Potassium Perchlorate

[26chimica26]

why you do not sell chemicels??

i need of it!

where i can buy it??

[26chimica26]

hi, i need of potassium perchlorate, how much cost?

i can have it from you?

[ytmachx]

@26chimica26 I do not sell chemicals.

[MJJProductions1724]

Your my idol

[ytmachx]

@MJJProductions1724 Aawwh shucks, thanks!

[Baspwnzz12]

Hello,

what kind of Mixed Metal Oxides Do i need MMO,

With titanium on it for Potassium Chlorate ?"

Nice video btw

[ytmachx]

@Baspwnzz12 Thanks! An MMO anode and a stainless steel cathode will work fine for the direct conversion.

[MsChriss080]

which material is the electrodes?

[ytmachx]

@MsChriss080 Platinum (+)anode and stainless steel (-)cathode.

[demnlordd666]

wow, nice. so your electrode is Nb w/ Pt coating, is this a common type? every time I go on ebay they have neither MMO or Pt regardless of base metal choice. how hard is it to plate out Pt? I have scrap from a pacemaker's electrodes(gotta love ebay) and 6' or so section of high purity Nb wire, I also have a fair amount of Ti wire if that is preferable/easier. just curious if it was something I could try at home b/c its just laying around, I collect metals. would ~10g Pt work for a few?

[RatkoUSA]

Damn dude, you have the industrial production sized glassware!

[karatefreak97]

How do i know when my electrolysis is ready?

[ytmachx]

@karatefreak97 It all depends on the amount of chloride, the overall electrolysis quality and amount of wattage dissipated through the electrolyte.

[karatefreak97]

How do I know when my electrolysis is ready?

[BMan0815]

I think you only produce KClO3 with this electrolysis. KClO3 form these flat crystals KClO4 crystals has another shape. The normal procedure is to use a chloride free ClO3 solution and make a electrolyse of the cold solution. Low chloride concentrations will eat the Pt from the elecrode. Only chloride free solutions will form perchlorate without harm the elecrode.

[ytmachx]

@BMan0815 This electrolysis was mostly KCIO3. I have another video where mostly KCIO4 is metathesized. Watch my video "KCLO4(Potassium Perchlorate)" You will see that it indeed works just fine.

[karatefreak97]

Is it only covered with platinum cause at it's size i thaught it was more expensive?? (if there are mistakes of grammar or spelling sorry but i'm german ) :)

[ytmachx]

@karatefreak97 Yes, the electrode material is actually Niobium metal covered with a thin layer of platinum.

[karatefreak97]

*anode ;)

[ytmachx]

@karatefreak97  $135

[karatefreak97]

How much is a platinum kathode??

[Mr9ttt9]

Hey ytmachx i watched all of your electrolysis videos and they are brilliant !

But i have one question, i red that the Platin Anode corrode if you electrolys directly from Sodiumchlorid to Sodiumperchlorat ? Why yours not?

[BigBananaMan]

I'm just a curious layman, not a student or anything so correct me if I'm wrong. I notice that NaOCl is a byproduct because of the NaOH coming off the cathode if I'm not mistaken. When you boil it, the NaOCl breaks down into NaCl and NaCLO3 correct? I know NaClO3 and NaCl can just be washed from KClO4 with H2O but would it make sense to run the solution through electrolysis again to recycle that NaCl and NaClO3 into more NaCLO4 to reduce waste?

[ytmachx]

@BigBananaMan Yes,It is common practice to recycle the used electrolyte.

[rysn09]

yeah it says "Made in Germany" :)

[Mrkaya1000]

What I always wanted to know is how much is the purity??

[ytmachx]

@Mrkaya1000 I really couldn't say for sure, but I would guess <70%

[drfatleg]

I always enjoy watching your videos. They are very entertaining.

I have a question for you.

Do you use a trap to protect your vaccuum from moisture and fumes?

I just got a nice vaccuum and want to make sure it lasts.

Please share details on what is needed.

The vaccuum has a some protection, but it might be smart to add a trap.

[ytmachx]

@drfatleg The vacuum pump is a diaphragm type which can handle the moisture going through, however, I do have a trap. The trap is a tall cylinder with the pump inlet at the top and suction inlet close to the bottom. Between the two of these, there are fine screens that suspend a drying agent. Sometimes there is so much moisture vapor that the drying agent becomes completely saturated, and comes out looking like Cream of Wheat.

[labchemo]

In Lithuania it cost 8 GB per kg, my friend is selling :)

[W4llyB4nger]

What's the name of the glassware you used for the cell? How much do they cost?

[ytmachx]

@W4llyB4nger It is called a "reaction vessel" They are fairly expensive, about $140 plus $100 for the reactor head,(lid), and $130 for the clamp that holds them together. Check Wilmad Lab Glass.

[mayday23500]

/watch?v=kp4BoEam3iY&feature=r­elated

HERE you said you boiled the electrolyte for 45Min and you told me 2hrs !!!!!!!!!!!!! are you kidding me here or what ?

[ytmachx]

@mayday23500 Sometimes more sometimes less. It doesn't really matter.

[mayday23500]

hello ,you did very good work here ..i hust wanna ask

is the boiling of electrolyte is enough to destroy chlorates .how long should take? and at which tempreture degree ?

and is it safe to add KCL the electrolyte after boiling?d

thanks in advance

[ytmachx]

@mayday23500 Thanks!

The boiling is to destroy hypochlorite~ not chlorate. You can see in the video that I do add the KCI after boiling. Boiling occurs at approx. 100*C

[mayday23500]

@ytmachx

welcome !!

for how long did you boil the electrolyte? and did you destroy the chlorates by acids liike HCL?1

thanks again :)

[ytmachx]

@mayday23500 I boiled for approx 2 hours. I did not destroy chlorates with acid. The video shows the entire process.

[labchemo]

I have potassium perchlorate at home :) if you need i can sell (only to EU) labchemo@gmail.com

[NOBOX7]

hey friend , your a very smart person , i have an idea, what if i added 1 cup salt and 1/4 cup naoh into a 1 liter carbon anode cell with a ss cathode, i will rapp thread around the carbon anodes to hold them to gether and to creat very small chlorine bubbles , i may varnish and sand them also to water proof them, then i will pump the chlorine threw the cell via air stone and a mini compressore to react the chlorine further. maybe then i could burn the remaining naoh out using aluminum cans ,

[ytmachx]

@NOBOX7 Thanks. They may work. I like the air stone idea but the chlorine may take it apart.

[NOBOX7]

@ytmachx i was thinking the same about the air stone, perhaps an elabrit gas cascade flow set up with the anode at the very bottom of the cell would be better, any way thanks for the input , i love your vids... could you make us some h2o2 with that chlorate cell you got there i tried to distil h2so4 using electrolysis , well i did some research to find out what i made

turns out so many factors come into play no single text described my conditions, but i do beleave i was maken h2o2

[nanus102000]

Is it ok to use a catalyst as a annode and katode

[elchobacabra]

Do you have a video of where you made these machines or where you bought them, Or even a way to make one yourself

[gogo311]

Doesn't the stainless steel get eaten by the HCl or chlorine?

[ytmachx]

@gogo311 It does, but it is protected by the negative charge. It will corrode almost instantly if the power supply is turned off while the electrode is in solution.

[gomez6325]

Hi, a question:

Can I make amonium perclorate with this steps changing the potassium chloride by amonium chloride?

Excellent video and excuse my english, is not good enough.

[ytmachx]

@gomez6325Thanks for your interest. Yes, you could but it would be unsafe. The formation of ammonium chlorate would be unavoidable using this process. Ammonium chlorate is dangerously unstable and explosive.

[gomez6325]

@ytmachx Hmmm....

And if I use sodium bisulfite to avoid the formation of the ammonium chlorate, could that make it safer, as I see in my table electrical potentials it should form acid sodium sulphate (NaHSO4), I'm using all my knowledges here, so i could be making a mistake.

Thanks for the quick answer.

[ytmachx]

@gomez6325 No, that's not going to work.

[gomez6325]

@ytmachx Thanks you anyway, do you another way to manufactrue it? If not i'll search another way, because here in Argentina is not sell (there is no factory) and buy in the exterior is not cheaper and the minimum buy is arround 30 Kg. If u want we can discuss this by MP Thank you again for the answers.

[46564364]

@gomez6325 it will work if you use sodium sulfite, another option is to destroy the chlorate using HCl an then raising the pH with sodium hydroxide

[pidr97]

do you think adding a bit of sodium fluoride to the electrolyte will increase the yield?

[ytmachx]

@pidr97 I don't really know.

[LeftCatcher]

KCL (Potassium cloride, potassium salt [NO salt]) and Nacl (Sodium Chloride, sodium salt [table salt]) can be found in big bags at Wall mart, K mart, Win dixie, Publix , Giant Eagle, Kroger, Cosco, Lowes, Home depot, etc.

they sell it as water softener

Dimond Crystal makes them.

[volatilesquid]

the problem is with this video is that most people watching this probably dont have the necessary equipment for electorlysis. could i possible make this stuff from potassium nitrate instead?

[ytmachx]

@volatilesquid No, that would not be a good starting material. You really don't need any special materials except for the KCL and carbon rod.

[volatilesquid]

@ytmachx that's the problem. i dont have pure KCl, only 66% KCl.

[ytmachx]

@volatilesquid Go ahead and use the 66%. You might end up with both NaCIO3 and KCIO3. The KCIO3 should fall out of solution and the NaCIO3 should stay in solution.

[volatilesquid]

@volatilesquid again, i don't have the proper equipment for electrolysis.

[luftwaffe1111]

How much chlorine gas is produced through electrolysis? Would a suitable way to neutralize the gas be to vent the gas into a solution of NaOH that is located outside of my house?

[ytmachx]

@luftwaffe1111 Venting this chlorine into a NaOH solution will completely neutralize the chlorine gas to the point were no chlorine odor will be detectable. The chlorine production is at its highest for the first day and a half, then it drops off considerably. If you then add more fresh KCL solution as the level drops,(as I do), then the chlorine production increases to a high level for a day or so. Even at this "high level" it is not a big deal.

[luftwaffe1111]

@ytmachx Thanks for the reply, I have another question to ask. For lack of a better option I am purchasing 2 smaller platinum anodes instead of 1 large one, would setting them up in parallel in the cell be a suitable option to maintain the same current density of a large one? My main concern is if the resistance of the solution would cause a harsh difference in current load if the anodes were of different distance from the cathode. My cell design is cathode centered with both anodes on opp sides

[shidoink]

And after you nix the KCl and NaClO3, all of the precipitate is KClO4?

[ytmachx]

@shidoink KCL is mixed with NaCLO4 producing KCLO4. The residual NaCL/KCL is washed away in the filtering and in the recrystallization.

[shidoink]

@ytmachx and, the sodium chloride/chlorate/perchlorate doesnt fall out of solution until it reaches perchlorate?

[ytmachx]

@shidoink It's an issue of solubility or relative solubility. Sodium compounds are far more soluble than potassium compounds. KCLO4 is practically insoluble in water- even hot water. NaCLO4 dissolves quite easily in water and, in fact, even at RT it doesn't precipitate. It is the metathesis to the K compound that causes the precipitation.

[shidoink]

@ytmachx sorry i misspoke. what i meant to ask is what is the precipitate after your electrolysis?

[ytmachx]

@shidoink If you are talking about the junk in the bottom of the cell when the electrolysis is done, it is calcium silicate,(anti-caking agent), and other impurities in the salt. This material is filtered out before metathesis and discarded.

[shidoink]

@ytmachx excellent, yes that is what i wanted to know. who needs teachers when you have youtube! and more specifically ytmachx!

[ytmachx]

@shidoink ThankYou!

[OneJibed]

potassium perchlorate sugar

[likmahchoda]

Is it possible to use Titanium nitride drill bits as anodes?

[ytmachx]

@likmahchoda No, I don't think so

[thecrazypoet]

you got a cool video here but only one problem with me i cant find no platinum

i can get stainless steel or even titanium wire but where can i get platinum and i mean cheap or free from something around the house

[ytmachx]

@thecrazypoet Platinum is over $1800/oz, it is not common. You're not going to find it in something around the house.

[thawdani]

wiat, you only used sodium chloride to get potassium chlorate? that does not make sense good sir.

[ytmachx]

@thawdani You must pay better attention and read the notes on the video screen. You could also read the video description. At 3:31 it says to "prepare a saturated solution of KCL"

The KCL solution and the NaCLO4 are then combined together at 4:30

The video clearly shows the metathesis to KCLO4 in its entirety. Please watch again.

[thawdani]

@ytmachx okay i did, yea i see ti now beacuse before i just skipped ahead to the good part :) and can you get potassium perchlorate with another humanly possible proses other then electrolysis? and i would love to know where did you get platinum electrodes.

[ytmachx]

@thawdani The anode is from Anomet. There are indeed other ways to make KCLO3/4 but I don't cover those.

Watch youtube.com/watch?v=kp4BoEam3i­Y&feature=player_detailpage#t=­48s

[Zanragnar]

@ytmachx Could you use the platinum stainless steel material from a stainless steel catalytic converter as an anode?

[ytmachx]

@Zanragnar I believe you will find that the platinum in a catalytic converter is applied to a ceramic honeycomb type material which is unusable for an anode. (I have opened several and they were all the same)

[Zanragnar]

@ytmachx This is not entirely correct. While most catalytic converters are ceramic material, a few of them are stainless steel sprayed with the platinum material, and wrapped in a spiral pattern. They use those because they heat up much faster, and are much more durable than the ceramic material. Only drawback is they are much harder to recycle. I know this, because I am in the recycling business. I see hundreds of catalytic converters a day.

[Zanragnar]

@ytmachx This is why I specified stainless steel as the catalytic substrate.

[ytmachx]

@Zanragnar The last cat converter I opened up was 17 years ago. I suggest that you try this stainless/platinum material and your discovery could be then be shared with everyone on Youtube. This would,IMO, be an excellent and worthwhile endeavor,possibly providing a much needed substitute for the very costly platinum electrodes that I use.

[Zanragnar]

@ytmachx I'll do that once I get a place set up to do this. I'll be sure to share the results. If you look into it, you'll notice there have been quite a few changes to catalytic converters in the last 17 years. They're always trying new stuff, and to be honest, it's made my job extremely hard noticing all the subtle differences. If the converter doesn't serve as a decent anode, I've also been looking into a way to extract the platinum group metals from the material, possibly using aqua regia.

[ytmachx]

@Zanragnar With platinum prices over $1800/oz that sounds like a good idea. Look at the videos on the indeedItdoes channel. This guy recovers precious metals from computers and other electronics using acids and other means.

[Zanragnar]

@ytmachx Thank you very much. I'll check that out. Always neat to find ways to recover stuff myself.

[ChemistryProduction]

Can I use 12 volts for electrolysis, or it is too much???

[ytmachx]

@ChemistryProduction You could try it but half that voltage is better.

[samanthms123]

one more question :P (i am really passionate about chemistry)

are there any substitutes to the Platinized Niobium Electrodes ?

[ytmachx]

@samanthms123 Yes, there are.

Carbon....MMO....

[samanthms123]

Can i use 12v 3Amps ? , cause I dont have a power supply that gives an output like yours... are there any conditions for electrolysis ? and isnt Sodium Perchlorate highly toxic ?

[rdpuddles]

First batch comming off thursday. can't wait!!!

[ytmachx]

@rdpuddles Excellent! .....(in the voice of Mr Burns)

[rdpuddles]

I see that you start with 4000Ml do you boil it down to 2000ml or are u getting a 2fer? My cell is a 2.2 l !also do u weigh out the klc or is that not inportant

[ytmachx]

@rdpuddles I run all 4 liters through the 3 liter cell in one run.

When preparing the electrolyte, I just dissolve as much as possible into the 4 liters of solution, which turns out to be 2.5-2.75 lbs of KCL.

[Sb01343]

Would I be able to make ammonium perchlorate if I just added ammonium nitrate instead of potassium chloride

[ytmachx]

@Sb01343 No, that won't work.

Making ammonium perchlorate is dangerous because ammonium chlorate is unstable.

[Sb01343]

Is the electrolysis of sodium chloride to sodium chlorate quicker and more easier than the electrolysis of potassium chloride to potassium chlorate

[ytmachx]

@Sb01343 No, it is more difficult and less rewarding.

[rdpuddles]

thax!



[rdpuddles]

can't find one!!!

[ytmachx]

@rdpuddlesTry: business and industrial/life sciences/laboratory glassware/ reaction vessel

[rdpuddles]

Where did you get that cell ? that is a bad boy!

[ytmachx]

@rdpuddles Ebay ,FTW

[Dornier335A]

Is it necessary to keep the solution warm during the entire electrolysis?

Or did you just heat it up to dissolve the salt?

[ytmachx]

@Dornier335A The solution stays warm because of the electrolysis current, the temperature also increases the conversion efficiency.

[9DragonMaster]

can you use platinized titanium mesh instead of mmo for potassium chlorate electroylsis instead of potassium perchlorate electroylsis?

[ytmachx]

@9DragonMaster Sure, that's sort of what I'm doing.

[efaigin]

i have a titanium MMO mash, could i use it as an anode with a stainless rod as a cathod? will it work as well as your setup ? and if not what other options do i have exept getting a pt clad nibium....

[efaigin]

i have a titanium MMO mash, could i use it as an anode with a stainless rod as a cathod? will it work as well as your setup ? and if not what other options do i have exept getting a pt clad nibium....

[tiagonyl]

@ytmachx thank's!



[9DragonMaster]

not that i would, but could you use sea water instead?

[ytmachx]

@9DragonMaster Yes, you can.

Sea water would not be as pure and not quite as saturated with salt.

[9DragonMaster]

if 10 years ago you told me that table salt could be turned into flash powder, I'd of called you a liar.

[ytmachx]

@9DragonMaster Yeah, chemistry is amazing

[tiagonyl]

thanks... here, in brazil, its so dificult to obtain patassium chloride, how may I crystalize with sodium chloride? or other? thanks

[ytmachx]

@tiagonyl You can't do a double displacement with sodium chloride in sodium chlorate. There is nothing to displace. Just process your electrolyte as sodium chlorate/perchlorate

[tiagonyl]

@ytmachx I'm using a 33 volt transformer, with a capacitor with the size of a "D" battery (it's wrote 09.86), four semikron ske95 -2.5/02- diodes, all this retired of an old printer... the elctrodes are Pb and stailess steel... it works well, but the supply gets very hot, and sometimes makes fumes... when I put the enlectrodes on the electrolyte, the voltage lowers estabilize on 13,5~14.. what's the problem? bad amps? electronics isn't my area haushausha! I know more of chemistry... thanks!!

[ytmachx]

@tiagonyl The transformer wattage is what you need to know. At the relatively high voltage of the transformer output, the solution current is much too high. If you lower the voltage to 6.5v under load I think you will be fine. The cap is very small and the diodes may not handle the current you're trying to run. Look at my MOT rewinding video.

[duschkabinenreiniger]

how pure is this? doesnt kclo3 also precipitate when cooled?

[ytmachx]

@duschkabinenreiniger I would guess that it is better than 70% and yes, some KCLO3 also precipitates.

[ytmachx]

Watch youtube.com/watch?v=PwewwZ9-2o­k

[tiagonyl]

does it work with carbon and stainless steel cell? thanks

[gogo311]

@tiagonyl Chlorine gas destroys the carbon.

[MortenFS95]

i know what this can be used for,, but what do YOU use it for????

[ytmachx]

@MortenFS95 I haven't used any except for the usual burn tests with sugar.

[JavAnarkoMet]

you have very inteesting experiments, ill subscribe

[ytmachx]

@JavAnarkoMet Thanks!

[chemicalwarfare224]

@ytmachx i see you like to work on a large scale :P

[megamarko94]

What about graphite and stainless steel

Or zinc

[ytmachx]

@megamarko94 Watch my "Potassium Chlorate Cell" video

[megamarko94]

Would 2 stainless stell electrodes work

[ytmachx]

@megamarko94 no

[JavAnarkoMet]

@megamarko94

cathode gets uglyly corroded and you get a red-brownish slurry thats stinks , totally nasty

[46564364]

will it work with a platinum coated titanium anode and a mmo covered titanium anode as a cathode?

[ytmachx]

@46564364 Yes, I think it might. I have never tried it though.

[46564364]

@ytmachx It worked!!

[theitalian556]

@46564364 I'm sure it will work

[rosejordan123]

what material/metal is the cathode made of?

[ytmachx]

@rosejordan123 Stainless steel

[giorulesallofu]

@ytmachx How can you tell when you have stopped producing sodium chlorate and started producing sodium perchlorate?

[ZnachiBeatBox95]

Can i use graphite anode...?

[ytmachx]

@ZnachiBeatBox95 Yes

[NiyoHn]

What is that electrolysis device called? I've been trying to find it

[ytmachx]

@arkfussion MMO

[ytmachx]

@arkfussion carbon rod

[TheHoboPyro]

@andrefer7 tes go to nurdrages video

[giorulesallofu]

@andrefer7 Yes you can! Boil the bleach down to 50%, create a saturated solution of potassium chloride, and mix the two in an ice bath! Be careful though! Cl gas is a terrible thing and chlorates HATE sulfur(because it contains H2SO4)

[spotlightman1234]

@giorulesallofu how does S contain Sulfuric acid? you sir/ma'am FAIL

[giorulesallofu]

@spotlightman1234 Most Sulfur that you can easily buy (think hardware/gardening store) will contain some small trace of sulfuric acid, this may be enough to set off the reaction. (Trust me I know) FAIL =P

[ytmachx]

@andrefer7 sodium chlorate

[bradder555]

I like your video

where did you get your anode from? you rinse with ice cold water in the buchner funnel?

[ytmachx]

@bradder555 Yes, ice cold water.

[bradder555]

@ytmachx do you do this at home? I like your collection of glassware, must have cost a fortune. Are you a chemist? Do you use the potassium chlorate as rocket fuel?

[ytmachx]

@bradder555 This is done on commercial property but I'm no chemist.

[bradder555]

where did you get your anode from?

[ytmachx]

@bradder555 ANOMET

[bradder555]

@ytmachx cool, thanks for the reply, platinum coated anything is way outside my budget range. I'm thinking of using Lead Dioxide from a car battery as the anode and using a stainless steel container as the cathode. I'm impressed with your 5v switched mode power-supply. I'm thinking of using a large 5V transformer and a couple of large bridge rectifiers (or a large rectifying diode). I'm thinking that would give pseudo-pulsed DC which would be beneficial due to less polarization?

[ytmachx]

@bradder555 Lead dioxide from a car battery rarely works. You'll have better luck with a carbon rod.If you use the transformer,then add a turn or two to the secondary to make 6 or 7 volts. The bridge will be fine or use two diodes on a center tapped secondary. An inductor and cap will smooth out the result. Don't forget the heat sink for the rectifier!

[bradder555]

@ytmachx Yeah, a heatsink is a good idea. I don't see the need to have clean DC as long as the peak voltage is above the reaction potentials. with halfwave rectification the current would run for only half the time, but then issues of polarization around the electrodes would be reduced. Do lead oxide electrodes from car batteries melt? I've heard that they do not perform well, but it would make sense that they would since the electrode comes from an electrochemical cell

[ytmachx]

@bradder555 Clean DC is more power per second/kwh when it comes to strictly polarized electrolysis.The nature of lead electrodes from car batteries is contamination to the point of ineffectiveness and the harvesting from the plates is difficult. The free chlorine in solution proves to be extremely corrosive and few materials work well for the process.

[Aranwu]

Would a power supply of 20 volts and 10 amp work for this process?

[ytmachx]

@Aranwu 20 volts is too much. !0 amps is good.

[Aranwu]

@ytmachx

Those were the maximum capacity of my power supply :)

If 20 volts is too much how much do you suggest I use?

[ytmachx]

@Aranwu What kind of power supply is it? Does it have a transformer or is it a switching power supply, like in a computer?

[Aranwu]

@ytmachx

Its a switching power supply

[ytmachx]

@Aranwu I suggest that you re wind a microwave oven transformer. I have a video showing how to do it.