AC Grayling: Religion is in its "Death Throes" - Part 2

[MrJohnnyrace]

Finally, religions are dying. The superstitous fools are laughed at. People are calling them out for the lies they tell.

[TheAliceShow]

Great interview. Thanks for posting!

[GVD108]

Im just wondering if anyone can tell me a universal deffinition for what is good and what is bad. If it is all subjective...then we get crazy people believing they are doing good. And if it is defined by trial and error...that still assumes that a "bad" result , like physical harm, is bad. And if it is based on motive, then poeple like Hitler had the moitve to create a better world. Good and bad need a standard. What is that standard? The majority? Cause..the majority goes back and f orth

[Sideways0J]

@GVD108

No, nobody can give you this standard. Including God. Why? Because you're still human, so it's going to be interpreted and enacted subjectively anyway. God does not solve this problem.

[GVD108]

Though this line of thought has some validity, it is in essence illogical. Your saying that a parent shouldn't tell their kids "don't touch fire, because it will burn you" because the kids will interpret that statement in their own way. Though it may take a while for a child to realize the statement, it doesn't make a parent stop giving a standard for what is right or wrong. Similarly, if God gives a standard, but people misinterpret it, it doesn't make having that standard less valid.

[Sideways0J]

@GVD108

Nice try, but no. God doesn't solve the problem because the "objecivity" or "universality" of the supposed standard can never be established.

[GVD108]

You set forth a tough question to answer. Unfortunatly this is not the right forum to do so; lack of space. In brief: The "unversality" of all theism is: We as humans are flawed BECAUSE of our subjectivity, where we put ourselves in the center. If we put an absolute authority in the center we can begin to make true advancement. This will not only help the self but also society. Unfortunatly, like you said, there will NEVER be universal agreement, otherwise we'd already be in heaven.

[wimsweden]

Thanks for uploading. :-)

[IAMtheNewWorldOrder]

I like the point he makes at the beginning, about how if you want to teach religion as science, put it with ALL the other fucking religious stories, then after that, say "Now here's what the scientists think."

But this is what the entire argument really comes down to: Would you rather believe something just because you WANT to believe it, or would you rather believe what the facts, statistics, and evidence indicate.

[GVD108]

Though there is a lot of sillyness in man's interpretation of religion. There is a lot of facts, statistics, and evidence for intelligent design. Like for example, the astrophysics percentage chance of life coming from matter, an explosion, or the other "scientific" therioes..is I believe the number was 10 to the 72nd. And any mathamation will tell you that anything bigger than 10 to the 42 is ....0 The example is if I set off a bomb in a junk yard...what is the chance a building will appear

[IAMtheNewWorldOrder]

What is the chance of you making the building with your mind?

[GVD108]

Your logic is unreasonable. If you stumble upon a watch in the street. You automatically assume that there was a watchmaker...everyone does. A single cell organism, and the universe as a whole is infinitly more complicated than a watch, yet you assume it happened by chance...and not by design. Say what you will about the illogic of man's interpretation of God's laws, but it is unreasonable and unscientific to assume something other than the obvious. That there is Intelligent Design.

[IAMtheNewWorldOrder]

I know what you are saying. Nature does function a lot like manmade machines.

The difference is, when I see the watch, I know that I can find a watchmaker and watch him build the watch with my own eyes. I can SEE the watch's creator. With nature, the only creator I see are clouds that bring rain, semen and eggs that bring reproduction, and the wombs & soil that incubate life. I do not see anything beyond that, so why should I even speculate, let alone believe in anything beyond that?

[GVD108]

Actually your point is correct. The only problem is that, a lot of scientists DO speculate by saying there is NOT a God as a definite, or speculating that there WAS a big bang. Instead, if science was really all about what they could see and test, they would say what you did..."we don't know" Another point is that just because we cant see something physically, doesn't mean there isn't logical evidence all around us for it. Example: gravity. Can't see it, but there is evidence for it.

[BoredToDistraction]

IAMtheNewWorldOrder's logic is not unreasonable. Your own understanding of the origin of the universe and of life is hundreds of years behind. Catching up would take a few hours of focused reading, if you value real knowledge/reality...

[IAMtheNewWorldOrder]

I wish our news was like this.

When you talk about something like climate change in America, it's simplified to "Well, the dems think it's happening, the republicans think it's a hoax."

Haha, yeah and fuck what the scientists say. As long as they can find one scientist who's skeptical of climate change, then they can have "both sides" of the argument, even though, as Grayling points out, the skeptic side of climate change in the scientific community represents 5%.

[DavidRandallCurtis]

Great post. 5* on both

[koren1124]

"Magic should be taught along side medicine" haha I love it. I'm going to have to use that one next time someone says intelligent design should be taught along evolution.

[mycatisamoron]

We've had Catholic and Protestant schools for several centuries and there is no evidence that it caused "divisions" or "sectarianism" here. Just because Islam and others don't integrate... maye we should just throw them out since they don't like it here.

[JoeyDiphard]

@ mycatisamoron

No "divisions or sectarianism"?

WANNA BET!?

"It forbids them the freedom and space to develop their own thinking and decide if they wish to sign up to the varied mumbo jumbo religions espouse."

"...the next generation could emerge more religious, more divided, more irrational than voters are now."

"...crippled by the stigma and idiocy which faith will impose on [the children]."

Read more:

tinyurl [dot] com/BanFaithSchools

[DeletedDelusion]

Thank you for sharing this.