And its not racist that they have thaos kinds of clothing. First of all Haradrim are from a desert area, so they have to cover their faces. they have darker skin because of the sun. the easterlings are not evil. gondor tried to take their lands multiple times, so their kinda pissed off. Many european culture attempted to take Japan and India from the locals, so they West was veiwed as a threat to their way of life.
Well i wuld imagone that the african peoples wuld be from far harad, and the more bedoiun like ones from near harad. easterlings and rhun wuld correspond with the asian continent and east asian cultures. i think variags (though not shown) wuld be like mongols or huns.
There are no Evil humans in Tolkien's Middle Earth. Only people who have been deceived by Sauron. Numenoreans weren't evil either. Yet Sauron managed to deceive most of them and turned them again the Valar.
and as for ppl that were in the movie well tolkien story was written from his own perspective so ofc northern european cultures would be favored here. it has nothing to do with black white. and there are no blacks in rohan gondor cuz theyre not native to tolkiens homeland rly :)
like what the hell are u ppl talking about. first of all light/white and dark/black are just natural occurrences what are they gonna show black light and white darknes lol ??? if u have problem with colors ask God about it or Mother Nature or whatever.
@idioticozzy yeah! exactly! rhun corresponds to asia and harad corresponds to africa. and easterlings have samurai like armor. plus look at their eyes! very asian looking to me. and in battle for middle earth 2 their buldings are pagodas.
Well, have you ever wondered that maybe that the easterlings were asian because Asia is in the East? Easterlings...East...And the Haradrim are from the south, like, Africa?
The Easterlings are in no way evil, their way of life was viewed as evil by the west and they were used by Sauron after he convinced them he was a 'god', the Haradrim came from a land where their way of life was hard and difficult, being payed and supported by Sauron allowed them to live better, Tolken lived in a time where alienation of other countries and the east and south had become great after the Second World War and was brought up when the term 'Racist' wasn't used.
These guys werent evil. the easterlings viwed the west as barbarians, much like japan, and were just protecting their lands and fammilies. same with haradrim.
@Wuanslm Jackson slightly deviated from The Two Towers- Faramir did not speak those words, but rather those were Sam's thoughts.
Personally I don't think it is appropriate to accuse Jackson of being racist for sticking with Tolkien's racial divisions. It was Tolkien himself who was racist.
Nothing strange for Tolkien (white European) to portray villains in his fictional story as foreigners. Every culture depicts foreigners as, it's nothing new. The Japanese tagged white westerners as foreign devils, Arabs viewed Alexander the Great and other non Arabs as evil, etc etc.
If you live in a desert, which both the Haradrim and Easterlings do, then you're going to get dark skin, the clothes the arabs wear has been evolved through trial and error through hundreds of generations of living in the desert, and this is likely the case with these peoples too. It just make sense, white people in armour like the Western cultures have would not make sense, they'd get sun burn and would be too hot in their equipment.
They are more mercenaries than anything, not ideally opposed to the freedom of the white peoples of Middle-Earth. They live in different parts of the world and as such have real stake in the War of the Ring.
They are inspired by persians,steppe,asian culture like japanese as well do to the armor styles, and racist? did i not hear the man explain, he wished he knew the dead mans name and that he was only doing his duty for his land? how does that portray them as bad if not mis understood? a duty is a duty, the leader is to blame not the soldiers is what i saw in the message.
@MakYakky well bud just saying europe fought against europians for a long time and liek in the 1950s the russians were the badguys for lots of movies so quit complaing
Was Tolkien a racist? Maybe not, but he was certainly paternalistic. That was the way of thought of almost every british man in the beginning of the XXth century. Britain was very proud of its Empire, and for them colonization was a good thing for those "poor, uncivilized peoples who needs Britain/France/Spain/Germany/Netherlands help to govern themselves and progress. You see that way of thinking in Silmarillion and LOTR. We can't accuse someone to live with its time.
@Xerxes2005 I agree, it's the same deal with the States in a hundred years everyone is going to look back a be like "Wow. The way the states were always vilifying the Middle Easterns/ Russians is really racist." But that's just the way things are in the society right now.
@Xerxes2005 Not to mention the centuries if not thousand year old idea of West vs East. Of West Warrior Indo European dominance over Eastern Comercial Dark peoples. This is very present in Tolkien Works
@ImperialGuard9001 Centuries maybe, but certainly not a thousand years. Western Europe only began to really dominate the world by the 19th century, end of 18th century at best. Before that the Turks were dominating the Mediterranean Sea from the Balkanic States to Morocco. The Far East was ruled by China. Europe powers only had a few posts on the African coasts.
@Xerxes2005 Of course dont count the Portuguese Spanish and Dutch! At least since 16th century started dominating regions outside of Europe. Portugal controled the Easter Comerce the Atlantic Comerce(mainly Slavery) and great areas in Brazil and enclaves in Africa and Asia that were crucial in domination of seas and comerce. Spain had one biggest empires in America not to mention the control of Philipines The Dutch began to dominate themselfs and chalenge Spain and Portugal
Especealy with creation of two great companies the VOC and WIC. One of their early "colonies" was what is now New York! That was called New Amesterdan. They controled enclaves in Africa and Asia and big part of Out of Europe comerce into Europe all those trade routes. They did by dominanting several areas from natives many times using policies of divide and conquer that were higly sucefull in areas such Indonesia.
And finaly just to name one last example just look at godam Russia. Its gigantical terrotory didnt began in 19th century since 16th century Russia came to be as Tsardom and star expading into areas of great mass of Asia.Also the British Empire did reach its peak in 19th century but its contruction and grownth began a lot earlier such as France. It was centuries and centuries of domination conquest and sometimes lost. But it was continutions developement since 16th or 15th century.
Remember that first time that European seet foot into non European area and domination was 1415! England and France were still involved in Hundred Yeas War in east Ottomans were indeed expanding. But a country that came out of several wars with Castile and France(involved in Hundred Years War) with suport of England manage an expeditation into Traditional Islamic dominate lands. It was the Conquest of Ceuta and it marked the star of European Hegemony of the world.
@ImperialGuard9001 Yes, yes, I know all that. I was speaking of the actual domination of Western civilization. Nothing comes from nothing, and it was already building in the 16th century. However, it was more England vs the World, France vs the World, etc. than West vs East. It is only by the 19th century that the Western civilization dominated the world not only economically, but also culturally and politically. And what do you mean with west warriors vs east traders?
@Xerxes2005 LOTR actualy came out after Old European Impearlism peak and in time of its publication Britain had lost part of its empire such as the Jewel India. Tolkien live until 70s a age of anti impearlism and anti colonialism tough ones tougths are of each one of us. He could disagree with majory opnion of that time such as he did with other matters.
@Xerxes2005 im with you on that one cos at the time most of the empire was still together like australia, india new zealand ect, that was general appinion at the time, also it could just be creative lisence of the studia who made and tolkiens idea of what they looked like may have been different
Well, although I disagree with what this video is implying (Whether or not he meant it) i'm sure the main reason for doing it was to get some LotR into his school work XD What software did you use, btw?
Another point is that at least several of the most characters in the LOTR lore were Elves and Numenoreans/Dunedains; the latter being of the same race as Aragorn and Faramir
What bullshit. You're seeing what you want to see. There are people in our society who believe that the only way for our culture to advance is to eliminate racism, sexism, etc - wherever they IMAGINE it to be.
The inspiration for the elephant riders came from Aztecs, by the way. You see Islamophobia because that's what you want to see.
this is really dumb arguement if youve read the books and works of tolken, but I hope you got a good grade. The descriptions and alot of the costume designs were taken and inspired from pictures and paintings used in the LOTR RPG by ICE from the 80's. yes I am that kind of tolken nerd
Look at the maps in the books. The shape and geographical location of Mordor is very similar to that of Turkey. And the Battle of Minas Tirith is a lot like the Battle of Vienna in 1683. Look it up if you don't know it already. One can hardly blame a film for being based on a book. And it's not strange there's a lot of west vs east in the Lord of the Rings and other books. After all, Europe was seriously threatened by the Ottoman Empire for 300 years.
Look at the maps in the books. The shape and geographical location of Mordor is very similar to that of Turkey. And the Battle of Minas Tirith is a lot like the Battle of Vienna in 1683. Look it up if you don't know it already. One can hardly blame a film for being based on a book. And it's not strange there's a lot of west vs east in the Lord of the Rings and other books. After all, Europe was seriously threatened by the Ottoman Empire for 300 years.
@Svebicum The Battle of Pelennor Fields ca be also the Battle of the Catalaunian Plains, in which Aetius (the last of the romans, like Aragorn...) fought defensively in a hilltop against Attila the Hun and his "easterlings" and was recued at the last moment by the blonde horsemen of the gothic king Theodoric, who was killed in the battle (like Théoden...).
@makemap Middle-earth is a original creation, but the most remarkable of its originality is that it´s rooted in the european folklore, history, literature: "The hands of the king are the hands of a healer", the beacons of Aeschylus´ Oresteia, the homeric claims that these deeds will be the stuff of future poems... we can add many sources or unconscious similarities. It´s a original world, but it´s so a recognizable world that one feels it was born from the european´s cultural subconscious
I mean, should have Peter put in a division of blond-haired, blue-eyed soldiers loyal to the Dark Lord? Would have been a nice, balancing touch, I guess.
The land of Eriador represents the fragmented feudal system which dominated the lands of Iberia, France, Britain, Germany, Scandinavia, and Italy during most of the Middle Ages. Eriador is mostly a collection of cities and provinces that are in somewhat of a loose alliance.
Harad, of course, represents the Middle-East and North Africa. The Haradrim location in Middle-Earth - to the south and east of Gondor, the "Byzantine Empire", automatically gives the impression of Middle-Eastern design.
Dale resembles Russia, a northern province which guards against the hordes of Easterlings (representing the Mongols and Timurids) for most of its existence.
Rohan represents northern Europe and the barbarian tribes that settled it. When Gondor was threatened by a massive Easterling invasion, the Rohirrim aided them, and in return Gondor gave them a massive expanse of land to settle. This is just like the Romans, and later Byzantines, who gave barbarians land for aiding them against invaders.
Middle-Earth was designed by Tolkien to be a parallel to Europe in many ways.
Numeór resembles Atlantis figuratively, but is more of a parallel to the Roman Empire - a great, advanced culture that once ruled most of Middle-Earth but now only exists in one nation - Gondor - and is a shadow of its former self. In that sense, Gondor resembles the old Byzantine Empire. It guards against invaders from the east and south, just as the Byzantines did, and suffers from corruption and infighting.
Well... if THE EAST AND SOUTH were under the sway of a Dark lord, then of course their skin happens to be dark, out of consequence. Faramir put it perfectly when he said that perhaps they weren't truly evil after all, and that war makes corpse of us all...
in the eyes of the haradrim and easterlings the men of gondor and rohan are the bad guys, so whats the point? they joined sauron, and that's why they are the bad guys, hence the speach of faramir at the end. and indeed.. what about the corsairs of umbar and the wildmen.
Helm's Deep=Transylvania?.Minus Tirinth=Rome?.Saruman's Tower before he went 'bad'=Alexandria.Saruman's Tower after he went 'bad'=Constantinople(the city that was east of Minus Tirinth)=Jerusalem.Mordor=Persia/Iraq/Iran
Rohirrim=Norsemen/Germanic Tribes.Gondor=Holy Roman Empire/Byzantium.Dwarves=Scottish/Irish/Celtic.Elves=French/Spanish/Gauls.Orcs=Near East Turkish Ottomans.Goblins=Earlier Persians.Urukai=African.Corsairs=Hannibal/North Africa.Elephant riders=Hindu-Kush/Gupta
For what it's worth, the racial portrayals of the characters were not consistent across all versions of LOTR. The animated movies by Rankin-Bass and Ralph Bakshi weren't viewed as racist. Aragorn looked middle-eastern in the Rankin Bass "Return of the King" and Ralph Bakshi made him look like native american! Personally I like the Rankin Bass version best, he had much more strong and kingly appearance than Viggo Mortensen. No offense to the fangirls but Viggo looks like a sissy by comparison.
Some men from the south were good and there are darker skinned people in gondor, watch the bkack gate battle theres a guy with curlyish hair and gondor armor, I love LOTR and im dark skinned, and haradrim ROCK rofl they cool
to put it quite simply, tolkien viewed it as our world from times gone by. Through what he has said, and the necseasry calculations, Minas Tirith is roughly where modern day Florence is. As a result, the Easterlings are kinda slavic/Greek, and the Haradrim are middle-eastern/north african
exactly .. The Easterners with turbans represent arabs and north africans , desert people ..
The southerners on elephants where supposed to be black people , when you read the book , but they didn't make them black in the film because of the sensitivity of the issue in the US . so they made them look like some sort of Indians, clearly non-Europeans anyway .
and you missed the part where Aragorn comes with boats from the people he defeated with his ghost army , clearly asian chinese boats .
@alger100 Those ships were actually based off of the design of arabic warships used in byzantine era. With the sharp, aerodynamic sail and the medium sized hull. But i understand ur message nonetheless. The enemy is naturally protrayed as the minority ethnic groups which really raises issues of cultural conditioning and reprogramming of racial stereotypes.
@MrGilles1990 normans are vikings . i don't see the gondor people looking like vikings. and why the orcs represent the germans ? and why the dwarves represent the gauls ? from where did you get these interpretations ?
you could be right though on the fact that the people who focus on the appearance may be racists themselves, since it's an important issue for them .
Even evil these guys are still kick ass is pitty that tolkien didnt developed as much as Gondor Rohan and other peoples of Middle Earth I dont think is Racist but is probaly a bit Eurocentric but if you notice big part of our Fantasy is why woulnt it be? We are Europeans afterall! You think that Arabian Fantasy about Saladin puts Crusaders as the "good guys"?!
@ImperialGuard9001 that's not the point .. the point is that the racist message of the film is acknowledged .. we are not judging it , we are establishing the reality , that's different .
@alger100 okay well then understand the reality of racism, that it is healthy and natural for all races! as a matter of fact even you are racist to a certain degree, you just go to an immense ammount of trouble to suppress these feelings you have deep down in your heart and soul! Since people like you love diversity soo god damn much, why wont you understand that the end result of multiculturalism is NO diversity! No Black, No White, No Yellow or Red.. ONLY BROWN!
Nobody mentioned the Wild Men Of Dunland yet, those savages in The Two Tower's that Saruman convinces to fight for him, they are White men and close to being cavemen but much more advanced, they are corrupted men and fight for Saruman and Mordor, its just that the others were in the eastern lands and never met the Elve's at all and fell under the sway of Mordor and Sauron, they are not evil but under the control of Mordor, most likely they are forced to fight and dont resist out of fear.
Bro you need to get a life, those people have different clothing and darker skin because they are from a different part of that world. Oh and that looks more persian than arabian
Ruhn are based on Persians, Ruhm was Arabic for the Eastern Roman empire in the middle ages, so as a Catholic, Tolkien would associate that with Eastern, heretical men.
Southrons are based on Africans, thus tribal designs and elephants, the Arab factor is obviously based on north Africans. but as a man from Northern Europe who is selling a book, what better than this for an even person. His good mate CS Lewis has evil arab type people in his later books too. it is a way of selling them.
I ain't complaining... BUT, I do believe that Tolkien himself was a racist... But, I too am LOTR fan and have been since childhood and always will be......
And oh my god! The leader of the people who capture Frodo and Sam has reddish looking hair! MY GOD! THEY MUST BE GINGER HATERS TOO! And did you notice how he showed sympathy for the Arabian looking guy who died at the end? Yeah your right, So racist. You do realize that Most of the people fighting for Salron were the smaller villages and cities that did not have the numbers to resist him, right? Stop belly aching about racism. Good god seriously.
Samurai head piece? Are you serious? That does not look much like a Samurai head piece. It looks like what it is. A helmet. And obviously darker skinned? They looked white. I've seen much darker skinned white people. Arabian clothing... Since when was spiky leather armor considered Arabian? And what about them being blonde? Is it that uncommon for certain people from a certain region to have similar hair color?
This video is really stupid, Tolkien was a well known racist, but this shit is to far fetched, I guess that Orc's are Tolkiens vision of Osama Bin Laden right, they are called easterlings, so they are based on.. People from the east, and if you read the books, you'll see they apperantly made peace after the ring and sauron were destroyed, so they were under the control of Sauron.
And dude, one tip, don't seek so much behind a movie, just saying.
I guess the Evil Men weren't truly malevolent, but simply existed to be manipulated by the will of Sauron. After all, I heard they had a peace treaty with Rohan and Gondor after the war of the ring. Whether or not it lasted, I'm not so sure. Truth be told, peace is a fleeting state of human nature, and at some point, mankind always has to go to war with one another. I wouldn't be surprised if Tolkien thew that in this high fantasy of his, but I'd still have to look it up on the series' wiki.
If it had been the other way round no one would have batted an eyelid. However in the books Tolkien's descriptions of the humans seem to match real life cultures, so in essence its Tolkien not Peter Jackson's interpretation that is the issue. And as Tolkien was from a different era when racism wasn't invented I think we can forgive the likeness.
Also, both the books and the films make reference that many of the men of Gondor, especially those of the southern provinces were swarthy dark skinned men, yet they fought Sauron and Mordor.
Pippin notices that many of the Gondorians were darker skinned while passing through Minas Tirith. Also reference to Forlong the fat, lord of the lossarnach province, who died bravely, and his contingent of well armed men who were short, broad shouldered and swarthy.
I remember that very clearly from the books. I haven't seen them in a long time but where is it in the movie?
In the books there are also the wild men of the woods that help the Rohirrim bypass an enemy army so they can reach Minas Tirith in time. And the Corsairs of Umbar, bad guys, are descendants of Numenorians.
@Xerxes855 While the films dont directly make mention to it in the way the books did, i remember some of the gondor soldiers in Minas Tirith are of a darker aspect, more mediterranean than north european looking. It's been a while since i've seen the film but some of the guards at the beacon which Pippin sneaks past are an example if memory serves me right.
@BVargas78 Darker skinned does not imply African descent. I bet you would refer southern Europeans as more darker skinned than northern Europeans. Still they are all part of the European indigenous people.
@wijse I didnt say that darker skin implies african descent either. But generally you are right, in that i would say that south europeans are darker, i see nothing wrong or bad with this. My father is spanish and he is of a fairly dark complexion. Maybe south europe had a larger population of prehistoric people than northern europe, before the indo europeans arrived. Maybe the indo european tribes themselves were fairly diverse. Im not an expert in this kind of stuff however.
@BVargas78 that's probably cause Gondor knights resemble ancient greeks or italic-romans. thus the roman shield and the corinthian/spartan like helmet.
It's not racist, it's often stressed that the men under Sauron are not inherantly evil but have been manipulated or forced to fight for him.
Even the noblest men, the old numenoreans were susceptible to Saurons wiles. Most of the numenoreans in fact became amongst the evilest of men that there were, enslaving other men and performing human sacrifice, and they were white. So it's not just the dark skinned, eastern like peoples that are susceptible to falling under evil.
and even tolkien described hobbits(harfoots) as being brown skinned. so tolkien was not at all racist. peter jackson could've made the hobbits a little darker though.
Dude, in Star Wars Empire Strikes Back the costumes for Queen Amidalla was inspired by Mongolians and Korean traditional clothing. I don't see nothin' bad there. Just taking inspiration from foreign cultures because it lends and exotic appeal. Same here in LOTR.
Bear in mind that neither the Haradim or Easterlings were explicitly *evil*. Their alliance with Sauron was a textbook case of "the enemy of my enemy is my friend." They forged an alliance with him if only because he was going to war against Gondor.
At least in the Easterlings case, that is. They didn't like Gondor as it was, and if memory serves, one of their rulers became one of the Nazgul.
Peter Jackson can't get everything from the book in the movies. In the book the men of Gondor were described as darker than the men of Dale or Rohan. There were also allies who were darker than than the men of Gondor and here are some examples; the men of Lossarnach, the Wildmen of the Druadan Forest and the 4000 men of Gondor's Southern Fiefs who marched north to protect Gondor. In the appendixes there were the men of Forochel who used sleds like the Eskimos and they seemed to be good men.
Of course medievalists like Lewis and Tolkien were inspired by actual history when they created their sagas. And to a bookish, catholic Oxford professor the outer threat to the West would be invasions from the east (Ruhn/Huns/Magyars/Mongols/Wainriders/Balcoth/etc) and south (Arabs, Seljuk turks, Haradrim, Berber pirates/Umbar). Apart from the Mûmak in The Two Towers book there is nothing african whatsoever about the Haradrim, who instead are described as fighting on horseback.
The Lord of the Rings was a fantasy based upon a fictional Europe. It is about white Europeans fighting the uncouth evil hordes of people, based upon Arabia and Africa. For this reason, it is my favorite fantasy. No matter how racist you may think this movie may be, it is something that white people should be proud of. No matter how hard colored people try, they can never strip us of our culture and heritage.
the "Asian and Arabian armor" = the Samurai Head piece look like a modified Greek Helm to me, the shield is Roman based and the Pole arms are based off the European halbert, and the armor its self just looks cool
Obviously Darker Skin = could that be the shade from the helmet and war makup and DIRT from marching from there homes to Mordor
Bad Guys: well they cant wear the same thing as the good guys, it become too hard to tell them apart
the blonde hair was horse hair just to point that out
@wwwaaarrrggghhh But Easterling and Haradrim are realy based on "oriental peoples" i dont see problem with it! Tolkein world puts even Elves tempeted to Corruption from Evil! After all Melkor was a God! And Sauron was Maiar that is close to a God and they were both corrupted to Evil! all races in Lord of the Rings can be corrupted.
Orcs/Uruk Hai is the portrayal of modern humans where most people are corrupted and very industrialized peoples. Easterlings and Harad is just an eastern representation of lord of the ring because in the story they came from the east.
I dont get it.....this is just like it is in real life, good guys have light skin and blonde hair, bad guys have turbans brown skin and are arab looking. seems right to me
The easterlings look more Greek to me, especially armoured in bronze with long sprears they look alot like a phalanx. Thinking about it the Eastern powers in the Lord of the Rings quite well resemble the armies of the Seleucid Empire. The Selucids were a Greek people who's armies used both armoured phalaxes and war elephants.
I dont know if you realize this, but there called Easterlings. In the book it sates they were from the Eastern edge of middle earth. So he gave them eastern attire. There isnt really any facts here that say he is portraying any group of people as evil. I mean he just dressed them to represent that they were from the east. He couldnt put them in indian like costumes or russian like clotheing because it would make no sence to the viewer and the reader.
Well ofcourse it may have slight hints of racism, the epic story was created at a time when racism wasn't so much of an issue, Tolkien might of been a racist as far as i know, but as u can see from the deleted scene at 2:17 that at least peter jackson was trying to ensure the movie wouldn't be labeled racist, whether that is in the book or not im unsure of, still to read them. You might aswell also say that the trilogy is sexist, theres about 2 main female characters in it that are human.
I remember they said something about "trying not to make them look/resemble Arabic and/or Asian culture" in the Special Extended Commentary.
I think they really achieved that. No Muslim and/or Mongolian warrior ever wore such armor/cloth and even the weapons (spears) have more resemblance to the actual historic European version of that weapon. Not a weapons expert though.
Both Narnia and LOTR were written by English authors. As a result, the good guys tend to resemble western/European style clothing, weapons, etc. The bad guys tend to resemble the non-European style, aka: Middle Eastern and Asian. Peter Jackson is just staying true to the theme of the books.
Avatar the Last Airbender also uses various real world cultures as inspiration of their characters' culture.
lord of the rings was based on old times think about what your saying how many black kings are there through Englands past non lol i cant see any racism ether so u must be stupid ? that's like saying Fridays racist ? and ppl like you must think the world revolves around them ? i cant see any Chinese ether or Thai or jap or ita or Indian ? what about other films where whites are the bad's its cause they don't live with us and they depict there wars with whites which is cool with me
This movie was racist. Just like that trash movie 300. All war propaganda. Demonise the people if Iraq and Afghanistan. Also create hate against dark skinned people living in 'white areas'.
Is it no surprise that several racist groups recommended the movie?
@sonofthedestroyer So what would you suggest? That they should have altered the plot of an ACTUAL HISTORICAL EVENT so that the movie doesn't depict Spartans vs. Persians? Or how about changing a classic book that was been around the better part of half a century so the movie doesn't hurt anyones feelings? Sorry, I'm going to take any comment about racism from a guy whose screenname is "sonofthedestroyer" with a grain of salt and a shrug of irrelevance. Good day to you, sir.
They dont need to change anything. The illuminati white supremacists are evil creatures and they will never change their ways. I am just pointing it out to people. Wake some people up.
@sonofthedestroyer While I disagree with you on the movies being racist, I definitely agree with you on the fact that white supremacists are evil, and never change their ways. At least there seems to be less and less of them these days. They are far from gone, don't get me wrong, but they are a dwindling group of idiots, as less and less people subscribe to their pointless racism and hate filled messages.
the thing with all these comments over racism is that actually tolkien was more then a little racist and the connections between races in the movie and possible ones in real life are pretty easy to be seen.
toive more variety in the movie i wish jackson had included all the types of evil men from the books, of which there were about 3 or 4, including dark numenorians who looked like gondorians (mouth of sauron). probably couldve softened the whole racist thing too.
@TheSimguy007 They aren't all white. Khamul, one of the Nazgul, was an Easterling. Which just goes to even more prove your point though. Evil comes from all races and colors, as does good. This rule always applies, both to this movie, and real everyday life. The people crying "racism" just have no lives.
People from the subcontinent of India are the first human beings on this planet that used elephants in war. The North African's started to use them later after studying about the various types of warfare that was practiced in the east.
Also, Harad was located SOUTH of Gondor, or pretty much where our current Northern Africa/Middle East is at. Was Peter Jackson suppose to get lighter skinned men to represent people who are closer to the equator?
Thank god Peter Jackson did not portray the tribes of Far Harad, because Tolkien himself described them to be BLACK MEN. Would Peter Jackson have been considered irresponsible if he went by Tolkien lore and represented certain Haradrim as black dudes?
I don't really understand what this video is all about. Tolkien published the book in the 50s, long before our current "antagonistic" view towards certain people. Peter Jackson was merely recreating the book that was written in the 50s on film through adaptation. Tolkien considered his Middle-earth to be a predecessor of today's Europe/Africa/Asia land mass. Is it Peter Jackson's fault that the EASTerlings have "Samurai" helmets (which in our world is in the EAST).
has anyone actually thought about where harad and rhun is in the lotr universe??? their both hot barren desert places!! thats why they are middle eastern in appearance!
Right, look at it from a logical perspective, too: the nations of Middle Earth are often at war with the continentally distant lands in the East. Hence the racial divide from the different environments. Sauron decides to conquer Middle Earth, and seeks aide from the enemies of them. Naturally, the men of the East come to his aide. Perfectly logical progression.
Umm...yeah, I'm gonna go out on a limb and say 'not really' to the accusations of racism. The men of Rhun reflect very Roman military tendencies, even if they do have what *seems* like a Persian flare to it. Tower shields: Roman. Phalanx formations: Roman. Tower shields and spears: Roman.
Then there's the Harradim. War elephants were obviously Hannibal's thing, but the 'drivers' have a distinct Maori influence, what with the tattoos and such, as well as the Haka-reminiscent chants.
In the LOR books, the evil humans were actually black people decked out in gold. Tolkien was most likely racist and lived in a very racist era. Elephants are from Africa as well. But Peter Jackson and the execs most likely changed them to Middle Eastern looking people in order to keep the heat of civil rights groups from creating problems for him. Arabs are not organized and won't even know how to begin to complain about it so it was a worthwhile move on their part.
And its not racist that they have thaos kinds of clothing. First of all Haradrim are from a desert area, so they have to cover their faces. they have darker skin because of the sun. the easterlings are not evil. gondor tried to take their lands multiple times, so their kinda pissed off. Many european culture attempted to take Japan and India from the locals, so they West was veiwed as a threat to their way of life.
CarterKhoury 1 day ago
Also easterlings are described to, whater the darkness or palness of skin, to have a sallow (yellowish so asian like) complexion and slanted eyes.
CarterKhoury 3 days ago
Well i wuld imagone that the african peoples wuld be from far harad, and the more bedoiun like ones from near harad. easterlings and rhun wuld correspond with the asian continent and east asian cultures. i think variags (though not shown) wuld be like mongols or huns.
CarterKhoury 3 days ago
There are no Evil humans in Tolkien's Middle Earth. Only people who have been deceived by Sauron. Numenoreans weren't evil either. Yet Sauron managed to deceive most of them and turned them again the Valar.
TheSleeper33 4 days ago
and as for ppl that were in the movie well tolkien story was written from his own perspective so ofc northern european cultures would be favored here. it has nothing to do with black white. and there are no blacks in rohan gondor cuz theyre not native to tolkiens homeland rly :)
dannydong3000 1 week ago
like what the hell are u ppl talking about. first of all light/white and dark/black are just natural occurrences what are they gonna show black light and white darknes lol ??? if u have problem with colors ask God about it or Mother Nature or whatever.
dannydong3000 1 week ago
@idioticozzy yeah! exactly! rhun corresponds to asia and harad corresponds to africa. and easterlings have samurai like armor. plus look at their eyes! very asian looking to me. and in battle for middle earth 2 their buldings are pagodas.
CarterKhoury 1 week ago
@CarterKhoury yea their eyes look like the Indian or middle-eastern of asia
pakheng 16 hours ago
Well, have you ever wondered that maybe that the easterlings were asian because Asia is in the East? Easterlings...East...And the Haradrim are from the south, like, Africa?
idioticozzy 2 weeks ago
@idioticozzy i think who ever reads your coment and goes " oohhh....." wil have one hell of a face palm moment! very shortly
thebrigadier27 4 days ago
The Easterlings are in no way evil, their way of life was viewed as evil by the west and they were used by Sauron after he convinced them he was a 'god', the Haradrim came from a land where their way of life was hard and difficult, being payed and supported by Sauron allowed them to live better, Tolken lived in a time where alienation of other countries and the east and south had become great after the Second World War and was brought up when the term 'Racist' wasn't used.
Syrath101 3 weeks ago
These guys werent evil. the easterlings viwed the west as barbarians, much like japan, and were just protecting their lands and fammilies. same with haradrim.
CarterKhoury 4 weeks ago
Faramir's scene there proves to me that jackson didnt want to convey any sort racist message intentionally.
Wuanslm 1 month ago
@Wuanslm Jackson slightly deviated from The Two Towers- Faramir did not speak those words, but rather those were Sam's thoughts.
Personally I don't think it is appropriate to accuse Jackson of being racist for sticking with Tolkien's racial divisions. It was Tolkien himself who was racist.
wijayapala 1 month ago
Frodo and his pals can't be racists, because there are midgets :P
JohanOlsson 1 month ago
Nothing strange for Tolkien (white European) to portray villains in his fictional story as foreigners. Every culture depicts foreigners as, it's nothing new. The Japanese tagged white westerners as foreign devils, Arabs viewed Alexander the Great and other non Arabs as evil, etc etc.
truboricua 2 months ago
ARABS
ScorpixWaffenSS 2 months ago
well Rohan is inspired from Russian midcentrury riders wwsup
Vladiniho 2 months ago
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If you live in a desert, which both the Haradrim and Easterlings do, then you're going to get dark skin, the clothes the arabs wear has been evolved through trial and error through hundreds of generations of living in the desert, and this is likely the case with these peoples too. It just make sense, white people in armour like the Western cultures have would not make sense, they'd get sun burn and would be too hot in their equipment.
MrNoakesy 2 months ago
I love the Bad Boys and the one Woman by the Easterlings!!! Harad and Rhûn 4ever!!!
DJAyanami 2 months ago
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Liquidsback 2 months ago
They are more mercenaries than anything, not ideally opposed to the freedom of the white peoples of Middle-Earth. They live in different parts of the world and as such have real stake in the War of the Ring.
Jonassoe 2 months ago
Besides, seems many people thought the easternlings were badass and loved their marching etc.
TheSputan 3 months ago 7
They are inspired by persians,steppe,asian culture like japanese as well do to the armor styles, and racist? did i not hear the man explain, he wished he knew the dead mans name and that he was only doing his duty for his land? how does that portray them as bad if not mis understood? a duty is a duty, the leader is to blame not the soldiers is what i saw in the message.
TheSputan 3 months ago
Hitler was right.
BobinatorLulz 3 months ago
only darker skin as the people were maori lol
mouseycou 3 months ago
@MakYakky well bud just saying europe fought against europians for a long time and liek in the 1950s the russians were the badguys for lots of movies so quit complaing
Blazethebest3 3 months ago
Was Tolkien a racist? Maybe not, but he was certainly paternalistic. That was the way of thought of almost every british man in the beginning of the XXth century. Britain was very proud of its Empire, and for them colonization was a good thing for those "poor, uncivilized peoples who needs Britain/France/Spain/Germany/Netherlands help to govern themselves and progress. You see that way of thinking in Silmarillion and LOTR. We can't accuse someone to live with its time.
Xerxes2005 4 months ago 15
@Xerxes2005 I agree, it's the same deal with the States in a hundred years everyone is going to look back a be like "Wow. The way the states were always vilifying the Middle Easterns/ Russians is really racist." But that's just the way things are in the society right now.
TheHammer231 3 months ago
@Xerxes2005 Not to mention the centuries if not thousand year old idea of West vs East. Of West Warrior Indo European dominance over Eastern Comercial Dark peoples. This is very present in Tolkien Works
ImperialGuard9001 2 months ago
@ImperialGuard9001 Centuries maybe, but certainly not a thousand years. Western Europe only began to really dominate the world by the 19th century, end of 18th century at best. Before that the Turks were dominating the Mediterranean Sea from the Balkanic States to Morocco. The Far East was ruled by China. Europe powers only had a few posts on the African coasts.
Xerxes2005 2 months ago
@Xerxes2005 Of course dont count the Portuguese Spanish and Dutch! At least since 16th century started dominating regions outside of Europe. Portugal controled the Easter Comerce the Atlantic Comerce(mainly Slavery) and great areas in Brazil and enclaves in Africa and Asia that were crucial in domination of seas and comerce. Spain had one biggest empires in America not to mention the control of Philipines The Dutch began to dominate themselfs and chalenge Spain and Portugal
ImperialGuard9001 2 months ago
Especealy with creation of two great companies the VOC and WIC. One of their early "colonies" was what is now New York! That was called New Amesterdan. They controled enclaves in Africa and Asia and big part of Out of Europe comerce into Europe all those trade routes. They did by dominanting several areas from natives many times using policies of divide and conquer that were higly sucefull in areas such Indonesia.
ImperialGuard9001 2 months ago
And finaly just to name one last example just look at godam Russia. Its gigantical terrotory didnt began in 19th century since 16th century Russia came to be as Tsardom and star expading into areas of great mass of Asia.Also the British Empire did reach its peak in 19th century but its contruction and grownth began a lot earlier such as France. It was centuries and centuries of domination conquest and sometimes lost. But it was continutions developement since 16th or 15th century.
ImperialGuard9001 2 months ago
Remember that first time that European seet foot into non European area and domination was 1415! England and France were still involved in Hundred Yeas War in east Ottomans were indeed expanding. But a country that came out of several wars with Castile and France(involved in Hundred Years War) with suport of England manage an expeditation into Traditional Islamic dominate lands. It was the Conquest of Ceuta and it marked the star of European Hegemony of the world.
ImperialGuard9001 2 months ago
@ImperialGuard9001 Yes, yes, I know all that. I was speaking of the actual domination of Western civilization. Nothing comes from nothing, and it was already building in the 16th century. However, it was more England vs the World, France vs the World, etc. than West vs East. It is only by the 19th century that the Western civilization dominated the world not only economically, but also culturally and politically. And what do you mean with west warriors vs east traders?
Xerxes2005 1 month ago
@Xerxes2005 LOTR actualy came out after Old European Impearlism peak and in time of its publication Britain had lost part of its empire such as the Jewel India. Tolkien live until 70s a age of anti impearlism and anti colonialism tough ones tougths are of each one of us. He could disagree with majory opnion of that time such as he did with other matters.
ImperialGuard9001 1 month ago
@Xerxes2005 im with you on that one cos at the time most of the empire was still together like australia, india new zealand ect, that was general appinion at the time, also it could just be creative lisence of the studia who made and tolkiens idea of what they looked like may have been different
thebrigadier27 4 days ago
Well, although I disagree with what this video is implying (Whether or not he meant it) i'm sure the main reason for doing it was to get some LotR into his school work XD What software did you use, btw?
TheCreedofAssassinos 4 months ago
Another point is that at least several of the most characters in the LOTR lore were Elves and Numenoreans/Dunedains; the latter being of the same race as Aragorn and Faramir
battousai12345 4 months ago
What about the wild men of dunland they didnt look very arab, and Grimer Wormtounge was like the whitest white guy I ever saw, so was Saruman
Pancakeman7 4 months ago
What bullshit. You're seeing what you want to see. There are people in our society who believe that the only way for our culture to advance is to eliminate racism, sexism, etc - wherever they IMAGINE it to be.
The inspiration for the elephant riders came from Aztecs, by the way. You see Islamophobia because that's what you want to see.
wasteofspace1234 4 months ago
this is really dumb arguement if youve read the books and works of tolken, but I hope you got a good grade. The descriptions and alot of the costume designs were taken and inspired from pictures and paintings used in the LOTR RPG by ICE from the 80's. yes I am that kind of tolken nerd
rudypeni 4 months ago
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Look at the maps in the books. The shape and geographical location of Mordor is very similar to that of Turkey. And the Battle of Minas Tirith is a lot like the Battle of Vienna in 1683. Look it up if you don't know it already. One can hardly blame a film for being based on a book. And it's not strange there's a lot of west vs east in the Lord of the Rings and other books. After all, Europe was seriously threatened by the Ottoman Empire for 300 years.
Svebicum 5 months ago
Look at the maps in the books. The shape and geographical location of Mordor is very similar to that of Turkey. And the Battle of Minas Tirith is a lot like the Battle of Vienna in 1683. Look it up if you don't know it already. One can hardly blame a film for being based on a book. And it's not strange there's a lot of west vs east in the Lord of the Rings and other books. After all, Europe was seriously threatened by the Ottoman Empire for 300 years.
Svebicum 5 months ago
@Svebicum The Battle of Pelennor Fields ca be also the Battle of the Catalaunian Plains, in which Aetius (the last of the romans, like Aragorn...) fought defensively in a hilltop against Attila the Hun and his "easterlings" and was recued at the last moment by the blonde horsemen of the gothic king Theodoric, who was killed in the battle (like Théoden...).
Hiponakte 5 months ago
@Hiponakte So you saying this was a copying from a history book?
makemap 5 months ago
@makemap Middle-earth is a original creation, but the most remarkable of its originality is that it´s rooted in the european folklore, history, literature: "The hands of the king are the hands of a healer", the beacons of Aeschylus´ Oresteia, the homeric claims that these deeds will be the stuff of future poems... we can add many sources or unconscious similarities. It´s a original world, but it´s so a recognizable world that one feels it was born from the european´s cultural subconscious
Hiponakte 5 months ago
this video shows your political correctness insanity
Panzerfaust88 5 months ago
Dude what do you wanna to say with this vid?
MegaKossak 5 months ago
and of course Tolkien wrote 3 books of propaganda against the people of the east and south :D
TzeentchChaos 5 months ago
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they have darker skin a little bit because they came from the great steppe of the East
TzeentchChaos 5 months ago
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TzeentchChaos 5 months ago
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TzeentchChaos 5 months ago
I thought Faramir's speech was very sympathetic towards the Easterlings.
InformationPollution 5 months ago
This video is better than even mine. Tag it properly. Mine has more views and its newer. Yours should have more views than mine.
sonofthedestroyer 5 months ago
I mean, should have Peter put in a division of blond-haired, blue-eyed soldiers loyal to the Dark Lord? Would have been a nice, balancing touch, I guess.
USABG58 5 months ago
@USABG58 If you played Warcraft, the Blond hair is the Dark Lord.
makemap 5 months ago
The land of Eriador represents the fragmented feudal system which dominated the lands of Iberia, France, Britain, Germany, Scandinavia, and Italy during most of the Middle Ages. Eriador is mostly a collection of cities and provinces that are in somewhat of a loose alliance.
Harad, of course, represents the Middle-East and North Africa. The Haradrim location in Middle-Earth - to the south and east of Gondor, the "Byzantine Empire", automatically gives the impression of Middle-Eastern design.
TKwarrior17 5 months ago
Dale resembles Russia, a northern province which guards against the hordes of Easterlings (representing the Mongols and Timurids) for most of its existence.
Rohan represents northern Europe and the barbarian tribes that settled it. When Gondor was threatened by a massive Easterling invasion, the Rohirrim aided them, and in return Gondor gave them a massive expanse of land to settle. This is just like the Romans, and later Byzantines, who gave barbarians land for aiding them against invaders.
TKwarrior17 5 months ago
Middle-Earth was designed by Tolkien to be a parallel to Europe in many ways.
Numeór resembles Atlantis figuratively, but is more of a parallel to the Roman Empire - a great, advanced culture that once ruled most of Middle-Earth but now only exists in one nation - Gondor - and is a shadow of its former self. In that sense, Gondor resembles the old Byzantine Empire. It guards against invaders from the east and south, just as the Byzantines did, and suffers from corruption and infighting.
TKwarrior17 5 months ago
Well... if THE EAST AND SOUTH were under the sway of a Dark lord, then of course their skin happens to be dark, out of consequence. Faramir put it perfectly when he said that perhaps they weren't truly evil after all, and that war makes corpse of us all...
GarlandFraser 6 months ago
in the eyes of the haradrim and easterlings the men of gondor and rohan are the bad guys, so whats the point? they joined sauron, and that's why they are the bad guys, hence the speach of faramir at the end. and indeed.. what about the corsairs of umbar and the wildmen.
DiscusvissenRocken 6 months ago
Oh yeah: Theoden=Charlemagne ,of course!
swamplight79 6 months ago
Fairly close I think.Its all about the crusades and the middle ages.
swamplight79 6 months ago
Helm's Deep=Transylvania?.Minus Tirinth=Rome?.Saruman's Tower before he went 'bad'=Alexandria.Saruman's Tower after he went 'bad'=Constantinople(the city that was east of Minus Tirinth)=Jerusalem.Mordor=Persia/Iraq/Iran
swamplight79 6 months ago
Rohirrim=Norsemen/Germanic Tribes.Gondor=Holy Roman Empire/Byzantium.Dwarves=Scottish/Irish/Celtic.Elves=French/Spanish/Gauls.Orcs=Near East Turkish Ottomans.Goblins=Earlier Persians.Urukai=African.Corsairs=Hannibal/North Africa.Elephant riders=Hindu-Kush/Gupta
swamplight79 6 months ago
LOTR is HISTORIC SATTIRE!!!
swamplight79 6 months ago
The wild men who fought Rohan are suppose to be "light skinned barbarians" ?
Intranetusa 6 months ago
we all know who the orcs,uruk hai and the others would represent...this movie was great and well made.
CragHack86 6 months ago
Where is the Wildmen of Dunland? Forgot them? Where are the Corsairs of Umbar?
Denal56 7 months ago
For what it's worth, the racial portrayals of the characters were not consistent across all versions of LOTR. The animated movies by Rankin-Bass and Ralph Bakshi weren't viewed as racist. Aragorn looked middle-eastern in the Rankin Bass "Return of the King" and Ralph Bakshi made him look like native american! Personally I like the Rankin Bass version best, he had much more strong and kingly appearance than Viggo Mortensen. No offense to the fangirls but Viggo looks like a sissy by comparison.
susumu07 7 months ago
Some men from the south were good and there are darker skinned people in gondor, watch the bkack gate battle theres a guy with curlyish hair and gondor armor, I love LOTR and im dark skinned, and haradrim ROCK rofl they cool
LonelyAssassin1 7 months ago
to put it quite simply, tolkien viewed it as our world from times gone by. Through what he has said, and the necseasry calculations, Minas Tirith is roughly where modern day Florence is. As a result, the Easterlings are kinda slavic/Greek, and the Haradrim are middle-eastern/north african
udun93 8 months ago
The Faramir scene was actually warm hearted, very well made.
ViruzNoob14 8 months ago
Peter Jackson is a xenophobic director. I wouldn't be surprised if the Orc's black skin isn't coincidental with african americans as well
Royjoy92 9 months ago
@Royjoy92 how does Peter Jackson have a fear of foreigners?
He Is the descendent of foreigners. Oh and by the way the orcs were based on the Germans during the first world war.
MrGilles1990 8 months ago
what about the dunelanders in saruman's service they are white
SlipperyPete884 9 months ago
Those guys I am not going to lie they look so fucking cool
snowballl53 9 months ago
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SilverTounge85 9 months ago
The haradrim are not using arabic clothes.
wicNKWD37 9 months ago
exactly .. The Easterners with turbans represent arabs and north africans , desert people ..
The southerners on elephants where supposed to be black people , when you read the book , but they didn't make them black in the film because of the sensitivity of the issue in the US . so they made them look like some sort of Indians, clearly non-Europeans anyway .
and you missed the part where Aragorn comes with boats from the people he defeated with his ghost army , clearly asian chinese boats .
alger100 9 months ago
@alger100 Those ships were actually based off of the design of arabic warships used in byzantine era. With the sharp, aerodynamic sail and the medium sized hull. But i understand ur message nonetheless. The enemy is naturally protrayed as the minority ethnic groups which really raises issues of cultural conditioning and reprogramming of racial stereotypes.
Royjoy92 9 months ago
@alger100 And you forgot about the orcs clearly represent the Germans.
Rohan represents the saxons, Gondor represents the Normans and the dwarves represent the Gauls.
This film is not racist, the people who think it is are, if you look at a film and see skin colour as a bugging factor then you sir are the racist.
MrGilles1990 8 months ago
@MrGilles1990 normans are vikings . i don't see the gondor people looking like vikings. and why the orcs represent the germans ? and why the dwarves represent the gauls ? from where did you get these interpretations ?
you could be right though on the fact that the people who focus on the appearance may be racists themselves, since it's an important issue for them .
alger100 8 months ago
@alger100 i got it from Christopher Tolkien.
MrGilles1990 8 months ago
Even evil these guys are still kick ass is pitty that tolkien didnt developed as much as Gondor Rohan and other peoples of Middle Earth I dont think is Racist but is probaly a bit Eurocentric but if you notice big part of our Fantasy is why woulnt it be? We are Europeans afterall! You think that Arabian Fantasy about Saladin puts Crusaders as the "good guys"?!
ImperialGuard9001 10 months ago
@ImperialGuard9001 Thanks for spotting on that.
Kalfus2007 10 months ago
@ImperialGuard9001 that's not the point .. the point is that the racist message of the film is acknowledged .. we are not judging it , we are establishing the reality , that's different .
alger100 9 months ago
@alger100 okay well then understand the reality of racism, that it is healthy and natural for all races! as a matter of fact even you are racist to a certain degree, you just go to an immense ammount of trouble to suppress these feelings you have deep down in your heart and soul! Since people like you love diversity soo god damn much, why wont you understand that the end result of multiculturalism is NO diversity! No Black, No White, No Yellow or Red.. ONLY BROWN!
Heineken57sauce 9 months ago
Nobody mentioned the Wild Men Of Dunland yet, those savages in The Two Tower's that Saruman convinces to fight for him, they are White men and close to being cavemen but much more advanced, they are corrupted men and fight for Saruman and Mordor, its just that the others were in the eastern lands and never met the Elve's at all and fell under the sway of Mordor and Sauron, they are not evil but under the control of Mordor, most likely they are forced to fight and dont resist out of fear.
riddick7819 10 months ago
Bro you need to get a life, those people have different clothing and darker skin because they are from a different part of that world. Oh and that looks more persian than arabian
sawneybeane100 10 months ago
the enemy come from narnia
luckyD1993 10 months ago
Ruhn are based on Persians, Ruhm was Arabic for the Eastern Roman empire in the middle ages, so as a Catholic, Tolkien would associate that with Eastern, heretical men.
Southrons are based on Africans, thus tribal designs and elephants, the Arab factor is obviously based on north Africans. but as a man from Northern Europe who is selling a book, what better than this for an even person. His good mate CS Lewis has evil arab type people in his later books too. it is a way of selling them.
AngelOfSephiroth 10 months ago
I can't say I agree with this video, however...
To everyone complaining about the person's views on the movie - have you read his little blurb?
"( this was done as a School project for a Cultural/Media class)"
Oh look! He did it for a class! He didn't do this video for the fun of it!!! He did it for a grade! Everyone - get over it!!!
EvilElven 11 months ago 17
@EvilElven
^This
ShelobsSneak 11 months ago
@EvilElven
I ain't complaining... BUT, I do believe that Tolkien himself was a racist... But, I too am LOTR fan and have been since childhood and always will be......
julaibeeb 4 months ago
@julaibeeb - but why do you think so?
Mack1ist 2 months ago
@EvilElven Most of the people doesn't read the description untill somebody highlight on it >_>
TheMonkeyWithTheHat 4 months ago
Lord of the rings was suppose to be like WW1, and in WW1 the ottoman empire (turkish) were on the same side as the germans.
IanLim455612 1 year ago
And oh my god! The leader of the people who capture Frodo and Sam has reddish looking hair! MY GOD! THEY MUST BE GINGER HATERS TOO! And did you notice how he showed sympathy for the Arabian looking guy who died at the end? Yeah your right, So racist. You do realize that Most of the people fighting for Salron were the smaller villages and cities that did not have the numbers to resist him, right? Stop belly aching about racism. Good god seriously.
addblades1 1 year ago
Samurai head piece? Are you serious? That does not look much like a Samurai head piece. It looks like what it is. A helmet. And obviously darker skinned? They looked white. I've seen much darker skinned white people. Arabian clothing... Since when was spiky leather armor considered Arabian? And what about them being blonde? Is it that uncommon for certain people from a certain region to have similar hair color?
addblades1 1 year ago
Every scared little chickenshit is afraid to be called racist. This video is such a proof...
MrBassDude15 1 year ago
This video is really stupid, Tolkien was a well known racist, but this shit is to far fetched, I guess that Orc's are Tolkiens vision of Osama Bin Laden right, they are called easterlings, so they are based on.. People from the east, and if you read the books, you'll see they apperantly made peace after the ring and sauron were destroyed, so they were under the control of Sauron.
And dude, one tip, don't seek so much behind a movie, just saying.
groenstinkt 1 year ago
I guess the Evil Men weren't truly malevolent, but simply existed to be manipulated by the will of Sauron. After all, I heard they had a peace treaty with Rohan and Gondor after the war of the ring. Whether or not it lasted, I'm not so sure. Truth be told, peace is a fleeting state of human nature, and at some point, mankind always has to go to war with one another. I wouldn't be surprised if Tolkien thew that in this high fantasy of his, but I'd still have to look it up on the series' wiki.
ChrisspacePatti 1 year ago
If it had been the other way round no one would have batted an eyelid. However in the books Tolkien's descriptions of the humans seem to match real life cultures, so in essence its Tolkien not Peter Jackson's interpretation that is the issue. And as Tolkien was from a different era when racism wasn't invented I think we can forgive the likeness.
Panda633 1 year ago
Also, both the books and the films make reference that many of the men of Gondor, especially those of the southern provinces were swarthy dark skinned men, yet they fought Sauron and Mordor.
Pippin notices that many of the Gondorians were darker skinned while passing through Minas Tirith. Also reference to Forlong the fat, lord of the lossarnach province, who died bravely, and his contingent of well armed men who were short, broad shouldered and swarthy.
BVargas78 1 year ago 8
@BVargas78
I remember that very clearly from the books. I haven't seen them in a long time but where is it in the movie?
In the books there are also the wild men of the woods that help the Rohirrim bypass an enemy army so they can reach Minas Tirith in time. And the Corsairs of Umbar, bad guys, are descendants of Numenorians.
Xerxes855 10 months ago
@Xerxes855 While the films dont directly make mention to it in the way the books did, i remember some of the gondor soldiers in Minas Tirith are of a darker aspect, more mediterranean than north european looking. It's been a while since i've seen the film but some of the guards at the beacon which Pippin sneaks past are an example if memory serves me right.
BVargas78 10 months ago
@Xerxes855 Indeed but the Numenorians of Umbar have mingled with the Haradrim.
wijse 10 months ago
@BVargas78 The English used to refer to Welsh and Scots as swarthy or darker skinned.
wijse 10 months ago
@BVargas78 Darker skinned does not imply African descent. I bet you would refer southern Europeans as more darker skinned than northern Europeans. Still they are all part of the European indigenous people.
wijse 10 months ago
@wijse I didnt say that darker skin implies african descent either. But generally you are right, in that i would say that south europeans are darker, i see nothing wrong or bad with this. My father is spanish and he is of a fairly dark complexion. Maybe south europe had a larger population of prehistoric people than northern europe, before the indo europeans arrived. Maybe the indo european tribes themselves were fairly diverse. Im not an expert in this kind of stuff however.
BVargas78 10 months ago
@BVargas78 that's probably cause Gondor knights resemble ancient greeks or italic-romans. thus the roman shield and the corinthian/spartan like helmet.
ninja909 7 months ago
It's not racist, it's often stressed that the men under Sauron are not inherantly evil but have been manipulated or forced to fight for him.
Even the noblest men, the old numenoreans were susceptible to Saurons wiles. Most of the numenoreans in fact became amongst the evilest of men that there were, enslaving other men and performing human sacrifice, and they were white. So it's not just the dark skinned, eastern like peoples that are susceptible to falling under evil.
BVargas78 1 year ago
This looks exactly like real life... I don't think it's racist.
NjordNiflheim 1 year ago
and even tolkien described hobbits(harfoots) as being brown skinned. so tolkien was not at all racist. peter jackson could've made the hobbits a little darker though.
gartatia 1 year ago
Dude, in Star Wars Empire Strikes Back the costumes for Queen Amidalla was inspired by Mongolians and Korean traditional clothing. I don't see nothin' bad there. Just taking inspiration from foreign cultures because it lends and exotic appeal. Same here in LOTR.
BuNRaKu8 1 year ago
Bear in mind that neither the Haradim or Easterlings were explicitly *evil*. Their alliance with Sauron was a textbook case of "the enemy of my enemy is my friend." They forged an alliance with him if only because he was going to war against Gondor.
At least in the Easterlings case, that is. They didn't like Gondor as it was, and if memory serves, one of their rulers became one of the Nazgul.
electricbayonet2 1 year ago
Peter Jackson can't get everything from the book in the movies. In the book the men of Gondor were described as darker than the men of Dale or Rohan. There were also allies who were darker than than the men of Gondor and here are some examples; the men of Lossarnach, the Wildmen of the Druadan Forest and the 4000 men of Gondor's Southern Fiefs who marched north to protect Gondor. In the appendixes there were the men of Forochel who used sleds like the Eskimos and they seemed to be good men.
kinkajou777 1 year ago
Of course medievalists like Lewis and Tolkien were inspired by actual history when they created their sagas. And to a bookish, catholic Oxford professor the outer threat to the West would be invasions from the east (Ruhn/Huns/Magyars/Mongols/Wainriders/Balcoth/etc) and south (Arabs, Seljuk turks, Haradrim, Berber pirates/Umbar). Apart from the Mûmak in The Two Towers book there is nothing african whatsoever about the Haradrim, who instead are described as fighting on horseback.
Logical, not?
RueUbu 1 year ago
The Lord of the Rings was a fantasy based upon a fictional Europe. It is about white Europeans fighting the uncouth evil hordes of people, based upon Arabia and Africa. For this reason, it is my favorite fantasy. No matter how racist you may think this movie may be, it is something that white people should be proud of. No matter how hard colored people try, they can never strip us of our culture and heritage.
elusivecorn1 1 year ago
@elusivecorn1
two thumbs up at your words
darwinism14 1 year ago
@elusivecorn1 so wats ur point?
legolas5802 1 year ago
Comment removed
sonofthedestroyer 1 year ago
p.s. the last staitment kinda killed your own argument and you also left out the Corsairs of Umbar and the Hillmen, who were both white
wwwaaarrrggghhh 1 year ago
the "Asian and Arabian armor" = the Samurai Head piece look like a modified Greek Helm to me, the shield is Roman based and the Pole arms are based off the European halbert, and the armor its self just looks cool
Obviously Darker Skin = could that be the shade from the helmet and war makup and DIRT from marching from there homes to Mordor
Bad Guys: well they cant wear the same thing as the good guys, it become too hard to tell them apart
the blonde hair was horse hair just to point that out
wwwaaarrrggghhh 1 year ago
@wwwaaarrrggghhh But Easterling and Haradrim are realy based on "oriental peoples" i dont see problem with it! Tolkein world puts even Elves tempeted to Corruption from Evil! After all Melkor was a God! And Sauron was Maiar that is close to a God and they were both corrupted to Evil! all races in Lord of the Rings can be corrupted.
ImperialGuard9001 1 year ago
That easterling with "obviously darker skin" is Shane Rangi who is probably Mauri and he is Mumakil rider.
DAVORINAAA 1 year ago
Orcs/Uruk Hai is the portrayal of modern humans where most people are corrupted and very industrialized peoples. Easterlings and Harad is just an eastern representation of lord of the ring because in the story they came from the east.
nyipnyop 1 year ago
I dont get it.....this is just like it is in real life, good guys have light skin and blonde hair, bad guys have turbans brown skin and are arab looking. seems right to me
pajiad191 1 year ago
The easterlings look more Greek to me, especially armoured in bronze with long sprears they look alot like a phalanx. Thinking about it the Eastern powers in the Lord of the Rings quite well resemble the armies of the Seleucid Empire. The Selucids were a Greek people who's armies used both armoured phalaxes and war elephants.
EquusFerrarius 1 year ago
I dont know if you realize this, but there called Easterlings. In the book it sates they were from the Eastern edge of middle earth. So he gave them eastern attire. There isnt really any facts here that say he is portraying any group of people as evil. I mean he just dressed them to represent that they were from the east. He couldnt put them in indian like costumes or russian like clotheing because it would make no sence to the viewer and the reader.
Entriken133 1 year ago
The Eastern and Asian "bad guy clothes" are the best in my opinion. For example in Lord of the Rings the Easterlings or in 300 the Immortals.
Devilsolution 1 year ago
Darker skin? Lolno.
HavePenisWillButtsex 1 year ago
Well, the Gondorians are darker than the Rohirrim (the blond horse-riding white guys).
the12345678guy 1 year ago
Well ofcourse it may have slight hints of racism, the epic story was created at a time when racism wasn't so much of an issue, Tolkien might of been a racist as far as i know, but as u can see from the deleted scene at 2:17 that at least peter jackson was trying to ensure the movie wouldn't be labeled racist, whether that is in the book or not im unsure of, still to read them. You might aswell also say that the trilogy is sexist, theres about 2 main female characters in it that are human.
LordAndyOfVids 1 year ago
@LordAndyOfVids
Arwen, Ewoyn, Galadriel
maybe 3?
darwinism14 1 year ago
@darwinism14
compared to a cast of like 20+ men xP
LordAndyOfVids 1 year ago
I dont know anything about them easterling guys but arent the guys on them elephants just slaves to the orcs?
I dont think all of the humans on the evil side are actually bad guys.
The easterlings and them pirates do look evil as hell but other guys dot seem all that bad.
redman7771red17 1 year ago
I remember they said something about "trying not to make them look/resemble Arabic and/or Asian culture" in the Special Extended Commentary.
I think they really achieved that. No Muslim and/or Mongolian warrior ever wore such armor/cloth and even the weapons (spears) have more resemblance to the actual historic European version of that weapon. Not a weapons expert though.
ric0h 1 year ago
Both Narnia and LOTR were written by English authors. As a result, the good guys tend to resemble western/European style clothing, weapons, etc. The bad guys tend to resemble the non-European style, aka: Middle Eastern and Asian. Peter Jackson is just staying true to the theme of the books.
Avatar the Last Airbender also uses various real world cultures as inspiration of their characters' culture.
UNLebanon 1 year ago
lord of the rings was based on old times think about what your saying how many black kings are there through Englands past non lol i cant see any racism ether so u must be stupid ? that's like saying Fridays racist ? and ppl like you must think the world revolves around them ? i cant see any Chinese ether or Thai or jap or ita or Indian ? what about other films where whites are the bad's its cause they don't live with us and they depict there wars with whites which is cool with me
JonNebula11 1 year ago
This movie was racist. Just like that trash movie 300. All war propaganda. Demonise the people if Iraq and Afghanistan. Also create hate against dark skinned people living in 'white areas'.
Is it no surprise that several racist groups recommended the movie?
sonofthedestroyer 1 year ago
@sonofthedestroyer DONT blame the movie or the director. blame J.R.R tolkien
97Wc 1 year ago
@sonofthedestroyer So what would you suggest? That they should have altered the plot of an ACTUAL HISTORICAL EVENT so that the movie doesn't depict Spartans vs. Persians? Or how about changing a classic book that was been around the better part of half a century so the movie doesn't hurt anyones feelings? Sorry, I'm going to take any comment about racism from a guy whose screenname is "sonofthedestroyer" with a grain of salt and a shrug of irrelevance. Good day to you, sir.
masamune2984 1 year ago
@masamune2984,
They dont need to change anything. The illuminati white supremacists are evil creatures and they will never change their ways. I am just pointing it out to people. Wake some people up.
sonofthedestroyer 1 year ago
@sonofthedestroyer While I disagree with you on the movies being racist, I definitely agree with you on the fact that white supremacists are evil, and never change their ways. At least there seems to be less and less of them these days. They are far from gone, don't get me wrong, but they are a dwindling group of idiots, as less and less people subscribe to their pointless racism and hate filled messages.
masamune2984 1 year ago
the thing with all these comments over racism is that actually tolkien was more then a little racist and the connections between races in the movie and possible ones in real life are pretty easy to be seen.
toive more variety in the movie i wish jackson had included all the types of evil men from the books, of which there were about 3 or 4, including dark numenorians who looked like gondorians (mouth of sauron). probably couldve softened the whole racist thing too.
fluffyzhangfei 1 year ago
the nazgul are formerly WHITE kings of gondor.....but they're bad....
TheSimguy007 1 year ago
@TheSimguy007 They aren't all white. Khamul, one of the Nazgul, was an Easterling. Which just goes to even more prove your point though. Evil comes from all races and colors, as does good. This rule always applies, both to this movie, and real everyday life. The people crying "racism" just have no lives.
masamune2984 1 year ago
Comment removed
TheSimguy007 1 year ago
People from the subcontinent of India are the first human beings on this planet that used elephants in war. The North African's started to use them later after studying about the various types of warfare that was practiced in the east.
993ironman 1 year ago
Also, Harad was located SOUTH of Gondor, or pretty much where our current Northern Africa/Middle East is at. Was Peter Jackson suppose to get lighter skinned men to represent people who are closer to the equator?
Thank god Peter Jackson did not portray the tribes of Far Harad, because Tolkien himself described them to be BLACK MEN. Would Peter Jackson have been considered irresponsible if he went by Tolkien lore and represented certain Haradrim as black dudes?
It's just how the book is.
DanteSitwell 1 year ago
I don't really understand what this video is all about. Tolkien published the book in the 50s, long before our current "antagonistic" view towards certain people. Peter Jackson was merely recreating the book that was written in the 50s on film through adaptation. Tolkien considered his Middle-earth to be a predecessor of today's Europe/Africa/Asia land mass. Is it Peter Jackson's fault that the EASTerlings have "Samurai" helmets (which in our world is in the EAST).
DanteSitwell 1 year ago
1. Wildmen are white yet there bad
2. sure the harad and easterlng skin is darker but still some white in it
3. orcs are same as all human beings and are raw elves
4. dwarves are like jews
5. there is another race of men who serve sauron and their white "the black numenoreans"
ceitiosaurus 1 year ago
@ceitiosaurus lol they're white and they are called Black numenoreans
97Wc 1 year ago
the lord of the rings is indeed based on race
TheEnkiTruth 1 year ago
has anyone actually thought about where harad and rhun is in the lotr universe??? their both hot barren desert places!! thats why they are middle eastern in appearance!
nerf4you96 1 year ago
Actually Hardrim are based on Aztec and Easterlings are based on Japanese.
SaiyanElite 1 year ago
Right, look at it from a logical perspective, too: the nations of Middle Earth are often at war with the continentally distant lands in the East. Hence the racial divide from the different environments. Sauron decides to conquer Middle Earth, and seeks aide from the enemies of them. Naturally, the men of the East come to his aide. Perfectly logical progression.
electricbayonet2 1 year ago
Umm...yeah, I'm gonna go out on a limb and say 'not really' to the accusations of racism. The men of Rhun reflect very Roman military tendencies, even if they do have what *seems* like a Persian flare to it. Tower shields: Roman. Phalanx formations: Roman. Tower shields and spears: Roman.
Then there's the Harradim. War elephants were obviously Hannibal's thing, but the 'drivers' have a distinct Maori influence, what with the tattoos and such, as well as the Haka-reminiscent chants.
electricbayonet2 1 year ago
Easterlings own haradrim sucks only good thing are thier mumakils
MultiKillerBot 1 year ago
In the LOR books, the evil humans were actually black people decked out in gold. Tolkien was most likely racist and lived in a very racist era. Elephants are from Africa as well. But Peter Jackson and the execs most likely changed them to Middle Eastern looking people in order to keep the heat of civil rights groups from creating problems for him. Arabs are not organized and won't even know how to begin to complain about it so it was a worthwhile move on their part.
pharaonic7 1 year ago
2:30 Not to mention a white supremacist wouldn't show empathy or any sense of regret.
bimbolover28 1 year ago
Still they look badass, even if it was racist, the LOTR was based off of WW1 accually, they have it here in KCK at the National WW1 museum.
PentagonStudio 1 year ago