Stop wasting our money you jerks are taxing sugar now. You want to see tyranny look at your tax code buddy. You say we pass a bill, more you and your elitist cronies pass a slave tax on the good people of Colorado. We see through your money hungry antic stooge.
IF YOU DRIVE THEY WILL TAX THE STREET , IF YOU WALK THEY WILL TAX YOUR FEET.
The King or England felt the same way you do before WE THE PEOPLE, GAVE HIM THE BOOT. With luck you will be next pork bellyXD
Despite all these advances Amazon Jeff Besoz is a real Asshole , he steals intellectual property from authors, and publishing companies, he steals debit funds from buyers and sellers, from partners- underpay their employees and treat then like children. All to inflate Amazon stock. Which has been slowly shrinking for weeks now. Jeff B you are an Ass treat you employees with respect and paid a fair wage , Jeff B you bully asshole, stop stealing
If our politicians paid a sales tax on the money they collected under the table for "selling themselves" to special interest groups and lobbyists we could pay off the national debt.
More to the point, you obviously just didn't think about your actions before carrying them out.
Now that you've caught my eye, I'll be taking a deeper look at your track record of decision making. I'm willing to bet that after I do so, I won't be able to stomach the thought of voting for you, ever, since that's the head start I already have from the mess you've made of this issue.
I know it's too much to ask, but the next time you decide to gamble with peoples means of income, you should try starting with your own.
Say what you like about high minded theoretical nonsense and intentions, the bottom line is this:
You set off a chain of events that led to the demise of a significant opportunity for Coloradans to increase their revenue and funnel funds back into the state from remote markets...
... to open up doors here, and to leave the interests it has here, here.
Along with thinking about what you can and can't do, you would do well to consider what you should and shouldn't do. Any form of incentive you can offer to stimulate growth is what you SHOULD be doing. Batting companies around with tax laws during a recession is the exact opposite.
You gambled. You lost. You poked a bear, and the people of Colorado ended up taking the bite in your stead because the bear pushed back...
John Morse and his cronies made a decision that the best way to increase tax revenues was to play tax collector hardball, gambling with the revenue of entrepreneurial Coloradans in the process, by attempting to put a gun to the head of a leader of industry.
This was, in reality, a feeble idea to begin with, and was executed at the absolute worst time possible. A time, in fact, when the theme of government should be to do everything in its power to convince industry...
john morse is an enemy of the people. he taxes us and hurts us in any way he can.. he does not realize that the more he taxes the more people will give up. there will be no reason to work in this country. they want to destroy hard working people in this country. i have no faith in john morse or any politician that thinks like he does. there are sad days in america. they want to have us give up and destroy hard workers in this country. they love failure.
I just got an email from an internet retailer that said they were going to report all my purchases to the Colorado Government. This made me really angry. I'll bet a lot of people will be really angry. If you were smart, you'd pull this video.
Amazon is the bully, Mr. Morse? Oh, you are the bully, sir. And your actions have caused the financial loss to the Amazon Affiliates and others. You raise taxes, threaten to tax demand more and more information to tax, and then you wonder why people react negatively? Really? Well, it is really is quite simple: you are a greedy thug. I just migrated my Amazon Affiliate account to a different state, you thug.
Everyone who has a profitable website should just form a corporation in Wyoming, they will then not need to worry about what Colorado does. So not only will Colorado lose the affiliate revenue, they will lose even more money to Wyoming. I forecast incorporation is going to be a huge trend that business friendly states will benefit from.
Everyone who has a profitable website should just form a corporation in Wyoming, they will then not need to worry about what Colorado does. So not only will Colorado lose the affiliate revenue, they will lose even more money to Wyoming. I forecast incorporation is going to be a huge trend that business friendly states will benefit from.
First off if this Bozo's state of colorado wants to do this and it is in their state constitution, then fine, but I have a right to leave and go to a better place that is more to my liking as a business. Also remember he has that pig intelligence with a 9 yr stint, also seems he can't keep a REAL HONEST JOB. Oh well just more of the progressive intelligence by politicians.
Good for Amazon! Haha...I buy at least ten thousand dollars a year of merchandise a year on Amazon (it's my go to place; I hate going to most bricks & mortar stores). Having seen this video, I'm going to see if I can shift even MORE of my purchases to Amazon. And if I ever give my Kindle DX in favor of an iPad, I'll be sure to buy it through Amazon.
Three cheers for Amazon. You have made a loyal customer. Amazon can only get money from you when voluntarily decide their product is worth your money. On the other hand, Colorado politicians just decide to take your money. This is another example of how GOVERNMENT ruins private sector jobs. Love this story!
All of you who are blasting Morse, remember: he was a cop, and has the connections to track you down and make trouble for you. After listening to this, does anyone doubt that he would if he thought he could get away with it? In Morse's world, everyone wants to be an informer for Colorado. Who can doubt that if Amazon hadn't declined, they'd have to provide income details for the affilates to Colorado's Department of Revenue.
Wow, all that mighty legislation and blustering, and all you're going to have to show for it is 5,000 lost jobs and a bunch of ticked-off Colorado voters who can't buy stuff on Amazon. Sucks to be you.
Need a clearer example of why the Tea Party has resonated with the common man? Tyranny my petty little legislator is the domain of the government. you no doubt attended public school in CO so never heard of things like "No taxation without representation".
This is typical of the tax and spend set (both sides of the aisle, don't flame me). The first 8 seconds convinced me that this person is full of himself.
Somehow, politicians got it into their heads that they could make people mad at corporations because they make money.
Hey John -- guess what -- when corporations make money, they HIRE PEOPLE. So umm, maybe you could stimulate the economy or something and quit being such a creepy entrenched politico type.
Hey Morse? Take that f-ing Kindle of yours and see if you can look up the word tyrant, you petulant horses ass, because you clearly have no idea what it means.
Amazon called your bluff and you didn't have the cards. Read em and weep tough guy. I'll buy more stuff from them because they stood up to a two-bit thug like you than I ever would have before.
You make me want to vomit. Go on over to Cannon City and check in before you do any more harm.
"It is my sincere wish that all the company's you mentioned would follow the superb example given by Amazon, with regards to dealing with thugs like you."
"JohnMorseSD11 - You thought you could use a law to take what you have not earned from those who have earned it. Amazon is showing you, you have no right. You need them, you said so yourself. The revenue the company creates for non-profits in your state, The machine you hold in your hand. Amazon does not need you. And I for one am glad they they are standing up to the tyranny and abuse you tried to level at them."
What an idiot. B&N, Apple, and other retailers that have a physical presence in CO are required to collect the tax. Amazon isn't, and the Supremes said so. Amazon isn't going to be a tax collector for CO, and why should they be? Who wants to deal with the petulance and ignorance of morons like Mr. Morse?
Congrats to the Colorado State Legislature for losing 5,000 jobs during a recession, in a foolish attempt to make up for their own fiscal recklessness. Well played.
wow - you sound bitter that they wouldn't play by your rules. Maybe you guys should have checked at the success, or lack thereof, that other states have had with 'amazon' taxes. Tyranny? maybe you should use a dictionary. Tyranny is more like tools like you thinking they can squeeze money out of everyone. Newsflash, the populace is not there to serve you - in fact its the other way around.
This is like the mafia complaining because the local chain store left town rather than pay protection money to them.
Your impotent rage in trying to create a lynch mob to attack amazon because your guns weren't enough is laughable.
Try producing wealth instead of redistributing it. While your at it try justifying how you have any claim on a portion of a private transaction without cowardly references to, "that's the way it's always been."
Amazon's refusal to do even this clearly shows that it is only interested in maintaining its significant competitive advantage over the bricks-and-mortar retailers in the state--and that it is more than willing to use its online affiliates as pawns to do so
unlike sales tax equity legislation in other states, which makes clear that an active network of in-state affiliates establishes nexus--and requires an out-of-state retailer to collect sales tax for online sales--our state's law now merely asks these retailers to inform residents of the amount of use tax that they owe for online purchases.
You created a ridiculous tax using affiliates as the rationale. Why should Amazon be taxed just because of affiliates in the state. As you say in the video, it's a just a pass through reference and completely intangible. Yet, you hinged your tax rationale on it anyway. Many people testified that this is what would happen if this tax was passed. Now you're surprised and angry?! WOW.
Affiliates were not used as the rationale. In fact, they were intentionally left OUT of the bill, to avoid this exact issue. In other states, they WERE used as the rationale as they were deemed "physical presence." Not here. People DID testify this is what would happen, thus legislators changed the bill to not use affiliates as the basis for enforcing the tax, thus Amazon (and everyone else) is bound by this regardless of affiliates.
@desrea777 Hmmm...maybe you should read the amended bill. Section 1, sentence 2 - "...section 1 articulates a presumption that any out-of-state retailer that has a referral relationship with an affiliate has an obligation to collect sales tax."
You aren't reading the most current bill, I know quite well the version you speak of, but it has been amended many times since at the request of affiliates and others. Google the CO legislature website and find HB 10-1193. They have the most current one posted on the site. I'd post a link if youtube would allow. The word "affiliate" is not there (do a Ctrl+F even to search). It, and the section you quote, was removed to protect affiliates by not associating them with being a phys presence in CO.
If the bill you are looking at says "introduced" on the top, it is not the bill as passed. A passed bill will A) come directly from the CO leg site itself when you click on the bill number (some "backdoor" searches will pull up old bills from the site) and B) will have "An ACT" written on the top.
Affiliates were not used as the rationale. In fact, they were intentionally left OUT of the bill, to avoid this exact issue. In other states, they WERE used as the rationale as they were deemed "physical presence." Not here. People DID testify this is what would happen, thus legislators changed the bill to not use affiliates as the basis for enforcing the tax, thus Amazon (and everyone else) is bound by this regardless of affiliates.
JohnMorseSD11 - You thought you could use a law to take what you have not earned from those who have earned it. Amazon is showing you, you have no right. You need them, you said so yourself. The revenue the company creates for non-profits in your state, The machine you hold in your hand. Amazon does not need you. And I for one am glad they they are standing up to the tyranny and abuse you tried to level at them.
It is my sincere wish that all the company's you mentioned would follow the superb example given by Amazon, with regards to dealing with thugs like you.
Amazon walked away (Shrugged!) Did you ever hear about a "bully" who walks away?
What bullies do is this: trying to extort money from a voluntary seller and a voluntary customer by means of harassment. And this is what Colorado government did!
I'm an Amazon Associate sickened by this whole fiasco, but Amazon is NOT to blame.
The Colorado government -- our legislators and governor -- created this mess by its imposition of an "Amazon Tax" with HB 1193. Given its Colorado-based affiliates, that law would have crippled Amazon with an onerous and expensive confusion of red tape, plus a crazy patchwork of local taxes. The only way for Amazon to extricate itself from that nightmare was to terminate the Affiliate Program.
Morse is quite possibly the least intelligent person in the Colorado Senate...with the exception of Hudak.
This is what happens when liberals realize that they cannot contol every aspect of the private sector. they make videos and complain.
Morse, keep your Kindle, but start reading new books. Try reading about the founding Fathers, (Alinsky was not a founding father). Try reading Atlas Shrugged
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
Atlas shrugged? Or sure Ann Rand is the bible of capitalism and callous disregard for people like you.
Least intelligent category in the CO State Senate has to go to Bill Cadman, or maybe Dave Schultheis, Josh Penry or Greg Brophy. So many others stand in front of John Morse winning this distinction......
@JohnMorseSD11 -- "We worked on the law to make sure they could comply with almost no cost."
Please post to your website any projections the legislature used to determine what the average cost of compliance of this law would be (including any secondary costs such as complying with a state audit) along with the source of these projections.
I am genuinely interested in what figures the state legislature used here.
Viewers should take note of the plaque prominently and ironically placed behind him to the right, which states: "Mental Health Legislator of the Year." I'm am sure he's a better customer for that industry than for Amazon. He probably increases the mental health needs of normal Coloradans who are going broke because all three branches of Colo. government are controlled by the Dems. That will end in November. Adios, Senator.
Amazon has made a business decision because they no longer see their situation as being profitable. It's a never ending cycle, you raise taxes in one area or pass legislation, and certain businesses will become unprofitable. The businesses go under, then politicians jump in screaming about lost jobs. They raise taxes elsewhere to subsidize businesses they favor, in turn putting other small companies out of business.
@sensuzannewilliams But by boycotting Amazon, Senator Williams, you risk disrupting their business and causing layoffs or potentially outright failure of Amazon. Think of all the people you could be harming.
The State made a decision and Amazon chose to take their affiliate business elsewhere. Amazon made a decision and you decided to take your shopping business elsewhere. Why is one better than the other? Aren't we all generally encouraged to "vote with [our] wallet[s]?"
you have a mild point but your argument falls flat. First, Amazon already "fired" the people it was giving income to, even though they are not tied to legislation implied. Second, I don't think amazon stands to be put financially out by this at all. They have the means to track every single click by every person, you don't think they can send a form out? Third, this is not a tax raise lol. it's hilarious that people either refuse or can't see that. Maybe a civics lesson would help ;)
@hsft It's also amazing how some people fail to understand that "only one form" means extra staff, programmers, servers, database managers... and plenty of other hidden costs. Bash Amazon all you will, but it will cost them and other companies money.
I find it mildly hilarious that the only pro comments are from accounts that have either just popped up, or have obviously never viewed any other youtube channels.
Meh I've had this account for a few years. I like Morse and subscribe to his channel. So Amazon would have to hire maybe one or two people to send out the forms? after they just fired hundreds I'm sure the costs offset in their favor. I comment here because a family member (my mom actually..hard core R) is boycotting Amazon because she and many of her peers were affiliates. I happen to agree w their pov.
Can you really tell what I've viewed? that's kinda cool :) Or is it just where I post?
@hsft The likely costs aren't in simply "send[ing] a form out", but to verify that the right data is being sent correctly (this is not 100 orders that can be verified manually), to ensure that all data relevant to this law is properly accounted for in case of audit, to comply with an audit and in any penalties that are assessed due to any failures in reporting (intentional or otherwise).
Certainly not impossible, but nobody would volunteer to do this out of the kindness of their heart.
I've yet to meet anyone who embarks on semi-arduous paperwork out of the "kindness of their hearts" You pay taxes because you are supposed to. This was an EXEMPTION, one of over 100 pages worth dolled out when we were in a fiscal boom. Now we are in a fiscal crunch, so the state repeals some of those exemptions. Are tax breaks Indefinite?
@hsft What does any of this have to do with this law not being at all burdensome on Amazon?
I don't recall saying tax breaks are indefinite. I don't recall saying individuals or Amazon shouldn't pay taxes that they are legally obligated to pay.
What I did say is that you (and Senator Morse) are trivializing the requirements. It's not simply "sending a form" and we're done. Have you ever been involved in a sales tax audit? Have you ever had to prove you've complied with a law like this?
@jeffdeed It's impossible to get people to understand that computers aren't magical boxes that read your mind. They hear "web company" and they think anything can simply be done with the flip of a switch. They refuse to believe that even "shopping carts" on a website can take months for a team to properly design. After all the user only has to click so it must be that simple for Amazon right? Databases, servers, programmers, accountants, and many other things are required for a "simple change".
While it is great that you want to stand up to Amazon, remember that you are doing it on the backs of people like me who are losing money every days because of this.
Put your concern for Coloradans ahead of your hatred from Amazon and take action that will get Amazon to re-instate its affiliate program here. Find another way to raise awareness of Use Tax.
While I agree with your sentiment in this video, I have to urge you NOT to boycott Amazon. I'm one of the people affected here (I'll lose thousands in 2010 because my affiliate account was closed) -- but a boycott will make things WORSE. You see, Amazon sells books and other products from Colorado producers, like me. And when you buy from Amazon, you are sometimes buying from Colorado resellers. A boycott against Amazon will hurt even more Colorado businesses than what Amazon has done.
I challenge you to post your state income tax returns showing where you have paid the use tax on your past Amazon and other online purchases. Certainly since you feel so strongly about it and accuse others of evading taxes, you have done so and will provide this information. Just to ensure this isnt the first year you have paid, please be sure to post a year prior to 2009 otherwise folks will say you only paid them because of this legislation.
In taking this move, it will help to quell the naysayers and show you are on the up and up.
I will be watching your website for these to be posted. I believe in doing so you will give your argument much more credence and show you have done your fair share as a Coloradoan to pay your taxes.
This Amazon reaction is only the beginning. Coloradans are about to find that online transactions are suddenly more onerous, with many small retailers (and ebayers) simply refusing to ship to CO. Then they will find that complying at tax time is time-consuming and an incredible invasion of privacy. Yet promised revenues will lag, and the economy will suffer.
Then they will vote Morse, Heath, and the rest of these bozos out of office.
It's also transparently manipulative @2:15 where you switch from complaining that people making a living through affiliate links are losing business, to suddenly describing those benefitting from the affiliate link program as churches and other nonprofit organizations.
Which is it? Website owners getting a little cut of Amazon's sales through advertising, or unimpeachably noble nonprofits funding their good-doing organizations through Amazon's grudging sharing of its unconscionable profits?
The things that bother me about this bill are: 1. The people that purchase products from Amazon are not interacting with a server in Colorado. They are reaching across state lines. Same as if I pick up the telephone.
2. It's troubling that you think we can force an out-of-state entity to do anything with our laws. If this is the case, what's going to stop Florida from forcing my business in Colorado, to perform any number of activities that cost me time and money.
The people of the other 49 states in the union would like to thank Senator Morse and his colleagues for the business, investment and jobs they're chasing out of their state and into ours. Keep up the great work! :)
This is a great indicator of how politicians don't understand economics.
Firstly, Amazon's net income will be significantly lower than Colorado's budget deficit for 2010 -- which shows where the first problem lies, out of control spending.
Secondly, any and every tax increase or other bureaucratic requirement simply causes productive businesses and people to choose to decamp from jurisdictions like CO that "don't get it." Other states happily welcome their business. Economics 101.
If I have a online business in another state and I sell to 50 people in Colorado I now have to send out 50 notices via first class mail to people in Colorado. One way to get around this is to not sell to people in Colorado. This law is going to be a real pain for small online businesses. Thanks Colorado Legislature.
Also, this law would require that if a user "Joe" who lives in Florida, is browsing a website run by a guy in Colorado and clicks on a link advertising a book, and ends up buying that book from Amazon who, like Joe, isn't in Coloado, that Amazon should treat the website owner in CO that advertised the book as a brick and mortar and pay taxes on that purchase.
In other words... Colorado wants sales tax from two entities not located in Colorado. Of course Amazon told them to go fudge themselves.
Nonsense. This law requires that Amazon send the equivalent of a 1099 to each Colo resident at year end telling the resident and the state the total amount of purchases for the year so the state can follow up and collect the use tax that is owed, no one in any other state will be subject to Colo tax. The use tax is already owed, always has been. This permits us to collect it. Amazon paid not one nickel in sales or use tax before this law and will pay not one nickel in tax after the law.
What exactly is your argument? That more forms won't increase the cost of Amazon doing business? It will. As long as politicians like yourself continue to add more bureaucracy, paperwork, and taxes... businesses will leave. I hardly see Amazon doing this out of spite. Amazon is a business and if this cuts into their profits they will leave. Calling businesses evil because they want to make money is cutting off your nose to spite your face.
Really? More forms? Your'e kidding, right? Amazon is an absolute master at collecting data and doing it digitally. Until yesterday, I was probably one of their best customers. They know what I buy, they know what is related to what I buy, they know what I should buy next.
Complying with this law will cost them very little, they already have all the data they need and then some. We worked on the law to make sure they could comply with almost no cost. And they pay zero in tax, zero.
Doing it digitally requires databases and programmers. Sending out the completed documentation requires postage, and envelope packers. If the data is sent out digitally it requires extra bandwidth and servers. No matter how you look at it, this will cost Amazon money. I would still like an explanation on how the Constitution comes into play here preferably with some quotations directly from it explaining your point.
What about the businesses that are not Amazon? What about all the little online businesses that now have to deal with these regs? The law does not say that it applies to Amazon alone? The law would also apply to eBay wouldn't it?
People who don't support what Amazon has done just don't understand the laws and how the state is actually the one trying to bully Amazon into doing something it isn't required to do.
Typical. Barnes and Noble is nothing like Amazon... using that as an example just shows how deceitful you are being to try and gain support. Congratulations on achieving the exact opposite of what you thought you would. Enjoy the rest of your time in office, it won't be long.
Ahh, the Rush Limbaugh defense--when you have no idea what you are talking about, just call people names.
B&N has on on-line component just like Amazon. Difference is Amazon does not have brick & mortar in Colo. B&N must collect SALES tax. Amazon must help us collect USE tax. The reason they must is that they do business in Colo even if not physically here. They don't have to collect and we are not asking them to, but they have to report. They still have too even after this decision.
@JohnMorseSD11 he brought up valid points , barnes and noble have buildings in colorado , amazon does not, apple has stores here in colorado, you are asking compaines out of your jurisdiction to do your work for you and sit back like a fat cat just like you did in fountain colorado and collect taxes. in law enforcement you collected through traffic fines and now being in the state you do it through taxation. november will kick alot of democrats out because they have hurt hard working people.
Respectfully I disagree with you and blame 1193 and people like you who voted for it. I understand the state needs money but creating taxes on candy, pop, and internet is not the way to go.
Spin it anyway you want but the internet tax is a new tax. Per Quill v. ND If I buy from a site that does not have nexus in CO, there is no sales tax; yet you created a new tax. Per that ruling, the CO affiliates is nexus and amazon's decision.
Not true. This is a use tax, not a sales tax. Granted, they are complimentary taxes, but still different. And, the use tax was already legally due. All we did was ensure a mechanism to collect a tax that is already due. Incidentally, it is not due from Amazon--they will pay zero in tax. Why should we permit people to evade paying their taxes when the rest of us pay? Why do I have to pay tax at the shops on main street while you evade the tax that you legally owe in cyberspace?
Ritter called a Car Registration Tax Increase a 'fee', you want to call this sales tax a 'use tax'. Spin it anyway you want, we have a new tax on candy, pop, and internet that the people of CO have to pay while already are beat down by the furloughs, pay cuts, and layoffs. Per Quill v. ND ruling, unless there i nexus, no sales/use tax/fee to be collected.
To answer your question, we pay taxes for B&M because they are in CO, we use states resources, streets, light etc, people work here.
@JohnMorseSD11 you do notpay taxes like the rest of us , you take tax money to support yourself. amazon called your bluff. the more you tax the more you will love revenue. switch to apple . pay 3 times what a computer is worth. why are you so against the people john?
watch in the coming years , people will give up being producing citizens after you tax them on car license plate fees, soda, candy, internet sales, property tax, fees to do anything. at some point you break the middle class.
The bill that you passed caused the reaction - unfortunately you then need to take some responsibility for how companies react.
Amazon may be wrong here - but the end result is that Coloradans are out business based on the law that you passed. And only you can solve the problem if you choose to with a repeal until things can be worked out on language.
Respectfully, that's my opinion. Thank you for sharing yours, it is good to see more understanding on the issue overall.
Really? Existing law requires people to pay tax. We have no way currently to enforce collection and we all know that without enforcement, people pay as little as possible, in this case nothing. We devise a strategy that spares Amazon from being responsible for paying a dime or doing anything but notifying consumers and the state of total purchases. Then they engage in immoral, unethical, reprehensible behavior and I am responsible. Since we outlawed murder am I responsible for each murder?
Notifying the customers costs money, it requires more employees. Why do you keep ignoring that fact? Comparing this to murder is not only extreme but ridiculous. Do you really expect a business to stick around if it is not profitable. I would still like you to clarify your point about the constitution. You've managed to insult my intelligence as a citizen, so please clarify your position so that I can better understand.
I think the point I am trying to make is that businesses make decisions based on laws. The law that your State passed caused a reaction. Amazon does not wish to be seen as "doing business" in your State... all based on this law.
Yes - I do think then that responsibility falls on both sides. If the legislation works, you could claim responsibility for it benefiting Colorado as you feel it does.... So I would think the same would be relevant if it failed.
Yeah a nice thought out way to word it so people see your way... but this is a business decision... not retaliating and attacking Colorado affiliates because they are mad at the State of Colorado... so manipulating.
Other companies are certain to follow suit. I am a small business owner in the state of Colorado and use affiliates to market my products so I can feed my family. If other states I do business in follow suit with this law, I would have to shut down because I do not have the means to administer this law.
This isn't about Amazon. Stop thinking corporate America and think about how you just screwed your constituents and decreased your income.
The fundemental problem I have with this is the fact that you are saying, "Because we made a law in Colorado, you must obey in other states." Is Colorado the new Federal Government? This is what Amazon is saying, in my view. By the way, why do you piss on success so much. Look how you hate companies / people being successful. What's your (the democrats) problem with that?
Residents of Colo owe sales tax on every purchase they make regardless of where they make it. If the vendor does not collect sales tax at the point of sale, the consumer owes the complimentary use tax. This has been true since the early 1930s. What this law does is require Amazon to help us enforce our existing tax law. I suspect, but don't know, that every other state has a similar tax. If you sell to Colo residents you have to help us collect what is lawfully owed--Amazon does.
I disagree. Too many corporate bullies expect to keep raking in the dough at the expense of the middle class. What? 900 million isn't enough money? 90% of Colorado's general fund comes form INDIVIDUAL income tax and sales tax. Why shouldn't big corporation pay their fair share? Nope, they throw tantrums instead and bully their affiliates who MADE THEM MONEY just to prove a point. I hope this catches on in every state then these corporate tyrants will have no where to run to.
You're right in that Amazon and B&N are situated differently (B&N has stores in CO, Amazon does not), but the bill treats them differently. Online stores with a physical presence (B&N) must collect/remit sales tax. Online retailers such as Amazon, with no stores in CO, only need to send the relevant tax info to the CO DOR so the state can collect taxes. Feel free to read the bill at the CO State Leg. website, as it's entirely consistent with the US Supreme Crt's Quill Corp v. N. Dakota decision.
Your understanding of the Constitution is rudimentary at best. The Supreme Court has ruled that if you do business in a state, you have to help that state collect the tax they are owed. If you have a physical presence you have to collect sales tax. If not, and the state requires you to provide information so they can collect the tax, you must unless you are not actively engaged in selling products in that state. Amazon sells to Coloradans with and without affiliates.
I'm trying to figure out exactly what part of the Constitution you are referring to and who you are directing that comment to. Perhaps you could quote the section to which you are referring.
I will buy only from Amazon,
Stop wasting our money you jerks are taxing sugar now. You want to see tyranny look at your tax code buddy. You say we pass a bill, more you and your elitist cronies pass a slave tax on the good people of Colorado. We see through your money hungry antic stooge.
IF YOU DRIVE THEY WILL TAX THE STREET , IF YOU WALK THEY WILL TAX YOUR FEET.
The King or England felt the same way you do before WE THE PEOPLE, GAVE HIM THE BOOT. With luck you will be next pork bellyXD
LerdoBurgerPimp 3 weeks ago
we already paid for those taxes when we first bought the product
katrynem 3 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Despite all these advances Amazon Jeff Besoz is a real Asshole , he steals intellectual property from authors, and publishing companies, he steals debit funds from buyers and sellers, from partners- underpay their employees and treat then like children. All to inflate Amazon stock. Which has been slowly shrinking for weeks now. Jeff B you are an Ass treat you employees with respect and paid a fair wage , Jeff B you bully asshole, stop stealing
youman1933 3 months ago
If our politicians paid a sales tax on the money they collected under the table for "selling themselves" to special interest groups and lobbyists we could pay off the national debt.
Go AMAZON KEEP FIGHTING!!!! DON'T GIVE UP!!!
mbmart2005 8 months ago
fuck sales tax
pf91rodman 9 months ago
why don't you worry about getting your per diem scandal in order and stop interfering with businesses that CREATE JOBS and SAVE CONSUMERS MONEY?
royalorleanshk 11 months ago
Idiots shouldn't try doing smear campaigns.
Those affiliates won't get paid because of your stupidity.
foreign96man 11 months ago
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More to the point, you obviously just didn't think about your actions before carrying them out.
Now that you've caught my eye, I'll be taking a deeper look at your track record of decision making. I'm willing to bet that after I do so, I won't be able to stomach the thought of voting for you, ever, since that's the head start I already have from the mess you've made of this issue.
bwehde 1 year ago
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bwehde 1 year ago
... in response to your bullying.
Or did you really think nobody had noticed?
I know it's too much to ask, but the next time you decide to gamble with peoples means of income, you should try starting with your own.
Say what you like about high minded theoretical nonsense and intentions, the bottom line is this:
You set off a chain of events that led to the demise of a significant opportunity for Coloradans to increase their revenue and funnel funds back into the state from remote markets...
bwehde 1 year ago
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bwehde 1 year ago
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bwehde 1 year ago
... to open up doors here, and to leave the interests it has here, here.
Along with thinking about what you can and can't do, you would do well to consider what you should and shouldn't do. Any form of incentive you can offer to stimulate growth is what you SHOULD be doing. Batting companies around with tax laws during a recession is the exact opposite.
You gambled. You lost. You poked a bear, and the people of Colorado ended up taking the bite in your stead because the bear pushed back...
bwehde 1 year ago
Said another way:
John Morse and his cronies made a decision that the best way to increase tax revenues was to play tax collector hardball, gambling with the revenue of entrepreneurial Coloradans in the process, by attempting to put a gun to the head of a leader of industry.
This was, in reality, a feeble idea to begin with, and was executed at the absolute worst time possible. A time, in fact, when the theme of government should be to do everything in its power to convince industry...
bwehde 1 year ago
our voting voices will be heard in november, then we can get rid of politicians with this mentality.
tonytonytee 1 year ago
john morse is an enemy of the people. he taxes us and hurts us in any way he can.. he does not realize that the more he taxes the more people will give up. there will be no reason to work in this country. they want to destroy hard working people in this country. i have no faith in john morse or any politician that thinks like he does. there are sad days in america. they want to have us give up and destroy hard workers in this country. they love failure.
tonytonytee 1 year ago
How much use tax did you pay on that Kindle, Senator?
LY8Ze7xK 1 year ago
I just got an email from an internet retailer that said they were going to report all my purchases to the Colorado Government. This made me really angry. I'll bet a lot of people will be really angry. If you were smart, you'd pull this video.
LY8Ze7xK 1 year ago
Amazon is the bully, Mr. Morse? Oh, you are the bully, sir. And your actions have caused the financial loss to the Amazon Affiliates and others. You raise taxes, threaten to tax demand more and more information to tax, and then you wonder why people react negatively? Really? Well, it is really is quite simple: you are a greedy thug. I just migrated my Amazon Affiliate account to a different state, you thug.
1blah2blah3blah4blah 1 year ago 4
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Everyone who has a profitable website should just form a corporation in Wyoming, they will then not need to worry about what Colorado does. So not only will Colorado lose the affiliate revenue, they will lose even more money to Wyoming. I forecast incorporation is going to be a huge trend that business friendly states will benefit from.
wlkalong 1 year ago
Everyone who has a profitable website should just form a corporation in Wyoming, they will then not need to worry about what Colorado does. So not only will Colorado lose the affiliate revenue, they will lose even more money to Wyoming. I forecast incorporation is going to be a huge trend that business friendly states will benefit from.
wlkalong 1 year ago
First off if this Bozo's state of colorado wants to do this and it is in their state constitution, then fine, but I have a right to leave and go to a better place that is more to my liking as a business. Also remember he has that pig intelligence with a 9 yr stint, also seems he can't keep a REAL HONEST JOB. Oh well just more of the progressive intelligence by politicians.
Cooter4 1 year ago
Good for Amazon! Haha...I buy at least ten thousand dollars a year of merchandise a year on Amazon (it's my go to place; I hate going to most bricks & mortar stores). Having seen this video, I'm going to see if I can shift even MORE of my purchases to Amazon. And if I ever give my Kindle DX in favor of an iPad, I'll be sure to buy it through Amazon.
stratman351 1 year ago
Three cheers for Amazon. You have made a loyal customer. Amazon can only get money from you when voluntarily decide their product is worth your money. On the other hand, Colorado politicians just decide to take your money. This is another example of how GOVERNMENT ruins private sector jobs. Love this story!
LibertyPen 1 year ago 3
So you are mad because they took _their_ ball and went home. Yea Amazon! Maybe I should increase my next order for them.
hobbittc 1 year ago 2
All of you who are blasting Morse, remember: he was a cop, and has the connections to track you down and make trouble for you. After listening to this, does anyone doubt that he would if he thought he could get away with it? In Morse's world, everyone wants to be an informer for Colorado. Who can doubt that if Amazon hadn't declined, they'd have to provide income details for the affilates to Colorado's Department of Revenue.
leoamery 1 year ago
Wow, all that mighty legislation and blustering, and all you're going to have to show for it is 5,000 lost jobs and a bunch of ticked-off Colorado voters who can't buy stuff on Amazon. Sucks to be you.
MScottEiland 1 year ago 5
Need a clearer example of why the Tea Party has resonated with the common man? Tyranny my petty little legislator is the domain of the government. you no doubt attended public school in CO so never heard of things like "No taxation without representation".
pgrossjr 1 year ago 5
This is typical of the tax and spend set (both sides of the aisle, don't flame me). The first 8 seconds convinced me that this person is full of himself.
Somehow, politicians got it into their heads that they could make people mad at corporations because they make money.
Hey John -- guess what -- when corporations make money, they HIRE PEOPLE. So umm, maybe you could stimulate the economy or something and quit being such a creepy entrenched politico type.
Get a clue!
dittomarks 1 year ago
Hey Morse? Take that f-ing Kindle of yours and see if you can look up the word tyrant, you petulant horses ass, because you clearly have no idea what it means.
Amazon called your bluff and you didn't have the cards. Read em and weep tough guy. I'll buy more stuff from them because they stood up to a two-bit thug like you than I ever would have before.
You make me want to vomit. Go on over to Cannon City and check in before you do any more harm.
Can't you creeps EVER leave us alone?
Ken4Pyro 1 year ago 3
"It is my sincere wish that all the company's you mentioned would follow the superb example given by Amazon, with regards to dealing with thugs like you."
WeDontNeedGod 1 year ago
"JohnMorseSD11 - You thought you could use a law to take what you have not earned from those who have earned it. Amazon is showing you, you have no right. You need them, you said so yourself. The revenue the company creates for non-profits in your state, The machine you hold in your hand. Amazon does not need you. And I for one am glad they they are standing up to the tyranny and abuse you tried to level at them."
WeDontNeedGod 1 year ago
Whats the deal with deleting comments on here?
WeDontNeedGod 1 year ago
What an idiot. B&N, Apple, and other retailers that have a physical presence in CO are required to collect the tax. Amazon isn't, and the Supremes said so. Amazon isn't going to be a tax collector for CO, and why should they be? Who wants to deal with the petulance and ignorance of morons like Mr. Morse?
jfnixon 1 year ago
John Morse, the 900 pound government bully. And a veritable Internet newb, to boot.
justanotherbob 1 year ago
"Tyranny"? Seriously?
Congrats to the Colorado State Legislature for losing 5,000 jobs during a recession, in a foolish attempt to make up for their own fiscal recklessness. Well played.
molyuk 1 year ago
wow - you sound bitter that they wouldn't play by your rules. Maybe you guys should have checked at the success, or lack thereof, that other states have had with 'amazon' taxes. Tyranny? maybe you should use a dictionary. Tyranny is more like tools like you thinking they can squeeze money out of everyone. Newsflash, the populace is not there to serve you - in fact its the other way around.
tool
bored383 1 year ago 2
Wow. Good for Amazon. I haven't bought anything through them in a while but I'm going to steer some purchases their way.
SusanAcuff 1 year ago
Doesnt that plaque behind him say "Mental Health Legislator" ??? LOL
krloach 1 year ago
"Tyranny" LOL ....This guy sounds like Glenn Beck!
krloach 1 year ago
This is like the mafia complaining because the local chain store left town rather than pay protection money to them.
Your impotent rage in trying to create a lynch mob to attack amazon because your guns weren't enough is laughable.
Try producing wealth instead of redistributing it. While your at it try justifying how you have any claim on a portion of a private transaction without cowardly references to, "that's the way it's always been."
mclazarus 1 year ago 2
Amazon's refusal to do even this clearly shows that it is only interested in maintaining its significant competitive advantage over the bricks-and-mortar retailers in the state--and that it is more than willing to use its online affiliates as pawns to do so
hsft 1 year ago
unlike sales tax equity legislation in other states, which makes clear that an active network of in-state affiliates establishes nexus--and requires an out-of-state retailer to collect sales tax for online sales--our state's law now merely asks these retailers to inform residents of the amount of use tax that they owe for online purchases.
hsft 1 year ago
@hsft It "merely asks them"? So they can politely decline, then. No?
LY8Ze7xK 1 year ago
I love how he has his "Mental Health Legislator of the Year" Award in the background..
He's trying to make us believe he's actually not crazy... Its not working John
topgun0152 1 year ago 3
You created a ridiculous tax using affiliates as the rationale. Why should Amazon be taxed just because of affiliates in the state. As you say in the video, it's a just a pass through reference and completely intangible. Yet, you hinged your tax rationale on it anyway. Many people testified that this is what would happen if this tax was passed. Now you're surprised and angry?! WOW.
iseyffert 2 years ago 4
Affiliates were not used as the rationale. In fact, they were intentionally left OUT of the bill, to avoid this exact issue. In other states, they WERE used as the rationale as they were deemed "physical presence." Not here. People DID testify this is what would happen, thus legislators changed the bill to not use affiliates as the basis for enforcing the tax, thus Amazon (and everyone else) is bound by this regardless of affiliates.
desrea777 1 year ago
@desrea777 Hmmm...maybe you should read the amended bill. Section 1, sentence 2 - "...section 1 articulates a presumption that any out-of-state retailer that has a referral relationship with an affiliate has an obligation to collect sales tax."
iseyffert 1 year ago
@iseyffert What you're quoting is a bill summary that describes the original bill as initially presented, not the final version.
The various versions are available here (remove spaces):
w ww.leg.state.c o.u s/clics/clics2010a/csl.nsf/fsbillcont2/B30F574193882B4B872576A80026BE0C?Open
jeffdeed 1 year ago
You aren't reading the most current bill, I know quite well the version you speak of, but it has been amended many times since at the request of affiliates and others. Google the CO legislature website and find HB 10-1193. They have the most current one posted on the site. I'd post a link if youtube would allow. The word "affiliate" is not there (do a Ctrl+F even to search). It, and the section you quote, was removed to protect affiliates by not associating them with being a phys presence in CO.
desrea777 1 year ago
If the bill you are looking at says "introduced" on the top, it is not the bill as passed. A passed bill will A) come directly from the CO leg site itself when you click on the bill number (some "backdoor" searches will pull up old bills from the site) and B) will have "An ACT" written on the top.
desrea777 1 year ago
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Affiliates were not used as the rationale. In fact, they were intentionally left OUT of the bill, to avoid this exact issue. In other states, they WERE used as the rationale as they were deemed "physical presence." Not here. People DID testify this is what would happen, thus legislators changed the bill to not use affiliates as the basis for enforcing the tax, thus Amazon (and everyone else) is bound by this regardless of affiliates.
desrea777 1 year ago
JohnMorseSD11 - You thought you could use a law to take what you have not earned from those who have earned it. Amazon is showing you, you have no right. You need them, you said so yourself. The revenue the company creates for non-profits in your state, The machine you hold in your hand. Amazon does not need you. And I for one am glad they they are standing up to the tyranny and abuse you tried to level at them.
WeDontNeedGod 2 years ago 13
It is my sincere wish that all the company's you mentioned would follow the superb example given by Amazon, with regards to dealing with thugs like you.
WeDontNeedGod 2 years ago 8
Amazon walked away (Shrugged!) Did you ever hear about a "bully" who walks away?
What bullies do is this: trying to extort money from a voluntary seller and a voluntary customer by means of harassment. And this is what Colorado government did!
Brother, you asked for it.
bedzzled 2 years ago 8
I'm an Amazon Associate sickened by this whole fiasco, but Amazon is NOT to blame.
The Colorado government -- our legislators and governor -- created this mess by its imposition of an "Amazon Tax" with HB 1193. Given its Colorado-based affiliates, that law would have crippled Amazon with an onerous and expensive confusion of red tape, plus a crazy patchwork of local taxes. The only way for Amazon to extricate itself from that nightmare was to terminate the Affiliate Program.
...
dmbrickell 2 years ago 13
Morse is quite possibly the least intelligent person in the Colorado Senate...with the exception of Hudak.
This is what happens when liberals realize that they cannot contol every aspect of the private sector. they make videos and complain.
Morse, keep your Kindle, but start reading new books. Try reading about the founding Fathers, (Alinsky was not a founding father). Try reading Atlas Shrugged
topgun0152 2 years ago 3
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Atlas shrugged? Or sure Ann Rand is the bible of capitalism and callous disregard for people like you.
Least intelligent category in the CO State Senate has to go to Bill Cadman, or maybe Dave Schultheis, Josh Penry or Greg Brophy. So many others stand in front of John Morse winning this distinction......
kulpc 2 years ago
@JohnMorseSD11 -- "We worked on the law to make sure they could comply with almost no cost."
Please post to your website any projections the legislature used to determine what the average cost of compliance of this law would be (including any secondary costs such as complying with a state audit) along with the source of these projections.
I am genuinely interested in what figures the state legislature used here.
jeffdeed 2 years ago 2
Viewers should take note of the plaque prominently and ironically placed behind him to the right, which states: "Mental Health Legislator of the Year." I'm am sure he's a better customer for that industry than for Amazon. He probably increases the mental health needs of normal Coloradans who are going broke because all three branches of Colo. government are controlled by the Dems. That will end in November. Adios, Senator.
BalkoVCFan 2 years ago
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Outstanding explaination of what really is the truth. I too will never buy from Amazon!!!!!! GREAT JOB
sensuzannewilliams 2 years ago
@sensuzannewilliams
That's a fairly new account you have Suzanne...
Amazon has made a business decision because they no longer see their situation as being profitable. It's a never ending cycle, you raise taxes in one area or pass legislation, and certain businesses will become unprofitable. The businesses go under, then politicians jump in screaming about lost jobs. They raise taxes elsewhere to subsidize businesses they favor, in turn putting other small companies out of business.
aquabanianskakid 2 years ago
@sensuzannewilliams But by boycotting Amazon, Senator Williams, you risk disrupting their business and causing layoffs or potentially outright failure of Amazon. Think of all the people you could be harming.
The State made a decision and Amazon chose to take their affiliate business elsewhere. Amazon made a decision and you decided to take your shopping business elsewhere. Why is one better than the other? Aren't we all generally encouraged to "vote with [our] wallet[s]?"
jeffdeed 2 years ago 7
you have a mild point but your argument falls flat. First, Amazon already "fired" the people it was giving income to, even though they are not tied to legislation implied. Second, I don't think amazon stands to be put financially out by this at all. They have the means to track every single click by every person, you don't think they can send a form out? Third, this is not a tax raise lol. it's hilarious that people either refuse or can't see that. Maybe a civics lesson would help ;)
hsft 1 year ago
@hsft It's also amazing how some people fail to understand that "only one form" means extra staff, programmers, servers, database managers... and plenty of other hidden costs. Bash Amazon all you will, but it will cost them and other companies money.
I find it mildly hilarious that the only pro comments are from accounts that have either just popped up, or have obviously never viewed any other youtube channels.
aquabanianskakid 1 year ago
Meh I've had this account for a few years. I like Morse and subscribe to his channel. So Amazon would have to hire maybe one or two people to send out the forms? after they just fired hundreds I'm sure the costs offset in their favor. I comment here because a family member (my mom actually..hard core R) is boycotting Amazon because she and many of her peers were affiliates. I happen to agree w their pov.
Can you really tell what I've viewed? that's kinda cool :) Or is it just where I post?
hsft 1 year ago
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jeffdeed 1 year ago
@hsft The likely costs aren't in simply "send[ing] a form out", but to verify that the right data is being sent correctly (this is not 100 orders that can be verified manually), to ensure that all data relevant to this law is properly accounted for in case of audit, to comply with an audit and in any penalties that are assessed due to any failures in reporting (intentional or otherwise).
Certainly not impossible, but nobody would volunteer to do this out of the kindness of their heart.
jeffdeed 1 year ago
I've yet to meet anyone who embarks on semi-arduous paperwork out of the "kindness of their hearts" You pay taxes because you are supposed to. This was an EXEMPTION, one of over 100 pages worth dolled out when we were in a fiscal boom. Now we are in a fiscal crunch, so the state repeals some of those exemptions. Are tax breaks Indefinite?
hsft 1 year ago
@hsft What does any of this have to do with this law not being at all burdensome on Amazon?
I don't recall saying tax breaks are indefinite. I don't recall saying individuals or Amazon shouldn't pay taxes that they are legally obligated to pay.
What I did say is that you (and Senator Morse) are trivializing the requirements. It's not simply "sending a form" and we're done. Have you ever been involved in a sales tax audit? Have you ever had to prove you've complied with a law like this?
jeffdeed 1 year ago 2
@jeffdeed It's impossible to get people to understand that computers aren't magical boxes that read your mind. They hear "web company" and they think anything can simply be done with the flip of a switch. They refuse to believe that even "shopping carts" on a website can take months for a team to properly design. After all the user only has to click so it must be that simple for Amazon right? Databases, servers, programmers, accountants, and many other things are required for a "simple change".
aquabanianskakid 1 year ago
While it is great that you want to stand up to Amazon, remember that you are doing it on the backs of people like me who are losing money every days because of this.
Put your concern for Coloradans ahead of your hatred from Amazon and take action that will get Amazon to re-instate its affiliate program here. Find another way to raise awareness of Use Tax.
rosenz 2 years ago 4
While I agree with your sentiment in this video, I have to urge you NOT to boycott Amazon. I'm one of the people affected here (I'll lose thousands in 2010 because my affiliate account was closed) -- but a boycott will make things WORSE. You see, Amazon sells books and other products from Colorado producers, like me. And when you buy from Amazon, you are sometimes buying from Colorado resellers. A boycott against Amazon will hurt even more Colorado businesses than what Amazon has done.
rosenz 2 years ago 3
Senator,
I challenge you to post your state income tax returns showing where you have paid the use tax on your past Amazon and other online purchases. Certainly since you feel so strongly about it and accuse others of evading taxes, you have done so and will provide this information. Just to ensure this isnt the first year you have paid, please be sure to post a year prior to 2009 otherwise folks will say you only paid them because of this legislation.
TonysRants 2 years ago 3
In taking this move, it will help to quell the naysayers and show you are on the up and up.
I will be watching your website for these to be posted. I believe in doing so you will give your argument much more credence and show you have done your fair share as a Coloradoan to pay your taxes.
TonysRants 2 years ago 2
@TonysRants
Fat chance of that happening. If he did, I would be impressed but still not sold.
aquabanianskakid 2 years ago
@TonysRants Don't hold your breath, Tony.
LY8Ze7xK 1 year ago
What a sanctimonious performance.
This Amazon reaction is only the beginning. Coloradans are about to find that online transactions are suddenly more onerous, with many small retailers (and ebayers) simply refusing to ship to CO. Then they will find that complying at tax time is time-consuming and an incredible invasion of privacy. Yet promised revenues will lag, and the economy will suffer.
Then they will vote Morse, Heath, and the rest of these bozos out of office.
ArtD0dger 2 years ago
It's also transparently manipulative @2:15 where you switch from complaining that people making a living through affiliate links are losing business, to suddenly describing those benefitting from the affiliate link program as churches and other nonprofit organizations.
Which is it? Website owners getting a little cut of Amazon's sales through advertising, or unimpeachably noble nonprofits funding their good-doing organizations through Amazon's grudging sharing of its unconscionable profits?
revenki 2 years ago 2
@revenki Organizations which, ironically, pay no taxes.
LY8Ze7xK 1 year ago
The things that bother me about this bill are: 1. The people that purchase products from Amazon are not interacting with a server in Colorado. They are reaching across state lines. Same as if I pick up the telephone.
2. It's troubling that you think we can force an out-of-state entity to do anything with our laws. If this is the case, what's going to stop Florida from forcing my business in Colorado, to perform any number of activities that cost me time and money.
frequencyhopper 2 years ago
The people of the other 49 states in the union would like to thank Senator Morse and his colleagues for the business, investment and jobs they're chasing out of their state and into ours. Keep up the great work! :)
BrianRMiller 2 years ago
Screw you jerk, pass a law that screws over a legitimate business, expect that business to vote with its feet.
joshholmes86 2 years ago
This is a great indicator of how politicians don't understand economics.
Firstly, Amazon's net income will be significantly lower than Colorado's budget deficit for 2010 -- which shows where the first problem lies, out of control spending.
Secondly, any and every tax increase or other bureaucratic requirement simply causes productive businesses and people to choose to decamp from jurisdictions like CO that "don't get it." Other states happily welcome their business. Economics 101.
BrianRMiller 2 years ago
If I have a online business in another state and I sell to 50 people in Colorado I now have to send out 50 notices via first class mail to people in Colorado. One way to get around this is to not sell to people in Colorado. This law is going to be a real pain for small online businesses. Thanks Colorado Legislature.
iBookWatch 2 years ago
What a punk.
earthmombooks 2 years ago
Also, this law would require that if a user "Joe" who lives in Florida, is browsing a website run by a guy in Colorado and clicks on a link advertising a book, and ends up buying that book from Amazon who, like Joe, isn't in Coloado, that Amazon should treat the website owner in CO that advertised the book as a brick and mortar and pay taxes on that purchase.
In other words... Colorado wants sales tax from two entities not located in Colorado. Of course Amazon told them to go fudge themselves.
ptwiggens 2 years ago
Nonsense. This law requires that Amazon send the equivalent of a 1099 to each Colo resident at year end telling the resident and the state the total amount of purchases for the year so the state can follow up and collect the use tax that is owed, no one in any other state will be subject to Colo tax. The use tax is already owed, always has been. This permits us to collect it. Amazon paid not one nickel in sales or use tax before this law and will pay not one nickel in tax after the law.
JohnMorseSD11 2 years ago
What exactly is your argument? That more forms won't increase the cost of Amazon doing business? It will. As long as politicians like yourself continue to add more bureaucracy, paperwork, and taxes... businesses will leave. I hardly see Amazon doing this out of spite. Amazon is a business and if this cuts into their profits they will leave. Calling businesses evil because they want to make money is cutting off your nose to spite your face.
aquabanianskakid 2 years ago
Really? More forms? Your'e kidding, right? Amazon is an absolute master at collecting data and doing it digitally. Until yesterday, I was probably one of their best customers. They know what I buy, they know what is related to what I buy, they know what I should buy next.
Complying with this law will cost them very little, they already have all the data they need and then some. We worked on the law to make sure they could comply with almost no cost. And they pay zero in tax, zero.
JohnMorseSD11 2 years ago
@JohnMorseSD11
Doing it digitally requires databases and programmers. Sending out the completed documentation requires postage, and envelope packers. If the data is sent out digitally it requires extra bandwidth and servers. No matter how you look at it, this will cost Amazon money. I would still like an explanation on how the Constitution comes into play here preferably with some quotations directly from it explaining your point.
aquabanianskakid 2 years ago 2
@JohnMorseSD11
What about the businesses that are not Amazon? What about all the little online businesses that now have to deal with these regs? The law does not say that it applies to Amazon alone? The law would also apply to eBay wouldn't it?
iBookWatch 2 years ago 2
@iBookWatch
Exactly... what about other businesses? What about people that work from their homes? What about businesses with 100 employees or less?
aquabanianskakid 2 years ago 2
What a moron.
People who don't support what Amazon has done just don't understand the laws and how the state is actually the one trying to bully Amazon into doing something it isn't required to do.
Typical. Barnes and Noble is nothing like Amazon... using that as an example just shows how deceitful you are being to try and gain support. Congratulations on achieving the exact opposite of what you thought you would. Enjoy the rest of your time in office, it won't be long.
ptwiggens 2 years ago 2
Ahh, the Rush Limbaugh defense--when you have no idea what you are talking about, just call people names.
B&N has on on-line component just like Amazon. Difference is Amazon does not have brick & mortar in Colo. B&N must collect SALES tax. Amazon must help us collect USE tax. The reason they must is that they do business in Colo even if not physically here. They don't have to collect and we are not asking them to, but they have to report. They still have too even after this decision.
JohnMorseSD11 2 years ago
@JohnMorseSD11 he brought up valid points , barnes and noble have buildings in colorado , amazon does not, apple has stores here in colorado, you are asking compaines out of your jurisdiction to do your work for you and sit back like a fat cat just like you did in fountain colorado and collect taxes. in law enforcement you collected through traffic fines and now being in the state you do it through taxation. november will kick alot of democrats out because they have hurt hard working people.
tonytonytee 1 year ago
Senator,
Respectfully I disagree with you and blame 1193 and people like you who voted for it. I understand the state needs money but creating taxes on candy, pop, and internet is not the way to go.
Spin it anyway you want but the internet tax is a new tax. Per Quill v. ND If I buy from a site that does not have nexus in CO, there is no sales tax; yet you created a new tax. Per that ruling, the CO affiliates is nexus and amazon's decision.
I will vote out those who voted for for 1193!
AceWebMaster 2 years ago 5
Not true. This is a use tax, not a sales tax. Granted, they are complimentary taxes, but still different. And, the use tax was already legally due. All we did was ensure a mechanism to collect a tax that is already due. Incidentally, it is not due from Amazon--they will pay zero in tax. Why should we permit people to evade paying their taxes when the rest of us pay? Why do I have to pay tax at the shops on main street while you evade the tax that you legally owe in cyberspace?
JohnMorseSD11 2 years ago
Senator,
Ritter called a Car Registration Tax Increase a 'fee', you want to call this sales tax a 'use tax'. Spin it anyway you want, we have a new tax on candy, pop, and internet that the people of CO have to pay while already are beat down by the furloughs, pay cuts, and layoffs. Per Quill v. ND ruling, unless there i nexus, no sales/use tax/fee to be collected.
To answer your question, we pay taxes for B&M because they are in CO, we use states resources, streets, light etc, people work here.
AceWebMaster 2 years ago
@JohnMorseSD11 you do notpay taxes like the rest of us , you take tax money to support yourself. amazon called your bluff. the more you tax the more you will love revenue. switch to apple . pay 3 times what a computer is worth. why are you so against the people john?
watch in the coming years , people will give up being producing citizens after you tax them on car license plate fees, soda, candy, internet sales, property tax, fees to do anything. at some point you break the middle class.
tonytonytee 1 year ago
Senator Morse,
The bill that you passed caused the reaction - unfortunately you then need to take some responsibility for how companies react.
Amazon may be wrong here - but the end result is that Coloradans are out business based on the law that you passed. And only you can solve the problem if you choose to with a repeal until things can be worked out on language.
Respectfully, that's my opinion. Thank you for sharing yours, it is good to see more understanding on the issue overall.
shareasale 2 years ago
Really? Existing law requires people to pay tax. We have no way currently to enforce collection and we all know that without enforcement, people pay as little as possible, in this case nothing. We devise a strategy that spares Amazon from being responsible for paying a dime or doing anything but notifying consumers and the state of total purchases. Then they engage in immoral, unethical, reprehensible behavior and I am responsible. Since we outlawed murder am I responsible for each murder?
JohnMorseSD11 2 years ago
@JohnMorseSD11
Notifying the customers costs money, it requires more employees. Why do you keep ignoring that fact? Comparing this to murder is not only extreme but ridiculous. Do you really expect a business to stick around if it is not profitable. I would still like you to clarify your point about the constitution. You've managed to insult my intelligence as a citizen, so please clarify your position so that I can better understand.
aquabanianskakid 2 years ago
Senator Morse,
I think the point I am trying to make is that businesses make decisions based on laws. The law that your State passed caused a reaction. Amazon does not wish to be seen as "doing business" in your State... all based on this law.
Yes - I do think then that responsibility falls on both sides. If the legislation works, you could claim responsibility for it benefiting Colorado as you feel it does.... So I would think the same would be relevant if it failed.
shareasale 2 years ago
Yeah a nice thought out way to word it so people see your way... but this is a business decision... not retaliating and attacking Colorado affiliates because they are mad at the State of Colorado... so manipulating.
sukishiratu 2 years ago
I am disappointed with your video response.
Other companies are certain to follow suit. I am a small business owner in the state of Colorado and use affiliates to market my products so I can feed my family. If other states I do business in follow suit with this law, I would have to shut down because I do not have the means to administer this law.
This isn't about Amazon. Stop thinking corporate America and think about how you just screwed your constituents and decreased your income.
ExpertMarketingCoach 2 years ago
The fundemental problem I have with this is the fact that you are saying, "Because we made a law in Colorado, you must obey in other states." Is Colorado the new Federal Government? This is what Amazon is saying, in my view. By the way, why do you piss on success so much. Look how you hate companies / people being successful. What's your (the democrats) problem with that?
frequencyhopper 2 years ago
Residents of Colo owe sales tax on every purchase they make regardless of where they make it. If the vendor does not collect sales tax at the point of sale, the consumer owes the complimentary use tax. This has been true since the early 1930s. What this law does is require Amazon to help us enforce our existing tax law. I suspect, but don't know, that every other state has a similar tax. If you sell to Colo residents you have to help us collect what is lawfully owed--Amazon does.
JohnMorseSD11 2 years ago
Comment removed
denverjeffrey 2 years ago
I disagree. Too many corporate bullies expect to keep raking in the dough at the expense of the middle class. What? 900 million isn't enough money? 90% of Colorado's general fund comes form INDIVIDUAL income tax and sales tax. Why shouldn't big corporation pay their fair share? Nope, they throw tantrums instead and bully their affiliates who MADE THEM MONEY just to prove a point. I hope this catches on in every state then these corporate tyrants will have no where to run to.
hsft 2 years ago
You're right in that Amazon and B&N are situated differently (B&N has stores in CO, Amazon does not), but the bill treats them differently. Online stores with a physical presence (B&N) must collect/remit sales tax. Online retailers such as Amazon, with no stores in CO, only need to send the relevant tax info to the CO DOR so the state can collect taxes. Feel free to read the bill at the CO State Leg. website, as it's entirely consistent with the US Supreme Crt's Quill Corp v. N. Dakota decision.
JohnMorseSD11 2 years ago
Your understanding of the Constitution is rudimentary at best. The Supreme Court has ruled that if you do business in a state, you have to help that state collect the tax they are owed. If you have a physical presence you have to collect sales tax. If not, and the state requires you to provide information so they can collect the tax, you must unless you are not actively engaged in selling products in that state. Amazon sells to Coloradans with and without affiliates.
JohnMorseSD11 2 years ago
@JohnMorseSD11
I'm trying to figure out exactly what part of the Constitution you are referring to and who you are directing that comment to. Perhaps you could quote the section to which you are referring.
aquabanianskakid 2 years ago