I Really Like The Video From Your His Holiness The Dalai Lama goes one-on-one with Larry King in his first interview after his meeting with President Obama
Thank you, YouTube, for closed captioning; it wasn't perfect, i.e. Larry King's comments were ignored completely, and parts of the Dalai Lama's talk were obscured, but overall, I got the gist. Thank you again! Yes, we already know how the Chinese Government thinks of Tibet, but it's still good to see dialogue.
Why do we argue on here? I have an Idea, why don't we post about what we learned from this video. This is a very serious subject to be discussed. Autonomy for Tibet and freedom from oppression from China is a serious issue, and demands great "Compassion " from us all ! Peace be with you all along your journey's Long or Short they may be. Hope in finding inner peace is your responsibility right now. Loving happiness to all!
According to Buddhist practice, there are three stages or steps. The initial stage is to reduce attachment towards life.
The second stage is the elimination of desire and attachment to this samsara. Then in the third stage, self-cherishing is eliminated
The creatures that inhabit this earth-be they human beings or animals-are here to contribute, each in its own particular way, to the beauty and prosperity of the world.
@theyansterr Very good observation my friend. Did you even listen to the discussion they had ?, And do you have any intelligent response to it! Or do you just go on here disrespecting great influential people. Like "His Holiness".
@iamlumin LOL Chinese government in the 12th 5 year plan is looking to reduce the rich and poor gap, its stated by Chinese primier Wen jiabao that the enemy of Chinese government is not anyother great powers but the tich and poor gap and social inequalities. those are his own words. 1 there are no forest in tibet 2 mining activities are not effect the tibetan environment in anyway it actually creats wealth in the region.3 we have not diverted any major rivers on tibet =) so stop lying
actually china contribute a lot to Tibet, which make tibet relatively a modern place now. you can not imagine what was going on there before china CCP came. the slaves were treated as no human, they were eaten by those slave owners like Dalai lama. Of course, Dalai lama wouldn't tell you that story. But please google the history of tibet, they even had the pictures.
someone said they want to free tibet from china, funning, just come, and we'll see
@robertccjj1 China has taken much more from Tibet than they've contributed. Gold, silver, lithium, copper, lumber and of course, water in necessary for entire nation of China. Chinese officials admitted this reality. When Chinese were starving, even some eating their dead babies we had never had a famine in Tibet not until MAO invaded, then famine soon arrived. Chinese moved in millions of Chinese into Tibet. That is their contribution, to make us minority, marginalize and oppress us.
@iamlumin tibet is infamous for lack of resources thats why tibetan monks eat meat, they even lack the fertile soil to grow vegetables. by millions u mean only 72,000 Han chinese have their registered household in tibet(according to Australian and american demographic sources) and 1 in 35 tibetans are a monk, and the fact 95% of tibetan speak the tibetan language its also compulsary and the only language in primary schools in tibet, and the fact tibetans on average have 3.5 children STOP LYING
@obsidianstatue Chinese have been mining like crazy in Tibet. Gold, silver, lithium, copper, uranium, etc. What you're talking about was over a half century ago. The whole world has changed since then. That's a ridiculous statement about language. Just 2 years ago a law was passed minimizing Tibetan language being taught in Tibet. Please, in many areas there are more Chinese visible than Tibetan. Changing street names and putting up fake monuments Lhasa looks more Chinese than Tibetan.
@iamlumin lol i was in the Chinese education system for 11 years, i know for a fact tibet is compulsary and ONLY language in primary schools in tibet and there are NO laws EVER passed to impede the growth of tibetan language, 98% of tibetan children speaks tibetan how can you LIE and say they are not learning tibetan. also u cant say some1 digged up some gold and say tibet is resource rich, its resource in any form such as lithium gold etc is meagre compared to central asia or south america.
@obsidianstatue First of all, there's a difference in what the Chinese say and what they do. That being said, you are completely wrong about the educational system in Tibet and to top that off, because so many businesses are owned and operated by Chinese it's almost impossible to function in many places if you don't speak Mandarin. Aside from the minerals and lumber that has already been taken by the tons, there is one thing the Chinese authorities themselves admit they need and that is WATER!
@iamlumin oh for fuck sake the gange the mekong are all originated from the tibetan platau so are they stealing water as well. fucking retard. and YOU ARE WRONG ABOUT TIBET. ive been to tibetan primary schools in lhasa the primary language used in the class is Tibetan its only until secondary school mandarin is introduced as a second language.also tibetans are free to start a business infact most market retalers are tibetan.also most tibetan prefer tobe monks, thats why 1 in 35 tibetan is a monk
@obsidianstatue Get a clue. Chinese have complete disassembled the Monastic system. The few that are left are only for tourism. There are actually undercover police dressed as monks, Monks are watched 24/7. The Chinese are building many dams and diverting waters and by the way, totally screwing up the environment. Most businesses in Lhasa are owned and operated by Chinese not Tibetans. I've greeted many Tibetans just arriving in India and most can't even speak Tibetan but they speak Mandarin.
@obsidianstatue There's only a small number of monasteries remaining out of the thousands that once existed in Tibet. There are some monasteries that had between 5,000 and 10,000 monks. The Chinese don't allow this any longer. There are however, hundreds of thousands of military personnel, and yes, Tibet is a nuclear dumping ground. Not to mention deforestation, desertification, and the fact that many species in Tibet are now endangered. There are marksman on the rooftops of temples, wake up!
@iamlumin "most tibetan monastaries are currently in good shape and its full of monks"(according to Dr Sautman),if you believe there are underconver police placed in monastaries then i have nothing say to a paranoid idiot like you, also you provided absolutly no evidence to your rhetoric, btw you went to india? guess where did i go? yes TIBET, if you want know the truth then goto tibet and see it for yourself otherwise you will forever be blinded by daLIE lama's clique of slave owners in india.
@obsidianstatue Most monasteries are gone, destoryed. Guess where I went, Tibet? I grew up in Tibet idiot! I know the truth from presonal experience and direct observation. My Father died in a Chinese prison after 4 years of abusive treatment. My Mother died shortly after her release as she was tortured for years because she wouldn't go along with the Chinese version of Tibetan history. Before you open your big mouth you should know who you're dealing with. I have nothing to do with the DL.
@iamlumin hahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha XD lol your so called family story sounds like a hollywood anti-Chinese film LOL poor bastard, stop lying. who the fuk do u think you are? you are not even important enough to have the alledged torture treatments its reserved for VIP only LOL fat fuk westerner.
@obsidianstatue Not true A hole. And your response is very mature. NOT! This is the kind of response given by someone with nothing to say and no ground to stand on. Thanks for making my point.
@iamlumin also you know what? i dont have to take this insulting shit from anti-china racist like you. I PERSONALY dont really care about the backward tibetan reglious practices, so all i care is that tibet will forever be a part of CHina. full stop. this is a fact learn it and then respect it, if you want to lick daLie lama's balls then go ahead it wont change this fact.
@obsidianstatue I'm not anti-China, you're just insecure. So if you're so comfortable with the actions of your government then why speak about it at all? Because deep down you know the truth. There's simply too much evidence to contridict what you'd been told to believe. So our relgious pratices are backward? This reveals who the racist is. Thanks for findly showing your true colors. Of course, I knew it all along.
@iamlumin also if you live in post 1950 tibet then you must have atleast some understanding of Chinese mandarin which im sure you cant even speak so STOP LYING. lying like daLie lama wont change the fact that tibet is still a part of China and Me with my Chinese passport can goto tibet when ever i wish and piss anywhere in tibet i like =)
@obsidianstatue Of course, anyone who disagrees with the Chinese view is a liar, a trader, a splittest, or whatever other stupid word they come up with. I love that. Like the Chinese Tibetologist. Like a Chinese knows more about our history, cutlure & traditions than we do. So freakin' stupid it's beyond belief really. Of course, Chinese government loves to speak for us, saying how happy we are and how much we support the communist government, only thing is they're completely wrong & so are you!
@iamlumin wrong? i just dont care. there is nothing u treehuggers can do. btw u still havent provided ANY form of evidence to your rhetorics. unitl you actually find some convicing evidence about on rediculous claims such as "undercover police dressed as monks" then noone will take you seriously. have fun with your imagined genocide =)
@obsidianstatue If you don't care why to you keep posting your senseless comments? Not long ago BBC was given an "escorted" visit of Tibet. There is plenty of evidence on those video tapes to dispute your claims. There are plenty of Tibetans with the scares and wounds left from being tortured. There is also video evidence of Chinese soldiers shooting Tibetan attempting to leave Tibet. Many atrocities in Tibet have been documented no matter how hard the Chinese try to keep this from happening.
@iamlumin lol u r the one who replyed to me about claiming rediculous things like "there are chinese police dressed as monks in tibetan monastaries" and provided not a single thread of evidence on these kind of aburd claims. also only idiots would take the treatment of tibetan rebels who broken laws and then generalized. that idiot is you.
@obsidianstatue Undercover police in Tibet is common practice. Where have you been? Invading someone else's country, exploiting resources, killing people, false imprisonment, oppression, all these are crimes against humanity. The evidence is easily accessible. Do some homework. Yes the Chinese try to keep all this a secret but it makes its way out of Tibet anyway. There are plenty of videos the Chinese would have preferred that the world never seen. Do some research It's out there.
@iamlumin China imprisons those who advocate rebelion. its NOT false imprisonment, if you are a pecaful tibetan monk in a monastary teaching religion to local tibetans then they wont have any problem with the government. you need to learn this fact.
@obsidianstatue Ya right, that's why so many have been forced into exile, falsely imprisoned, spied on, tortured, beaten, etc. Sure it's false imprisonment. We never asked for the Chinese to come to our country. No thanks. They said they were there to help & then they'd leave. Of course, that was a lie. Hell that was 60 years ago! You need to learn right from wrong. I support my people, my country, my culture, my traditons, etc, because it's right & you might not admit it but you'd do the same.
@iamlumin according to the Succession of states theory in international law all subsequent Chinese governments (Ming Dynasty, Qing Dynasty, ROC and PRC) have succeeded the Yuan Dynasty in exercising de jure sovereignty and de facto power over Tibet. and all together we exercised 800 years of soverignty over tibet, a small percentage of tibetan rebels will NOT change this fact.
@obsidianstatue You really don't want to refer to International law because under International Law Tibet meets all the requirements for statehood. the Tibetan state began in 127 BC with the establishment of the Yarlung Dynasty, the country as we now know it was first unified in the AD 700 under King Songtsen Gampo and his successors.
@iamlumin it doesnt matter, under international law ALL USA land belonges to european settlers they dont belong to natives, and europeans have only been occupying all of USA for no more than 250 years. and tibet is a part of Chinese dynasties since late 1260s.
@obsidianstatue Who's talking about the USA? By the way recently discovered evidence reveals that Europeans were in the US prior to the "natives". Tibet has not been part of the Chinese dynasties since late 1260's. That's insane! In fact, from a legal standpoint, Tibet to this day has not lost its statehood. It is an independent state under illegal occupation. Neither China's military invasion nor the continuing occupation by the PLA has transferred the sovereignty of Tibet to China.
@iamlumin the native americans arrived in north america 12,000 years ago that is 10,000BC even the pyrimids havent been built and u say some how europeans were their before that?YOU FUKING RETARD white americans only exercised sovernignty over America for 250 years, while China has exercised soverignty over tibet for 800 years. Yuan dynasty in the 1200s exercised soverignty in tibet and the Ming, Qing ROC and now PRC has all exercised soverginty in tibet,
@obsidianstatue Again you're getting off subject. I'm not from America. China has not exercised soverignty over Tibet for 800 years. That's a complete lie rooted in fiction and the result of indoctrination and brainwashing. Do you really think we don't know our own country? Are you that stupid? The Yuan dynasty was founded by Kublai Khan in the13th century...he was not Chinese he was Mongolian.
@iamlumin LOL Yuan dynasty is a Chinese dynasty, the emperors spoke Chinese lived in Chinese culture, he use han CHinese as officials so its sinicized and then monglian became a part of Chinese ethnic same goes to Qing dynasty im Manchu, i and my fellow manchu friends consider ourselves a part of the greater Chinese ethnic, the Qing emperors also were sinicized(became chinese)
@obsidianstatue The Mongol Empire was a world empire and, whatever the relationship between its rulers and the Tibetans, the Mongols never integrated the administration of Tibet and China nor appended Tibet to China in any manner. Tibet broke political ties with the Yuan emperor in 1350, before China had regained its independence from the Mongols.
@iamlumin the mongol emprire and Yuan dynasty ARE TWO DIFFERENT POLITICAL ENTITIES. Yuan dynasty is exclusive to China NO WERE ELSE. and the subsequent Ming Qing dynasties and ROC and PRC have ALL EXERCISED SOVERIGNTY. go learn you damn history idiot. and btw the majorities of tibetans have no problem being a part of China its ONLY the religious fanatics that worship daLIE LAMA who is against China.
@obsidianstatue Tibet developed no ties with the Chinese Ming Dynasty (1386-1644). On the other hand, the Dalai Lama, who had established his sovereign rule over Tibet with the help of a Mongol patron in 1642, did develop close religious ties with the Manchu emperors, who conquered China & established the Qing Dynasty (1644 - 191 1).
@iamlumin lol what kind of bullcrap is that, tibet during the last 800 years never had de jure independance, it was only when the british tried to steal it from China in the 1920s China lost control in tibet but back then tibet was NEVER recognized by any country, btw back in 1920s mongolia was also under Chinese soverignty with recognition from the legue of nations.
@obsidianstatue Under International Law recognition by another state is not required. Tibet was for many centuries very isolated by choice. When the US Congress declared Tibet an occupied country on more than one occasion did that matter to you? Now that the International community is sucking at the financial utter of the Chinese, no one has the backbone to state the truth. Who the hell cares about any of this anyway? I'm talking about today, here and now.
@obsidianstatue The Dalai Lama agreed to become the spiritual guide of the Manchu emperor, & accepted patronage and protection in exchange. This "priest-patron" relationship (known in Tibetan as ChoeYoen), which the Dalai Lama also maintained with some Mongol princes & Tibetan nobles, was the only formal tie that existed between the Tibetans & the Manchus during the Qing Dynasty. It did not, in itself, affect Tibet's independence.
@iamlumin how can the europeans only occupied America for 250 years automatically have soverignty and tibet has been a part of China for 800 years have no soverignty ?? LOL and oh yea retard let me tell you this tibet after 1200s were NEVER recongized as a independant state by international law, so tibet SINCE 1200s were never independant. NOt a single country recognize tibet as independant.
@obsidianstatue Again who the hell is talking about America or the Europeans? This is what all Chinese do when they're backs are against the wall. They divert from the subject at hand trying to justify the actions the Chinese are taking to day that something that happened hundreds of years ago. International law does not requrie recoginization by another state and even the US Congress on more than one occasion declared Tibet an occupied country.
@iamlumin btw im not diverting the subject away. the europeans have only occupied america and australia for no more than 300 years, but China has exercised soverignty over tibet for 800 years. how come you recognize white people's claim in america australia and Russian far east while not recognize Chinese claims in tibet?? oh yea i forgot you are a retard teabagger.
@obsidianstatue You are diverting the subject and you're doing it again. China has not excercised soverignty over Tibet ofr 800 years. This is what Chinese are taught in order to rationalize the current situation. If what you're saying were true as Tibetans we would have been aware of this all along & we would have no problem with Chinese control of our land. There'd be no need to rename streets, incorporate our land into other provinces, rename towns, etc.
@iamlumin dispite what you think about Yuan dynasty(Yuan being a Chinese word and mongols a one of 56 Chinese ethnics) qing dynasty also exercised unquestioned soverignty over tibet since 1750s EARLIER THAN the establishment of USA, Australia. so why dont you ask those countries to give their land back to the natives and then you can point your fingers at China all you like.
@obsidianstatue Again you're getting off subject. I have no interest in what America or Australia may have or not have done. My business is my country. Most Tibetans are not happy being part of China. In fact, most Tibetans who seek to end the occupation are against the Dalai Lama. You don't understand the average Tibetan, and it would surprise you how many Tibetans coming across the pass that are not religious at all. Labeling us as fanatics reveals how little you know of our culture.
@iamlumin btw i respect reality, so before you argue with me the technicalities of tibetan history lets look at the current facts. under the Succession international Law of the UN tibet is recognized as a part of China. so CHina has the backings of UN law and 192 counties of UN all recognize tibet being a part of CHina. so tibet under internaional law its illegal to have de jure independance, and China has total control as aways in tibet so it cant have de facto independance.
@obsidianstatue This is all due to the fact that the International community is in debt to the Chinese. It's that simple. One doesn't have to look to far back the moments when countries freely admitted that Tibet was an occupied country. If China "always" had total control then there'd be no issue. It's that simple. We would have always known it. If China always had control then by default they're the ones who are responsible for the current screwed up situation. You can't have it both ways.
@iamlumin tibet is under absolute Chinses soverignity since 1750 and no point in history tibet was recognized as independant. so where did you get the stupid idea? btw you want to talk about now? well let me tell you, tibet is recognized as part of China by the League of Nations(before 1945 when China was weak) and when the UN established after WW2 tibet was also recognized by All members of UN when CHina was weak and in civil war. so the argument of the world bowing to Chinese economy is WRONG
@obsidianstatue I don't know where you come up with this crap but you hold the party line and are a good sheep. The CCP did there job well with you. By the way the US congress recognized Tibet as an occupied country on more than one occasion. When Tibet was invaded the world was a bit involved with other matters is you know your history. Also, the US being a Christian based nation had litte motivation to help a Buddhist based state. Wait until it's your turn and we'll see how you feel.
@iamlumin LOL you care what US congress say when they are the ones who has been occupying the land of native americans and commiting culture genocide to the point of native American Indian language is all but dead? dont you think US congrees is not in the position to judge?? GET THIS FACT INTO YOUR SHIT HEAD- Chinese soverngity in tibet is protected by international law and PLA so dont fuk with us or we will flantten the himalayas
@obsidianstatue I don't care, since you referred to it & to others I used your own rational to invalidate your silly position. Don't fuck with you? You are nothing. You are completely and totally meaningless in the larger picture & even in the smaller picture. Your own insecurities are now being revealed in your postings. Who gives a crap about the PLA? They are nothing, insects, lower than the lowest criminal on the planet. In fact, a plague on the planet like the worst cancer known to man.
@iamlumin LOL you are the retard who are incapable to understand English language. i said EVEN wikipedia can prove your version of "history" wrong. i said EVEN. what kind of retard are you to not understand this simple expression? btw as i said dont argue historical technicalities with me its a fact that tibet was in the past 800 years were NEVER recognized by anyform of internationally approved law that its indenpendant country. get this simple fact into your shit head then you will understand
@obsidianstatue I was being serious. You may have a learning disability or something. To think you know Tibet better than someone who lived there most of their life and who's family dates back in Tibet hundreds of years is plain silly. Like we don't don't our own country. Under international law recognition can be impicit or explicit. Learn something about us. We had been a isolated state for centuries. Prior to the invasion most Chinese couldn't tell you anything about Tibet.
@iamlumin first of all you are not tibetan so stop lying, second of all China has legal rights and and the ablilities to keep tibet from ever go independance, these are simple facts learn it and respect it ok?
@iamlumin STOP LYING the international community Changed the status of taiwan(ROC) in the international law. after daLie lama escaped to india after the failed violent uprise, then he imediatly went to on the international scene and recieved alot of attention BUT not a single government changed their view on tibet, the UN also NEVER changed the international law according to tibet. eventhough back in the 50s China was at war with USA and 16 UN memeber states. SO YOUR ARGUMENT DONT STAND
@obsidianstatue What would you expect them to do? I don't think so. As I said the US declared Tibet an occupied country on more than one occasion. think you need to review your history again. The world was a bit distracted in 1949 - 1950 not to mention that few outsiders knew anything about Tibet. The Chinese had been making claims about Tiibet for years. While others including Cihna wanted to use Tibet to transport supplies through in WW II , Tibet remained neutral and would not allow it.
@iamlumin no USA NEVER decleared tibet as an independant state, infact NOt a single country has EVER recognized tibet as independent under any form of muilti-national approved law. SO STOP LYING.
@obsidianstatue During four U.N. General Assembly debates on Tibet (1959, 1960, 1961, & 1965), many countries (e.g., Philippines, Nicaragua, Thailand. United States, Ireland) openly stated that Tibet was an independent country illegally occupied by China.
@obsidianstatue 28th October 1991, US Congress under a Foreign Authorization Act passed a resolution wherein they recognized "Tibet, including those areas incorporated into the Chinese provinces of Sichuan, Yunnan, Gansu and Qinghai, AN OCCUPIED COUNTRY under the established principal of international law". The resolution further stated that Tibet's true representative are the Dalai Lama and the Tibetan Government in exile as recognized by the Tibetan people.
@iamlumin congress of USA has NOT a single right to speak on the matter their decision was forced through by daLie lama cult member like nancy pelosi. they are nothing but a bunch of old pricks who has nothing todo so they decided to annoy China. not a single formally recognized international or any law of any country do they suggest tibet was ever recognized as independent. also openly state=/=recognized by any for of legitmate law so they only count as political rhetoric duting the cold war.
@obsidianstatue So now you realize you've lost the angument so you bow out and say the US has no right to speak on the matter? So about that you already committed yourself, real your own postings. Again, under international law recognition by other states is NOT necessary. We were an isolated country for many, many years, by choice and because of location. I contradicted your position with facts and now you come up with some lame rationalization. You can't win we have truth on our side.
@iamlumin all im saying is that any statement made without any form of recognized law is political rhetorics and it has NOTHING to do with the history or the cunrrent status of tibet. if USA and China were close allies then US congress will never talk of such rhetoric. is that simple enough for you?
@obsidianstatue I know what you're saying and you're back peddling. Is that simple enough fo you? Read your own postings. Listen today is today, tomorrow is another day. Tibet once conquered ancient capital of China. Do you deny that as well? Things change, China will implode. It's just a matter of time. CCP is so nervous about he protests spreading across the Middle East, because they fear that people they're oppressing, brainwashing & oppressing will stand up and demand their freedom as well.
@iamlumin due tto your ilogical political views i do not trust your political prediction for China. so dont even try and make youslef look like a retarded clown. in your pathetic attempts you still havent answered me on why there is NOT a single formal law of any country that actually recognize tibet as a independent country with support of historians. in your entire days of research you were only able to find Cold War political rhetorics so pathetic.
@iamlumin if you think so many countries SO CALLED "recognize" tibet as independent then how come NOT a single country was willing or let alone able to pass an internationally recognized law that say tibet is an independent country?BECAUSE all of the empty talk done by small percentage of countries are CALLED POLITICAL RHETORICS it has NOTHING todo with tibet, its a game of politics. after all countries like Kosovo was made independent by international law,why not tibet? TIBET IS NOT INDEPEDENT
@obsidianstatue It is political. In these current times countries have massive debt and owe the Chinese billions and want to continue with getting money and importing cheap crap. As I said before, things change. Remember the Soviet Union? Gone!
@iamlumin USSR and CHina are different USSR was brought down by revolution, China is currently on the path of reform. politcally and economically, any politcal changes and reforms will be led and credited to CCP just like the reform and opening up of 1978 was credited to deng. but no matter what politcal system CHina under the guildance of CCP evolves into tibet will NEVER be independent because 100% of Chinese will NEVER support it.
@obsidianstatue Path of reform, economically. Tibetans still are blocked from speaking freely, practicing religion freely. Look around, there are enough videos online where you can see the oppress both subtle and overt. China doesn't have to support it. The masses have the power, they just don't know it yet and many in China have been brainwashed to believe misinformation about Tibet. Hell, most Chinese knew nothing about Tibet prior to invasion and now it's seen as a place to make money.
@iamlumin due tto your ilogical political views i do not trust your political prediction for China. so dont even try and make youslef look like a retarded clown. in your pathetic attempts you still havent answered me on why there is NOT a single formal law of any country that actually recognize tibet as a independent country with support of historians. in your entire days of research you were only able to find Cold War political rhetorics so pathetic.
@iamlumin what evidence do you have to suggest CHinese are ignorant of tibetan history? just because many Chinese and foreigners believe a different version of tibetan history they are automatically "brainwahed". you dont even have a single piece of evidence to prove your version of history. I have proven my-tibet under no formally recognized law says its independent.
@obsidianstatue Thousands of postings by Chinese who almost always drift in to futile attacks and criticisms that make no sense at all. I have direct experience that many Chinese simply don't understand us, our culture or our history. The Chinese authorities by the way don't ask. They tell us we're happy. They tell us and others we're happy with the communist party. They don't bother asking us. They tell the world how we feel without even involving us. They lie excessively about the Dalai Lama.
@iamlumin you are not tibetan so stop pretending tobe one, second of all the serfs and slaves which accounts for 80-95% of the tibetan population under the theocratic rule of daLie lama had an life expectancy of around 30 years old. so there are currently almost no peasants of the theocratic tibet society remembers the brutal daLie lama's iron fist. also dont be idiot and burst out usless bullshits bring some facts into the discussion, if this is standard of ur discussion then u can fukoff.
@obsidianstatue My heart, my blood, my bones are Tibetan. You have been indoctrinated well. Now you're really off subject. Tibet wasn't perfect prior to the invasion but that doesn't matter not the least little bit. China was not and is not perfect and prior to 1950 it was horrid. This is about the invasion and occupation of a peaceful neighbor. The Chinese want our resources and have always wanted to get their hands on Tibet. The land, space, strategic military location, WATER, etc.
@iamlumin well im tired of repeating myself that in the past 300 year history of international law and order not a single country has ever stated tibet as independent. and dispite the lies daLie lama spreads in the past 60 years NOT a single country has ever recognized tibet as independent. recognition of independence by int. law has happened to Kosovo and recently South Sudan, how come no law recognize tibet?because it has been in absolute part of China for 300 years.btw u r NOT a tibetan.
@obsidianstatue I don't blame you but reapting oneself is what a person does when they've been successfully brainwashed and indoctrinated. Again, under International Law recognition by another state is not required. By the way, I am Tibetan, always have been and always will be. Part of China for 300 years? Please. There was a point when all Chinese were expelled from Tibet in the early 1900's. How can that happen if Tibet was under Chinese rule? Tibet was never ever really a part of China.
@iamlumin let me make it clear i know you are not tibetan. the lamas and slave owners that enslaved 80-95% of the tibetan population did get away with not following ROC governent's orders in the 1910s but it was not recognized by either the internation community or the ROC so its an illegitimate separatist movement when China at the time was in crisis, so its illegitmate the fact that u cant provide a single evidence than a illegitmate separitst movement proves that im right.
@obsidianstatue Unbelievable! You're still going on with your lies and distortions and accusations?? Wow! You must have such a deep sense of guilt over what the Chinese have done to my sacred homeland and my people. We don't want to separate anyone. The Chinese separated us from our own country. Got away with it? They never took orders from the ROC or anyone else. They tried to give orders as they always wanted Tibet. In Tibet now we are like slaves but not back then this was not the case.
@iamlumin proior to WW2 the Nazi part sent experditionary explorers to tibet and one of the thing they found is that they very admire the tibetan nobles, why? because they enslaved the majority of tibetan as serfs and slaves, and no one question their medieaval acts of crimes. they have wrote an artical for major media outlets in Nazi germany discribing tibetan aristocrates and slave owners as example for all pure German race, and the tibetan horsemen as example for the brutal SS Nazi guards
@obsidianstatue They wanted to take symbology that they knew had deep meaning and ancient roots. That was part and parcel to Hitler's plan to fool the International community. The fact is very few outsiders knew anything about Tibet. Our country was closed off. During WWII we refused to allow Tibet to be used to transport supplies across. The entire world was different back then. Some Chinese had to eat their dead children due to famines. My Mother never refused anyone food & we were poor.
@iamlumin 1 you dont speak tibetan 2 you dont speak Chinese, all you can speak is english so stop lying you are not tibetan. human rights problem is irrilevant to the status of tibet. China needs stablilities to ensue economic development, atleast CHinese arnt dirt poor compared to democraric indians who had similar time of development as China but 3/4 of indians still live in poverty. also you blame China for Mao's mistake? even the CCP stiped Mao of his power in the Lu Shan conference.
@obsidianstatue I left Tibet a long time ago my friend. Although I do still speak some Tibetan and you don't. MAO is worshipped by man sheep in China today. That's how dumb people are. Well ya, MAO was the leader at the time and took is stupid ideas to Tibet. By the way, MAO knew Tibet was independent state, he even said so. He liked the idea of having the land, space & strategic military location. In his old age MAO was having 15 year old Chinese girls give him tongue baths. He was a sick man.
@iamlumin all i saw as english, admit it you are not tibetan =) neither CCP leaders nor chinese citizens care about Mao and his idiologies. that is why we are rich now because we abandon the empty promise of Mao just after his death. the only reason why Mao is loved by some is because he led an army that defeated many foreign powers, his economic incompetantness is widely criticized in China today. so no matter how much u curse Mao, i and most of Chinese dont really care.
@obsidianstatue Care about MAO are you joking? He's still revered by many Chinese. You must be joking. I know many Chinese people who still revere MAO. I don't care about MAO. I care about my country and if what happen to my country happened to yours you'd feel the same way. The fact that I've lived in exile for so long matters not. I still have man friends struggling to survive in Tibet. Rich! Are you kidding? There are still hundreds of millions of Chinese living below poverty level.
@iamlumin only 20% Chinese are under the UN poverty line. compare other large developing countries like india 75%. only in 30 years china lifted more people out of poverty than the entire history of Mankind, China now is the world's 2nd largest consumer market, and the country with the largest middle class population, we are even the worlds largest car buyers, so yes we are getting richer and richer give China another 30 years we will be on top.
@obsidianstatue Above UN poverty line doesn't mean one is living well. Who cares about all these things you're talking about? I don't. China will be on top of what? You don't understand life. It still comes down to what you do individually and while China is obsessing with outer development they are not working on inner development. Some the most impoverished people I know are incredibly wealthy. It means nothing. Chinese haven't figured this out yet.
@iamlumin quit changing the subject, where is your evidence that we are "raping tibetan land and its people" lol and where is your evidence to proof that you are a tibetan ? lol if you want to discuss the Chinese economic model vs a so called "free market economy" im happy to educat you in my channel but not here. so stay on topic and give me thos evidence LOL
@obsidianstatue I'm not changing anything. You simply are too ignorant to follow a consistent line. You don't understand. I'm not arguing. I know my country. I know my history of my country. I have direct experience and observation. Do you want some of my DNA? If I'm not careful friends of extended family could be harmed in Tibet. I don't know who you are. By the way. I don't have to prove anything to do. I'm quite comfortable in my own skin. My wife is Tibetan as well so live with it.
@iamlumin there are not a single major monastaries destoryed AFTER the the culture revolutions, today most of tibetan monastaries are in good shape and in use, and according to Barry Sautman who has been to many of them says the monarstaries are respected and restored and full of tibetans who are studying religion.
@obsidianstatue Monasteries are only kept up for tourism dollars. There is only a small percentage of monks and nuns compared to the old days. Monks must go through forced re-education first. There's even laws made my atheist concerning reincarnation. Please. You are either really dumb, mentally disabled or like I said a pathological liar. BBC just gave a escorted tour last July, google it and learn how Tibetans are treated and controlled.
@iamlumin 1 out of every 35 tibetans are a monk, how is that low, more tibetans have simply moved on from a religious live to a life where they can send their kids to good schools. and no it is prooven by many tibetan scholars such as Barry Sautman that any tibetan over 18 are allowed to be a monk but often they are younger. infact according to the sochlary paper of Sautman many local officals encourage tibetans to go into monarstaries and be a monk because then they dont have to take care of it
@obsidianstatue Stop spreading lies. Barry Sautman is not Tibetan and can't speak for us. He makes one visit to a secondary school and writes a 4 pages article on how great things are. He knows nothing.
@iamlumin lol when did i say he was tibetan does Barry souds like a tibetan name LOL, he was a scholar who has an authority in the history and current status of tibet, he traveled to many places in tibet, and his scholary works are dont independently and referencing more than 300 source of solid evidence. LOL he knows alot.
@obsidianstatue I know you didn't say it. I'm saying it. You simply can't comprehend. He knows shit. He is not Tibetan. He has not experienced what we experienced and experience on a daily basis. A person can know a lot about things and still actually "know" nothing at all. The accumulation of false information may sound impressive but it is false nonetheless.
@iamlumin it seems like NOT only barry sautman that have stated the brutal crimes of tibetan theocratic governent headed by daLie lama. its not only him any serious independent scholars all know that tibetans were inslaved by the daLie lama clique before 1950s. infact it was China land reforms and abolishment of slavery that convinced the Tibetan aristocrates and lamas to organize and rebelion in 1959.
@obsidianstatue Why do you continue on? It's like you have a mental problem. There is no Dalai Lama clique. It doesn't exist. You should be kissing the Dalai Lama's ass. If not for him many Tibetans would have changed and turned violent by now. Most of the people rebelling in front of the Potala where ordinary citizens from all over. You have a lot to learn. Tibetans in exile are welcome whether monks, nomads or whatever.
@iamlumin lol my friend as ive said before the "tibetan government in exile" is the daLie lama clique where daLie lama has absolute control of every tibetan in india. lol you are the one who claimed tobe tibetan yet cant speak a word of it, im simply claiming to be an chinese who have been in tibet many times. the reason why ordinaty tibetans never rebel is because their lives were better under CHinese administration than the theocratic slavery of old tibet =)
@obsidianstatue First of all, I'm not your friend. There is no Dalia Lama clique. You're nuts! You have been successfully brainwashed. We don't rebel because it's not in our nature. We are a peaceful people. That can change.
@obsidianstatue Do you really want to continue to bring up irrelevant issues? Do you want to discuss how the Chinese treated their own people? Even today many are treated like animals, even worst. You can't speak your mind in China. You know it and so does everyone else. They can shut the internet down, block YouTube whenever they want. MAO was responsible for millions and millions of deaths of his own people. His stupid agricultural ideas were imposed on us & resulted in our first ever famine.
@iamlumin 1 how is asking for evidence of legitimate independence of tibet irralivent?? 2 how is asking evidence to proof 80-95% of tibetans were not slaves under daLie lama's theocracy? even the Nazi party during the 1938 expidition to tibet was amazed on how obedient slaves and serfs can be. there was even a documentary filmed at that period showing starving tibetans slaves and serfs with chains on their neck and feet.
@obsidianstatue Chinese are raping our land and exploiting our people and homeland today. Chinese have purposely worked to make it looked like Tibet was always part of China. Changing street names false monuments, etc. Staving Tibetans in Chinese prisons today so you need not speak of yesterday. The Dalai Lama was a child when he arrived in Lhasa aside from that our country is none of Chinese business. I gave you evidence although no one need prove it to you. Who the hell are you? Nobody!
@iamlumin lol then why is daLie lama was the chairman of ethnic monorities congress of People's Republic of China. you acuse "Chinese raping your land and exploit your people" is there any evidence of this?? all i know tibetan students get extra points in university enrance exam, they also get prefered in many state jobs. its not our problem that most of tibetans choose to be monks and be poor economically so dont blame Han Chinese.
@obsidianstatue Dalai Lama was very trusting and was taken advantage of. You're fogetting how young he was and he was trying to save his country. What choice did he have? Tell me. We had a very small army, we were a non-violet society, we were focused on spiritual matters more than matters of the state. No one asked for what you're offering. We'd rather you simply pack up and leave Tibet. Trust me, the majority of Tibetans secretly feel this way but are afraid to speak out.
@obsidianstatue You really don't understand Tibetans. We are not as obsessed with materialism as you are. We prefer our freedom, our rights, our traditions, our sacred land, etc. Of course, we want some modernization but on our own terms at our own pace. Not dicdated by the Chinese, who speak for us, tell us what we want, how we feel, etc. They are wrong. Tibetans are not happy under Chinese rule & never will be. Evidence of exploitation and raping of our land. You must be kidding? Unbelievable!
@iamlumin LOL just a day ago you BLAMED HAN CHINESE for not giving tibetans enough wealth and complaing how All the business in tibet is owned by Han Chinese and now you say u dont care about material wealth LOL you fucking little liar. again give me evidence of the alledge "raping of your land and people" then we will talk more =)
@obsidianstatue I'm not blaming Han Chinese for any of that. You are insane! I care about inner development along with external development. I care about balance. Do your own research. Mining is out of control and that's why so many flooding problems. Deforestation, diverting of revers, all this is damaging our environment. Hundreds of thousands of Tibetans have died as a result of the invasion and occupation.
@iamlumin LOL Chinese government in the 12th 5 year plan is looking to reduce the rich and poor gap, its stated by Chinese primier Wen jiabao that the enemy of Chinese government is not anyother great powers but the tich and poor gap and social inequalities. those are his own words. 1 there are no forest in tibet 2 mining activities are not effect the tibetan environment in anyway it actually creats wealth in the region.3 we have not diverted any major rivers on tibet =) so stop lying
@obsidianstatue Chinese government is largest criminal syndicate on the planet. You are either really stupid or you essentially a pathological liar. So it's not possible to continue with is futile conversation. In 1959, 25.2 million hectares of forest were found in Tibet, but in 1985 the Chinese had reduced forest-cover to 13.57 million hectares. Over 46 percent of Tibet’s forest has been destroyed and in some areas this figure is as high as 80 percent. Now go learn more about Tibet.
@iamlumin LOL as i said the forest is not on the tibetan platau they are in other provinces of China NOT in the province of tibet, and it has absolutly no effect on the highland enviroment like tibet. so stop lying and get real =)
@obsidianstatue Here's what you said, "1 there are no forest in tibet ". Next, Tibetan forest regions of Nyingtri, Gyalthang, and Drago were ravaged between 1965-1985 and a total of 18 million cubic meters of timber were transported to China. Since that period it's even worst. Much of the old growth forest are simply gone.
@iamlumin actually ive been to Nyingtri very beutiful and full of trees. =) my friend dont use figures from anti-china websites like "tibetan environment watch" logging from tibet is the stupdest thing a company can do do you even know what the tibetan roads were like in the 1980s? even in the early 2000s me and my dad when entering tibet from SiChuan saw a family in a car fell down an 100 meter cliff. just transporting these woods out of tibet is a miracle let along saling them at a good pirce
@obsidianstatue Please my friend. I have photos of trucks leaving for the mainland full of timber, not stop truck after truck. Hey you said there are no forest in Tibet. What happened? First you said you never said that. I copied your own post to prove you wrong. You are a liar! Perhaps pathological.
@iamlumin again ive been to the places u accused of being logged and to me it was full of trees, i would rather tust my own eyes than a word from a stranger who cant even speak tibetan. =) lol
@obsidianstatue Again, I have photo evidence. I trust my eyes, I have direct experience and direct observation of what has been done in my country. Come on. Lhasa looks like a Chinese city now. Trust me it will always be Tibetan to me. Notice our buildings, our language, our script, our traditions, all different than Chinese. Do you have any perception at all?
@iamlumin direct observations? LOL you just said u havent been in tibet for many years and know you claim direct observations?? you cant speak tibetan so stop trying to be one. oh im sorry that Chinese helped tibetans to build modern building so they can have a chance of normal live.
@obsidianstatue Unbelievable. You are obsessed. If you don't care and it doesn't matter to you why to you continue on wasting your time? I don't get it. You are insane! You can't speak for Tibetan and why so many Chinese think they know Tibet and Tibetan's bettter than Tibetans is beyond me. Chinese help get rid of Tibetan footprint in Tibet. That's all they're doing. Like after earthquake now they want to rename the town with a Chinese name. Why? Think about it.
@iamlumin infact many Han Chinese and other ethnics of china like tibetan culture very much that is why we will NEVER let tibet be separated from its motherland. for the last 300 years history has prooved me right =)
@obsidianstatue I have picture that contradict your position on this as well. Han looking at passing Tibetans with distain and making fun of us. We have never been a part of China and never will be. China only holds Tibet by force. That's why marksman on temple rooftops,. Eveyone is so happy. That's why when you drive you are likely to pass hundres of military trucks, people so happy. You are in total denial.
@iamlumin well you have been a part of China for the last 300 years and still is a part of China, what lunatic give u the idea of tibet is not a part of China? lol i can go to tibet without a visa with my People's Republic of China passport. =) my friend snap into reality =)
@obsidianstatue So in your twisted mind you know our country and history better than we do? What I really hope you get help. I mean that seriously. Exactly, Tibetans are treated like second class citizens in our own country. Reality changes on a moment to mement basis. Things are always changing. Take a good look at the news and you'll see what I mean.
@iamlumin 1 you cant even speak tibetan so you arnt one stop lying =) 2 you have not a single piece of evicence that tibetans are discrinimated in the province of Tibet, infact the policies of the government prove me right and you wrong. tibetans dont have to follow the 1 child policy, tibetans get extra points in university entrance exam, if your house registertion is in tibet you also get a higher state funded pension than Han Chinese. so my friend stop lying =)
@obsidianstatue I have boat loads of evidence and it's amazing that I do because the Chinese authorities make it difficult to get video and photos out that make them look bad. I'm not your friend so stop saying that. We don't want these things you're offering. Who asked you? We'd rather you leave our country and let us be in peace. You are in denial and it's doubtful that there's any hope for you. Good luck with your delusional mind.
@iamlumin oh do you my friend? do u have "boat loard of eivdence" LOL me too,=) my friend please stop lying you are NOT even close to counter my evidence, LOL
1 u claimed to be tibetan, which u obviously not u cant even speak tibetan
2 you claim to have "boat load of evidence" which u obviously do not have. cant see any =)
stop making youself look like an idiot. tibetans today have their religious freedom, as they have for the past 300 years that they have been a part of China=)
@obsidianstatue #1 - Yes after all these years I can speak some Tibetan and #2 there's tons of evidence available all over the web if you just look. People who have been tortured, video interviews done undercover, etc. You're the one who looks like an idiot. People all over the world support the Tibet issue & we are a small population of people. We have not been part of China for the last 300 years & if we were there would be no Tibet issue. Can't you see the missing logic behind your position?
@iamlumin so you claim with fake evidence done by actors and posted on anti-China websites. =) my friend you already lied being a tibetan dont lie anymore =)
@obsidianstatue I never said I take evidence from actors and posted on anti-China websites. I never lied about being Tibetan. You are a liar and everything that comes out of your mouth is a lie. If anyone disagrees with your position you follow the party line. You've been indoctrinated well. However, it seems you are not so comfortable afterall, for if you were so sure of your position you wouldn't spend your time posting nonsense. I'm not sure who you're trying to convince me or yourself.
@iamlumin my white westerner friend ive already conviced you,=) no need to argue anymore, i will be looking forward to my tibetan trip =) of course with no visa need because i have an People's republic of China passport, see i was right after all =)
@obsidianstatue I'm neither white nor am I a westerner. You "think" you know someone you never meant and you couldn't be more wrong. Enjoy the effects that will eventually manifest for what you've been complicit in. I don't believe you're Chinese. I don't believe you're going to Tibet. You are simply an internet trroll and that's the end of it. That's the actual truth.
@iamlumin 你一个西方鬼子有你妈个屄资格是我？use online translator want to know what i just said my western white friend who claims tobe tibetan but speak not a word of it =)
@obsidianstatue That's a very intelligent post. Not! I do speak more than a word but you don't so what's the point. I don't even believe you're Chinese. You used a translator to make your post in the first place. Sure when someone disagrees with you call them names, be critical but never look at the possiblity that you are stuck in your own fixed frame of mind rooted in brainwashing and years of repetitious indoctrination. 打漢語太久，并且他將聯繫藏語。
@iamlumin lol you acuse me of using translator when you r the idiot who clearly had the rediculously obvious translator gramma problems LOL what an retard =)
@obsidianstatue I didn't say I speak Chinese. Of course, you attack and accuse, exactly what scared little boys do when they no they have no leg to stand on. Good luck with your limited future and short life span.
@iamlumin again even daLie lama's clique accused China of killing 2 million tibetans(a figure that NOT A single historian or scholars agree). LOL so its no suprise that anti-china website claim we logged 2 million tibetan trees LOL. its very easy to fabricate figures but its no easy to deny the documentary filmed by Nazi officers in tibet showing slaves and serfs everywhere. =) so please stop lying and blam us han Chinese and the government =)
@obsidianstatue There's no such thing as a Dalai Lama clique, a Chinese invention like many other lies. Again, no one is blaming. Leave Tibet, no problem, gather your shit, take your tacky shops and stupid buildings, all your military vehicles and personnel, etc and go, do not hesitate. I never said China killed 2 million Tibetans so I don't know what websites you're talking about.. Sorry but someday you will have to accept the attrocities committed against my people and my sacred homeland.
@iamlumin LOL yes i know you never said China killed 2 million tibetans BUT it was the "tibetan government i exile"(the daLie lama clique) made such statement. and it was clearly proven wrong and fabricated by many independent scholars. we have commited no atrocities aimed at tibetans, and we like tibet so we will not leave as other governments of china in the last 300 years has prooven we really like it here and not leaving =)
@obsidianstatue They neve rsaid 2 million so you are a liar. China is not leaving because of the resources. That's a fact. Chinese who stay too long will eventually get sick. It's already happening. Tibetan DNA is different and handles the altitude much better. You'll see. We're not going anywhere either. I'm teaching my grandchildren the truth and they will carry on long after I'm gone.
@iamlumin lol im so sorry i was supposed to say 1.2 million, its the figur fabricated by the daLie lama clique in india, ive been to tibet and i have only felt out of breath for the first 15 minutes when i first set foot in tibet but after that it felt normal like anyother sacred land of China =)
@obsidianstatue Give me a break. Thousands of monasteries destroyed, people forced to use ancient scriptures as toilet paper, tons of gold and silver statues taken to Beijing to be melted down and sold. The way are animals are treated now. The relocation of nomads, please the list is too long for YouTube.
@iamlumin if the so called truth is on your side then how come the international law NEVER agrees with you? after all it was through UN recognized law that South Sudan(the newest country in the world founded in 2011) was created, it was through UN security council discussion that the nation of Kosovo was created. these cases all have valid and truthful history to back its claims.
@obsidianstatue Many Chinese people are stuck in a delusional matrix. They will come to see the truth. Over the centuries when the world was working hard on outer development we were focused on inner development. There is common vision and uncommon vision. Many, many, many Tibetans have uncommon vision and they see the forest through the trees. The Chinese are stuck in obsessive attachment to materialism and the compulsive mantra of more, more, bigger, bigger, more, more, etc. It's a dead end.
I Really Like The Video From Your His Holiness The Dalai Lama goes one-on-one with Larry King in his first interview after his meeting with President Obama
willamricard 2 days ago
love the video really good
samjenkinssam 1 month ago
Larry King show some respect on his holiness..! watch your legs and the way yo speak with his holiness
MrPemba23 3 months ago
from lk's questions, he probably does not know what the heck is going on in china and was just using very general questions.
eastern2western 5 months ago
when was this aired
sueryun 7 months ago
@sueryun Feb 22 2010
Bylkup389 7 months ago
Thank you, YouTube, for closed captioning; it wasn't perfect, i.e. Larry King's comments were ignored completely, and parts of the Dalai Lama's talk were obscured, but overall, I got the gist. Thank you again! Yes, we already know how the Chinese Government thinks of Tibet, but it's still good to see dialogue.
riverdwell 8 months ago
@riverdwell Youtube didnt put cc. uploader did (their best)
Bylkup389 7 months ago
Why do we argue on here? I have an Idea, why don't we post about what we learned from this video. This is a very serious subject to be discussed. Autonomy for Tibet and freedom from oppression from China is a serious issue, and demands great "Compassion " from us all ! Peace be with you all along your journey's Long or Short they may be. Hope in finding inner peace is your responsibility right now. Loving happiness to all!
MultiDjelement 8 months ago
interdependance and equality and acceptance over independance and seperation and self righteousness. right on dalai!
youngs1ncere 9 months ago
According to Buddhist practice, there are three stages or steps. The initial stage is to reduce attachment towards life.
The second stage is the elimination of desire and attachment to this samsara. Then in the third stage, self-cherishing is eliminated
The creatures that inhabit this earth-be they human beings or animals-are here to contribute, each in its own particular way, to the beauty and prosperity of the world.
FREE TIBET FROM CHINA
benza168 10 months ago
Dalai Lama is intimidated by Larry King! Haha!
theyansterr 10 months ago
@theyansterr Very good observation my friend. Did you even listen to the discussion they had ?, And do you have any intelligent response to it! Or do you just go on here disrespecting great influential people. Like "His Holiness".
MultiDjelement 8 months ago
@iamlumin LOL Chinese government in the 12th 5 year plan is looking to reduce the rich and poor gap, its stated by Chinese primier Wen jiabao that the enemy of Chinese government is not anyother great powers but the tich and poor gap and social inequalities. those are his own words. 1 there are no forest in tibet 2 mining activities are not effect the tibetan environment in anyway it actually creats wealth in the region.3 we have not diverted any major rivers on tibet =) so stop lying
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
go to the chinese yahoo! and type dalai lama.. you get censored crap.. only the side with something to hide distorts information
TheUndergrnd 1 year ago
"there is enough treachery, hatred violence absurdity in the average
human being to supply any given army on any given day
and the best at murder are those who preach against it
and the best at hate are those who preach love
and the best at war finally are those who preach peace" - Charles Bukowski
EllyMcCormack 1 year ago
lol at a former slave owner talking about freedom and human rights :0 dalai good job!
Mrasianpopmusic 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
His holiness Dalai Lama.
fifafreak310258 1 year ago
actually china contribute a lot to Tibet, which make tibet relatively a modern place now. you can not imagine what was going on there before china CCP came. the slaves were treated as no human, they were eaten by those slave owners like Dalai lama. Of course, Dalai lama wouldn't tell you that story. But please google the history of tibet, they even had the pictures.
someone said they want to free tibet from china, funning, just come, and we'll see
robertccjj1 1 year ago
@robertccjj1 China has taken much more from Tibet than they've contributed. Gold, silver, lithium, copper, lumber and of course, water in necessary for entire nation of China. Chinese officials admitted this reality. When Chinese were starving, even some eating their dead babies we had never had a famine in Tibet not until MAO invaded, then famine soon arrived. Chinese moved in millions of Chinese into Tibet. That is their contribution, to make us minority, marginalize and oppress us.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin tibet is infamous for lack of resources thats why tibetan monks eat meat, they even lack the fertile soil to grow vegetables. by millions u mean only 72,000 Han chinese have their registered household in tibet(according to Australian and american demographic sources) and 1 in 35 tibetans are a monk, and the fact 95% of tibetan speak the tibetan language its also compulsary and the only language in primary schools in tibet, and the fact tibetans on average have 3.5 children STOP LYING
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Chinese have been mining like crazy in Tibet. Gold, silver, lithium, copper, uranium, etc. What you're talking about was over a half century ago. The whole world has changed since then. That's a ridiculous statement about language. Just 2 years ago a law was passed minimizing Tibetan language being taught in Tibet. Please, in many areas there are more Chinese visible than Tibetan. Changing street names and putting up fake monuments Lhasa looks more Chinese than Tibetan.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin lol i was in the Chinese education system for 11 years, i know for a fact tibet is compulsary and ONLY language in primary schools in tibet and there are NO laws EVER passed to impede the growth of tibetan language, 98% of tibetan children speaks tibetan how can you LIE and say they are not learning tibetan. also u cant say some1 digged up some gold and say tibet is resource rich, its resource in any form such as lithium gold etc is meagre compared to central asia or south america.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue First of all, there's a difference in what the Chinese say and what they do. That being said, you are completely wrong about the educational system in Tibet and to top that off, because so many businesses are owned and operated by Chinese it's almost impossible to function in many places if you don't speak Mandarin. Aside from the minerals and lumber that has already been taken by the tons, there is one thing the Chinese authorities themselves admit they need and that is WATER!
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin oh for fuck sake the gange the mekong are all originated from the tibetan platau so are they stealing water as well. fucking retard. and YOU ARE WRONG ABOUT TIBET. ive been to tibetan primary schools in lhasa the primary language used in the class is Tibetan its only until secondary school mandarin is introduced as a second language.also tibetans are free to start a business infact most market retalers are tibetan.also most tibetan prefer tobe monks, thats why 1 in 35 tibetan is a monk
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Get a clue. Chinese have complete disassembled the Monastic system. The few that are left are only for tourism. There are actually undercover police dressed as monks, Monks are watched 24/7. The Chinese are building many dams and diverting waters and by the way, totally screwing up the environment. Most businesses in Lhasa are owned and operated by Chinese not Tibetans. I've greeted many Tibetans just arriving in India and most can't even speak Tibetan but they speak Mandarin.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue There's only a small number of monasteries remaining out of the thousands that once existed in Tibet. There are some monasteries that had between 5,000 and 10,000 monks. The Chinese don't allow this any longer. There are however, hundreds of thousands of military personnel, and yes, Tibet is a nuclear dumping ground. Not to mention deforestation, desertification, and the fact that many species in Tibet are now endangered. There are marksman on the rooftops of temples, wake up!
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin "most tibetan monastaries are currently in good shape and its full of monks"(according to Dr Sautman),if you believe there are underconver police placed in monastaries then i have nothing say to a paranoid idiot like you, also you provided absolutly no evidence to your rhetoric, btw you went to india? guess where did i go? yes TIBET, if you want know the truth then goto tibet and see it for yourself otherwise you will forever be blinded by daLIE lama's clique of slave owners in india.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Most monasteries are gone, destoryed. Guess where I went, Tibet? I grew up in Tibet idiot! I know the truth from presonal experience and direct observation. My Father died in a Chinese prison after 4 years of abusive treatment. My Mother died shortly after her release as she was tortured for years because she wouldn't go along with the Chinese version of Tibetan history. Before you open your big mouth you should know who you're dealing with. I have nothing to do with the DL.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin hahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha XD lol your so called family story sounds like a hollywood anti-Chinese film LOL poor bastard, stop lying. who the fuk do u think you are? you are not even important enough to have the alledged torture treatments its reserved for VIP only LOL fat fuk westerner.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Not true A hole. And your response is very mature. NOT! This is the kind of response given by someone with nothing to say and no ground to stand on. Thanks for making my point.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin also you know what? i dont have to take this insulting shit from anti-china racist like you. I PERSONALY dont really care about the backward tibetan reglious practices, so all i care is that tibet will forever be a part of CHina. full stop. this is a fact learn it and then respect it, if you want to lick daLie lama's balls then go ahead it wont change this fact.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue I'm not anti-China, you're just insecure. So if you're so comfortable with the actions of your government then why speak about it at all? Because deep down you know the truth. There's simply too much evidence to contridict what you'd been told to believe. So our relgious pratices are backward? This reveals who the racist is. Thanks for findly showing your true colors. Of course, I knew it all along.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin also if you live in post 1950 tibet then you must have atleast some understanding of Chinese mandarin which im sure you cant even speak so STOP LYING. lying like daLie lama wont change the fact that tibet is still a part of China and Me with my Chinese passport can goto tibet when ever i wish and piss anywhere in tibet i like =)
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Of course, anyone who disagrees with the Chinese view is a liar, a trader, a splittest, or whatever other stupid word they come up with. I love that. Like the Chinese Tibetologist. Like a Chinese knows more about our history, cutlure & traditions than we do. So freakin' stupid it's beyond belief really. Of course, Chinese government loves to speak for us, saying how happy we are and how much we support the communist government, only thing is they're completely wrong & so are you!
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin wrong? i just dont care. there is nothing u treehuggers can do. btw u still havent provided ANY form of evidence to your rhetorics. unitl you actually find some convicing evidence about on rediculous claims such as "undercover police dressed as monks" then noone will take you seriously. have fun with your imagined genocide =)
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue If you don't care why to you keep posting your senseless comments? Not long ago BBC was given an "escorted" visit of Tibet. There is plenty of evidence on those video tapes to dispute your claims. There are plenty of Tibetans with the scares and wounds left from being tortured. There is also video evidence of Chinese soldiers shooting Tibetan attempting to leave Tibet. Many atrocities in Tibet have been documented no matter how hard the Chinese try to keep this from happening.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin lol u r the one who replyed to me about claiming rediculous things like "there are chinese police dressed as monks in tibetan monastaries" and provided not a single thread of evidence on these kind of aburd claims. also only idiots would take the treatment of tibetan rebels who broken laws and then generalized. that idiot is you.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Undercover police in Tibet is common practice. Where have you been? Invading someone else's country, exploiting resources, killing people, false imprisonment, oppression, all these are crimes against humanity. The evidence is easily accessible. Do some homework. Yes the Chinese try to keep all this a secret but it makes its way out of Tibet anyway. There are plenty of videos the Chinese would have preferred that the world never seen. Do some research It's out there.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin China imprisons those who advocate rebelion. its NOT false imprisonment, if you are a pecaful tibetan monk in a monastary teaching religion to local tibetans then they wont have any problem with the government. you need to learn this fact.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Ya right, that's why so many have been forced into exile, falsely imprisoned, spied on, tortured, beaten, etc. Sure it's false imprisonment. We never asked for the Chinese to come to our country. No thanks. They said they were there to help & then they'd leave. Of course, that was a lie. Hell that was 60 years ago! You need to learn right from wrong. I support my people, my country, my culture, my traditons, etc, because it's right & you might not admit it but you'd do the same.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin according to the Succession of states theory in international law all subsequent Chinese governments (Ming Dynasty, Qing Dynasty, ROC and PRC) have succeeded the Yuan Dynasty in exercising de jure sovereignty and de facto power over Tibet. and all together we exercised 800 years of soverignty over tibet, a small percentage of tibetan rebels will NOT change this fact.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue You really don't want to refer to International law because under International Law Tibet meets all the requirements for statehood. the Tibetan state began in 127 BC with the establishment of the Yarlung Dynasty, the country as we now know it was first unified in the AD 700 under King Songtsen Gampo and his successors.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin it doesnt matter, under international law ALL USA land belonges to european settlers they dont belong to natives, and europeans have only been occupying all of USA for no more than 250 years. and tibet is a part of Chinese dynasties since late 1260s.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Who's talking about the USA? By the way recently discovered evidence reveals that Europeans were in the US prior to the "natives". Tibet has not been part of the Chinese dynasties since late 1260's. That's insane! In fact, from a legal standpoint, Tibet to this day has not lost its statehood. It is an independent state under illegal occupation. Neither China's military invasion nor the continuing occupation by the PLA has transferred the sovereignty of Tibet to China.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin the native americans arrived in north america 12,000 years ago that is 10,000BC even the pyrimids havent been built and u say some how europeans were their before that?YOU FUKING RETARD white americans only exercised sovernignty over America for 250 years, while China has exercised soverignty over tibet for 800 years. Yuan dynasty in the 1200s exercised soverignty in tibet and the Ming, Qing ROC and now PRC has all exercised soverginty in tibet,
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Again you're getting off subject. I'm not from America. China has not exercised soverignty over Tibet for 800 years. That's a complete lie rooted in fiction and the result of indoctrination and brainwashing. Do you really think we don't know our own country? Are you that stupid? The Yuan dynasty was founded by Kublai Khan in the13th century...he was not Chinese he was Mongolian.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin LOL Yuan dynasty is a Chinese dynasty, the emperors spoke Chinese lived in Chinese culture, he use han CHinese as officials so its sinicized and then monglian became a part of Chinese ethnic same goes to Qing dynasty im Manchu, i and my fellow manchu friends consider ourselves a part of the greater Chinese ethnic, the Qing emperors also were sinicized(became chinese)
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue The Mongol Empire was a world empire and, whatever the relationship between its rulers and the Tibetans, the Mongols never integrated the administration of Tibet and China nor appended Tibet to China in any manner. Tibet broke political ties with the Yuan emperor in 1350, before China had regained its independence from the Mongols.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin the mongol emprire and Yuan dynasty ARE TWO DIFFERENT POLITICAL ENTITIES. Yuan dynasty is exclusive to China NO WERE ELSE. and the subsequent Ming Qing dynasties and ROC and PRC have ALL EXERCISED SOVERIGNTY. go learn you damn history idiot. and btw the majorities of tibetans have no problem being a part of China its ONLY the religious fanatics that worship daLIE LAMA who is against China.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Tibet developed no ties with the Chinese Ming Dynasty (1386-1644). On the other hand, the Dalai Lama, who had established his sovereign rule over Tibet with the help of a Mongol patron in 1642, did develop close religious ties with the Manchu emperors, who conquered China & established the Qing Dynasty (1644 - 191 1).
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin lol what kind of bullcrap is that, tibet during the last 800 years never had de jure independance, it was only when the british tried to steal it from China in the 1920s China lost control in tibet but back then tibet was NEVER recognized by any country, btw back in 1920s mongolia was also under Chinese soverignty with recognition from the legue of nations.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Under International Law recognition by another state is not required. Tibet was for many centuries very isolated by choice. When the US Congress declared Tibet an occupied country on more than one occasion did that matter to you? Now that the International community is sucking at the financial utter of the Chinese, no one has the backbone to state the truth. Who the hell cares about any of this anyway? I'm talking about today, here and now.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue The Dalai Lama agreed to become the spiritual guide of the Manchu emperor, & accepted patronage and protection in exchange. This "priest-patron" relationship (known in Tibetan as ChoeYoen), which the Dalai Lama also maintained with some Mongol princes & Tibetan nobles, was the only formal tie that existed between the Tibetans & the Manchus during the Qing Dynasty. It did not, in itself, affect Tibet's independence.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin how can the europeans only occupied America for 250 years automatically have soverignty and tibet has been a part of China for 800 years have no soverignty ?? LOL and oh yea retard let me tell you this tibet after 1200s were NEVER recongized as a independant state by international law, so tibet SINCE 1200s were never independant. NOt a single country recognize tibet as independant.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Again who the hell is talking about America or the Europeans? This is what all Chinese do when they're backs are against the wall. They divert from the subject at hand trying to justify the actions the Chinese are taking to day that something that happened hundreds of years ago. International law does not requrie recoginization by another state and even the US Congress on more than one occasion declared Tibet an occupied country.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin btw im not diverting the subject away. the europeans have only occupied america and australia for no more than 300 years, but China has exercised soverignty over tibet for 800 years. how come you recognize white people's claim in america australia and Russian far east while not recognize Chinese claims in tibet?? oh yea i forgot you are a retard teabagger.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue You are diverting the subject and you're doing it again. China has not excercised soverignty over Tibet ofr 800 years. This is what Chinese are taught in order to rationalize the current situation. If what you're saying were true as Tibetans we would have been aware of this all along & we would have no problem with Chinese control of our land. There'd be no need to rename streets, incorporate our land into other provinces, rename towns, etc.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin dispite what you think about Yuan dynasty(Yuan being a Chinese word and mongols a one of 56 Chinese ethnics) qing dynasty also exercised unquestioned soverignty over tibet since 1750s EARLIER THAN the establishment of USA, Australia. so why dont you ask those countries to give their land back to the natives and then you can point your fingers at China all you like.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Again you're getting off subject. I have no interest in what America or Australia may have or not have done. My business is my country. Most Tibetans are not happy being part of China. In fact, most Tibetans who seek to end the occupation are against the Dalai Lama. You don't understand the average Tibetan, and it would surprise you how many Tibetans coming across the pass that are not religious at all. Labeling us as fanatics reveals how little you know of our culture.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin btw i respect reality, so before you argue with me the technicalities of tibetan history lets look at the current facts. under the Succession international Law of the UN tibet is recognized as a part of China. so CHina has the backings of UN law and 192 counties of UN all recognize tibet being a part of CHina. so tibet under internaional law its illegal to have de jure independance, and China has total control as aways in tibet so it cant have de facto independance.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue This is all due to the fact that the International community is in debt to the Chinese. It's that simple. One doesn't have to look to far back the moments when countries freely admitted that Tibet was an occupied country. If China "always" had total control then there'd be no issue. It's that simple. We would have always known it. If China always had control then by default they're the ones who are responsible for the current screwed up situation. You can't have it both ways.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin tibet is under absolute Chinses soverignity since 1750 and no point in history tibet was recognized as independant. so where did you get the stupid idea? btw you want to talk about now? well let me tell you, tibet is recognized as part of China by the League of Nations(before 1945 when China was weak) and when the UN established after WW2 tibet was also recognized by All members of UN when CHina was weak and in civil war. so the argument of the world bowing to Chinese economy is WRONG
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue I don't know where you come up with this crap but you hold the party line and are a good sheep. The CCP did there job well with you. By the way the US congress recognized Tibet as an occupied country on more than one occasion. When Tibet was invaded the world was a bit involved with other matters is you know your history. Also, the US being a Christian based nation had litte motivation to help a Buddhist based state. Wait until it's your turn and we'll see how you feel.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin LOL you care what US congress say when they are the ones who has been occupying the land of native americans and commiting culture genocide to the point of native American Indian language is all but dead? dont you think US congrees is not in the position to judge?? GET THIS FACT INTO YOUR SHIT HEAD- Chinese soverngity in tibet is protected by international law and PLA so dont fuk with us or we will flantten the himalayas
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue I don't care, since you referred to it & to others I used your own rational to invalidate your silly position. Don't fuck with you? You are nothing. You are completely and totally meaningless in the larger picture & even in the smaller picture. Your own insecurities are now being revealed in your postings. Who gives a crap about the PLA? They are nothing, insects, lower than the lowest criminal on the planet. In fact, a plague on the planet like the worst cancer known to man.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin LOL you are the retard who are incapable to understand English language. i said EVEN wikipedia can prove your version of "history" wrong. i said EVEN. what kind of retard are you to not understand this simple expression? btw as i said dont argue historical technicalities with me its a fact that tibet was in the past 800 years were NEVER recognized by anyform of internationally approved law that its indenpendant country. get this simple fact into your shit head then you will understand
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue I was being serious. You may have a learning disability or something. To think you know Tibet better than someone who lived there most of their life and who's family dates back in Tibet hundreds of years is plain silly. Like we don't don't our own country. Under international law recognition can be impicit or explicit. Learn something about us. We had been a isolated state for centuries. Prior to the invasion most Chinese couldn't tell you anything about Tibet.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin first of all you are not tibetan so stop lying, second of all China has legal rights and and the ablilities to keep tibet from ever go independance, these are simple facts learn it and respect it ok?
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue I am Tibetan and certainly not Chinese. Never have been never will be. Respect invasion and occupation? I think not!
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin STOP LYING the international community Changed the status of taiwan(ROC) in the international law. after daLie lama escaped to india after the failed violent uprise, then he imediatly went to on the international scene and recieved alot of attention BUT not a single government changed their view on tibet, the UN also NEVER changed the international law according to tibet. eventhough back in the 50s China was at war with USA and 16 UN memeber states. SO YOUR ARGUMENT DONT STAND
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue What would you expect them to do? I don't think so. As I said the US declared Tibet an occupied country on more than one occasion. think you need to review your history again. The world was a bit distracted in 1949 - 1950 not to mention that few outsiders knew anything about Tibet. The Chinese had been making claims about Tiibet for years. While others including Cihna wanted to use Tibet to transport supplies through in WW II , Tibet remained neutral and would not allow it.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin no USA NEVER decleared tibet as an independant state, infact NOt a single country has EVER recognized tibet as independent under any form of muilti-national approved law. SO STOP LYING.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue During four U.N. General Assembly debates on Tibet (1959, 1960, 1961, & 1965), many countries (e.g., Philippines, Nicaragua, Thailand. United States, Ireland) openly stated that Tibet was an independent country illegally occupied by China.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue 28th October 1991, US Congress under a Foreign Authorization Act passed a resolution wherein they recognized "Tibet, including those areas incorporated into the Chinese provinces of Sichuan, Yunnan, Gansu and Qinghai, AN OCCUPIED COUNTRY under the established principal of international law". The resolution further stated that Tibet's true representative are the Dalai Lama and the Tibetan Government in exile as recognized by the Tibetan people.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin congress of USA has NOT a single right to speak on the matter their decision was forced through by daLie lama cult member like nancy pelosi. they are nothing but a bunch of old pricks who has nothing todo so they decided to annoy China. not a single formally recognized international or any law of any country do they suggest tibet was ever recognized as independent. also openly state=/=recognized by any for of legitmate law so they only count as political rhetoric duting the cold war.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue So now you realize you've lost the angument so you bow out and say the US has no right to speak on the matter? So about that you already committed yourself, real your own postings. Again, under international law recognition by other states is NOT necessary. We were an isolated country for many, many years, by choice and because of location. I contradicted your position with facts and now you come up with some lame rationalization. You can't win we have truth on our side.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin all im saying is that any statement made without any form of recognized law is political rhetorics and it has NOTHING to do with the history or the cunrrent status of tibet. if USA and China were close allies then US congress will never talk of such rhetoric. is that simple enough for you?
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue I know what you're saying and you're back peddling. Is that simple enough fo you? Read your own postings. Listen today is today, tomorrow is another day. Tibet once conquered ancient capital of China. Do you deny that as well? Things change, China will implode. It's just a matter of time. CCP is so nervous about he protests spreading across the Middle East, because they fear that people they're oppressing, brainwashing & oppressing will stand up and demand their freedom as well.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin due tto your ilogical political views i do not trust your political prediction for China. so dont even try and make youslef look like a retarded clown. in your pathetic attempts you still havent answered me on why there is NOT a single formal law of any country that actually recognize tibet as a independent country with support of historians. in your entire days of research you were only able to find Cold War political rhetorics so pathetic.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@iamlumin if you think so many countries SO CALLED "recognize" tibet as independent then how come NOT a single country was willing or let alone able to pass an internationally recognized law that say tibet is an independent country?BECAUSE all of the empty talk done by small percentage of countries are CALLED POLITICAL RHETORICS it has NOTHING todo with tibet, its a game of politics. after all countries like Kosovo was made independent by international law,why not tibet? TIBET IS NOT INDEPEDENT
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue It is political. In these current times countries have massive debt and owe the Chinese billions and want to continue with getting money and importing cheap crap. As I said before, things change. Remember the Soviet Union? Gone!
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin USSR and CHina are different USSR was brought down by revolution, China is currently on the path of reform. politcally and economically, any politcal changes and reforms will be led and credited to CCP just like the reform and opening up of 1978 was credited to deng. but no matter what politcal system CHina under the guildance of CCP evolves into tibet will NEVER be independent because 100% of Chinese will NEVER support it.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Path of reform, economically. Tibetans still are blocked from speaking freely, practicing religion freely. Look around, there are enough videos online where you can see the oppress both subtle and overt. China doesn't have to support it. The masses have the power, they just don't know it yet and many in China have been brainwashed to believe misinformation about Tibet. Hell, most Chinese knew nothing about Tibet prior to invasion and now it's seen as a place to make money.
iamlumin 1 year ago
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@iamlumin due tto your ilogical political views i do not trust your political prediction for China. so dont even try and make youslef look like a retarded clown. in your pathetic attempts you still havent answered me on why there is NOT a single formal law of any country that actually recognize tibet as a independent country with support of historians. in your entire days of research you were only able to find Cold War political rhetorics so pathetic.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@iamlumin what evidence do you have to suggest CHinese are ignorant of tibetan history? just because many Chinese and foreigners believe a different version of tibetan history they are automatically "brainwahed". you dont even have a single piece of evidence to prove your version of history. I have proven my-tibet under no formally recognized law says its independent.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Thousands of postings by Chinese who almost always drift in to futile attacks and criticisms that make no sense at all. I have direct experience that many Chinese simply don't understand us, our culture or our history. The Chinese authorities by the way don't ask. They tell us we're happy. They tell us and others we're happy with the communist party. They don't bother asking us. They tell the world how we feel without even involving us. They lie excessively about the Dalai Lama.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin you are not tibetan so stop pretending tobe one, second of all the serfs and slaves which accounts for 80-95% of the tibetan population under the theocratic rule of daLie lama had an life expectancy of around 30 years old. so there are currently almost no peasants of the theocratic tibet society remembers the brutal daLie lama's iron fist. also dont be idiot and burst out usless bullshits bring some facts into the discussion, if this is standard of ur discussion then u can fukoff.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue My heart, my blood, my bones are Tibetan. You have been indoctrinated well. Now you're really off subject. Tibet wasn't perfect prior to the invasion but that doesn't matter not the least little bit. China was not and is not perfect and prior to 1950 it was horrid. This is about the invasion and occupation of a peaceful neighbor. The Chinese want our resources and have always wanted to get their hands on Tibet. The land, space, strategic military location, WATER, etc.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin well im tired of repeating myself that in the past 300 year history of international law and order not a single country has ever stated tibet as independent. and dispite the lies daLie lama spreads in the past 60 years NOT a single country has ever recognized tibet as independent. recognition of independence by int. law has happened to Kosovo and recently South Sudan, how come no law recognize tibet?because it has been in absolute part of China for 300 years.btw u r NOT a tibetan.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue I don't blame you but reapting oneself is what a person does when they've been successfully brainwashed and indoctrinated. Again, under International Law recognition by another state is not required. By the way, I am Tibetan, always have been and always will be. Part of China for 300 years? Please. There was a point when all Chinese were expelled from Tibet in the early 1900's. How can that happen if Tibet was under Chinese rule? Tibet was never ever really a part of China.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin let me make it clear i know you are not tibetan. the lamas and slave owners that enslaved 80-95% of the tibetan population did get away with not following ROC governent's orders in the 1910s but it was not recognized by either the internation community or the ROC so its an illegitimate separatist movement when China at the time was in crisis, so its illegitmate the fact that u cant provide a single evidence than a illegitmate separitst movement proves that im right.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Unbelievable! You're still going on with your lies and distortions and accusations?? Wow! You must have such a deep sense of guilt over what the Chinese have done to my sacred homeland and my people. We don't want to separate anyone. The Chinese separated us from our own country. Got away with it? They never took orders from the ROC or anyone else. They tried to give orders as they always wanted Tibet. In Tibet now we are like slaves but not back then this was not the case.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin proior to WW2 the Nazi part sent experditionary explorers to tibet and one of the thing they found is that they very admire the tibetan nobles, why? because they enslaved the majority of tibetan as serfs and slaves, and no one question their medieaval acts of crimes. they have wrote an artical for major media outlets in Nazi germany discribing tibetan aristocrates and slave owners as example for all pure German race, and the tibetan horsemen as example for the brutal SS Nazi guards
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue They wanted to take symbology that they knew had deep meaning and ancient roots. That was part and parcel to Hitler's plan to fool the International community. The fact is very few outsiders knew anything about Tibet. Our country was closed off. During WWII we refused to allow Tibet to be used to transport supplies across. The entire world was different back then. Some Chinese had to eat their dead children due to famines. My Mother never refused anyone food & we were poor.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin 1 you dont speak tibetan 2 you dont speak Chinese, all you can speak is english so stop lying you are not tibetan. human rights problem is irrilevant to the status of tibet. China needs stablilities to ensue economic development, atleast CHinese arnt dirt poor compared to democraric indians who had similar time of development as China but 3/4 of indians still live in poverty. also you blame China for Mao's mistake? even the CCP stiped Mao of his power in the Lu Shan conference.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue I left Tibet a long time ago my friend. Although I do still speak some Tibetan and you don't. MAO is worshipped by man sheep in China today. That's how dumb people are. Well ya, MAO was the leader at the time and took is stupid ideas to Tibet. By the way, MAO knew Tibet was independent state, he even said so. He liked the idea of having the land, space & strategic military location. In his old age MAO was having 15 year old Chinese girls give him tongue baths. He was a sick man.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin all i saw as english, admit it you are not tibetan =) neither CCP leaders nor chinese citizens care about Mao and his idiologies. that is why we are rich now because we abandon the empty promise of Mao just after his death. the only reason why Mao is loved by some is because he led an army that defeated many foreign powers, his economic incompetantness is widely criticized in China today. so no matter how much u curse Mao, i and most of Chinese dont really care.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Care about MAO are you joking? He's still revered by many Chinese. You must be joking. I know many Chinese people who still revere MAO. I don't care about MAO. I care about my country and if what happen to my country happened to yours you'd feel the same way. The fact that I've lived in exile for so long matters not. I still have man friends struggling to survive in Tibet. Rich! Are you kidding? There are still hundreds of millions of Chinese living below poverty level.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin only 20% Chinese are under the UN poverty line. compare other large developing countries like india 75%. only in 30 years china lifted more people out of poverty than the entire history of Mankind, China now is the world's 2nd largest consumer market, and the country with the largest middle class population, we are even the worlds largest car buyers, so yes we are getting richer and richer give China another 30 years we will be on top.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Above UN poverty line doesn't mean one is living well. Who cares about all these things you're talking about? I don't. China will be on top of what? You don't understand life. It still comes down to what you do individually and while China is obsessing with outer development they are not working on inner development. Some the most impoverished people I know are incredibly wealthy. It means nothing. Chinese haven't figured this out yet.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin quit changing the subject, where is your evidence that we are "raping tibetan land and its people" lol and where is your evidence to proof that you are a tibetan ? lol if you want to discuss the Chinese economic model vs a so called "free market economy" im happy to educat you in my channel but not here. so stay on topic and give me thos evidence LOL
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue I'm not changing anything. You simply are too ignorant to follow a consistent line. You don't understand. I'm not arguing. I know my country. I know my history of my country. I have direct experience and observation. Do you want some of my DNA? If I'm not careful friends of extended family could be harmed in Tibet. I don't know who you are. By the way. I don't have to prove anything to do. I'm quite comfortable in my own skin. My wife is Tibetan as well so live with it.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin there are not a single major monastaries destoryed AFTER the the culture revolutions, today most of tibetan monastaries are in good shape and in use, and according to Barry Sautman who has been to many of them says the monarstaries are respected and restored and full of tibetans who are studying religion.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Monasteries are only kept up for tourism dollars. There is only a small percentage of monks and nuns compared to the old days. Monks must go through forced re-education first. There's even laws made my atheist concerning reincarnation. Please. You are either really dumb, mentally disabled or like I said a pathological liar. BBC just gave a escorted tour last July, google it and learn how Tibetans are treated and controlled.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin 1 out of every 35 tibetans are a monk, how is that low, more tibetans have simply moved on from a religious live to a life where they can send their kids to good schools. and no it is prooven by many tibetan scholars such as Barry Sautman that any tibetan over 18 are allowed to be a monk but often they are younger. infact according to the sochlary paper of Sautman many local officals encourage tibetans to go into monarstaries and be a monk because then they dont have to take care of it
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Stop spreading lies. Barry Sautman is not Tibetan and can't speak for us. He makes one visit to a secondary school and writes a 4 pages article on how great things are. He knows nothing.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin lol when did i say he was tibetan does Barry souds like a tibetan name LOL, he was a scholar who has an authority in the history and current status of tibet, he traveled to many places in tibet, and his scholary works are dont independently and referencing more than 300 source of solid evidence. LOL he knows alot.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue I know you didn't say it. I'm saying it. You simply can't comprehend. He knows shit. He is not Tibetan. He has not experienced what we experienced and experience on a daily basis. A person can know a lot about things and still actually "know" nothing at all. The accumulation of false information may sound impressive but it is false nonetheless.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin it seems like NOT only barry sautman that have stated the brutal crimes of tibetan theocratic governent headed by daLie lama. its not only him any serious independent scholars all know that tibetans were inslaved by the daLie lama clique before 1950s. infact it was China land reforms and abolishment of slavery that convinced the Tibetan aristocrates and lamas to organize and rebelion in 1959.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Why do you continue on? It's like you have a mental problem. There is no Dalai Lama clique. It doesn't exist. You should be kissing the Dalai Lama's ass. If not for him many Tibetans would have changed and turned violent by now. Most of the people rebelling in front of the Potala where ordinary citizens from all over. You have a lot to learn. Tibetans in exile are welcome whether monks, nomads or whatever.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin lol my friend as ive said before the "tibetan government in exile" is the daLie lama clique where daLie lama has absolute control of every tibetan in india. lol you are the one who claimed tobe tibetan yet cant speak a word of it, im simply claiming to be an chinese who have been in tibet many times. the reason why ordinaty tibetans never rebel is because their lives were better under CHinese administration than the theocratic slavery of old tibet =)
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue First of all, I'm not your friend. There is no Dalia Lama clique. You're nuts! You have been successfully brainwashed. We don't rebel because it's not in our nature. We are a peaceful people. That can change.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Do you really want to continue to bring up irrelevant issues? Do you want to discuss how the Chinese treated their own people? Even today many are treated like animals, even worst. You can't speak your mind in China. You know it and so does everyone else. They can shut the internet down, block YouTube whenever they want. MAO was responsible for millions and millions of deaths of his own people. His stupid agricultural ideas were imposed on us & resulted in our first ever famine.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin 1 how is asking for evidence of legitimate independence of tibet irralivent?? 2 how is asking evidence to proof 80-95% of tibetans were not slaves under daLie lama's theocracy? even the Nazi party during the 1938 expidition to tibet was amazed on how obedient slaves and serfs can be. there was even a documentary filmed at that period showing starving tibetans slaves and serfs with chains on their neck and feet.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Chinese are raping our land and exploiting our people and homeland today. Chinese have purposely worked to make it looked like Tibet was always part of China. Changing street names false monuments, etc. Staving Tibetans in Chinese prisons today so you need not speak of yesterday. The Dalai Lama was a child when he arrived in Lhasa aside from that our country is none of Chinese business. I gave you evidence although no one need prove it to you. Who the hell are you? Nobody!
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin lol then why is daLie lama was the chairman of ethnic monorities congress of People's Republic of China. you acuse "Chinese raping your land and exploit your people" is there any evidence of this?? all i know tibetan students get extra points in university enrance exam, they also get prefered in many state jobs. its not our problem that most of tibetans choose to be monks and be poor economically so dont blame Han Chinese.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Dalai Lama was very trusting and was taken advantage of. You're fogetting how young he was and he was trying to save his country. What choice did he have? Tell me. We had a very small army, we were a non-violet society, we were focused on spiritual matters more than matters of the state. No one asked for what you're offering. We'd rather you simply pack up and leave Tibet. Trust me, the majority of Tibetans secretly feel this way but are afraid to speak out.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue You really don't understand Tibetans. We are not as obsessed with materialism as you are. We prefer our freedom, our rights, our traditions, our sacred land, etc. Of course, we want some modernization but on our own terms at our own pace. Not dicdated by the Chinese, who speak for us, tell us what we want, how we feel, etc. They are wrong. Tibetans are not happy under Chinese rule & never will be. Evidence of exploitation and raping of our land. You must be kidding? Unbelievable!
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin LOL just a day ago you BLAMED HAN CHINESE for not giving tibetans enough wealth and complaing how All the business in tibet is owned by Han Chinese and now you say u dont care about material wealth LOL you fucking little liar. again give me evidence of the alledge "raping of your land and people" then we will talk more =)
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue I'm not blaming Han Chinese for any of that. You are insane! I care about inner development along with external development. I care about balance. Do your own research. Mining is out of control and that's why so many flooding problems. Deforestation, diverting of revers, all this is damaging our environment. Hundreds of thousands of Tibetans have died as a result of the invasion and occupation.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin LOL Chinese government in the 12th 5 year plan is looking to reduce the rich and poor gap, its stated by Chinese primier Wen jiabao that the enemy of Chinese government is not anyother great powers but the tich and poor gap and social inequalities. those are his own words. 1 there are no forest in tibet 2 mining activities are not effect the tibetan environment in anyway it actually creats wealth in the region.3 we have not diverted any major rivers on tibet =) so stop lying
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Chinese government is largest criminal syndicate on the planet. You are either really stupid or you essentially a pathological liar. So it's not possible to continue with is futile conversation. In 1959, 25.2 million hectares of forest were found in Tibet, but in 1985 the Chinese had reduced forest-cover to 13.57 million hectares. Over 46 percent of Tibet’s forest has been destroyed and in some areas this figure is as high as 80 percent. Now go learn more about Tibet.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin LOL as i said the forest is not on the tibetan platau they are in other provinces of China NOT in the province of tibet, and it has absolutly no effect on the highland enviroment like tibet. so stop lying and get real =)
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Here's what you said, "1 there are no forest in tibet ". Next, Tibetan forest regions of Nyingtri, Gyalthang, and Drago were ravaged between 1965-1985 and a total of 18 million cubic meters of timber were transported to China. Since that period it's even worst. Much of the old growth forest are simply gone.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin actually ive been to Nyingtri very beutiful and full of trees. =) my friend dont use figures from anti-china websites like "tibetan environment watch" logging from tibet is the stupdest thing a company can do do you even know what the tibetan roads were like in the 1980s? even in the early 2000s me and my dad when entering tibet from SiChuan saw a family in a car fell down an 100 meter cliff. just transporting these woods out of tibet is a miracle let along saling them at a good pirce
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Please my friend. I have photos of trucks leaving for the mainland full of timber, not stop truck after truck. Hey you said there are no forest in Tibet. What happened? First you said you never said that. I copied your own post to prove you wrong. You are a liar! Perhaps pathological.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin again ive been to the places u accused of being logged and to me it was full of trees, i would rather tust my own eyes than a word from a stranger who cant even speak tibetan. =) lol
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Again, I have photo evidence. I trust my eyes, I have direct experience and direct observation of what has been done in my country. Come on. Lhasa looks like a Chinese city now. Trust me it will always be Tibetan to me. Notice our buildings, our language, our script, our traditions, all different than Chinese. Do you have any perception at all?
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin direct observations? LOL you just said u havent been in tibet for many years and know you claim direct observations?? you cant speak tibetan so stop trying to be one. oh im sorry that Chinese helped tibetans to build modern building so they can have a chance of normal live.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Unbelievable. You are obsessed. If you don't care and it doesn't matter to you why to you continue on wasting your time? I don't get it. You are insane! You can't speak for Tibetan and why so many Chinese think they know Tibet and Tibetan's bettter than Tibetans is beyond me. Chinese help get rid of Tibetan footprint in Tibet. That's all they're doing. Like after earthquake now they want to rename the town with a Chinese name. Why? Think about it.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin infact many Han Chinese and other ethnics of china like tibetan culture very much that is why we will NEVER let tibet be separated from its motherland. for the last 300 years history has prooved me right =)
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue I have picture that contradict your position on this as well. Han looking at passing Tibetans with distain and making fun of us. We have never been a part of China and never will be. China only holds Tibet by force. That's why marksman on temple rooftops,. Eveyone is so happy. That's why when you drive you are likely to pass hundres of military trucks, people so happy. You are in total denial.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin well you have been a part of China for the last 300 years and still is a part of China, what lunatic give u the idea of tibet is not a part of China? lol i can go to tibet without a visa with my People's Republic of China passport. =) my friend snap into reality =)
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue So in your twisted mind you know our country and history better than we do? What I really hope you get help. I mean that seriously. Exactly, Tibetans are treated like second class citizens in our own country. Reality changes on a moment to mement basis. Things are always changing. Take a good look at the news and you'll see what I mean.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin 1 you cant even speak tibetan so you arnt one stop lying =) 2 you have not a single piece of evicence that tibetans are discrinimated in the province of Tibet, infact the policies of the government prove me right and you wrong. tibetans dont have to follow the 1 child policy, tibetans get extra points in university entrance exam, if your house registertion is in tibet you also get a higher state funded pension than Han Chinese. so my friend stop lying =)
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue I have boat loads of evidence and it's amazing that I do because the Chinese authorities make it difficult to get video and photos out that make them look bad. I'm not your friend so stop saying that. We don't want these things you're offering. Who asked you? We'd rather you leave our country and let us be in peace. You are in denial and it's doubtful that there's any hope for you. Good luck with your delusional mind.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin oh do you my friend? do u have "boat loard of eivdence" LOL me too,=) my friend please stop lying you are NOT even close to counter my evidence, LOL
1 u claimed to be tibetan, which u obviously not u cant even speak tibetan
2 you claim to have "boat load of evidence" which u obviously do not have. cant see any =)
stop making youself look like an idiot. tibetans today have their religious freedom, as they have for the past 300 years that they have been a part of China=)
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue #1 - Yes after all these years I can speak some Tibetan and #2 there's tons of evidence available all over the web if you just look. People who have been tortured, video interviews done undercover, etc. You're the one who looks like an idiot. People all over the world support the Tibet issue & we are a small population of people. We have not been part of China for the last 300 years & if we were there would be no Tibet issue. Can't you see the missing logic behind your position?
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin so you claim with fake evidence done by actors and posted on anti-China websites. =) my friend you already lied being a tibetan dont lie anymore =)
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue I never said I take evidence from actors and posted on anti-China websites. I never lied about being Tibetan. You are a liar and everything that comes out of your mouth is a lie. If anyone disagrees with your position you follow the party line. You've been indoctrinated well. However, it seems you are not so comfortable afterall, for if you were so sure of your position you wouldn't spend your time posting nonsense. I'm not sure who you're trying to convince me or yourself.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin my white westerner friend ive already conviced you,=) no need to argue anymore, i will be looking forward to my tibetan trip =) of course with no visa need because i have an People's republic of China passport, see i was right after all =)
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue I'm neither white nor am I a westerner. You "think" you know someone you never meant and you couldn't be more wrong. Enjoy the effects that will eventually manifest for what you've been complicit in. I don't believe you're Chinese. I don't believe you're going to Tibet. You are simply an internet trroll and that's the end of it. That's the actual truth.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin 你一个西方鬼子有你妈个屄资格是我？use online translator want to know what i just said my western white friend who claims tobe tibetan but speak not a word of it =)
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue That's a very intelligent post. Not! I do speak more than a word but you don't so what's the point. I don't even believe you're Chinese. You used a translator to make your post in the first place. Sure when someone disagrees with you call them names, be critical but never look at the possiblity that you are stuck in your own fixed frame of mind rooted in brainwashing and years of repetitious indoctrination. 打漢語太久，并且他將聯繫藏語。
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin lol you acuse me of using translator when you r the idiot who clearly had the rediculously obvious translator gramma problems LOL what an retard =)
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue I didn't say I speak Chinese. Of course, you attack and accuse, exactly what scared little boys do when they no they have no leg to stand on. Good luck with your limited future and short life span.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin lol you got no comeback than derogative insults, =) you are so imature.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue
china had control over tibet before 1950 for 800 years? when and how? sorry for jumping in but i think its enough now
TheMightyGuri 1 year ago 2
@iamlumin again even daLie lama's clique accused China of killing 2 million tibetans(a figure that NOT A single historian or scholars agree). LOL so its no suprise that anti-china website claim we logged 2 million tibetan trees LOL. its very easy to fabricate figures but its no easy to deny the documentary filmed by Nazi officers in tibet showing slaves and serfs everywhere. =) so please stop lying and blam us han Chinese and the government =)
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue There's no such thing as a Dalai Lama clique, a Chinese invention like many other lies. Again, no one is blaming. Leave Tibet, no problem, gather your shit, take your tacky shops and stupid buildings, all your military vehicles and personnel, etc and go, do not hesitate. I never said China killed 2 million Tibetans so I don't know what websites you're talking about.. Sorry but someday you will have to accept the attrocities committed against my people and my sacred homeland.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin LOL yes i know you never said China killed 2 million tibetans BUT it was the "tibetan government i exile"(the daLie lama clique) made such statement. and it was clearly proven wrong and fabricated by many independent scholars. we have commited no atrocities aimed at tibetans, and we like tibet so we will not leave as other governments of china in the last 300 years has prooven we really like it here and not leaving =)
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue They neve rsaid 2 million so you are a liar. China is not leaving because of the resources. That's a fact. Chinese who stay too long will eventually get sick. It's already happening. Tibetan DNA is different and handles the altitude much better. You'll see. We're not going anywhere either. I'm teaching my grandchildren the truth and they will carry on long after I'm gone.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin lol im so sorry i was supposed to say 1.2 million, its the figur fabricated by the daLie lama clique in india, ive been to tibet and i have only felt out of breath for the first 15 minutes when i first set foot in tibet but after that it felt normal like anyother sacred land of China =)
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Give me a break. Thousands of monasteries destroyed, people forced to use ancient scriptures as toilet paper, tons of gold and silver statues taken to Beijing to be melted down and sold. The way are animals are treated now. The relocation of nomads, please the list is too long for YouTube.
iamlumin 1 year ago
@iamlumin if the so called truth is on your side then how come the international law NEVER agrees with you? after all it was through UN recognized law that South Sudan(the newest country in the world founded in 2011) was created, it was through UN security council discussion that the nation of Kosovo was created. these cases all have valid and truthful history to back its claims.
obsidianstatue 1 year ago
@obsidianstatue Many Chinese people are stuck in a delusional matrix. They will come to see the truth. Over the centuries when the world was working hard on outer development we were focused on inner development. There is common vision and uncommon vision. Many, many, many Tibetans have uncommon vision and they see the forest through the trees. The Chinese are stuck in obsessive attachment to materialism and the compulsive mantra of more, more, bigger, bigger, more, more, etc. It's a dead end.
iamlumin 1 year ago