Was Jesus a Muslim? ( Q & A Session - 1 of 2 )

[shieldsff]

The problem is still there either way. When a person talks of "struggle" against there "fleshly" (i.e.,sin) nature, they are still speaking of trying to address the problem of sin and alienation from God under their own power & based on their own merit. Jesus explains however, they unless one is born again of the Water & Spirit they cannot see God/the Kingdom. We also know by the works of the Law shall no flesh be justified. Apart from faith & the righteousness of Christ the 'jihad' is worthless

[austriaheute]

We have the newest news and the evidence that Jesus is God from Stanley VILLAVINCENCIO city of Cebu in Philippines, he encountered Lord Jesus and nowadays he can hear his inner voice and Jesus appears in his dreams giving him messages about spreading of Jesus mercy to the mankind because Jesus is a merciful God but the time of mercy will not last forever and it will come a time when he comes back to judge everybody, and who doesn’t have atonement for his sins will faces his judgment.

[EdninKOg360]

intelligence was given by god to all humans

/watch?v=ukfPKcUagPU

got brain???

use it

[faares]

Sceptic Thomas fabricated the story because the real Thomas crucified because he was very similar to Christ

[TheE5426]

It's not by debate that I want to him. I don't need to prove to you that The Christians are correct. Jesus The Messiah said. Go and preach. The Gospel. And every Christian should only Preach The Good News of The Savior, Jesus. Thats the purpose.

[TheE5426]

Jesus says, I am the way and the Truth and the life. (John 14:6) There is only one way to Heaven and that is Jesus The Messiah. Because He said I am the way. He didn't say that I am one of the ways to Heaven. Thats the Gospel Message.

[missfatin101]

dsaad

[Hrvojecroatian]

Jesus the Christ represents the body of God; He is God in physical form. For in Him all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form,Just as the body receives and obeys commands from the soul, or mind, Jesus receives and obeyed commands from the Father. Jesus said that He only did what He saw the Father do and He only said what He heard the Father say. Then Jesus said to them, "When you lift up the Son of Man, then you will know that I am He, it means that HE IS GOD

[EdninKOg360]

@Hrvojecroatian

so weird.why he did so??he dont trust all previous prophets anymore??so why he send prophets??at the end he died??god dying??where his immortal??why his dad didnt save him??r angel of death take their god almighty soul,can??why do god sacrifice his son,god can't forgive people with his power,so why we have to pray??if jesus have dad & mom,whose his grandfather & grnmther??can we kill god??god are weak??

[EdninKOg360]

@EdninKOg360

god have a sexual desire??until now if thier didnt used condom,how many gods we have??All this questions will appeare when u read bible..you can find the true answer when u read about jesus in Islam.

[Hrvojecroatian]

Jesus is the only Saviour.

..the Father sent the Son to be the Saviour of the world. 1 John 4:14...our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

...God and our Saviour Jesus Christ. the Christ, the Saviour of the world.

...the Lord Jesus Christ our Saviour. Titus 1:4a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

Neither is there salvation in any other (than Jesus): for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

...salvation... is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.

.

[Hrvojecroatian]

For a good work we stone thee not; replied the Jews, but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God. Now we see an actual claim.The Jews understood Jesus statement to be a claim to be God. In the following verses, Jesus never corrects the Jews by saying, I did not claim to be God. That indicates Jesus was truly saying He was God by declaring, I and the Father are one the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us This clearly indicates that Jesus is God in the flesh.

[Hrvojecroatian]

He is God, of the Substance of the Father, begotten before the worlds: and He is Man, of the substance of His Mother, born in the world;

Perfect God and perfect Man: of a reasonable soul and human flesh subsisting;

Equal to the Father, as touching his Godhead: and inferior to the Father, as touching his Manhood. He ascended into heaven, He sitteth on the right hand of the Father, God Almighty: from whence He shall come to judge the quick and the dead.

[Hrvojecroatian]

He is God, of the Substance of the Father, begotten before the worlds: and He is Man, of the substance of His Mother, born in the world;

Perfect God and perfect Man: of a reasonable soul and human flesh subsisting;

Equal to the Father, as touching his Godhead: and inferior to the Father, as touching his Manhood. He ascended into heaven, He sitteth on the right hand of the Father, God Almighty: from whence He shall come to judge the quick and the dead.

[asimoromzi]

One more thing FilistemoRules..if jesus claim himself as God according to you.why christian not embracing Adam and EVE...God create Adam and eve without parents..but jesus was born with Mother..Mary...that means Adam and Eve is more superior than jesus..OK..If i claim myself as God did you trust me..I will said " I am He..I'm the one who create the universe,human and every living thing on earth,hell and paradise...DO YOU TRUST ME.??

[TheE5426]

God created Adam and Eve from dust. But Jesus The Messiah was born with Spirit of Allah. Is the dust of the earth more precious or the The Spirit of Al-Mighty God. God created Adam and Eve. But no one created Jesus. He just came to earth from heaven. Left His throne for for mankind. Died on the cross and arose again. Thats The The Gospel, Good News Message.

[asimoromzi]

FilistemoRules:

As your mention " I the Lord the first and with the last; I am he.."Lord doesnt mean His the God...did he claim himself is the God??Lord means master,MR,sir,...he said LORD NOT GOD...if he said so,that mean he also the human being like us with flesh and bone.don't compare human and god.human eating but God not.God living and Human Living too but can died..every living creature on earth will die..God is the creator he can't died.

[TheE5426]

Thomas said to Him, My Lord and My God!". (John 20:28) Jesus didn't say wait Thomas I am not God so don't call me God. God came to save sinners thats the GOOD NEWS. We can't be saved by our own works but BY THE BLOOD OF JESUS.

[Saracen187]

@TheE5426 Thats bcos Thomas was talking 2 Jesus and God.

Jesus had no reason 2 correct him. If u thought ur dad dead & he walked in, U wouldn't say My Dad and My Father, would u. U might say my God, Dad! This doesn't mean ur Dad is ur God but even this is not what Thomas said. It is the "AND" that denotes two different people

This is one reference you have to equal Jesus with God and its not even spoken by Jesus. Many times he distinguishes himself from God but you deny them.

[asimoromzi]

FilistemoRules:

How come you can say "if God cannot become his creation then he is not all-powerfull and is not a God"..what if i agree with your argument...OK..Lets talk about logic...If i produce VCDR one of video decoder product then i found out there is a problem with the functionality with VCDR...then am i need to transform myself to VCDR to check which part are not function??I'm the one who produce it why i need to do so..God must be Godly..God and Human got different quality.

[FilistemoRules]

And who are you to say what God needs or doesn't need? Are you God?

[FilistemoRules]

God

God forgives sins.

[T]he Lord..forgiveth all thine iniquities... Psalm 103:2-3

"[W]ho can forgive sins but God only?"

Jesus

Mark 2:7 Jesus forgives sins.

Jesus...said..."Son, thy sins be forgiven thee." Mark 2:5

[vaea46]

3 that bear record in heaven. come on now - that is the only close verse to a trinity- but read it properly - 3 stil doesnt make it 1 - and it also can me. God is the Boss - Jesus is the sales rep, and the Holy spirit is the accountant. they are 3 different rolls, but all work for the same company, which makes it a team under 1 company, but not the same-

[FilistemoRules]

Are you illiterate? It clearly says that the 3 are one. If God cannot manifest himself into 3 different forms, then god is not all-powerful and therfore is not God. You amuse me! lol

[hassan691987]

God is ONE end of story. he doesnt need to be 3, it makes no sense. this idea came from the roman pagans and doesnt exist in any early manuscript, scribes just added and played with the hebrew to fit their propaganda. God has always been ONE and trinities only exist in pagan religions

[FilistemoRules]

God

God is the first and the last.

I the LORD, the first, and with the last; I am he. Isaiah 41:4 Jesus is the first and the last.

Jesus

Jesus said, "Fear not; I am the first and the last:" Revelation 1:17

[FilistemoRules]

God is the Holy One

Psalms 71:22 I will also praise thee with the psaltery, even thy truth,O my God: unto thee will I sing with the harp, O thou Holy One of Israel.

Jesus is the Holy One. 3:13-14 The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go. But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you;

[FilistemoRules]

Only God is worshipped.

... Then saith Jesus unto him... Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve. Matthew 4:10 Jesus is worshipped.

While [Jesus] spake these things unto them, behold, there came a certain ruler, and worshipped him... Matthew 9:18

And again, when [God] bringeth in the firstbegotten [Jesus] into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him. Hebrews 1:6

[vaea46]

Jesus has stated no one has seen the Father, not ONE - yet we have seen Jesus. - Christian worship and make Jesus Lord & God.

10 commandments- Law of GOD - given too moses.

1 - there is no other God but the one True God.

2 - there shall not create images of those in heaven or earth or anything below- yet we have images of Jesus -

When u use verses like i and the father are 1 - or verses like beleive i am he - or verses like 3 that bear record - learn what the original txt says

[FilistemoRules]

Sure, you learn:

God is the only Saviour.

"I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour." Isaiah 43:11

To the only wise God our Saviour... Jude 1:12

Jesus is the only Saviour.

...the Father sent the Son to be the Saviour of the world. 1 John 4:14

...our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. II Peter 3:18

[FilistemoRules]

God is our redeemer.

[T]hou, O LORD, art our father, our redeemer.. Isaiah 63:16 Jesus redeemed us.

[T]the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ...gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity.. Titus 2:13-14

[vaea46]

Throughout the whole Bible Old and New - OLD Testiment, states GOD Can not become his Creation - God commandment his followers to destroy nations, and God show lots of wrathed - God killed many via the floods.  But in the New Testiment - Jesus was peace, Jesus advs his disciples fled, and were disobedient, when they failed lots of test- PAUL whole wrote most of the new testiment, was not with Jesus - the Jews say that ROMAN Catholics have to much emphasy on the New testiment - Jesus is not GOD

[FilistemoRules]

If God cannot become his creation then he is not all-powerfull and is not God. lol

Who created God? God did! So God is both the father and the son to himself. the creator and creation of himself again proving you WRONG! LoL

[hassan691987]

God doesnt do unnecesary and silly things. God created himself??? what??? this argument makes no sense, rather God is not created rather he is the only Creator the eternal, had no beginning nor end.

[FilistemoRules]

if God didn't created himself who did?

[FilistemoRules]

God is the Word.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God

John 1:1

Jesus is the Word.

...the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us...John 1:14

[vaea46]

Lots of christians say well Jesus is just the body, but he is God - i know this has been taught from generation to generation, and it has come too a point, where u dont know truth - When u put other things and compare them too God- then u make God =3 not 1 - and they u try and explain yrself by using substance like water, ice, air - come on now - Satan will deceive anyone, main purpose too take away the Glory of God - who do u pray too and who do u give glory too - Jesus, who u say is God= ??

[FilistemoRules]

Let's hear the man himself:"...if ye believe not that I am he(GOD),

ye shall die in your sins."

--JESUS CHRIST, JOHN 8:24

"I and my Father are ONE."

--Jesus Christ, John 10:30

[FilistemoRules]

"For there are three that bear record in heaven, the FATHER, THE WORD, AND THE HOLY GHOST: and THESE THREE ARE ONE."

--1 John 5:7

"And Thomas answered and said unto him [JESUS], My Lord and MY GOD."

--John 20:28

[FilistemoRules]

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and THE WORD WAS GOD. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. In him was life; and the life was the light of men. And THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH, AND DWELT AMONG US, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth."

--John 1:1-4, 14

[vaea46]

Let me break it down 4 u - THE WORD was WITH GOD- (Not God, another person) - The word- was GOD (OUT of our mouths we preached about God) The word became Flesh (Just as a story from a book, a book becomes a movie when the story is acted out) - Jesus was on this Earth - and stated from his own mouth - IT IS NOT MY WILL - He has NO POWER but what was authorised by God - Jesus said I AM NOT GOOD - Jesus Prayed too GOD, JESUS DIED ?? God cannot die - JESUS is not all known, God is all knownin

[FilistemoRules]

Let me break it down for you in a resumed bored fashion:you are twisting and putting stuff there-LIES- that simply are not there.LOL

[FilistemoRules]

JESUS NEVER DIED REALLY SINCE HIS SPIRIT IS CONSUBSTANTIAL TO THE ETERNAL SPIRIT OF GOD! Only his physical body died.

[FilistemoRules]

Yes, we can be sure that Christ is all knowing and omniscient! Colossians 1:16-17 speaks of Jesus when it says: "For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And he is before all things, and by him all things consist."

[rhdez11]

"Was Jesus a Muslim?" hahaha.... There wouldn't be Crhistianity if he was one. Christianity derived from Christ.

Also there is not one right religion or a wrong one. I am sure that all religions put together dont cover exactly what God truly is. There is only one God, but many ways to worship.

[GothThug81]

Why are you laughing, do you know what muslim means in english? it means submitter the question is did jesus submit his will to his father, according to the bible it says he does that makes him a muslim you said Jesus was Christian thats not true, no where in the bible did Jesus use the term Christian, on the contary it tells us that He was raised as a jew !! the term Christian was used later by his followers ..

[rhdez11]

What I meant to say is that Christianity derives from the name/word Christ. Jesus did submit his will to the father, but mind you Islam is not the only religion that submits to a supreme God. He wouldn't be God if you didn't have to submit and worship him now would he?

[roxy841991]

yes but you were laughing at the idea of Jesus being a Muslim...this is because you don't understand what the word "Muslim" means. Of course Jesus (pbuh) wasn't a follower of Muhammad (pbuh) because he came afterwards. But the word Muslim literally means "one who submits to God". This makes Jesus (pbuh) and every single Prophet of God a Muslim by this definition. Also Jesus (pbuh) prayed like a Muslim, in the Bible it says he fell on his face before God.

[rhdez11]

"This makes Jesus (pbuh) and every single Prophet of God a Muslim by this definition."

What if I was to tell you that Muhamed was a Christian by the way that he gave himself to the father? Isn/t that what Jesus did? Keep in mind that Jesus was born some 600 years before Muhamed or before Islam was founded. Also Jesus prayed to God the way that Christians do, hence, that's were they get it from. Besides, there is no right or wrong way to pray, as long as you do it with your heart.

[roxy841991]

A Christian doesn't mean someone who gives himself to the Father. It means, in the loosest sense of the word, someone who follows Christ(pbuh). Anyone who gives themselves to the Father alone, I would consider a Muslim. I have never seen a Christian pray to God by prostrating before Him. Most so called Christians don't even pray unless they want something from God. Jesus in the Bible prayed similar to the way Muslims pray today, not at all like modern Christians.

[rhdez11]

Like I said, know more about other religions before you talk about them. I have also known Muslims who call themselves this and also only pray when they need something. Quite a few of my frineds are Muslims and they go clubbing and drinking. So, the types of Christians that you have mentioned are in every religion. Also, where in the Bible does it say this about Jesus? tell me.

[roxy841991]

Those "Muslims" are what we call fasiq. They are rebellious and don't obey the laws of God. They are still Muslims as long as they believe that clubbing and drinking is not allowed. If they believe they are allowed, they are no longer considered Muslims. The difference is that Muslim tradition teaches not to do those things. However, the original Christian way of praying (which came from the Jews) has been lost out of their own tradition.

[roxy841991]

This is the main verse I am talking about:

Going a little farther, he fell with his face to the ground and prayed, "My Father, if it is possible, may this cup be taken from me. Yet not as I will, but as you will. (Matthew 26:39)

[FilistemoRules]

That is Jesus showing his human weakness that was merely temporary. he is not refusing to be crucified , but merely asking God if God wishes to spare him this torture.

[roxy841991]

Ok. It is just hard for me to understand why, if Jesus is God, why he would have to ask himself for anything? And wouldn't Jesus know God's plan to have him crucified, so why ask for the plan to be changed? I'm sorry, but it just isn't coherent to me.

[roxy841991]

Also most other religions don't submit to the will of God without setting up partners with Him. They will pray to God but also to other things - for example the Christians pray to God but they also pray to Jesus. And Hindus believe in a supreme God but they worship countless "lesser" gods and idols instead. Islam worships God alone - not idols, not prophets, not animals, not false gods, just God. I don't think God would like people worshiping other than Him. Just something to think about. peace

[rhdez11]

Make you sure that you are certain when you talk about other religions and "lesser Gods" because there is only one God. Also Christians worship Jesus because we belive he is the son of God or God himself and he is the way to God. Ex: You are just a peasent, can you really get to talk to the CEO of a company without talking to his secretary and his administration and bodyguards and making appointments and more? Who do you think you are?

[rhdez11]

(continued) You must think your pretty powerful if you think you can get to God without any path. In reality only the pure can talk to him directly - Moses, Abraham and others. Tell me this: What has happened in the past to those that tried seeing or talking to God directly? (Hint: time of Moses)Case closed.

[roxy841991]

God created us. He is not ashamed to have a connection with us. I guess you think God is pretty far removed, but Islam teaches that He is close to His creation and Merciful to it. Besides, of course we don't "talk" to Him directly. Islam teaches that no one can talk to God directly, nor can they see Him. But we can communicate and have a connection with Him.

[rhdez11]

"Islam teaches that no one can talk to God directly, nor can they see Him. But we can communicate and have a connection with Him." Sounds like you are talking about the Holy spirit? The father son and holy spirit. You can feel a good sensation when you pray from your heart to God because that is the holy spirit that you feel, not his presence right?

[roxy841991]

I guess, although Islam forbids the splitting of God into three persons. I wouldn't call it the Holy Spirit, I would just call it God.

God is close to all of His creation in a way, but He doesn't actually "talk" to us as in we hear a voice in our head. Mostly He listens to us when we call on Him and is near when we pray. He communicates to us through feelings and "inspiration". I don't think the human body could handle fully experiencing God.

[roxy841991]

Are you a Christian? You said there was no right or wrong religion. I was under the impression you were a deist. Christians may believe Jesus is God, but if he is not that would mean you were worshiping a false God. Your example doesn't work well with God for two main reasons - A CEO is too arrogant to talk to someone "lower down". God is not, if you approach Him with a sincere heart. Also, a CEO humanly is not able to talk to every single person that comes to him, God is.

[rhdez11]

Yes, I am a Christian by birth and belief. And no there isn't any right or wrong way to worship God. I cant tell you my way si better than your because after all, would he like me to put you down like that? Not every CEO is too arrogant. My uncle is a CEO (I wont say which company) and he is the nicest man I know. I also know who my CEO is and he is kind. "Also, a CEO humanly is not able to talk to every single person that comes to him, God is." Thats rght, thats why he became man (Jesus).

[rhdez11]

(continued)Like I said before, if he had come in his natural form (light) dont you think that he would burn us all?

[roxy841991]

I would be careful in saying what God's "natural form" is. Although God describes Himself in the Qur'an like this "God is the Light of the heavens and the earth. His Light is like this: there is a niche, and in it a lamp, the lamp inside a glass, a glass like a glittering star, fueled from a blessed olive tree from neither east nor west, whose oil almost gives light even when no fire touches it - light upon light...shining out in houses of worship." (24:35)

[roxy841991]

I didn't say any way of praying was better than the other - although as I believe the Muslim way was taught by God, it is the way He prefers to be worshiped. What I was getting at is that the earliest Christian beliefs and practices were probably closer to Islam than to modern Christianity. For example, most modern Christians don't follow any of the laws in the Bible, nor do they even think they have to. At least that is my experience. The laws in the Bible are very similar to Islamic law.

[FilistemoRules]

Really? we all try not to murder, not to lie, not to steal, not to harm any one.

muslims on the other hand, inspired by garbage quran try very hard to murder, rape, lie, deceive, coerse, use violence, harm and do all forms of evil specially against non-muslims, but even amongst themselves.

[roxy841991]

Peace.

Yes of course none of us wants to murder, lie, etc. Thank you for doing your part in trying to prevent all of the above.

I should have been more specific when I said "laws". I was speaking about the ritual laws in the Old Testament such as the ban on eating pork. And also some teachings in the New Testament such as women not speaking in church. I didn't mean to imply that Christians were bad people, just that many of them can be very picky about which of God's laws they actually follow.

[FilistemoRules]

We christians tend not to mix important teachings like to love God and love all humans-including unbelievers - at the same level as the teaching of what to eat or how to dress, materialistic rituals that are mostly nonsense. But of course to a muslim the way you clean your ass with a stone is as inportant as the teaching to go kill infidels! Go figure!

[roxy841991]

Once again, I agree with you - the ritualistic laws of the type subscribed in the Old Testament are no where near as important loving God, loving others, etc.

But still, if the Bible is the word of God, which I would say a lot of it is, then don't the ritual laws prescribed by God have a lot of wisdom in them? I just wondered why Christians don't strive harder to follow ALL of the laws in the Bible. And I wouldn't call God's laws nonsense, but I'm sure that's not what you meant.

[FilistemoRules]

Like I said what you eat, how you dress, how you walk, are im my opinium insignificant materialistic onstraints that lack true honest spirituality! Jesus came to brign spiritual circumcisium, NOT literla materialistic circumcision. In this muhamad also completely failed, proving again he is not a prophet but a charlatan.

[roxy841991]

That is your opinion, but what is God's opinion? Of course no one can truly know, but surely He wouldn't have spent so much time describing the many laws in the Old Testament if He Himself didn't think them important? I have read it myself - the Old Testament is about 3 quarters of the Bible and many many pages are devoted to describing the exact way to sacrifice certain animals, to build certain things, how to wage warfare, how to purify yourself etc. Pages upon pages. It is important to God.

[roxy841991]

My understanding of it is this and I will give you an example - The spiritual laws are the most important, but the "material laws" need to be adhered to in order to be able to follow the spiritual laws. Here is my example - The spiritual law to not commit adultery or fornication is very important, I think, and following God's "material laws" on proper clothing goes a long way in preventing the breaking of the more important law.

[roxy841991]

If you break the material law, you are much more likely to break the more important spiritual one. It is clear to me, at least, that no matter how much you try to abide the spiritual law, it is virtually impossible if you break the other laws. Take for example America, where many people are Christians, and they know the spiritual laws. Yet they have broken many times over God's laws on clothing. And see the results - fornication and adultery.

[roxy841991]

They were not able to abide by the spiritual law by themselves. Few, if any, human beings can do this when temptations arise. So God in His Wisdom gave us many "material laws" to help us. If we all dress modestly, the temptation to commit fornication and adultery is lessened. That is why I think the lesser laws are also important and I don't think you should ignore them.

[FilistemoRules]

The only REAL material laws that God gave us are on the 10 comadments and in jesus words and actions that agree with the 10 comadments, and these are:do not rape, kill, steal, lie...while allah asks muslims to do all these crimes and many more.

[FilistemoRules]

there is nothing spiritual about killing people, animals, cleaning your ass in a certain way, shaving or forcing your wimen to dress like ghosts. In fact all these material actions are crimes agaisnt God and against true honest spirituality.

[FilistemoRules]

Don't say that my friend. Muhamamd and muslims KNOW EXACTLY toi the last dot all that god wants from mankind:kill, rape, murder, steal, lie, cheat,make wars, collect booty and ransoms form the kidnappings allaha sks the muslims to do, torturing, practice all crimes you want mate....old jewish rituals were abandoned even by modern jews.get your facts straight!

[roxy841991]

Funny I definitely didn't get the memo that I was supposed to kill, rape, murder, steal, lie, cheat etc.

Let me ask you a question then because you don't seem to be getting my point - were those "old jewish rituals" put in the Bible by God or not? Just answer the question.

[FilistemoRules]

The only thing we can say God putted on the bible are the 10 comandments.Those rituals were invented by humans, not by God.

same with islam!

[roxy841991]

???

So do you not believe the entire Bible is the word of God?

Perhaps we aren't so different after all as I would agree with you if that was your view.

The Ten Commandments I agree with (more or less) anyway, as does the Qur'an.

[FilistemoRules]

I believ that the 10 comademnts are the word from God and that the bbble as a whole is the word of god, but not to take it literally.We have to read and understand the most important theological teachings there and ignore dumb detalis like what to eat, how to dress... and all that useless mumbo jumbo.

[roxy841991]

??????????????

Don't you understand that your explanation sounds hypocritical?

[FilistemoRules]

ther seems to be a great difference between what it seems to be and what it is. what more can I say. I am only human and cannot speak as Jesus did, always in a clear, simple but unbeatable way.

[roxy841991]

Would you be willing to admit that the Bible, as it is written literally, comes off as a lot more violent than the Qur'an, and a lot more weighed down with material laws than the Qur'an?

Why then did you endeavor to interpret the Bible, filled with war and violence, in the most peaceful way but when it comes to the Qur'an, filled with exhortations to give to charity and respect others, you took the few passages having to do with war and ignored the rest?

[FilistemoRules]

I absolutely disagree with that. The bible is wayyy more spiritual and less concered with materialism and infinitely less violent than the quran is. More than 70 % of the quran is hate speech and calls for jihad, torture, crimes. We have a very small portion of violent versicles on the OT that are irrelevant anyway to our daily spiritual lifes.

[roxy841991]

Filistemo, you're wrong. I don't think you've read the Bible. I highly recommend you read it, the whole thing. Don't you remember all the times God orders the Jews to go into towns and kill everything alive (including specifically pregnant women and animals?). Also there are some very harsh punishments in the OT towards breaking laws (harsher than Islamic law). I can give quotes but that might embarrass you...but I will if you insist.

[FilistemoRules]

God had limitations on his human form as Jesus, so I don'tn see why hiusn human part can't screem to his divine part for mercy? Do you prefer the "coherence2"of muhamamd of first lovoing all religions, then hating all non-muslims, constantly changing his mind on the same issuesas the wind changes direction, all supported by millions of very oportunistic "revelations" he never had?

[roxy841991]

Forgive me but I'm just not able to follow.

God? Limitations? Human form? Parts? These words don't seem to me to belong next to eachother. I hope we can agree that God is the Creator of all things, Infinite, Eternal, All Powerful, the Most High? Why would He place limitations on Himself - and if He did, wouldn't He no longer be God, as He would no longer possess all His Godly attributes? Also why would He divide Himself into parts? These are questions that arose when I read your reply.

[FilistemoRules]

Jesus had to eat , to dress, to walsk, to woek as any otehr human. Tjhose are limitaions proper of the flesh. Human emotions are also limitations that God outside Jesus body doesn't have! God didn't placed limitations on himslef. All material things are limited, even if God incarnates in them!

[roxy841991]

God outside Jesus's body??

lol I would love to know how you make sense of this because its making my brain hurt. If God is outside of Jesus's body then Jesus is not God. Either he's God or he's not. If Jesus is human, then he is limited. If God became Jesus, he placed limitations on Himself. And, if the entity that was once called God had limitations, he would no longer have the title God! One of the meanings of the word God with a capital G is to be limitless!

[FilistemoRules]

Since God creates all things-Both material and spiritual-souls of living beings- and the spirit of God incorporates somehow all things, yes God is everywhere, and watches , ears and sees everything. Don't you know that?

[roxy841991]

Yes, God created everything, and yes He is everywhere, seeing and hearing everything...that is what Islam teaches. However, I would say that while God is CLOSE to everything, He does not incarnate in them. You're not the first Christian I've seen go the Hindu route to try to explain how God could be God and human at the same time. You're trying to say that everything is God and God is everything...I say God is God and Creation is Creation.

[FilistemoRules]

I reject hinduism since it implies we are gods and that gods exist.that is false. Our souls and all cretations are indeed small fractions of God's own soul, also sharing eternity and great powers and habilities with our father-God, but God did incarnate ONCE in Jesus and God IS Jesus. Ask HIM why he did it, don't ask me.

[roxy841991]

Here is where we part philosophically - I can't accept that God is part of Creation or vice versa. God is eternal, limitless, independent, all-knowing, etc etc none of which any of His Creation is. None of His Creation shares ANY of His attributes.

[FilistemoRules]

God is inside Jesus body in a much more significant way that in it in any other human or thing.Jesus and God ARE one. if God couldn't be both totally in union in his incarnate form -Jesus-and also , in much smaller proportions in all creation, then God would not be God. Sill hurting your head?

[roxy841991]

Jesus and God are not one, because when Jesus supposedly died on the cross, God did not die, or else the universe would have vanished.

So was Jesus wholly God or just a part of God (a larger part than in any other creation) was inside him?

Is it possible for God ENTIRE being to be inside a human?

Yes still hurting my head. Your theology seems to be a bit tangled up

[FilistemoRules]

That is correct. The fact is Jesus only "died" physically.spiritually God never died on the cross, but of course none of us also dies spiritually when our bodies fail to keep alive.

[FilistemoRules]

About Jesus union with the father, your question is as fascinating as the answer is: Jesus was wholly God but he had serious limitations under his physical cage-body as we all have, therefore having some limitations MANIFESTING his power, that he doesn't have in spirit alone!

[roxy841991]

I don't follow and I will explain why - here is each step in my thinking process in trying to understand your POV, tell me where I'm going wrong

I start with the understanding that ,1. God is without limitations.

And you tell me that 2. Jesus was wholly God.

So it seems that 3. Therefore Jesus is wholly without limitations.

I am confused because this is in conflict with my other line of thinking which is:

1. Humans are limited.

2. Jesus was wholly human.

3. Therefore Jesus was wholly limited.

[FilistemoRules]

It is no easy to try to explain God and his incarnation I agree, but here it goes:1-God-Jesus doesn't have limitations in spirit;2-incarnated in Jesus on this earthly material existance, God has materialitic limitations;humans are not God but mere creations thatr depend of God to live-they share a small part of the spirit of God-soul; In heaven Jesus is all-poweful in spirit, and even on earth, but not under his physical body.

[roxy841991]

So part of God has limitations and part doesn't?

[FilistemoRules]

Whe God was incaranted in Human Jesus body, yes, God on the level of existence did had some limitations, but of course he could break them all if he wanted, but he didn't to our own sake.he was teaching us a lesson!

[roxy841991]

Oh, ok. :)

I still disagree, because I think God would never want to put limitations on Himself. I feel like God is permanently God, and humans are permanently humans, and they are not interchangeable, and there are no exceptions. And I still think Christian theology has to do a lot of loops and spins in order to coherently explain itself (and struggles even then) ....But I don't think either of us is going to convince the other. Thank you anyways for explaining your take on Christian theology.

[FilistemoRules]

It is your right no to agree with anything. i am not coersing you to believe what I believe.The trinoity is not an easy task for any one, christian or not to understand and even less to explain. it 9is just the way God showed himself. We cannot change divine revelation.

[vaea46]

the question FilistemoRules, What is the Greatest sin of all - I will tell you, The Greatest sin of all is not too Worship your God with yr Heart, Mind and Soul - SATAN purpose on earth is to misguild us from GOD, but throwing obstacles, so people will turn away from God - 2nd Commandment of the old testiment - Reads now shall not create images or worship images from Heaven or Earth or beneath the water - Jesus is a image - trinity or not. u still have jesus image - Jesus said not my will

[FilistemoRules]

You are a retard-muslim! All christian sworship God, the REAL GOD whose son-JESUS- in fact is nothing more than God himself. consubstantial with the father. Jesus and God are ONE! No chrsitian worships images. The images are mere helpers for praying to God, tools just like reading the bible is. You can use them as such but never worship them. IGNORANT JACKASS!

[roxy841991]

OK, not every CEO is arrogant. But most are...I assumed you were talking about CEOs in general. The two reasons I mentioned are the only reasons I can think of why a CEO wouldn't talk to anybody who wants to talk. If your uncle doesn't have a meeting with anyone who wants, and he is also not arrogant and a nice person, then I would say he does not have the time. But God does have the time.

[roxy841991]

So what are you saying, that Jesus (pbuh) is God's secretary? I don't really see what you're getting at. A CEO is not able to talk to everyone, therefore Jesus (pbuh) is God in human form? I don't get the jump. God doesn't need to become a man to communicate with humans. On the contrary, that would hinder Him as He would then be subject to human limitations. As God He could listen to all of humanity at the same time - as a man, at most a few at a time.

[FilistemoRules]

really? so why would god tranmit his contradictory nmessage to an illiterate bandit arabic bedouin, theif, mass-murderer, theif, rapist, torturer, slave trader, terrorist, thug, sexual pervert, pedophile cunt like muhammad?

[roxy841991]

Is there really any need for this? I say I don't think God would turn Himself into a human being and the only way you can respond is to insult the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh)?

I don't need to put down your prophets - in fact I love and respect all of them, peace be upon them all. Jesus (pbuh) is one of the foremost of these and he is a truly good person, one of the most beloved by God.

[FilistemoRules]

You can insult whoever you want my friend, including Jesus, if you wish. This is a free space of debate not saudi barbaria or pakistan. Go ahead! I Love mostly God and his incarnation in Jesus, Love the saints, love all good people of all religions and even the bad people, but muhamamd, sorry, I can never accept such an evil figure.He is forever rejected and ejected!

[roxy841991]

So here's a tough question - do you love Muhammad (pbuh)? ;)

Come on, you must at least admit that Muhammad (pbuh) wasn't all bad - he was always giving in charity, was kind to animals, and recognized Jesus as a prophet and Messiah - the only religious leader outside of Christianity to do so. He also entirely eliminated idol worship in the Arabian peninsula - a step in the right direction? He set himself against racism. He recognized your Bible and your prophets. Surely there are worse people?

[FilistemoRules]

I dispize muhamamd totally and completely. Why would I love a guy who faked to be my prophet while LYING to God, to mankind and to himself?!? Hilter and stalin also recognised jesus as a prophet and that doesn't mean they were good people!Actually even jews today, zaroastrians, bahais, budhists, hindus recognise Jesus as a spiritually superior entity, something they don't recognise to muhamamd!

[roxy841991]

What happened to love your enemies and turn the other cheek? But, I understand. At the moment your need to defend God and His religion against threats and your opposition to them have won out over the commandment to love your enemies.

[FilistemoRules]

I agree with giving the otehr cheek, but that doesn't mean I will nevessarily do it, specially when facing enemies-jihadists- that knowing this, will take great joy in killing me, my family, my country, my people, my values and everything I believe.islam is THE EXCEPTION to that rule!

[roxy841991]

What about love your enemy? Did Jesus say this or not?

he didn't say "love your enemies (unless they're Muslims!)"

And you know what, I don't support so called jihadists, or terrorists, or whatever you want to call them. If even a quarter of all Muslims in the world were Jihadists, the human race would have been extinct by now. But its a very small minority that support them and an even smaller minority who actually are terrorists. Most Muslims just want to be left in peace, at least in America

[FilistemoRules]

that is correct, but I don't think christian will ever be a ble to give their mlifes, religion, ideals when facing a satanic ideology that would love to take adventage to wipe us out and islamize -destroy us.We open a political exception for a political satanic ideology islam that dispizes human life, values and sanctity of all creation.

[roxy841991]

So you are saying ideally one should love their enemies but in practice you are not able to do so in this case?

[FilistemoRules]

That is correct! ideally we all should alwasy love all enmies but in practice there are a few exceptions, because these exceptions reckon no authorithy to this universal principle of love towards the other as we do.

[roxy841991]

To love your enemies doesn't mean to submit to them. It simply means that while you must fight them out of necessity, you don't hate them in your heart.

The purpose of loving your enemies isn't because they may or may not love you back..it isn't a contract. It is about transcending and being better than the ones who hate you.

[FilistemoRules]

NO! Love ahs nothign to do with submission. we are all equal brothers and sisters in God so why shoufdl we oppress and submit each other as if some of us are superior and the others garbage? That is ridiculous.I don't hate any one as Christ teached us, but giving the other cheek..I still have a long way to go ...

[roxy841991]

I feel that you have a lot of hate in your heart...I was trying to get you to realize that you are not following Jesus's teachings in being so venomous towards Muhammad (pbuh) and Muslims. Even if they had done all that you've accused them of, they would still be people. They are not demons, and Jesus (as he is in Christian doctrine) would have loved them and not hated them. But yet in your hatred of these people you have been acting as though you are being a good Christian.

[FilistemoRules]

I do not hate any one, muslim included. It is muslism that hate everyone, including themselves becase islam and muhammad teached and coersed them to hate others.

[roxy841991]

Really? It does come off that way, unfortunately. You felt the need to use the word cunt and a host of other insults towards the Prophet (pbuh) which was completely unnecessary. You were so eager to insult the Prophet (pbuh) that you used his race against him and further insulted the millions of Arabic peoples. You also described Muslims as murderers, rapists, liars, etc. Sorry but that doesn't come off as "well really I love everyone deep down".

[FilistemoRules]

muhammad is just One ARAB. ARABS ARE MILLIONS.i DO NOT HATE ANY ONE,arabs included.Yes muslims the moe indoctrinated in islam, and the more coherent with the islamic principles they become, they will surely become murderers,raspists, lairs, criminals,terroirsts..I still love them but they hate me anyway! Islam is responsible for their hatred against me.

[vaea46]

you have alot too learn FilistemoRules -  Muhammed teaching is no different then what was taught in the Old Testiment - ask you pastor about the man that comes with the 10 thousand saints and a firey law - in the old testiment - u will b amazed how that character in the old testiment sounds like Muhammed - in history there has been no one but Muhammed that fits that criteria - remember Satan has a army - that pulls people away from God - ISLAM soul base is pusing people 2wards God -

[roxy841991]

Thus, turn the other cheek. The meaning of that is, even if your enemy should strike you on the face, you should bear absolutely no ill will towards him. If your enemy hits you, instead of hitting him back or hating him, you should turn to him your other cheek and let him also strike that. You cannot have a fight if only one person is fighting. The idea is to defeat hate with love.

[FilistemoRules]

I agree, and I am trying very hard to do that but we both know it is sooo difficult isn't it?

[roxy841991]

Btw, it is interesting to me how you include the term Arabic Bedouin among your insults to the Prophet (pbuh).

I never thought racism was an ideal Christian trait. However, everyone can have something slip out that they don't really mean when they are angry or passionate about something. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that you are not a racist but were simply trying to think of as many degrading names in such a short time that the term slipped past without you noticing.

[FilistemoRules]

I never liked muhamamd, but I must confess that the more I study him, not just as a "prohet"( that he cklearky isn't) but even as aman, the more outraged I become with who he truly is.Not all arab beduins are as evil as muhamamd was, I agree with that!

[mawnyz1]

Al-Ikhlas

In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful

Say: He is Allah the One and Only; (1) Allah, the Eternal, Absolute; (2) He begetteth, not nor is He begotten; (3) And there is none like unto Him. (4)

[Chill197]

So if Jesus was a Muslim why do i get Christmas presents?

[lmkmonte]

Why so many different translations into English?? I say it is because men use it and change God's word to meet their own needs..

[FictionsBlaster]

When Jesus found Unbelief on their part (of his disciples) He said: "Who will be My helpers to (the work of) Allah." Said the disciples: "We are Allah's helpers: We believe in Allah, and do thou bear witness that we are Muslims. (Glorious Quran 3:52)

-------------

So this is 100% proof that all true followers of Jesus were Muslim. The term Christian was invented later by deceived ones

[googoogoo]

Totally, that's such a great point! I mean if the Quran says it, it MUST be true!

[evo55]

The Quran also says ants can talk like humans.

[Kite207]

The Quran says ants talk, but it never says it talks like humans.

[evo55]

The Quran automatically implies ants can talk like humans. How else does one ant say to the other ants, "run and hide in your nest lest Solomon and his soldiers trample you under foot"? Scientists know ants can communicate using chemical signals but only as a form identification. They cannot communicate such complex messages as the Quran claims they do.

[Kite207]

"They cannot communicate such complex messages as the Quran claims they do." (evo55)

Yes, they can communicate such complex messages according to this web site.

current-biology

watch?v=kzHMOkC0K-w

[evo55]

I couldn't access the video. Can you give me the title so I can search for it? I'm curious to know how an ant says, "beware, Solomon's soldiers are coming".

[Kite207]

[Talking Ants in the Noble Quran] made by "mowiz111"

You should watch this video also.

[Amazing Ants Amazing Quran] made by "rahimid".

Ants are amazing creatures. So amazing that to believe that how an ant says , "beware, Solomon's soldiers are coming" is NOTHING! compare to their amazment.

No wonder God named one of the sura in the Quran "Surah Al-Naml" Which means Sura The Ant.

[evo55]

The video is nothing but Islamic propaganda. There is no true science. You must get documentation from actual scientists who study ants otherwise you only offer Islamic pseudo-science. I have studied enough about ants to know they do not communicate complex messages as the Quran says they do.

[honesthonestgirl]

المسيح انسان كامل وهذا بعينه دليل الالوهية شاهدوا الاعجاز والاخطاء:) على thequran // islamexplained دوت كوم

[Kite207]

"because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me." [John 5:30] (KJV)

Anyone who says its not my will but Gods will is a muslim. A muslim who sumbits his will to the will of the almighty God.

"And he went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed" [Matthew 26:39] (KJV)

Do christians fall on their faces and pray?

No

Do Muslims fall on their faces and pray?

Yes

"CHRISTIANS" Follow the Bible and Join the Muslims in Prayer

watch?v=HualOlrlksY