Bob Avakian, "Imagine a new society," clip from Revolution, a film of a talk

[TheGoldenKing20]

Crazy commies, crazy commies, doing whatever crazy commies do, can they run a society? No they can't, they're fucking commies. Lookout, it's crazy commies!

[gatheringwithin]

You may say I am a dreamer but I am not the only one.. :)

[Tom27056]

"The role of the police is not to serve and protect the people. It is to serve and protect the system that rules over the people. To enforce the relations of exploitation and oppression, the conditions of poverty, misery and degradation into which the system has cast people and is determined to keep people in. The law and order the police are about, with all of their brutality and murder, is the law and order that enforces all this oppression and madness. " Bob Avakian

[BryantBergemann]

Cuz those countries wernt communist

[locksmithite]

You left wing communists can bash America and capitalism and lionize communism all you want. But think about this. If communism is so wonderful then why do communist nations never have a problem with foreigners trying to sneak in and why does America not have the problem of people trying to escape?

[azandhind4eva]

@locksmithite so many europeans/irish/british come settle down in the us.so many from india.all these countries aint communist,when theres a bubble & 14 tril economy ppl from all over,communist non communist come there 2 seek better life.many ppl cross the border from mexico.u might know that.it aint communist.u should know many expats are heading home.this will only speed up.there still time for economic collapse.ppl wait till they lose something 2 wake up.ppl r busy working now.

[azandhind4eva]

@azandhind4eva also ppl dont see,dont care about 5 10 15 20 yrs down the line.they care about how much money i can make today beleive tmorrow is the same.if it is they are happy & think thier entire life is gonna be like this.how long did this oppurtunkty last.10 yrs then a crisis,this crisis is bad.its not like 70's pr gr8 depression for ww2 to bail nation out.first take power back from the corrupt & rich then debate communism socialism or any other alternatives.

[dillinger9999]

The politicians are put there to give you the idea that you have freedom of choice ... you don't. You have no choice. You have owners. They own you. They own everything. They own all the important land. They own, and control the corporations. They've long since bought, and paid for the Senate, the Congress, the state houses, the city halls, they got the judges in their back pockets and they own all the big media companies. ~George Carlin~

[dillinger9999]

I have been working with the RCP since 1979 and I was working in the RCYB I was selling the RW before it was changed to "Revolution". The US GOV, fears this Party so much they had the LAPD DOGS Murder Domian Garcia in Pico Aliso projects in LA. it's all true and documented. I was and others were selling the RW with an undercover PIG who targeted Domian Garcia.

[fu66]

The invisible Money power is working to control and enslave mankind. It financed Communism, Fascism, Marxism, Nazism, Socialism, Zionism, Humanism, Fanatical Religions, Cults, wars and civil wars. All of these are directed to making the USA and the world members of a World Government.

[ProudBourgeoisie]

Oh, and one more thing. Most of your beloved "workers" aren't really intellectually equipped for directing things. If they were, they would find a way to the thinker class (managers, professionals, entrepreneurs, etc.).

There are of course, exceptions, like the great dockworker-philosopher, Eric Hoffer. If you haven't read his "True Believer: Thoughts on the nature of mass movements," you really should. There's more wisdom in that small book than in all of Avakian's victimology prattle.

[ProudBourgeoisie]

Imagine that I want to go to work? I do every day. IWork many more hours than I "have" to because I value what I do and the PROFIT I create.

And I'm quite well compensated of course. ;-)

I can't relate to this loser. But Marxism is really just a comprehensive justification system for losers, isn't it? It appeals to losers because it says "your problems aren't your own doing! It's the greedy capitalists! They're keeping you down!"

No one with any value could ever buy it, though.

[technatezin]

@ProudBourgeoisie Compensated for what? Nobody works harder than people dying or getting permanently maimed in mostly avoidable/unnecessary hard physical labor. Are you really that "hard working"? If your work is mentally important are you sure that you are that indispensable? Out of a world intellectual population of 6 billion human brains you have the one unique brain that can't be substituted by some ONE else or some GROUP else or some type of advanced technology? Maybe you should reconsider.

[scottistoxic]

Again: Leaving the bourgeoisie to interpret history and the rest of reality is a good way to make sure that you, and the world you live in, remain in darkness. People who aren't as *ahem* content with oppression and exploitation should check out the entire Avakian talk at revolutiontalk (dot) net.

[watchthemoviefitna]

American: The greatest country in the world and some people want to "seize power" in order to force it to conform to a new way for all because of problems. Yet, no one is brilliant enough to unite and try to coordinate solutions. In addition, they're fighting corruption with corruption. Dumbest bullshit I've ever hear of since I studied about Germany's new "seize power" by ... well ... nm. Been fun, peeps. You've got what you wanted. Enjoy your hunger - idiots.

[maladro1]

I can only say that he should take a trip, for like three years (and talk, live, and survive) to Cuba. He will change his mind? maybe, but otherwise the only thing I can say about this man is "he must be dreaming/is he for real?"

[scottistoxic]

@jcncnc Do you actually know anything about the history of China or the Soviet Union when they were socialist, or are you just paraphrasing Glenn Beck and every other bourgeois talking head? Imbecilic spouting of the wrong verdicts of the people who are currently plundering the world is going to lead us away from understanding how we're going to fix the world that they've fucked up so badly.

[bdj010]

@scottistoxic We know all about the history Soviet Union and China, and we got it from history books, documentaries, etc., not Fox News. You leftist loonbags always bring up Fox News to deflect from the facts. We all went to school, we all took history courses. The history of Communism can be studied at the library, online, etc. Heck, we seen news stories about North Korea and Cuba all of the time(and not just on Fox News). You are the one that needs to get out of the little box he is living in.

[ultromundoespossible]

@Chris polluck, you should check out the rest of this talk particularly Doesn't Communist equal totalitarianism? at revolutiontalk (dot) net. And to compare lenin, stalin and mao with Castro, Kim il sung shows how little you ( like the majority of people ) actually understand about the communist project because there are vast differences that people can see if they actually critically analyze this history. Most people have been lied to and locked out of understanding the communist project.

[Aleksi535]

And I don't like this sort of speeches behind a podium. What happens when the system does change. Will Bob just step down. Lenin and Stalin didn't! We need examples, not leaders. All Bob has to do, is to live a righteous life himself, and people will follow. Not follow him, but his ideals and in turn, be righteous themselves. That is the only way to change the world. There is no other way. He speaks many truths, bit I can't shake off the feeling, that he is only doing this so his party wins

[Aleksi535]

Bob says a lot of true things. They do happen. Happened to me in the hospital. But not all hospitals and doctor are that way. How will a change in government change this stuff. Gandhi didn't change any governments. He didn't even hate the British. He proposed logical solutions to the opposition and waited for their reaction. Meanwhile the people were listening. The moment, the opposition has turned down a logical and good change, that system destroys itself in the eyes of its people.

[Aleksi535]

Now, this could of been just one doctor, and we can't say that all doctors are like this or they are vicious capitalists. I am sure some of them are not, and they are compassionate. I have a history teacher who always says that change in government is just ceasing power and trade hands. Cease power or no, people will still be people. You can't cease power. It's an illusion. Here today, gone tomorrow. What we can do, is to go out there and set examples of good deeds and sacrifice.

[Aleksi535]

like i was a moron... He was like "what's the problem with your balls." And I was like excuse me!!! Now I know most people don't know much about gametogenesis, and meiosis, testicles and epididymis, but I felt he was looking down at me. Funny thing was that when he was trying to explain what a septated cyst was (I didn't ask and I just deduced what it was and I was right), he was like it's a desperate balloon. HAHAHAHAHAH... Cause we learned about fungal hyphae and some are septated

[Aleksi535]

Well, I don't believe in neither. No communism and no capitalism. However, what he says about the hospitals, well at least in my case has been somewhat true. When the doctor came to see me, and I went to get a testicle exam, because of an epididymal cyst, and the doctor was so rude. I believe it was because I didn't have insurance and I asked for an expensive test. After telling him that I was a biology student, and of course, I know biology and anatomy and so on, he was talking to me like...

[nero8289]

This guy is a joke. Communism has never worked,and will never work. It is a evil philosophy.

[RayG66]

@nero8289 If you actually watched the video, no way you can say that shit about a serious revolutionary leader. And if you want to go around name-calling a philosophy because you don't like it, just shows where you're at. But when someone lays out how socialism (the transition to communism) does work, and you want to make an argument, you gotta back your shit up.

[nero8289]

@RayG66 Socalism,communism,or fascism are evil because they sacrifice the individual for the collective.You end up not owning your life,but the collective owns you.

[ahhhhjjjj]

@nero8289 i disagree. under capitalism individuals own you. the heads of multi-national corporations own you and every meaningful institution in society. and fascism doesn't argue for a collective. fascists argue for capitalism in an economy. however they demand you conform to the government. or they else they kill or imprison you.

[TheAntiV]

@ahhhhjjjj

Actually farcists argue for the state. In fact Fascism just as against capitalism as is communism. Both lead to the destruction of the individual.

Another communist cultist doesn't know what he's talking about.

[ahhhhjjjj]

@TheAntiV Of course Fascists argue for the state. Who said they didn't? Not a communist cultist at all. And I know what Fascism is. No need for the condescending attitude.

[TheAntiV]

@ahhhhjjjj

If you don't want me to be condencending then don't say stupid shit like Fascists argue for capitalism.

[ahhhhjjjj]

@nero8289 not true. is it evil to want workers to have democratic control over the means of production? it is "evil" in my opinion to have 1% of the population controlling 80% of the wealth, to have a profit incentive in health care, to have situations like enron, to have the very structure of capitalism itself. that is evil.

[h82sk8]

Imagine if human nature was different? Imagine if there was enough gold for everyone to live in golden houses? Imagine if man could fly to any planet he wants by simply blinking his eyes? Imagine this idiot living in reality?

-

Communism and Socialism already exist on this planet! But, Only America has individual freedom and God given Rights. What communist nation do you want to follow? China, Cuba, Russia, Moldova, Ukraine?

-

Damn the Bankers and Merchants! Not Capitalism.

[RayG66]

@h82sk8 Human nature has been very different (you can watch the video "Isn't the problem human nature?") and can be radically different from how we have to act in this dog eat dog world. Watch this video to see a whole different way work and communities can be organized to enable people to emancipate themselves. Then make and argument against *that*.

[ahhhhjjjj]

@h82sk8 i disagree because bankers and merchants are the very nature of the capitalist system. and about "god given rights".....if they are intrinsic rights how can they be given? and america is not the only country to have that kind of freedom. however our freedom is very limited. its nothing to brag about. and about the "communist nation question" my answer is none. why do we need to follow those nations?

[RayG66]

This is a powerful excerpt imagining a whole other way people could organize society if they had state power. Damn he's got analysis and tremendous love for & confidence in the people; it shows that revolution had better be led by Bob Avakian! People gotta know we have this leadership.

Addressing the lies below: Yes, there IS a revolutionary movement right here & now, and everyone can find out about it and hook up with it at REVCOM[dot]US & spread this talk from FACEBOOK[dot]COM/REVOLUTIONTAL­K

[mclovin1234567890]

No Social classes wouldn't bother me. But #samson5791 is absolutely correct. Why should I have to be more productive then a neighbor who smokes crack and is lazy all day, and he still gets my paycheck. What would my motivation be? What would anyone's motivation be? It would be nothing. Everyone would slowly fail and production would decrease and before you know it the country will fall and it has been proven. AKA THE SOVIET UNION!

[ahhhhjjjj]

@mclovin1234567890 actually in marxist economics you are paid according to the labor you put out NOT by government handouts or wage labor. you have a very wrong and distorted view of socialist ideology. workers co-ops increase motivation. and that's not why the soviet union failed. they weren't communist. they were state capitalism with many socialist programs.

[mclovin1234567890]

Tell me again how communism is a "fair system" again? Why would I want the power in the Government instead of the people, which is the reason the RCP can do what they do. If it was communism you don't have a voice in the government. The RCP says you work with your community and get what you earn at the end. Biggest bullshit ever. The government selects what you do, and then takes your profits. You are then given what the government thinks you deserve or what your neighbors are making.

[oliverthered]

@mclovin1234567890

that's soclilsm.

[Praxis71]

What I have a problem with is the obvious hierarchical structure in the enterprise he represents. The whole idea that a man has developed a "scientific theory" that everyone should follow because it will lead to liberation and a "better world" is simply elitist and pompous. Besides, I think this guy presupposes that people LIKE to partake in decisions making processes... most people I know hate meetings.

[Praxis71]

I don't know much about Avankian or his party/movement. After listening to hima bit, I agree with much of what he says. I do think most people are alienated from their work . Undoubtedly, most folks find their jobs meaningless.. ..work is essentially a torture you have to endure a few hours a day in order to survive. Thus, I do appreciate Aviakian's call to imagine something different.

[samson5791]

The problem with this type of thinking is very simple. I would not mind waking up in the morning and earning the same income as my neighbor jack with equal work. But there is a problem, my neighbor jack is lazy and smokes crack and is not as productive as me, so with that being said should he earn what I earn? The answer is NO- That is why capitalism is here to stay plain and simple

[Praxis71]

@samson5791 I know people with very high incomes that don't do shit... and plenty of people who break their backs working everyday who can hardly make ends meet... the presumed meritocracy you attribute to capitalism is largely a myth.

[samson5791]

@Praxis71 lol, Its not a myth at all. Its 100 percent true, fuck sharing...I work hard and plan on keeping it, not giving it to Jack the crackead I mentioned that does not work and sits around collecting welfare.

[RayG66]

@Diosibundo Watch the clip before posting that nonsense.

[Diosibundo]

@RayG66

I watched the whole lecture, actually. He's cobbled this together from stuff we've all been hearing since 1972. The only organizing principle seems to be "The world sucks, put me in charge"

Ive talked to his fan club. They get all glassy eyed about him the same way Scientologists get all warm and fuzzy about L. Ron.

[Diosibundo]

God damn Bob. Not that I disagree in principle with what youre saying, I guess, but....

Do you talk in anything other than cliches?

[Tokopol]

what a charlatan, the last thing we need is our own version of glenn beck

comrade stalin we need you more than ever today

[RayG66]

@Tokopol You don't know what you're talking about. Glenn Beck is a raving fascist. Bob Avakian is the most forward-thinking revolutionary leader on the planet who's applying science, leading a revolutionary movement to emancipate humanity. That you sling these ad hominem attacks and refuse to seriously engage and contend with his body of work shows where you stand, and it's not with humanity.

[FlacoJetson]

now tell me, why isnt there mass support for the things avakian says? why is the RCP only a tiny group of so-called extremists, instead of a roaring mass that is ready to start a revolution? why did avakian have to flee the country while bill oreilly has millions of followers? because people generally are HAPPY with the status quo. and many of them enjoy right wing propaganda as entertainment. sure, democracy is a myth, but its the closest youre going to get to socialism. (good example: sweden!)

[RevolutionTalk]

@FlacoJetson Briefly, from "The Revolution We Need... The Leadership We Have":

"If you have not heard about this—if you don't know about the revolution we need and the leadership we have—that is because those who now hold power do not want you to knowthey keep this from you, or lie about it when they can't keep word of it from getting out. And it is because our Party itself has not, until now, been consistent enough and bold enough in getting the word out, and acting on it."

[TheAntiV]

@RevolutionTalk

Or perhaps the vast majority of people can see how incredibly stupid and backwards these views are? Please, there's no conspiracy against your little group. You're not that special.

[stan469]

@FlacoJetson Capitalists control what goes into the newspapers, television news, school text books, etc.

[taghbaz]

@FlacoJetson If One is born blind then he or she is born into a colorless world, he or she therefore, would not undrestand what colors are even if we try to explain them to that person. Americans are born into a "blinded society," a society where people are blinded by social constructs such as the media, education, art, etc. So when you say "people generally are HAPPY with the status quo" I dont agree with you because people in US are born into their optionless society they didnt chose it.

[arizonafb]

@FlacoJetson because no one ask question "why? but the day they ask it, the day the change will start. the important thing is to which direction.

[chrispollock]

@FlacoJetson because people are too smart to fall for another communist revolution that creates oppression. communist speakers: all utopian rhetoric, no logistics

[KillYourFriends100]

@chrispollock Actually, the true tenants of communism does not even advocate oppression and tyranny. So, before you insult an ideology, read up on it first. I was once a conservative Republican. Now, I'm a Marxist. 

[chrispollock]

@KillYourFriends100 i've read the manifesto. i know how marx dismisses individualistic freedom as "bourgeoise" freedom. that right there shows how wrong this ideology is and how it sets itself up for failure. plus it doesn't matter what the "true" tenets of communism are, when people try to apply it by seizing state power, it fails, always. so why do people still believe in it.

[KillYourFriends100]

@chrispollock Reading the manifesto does not completely show Marx's ideology. It is, in fact, a horrible place to begin when learning about communism. Try reading Capital and various other Marxist literature before you base an opinion on it. Furthermore, the people that attempted to seize power had a different mindset. They endeavored to seize power for themselves, not to distribute it to the masses.

[chrispollock]

@KillYourFriends100 yes because EVERY single leader who launches communist revolutions is secretly trying to seize power. give me a break. they wouldn't risk life and limb if they didn't believe in this stuff. but like every regime, they get corrupted, they get conservative, they get status quo. how is the manifesto a bad reflection? it outlines his position pretty clearly. bourgeoise bad, working class good, stateless, classless society. of course it's pie in the sky. that's why it never works

[KillYourFriends100]

@chrispollock Yes, because they were obviously compassionate individuals. Bullshit. They wanted to incorporate a system that was the complete antithesis of the ideology they preached. People kill, lie, cheat and steal for money, power and influence every day. They risk their own lives and the lives of others to climb the social latter. The Manifesto is a great outline yes, but it it's just a proposal. The means lie in the other works, the other theorists.

[chrispollock]

@KillYourFriends100 no one fights revolutions that almost lose because they are power hungry. selfish people are scared to lose their lives. fanatics are not. lenin, stalin, che, castro, kim il sung, mao, were all fanatics that believed in silly radical utopia. there has never been one communist who took state power that has proven you wrong. anything other than a free forum for ideology (which communism doesn't offer) is tyranny

[KillYourFriends100]

@chrispollock The leaders mostly stayed behind the curtain, orchestrating the revolution. And yes, people do fight because they are power hungry, it's a basic human nature. They used the communism as a guise for their true intentions.

[chrispollock]

@KillYourFriends100 lenin said the masses didn't know what was good for them, that's the whole vanguard idea. that is what communism became. i would say if you want power, it's easier to find a way within the status quo than challenging the status quo with it's armies and police and potential danger of being executed for treason.

[chrispollock]

@KillYourFriends100 so what i'm saying is, regardless of the elaborate philosophies of marx or the intricate systems that marxist theorists come up with, communist revolution that seizes state power always ends in tyranny. that is a fact. my opinion is that the seeds of dictatorship are inherent in communist thought, that is, belief in the elimination of all non communist power structures.

[KillYourFriends100]

@chrispollock Of course. If they seize the power through brute force and unnecessary bloodshed. A violent revolution ends with a violent state. And the seeds of dictatorship are inherent in non-compassionate, deceitful minds, not all communists.

[chrispollock]

@KillYourFriends100 well that is marx's prediction, isn't it? violent seizure of the means of production and ultimately the state, to create socialism and then communism. i would argue that every communist is a dictator apologist because they seek socialism as a means of obtaining their goals (communism) and socialism is embodied in the top down state outside of the theory books

[MsRoxy66]

@FlacoJetson Sweden is a Parliamentary Democracy, not Communist. Communists are like George Romero's zombies, with a pathetic sense of entitlement because they have neither the brains, confidence, or will to do for themselves! No one owes you anything!

[dillinger9999]

@FlacoJetson You will remain woefully ignorant of the big red white and blue dick that’s being jammed up your ass hole every day. ~George Carlin~

[joshmaslin]

As China continues to demonstrate, communism and capitalism are increasingly distinct and coexisting ideologies.

[Codyboyandme]

How utterly deluded you people are. How many tens of millions of bodies piled up or buried in mass graves will it take before you realize that this crap hasn't ever worked and will NEVER work? That anyone is still taking this seriously is simply mind boggling. Lenin, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot and you still think this stuff is going to lead to a better world if only we give it one more try. Wrap it up in some more nice psuedo-scientific bullshit to make it sound more enlightened. Bullshit.

[johnnyaught]

I turst fascists more thanI trust communists. Fascists tell you they are going to f**k you, then they f**k you. Communists sell you a story, then round you up and shoot you in the middle of the night. That said, I 'm not fan of the amoral multinational corporation that despoils the earth and dehumanizes people. People, as individuals, must be honored and respected. I find these ideas inspiring, but I am not ready to start killing only to submit to a new master.

[dayday98765]

@johnnyaught u really need to find out more about communism & I encourage you to ck out the full talk (google revolutiontalk). 1st, this is about a revolution made - in qualitatively different conditions - would have to deal with repression from the state seeking to defend its rule, not frustrated acts of individuals. But this is a serious topic and merits FAR more than a youtube comment.

[dayday98765]

Also, Avakian is talking about a society with the flourishing of individuality and what kind of new state, and whole new society is required to enable that.  He's also done a lot of work looking at democracy and dictatorship under socialism (and by the way, you're living under a dictatorship now).

[soakchips]

"Socialism is the new society established after the seizure of power"

Gee, what happened to New Democracy? @_@

[275Divine]

Just seen 'Imagine a New Society'.

I have imagined it- and for a long time now.

So ok - now what?

See "What the Friends of thye People are and How They Fight the Social-Democrats" for an interesting discussion which took place in circumstances similar to our own.

"What the friends ... " is rough going in places but a really good read for all that.

Salut!

[RedGuard1976]

To learn more about the specific breakthroughs in developing the science of communism that Bob Avakian has made in relation to: philosophy and method; internationalism; the character of the dictatorship of the proletariat and socialist society as a transition to communism; and strategic approach to revolution - Google: COMMUNISM:

THE BEGINNING OF A NEW STAGE

A Manifesto from

the Revolutionary Communist Party, USA

[Diosibundo]

@RedGuard1976

Dont be silly.

Communism is not a Science.

You cant make a "Science" of history.

[scottistoxic]

@Diosibundo That's absurd. Why is human history and human society any different from the rest of the natural world, that it can't be understood scientifically? That's exactly the kind of hocus-pocus thinking that keeps people in the dark about their own reality, and leaves them to be preyed upon by preachers and ruling-class pundits and others who are the only ones "qualified" to interpret reality for them...

[Diosibundo]

@scottistoxic

Well... depends. What I meant is that you can't make a predictive hard science of it like physics or math. It doesnt work that way.

I appreciate a lot of what "Marxist" approaches do, but I don't agree with making a science out of it, any more than there is a science of "Einsteinianism" or "Steven Hawkings-ism" or "Heisenberg-ism".

It's just a bad idea to develop cult of personalities around these things, it just gets in the way of clarity.

[scottistoxic]

@Diosibundo Actually it does work that way. Marxism isn't some magic crystal ball, but nor are any of the other sciences. There is no other serious attempt to synthesize social phenomena and how they are grounded in the historical reality of the way wealth is organized. If you're serious about understanding the world in order to change it, you have to take Marxism seriously, which in the present context means taking Avakian seriously, and digging in deep not only into his analysis (continued)

[scottistoxic]

@Diosibundo (continued) of the class forces at work in the present day and what it will take to end their rule, but his re-imagining of the period of socialism, particularly what it will take to get to communism, where all class divisions and the basis for those divisions have been eliminated. There's nothing "cultish" about saying that, any more than saying you should take Hawking seriously if you want to understand physics, so hopefully we can dispense with that sensationalist nonsense.

[Diosibundo]

@scottistoxic

Ive yet to come upon the brilliance of Avakian.

He seems to be regurgitating stuff that has been fairly commonplace since 1972...

Hey! You think maybe after we go through the Communist phase we can arrive at the promised land of... uh... Starbucks, like the Chinese did?

[scottistoxic]

@Diosibundo Yeah, you said that already. Repeating it doesn't make it any more true. Tell me what about Avakian's news synthesis of communist theory has "been fairly commonplace since 1972"? Who else but Avakian has rejected the notion of "class truth" and the instrumentalism common to the internat'l communist movement, while insisting that revolution and communism were necc. and possible? Who else but Avakian has placed dissent in a *central* role in propelling society forward under socialism?

[scottistoxic]

@Diosibundo As far as China goes, Avakian was virtually alone in recognizing China as revisionist (on the road back to capitalism) as early as 1977 after the death of Mao, while almost all the so-called communists who upheld Deng have fallen by the wayside--and China has become a sweatshop to the world? The fact that he was right about China that early on is due to his insistence on rejecting pragmatism, and uncovering the real underlying dialectic in all its complexity. Who else has done that?

[Diosibundo]

@scottistoxic

By the way... have you actually BEEN to China lately? It's fucking BOOMING. They're not just a sweatshop, it's a full on market economy. For a Marxist you're pretty high on the rhetoric and low on the facts dude, Karl would not be proud.

Dialectic Avakian my ass... where's the fucking theory???? Could you at least point me in the right direction? Where's the miraculous Avakian theory? Cant even find any writing of his that aren't collections of cliches.

[scottistoxic]

@Diosibundo Look, man, until you show that you've actually listened to any of these videos or read any Avakian and can reply in substance to ANYTHING he's said, your shit is looking pretty transparently shallow and cynical. If you want to be honest, take one thing he's said, and pick it apart. Just one. I'm not going to do your homework for you, bro--all the videos are here. You can watch them or not. But if you want to be serious, I will take you seriously. Give it a go. As for that "cult" shit

[scottistoxic]

@Diosibundo ...do you really think you're being original or thoughtful? Puh-fucking-leeeeze.

[Diosibundo]

@scottistoxic

Naw. Just making fun of Avakian.

Seriously, can you PLEASE point me towards this wonderful miraculous theory of his? Please please please??? Im begging!

[scottistoxic]

@Diosibundo One last thing I'd like to say about your posts: If you take cynicism as your outlook and methodology, all you're going to get is stasis and stagnancy. In a situation where the world is being torn apart and the very means for maintaining life on earth is being threatened, cynicism is an unacceptable outlook. If you've got serious criticisms to offer, you need to start making them. But if you're not serious about changing the world, get the fuck out of the way of the people who are.

[RedGuard1976]

@Mao4EverBadi First of all, by making the claim, "They aren't serious abt building a movemnt (decades of failure w/o real change)" you make very clear that it is in fact you who are not serious about revolution. A revolution is not made by sheer will it can only be made when the old decaying society becomes gripped by crisis. Bob Avakian has not given up, he has developed the science of communism to a new level and is leading a campaign to unleash a new wave of communist revolution worldwide.

[scottistoxic]

Man...if you think this capitalist worldwide system is the best of all possible worlds, you either are out of your mind, very wealthy, or have no capacity for creative thinking...or all of the above...the thing is, we actually COULD have the kind of world Avakian is talking about here...not just "better health care"...we could transform everything, and really make it so that people matter, if we would dare to really struggle, and unleash our imaginations from the lies we chain ourselves to...

[jcncnc]

@scottistoxic You mean the way people mattered in Soviet Russia as they were SLAUGHTERED by the millions. WAKE UP! How about the way they mattered in Communist China where 100 MILLION WERE MURDERED? Is that the kind of "mattered" you want? You see, what this guy offers does sound good. I can see why you'd be seduced by it. But the method he offers it by has been tried time and time again and it has NEVER WORKED! That's why we're against it! IT DOESN'T WORK! IT LEADS TO MURDER AND DEATH!

[bdj010]

@jcncnc Communism leads to famines and all sorts of crap. It is based on the idea of some utopia where everyone walks hand in hand and shares in the work. That never happens, all you get in communist governments is oppression. Avakian is a lunatic who needs a padded room and a straight jacket.

[godscuttingyoudown]

all socialist societies ended in blood baths with the people crying for the free market

Hitler was a socialist his party was the national socialist party, the Nazi government was socialism

Nazi is an occult word, fascism is the religion of socialism, but socialist don't understand this difference because historically socialist people have a below grade school reading level

that's why socialism is popular is poor and illiterate countries

[Antiks72]

You don't know the difference between national socialism and socialism. You don't know and you're ignorant.

[No3Patriot]

I've never been treated disrespectfully when I had no health insurance other than the fact that I've had to get in line and wait like the rest of the cattle.

[Antiks72]

What was you bill when you left?

[No3Patriot]

Nothing. I never paid anything. I went to a community hospital where all the cattle without insurance go to. Most people are not billed unless they have surgery. I don't know how the hospital is funded- most likely the state.

[No3Patriot]

And you wouldn't want to have surgery in a community hospital, or in any hospital that is funded by the government because you're simply not going to get the most knowledgeable doctors. At your own risk.

[godscuttingyoudown]

the ancient colored races teotihuacan, Mayan, hopi, Indian, kemetten, assyrian, Murrs, never had heart problems, cancer or alzheimer's

they only ate fruits and vegetables and fish maybe twice a month

if you consume poison, meat alcohol, artificial sweeteners, fluoride water, omega 6 trans fat then you deserve to die, no government has the right to steal from the healthy to keep the self inflicting sick alive for another month

[Antiks72]

Tell that to the corporations that are pushing these products on our kids. It's a free market after all. I'm not sure there's any credible evidence that suggest fluoride in the water or nutra sweet causes health problems.

Also, there is a huge genetic component to heart disease, as is evidenced by certain cultures consuming whole cream with very little heart disease.

Sorry, I don't buy social darwinianism..

[Antiks72]

Anyone who says a single-payer healthcare system is stealing is not only an asshole, but morally depraved. You sir, are a dickhead. You piss and moan about the weakest in society, yet you turn a blind eye toward all the theft that crony crapitalism is costing us.  Iraq? Afghanistan? Tarp? I hope do you die soon.

[ProserpinaFC]

Would they have had names for these things?

[TurkeylovesGreece]

Stop Communism!!

[policestory]

@TurkeylovesGreece Oh right, keep the current Capitalist system where you are nothing but a commodity and a statistic. It's not surprising though.. coming from someone as homophobic as you. There is obviously an incredible level of ignorance within yourself. Your background says "Peace" but you're so anti-communist. Interesting.

[djangothecat]

If YOU are a communist, answer this question honestly to yourself. When he says "imagine you work in a job you WANT to go to, where YOUR ideas were valuable and YOU were drawn into the administration and became part of the committee running that place". Do you really think that YOU are that person, the one that will advance and get to run things? Well, don't forget that he also says there are NO classes, everyone is equal. Deep down you all THINK you'll run things but trust me, it won't be YOU.

[johnlepo]

@djangothecat Nobody gets to run things at the moment. A select few. One can still earn promotion to organise fellow workers, but you will be elected to that position by your peers. It's not about rising to the top, it's about eliminating the top as the myth of capitalism.

[johnnyaught]

That's the thing...this is our national myth...and it can come true for almost anyone...but it usually gets played out in some soul-sucking and demoralizing way. Still, I don't trust communists to really deliver equity or social justice...(human nature).

[scottistoxic]

django...why should people "trust you" when the history of socialism as a form of the organization of society shows the opposite to be true? When has there been any other kind of society that brought people forward in organized ways to actually decide how things that affect their lives get done? We can learn from that, and Avakian HAS learned and is learning from that. What he talks about in this clip damn sure doesn't (and can't) exist under capitalism, but could exist if we dare fight for it.

[djangothecat]

Keep dreaming Avakian. Imagine this, imagine that, it's all in your imagination and will NEVER work in real life unless you can get people who are willing to go to 10 or 12 years of college to become a doctor and work for minimum wage or for free. communists always talk about some 'heaven on earth' where everyone is 'equal' and everything is free and then when no one wants to be the slave to provide it to the others they point a gun at you and say "work or else" and then the violence begins.

[Antiks72]

@djangothecat it's working in cuba. Cuba has a great health care system compared to our in the U.S. for example. Doctors shouldn't be in medicine for the money. That's where you get unnecessary billing and charges --- greed.

[godscuttingyoudown]

Cuba is in the shit hole, i doubt you understand the concept of propaganda

[Antiks72]

I didn't think you could address my points. Did you know that shithole boasts a higher life expectancy than we do here in the U.S.? Idiot.

[greenghost2008]

thats not the kind of work id like to be at.

[dayday98765]

@ahuj89 Avakian is NOTHING like LaRouche or Paul & there's nothing religious abt pple who recognize the need for leadership, genuine vanguards aren't "creepy", they're the only way revolution can happen - it has to be led! In particular, Avakian has played a role no one else has. Literally rescuing the communist project & leading a revolutionary mvmt today. Read his work - he is ruthless in his criticism of previous socialist societies where deserved, but he doesn't accept distorted verdicts.

[dayday98765]

@pseudonym U clearly know nothing abt communism which is in practice & conception in opposition to nazism. Search Raymond Lotta on youtube, watch his videos refuting the lies abt communism, including the idea that the leaders have been "mass murderers." Nothing is further from the truth. In China, under Mao, lives were saved & drastically improved w/ higher life expectancy, oppressed nations and women genuinely liberated etc. Don't just regurgitate the lies you've been told!

[Pseudonym25]

@dayday98765

1: The idea that nazism and communism are complete opposites was first suggested by Stalin in the 1930s, and is untrue. Both empowered the state at the expense of the individual, both advocated centralised economic planning, both installed governments unaccountable to the law, and both resulted in genocide on unpresidented levels.

And both failed.

[Pseudonym25]

@dayday98765

2: The mass murder and oppression ordered by Lenin and Stalin was admitted by the Soviet goverment under Gorbachev. The mass murders under Mao are about as disputable as the holocaust.

3: China is now a capitalist country. They wouldn't be if communism had worked for them. In fact, of all the countries that attempted communism, you can't point to a single success story. Communism doesn't work.

[Pseudonym25]

I can't understand why it's considered more acceptable to be a communist than a nazi, since the former ideology killed far more people.

Maybe it's because communists were equal opportunity mass murderers.

[greenghost2008]

u should add those damned kantians while ur at it.

[ahuj89]

Bob Avakian has created a personality cult around his "movement" much like your Lyndon LaRouches or your Ron Pauls, this is a weirdly american type of thing.

No cults of personality, no creepy vanguards. What happened to No Gods No Masters?

Stop this deluded wishful thinking crap, apply some REAL self criticism and analyze why China and Russia failed and move on, stop saying "oh but Russia had an improvement in X" because whatever the SU did wasn't sustainable! No "hail mary" self-criticism.

[greenghost2008]

its hard to work in politics w/o alittle drive for one person at least paul has created an entire organization to divert people from himself to other leaders like him. thats what campaign for liberty is. its about useing pauls followers to support politicains like paul(ie kokesh and shiff.)

[northpal2]

Show me one place in the world where this is up and running

[thetacogangsta]

imagine a world without a monetary system and when human limitation isn't limited by profit/money but by our resources alone....

[spenctheman989]

fox has nothing to do with it...watch the actual dvd and you'll know what i'm talking about...if you agree with him just get out of america, America doesn't need you

[psychocandychain]

Yea because fox is right huh dumb shit!

[RedGuard1976]

The chairman breaking it down... on the transformations we can make rapidly make with DOP (the dictatorship of the proletariat class) and communist leadership - throughout the transition from socialism to communism. If you urn for a much better world and the situation for humanity today makes you sick, you need to check this out and spread the word!

[maosaytounge49]

"Without state power, all else is illusion." We NEED state power to bring any of these changes into being. Who else is saying that right now besides Bob Avakian and the RCP?

[himrod67]

The tide is turning....