Secret in the Dirt: Ben Hogan Move?

[dschultz6072]

mike, thank you so much for your information. just like you said on the other video, he didn't leave it all out there because it would be far too easy for anyone to learn how to do, and the man worked his ass off trying to learn it. god bless ben hogan and 5 lessons.

[acershund]

Sevam-- Thanks for being there. You have helped so many and are a pleasure to watch

[helenathena]

moe norman teaches his own technique .... its very different

[AWOLgolf]

I would give you $5 to let me watch you eat a hotdog.

[bushel1963]

sevam1 - Is your stance closed? Do you turn your right foot square to the target line rather than flared to the right? Does this help get the feeling of being secured to the ground and the torque sensation?

[pat52007]

Here's something I experimented with on the range today. When starting the downswing think of the arms as just falling or dropping. In other words the lower body should be leading/pulling the hands rather than the other way around...this swing thought will help prevent casting from the top...one of my swing faults...I was amazed at the results...

[Holiver31]

thats how its suppose to be

[bookgirlforlife]

Bingo, the body swings the arms!!!!!! Most people will never know this, count your self blessed

[jbadyna]

Hogan bend his left knee back more on the back swing. His left heel comes off the ground.

[derekradac27]

I don't understand which move you are doing is it when hogan would go from a cuped wrist to a bowed wrist??

[silgneb]

i wish these square heads would quit relating themselves to hogan no one is like hogan just like no one is like jones or nicklaus just leave it alone and play your own game

[rgmmiller93]

Great swing, and great instruction! Would it be ok if you looked at my swing and possibly give me some tips, cheers!

[fedorianko]

You have nice swing, but Hogan got better hips release, you are doing too much with the hands at the impact.

[sevam1]

Yes, I had to work very hard to square the club that day. It was very hard to do anything decent on that wet grass wearing loafers.

[seankgpga]

what's the point? Ben Hogan?

[jonesy369]

madboo21 and timlin0607: the title is "hogan move" not "hogan swing". What sevam1 has been talking about is the use of a pressured, corkscrewing, toes-up motion of the right foot on the back swing, which presets the downswing. AS I understand it anyway.

[badnewsyaota]

yeah right......

[timlin0607]

More like Nick Faldo move.

[sevam1]

Little bit weak like Faldo I guess because I was in dress style street shoes so no traction.

[txcanadian73]

15 yrs ago when I played everyday with this gentleman it was as reminiscant to Hogan as anything then or now. Much better than Jonathon Byrd todays "en vogue" comparison. This video does not do the man's swing justice. back before 460cc clubheads and balls that don't curve (true wound balls)he was in total command of his golf ball with the driver. a real treat to watch!!! JF

[sevam1]

And I remember trying to beat a guy who swung like Weiskopf, shot the 9 hole record at Florida Southern (28 I think?)and started one of our matches 7 under after 5 holes...So thanks for remembering...

MM

[freddycupples]

txcanadian suggests a question for you, which current pro most reminds you of Hogan? Some candidates might be Chad Campbell,Rod Pampling, Immleman. David Frost was a real Hogan devotee.

[sevam1]

I like what Campbell is doing and David Frost is one of the best I have seen. I will think about this more. I don't watch a lot of golf these days so I am not up on everyone out there.

[fnlost]

beautiful swing :)

[madboo21]

Hmmm... nice try, but definitley not Hogan's swing. You have a very similar "early" hip transition resembling that of Hogan's. His hips were already rotating toward the target, before he finished his backswing. If we look at your swing in slow-mo, you have more of a "kick-out". You also lack the classic club-head lag created by the tremedous rotation of the lower body as the upper stays back. Only Sergio has come close to duplicating this, but we can learn alot from Ben's swing.

[roryhie]

@madboo21 pls advise on my swing on youtube watch?v=RZHRKjmdo5Q

[wildbyname2]

lets not forget hogan had a lot of pronation in the left hand, wrist which helped him to keep the ball on clubface for longer, he had extremely supple hands to help him almost lay the club off to stop the dreaded quick hook

[Garnold54]

Good swing man, that does look like Bens

[BillKelly13]

Upper body too dominant,leads to a lot of pulls,hogans hip turn was far more powerful and in control.Looks like you can occasionally send it a long way out there.Develop a more hanging left hip at the top to improve your timing and consistency.But hold the pressure in the adductor muscles as you try to develop this.

[earthshine2k]

i'm no expert, but you have a little bit of a hang back move. hogan really chased through the ball down the line with the right side. looks like you hit it pretty good, though. i'd like to see a down the line view. but i'm sure you're on plane and all that jazz. good swing, just not hoganesque. of course, who is?

[MJkate]

Hey, this is a great golf swing. But how do you get the balls back. Do you dive in after them?? that would be kinda fun!!

[golffreak1969]

surprisingly good...

[McTerror1]

I think your lower body motion is very similar to Hogan's. Really getting the hips and legs to do provide more power is something I've not yet worked out in my swing but I see you've done a pretty good job of it.

[tomo123m]

wy wud u want a swing like hogans

[michaelschunke]

did u really ask that?

[averyhughes]

Why wouldn't you want a swing like Hogan's

[shortgamebull]

tomo123m u r a fuckwit for even saying that

[hunterismyboo15]

Ben Hogan in the 1960 us open hit 70 consecutive greens in regulation, needing a birdie on the island green 17th, his shot had to much spin, and spun back at the edge of the water. He had a famous witness, his playing partner was an amatuer named Jack Nicklaus.

[scrgolfer13]

why copy another persons swing which is built around his own physical limitations????

just swing the damn club and do it your way! stop faking it!

[aservat62]

In the words of the great Johnny Miller.."..if Hogan would see this swing, he'd turn on his grave"..it's more like a Moe Norman during a really bad cold day..bahahahahahahhaa

[robertonr]

not even close

[kennnmoran]

Follow Hogan, the idea is to follow only one, otherwise you started getting too complicated! Either Moe, Ben or Jack. Only one. Hogans book, the modern fundamentals is all you need, all you want, the other have either too much or not enough. I have the book and if I read it and play, I play well, the more I read it the better I play. End of story!

[ggsehp]

u idiot thats not even close to Hogan... hahahaa

XD

[kennnmoran]

Can I suggest you get a copy of Hogans book, The Modern Fundamentals, read that only. Do only what he says, no one else. Dont watch videos, learn from the book, test your swing by watchin your ball flight. Not trying to suck up to him here, but you improve only practing one swing, not comparing one against the other.

[sevam1]

5 Lessons, some time to practice and an understanding of the ball flight laws is all you need to build powerful repeating swing and I agree with your idea to concentrate on a core method, but there are other valuable, credible sources beyond "Hogans bible". But..if someone like Moe offered you some information could you really ignore it? Could you ignore Ken Venturi or say Peter Thomson?

[benhoganfan]

you sure that was Moe Norman who showed you Hogan's moves in the carpark or was it some drunk lol. No seriously that is quite a good swing but i watch both Hogan and Moe and you kind of look like a mix of them both

[sevam1]

Yep...It's a hybrid. Moe's footwork and flat abbreviated action, but with a way weaker grip and less drop in transition. The ball goes way farther with the weak grip. And Cheers.... Moe didn't drink, but I do so you just might have something there :)

[benhoganfan]

wow they are giving you some flak maybe you should have put your head on some of hogan's footage and posted that guess what they would still tell you it doesn't look like his swing fact is most of them could not even bust an egg

[sevam1]

It's sort of funny. Easy to criticize you know, but I expected that. Hogan fans are passionate and you can't blame them. He was the best. You can add to that those that just like to post comments whether informed or not. I'm going to leave all the comments up positive or negative, but thanks for your comment!

[benhoganfan]

I think its pretty good i can tell you can hit a ball properly the one difference i see is that your right shoulder works a little lower than his as you finish the backswing and makes you come a little under through the shot hogans right shoulder stays higher and allows him to rotate his shoulder more around through impact ( less reverse C ) If you rotated as much as he did with your position at the top you may hook the crap out of it

[durockhog]

Looks accurate. So what did Moe show you?

[sevam1]

A lot was divulged in 5 minutes. Mostly about feelings during the swing. Hogan and Moe are identical in more respects than are noted at first blush. Grip is different, but Moe could also play with a more conventional hold on the club and from a narrower stance, but truth be told he liked to be noticed. We talked about turning down and into the right leg, using the ground...swinging into the course not over it, that sort of stuff. It's quite easy actually.

MM

[9182736]

can you explain the moves more in detail?

[sevam1]

Imagine turning into and around the right foot on the backswing without losing your targetward pressure and tension in the left leg. To do it you must take a sufficiently wide stance and you must compress (ie get shorter on the backswing and into and through transition). Most golfers get taller (that is they stand up more going back). When they do this they lose tension instead of creating tension of the backwing. So they miss out on the energy that could have been stored. cont'd

[sevam1]

Moe didn't need a big swing to hit it far and ridiculously straight. Create angles with your backswing, deepen them through transition and make them disappear through impact. You do this with your feet. Your leverage comes from the ground you are standing on. That is why Moe said he swung into the golf course not over it. He used the ground for leaverage and it gave him remarkable stability.

[highballguru]

Thanks for sharing your valuable experience, how to create leverage from the ground? I have that problem, I invite you to comment on my swing.

BTW What is "deepen through transition and make them disappear through impact"?. is it lag?

[sevam1]

I am sure you are familiar with still shots of Hogan's swing and in particular the extreme angles that form between the left arm and the clubshaft.What is happening is the clubhead is still travelling on the backswing route when he initiates the forward swing.He starts back to the target before the backswing finishes and then this angle deepens because of inertia.Use the pause button to try to stop Hogan and similar swings on youtube at the top and you will see what I mean.

[PingManCrusher]

Ben Hogan swung COMPLETELY different. Ben Hogan used his body and his lats in order to create his power. Ben Hogan tightened up his lat and pulled the club with the left side of his body down into the ball and around to the left. Moe, on the other hand, Moe used his hands in order to create speed and precision. The swings are very different, and not identical in more aspects. It is a shame Ben Hogan has been compared to somebody who theoretically swinging in a completely OPPOSITE fashion.

[sevam1]

You are right to a degree but I believe you are also wrong.Hogan used his back muscles of course.You must have tension there when you swing a golf club unless you want to stink.Moe used his back muscles too and probably more than you realize.But ask yourself why Hogan wished he had 3 right hands. Venturi called Hogan a hands and hips player, and I think he knew what he was talking about.Not making the news here.Just reporting it the way Moe showed it to me.

[678180]

That action looks nothing like Hogan, natural golf chop. I have never met a natural golfer that could break an egg.

[sevam1]

Natural Golf? Are you sure? Better look again....You've got to hold the club like a hammer and sort of do a one plane number to make the Natural Golf thing work. I don't think that's what you're looking at here.

[sevam1]

Jack (8 in Nov) and Julia who just turned 5. Hope all is well with you.

Quit golf in 99 when Jack was born. Only play about 5 times a year at insurance company scrambles and such. Video happened cause a guy asked me to help with his swing. Went to his house on my lunch and started hitting balls. Showed him Moe's swing, Hogan, Trevino... He kind of flipped out and grabbed his video camera. I was trying to show him Hogan's leg action, swingplane and lag, etc.

[sevam1]

Yep.