Road to Ruin: Burned by Brokers

[phocasone]

Here in S. California they were selling converted apartments for $400,000. Brokers made the loans and appraisers were confirming value and banks were buying the notes. Fraud all around. Don't blame the buyers. Even Alice in Wonderland would not have believed in this transaction. Buyers trusted the professionals. These crap apartments /condos are now going for less than $100,000 to investors. Multiple bids. Even they might be paying too much. Oh the horror. Thank god for investors.

[jerthemessiah]

You mean people are going to move out of houses they can't afford and into apartments that they can afford?

[RikaKazak]

I'm sorry, but if you can't read and understand a loan doc...then maybe you aren't cut out for home ownership.

[unameitltd]

no loan broker who violated their fudicary duty is yet in jail. They were crooks.

However, the damm fools like this woman are equally to blame for signing

loan documents they did not read.

She is responsible for the mess her greed enabled her to fall into.

I kept renting as prices fell and didnt get sucked into a teaser mortgage properties.

Why should I ever have to pay a penny for this womans bad decision?

[hannahunney]

she had a letter saying she would get thirty year fixed. They showed the letter. Why is she a fool?

SHE was ROBBED, and TRICKED (ie. fraud aka illegal)

That "fool woman" did nothing wrong.

What's your problem? Direct your bile where it belongs, you loser.

Would you not want the law to protect you if you were robbed?

[ixamxmsright]

The REINVESTMENT ACT began by CARTER ,Adopted by CLINTON and pushed forward by BARNEY FRANK and CHRIS DODD.Deregulation was a result of Maxine Waters and gang not allowing Fanny Mae to be regulated .Bush administration tried to curtail them(it's ALL on tape you can see it). the Democrats stopped all review. The repeal of the Glass Steagall Act (which caused all these problems with DERIVATIVE TRADING) was done by the CLINTON administration! Hate to confuse you emotional liberals with the FACTS.

[ixamxmsright]

Government has sold us out. BOTH parties are willing partners in our demise. The INTERNATIONAL BANKERS want to rule our country and the world. The NWO is their ultimate goal.

[shakaama]

"pay as you go" they let that legislation sunset and didn't renew it. Now you don't have to balance a budget and you can have all the inflation you want. Huge deficit, don't matter.

Turn a blind eye to companies raping america. this is what your government did to you.

There are other political parties just waiting to do the right thing. Vote them in office, because 100 years of a 2 party system is over and done with.

[puppisa]

Thanks to the 8 year reign of destruction I call the Bush adm. George W managed to spend all our money (Federal savings) that Clinton restored, start 2 wars, continue Reagon's voodoo economics (borrow on our Social Security), and allow another global ring (besides oil and pharmaceuticals) that controls wealth, the finance co.'s and banks to f*ck us! If you don't make over $250,000 and you hate Obama, then you need to watch a documentary called "Maxed Out". Wake up, there is no govt, we are!

[marcomariaz26]

@puppisa amen.

[mcanical]

Push these people into financial crisis and force their children to join the armed services to help support their family.

Pretty messed up society we have here.

[lizolivit]

Indeed.

When it's You vs. the Government + Banksters, the Government + Banksters always win.

[mcanical]

Not if we as a society stand up and say enough! Americans are the scariest people on the planet when it comes to repressive forces, why, because we won our independence. Look how we all come together when crisis happens. We can have everything we need as a free people if we just stop being sheep and do something.

[BlacksAreBeautiful]

customers at that bank should withdraw their funds immediately..It is clear, this young woman has been ripped off, yet they refuse to renegotiate?? if they just reverted back to the orig loan, they would still make money! wouldn't it be more logical to have her stay in the home and pay off the orig loan, than be saddled with a house that they won't be able to sell? these people are very illogical in addition to being demonic!

[marcomariaz26]

If that 21 yr old kid thinks joining the military is a good choice, he's goofed in the head.

[Sarandib22]

So sad about her oldest son. No jobs, so he has to join the marines. The banks win and the military industrial complex gets its cannon fodder. He's so hopeful. I hope he doesn't end up in a coffin.

[idjfixi]

thx u that is my cousin and plz keep him in ur prays

[WarDogLRS]

This young man is playing into the hands of the Zionist

he cant see a way out to what he thinks will help so by joining the Military and or Obama's youth Brigade your young sons & Daughters will be our captors. Why cant America see the danger there in?. Your Framers warned you about the bankers & there lie's. The Gov by pulling out all the strings of our FAKE Economy made out of Paper & Ink has taken it's course & toll now the deception of Obama is in place & they still cant see the danger

[toeg1]

War,

I guess magic's comment below shows you "why can't Americans see the danger they're in."

Believe it or not, there are millions of Americans that actually believe THEY forced the banks to give them a loan, as if the bank was going, "No, no, I can't give you a loan, you're too high of a risk." And the poor guy going, "Give me a loan or else."

Look up NINJA loans and predatory lending practices. That's the TRUTH. Americans just don't understand logic, that's all.

[magichandpuppet]

toeg1, you lack basic logic skills buddy. It was government policy which forced (encouraging with many consequences if they didn't) banks to loan money to those who could not afford it. Of course the greedy sheep who wanted loans can't force banks to loan to them. Rather, they are now turning around and playing the victim. It was a mutually beneficial agreement: The sheep wanted to be enslaved with debt... the money-lenders wanted debt-slaves. The bad guy is the government policies involved.

[toeg1]

magic,

Let me see if I get this. You are saying that the poor, who have no money, who have lost a home and are now either on the street homeless or living with relatives in cramped quarters are the true TYRANTS. The bank CEOs who have received 100s of BILLIONS OF FREE TAX PAYER MONEY are not to blame. And the Bush/Bernanke/Paulson cabal did ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to encourage it. Obama and Acorn ALONE caused the worldwide economic meltdown.

Your logic is astounding.

[magichandpuppet]

toeg1, you treat logic like a redheaded step child. Open your mind to reason and don't try to twist my words into something crazy. The people that go the loans Asked for them. The government and special interests pressured the banks to give loans to people who could not afford to pay them back. Is that so hard to understand? The victim is the taxpayer... NOT the greedy people who asked for loans that they cannot pay back. I did not say ACORN acted alone. The federal reserve is primary.

[toeg1]

um magic,

You wrote this:

"The government and special interests pressured the banks to give loans to people who could not afford to pay them back"

You might not know this, but the US is the MOST capitalistic country on planet Earth. NO US gov. EVER told ANY bank to lose money. NO US gov ever said, "We want to create a worldwide economic meltdown, okay?" And if you bring up a law from 1968 and pretend that it works now, that's bs.

Is THAT so hard to understand??

[magichandpuppet]

you are just so incorrect on so many levels. No, the US is not the most capitalistic country on planet Earth. Yes, the U.S. government through policy and the Federal Reserve told banks to lend more money. Not sure where you got the rest of your crap from... you live in a fantasy land... I suggest you rush out and get a mortgage

[toeg1]

magic,

Then which country is more capitalistic?

If you don't know about the tent cities cropping up all over US, type "tent city" in google and you'll get 50 million hits - where do you live, Mars??

type "ninja loans" - 1 million hits, type "predatory lending" - 1 million hits. Let me know when you land on planet Earth so I can have someone meet you and show you what's really going on.

[magichandpuppet]

oh my... you really think you are smart don't you? Yes, I know all about the tent cities... it is sad indeed. But, did someone hold a gun to the head of those people...or ninja swords as you might have us think with that term "ninja loans"? What a joke. How many links just shows how many sheep. They wanted to borrow money and the cannot afford to pay it back. What do they expect? And, things are going to get much, much worse. This is just the beginning. Bailouts = Corporatism (not capitalism)

[toeg1]

magic,

That's alright. I knew you couldn't find another country. I won't ask again.

Just one case:

[A homeowner] attracted by the low monthly payments, said the broker who signed him up for the loan didn't tell him the principal balance could increase. It has risen about $24,000 to $276,000. "He put me in a bad position," he said, who fears he will be forced into foreclosure. "He misled me."

Those are called "Liar loans" and are illegal. The broker makes out big. The buyer loses his home.

[magichandpuppet]

Chinese communists are more capitalist than this government. And "he put me in a bad position" is how sheep always react when they refuse to take responsibility. And, liar loans refer to the sheep that lied about how much money they make per year. The legal term is fraud.

[toeg1]

"Communists are more capitalists" that capitalists? Wow, I'm impressed. First time I've ever heard that one.

If I understand you right, you're saying that the banks REFUSED to check on an applicant's statements, but it's not the banks' fault that they didn't even check. Isn't that twisted logic??

10 minutes from Bill Moyer's interview of Bill Black.Here's the actual definition of liar's (ninja) loans.

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I strongly recommend you watch this. It will help you understand reality.

[magichandpuppet]

Ha ha ... just because you are told you are capitalist does not make you one. This American system is command-control corporatism with enough propaganda to convince you otherwise.

Logic twisted? Are you asking me if a liar should be let off the hook because they didn't get caught in their lie? Ha! You would make a good lawyer sheep. Do you think the bank should just give the sheep the house then since the sheep cannot afford to pay for it? Wouldn't that be nice? Encouraging more lies!

[toeg1]

magic,

Your misinterpretation notwithstanding, you miss the obvious. The banks NEVER CHECKED: No Income, No Job, No Asset. Why didn't the banks verify? Why did they encourage borrowers to lie telling them that they promise NEVER to check if they can even pay for the loan?

You seriously need to watch that video. You keep claiming that poor Americans were able to bring the entire world to its knees. That logic defies any sense of rationality.

WATCH THE VIDEO, DANGIT!!!

[magichandpuppet]

So, it's the banks fault that the greedy sheep lied to them? Great... I know all about it. I know plenty of mortgage brokers and I know ALL about the liar loans. Yes, the mortgage brokers are parasites, but they follow the protocol set before them by Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae, which are government backed organizations (actually, they are the Democrat piggy bank). If you want to blame someone else other than the sheep, blame your fascist corrupt federal government politicians.

[toeg1]

magic,

I know. Your mind is made up and you don't want to be bothered with facts. This may come as a surprise to you, but the main players in the trillion dollar bailout OF THE BANKS, NOT SHEEPLE, came from Paulson and Geithner, who worked in the finance industry before. I know, mere coincidence. Remember the bailouts OF THE BANKS?? I don't recall too many "sheeple" speaking their mind to Congress over this. I kid you not, SOF gave the money to bankers, not sheeple. Hey, I remember!!

[magichandpuppet]

dude... I know all about those crooks... read my comment below and stop being a sleepy sheep. Yes, Paulson and Geithner are of Goldman Sachs who completely own YOU. Yes, they own you. They own the government and all of your future earnings. They will let you keep a little bit as long as you are a good sheep slave. Of course, there are ways to free yourself and stop being a sheep... but, I am not sure you can handle it :)

[toeg1]

magic,

You almost got something right. Good. And you've stopped blaming the borrowers. Very good. However, naming Paulson and Geithner, aren't the owners, though they do attend a lot of the meetings. They are the lackeys who must go on TV and be tarred and feathered by the MSM repeaters in order to give the sheeple the false impression of addressing the issues. Their bosses own us, yes, but not them. And it's not NWO. that's a misnomer. It's OWO. They've been at this for centuries.

[magichandpuppet]

sounds like a sheepy is starting to wake up... but, if you want to let greedy sheep off the hook who borrow more money than they could afford because they were greedy sheep... that is ludicrous. They are the batteries of the beast. They choose this... over and over again. If you try to wake them up about the OWO or NWO (whatever... it doesn't matter) then they get angry AT YOU! They want to believe in hope and change while borrowing money that they cannot afford to pay back.

[toeg1]

Prove it.

[magichandpuppet]

prove the opposite.

[toeg1]

magic,

Nice try. Everyone knows you can't prove a negative, but that doesn't stop people for hoping that someone would fall into the trap. Face it, you can't prove it, period.

[magichandpuppet]

ha ha... no one can prove anything to sleep sheep.  Sheep will be sheep, and that is the law of nature.. and, no, I will not prove that either. Good night... sheep dreams

[toeg1]

magic,

I understand your position. I'd hate to be debating someone where my only proof for what I say comes from the voices in my own head. I feel for you.

That's why I don't do that, btw. I gather the facts first, THEN, I formulate a conclusion, not the other way around.

[magichandpuppet]

this is not a debate, toeg1... this is me saying one thing, and then you turning it around trying to put words into my mouth, and then demanding I provide proof in a little comment box. Ridiculous. You are bound to sheepdom.

[toeg1]

If you want to talk to me, magic, you'll have to use the available methods. I rarely check a video again.

You're right, this is not a debate. I showed evidence all over the net that the banksters in and out of office are controlling it, while you insist that "greedy" sheeple are one of the main causes. The banksters love people like you.

I give facts to support my assertions, you quote the voices in your head. That is definitely not a debate.

[magichandpuppet]

I give common sense, and then you twist it into nonsense when you try to repeat it back. Does it take "proof" for you to acknowledge that the borrower is a party to the loan they took? Should they be left off the hook? Given a free house because they were "misled" into thinking they would be able to pay for something that elementary math could prove otherwise?

[toeg1]

magic,

That's real uncommon common sense. Perhaps you've never tried to buy a house. That would certainly explain why you keep making illogical statements.

You show no proof, you offer your own opinion as if it were fact. I offer Nouriel Roubini who differs with you completely. I offer Max Keiser, huffington post and hundreds of sites.

Whatever floats your boat. I prefer to listen to experts and not the voices in my own head. But hey, that's me.

[magichandpuppet]

You lack common sense. You can't even agree that the borrower is a party to the legal contract? They sign a NOTE promising to pay back the money with interest. Can I prove that? Why would I try? That's like proving the sky is blue, and only a complete moron would say "prove it" to a commonly understood fact.

And, Max Keiser is my hero... Do you hear him saying "oh, poor people who fraudulently took out loans, lying on their applications"?

[toeg1]

magic,

I didn't address that issue. Lying about my opinion before I give it is disingenuous. You seem to be having problems with reality. You're right, you haven't proven anything.

You wrote this: "Why would I try" Well, proving statements is a way to show that you are not just listening to the voices in your head. No, he never said that the poor people acted fraudulently, you're right. In fact, that's my point. He never said that. Thanks for proving me right once again.

[magichandpuppet]

Dude... It's like I type something and then you read it, but when you try to affirm you understood what I was saying, I can only conclude that something fell on your head because what comes out is something completely different. I no longer think you are a sheep as now I just feel sorry for you, like I did with the special kids in school

[toeg1]

whatever floats your boat, magic.

[magichandpuppet]

I'm glad you finally conceded :)

[toeg1]

like I told you before, magic, I don't go back and check all the videos I leave comments. Only when I'm flagged, like what wild did, will I respond.

You're a funny kid. Got a lot to learn, but you're still funny. I may just put up a video with a friend to show people the false analogies circulating. These analogies start with the owners who hand them off to their minions to ensure that the people wind up fighting each other and forgetting about the real owners.

[magichandpuppet]

We all have a lot to learn my friend... I think you need to work a little harder than I. I agree with some of your points except it seems that somehow your position is that you want to give the borrowers a free pass from taking responsibility for the legal contract they entered into and, for many of them, lying on a mortgage application. This is called "mortgage fraud". Granted, because of corrupt government interaction, big banks benefit and taxpayers suffer - but the borrower is part of prob

[toeg1]

magic,

P.T.once said, "There's a sucker born every minute." If you're a broker and you tell people that they are guaranteed to make money, they are guaranteed to pay less, and they are guaranteed to lower their bills, some are stupid enough to believe you.

But no one goes for, "Take out this loan and you will be on the streets in two years, trust me!!" No one will buy a loan that way. You have to understand human nature better.

[magichandpuppet]

If a broker says that (and it can be proven) then that broker can (and should) be liable in that case. They have a fiduciary responsibility which is highly regulated (at least in the states where I have been involved in real estate transactions - over 100).

I know that the lies were out there, and I heard them myself - mostly from real estate agents: "Real estate has never depreciated."; "they aren't making any more of it". Sadly, sales techniques are taught to agents so they know how...(more)

[magichandpuppet]

(more) to be positive and encouraging without crossing the line of making claims like "you are guaranteed to make a lot of money". For cases where that happened, if evidence exists, then these agents (or brokers) can and should be held liable.

However, out of all of the transactions I participated in, I never witnessed any such statements. But, why would one have to make such statements with shows like Flip This House on t.v.?

[toeg1]

magic,

P.T. Barnum, "There's a sucker born every minute." As you say, the brokers know just what to say in case of any court litigation, they have to. Most people are walking around in their sleep anyway, makes it easier.

The winners here are the owners. The brokers filled their roles and so they won't suffer as much as the rest of us. Those who borrowed were played for suckers and they now live in tents. The shmuck isn't the problem, it's the owners.

[magichandpuppet]

Further... is it a car salesman's legal responsibility to tell you that your new car is going to depreciate a huge amount as soon as you pull out of the parking lot? Do they have to tell you that if you lose your job, you won't be able to continue paying for it and then the repo man will come and take the car back? Should everyone who lied on an auto loan application be given a free car because the salesman didn't catch them in their lie?

[toeg1]

magic,

If you're going to lose your job soon, they won't give you the loan. Otherwise, you're in the realm of "acts of God." You cannot give you a loan. You cannot sign all the documents so that you give yourself a loan. Unless you own the bank, someone else must sign, and that person is signing for the bank. That person must check your background first. You can say, anything. They still check. They will never take your word. They will always check before they sign. And they checked!!!!!

[magichandpuppet]

I agree with you toeg1.. Yes, the owners (and the politicians) are the real crooks. The lenders knew that the government-backed Freddie Mac/Fannie Mae would buy the loans from them, so it was a vicious game of hot potato. But, what did the buyer really lose that was really theirs. I understand they lost "their home", but the home never belonged to them as it was collateral for the debt they agreed to take. I agree with all of your points, except the borrowers do not deserve a free pass.

[toeg1]

magic,

Your complaint is against those who went in thinking they'd be able to scam "the system". Trust me, there's no buyer that thought, "I'm out of here in two years, but until then..."

Also, as is human nature, the vast majority hocked their savings, their credit cards, as much debt as possible to keep "their house". Human Nature,

But if you look at the possibly 10s of 1000s of dollars a few were hoping to scam, it doesn't compare in the slightest with the TRILLIONS GIVEN to the bankers

[magichandpuppet]

You should pay more attention to Max Keiser. If you listened to him more you probably wouldn't be trying to twist logical information into processed illogical doo doo

[toeg1]

magic,

I watch The Oracle, listen to Karmabanque radio, and watch his videos on Al Jazeera and elsewhere. You're right in saying he's smart. That's why he's constantly condemning the banks for generating this catastrophe. He knew about Iceland a year before it happened, and he's made other great predictions. He only goes after the guilty, however. The mortgage lenders lied to people as has been shown thousands of times. He doesn't blame the people for the lies from the lenders.

[magichandpuppet]

look, I condemn the banks too. But, does Max suggest that the borrowers are the victims? Does he suggest that they are innocent? NO he does not. He does point out that the tax payers and savers are the victim because of what our government is doing. But, he does not defend the actions of the borrowers... especially the ones who lied to get "liar loans". He merely points out that parasites prayed on the liars. The Liar loans are called Liar loans because the borrower lied... not the lender

[magichandpuppet]

the banksters do not love people like me.  I do not become their debt slave... I am well educated on their crookedness... and, when I make a mistake, I take responsibility for it then blaming the banks, the realtor, the broker, or whatever else there is to blame besides myself.

Is the gambler in a casino a victim because the waitress told him he will probably win big?

[toeg1]

Your analogy is meaningless. It would be correct only if you take out the word "probably." Again, Nouriel Roubini, Bill Moyer, Bill Black, and hundreds of the best economists in the US and overseas.

You can take a horse to water, but you can't make it drink. There's nothing more I, nor all those people cited can do. Your mind is made up and no amount of truth will change it.

[magichandpuppet]

so, you are trying to prove a point by dropping names? I know these people, and they are smart... but, do they stand up and say: "These borrowers are innocent"? No, they don't. They point out the corruption of the system, which is all true. But, how far would the corruption go without willing borrowers?

[toeg1]

magic,

I understand you like to voices in your head, but before you make such irresponsible claims, I'd suggest you make sure you're not putting your foot in your mouth once again.

[magichandpuppet]

I must confess... I love the voices in my head... it's the circus horns that get to me though

[magichandpuppet]

and, no, that is not what I said toeg1... Here is sheep-onomics 101 for sheep:

1. The Federal Reserve, creating fake money, artificially set interest rates too low and told banks to loan more (research it, silly sheep)

2. Fed. Gov. backed Freddie Mac/Fannie May (FMFM)

3. Dems prevented regulation of FMFM

4. FMFM securitized debt -sold to investors

5. Dems repealed Glass Steagal act, allowing for CDSs

6. Republicans prevented regulation of CDSs

7. Gov made loans too easy to get

8. Sheep lied

[magichandpuppet]

9. Some sheep didn't lie, but they took out loans they couldn't pay back.

10. Unemployment CONTINUED to rise during this entire fiasco

11. Federal Reserve kept lowering interest rates to make sure the sheep bubble was nice and inflated

12. Loans started resetting with new payments that sheep couldn't afford

13. More foreclosures than "anticipated" (by politicians) ensued causing triple A-rated securities to fail

14. CDSs kicked in, but AIG didn't have money to pay off speculators (who win big)

[magichandpuppet]

15. The Bush fascist regime bailed out their wall street buddies, stealing from the tax payers. The CDS speculators win even bigger.

16. The Obama fascist regime gives more bailouts to AIG and wall street. The CDS speculators hit the biggest grand slam ever.

17. The greatest wealth transfer (NOT destruction) which has ever taken place in the entire world is a huge amazing success!!!... YAY for wall street speculators who gave to Bush and Obama!!! YAY! They just screwed us all... yippie!

[magichandpuppet]

saw the video already... i've been subscribed to that channel for a while.. good vid. And, yes, all facts. But, it doesn't let the sheep off the hook. They don't mention that the sheep committed FRAUD first.... and then the lender created fraud against their derivative... and the rating agencies committed fraud against the world... and now your government is rewarding the people who bet that this system would implode! Consequently, the ones who bet against it created it... and now it's payday

[toeg1]

magic,

You're still missing the point. The banks told them that they "qualified for Ninja loans." rgemonitor's steve_pearlstein did a brilliant expose on the predatory lending practices two years ago, and it's still valid.

Again, it is ludicrous to actually believe that the banks were forced into ninja loans. Just look at them ADVERTISING ninja loans for years to the public. Today, the banks have their money back in spades. Many of the poor are now in tents. How can you even say they "won"?

[magichandpuppet]

your research is just beginning... yes, the federal reserve, who "loans" banks money, told them to loan, the government told them to loan, and ACORN told them to loan. Would they have loaned anyway? Probably. But, what do you propose? Give greedy sheep who couldn't afford the mortgage the house free and clear? Steal from honest people so that lying sheep can have a free house?

Can there be wolves without greedy lying sheep who believe a lying govt.? The ones who bet against the sheep won

[toeg1]

magic,

You're beginning to ramble. I have given you expert testimony of the predatory lending by the banks. Nouriel Roubini one of the best. You are suggesting that these sheeple WANTED a loan they couldn't pay back so that they could get their real reward, homelessness. Can you really prove that these sheeple knowingly took out loans they had every intention of defaulting on a few years down the road. There is just no evidence of that. And just typing, "Trust me" doesn't 'make it so either.

[magichandpuppet]

I know all about Nouriel Roubini... he saw this coming.

and... you can't read so I will ramble more in hope that you will actually read these words:

The sheep wanted to borrow money, without regard as to how they could pay it back, because they falsely believed that a house was an investment that they would make money on... rather than just pay rent they could afford.

They didn't want the natural consequence. they wanted to BORROW money from banks to invest. They intended to make money.

[toeg1]

Then why does Nouriel Roubini disagree with your "facts"?? Steve Pearlstein of WaPo on Liar Loans, Teaser Loans, Stretch Loans, NINJA Loans and Other Mortgage Monstrosities. Roubini says it's all part of predatory lending by the financiers. You that poor people forced banks.

But since your only source seems to be you, I'll leave it at that. I'm sure you've already convinced yourself that you're right and you have no time to see if it's true or not.

No proof. Nothing.

[magichandpuppet]

dude... you are completely retarded. I never said that poor people forced banks. You have completely lost your mind.

[magichandpuppet]

You have to realize that the government is stealing your tax money in order to pay it to AIG so AIG can pay off those who gambled that a lot of the lying debt sheep would fail...and, the ones getting the money OWN your government...they are the highest campaign contributors...and the OWN the federal reserve...and they forced politicians to open the flood gates so now they have pay dirt and the sheep become homeless. BUT, this couldn't have happened without sheep taking loans they couldn't afford

[magichandpuppet]

Your owners forced their government to remove the regulations so that they could feed properly on the sheep. Is the government corrupt? Yes! Are the banks parasites? YES! Did the sheep fall right into the trap? ABSO-F***ING-LUTELY. Is it fair? Well, anyone that voted for a republican or democrat gave the owners permission to feed. The corruption is so obvious...but everyone wants to believe in hope and change while borrowing money to get rich on an investment. THE GREEDY SHEEP GET EATEN

[magichandpuppet]

WarDogLRS, I agree completely with your analysis of our fraudulent fiat monetary system.... I also agree that Obama is a grand deception for the sheep. I hope no one joins the scary Obama brigade... This is the brown shirts coming back to life. We are indeed in grave danger... But we are going to have to take personal responsibility for saving our own skin. The government will only cause more problems at this point.

[magichandpuppet]

Sure... the sheep will try to pretend it wasn't their fault that they borrowed more money than they could afford to pay back. First they will go after the mortgage brokers (granted, they were parasites in a parasitic system), then they will go after their real estate agents, then they will go after the sellers of the home... And, eventually, they might get "bailed out" as those most irresponsible seem to get rewarded.

Was renting a place you could afford so bad after all?

[toeg1]

magic,

How does one "force" a banker to give them a bad loan?? Did they put a gun to the banker's head and say, "Give me the loan or I will blow your head off?"

I can't believe you're that stupid (well, maybe). I have purchased 3 houses in my time, AND EACH TIME I was asked for years of income tax records, bank statements, house budgets,etc to PROVE I qualified. Otherwise, the bank wasn't going to lend me any money. Quit listening and believing the lies. YOU CANNOT FORCE A BANK TO DO THAT.

[magichandpuppet]

silly insults aside... Obama represented ACORN in a slew of expensive lawsuits against various banks to force them to make their loan requirements more lenient for minorities. Smaller banks started reducing their standards of lending as a result of this and other policies coming from the Federal Reserve and the federal government. The borrowers were not forcing the banks to loan them money... that is a very silly suggestion. But it was gov. and activist actions.

[toeg1]

magic,

NINJA loans and predatory lending over several years started this. Blaming the poor, as if banks were afraid of them is ridiculous. The banks JUST IN THE US have received over $5 trillion dollars OF FREE TAX PAYER MONEY. I'd like some of that pressure. If you ever tried to get a loan for a house, you would see how ridiculous your logic is.

NINJA loans and predatory lending. Until you get the facts, you will believe any lie out there. $5 trillion free dollars, and they were the victims???

[magichandpuppet]

I don't blame the poor, silly. I know plenty of poor people who did not beg for loans that they could not afford to pay back. I never suggested the banks were afraid of them. Are you using your brain yet? It was a mutually beneficial relationship: One wanted to become a debt slave, the other wanted to own a debt slave. It is perfect harmony until the government gets involved. You have no logic toeg1. The only victims here are the tax payers. Wake up.

[toeg1]

magic,

You wrote this:

"The only victims here are the tax payers."

Can you please explain to me, then, how these tent cities springing up all over America full of people who lost their home due to NINJA loans and predatory lending are "winners"?? You need to read the definition of predatory lending. It DOES NOT state that the victim WANTS to be a victim. They are coaxed, lied to, and cheated into signing the loan. Read the friggin' definition.

[magichandpuppet]

There is no point in arguing with sheep. Go research... start with Peter Schiff, Marc Faber, Max Keiser.... anyone with a brain should be able to help you. I give up.

[magichandpuppet]

by the way, toeg1, the "ninja" loans you talk about were pushed by THE GOVERNMENT (both republican and democrats). If you want to point fingers, then this is where the finger should go. However, debt-slaves should take responsibility for their own actions. They trusted the government and the government-backed parasites... this was their mistake... not mine.

[wildpeachatl737]

You probably got a conforming loan in which case, that is standard mortgage underwriting conditions. A dirty little secret is that once those documents leave your hands, sometimes the unscrupulous brokers would alter docs in order to make the loan fly. Remember, if it didn't close, they didn't get paid.

[toeg1]

wildpeach,

All I know is that I was asked for 3 years tax returns, my entire resume with salary, my last four months pay stubs, ALL my credit cards, a loan which I was told by another broker "You never have to pay it, it's formality only," I was told to pay in OR NO LOAN!!!!

And now, people with no jobs get loans to buy houses??? Sorry, I can't believe the banks are saying, "Let's lose money here, and we'll cover with the money from there." These are bankers and you're right, no close, no pay.

[wildpeachatl737]

That's what was supposed to be done but there are an enormous amount of backend fees that are generated by making mortgage loans and there wasn't much of a risk as far as the banks were concerned because if the borrower defaulted, they had a home and land that covered the loans.

if it doesn't make dollars, it doesn't make sense. They knew what they were doing and took a risk, with the operative word being risk. Those who practiced such a policy need to fail and not be rewarded with a bailout.

[toeg1]

wild,

This isn't the first time. 1929 wasn't a fluke either, why do you think they call it "The Roarin'20s"?

This is the way the owners get big projects on the cheap. They told the poor schmuck that "housing prices will rise forever". One of the oldest con games in the books. Watch The Long Johns. They explain it well. It has nothing to do with people taking out loans at all. The owners are buying stuff on the cheap, that's all.

z-oIMJMGd1Q

That one is almost 2 years old and still valid.

[jerrydoubleu]

follow the money, the commission on the loan.

[wildpeachatl737]

Okay, I've got a couple of problems with this whole thing...

1) She had a good mortgage but she allowed herself to be conned into refinancing. I bet she got cash-out and if she did, that's due to greed. She didn't need to access her equity.

2) She should have never signed anything and definitely if it didn't match her Good Faith Estimate.

3) She had a 3-day right of recission to cancel the loan. She could have reviewed the docs and demanded a new program or no deal.

[wildpeachatl737]

I can't place the entire blame on the borkers, it takes more than that to pull this off. The closing attorney/title agent, appraiser and closer all could have caught this, but keep in mind no one gets paid unless the loan closes.

Borrowers are in control of the deal until you sign. I have little sympathy for those in the circumstance this woman finds herself in because more care and attention should have been placed in what she felt is so valuable.

[wildpeachatl737]

The broker may have been shady, no doubt, but she should have been a bit more savvy. There's simply no excuse and she's partly to blame for her circumstances.

In God you trust, everyone else you should question.

[jobrien2001]

All true, everyone is set to blame someone else but themselves.

People need to grow up and be responsible for their actions.