How are these paper rolls created, or even the metal disk ones. I can imagine them being computer-generated these days .. but what about back in the 19th & early 20th century?
@Astraea52 a good description of the roll making process is at wurlitzer-rolls . c o m slash pdetails . h t m l
(remove spaces...)
Some piano rolls were recorded live with a machine marking which notes were played. Wurlitzer band organ master rolls were hand marked on a drafting table. The arranger marked out the measures of the tune, then filled in the notes he wanted. An assistant then punched out the holes. It was a labor intensive process...
You've got to watch out for the roll drifting one hole or more to the left or to the right - because that does happen. Some player pianos have a roll compensation mechanism that keeps the roll in the centre - otherwise it plays a semitone down or up. Does this organ have the same mechanism?
@erikals2 The flanges on Wurlitzer band organ roll frames seem to keep the paper pretty well centered. The only problems I've seen came from extremely old Wurlitzer rolls. The tracking adjustment on this organ is a manual thumb screw to shift the tracker bar a little bit.
Due to the position of the camera, I can't really see how many holes there are on the trackerbar. The only hole I recognise is the one that trips the snare drum.
@er10b From left to right, the scale is: Swell open (153 only) Bells on Piccolo/Violins on (153 only) General Cancel Shutoff Snare drum Trombone: G, C, D Bass: G, C, D Accompaniment: G, A, B, C, D, E, F, F#, G Melody: G, A, B, C, C#, D, E, F, F#, G, A, B, C, C#, D, E Trumpet: C, D, E, F, F#, G, A, B, C, C#, D, E, F, F#, G Bass drum & Cymbal Rewind 54 total holes
I occasionally see the far left hole on the trackerbar uncovered by the roll at the same time as the Shutoff or nickel trip. Is that so (on 153 organs only) the swell shutters open when the organ is not playing and close when it is?
@er10b My comment got formatted wrong. The first few holes are: 1. Swell open; 2. Bells on; 3. Piccolos on; 4. Cancel; 5. Shutoff; 6. Snare
The two holes you mention are likely "swell open" and "cancel." Cancel turns off any registers that aren't being held open. For example, at 1:54 just after the final chord, the coin trip hole appears. Then, at 1:59 the short Cancel hole appears in conjunction with the swell and piccolo registers. At 2:03, the cancel hole appears, turning off all registers.
@MrSciencetificsasuke it all has to do with air pressure. The long row of holes behind the roll have a significant amount of air pressure. If the air is allowed to escape it triggers a mechanism which controls the music that you hear. For example; if one of the holes was open on pipe note F for example; air pressure would escape; causing the valve to trip and let air through to the pipe that played the note F.
Hello, I am a great fan of the WurliTzer Line of carousel band organs. The band organ is the soul of a carousel. I have CDs of models 146 and 146A and enjoy them very much. Keep the spirit of the WurliTzer going!!!
In The Netherlands, the first song is called 'Tantes Blues'. It tells the sad story of tantes (aunty's) blouse that didn't survive the drycleaner's. ('Blues' and 'Blouse' are pronounced the same in Dutch).
In The Netherlands, the first song is called 'Tantes Blues'. It tells the sad story of tantes (aunty's) blouse that didn't survive the drycleaner's. ('Blues' and 'Blouse' are pronounced the same in Dutch).
Some player piano rolls were recorded from a keyboard. Band organ rolls, however, were arranged on a drafting board. The arranger hand drew the notes with pencil on a roll of heavy paper. These marks were then punched out by an assistant. This roll, containing only one tune, is called a master roll. Many Wurlitzer masters survived and are still used at the Herschell museum. The punch reads the master and perforates the proper hole. For each tune on a roll, the punch operator must change.masters.
(2) This roll, however, was copied from an existing 10-tune roll by a company in California. Their perforator reads the roll pneumatically much like this organ does. For each punch step, the roll being read moves forward a small amount.
Late in production, Wurlitzer issued rolls with 6 tunes rather than 10. This cut down arranging costs but the extra repeats made the tunes monotonous. 13284 was one such roll. When Play-Rite later recut these rolls, they combined two rolls to make a 12-tune roll.
In this case, tunes from 13284 were alternated with those from 13281 to make roll 13281-13284.
Wish you had shown the front of the organ, and be able to see the drums and cymbal play. The case looks different than a typical 146 model. The cymbal is in front of the bass drum, like the 153 and 165 models. Plays very nice!
Yes. The songs are listed in the upper right hand box by clicking 'More Info.' The tunes are "Chattanoogie Shoe Shine Boy," "The Billboard March," and "Hoop Dee Doo."
How are these paper rolls created, or even the metal disk ones. I can imagine them being computer-generated these days .. but what about back in the 19th & early 20th century?
Astraea52 6 months ago
@Astraea52 a good description of the roll making process is at wurlitzer-rolls . c o m slash pdetails . h t m l
(remove spaces...)
Some piano rolls were recorded live with a machine marking which notes were played. Wurlitzer band organ master rolls were hand marked on a drafting table. The arranger marked out the measures of the tune, then filled in the notes he wanted. An assistant then punched out the holes. It was a labor intensive process...
wurlitzer153duplex 6 months ago
@wurlitzer153duplex Thanks! As an engineer, I find these things fascinating, because they're like the precursors to the old computer cards!
Astraea52 6 months ago
You've got to watch out for the roll drifting one hole or more to the left or to the right - because that does happen. Some player pianos have a roll compensation mechanism that keeps the roll in the centre - otherwise it plays a semitone down or up. Does this organ have the same mechanism?
erikals2 8 months ago
@erikals2 The flanges on Wurlitzer band organ roll frames seem to keep the paper pretty well centered. The only problems I've seen came from extremely old Wurlitzer rolls. The tracking adjustment on this organ is a manual thumb screw to shift the tracker bar a little bit.
wurlitzer153duplex 8 months ago
Due to the position of the camera, I can't really see how many holes there are on the trackerbar. The only hole I recognise is the one that trips the snare drum.
Still trying to figure out the rest...
er10b 8 months ago
wurlitzer153duplex 8 months ago
@wurlitzer153duplex thanks for the info.
I occasionally see the far left hole on the trackerbar uncovered by the roll at the same time as the Shutoff or nickel trip. Is that so (on 153 organs only) the swell shutters open when the organ is not playing and close when it is?
er10b 8 months ago
@er10b My comment got formatted wrong. The first few holes are: 1. Swell open; 2. Bells on; 3. Piccolos on; 4. Cancel; 5. Shutoff; 6. Snare
The two holes you mention are likely "swell open" and "cancel." Cancel turns off any registers that aren't being held open. For example, at 1:54 just after the final chord, the coin trip hole appears. Then, at 1:59 the short Cancel hole appears in conjunction with the swell and piccolo registers. At 2:03, the cancel hole appears, turning off all registers.
wurlitzer153duplex 8 months ago
@wurlitzer153duplex thanks for the info.
I'm assuming the shutoff hole is the coin trip as well?
er10b 8 months ago
@er10b Yes, shutoff, nickel trip, etc. are the same hole.
wurlitzer153duplex 8 months ago
A very fine sounding organ!
koasterkav 8 months ago
i am making something like that from scratch
so i was wondering how does the scroll trigger the instruments?
MrSciencetificsasuke 1 year ago
@MrSciencetificsasuke it all has to do with air pressure. The long row of holes behind the roll have a significant amount of air pressure. If the air is allowed to escape it triggers a mechanism which controls the music that you hear. For example; if one of the holes was open on pipe note F for example; air pressure would escape; causing the valve to trip and let air through to the pipe that played the note F.
erikals2 9 months ago
@erikals2 thanks
MrSciencetificsasuke 8 months ago
Hello, I am a great fan of the WurliTzer Line of carousel band organs. The band organ is the soul of a carousel. I have CDs of models 146 and 146A and enjoy them very much. Keep the spirit of the WurliTzer going!!!
oldbear52 1 year ago
In The Netherlands, the first song is called 'Tantes Blues'. It tells the sad story of tantes (aunty's) blouse that didn't survive the drycleaner's. ('Blues' and 'Blouse' are pronounced the same in Dutch).
Porkolty 1 year ago
In The Netherlands, the first song is called 'Tantes Blues'. It tells the sad story of tantes (aunty's) blouse that didn't survive the drycleaner's. ('Blues' and 'Blouse' are pronounced the same in Dutch).
Porkolty 1 year ago
How do you punch rolls? is there a keyboard??
anglerfly 1 year ago
Some player piano rolls were recorded from a keyboard. Band organ rolls, however, were arranged on a drafting board. The arranger hand drew the notes with pencil on a roll of heavy paper. These marks were then punched out by an assistant. This roll, containing only one tune, is called a master roll. Many Wurlitzer masters survived and are still used at the Herschell museum. The punch reads the master and perforates the proper hole. For each tune on a roll, the punch operator must change.masters.
wurlitzer153duplex 1 year ago
(2) This roll, however, was copied from an existing 10-tune roll by a company in California. Their perforator reads the roll pneumatically much like this organ does. For each punch step, the roll being read moves forward a small amount.
wurlitzer153duplex 1 year ago
13284 is the roll
anglerfly 1 year ago
Late in production, Wurlitzer issued rolls with 6 tunes rather than 10. This cut down arranging costs but the extra repeats made the tunes monotonous. 13284 was one such roll. When Play-Rite later recut these rolls, they combined two rolls to make a 12-tune roll.
In this case, tunes from 13284 were alternated with those from 13281 to make roll 13281-13284.
wurlitzer153duplex 1 year ago
Wish you had shown the front of the organ, and be able to see the drums and cymbal play. The case looks different than a typical 146 model. The cymbal is in front of the bass drum, like the 153 and 165 models. Plays very nice!
koasterkav 2 years ago
I know one of the songs is Hoop Dee Doo
mariosupersluggers98 3 years ago
Yes. The songs are listed in the upper right hand box by clicking 'More Info.' The tunes are "Chattanoogie Shoe Shine Boy," "The Billboard March," and "Hoop Dee Doo."
wurlitzer153duplex 3 years ago
How do the factorys make rolls? Where do you buy them?
anglerfly 1 year ago
Very nice and I like the fact that you played a few songs
wurly164 3 years ago
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yes 13284 is the roll
anglerfly 1 year ago