, since the poverty line in the US has been rising since 1980 (since reagan), since more and more people don't have health insurance.
the banks, wall street and the corporations have been largely unregulated. i don't know how can this be argued against.
Capitalism is a system. You can't change capitalism. It is what it is. What you probably mean is the U.S.'s current economic system. I agree with the latter but j0hn's "solutions" are stupid. Just the fact that he doesn't acknowledge government regulation in the market fucks it up (as statistics will show) shows he is in dire need of education.
Wall Street and corporations have been "largely" unregulated??? Haha! Then what do you think caused the housing bubble? FEDERAL INTEREST RATES.
You are a monetarist in the Milton Friedman tradition. OF COURSE you think interest rates control the economy. One lever to rule them all. Freshwater economics have been totally discredited.
I didn't say interest rates control the entire economy, jerk. You're straw manning now. I said THE ARTIFICIAL INTEREST RATES IMPOSED BY THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT were a significant factor in the HOUSING BUBBLE. The rest was a trickle effect. According to you, I alleged these interest rates caused small businesses to shut down as has happened during the recession.
capitalism is not a rigid set of dogmas, you moron. j0hn answered you idiotic question about interest rates already, and you still persist in asking me?
and statements with no evidence or substance don't really help you.
No, he didn't and I didn't even ask him anything other than, "What the fuck are you talking about???" He obviously didn't answer that since he still can't make a damn point, and his comment on interest rates was just stupid.
The only thing I asked you was a rhetorical question to show what a joke you are.
No evidence or substance? OK, right, says the idiot who says there's no regulation on Wall Street. OK, jackass....
What's "ironic" is you saying I'm asking you a question to clarify something when I clearly didn't. Don't worry about my balls. Worry about your own. Oh, wait, that's right, you don't have any.... Now go put your helmet on before you hurt yourself, you simplistic fool.
1) I never claimed such a thing. I only claimed that certain critical regulations were lax or missing.
2) I said that interest rates had an effect but were not the only factor, nor were they the most significant factor.
3) I never said the entire system should be changed, I said that capitalism works best for some things and not for others. I am in favor of a public option for health insurance if not outright single payer, because health insurance is broken.
1) Again, WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT??? A middle-aged man who can't even clue people on what the fuck he's saying....
2) Yes, and you have severely underestimated the effect the ARTIFICIAL interest rates had while claiming the biggest factor was "stupid people". Talk about a joke!
3) For the people capitalism "doesn't work for", that's THEIR problem, not the system's, and government-run healthcare is a bad idea as they can't undercut market costs without having to subsidize (use tax dollars)
1) In relation to the housing bust, the regulations that were lax were the lending standards, the regulations regarding credit default swaps and leveraging, and the firewalls between banks and investment firms. These regulations were dismantled by republicans, namely Phil Gramm.
2) You underestimate the power of stupidity, that is all I can say.
1) In a way, yes. The government forced banks to give loans to people they otherwise might not have. However, your reasons for the housing bubble do not account for the imbalance of spending and savings.
2) Yes, j0hn, for all I know someone as stupid as you might very well be very powerful -- I guess.... (rolls eyes)
3) I'm not the asshole whining about rich people. I'm most certainly not wealthy myself, but I don't say it's Bill Gates' fault. You're the hypocrite here so fuck off.
The left has them two. The only difference is that they legalize their criminal behavior and do it in broad daylight. (vis. fetal homicide and redistribution of wealth)
As for sociopathy, look up a professor in psychology named John Ray.
We disagree about abortion, that much is clear. I choose not to use extreme terminology to describe it because I think a mother has the right to self defense, even if it means the life of the POTENTIAL human being. I place more value on an ACTUAL person than on a POTENTIAL person.
Redistribution of wealth begins before the government has any say in it. The union busting practices of corporations steal just as much if not more from people by denying them the power of collective bargaining.
Why are we focused on "extreme vs. moderate" rather than "valid vs. invalid?"
"an ACTUAL person than on a POTENTIAL person."
Well yes, but the only reason that would be a relevant distinction for abortion is if one is ignorant of the scientific facts of personhood -since they are both ACTUALLY persons. (yes I'm not forgetting the personhood concept here)
On the broader note though. Can we agree that sociopathy is neither a defining trait of the left or the right?
HTWW was effectively brainwashed with the continually spoken phrases in politicians speeches like, "The U.S. is the best country in the world, we are the most free country, the richest country, the best health care, etc. etc." He was also brainwashed against anything other than capitalism, pure and simple. He absolutely refuses to look at examples of other societies where a combination of capitalism and socialism works very effectively, when measured in terms of the total society's well-being.
Great job once again. If only htww could glimpse at reality just long enough for it to make a significant impression, he might rethink things. His arguments are so thin it's like a 400lb man walking across a bridge on toothpicks glued together with Elmer's. He never makes it across, not even on a simple issue. Bravo John!
I second that!...a lot of HTWW's arguments are taken from the playbook of organized crime. Not just in the US, but Columbia, the Balkans, Nigeria and Moscow. It is humorous to watch his naivete, not realizing how his words and arguments support the activities of the worlds largest criminal cartels and syndicates.
j0hn, give it up. You already failed with your crap about how the fed had no hand in the housing bubble. Now you're saying capitalism ruins lives and shit? Hmm, I wonder how much capitalism made YOU "suffer" in your comfy home and whatnot. Seriously, try making a compelling argument rather than appealing to emotion.
Speaking of which, careful. At :40 you JUST might convince someone you're getting emotional....
Capitalism has worked out fine for me personally in a lot of regards. It has not worked out in others. California was screwed by Enron who lobbied to deregulate the energy market so they could manipulate it from within their corporate headquarters. Why is it all or nothing with you? The health insurance industry HAS ruined lives in very significant, profound, and FATAL ways. You think it is OK to make fun of the victims and sweep it all under the rug. Aren't YOU lucky?
You're an absolute lunatic. Capitalism hasn't "worked out for others"? Give me a break. Just because others haven't figured out how to become rich doesn't mean it's capitalism's fault. The U.S. has one of the highest rates if not THE highest of self-made millionaires.
Enron was criminal. It had nothing to do with their attempts to deregulate. They committed crimes. The health insurance industry is fuckd up, in large part due to government regulation in the market. You're clueless.
I am not talking about the crimes they were thrown in jail for, I am talking about the market manipulation for which they never answered for. They threw them in jail for defrauding stockholders, but not for defrauding the state of California.
No, if they defrauded California as you allegedly claim, then the state most certainly WOULD prosecute them for that. Fraud is a crime you know. Either they couldn't get enough evidence or you're just making some stupid conspiracy theory allegation, because there's no way in hell the government wouldn't try to prosecute someone who fucked them over.
Once again, you make another comment which I can't fathom the relevance or even meaning from. Please quit wasting my time. Your video already did enough of that.
Once again, you engage in bullshit, appeal-to-emotion arguments. You seem to have it in for the wealthy. Well, j0hn, you seem to have a few luxuries of your own. Why don't you give that chair in the background that you're not using to some poor person. I'm sure they could use it. There's nothing wrong with rich people trying to get the best deal for themselves possible. Hell, even poor people do it. Your "blame the rich" attitude is nothing short of pathetic and it shows your immaturity.
There is plenty wrong with the richest screwing the working class, particularly when it harms the economy. The economy works through the circulation of money, and when all the money goes to the top there is precious little to go in circulation, particularly if the wealthy are taking that money and investing it overseas to undermine the working class.
Nonetheless, j0hn, your solutions for fixing this are beyond retarded. Just the fact that you WORK for all these "evil" people shows you are nothing but a pulpit-ranting freak trying to pretend he's important and is doing something meaningful. Just the fact that you straw man like your life depends on it, not to mention say deranged irrelevancies that come out of nowhere, shows you are incapable of engaging in rational discussion.
Epic fail, dude. HTWW might agree to some "right-wing" principles, but he's more libertarian. until recently, being libertarian was a "left-wing" thing, so your point is moot.
I also find your attempts to besmirch him simply lilliputian and tired. People always result to mudslinging and name-calling to others who have differing views. There was nothing sopiopath about his video to TJ. It was heartwarming and civil, not condescending.
Libertarian is definitely not left wing. It is the same conventional wisdom that came out of Reagan and every other puppet for the wealthy in this country since the robber barons. Also I don't know what video you were watching but HTWW was definitely making fun of another mans suffering.
Social security, medicare, medicaid are all forms of generational theft. Compiling debt, high taxes, and aid in stifling the economy in my opinion. And people are dependent on them and at this point I would not advocate taking it away. But your side as well as mine justifies or supports them to one extent or another. What more does the liberal mind want from the private sector. Capitalism has done bad while doing more for the world than any other economic theory applied.
The liberal mind does not reject capitalism. The liberal mind transcends capitalism. It sees capitalism not as a complete system, but as a small part in a much bigger and more complex system. The liberal mind finds capitalism useful, but flawed and incomplete. As social beings there is more demanded of us. Capitalism is its purest form is only one phase of civilization's rise out of obscurity. As the planet becomes more crowded our freedom becomes more constricted.
I'm sorry, although my friend Loki coined the phrase, you don't get your mindset liberal. True liberals would advocate free markets, limited government, no welfare state, a gold standard, and the philosophical understanding of a moral order in the universe. It was only until counterfeits like FDR and yourself stole the language.
That is not the same liberal that Rush Limbaugh rants on endlessly about. It is not the same liberal that has been demonized by the right wing talking heads for the past two decades. Now that the conservative brand has turned to shit, now you want to be a liberal? I don't think so. Spend a lifetime of being a liberal and taking the heat for it like Ted Kennedy or get out.
You choose to call it generational theft, yet what do children do if not steal from their parents and society? What better motive for caring for the young than relying upon their productivity? Capitalism does this through savings and investment. However, it does not invest in anything that it can not own, therefore failing to invest in PEOPLE, the most important resource to secure the future.
Um, that's what parents do. They care for their children. Families don't operate like the government for materalists like you. In legal lingo, they have the ability to issue positive injunctions on each other because they can. That's why there's such thing as private charity. So your comparison, qualitatively and morally, is wrong.
When the economy forces both parents out of the house to make a living, where does that leave the family? I am not a materialist, contrary to your assertion. There is a connection between mind and body that is undeniable and if a person must put all their energy into earning enough to pay the bills, there is precious little left over for higher pursuits.
Private charities are all well and good but hardly put a dent in the structural problems of society.
I agree. In actuality, we haven't had real capitalism and the free market since Progressive Era and WWII, although the greats like Coolidge, Al Smith, and Robert Taft tried to reverse course. Goldwater and Reagan helped bring some sanity too. Since then, banking and the car industry is heavily regulated. Capitalism didn't fail. It was heavy regulation preached by the so-called progressives.
That is just plain stupid. You fail to understand that it was regulation that averted past depressions and that it was deregulation that allowed this one to occur. I like market mechanisms but there are some cases where they simply fail. Unregulated banking leads to leveraging and derivatives which push the system to the brink of collapse. Investors start betting on the system to fail. Goldman Sachs sold their toxic derivatives to firms and then turn around to sell them short. That's sabotage.
Again with your bullshit, j0hn. It's been well-documented now that the artificial interest rates in the housing market that were put there BY GOVERNMENT REGULATION were the key component in the housing bubble and its subsequent popping. You also claim the banks weren't regulated when they were FORCED by the government (once again) to give people loans they were otherwise unqualified for. You just refuse to listen to reason and fact and will continue spouting your socialist nonsense.
I have listened to YOUR side of the story but you have not listened to mine. Your logic: Here are a set of regulations that are "bad", therefore: All regulations are bad. You can't even decypher your own logic. The interest rates were only one factor and a minor one at that. I know you monetarist want to believe the economy is controlled by the levers of available currency, but even that proved to be an abject failure when even zero percent interest could not pull the economy out of a nosedive.
No, they weren't minor since they were a key factor in loans. If you had to only pay 1% interest on your house instead of 5%, you would be more inclined to apply for a loan. That's what drove the house prices up in the end, CAUSING THE BURSTING OF THE BUBBLE.
What 0% rate??? See, you can't even make a coherent argument. You're a loon. Your video shows you incapable of making a rational argument backed up by credible evidence. You only whine, bitch and appeal to emotion. Get a life.
You're just filling space with the monetarist conventional wisdom, that you can control the economy with the interest rate. What created the bubble wasn't the interest rate, it was the leverage. Some loans actually gave you cash in addition to the house, like a negative down payment. If the house is worth more than the loan, then if you can't make payment you can sell the house. If the house is worth less, you're stuck with foreclosure.
Other than that, sorry, you haven't said anything that's refuted the interest rate point. Just about every article I've read on the collapse of the housing bubble says the interest rate was largely responsible.
You should get out more often. The is an economics professor at UMass who claims that the fundamental problem with the economy was / is the disparity of wealth. Of the productivity gains the economy has seen in the past two decades, all of it has gone to the wealthy. Labor wages have remained flat.
"Disparity of wealth" is only a symptom. It doesn't address any actual causes. It's like me saying some food I'm eating tastes bad. Does saying that explain how to make the food any better? No.
Haha, labor wages have not remained flat. Once again, you're using your pin-it-all-on-the-rich "cure all solution". This is quite interesting considering that you work for such evil people. Why despite all your bitching to you continue to contribute to your imagined problem?
How can I be expected to argue with someone with such low regard for facts. Disparity of wealth is a symptom and a cause. It is both. It is the mechanism through which money is taken out of circulation.
Quit trying to cop out, j0hn. You said your bullshit now live with it and eat crow.
Money is taken out of circulation? Alright, whatever, j0hn. Keep saying that while you work for that huge, evil corporation with a rich, evil CEO at the top making millions while you make nothing.
i am good person but with sociopath... i act the same they do... i don't care if they get sick,i don't care if they died,something they ask me for anything that they need,i always don't help,if i know they are in the hospital i really don't care about it.. i give the person what they give me... as soon stared to change i pay back the same way.. no compation at all..
yoquieroseramada 3 weeks ago
Why is the left populated with dolts and dipshits?
Slave2Reason 3 months ago
Exactly what "human wreckage" has resulted from free individuals being permitted to exchange in an open marketplace in the absence of coercion which is what takes place in an economic structure in which the power of ownership over the means of production is excercised privately (the definition of capitalism)?
Are you perhaps referring to the "human wreckage" resulting from interventions into the economy by government (socialism) - such as the current crisis and BLAMING it on capitalism?
FletchforFreedom 1 year ago
It has nothing to do with Left/Right they just the join the group which gives them power. The believe in nothing. Irish guy on youtube has some excellent vids Labyrinth of the Psychopath. Well worth seeing.
nonearthlychildren 1 year ago
Your idea and 100% socialsm is flawed because humans are inherently selfish. Only a minority have emapthy to the extent you speak of so we need a system that can accomodate the remaining 98%. We need a socialist capitalism like what we have now but with more socialist elements.
And ppl do seem like sociopaths
1982mockingbird1982 1 year ago
@1982mockingbird1982 Yes, because those 2% would never find a way to get in charge of communist systems, and such systems will always be overseen by angels who only desire to do us well, like loving parents. /taskkill -D sarcasm.exe
Bullshit. We need a system where the only way the greedy can get richer is through voluntary transaction, necessitating that they provide a product or service that people need or want. That is the free market. Your paternal angels don't exist.
Virgil0211 1 year ago
@Virgil0211 98%, not 2%*
Virgil0211 1 year ago
You're a damn emo john.
gworksnell 1 year ago
You say Captitalism is bad because it has flaws, it has problems? Well tell me , does Socialism have flaws and problems? How about communism, Facism.
ArswawWorldofWarcraf 2 years ago
I am not against all capitalism. All systems are flawed. The question in my mind is what are the most significant flaws and how do we structure society to fix them. The answer is not capitalism. The answer is not socialism. The answer is a combination of the two.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago 4
@j0hnwi11iams : that would being lukewarm.
larsiemannen 1 year ago
@j0hnwi11iams sociol/psychopathic/ narcissism axis speaks to MOTIVATION. people can survive as empathic in capitalism or communism. "welfare statism" / the "multi-culturalism" of "left" caused much superficiality that is the underwiring of much socio-pathology and actually was generated by the left. (the empty internal human subject who must submerge real identity to get along in the system), not to mention sublimated rage from that; happens in every system, some are worse than others.
westchesterny 7 months ago
so wat
drdemayo 2 years ago
Jesus, you sound like a Baptist.
Dillrod90 2 years ago
1:14 well put!
Vamavid 2 years ago
LOL "good intentions" have done more harm to humans than capitalists could ever dream of
donotswallow 2 years ago
keep telling yourself that.
it was good intentions that helped the elderly woman across the street.
HowTheWorldJerks 2 years ago
And good intentions gave us the drug war, prohibition, the welfare state, countless wars, ect.
donotswallow 2 years ago
you are absolutely correct. i guess this is why a drug war, prohibition, a welfare state, and countless wars would never happen under capitalism. thanks for setting me straight.
HowTheWorldJerks 2 years ago
holy non sequitur batman
donotswallow 2 years ago
Are you saying this doesn't happen under socialism and or communism? LMAO
tubaboy71 2 years ago
no i am not. what i am saying is that a drug war, prohibition, a welfare state, and countless wars would never happen under capitalism. EVER.
HowTheWorldJerks 2 years ago
genocide?
tubaboy71 2 years ago
I think John is basically a good guy just VERY misguided.
tubaboy71 2 years ago
Not really.
Brilliant but misguided would be Chomsky.
I kinda don't like moral justifications by liberals, because I think that ironically makes conservatives seem more rational than they really are.
SUpersaiyajinjerkbag 2 years ago
By the way, j0hn, I think the biggest bullshit of all your incredibly big bullshit is the fact that under "companies" on your profile you list Cisco Systems. I did a quick Google of it and unless there is a smaller company under the same name, Cisco Systems is a multinational corporation with over 65k employees and an annual revenue of $36.1 BILLION as of 2009. So for all you're ranting against the evil rich and evil corporations, it turns out you work for them. Hmm, go figure....
kommisar 2 years ago
So call me a hypocrite for working for a big company. I design internet routers for a living and the days of inventing this stuff in your garage are long over. Companies like Cisco brought you the internet. That does not mean I am not wary of their power. It does not mean I should ignore abuses. Corporations aren't all bad. It is like government in a way, necessary, useful, but vigilance is mandatory.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
"So call me a hypocrite for working for a big company."
I just did.
"Companies like Cisco brought you the internet."
Oh, so you mean these big, evil companies full of rich people that fuck over poor people actually provided the public with a good they value and like very much?! That's shocking! I thought they only did stuff like kill puppies!
"Corporations aren't all bad."
Funny how when it comes to YOUR company, you suddenly stop generalizing. Yes, I think you've fucked yourself.
kommisar 2 years ago
I would be concerned if the company I worked for did not have significant employee ownership or if it didn't have significant competition from other companies. WE have not reached anywhere near the end game with the internet. It is easier for you to dismiss what I say as coming from a hypocrite than it is to refute the points I am making.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
I've already refuted the points you have made, but the hypocrite part isn't only a bonus but also relates to your credibility. You have GENERALIZED large corporations as capitalist opportunist who do whatever they can to fatten their wallets, even if it means screwing over the common worker or the middle and lower class as a whole. Now you're making it out to be as if your company is the exception. How telling.
Speaking of not refuting, you didn't refute any of MY points in my last comment.
kommisar 2 years ago
Because you fail to make distinctions between different types of corporation and market. I have a video explaining opening game vs end game capitalism. I complain about powerful corporations engaged in end game capitalism. I do not work for a corporation that is anywhere near the end game. We are large because of the complexity of the systems we are building. It is YOU generalizing about corporations or specifically what gripes I have about them. You've beaten a strawman, congratulations.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
"It is YOU generalizing about corporations or specifically what gripes I have about them."
Your past arguments say otherwise. No use backpedalling to try and cover up your hypocrisy, j0hn.
kommisar 2 years ago
So now you're going to take something I said out of context to prove I'm a hypocrite because that is worth more to you than any sort of argument I might make now. That makes you narrow minded. Enjoy living in the past, Lucy.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
What context? You went on a rant against the rich and powerful and large corporations. You didn't modify those things in any way to show that you were talking about certain kinds. God, you're so full of shit. Anyone can read your prior comments/our conversations and see this.
kommisar 2 years ago
Another thing. I find it very amusing you call HTWW a sociopath. Do you even know what a sociopath is? Do you know how serious a thing that is to call someone? Do you know there is a specific criteria for someone to be considered a sociopath? According to your video, you're calling him that because he mocked TAA's story about his father getting sick, in your mind, which he (HTWW) didn't even do. You're just a desperate fool grasping at straws, trying to take everyone down with you.
kommisar 2 years ago
To anyone who's reading, here's a look at some of the things j0hn is claiming:
-The housing market and banks were unregulated prior to the housing crash.
-The housing crash was in no way caused by artificial interest rates courtesy of the Federal Reserve.
-For some people, capitalism "doesn't work out" for them, so therefore the entire system should be changed for everyone, even though for some people, like him (which he admits), it has.
Hope this illimunates j0hn's mentality....
kommisar 2 years ago 5
Good work, kommisar. guys like this are pretty reprobate if you ask me. Only a miracle from God could heal his mind that is so turned inward and deranged.
XanatharEye 2 years ago
Thanks, Xanathar. These guys just like to stand at a pulpit and pretend like they're important. I wouldn't mind this so much if they actually spouted some credible and correct information, but all they do is preach liberal and neocon bullshit like a bunch of sheep. "Capitalism hasn't worked for a lot of people." Ugh, that kind of shit makes me sick....
kommisar 2 years ago
And you have no interest in knowing why capitalism hasn't worked out for these people? Specifically talking about those INJURED by the health insurance industry? Just sweep them under the rug, much easier than questioning your own assumptions.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
You're thinking black and white, fool. I explained the healthcare problems to you at least more than once now. When healthcare was cheap, it was unregulated in terms of costs. When it became regulated thusly, the prices went up. But I'm sure you didn't bother to figure that out.
kommisar 2 years ago
There is nothing to figure out. If your solution for achieving lower prices is letting more people suffer, then that isn't much of a solution at all, is it? We increase demand, so where is the corresponding increase in supply? Why is the US so out of whack compared to other more socialized systems of medicine when it comes to cost?
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
"If your solution for achieving lower prices is letting more people suffer, then that isn't much of a solution at all, is it?"
STRAW MAN ALERT!
In regards to your healthcare questions, you seem to like asking the same things over and over, even when they've been answered. Get off your lazy ass and do your own research. I suggest listening to the likes of Peter Schiff, who actually predicted the recession 2 years ago.
kommisar 2 years ago
He does what republicans do best, that is to generalize the case I am speaking about and portray me as advocating the principle as a universal. I want to fix health insurance, not orchestrate a socialist takeover of the economy. They fill in every blank with whatever they think paints their opposition as the most ridiculous. In simple terms, when it comes to arguments, republicans fight dirty.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
"ilimunating" is such a strong word. j0hn never claimed that capitalism as a system needs to be changed for everyone, but that it needs to adapt as time goes on, since the poverty line in the US has been rising since 1980 (since reagan), since more and more people don't have health insurance.
the banks, wall street and the corporations have been largely unregulated. i don't know how can this be argued against.
franzpolak 2 years ago
Capitalism is a system. You can't change capitalism. It is what it is. What you probably mean is the U.S.'s current economic system. I agree with the latter but j0hn's "solutions" are stupid. Just the fact that he doesn't acknowledge government regulation in the market fucks it up (as statistics will show) shows he is in dire need of education.
Wall Street and corporations have been "largely" unregulated??? Haha! Then what do you think caused the housing bubble? FEDERAL INTEREST RATES.
kommisar 2 years ago
You are a monetarist in the Milton Friedman tradition. OF COURSE you think interest rates control the economy. One lever to rule them all. Freshwater economics have been totally discredited.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
I didn't say interest rates control the entire economy, jerk. You're straw manning now. I said THE ARTIFICIAL INTEREST RATES IMPOSED BY THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT were a significant factor in the HOUSING BUBBLE. The rest was a trickle effect. According to you, I alleged these interest rates caused small businesses to shut down as has happened during the recession.
kommisar 2 years ago
capitalism is not a rigid set of dogmas, you moron. j0hn answered you idiotic question about interest rates already, and you still persist in asking me?
and statements with no evidence or substance don't really help you.
franzpolak 2 years ago
No, he didn't and I didn't even ask him anything other than, "What the fuck are you talking about???" He obviously didn't answer that since he still can't make a damn point, and his comment on interest rates was just stupid.
The only thing I asked you was a rhetorical question to show what a joke you are.
No evidence or substance? OK, right, says the idiot who says there's no regulation on Wall Street. OK, jackass....
kommisar 2 years ago
"The only thing I asked you was a rhetorical question to show what a joke you are."
i'm not interested in a pissing contest with a 13 year old.
franzpolak 2 years ago
You're not interested in intelligent debate or even proving your bullshit either apparently. Go fucking waste someone else's time, you loser.
kommisar 2 years ago
irony much?
come back when your balls drop.
franzpolak 2 years ago
What's "ironic" is you saying I'm asking you a question to clarify something when I clearly didn't. Don't worry about my balls. Worry about your own. Oh, wait, that's right, you don't have any.... Now go put your helmet on before you hurt yourself, you simplistic fool.
kommisar 2 years ago
1) I never claimed such a thing. I only claimed that certain critical regulations were lax or missing.
2) I said that interest rates had an effect but were not the only factor, nor were they the most significant factor.
3) I never said the entire system should be changed, I said that capitalism works best for some things and not for others. I am in favor of a public option for health insurance if not outright single payer, because health insurance is broken.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
1) Again, WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT??? A middle-aged man who can't even clue people on what the fuck he's saying....
2) Yes, and you have severely underestimated the effect the ARTIFICIAL interest rates had while claiming the biggest factor was "stupid people". Talk about a joke!
3) For the people capitalism "doesn't work for", that's THEIR problem, not the system's, and government-run healthcare is a bad idea as they can't undercut market costs without having to subsidize (use tax dollars)
kommisar 2 years ago
1) In relation to the housing bust, the regulations that were lax were the lending standards, the regulations regarding credit default swaps and leveraging, and the firewalls between banks and investment firms. These regulations were dismantled by republicans, namely Phil Gramm.
2) You underestimate the power of stupidity, that is all I can say.
3) Just like you to externalize failure.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
1) In a way, yes. The government forced banks to give loans to people they otherwise might not have. However, your reasons for the housing bubble do not account for the imbalance of spending and savings.
2) Yes, j0hn, for all I know someone as stupid as you might very well be very powerful -- I guess.... (rolls eyes)
3) I'm not the asshole whining about rich people. I'm most certainly not wealthy myself, but I don't say it's Bill Gates' fault. You're the hypocrite here so fuck off.
kommisar 2 years ago
One word for these folks overcompensation.
Mahoivlich 2 years ago
HTWW thinks everyone convicted of murder should be executed within 10 days. So this shouldn't surprise anyone
Todays conservatives don't base their world view on reality, they base it on gut feelings of 'right' and 'wrong' that aren't influenced by fact.
Their arguments consist of baseless assumptions they never bother to question (which makes conservatism like a religion in my mind)
Being compassionate and understanding others would undermine these assumptions, and that makes them very angry
embracedestruction 2 years ago
HTWW needs to take the cork out.
MarxBakuninMe 2 years ago
Let's see here. Criminals and sociopaths.
The left has them two. The only difference is that they legalize their criminal behavior and do it in broad daylight. (vis. fetal homicide and redistribution of wealth)
As for sociopathy, look up a professor in psychology named John Ray.
JohananRaatz 2 years ago
We disagree about abortion, that much is clear. I choose not to use extreme terminology to describe it because I think a mother has the right to self defense, even if it means the life of the POTENTIAL human being. I place more value on an ACTUAL person than on a POTENTIAL person.
Redistribution of wealth begins before the government has any say in it. The union busting practices of corporations steal just as much if not more from people by denying them the power of collective bargaining.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
"extreme terminology"
Why are we focused on "extreme vs. moderate" rather than "valid vs. invalid?"
"an ACTUAL person than on a POTENTIAL person."
Well yes, but the only reason that would be a relevant distinction for abortion is if one is ignorant of the scientific facts of personhood -since they are both ACTUALLY persons. (yes I'm not forgetting the personhood concept here)
On the broader note though. Can we agree that sociopathy is neither a defining trait of the left or the right?
JohananRaatz 2 years ago
HTWW was effectively brainwashed with the continually spoken phrases in politicians speeches like, "The U.S. is the best country in the world, we are the most free country, the richest country, the best health care, etc. etc." He was also brainwashed against anything other than capitalism, pure and simple. He absolutely refuses to look at examples of other societies where a combination of capitalism and socialism works very effectively, when measured in terms of the total society's well-being.
1140Cecile 2 years ago
Great job once again. If only htww could glimpse at reality just long enough for it to make a significant impression, he might rethink things. His arguments are so thin it's like a 400lb man walking across a bridge on toothpicks glued together with Elmer's. He never makes it across, not even on a simple issue. Bravo John!
mccainisthrough 2 years ago
I second that!...a lot of HTWW's arguments are taken from the playbook of organized crime. Not just in the US, but Columbia, the Balkans, Nigeria and Moscow. It is humorous to watch his naivete, not realizing how his words and arguments support the activities of the worlds largest criminal cartels and syndicates.
savvysymbiont 2 years ago
j0hn, give it up. You already failed with your crap about how the fed had no hand in the housing bubble. Now you're saying capitalism ruins lives and shit? Hmm, I wonder how much capitalism made YOU "suffer" in your comfy home and whatnot. Seriously, try making a compelling argument rather than appealing to emotion.
Speaking of which, careful. At :40 you JUST might convince someone you're getting emotional....
kommisar 2 years ago
Capitalism has worked out fine for me personally in a lot of regards. It has not worked out in others. California was screwed by Enron who lobbied to deregulate the energy market so they could manipulate it from within their corporate headquarters. Why is it all or nothing with you? The health insurance industry HAS ruined lives in very significant, profound, and FATAL ways. You think it is OK to make fun of the victims and sweep it all under the rug. Aren't YOU lucky?
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
You're an absolute lunatic. Capitalism hasn't "worked out for others"? Give me a break. Just because others haven't figured out how to become rich doesn't mean it's capitalism's fault. The U.S. has one of the highest rates if not THE highest of self-made millionaires.
Enron was criminal. It had nothing to do with their attempts to deregulate. They committed crimes. The health insurance industry is fuckd up, in large part due to government regulation in the market. You're clueless.
kommisar 2 years ago 2
I am not talking about the crimes they were thrown in jail for, I am talking about the market manipulation for which they never answered for. They threw them in jail for defrauding stockholders, but not for defrauding the state of California.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
No, if they defrauded California as you allegedly claim, then the state most certainly WOULD prosecute them for that. Fraud is a crime you know. Either they couldn't get enough evidence or you're just making some stupid conspiracy theory allegation, because there's no way in hell the government wouldn't try to prosecute someone who fucked them over.
kommisar 2 years ago
You can't get money out of a corporation that doesn't exist.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
Once again, you make another comment which I can't fathom the relevance or even meaning from. Please quit wasting my time. Your video already did enough of that.
kommisar 2 years ago
That is the kind of winner take all attitude exhibited by the wealthy that landed us in this recession.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
Once again, you engage in bullshit, appeal-to-emotion arguments. You seem to have it in for the wealthy. Well, j0hn, you seem to have a few luxuries of your own. Why don't you give that chair in the background that you're not using to some poor person. I'm sure they could use it. There's nothing wrong with rich people trying to get the best deal for themselves possible. Hell, even poor people do it. Your "blame the rich" attitude is nothing short of pathetic and it shows your immaturity.
kommisar 2 years ago
There is plenty wrong with the richest screwing the working class, particularly when it harms the economy. The economy works through the circulation of money, and when all the money goes to the top there is precious little to go in circulation, particularly if the wealthy are taking that money and investing it overseas to undermine the working class.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
Nonetheless, j0hn, your solutions for fixing this are beyond retarded. Just the fact that you WORK for all these "evil" people shows you are nothing but a pulpit-ranting freak trying to pretend he's important and is doing something meaningful. Just the fact that you straw man like your life depends on it, not to mention say deranged irrelevancies that come out of nowhere, shows you are incapable of engaging in rational discussion.
kommisar 2 years ago
Epic fail, dude. HTWW might agree to some "right-wing" principles, but he's more libertarian. until recently, being libertarian was a "left-wing" thing, so your point is moot.
I also find your attempts to besmirch him simply lilliputian and tired. People always result to mudslinging and name-calling to others who have differing views. There was nothing sopiopath about his video to TJ. It was heartwarming and civil, not condescending.
namelessronin 2 years ago
Libertarian is definitely not left wing. It is the same conventional wisdom that came out of Reagan and every other puppet for the wealthy in this country since the robber barons. Also I don't know what video you were watching but HTWW was definitely making fun of another mans suffering.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
Resisting extortion is now "making fun of another man's suffering?"
You really do have an odd view of the world.
btw you are correct right up to "came out of Reagan."
Although I can't remember a time when Reagan's wisdom was thought of as conventional. If only we had stayed the course.
maskedphrogg 2 years ago
best title ever. haha
ashtool 2 years ago
Social security, medicare, medicaid are all forms of generational theft. Compiling debt, high taxes, and aid in stifling the economy in my opinion. And people are dependent on them and at this point I would not advocate taking it away. But your side as well as mine justifies or supports them to one extent or another. What more does the liberal mind want from the private sector. Capitalism has done bad while doing more for the world than any other economic theory applied.
LokiScoutSniper 2 years ago 2
The liberal mind does not reject capitalism. The liberal mind transcends capitalism. It sees capitalism not as a complete system, but as a small part in a much bigger and more complex system. The liberal mind finds capitalism useful, but flawed and incomplete. As social beings there is more demanded of us. Capitalism is its purest form is only one phase of civilization's rise out of obscurity. As the planet becomes more crowded our freedom becomes more constricted.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
I'm sorry, although my friend Loki coined the phrase, you don't get your mindset liberal. True liberals would advocate free markets, limited government, no welfare state, a gold standard, and the philosophical understanding of a moral order in the universe. It was only until counterfeits like FDR and yourself stole the language.
namelessronin 2 years ago
That is not the same liberal that Rush Limbaugh rants on endlessly about. It is not the same liberal that has been demonized by the right wing talking heads for the past two decades. Now that the conservative brand has turned to shit, now you want to be a liberal? I don't think so. Spend a lifetime of being a liberal and taking the heat for it like Ted Kennedy or get out.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
You choose to call it generational theft, yet what do children do if not steal from their parents and society? What better motive for caring for the young than relying upon their productivity? Capitalism does this through savings and investment. However, it does not invest in anything that it can not own, therefore failing to invest in PEOPLE, the most important resource to secure the future.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
Um, that's what parents do. They care for their children. Families don't operate like the government for materalists like you. In legal lingo, they have the ability to issue positive injunctions on each other because they can. That's why there's such thing as private charity. So your comparison, qualitatively and morally, is wrong.
namelessronin 2 years ago
When the economy forces both parents out of the house to make a living, where does that leave the family? I am not a materialist, contrary to your assertion. There is a connection between mind and body that is undeniable and if a person must put all their energy into earning enough to pay the bills, there is precious little left over for higher pursuits.
Private charities are all well and good but hardly put a dent in the structural problems of society.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
I agree. In actuality, we haven't had real capitalism and the free market since Progressive Era and WWII, although the greats like Coolidge, Al Smith, and Robert Taft tried to reverse course. Goldwater and Reagan helped bring some sanity too. Since then, banking and the car industry is heavily regulated. Capitalism didn't fail. It was heavy regulation preached by the so-called progressives.
namelessronin 2 years ago
That is just plain stupid. You fail to understand that it was regulation that averted past depressions and that it was deregulation that allowed this one to occur. I like market mechanisms but there are some cases where they simply fail. Unregulated banking leads to leveraging and derivatives which push the system to the brink of collapse. Investors start betting on the system to fail. Goldman Sachs sold their toxic derivatives to firms and then turn around to sell them short. That's sabotage.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
Again with your bullshit, j0hn. It's been well-documented now that the artificial interest rates in the housing market that were put there BY GOVERNMENT REGULATION were the key component in the housing bubble and its subsequent popping. You also claim the banks weren't regulated when they were FORCED by the government (once again) to give people loans they were otherwise unqualified for. You just refuse to listen to reason and fact and will continue spouting your socialist nonsense.
kommisar 2 years ago 2
I have listened to YOUR side of the story but you have not listened to mine. Your logic: Here are a set of regulations that are "bad", therefore: All regulations are bad. You can't even decypher your own logic. The interest rates were only one factor and a minor one at that. I know you monetarist want to believe the economy is controlled by the levers of available currency, but even that proved to be an abject failure when even zero percent interest could not pull the economy out of a nosedive.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
No, they weren't minor since they were a key factor in loans. If you had to only pay 1% interest on your house instead of 5%, you would be more inclined to apply for a loan. That's what drove the house prices up in the end, CAUSING THE BURSTING OF THE BUBBLE.
What 0% rate??? See, you can't even make a coherent argument. You're a loon. Your video shows you incapable of making a rational argument backed up by credible evidence. You only whine, bitch and appeal to emotion. Get a life.
kommisar 2 years ago
You're just filling space with the monetarist conventional wisdom, that you can control the economy with the interest rate. What created the bubble wasn't the interest rate, it was the leverage. Some loans actually gave you cash in addition to the house, like a negative down payment. If the house is worth more than the loan, then if you can't make payment you can sell the house. If the house is worth less, you're stuck with foreclosure.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
Leverage? You'll have to clarify.
Other than that, sorry, you haven't said anything that's refuted the interest rate point. Just about every article I've read on the collapse of the housing bubble says the interest rate was largely responsible.
kommisar 2 years ago
You should get out more often. The is an economics professor at UMass who claims that the fundamental problem with the economy was / is the disparity of wealth. Of the productivity gains the economy has seen in the past two decades, all of it has gone to the wealthy. Labor wages have remained flat.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
"Disparity of wealth" is only a symptom. It doesn't address any actual causes. It's like me saying some food I'm eating tastes bad. Does saying that explain how to make the food any better? No.
Haha, labor wages have not remained flat. Once again, you're using your pin-it-all-on-the-rich "cure all solution". This is quite interesting considering that you work for such evil people. Why despite all your bitching to you continue to contribute to your imagined problem?
kommisar 2 years ago
How can I be expected to argue with someone with such low regard for facts. Disparity of wealth is a symptom and a cause. It is both. It is the mechanism through which money is taken out of circulation.
j0hnwi11iams 2 years ago
Quit trying to cop out, j0hn. You said your bullshit now live with it and eat crow.
Money is taken out of circulation? Alright, whatever, j0hn. Keep saying that while you work for that huge, evil corporation with a rich, evil CEO at the top making millions while you make nothing.
kommisar 2 years ago
HTWW has a flat affect which is indicitive of a schizo Affective disorder diagnosis according to the DSM-IV
kukynphunt 2 years ago