2.3 - USSR Failure and Collapse (Commanding Heights Sample)

[jumpnjza2]

I miss the good old days when NATO was too shit scared to make moves because of the glorious SOVIET ARMY!

[mlk22771]

@jumpnjza2

When was NATO scared, when they toppled Mossadeq,Aliendez,Arbenz or when they invaded Korea,Angola,Vietnam ?

The SU was a a giant with feet of clay even hesitant to invade Afghanistan.

[SonicYouthXXX]

where can you find the full version?

[Dimitri0809]

Soviet union was not democratic.

[sebidelpi]

what fucking bullshit capitalist propaganda fuck youuuuuuuuu...the problem was not that the peoples didnt work,but the poor managment...the story of incative is a fucking propagandistic capitalist bulshit.what incentive do you have in capitalism when you work for nothing contribuing with your work only to the wealth of the owners???? if this is really the reason socialist economy didnt work this meen people are stil brainles monkeys living stil in the stupid ages,real evolution is stil to come

[madass888]

@sebidelpi

That's why al western Germans fled to the east. oh wait...

[Sexisttroll]

@sebidelpi what incentive? a raise! a promotion! more benefits! what do you have in the soviet union? a medal and a weekend in a dacha every year?

[ChannelingusIV]

The Soviet Union's lack of an efficient economic price system resulted in everything costing more and using more raw materials than in the US. Estimates by Russians themselves held that 1.5 time more materials and 2.4 times more energy to produce the same products as the US.......all because they had no efficient price signaling system to ration where resources went and their true value.

[exenrontexas]

At the first of this documentary they mention they key cause of the fall of the Soviets and that is the price of oil. Oil and natural gas was a Soviet gold mine. They had lots of it and exported it freely to Europe. When energy prices collapsed during Reagan, it cut the Soviets main supply of foreign currency. Reagan also dumped one and a half million American oil field workers into the unemployment line and caused a major economic catastrophe in Texas, LA and Oklahoma.

[musikant7]

Yavlinskii-urod

[JackB733]

I love how it's all bosses and bureacrats talking so much about how the USSR's economy and socialism was always doomed to fail. What brought about the drop and ultimate failure truthfully was revisionism, then idelogical weakness within the countries leadership. When the government got weak and dident do it's job well, so did the people. What else would they do?

This video is just the typical crap you see all the time in the west. Just because you hear it ever and over dosent make it true.

[FletchforFreedom]

De plane! De plane!

Say hello to Mr. Rourke while you're there on the island.

That communism was doomed to fail from the outset was the REASON for "revisioniosm" else it would have collapsed even sooner.

[kopiledon]

@JackB733 Just what i allways say... These people don't speak in russian, they speak english - why? So that american propaganda could be heard. And what people hear on television, they trust, no matter if its true or not...cause they don't know.

[RealQi]

Propaganda...

[billyysands]

go to the website! its still up this is amazing!

[Netevolution]

Deja vu?

[sherribailey75]

indeed indeed. what is it about russian people (and i am one) that we are so easily brainwashed and manipulated by a totalitarian leader? it will take many more years the shake this cow herd mentality that we've lived with for decades.

[hardwood007]

the soviets abolished the barbaric monarchy of the feudal czars but could not bring an end to the class-division between the peti-bourgeois and the proletarians. as karl marx tomb reads from my understanding....workers of the world unite!!!!!

[sanchozpipas]

you hit it right on the money. if all the workers of the world really knew what was going on, there would be world wide revolution i believe.

[billyysands]

when iwas a yong man a was a militant socialist its an ideology for the losers in society people who feel they will never make it

perhaps you are a loser perhpas you were brainwashed to think so

forget about socialism its a dead end it never works

try to be a success in life

you just might

you dont know if you dont try

[bntw82]

also look at todays wonderful capitalist Russia, the life expectancy has plummeted, a small few have become disgustingly wealthy, more than a few formerly "communist" officials, and the vast majority of people have been pushed in extreme poverty. I'm not fan of Soviet style authoritanism, and frankly I think Marxism-Leninism in general is a perversion of good socialist ideas, but lets acknowledge the end of the Soviet Union for what it was, the worst economic collapse in modern history.

[bntw82]

this is so clearly one sided and biased. Yes the Soviet economy was stagnant, but the idea that there were no incentives for better workers is silly and keep in mind during the Khruschev era in the 50s and 60s, the Soviet economy was growing at a rapid rate, (much faster than Americas) and the living standard had impoved dramatically over the Stalinist hellhole from only a few years before...

[jackson32]

What bunk. The soviet economy never got better, the store shelves were empty right until the end.

[KangaKucha]

Command economy is no good, what the USSR should hav done, and what Lenin was trying to do with his new economic plan, which Gorbachev also tried to do but at the same time reform the political system with diasterrous results (unlike China, who just reformed the economy), is create a Welfare economy like Sweden.

[jackson32]

Socialism reduces incentives to the extent it tries to make everyones income equal. Communism obliterates economic incentive. Both are against human nature and are destined to fail.

[ixFUhKTxURxGRL]

this is all true when living in a communist society, why would a person go through 10 years of medical school to become a doctor when he is going to make the same as a mine worker. They have no motivation because they wont see any results in the long run

[SSMMPPLLEE]

communism has never been tested properly. in russia it was corrupted

[unnamed00]

Where did you get that doctors made as much as mine workers?

[sean1980be]

So you become a doctor to make a lot of money? Gee, I hope you'll never get your degree then. Talking about motivation!

[ixFUhKTxURxGRL]

if in the united states a doctor was paid the same as a janitor, trust me there would be 90% less doctors

[TaffyAlpha]

I don't that would be a moral reason to become a doctor. Doctors don't become doctors simply to make money. They may as well become stock investors since that seems like an easier way to make money.

[Sleck06]

@ixFUhKTxURxGRL the point of socialism isn't to make all people have the exact same wage its to close the gross wealth gap between the rich and the poor in capitalist countries, that argument is completely juvenile warsaw pact countries did not have skill shortages as communist countries had an effective education system and many privileges came along with having a specialist job

[FletchforFreedom]

@Sleck06 That may be the point of SOME socialism - not necessarily all, though the point is moot since, of course, capitalism demonstrably makes everyone better off (which is why the US has the wealthiest "poor" in the world, living on average by many measures better than the middle class throughout Europe). The notion that the Warsaw Pact countiries had "an effective education system" doesn't bear scrutiny either.

[117wolf]

Wow you are very self-righteous to assume that your values alone should decide how people should act. News flash people care about themselves and not about others. If your aren't going to be rewarded for hard work then what's the point of doing it.

[billyysands]

people work to make money grow up

thats why socialism will nver work

your moral platitutes wont run a succesfull economy

long at your ireland sean

once it was the most backwards

nanion in the western world

in the 90s it became one of the most advanced

that was the free market NOT socialism

[ilshyf]

The demise of communism means that human being is too greedy to applicate the pure theory of peaceful sharing.

[117wolf]

True, and I'll be honest I care about me, my family and friends, and that's about it. I don't like the government telling me what to do and what I can and can't have. I like the freedom to make my own choices and the constant competition makes life interesting, and gives me better products all the time.

[illmatic77]

What the guy said about socialism creates lazy workers is a load of crap. In a free market Captalist system workers have no incent either because at the end of the month they're still going to receive the same crappy wage or salary. Their hard work only makes their bosses richer, not them.

[117wolf]

Actually there are incentives in a capitalist system. If you do your job well then you get a raise, a promotion, more benefits, company paid holiday. The boss should get rich because he founded the company, it's his/her companies they can do what they want. Don't like it work somewhere else.

[eaglepies]

He founded the company, but does his hard work go into keeping it afloat? Not in the same way the work of the lower workers does. Let's say you're on a production line, and you make 10 cars in one hour, each car sells for £1000, and you get paid £10/hour - is this fair?! I think not!!

[117wolf]

If the car sells for a $1000, the company didn't just make $1000 dollars. It has to pay the electric bill, the heating bill, the expense on the materials used to make the car, the cost to make and maintain the factory the car was made in, the worker who made the car, business income tax, property income tax, ship and handling, advertising, developing new product, it goes on. Many companies actually loss money when they sell the car at $1000 because it doesn't remake the cost to produce it.

[unnamed00]

"Actually there are incentives in a capitalist system. If you do your job well then you get a raise, a promotion, more benefits, company paid holiday. "

That is how it was in the USSR.

[eaglepies]

I disagree that there is no incentive in Capitalism - there is - but it's a selfish encouragement that leads to class alienation, as Marx said. Under socialism the main incentive is to better the country, and by doing so, improve your lives and those around you, as well as creating a classless society. Which incentive would you rather follow?

[117wolf]

Class discrimination is a social problem that happens allover the world regardless of economy style. I would rather follow capitalisms because that improves lives. I have access to the best healthcare the world has ever known in my capitalist society. For instance the state of Ohio has more MRI machines then all of Britain or France and it is a capitalist healthcare system unlike socialist ones in Europe

[eaglepies]

How many people have access to those machines though? In this country, Britain, I can be living on the streets with nothing more than what I'm wearing, walk into a hospital and get treated. Yes, I'll have to wait a few hours at most, but I'd rather have it like this than the private American system.

[117wolf]

You obviously have never studied the American health system. Under US federal law no one can be turned away from a hospital; and everyone receives the same level of care as anyone else. A homeless man can walk into an emergency room and within an hour have received the full gamut of diagnostic tests and access to the best doctors, be treated, feed and given information on homeless shelters by the time he leaves. The hospital then sends the bill to the US government who pays it

[unnamed00]

They will try to get rid of him any way they can, like dumping him to a lesser hospital.

[117wolf]

what are you on about? The hospital will keep him there until he is treated then send him off. Unless he's a truma case and they can't handle it. In which case he will be stabilized and will be sent to a better hospital, where he will stay until treated.

[unnamed00]

Ever heard of patient dumping?

wsws*.*org*/*articles*/*2001*/­*nov2001*/*dump-n07*.*shtml

[117wolf]

I work in a hospital, we only kick people out when a) they have nothing wrong and just want drugs or food b) when they disrupt safety and endanger other patients. The people being dumped just want drugs and food; there isn't anything wrong with them.

[unnamed00]

So, according to you, all those people being dumped are just bums looking for food and drugs?

[117wolf]

For the most part yes; I work in an inner city hospital ER department. The people we kick out (which is rare in of it self) usually have nothing wrong with them expect that they are drug addicts and want free drugs. We are a hospital not a drug councilor.

[unnamed00]

Who should I believe you or the report?

[117wolf]

You believe who you want to believe; I work in a hospital and have first hand unbiased knowledge of the subject, I know what is going on. I don't need a report from the liberal media using third hand information to tell me what I see every day.

[unnamed00]

Your knowledge is limited to one hospital and it is not unbiased.

[sean1980be]

Oh yeah, so you just 'dump' poor people because they want food? Gee I wonder how you sleep at night. Have fun in church this sunday, and especially -don't listen-.

[117wolf]

We are a for profit hospital not a charity. If some ass who is to lazy to go and get job comes in looking for free handouts ya we kick them out. There are seriously ill people who also have to get back to work that need help first. We also reinvest our profits into developing new treatments to market, which is a reason you won't die when you come into the hospital needing your gallbladder removed.

[billyysands]

you know people like you make the united states look downright evil

[billyysands]

the dutch have a totally private health system it provided quality health care to all at affordable pricesand covers the poor, its nt just communism/socialsim or predatory capitalism there are other models

[EmperorHarold]

The Northern European countries like Denmark and the Netherlands do appear to have it best.

[billyysands]

they do well a mix of capitalism and socialism

but they respect the market!

[Myndir]

Actually, contrary to what Yavlinksy says, there are three ways to motivate workers- with a better standard of living, with a gun, or an empty stomach. If starving to death is like being shot, then the modern globalised economy is similar to Stalinism.

Furthermore, the factory manager is talking about the abscence of labour competition in a socialist society: the same thing that Americans are so keen to preserve in the face of migrant labour.

[davycarton]

Every crook, spiv & leech has robbed the region of its natural assets. Now: homelessness, drugs, prostitution & gangsters everywhere. Yes, capitalism has helped the overweight men in Armani suits you interviewed. They blamed the collapse of the USSR on the lazy workers. There was a coup for God sake, and as Trotsky predicted when Stalin sold out, there would be a restoration of the old, stinking system of profit & exploitation!

[mistahtut]

Nonsense - Nobody argues that the collapse of the Soviet Union was a result of the innate shortcomings of Soviet workers. Rather, the system they lived under gave them absolutely no incentives - why work hard when you know you will always receive the same wage? What is the point of being a diligent worker if you know you and your family won't reap the benefits? A communist system can be sustained only by coercion - forcing people to work with the threat of violence.

[Myndir]

You seem to be equating capitalism with a piecemeal pay system. Almost all jobs in a modern society are based on a fixed wage, just as in the Soviet Union. What differs a society like the UK (where the rich often earn as much as 98 times the average salary) from the USSR (where the elite still had higher salaries) is a question of scale. Soviet communism wasn't pure communism- otherwise, it'd have been luck to get past the 1920s. :D

[goldenpanda]

there's nothing about state ownership that says you cannot be efficient. It is an ideological misconception often carried by the west. State ownership is like a corporation where every citizen holds stock. The important thing is the managerial system--and yes incentives can exist. How do people explain Soviet success from 1950-1980? You CAN have incentives under socialism.

[117wolf]

As the video series points out the Soviet Government greatly toyed with the numbers to make it show that they were progressing, when in fact they weren't. Every thing about state ownership means inefficiency and waste. The west for the longest time thought that state ownership was a great idea, until the companies started losing money on bad business practices.

[goldenpanda]

there you go distorting information to suit your own views. What he said was, "the budget deficit was covered only with the help of the oil price". When no shit if can charge higher price it's gonna help your deficit. Where's the "greatly toyed" in there?

Amtrak might have sucked compared to IBM, but having *nothing* sucks even more compared to Soviet SOE's.

[117wolf]

Here you're making my point. Prices are a way of coordinating knowledge, knowledge that is dispersed among market participants making it impossible to centralize. Because central planners could not know all the relevant information about what things should cost, they set prices arbitrarily, with no reference to reality of economic circumstances.

[goldenpanda]

The contribution of the private sector is that it's more nimble and is better at experimenting with new types of economic work. This is why Chinese economy is a mix between a nimble private sector, and increasingly efficient state sector in the capital intensive and technology intensive industries such as heavy machinery, aerospace, and defense. However all land remains owned by the state. It is a fundamental ideological difference which we still maintain.

[117wolf]

In China the government is perpetrating huge human rights violations its people. Why do you think that so many people are protesting it in the west? The Government is also censoring the press, the people's access to internet sites it deems bad, and right to from a political party that is the polar opposite of the current one.

[goldenpanda]

America does not want to understand different needs of other societies. In Iraq they shutdown all the state owned enterprises, insisting markets will take over. Markets did no such thing. People lost jobs. Country is a mess. But America will say "no regrets!"

[mistahtut]

The Soviet Union experienced growth in the 50's through 70's, but the standard of living was never anywhere near the western world, and growth slowed significantly in the 70's. And how do you explain the collapse of the 80's?  I never said the state shouldn't exist...I'm arguing against central planning of all economic activities. Also, how do you justify the horrendous human rights abuses that occurred earlier - the direct result of absolute government power.

[goldenpanda]

Hey India practices capitalism but it's poorer than Soviet Union ever was. The best evidence we have is before and after, rather than comparing across cultures. With regards to "horrendous human rights abuses", you know every society pays one price to get something else. In the USA they even have to restrict hate speech to get acceptable race relations. USA has to imprison a million people, to keep streets safe.

[117wolf]

Actually modern crime figures in the US indicate a fall in crime, and statistically slightly lower then the rate of many countries in the EU even lower outside of the western world. India practices democratic socialism, not democratic capitalism. In India the government is practically communist in its control of the economy and it shows. It can take years to get permission to open a shop so many don't.

[goldenpanda]

okay let's just call all the failed capitalist societies in easter europe, africa, latin america, any BUT democratic capitalism. Hey just define your idea as success, then you win every argument!

Hey how come you couldn't bring "democratic capitalism" to iraq, even with 120,000 M16's?

[117wolf]

Eastern Europe was communist it was known as the eastern block states. Africa was never capitalist as it was subject to European imperialism till the 1970's. Then many of the poorest nations in Africa became communist and got even poorer. Look at South Africa their economy is capitalist and there better off then the rest.

[unnamed00]

What are you talking about? Who got poorer? South Africa is the most modern and developed country in Africa, and has been so for a while. Your point is very weak.

[117wolf]

Look at the poorest nations in Africa; they all joined with the USSR when the proxy wars were going on. They all have some of the worst human rights abuses ever recorded, and when the USSR collapsed they lost almost all of their funding, and promptly proceeded into massive amounts of debt. South Africa on the other hand has a capitalist economy and they are the most advanced.

[unnamed00]

Worst human rights abuses? Prove your point.

Of course they lost funding and suffered - this is another example of how the breakup of the USSR was terrible.

What would happen to developing nations that lost funding from Western countries? South Africa is not a developing country like others in Africa. Why are you making it seem that South Africa is the only capitalist country on the continent?

[adi87tya]

South Africa is a developing nation...not by any means developed

[unnamed00]

I meant that compared to other African countries it is far ahead.

[Jaycephus01]

goldenpanda: "India practices capitalism but it's poorer than Soviet Union ever was..."

India hardly practices 'capitalism' and certainly not free-market capitalism. They have so many import controls and tariffs, along with a 'planned economy' mentality, that it is difficult to say they are any freer than the old Soviet Union. They are often stuck with 1950's tech in their factories due to the govt banning import of non-Indian tech, and it is almost impossible to start your own business.

[goldenpanda]

Soviet life was far from "horrendous", especially compared to the amoral mafia state it has become. On the other hand Soviet people lived with great pride about themselves, and had a purpose in the world. SU was culturally close to europe. By the 80's the west's material success stared at them in their faces. In the east China looked at success of Japan and other Asian tigers. In the end material comparisons buried the ideological energy which had driven both countries.

[117wolf]

China practices a completely different style economy then the Russians. The Chinese realized that governmental controls of the economy to the point where people didn't have much choice in perches wouldn't get to them to the level of the west. By any definition of communist China isn't it. They are very much socialist, the government welcomes companies but has high control over social life

[unnamed00]

What exactly do you mean by material success and material comparisons?

[goldenpanda]

Both countries had disillusioned populations that dreamed of instant material riches like their neighbors. China had one small but crucial difference. The Chinese people did not have a hostile attitude towards the state. We had a strong historical memory of the real accomplishment by CCP for Chinese society. Even Tiananmen in 89 did not end this attachment. CCP took the events at home and broad in stride, and seriously reinvented itself. Today CCP enjoys wide support in China.

[117wolf]

The difference between China and Russia is explained fully in the Commanding heights online series available at the PBS web page. The Chinese adapted the economy to embrace globalization and they are reaping the rewards. The Russians are still trying to revolutionize their approach to economics and are fighting any change at all which is what as gotten them to today.

[goldenpanda]

personally I think PBS is bunch of jingoistic bullshit hiding behind phony couture. Yeah everything that goes wrong is because people didn't listen to USA. USA messed up latin american economy so much, nobody listens anymore to yankees. Everyday they come to China with some phony smile "hey this is good for China!" while behind your back they glee about their own "superior sophistication". LOL Chinese have improved economies everywhere we touch in Africa.

[117wolf]

What you think and what it is are two separate things. PBS is renowned for its journalism integrity, as is the BBC. CCTV is renowned for being censored, under reporting and misleading the public on major news stories around the world. Are you talking about the Sudan, who is world renowned for mass genocide and not having an economy worth speaking of?

[goldenpanda]

If PBS knew anything about running economy they wouldn't be working as fakey journalists. lol. That's the problem of western media. People that lack the experience and judgement to do REAL WORK form all the public opinion. I'll take economic advice from CCTV anyday over PBS--even if the latter looks much better.

[117wolf]

The people who made this series and interviewed in it have more economic knowledge then you do. They interviewed world renowned economists, and until the end of the series only discus the history of economics which is undisputable fact. You can say all you want but fact is communist/socialist economy don't come close to the standard of living that capitalist do

[goldenpanda]

i tell you what. half of western economists are retards. Guess which half PBS picked?

Tell me one country your economists gave good advice, I'll give you five they fucked up. They can't think straight because they get confused by their own ideological agenda.

[117wolf]

The intelligent ones, such as the man in later half of series which I assume you haven't watched based on your misinformed opinion, whom is revolutionizing the poorest South American economies and causing them to grow at unprecedented rates. You name the five countries that we fucked up and I'll name you five countries that didn't implement our suggestions in the manner that we told them to.

[goldenpanda]

Hey I have suggestion for USA.

Stop racism.

Don't go blame me next race riot because you didn't listen to what I tell you.

[117wolf]

The US hasn't had a major race riot in decades. And racism in the US is at an all time low. The US has more cross race marriages then any other place on planet. Why would I blame some random person with a misinformed opinion on economics for a race riot? I have a suggestion for China, how about you stop abusing and raping Tibet.

[clintcarl]

Awesome Video

[TheManifesto]

Funny how they blame the lack of incentives on the Socialist system, when there is less incentive to work in Free Market Economy. That is the only argument the bourgeois have ever had against Socialism, and it is no doubt the most void one you can make coming from a system where 3% of the population owns 3% of the wealth.

[residentfan2]

Yes, as we can see in China, there is not room for economic growth in a market economy. Oh.. uh.. wait, okay, here: as we see in Vietnam there is no room fro economic growth in a market economy.

Wait a minute... uh...

Nevermind.

[vidhan349]

uh .. ya right .. Marxists are just stuck in a different time .. there is no bourgeois or proletariats anymore.

[Myndir]

There are, it's just that the bougeois won the class war (in the West at least). Marx's dialectian thesis was created in ignorance of the rise of the consumer and information revolutions of the 20th century.

What many people forget is that a lot of Deng's theory (which forms the basis of the modern PRC economy) is actually some pretty astute socialist thought. It really is "socialism with Chinese characteristics."

[goldenpanda]

I think that is a good insight. "Market socialism" to put simply means socialism using market mechanisms to achieve efficiency. Government even today have control over many aspects of the economy, but more in the form of a guiding hand that respects markets. In fact many highly competitive corporations such as Lenovo and Huawei, are government owned! The west hates that and keeps trashing them because it doesn't suit their ideology.

[goldenpanda]

The government guidance means several things

- it is necessary a company respects the public good. mafia behavior, illegal activity are strictly banned as communist times.

- the government will step in to compensate problems in market mechanism, such as speculation and other "tragedy of commons" behavior.

- difference from western rule of law is government is an organic participant in the economy, rather than as an abstract, dispassionate enforcer that loses touch with the people.

[residentfan2]

You're joking, right? I've been in China and I've seen organized crime there.

[eaglepies]

You're an idiot if you seriously think that. Look around you! Can't you see the clear class divisions in society? The top 10% of Americans control 60-70% of the wealth, there's a division for you.

[117wolf]

I see the division but I also the people who move beyond it. If you read Forbs Magazine fortune five hundred articles, you will see that many of those people who now control so much wealth arose from the bottom of society. They are also paying 90% of America's total taxes. After paying the taxes they then donate billions to fight AIDS/HIV, education, scholarships, they don't hoard it from the people like the few soviet who ran the country.

[unnamed00]

Typical anti-Soviet propaganda. They talk about the economic crisis of the mid 80s, but show footage of the empty shelves of the late 80's and early 90's (caused by perestroika).

[Myndir]

Empty shelves were not specific to any particular period. They were certainly present in the early 1970s, which was a good time to live in the Soviet Union; however, after glasnost, you didn't have to be in the USSR to know what it was like.

[unnamed00]

There could be empty shelves in any store anywhere, but I am talking about what they showed - almost all the shelves empty in a store.

[eaglepies]

It was an unnaccurate and exagerated depiction though. Yes, there were shortages, but it wasn't like that, people weren't starving. You saw what, three shots of stores? Can't make a proper judgement on the whole of the USSR from that.

[117wolf]

I actually know a man from the USSR; he's a close friend acutely. His family left the country as soon as they could without being shot as traitors, he couldn't speak his mind about the government without disappearing never to be heard from again. And the shortages were bad, but not bad enough that people were starving to death.

[unnamed00]

He probably also told you that the KGB were still following him.

[117wolf]

No he never said that, he will tell you that the one thing about the USSR is that if you kept quiet and didn't try to do anything, then you didn't live a bad life. But in the USSR you didn't have the opportunity to advance you situation in live.

[unnamed00]

So your only source is what someone supposedly said? Kept quiet as in what? They only went after those who actively tried to spread their anti-government thinking.

No opportunity to advance? Another stupid thing people who are anti-USSR like to say that is far from being true.

[117wolf]

He isn't my only resource just the one I referenced in that one post. And for your information the USSR went after everyone who didn't join the party. And the only people who advanced their position in life were upper level party members. Your average soviet could expect to live an uneventful life working in a factory making crap products.

[unnamed00]

You don't know what you are talking about. You never lived in the USSR and go by what some fools say. Just stop posting because you are making yourself look silly.

[117wolf]

I do know what I'm talking about, I have several college level history classes under my belt, all but one of them concerning this period in history. I didn't have to live in the USSR to know what it was like. I can read a history book, watch a documentary, and talk to the old Russians at the Orthodox Church

[unnamed00]

There is a difference between what they teach in schools and show on TV (in the US) and how it really was. This documentary is an example of that. Much of your knowledge about this is based on misconceptions, stereotypes, and old propaganda.

[nick8874]

Death to Communisum