Osaka Kata

[emado4ever]

is there any thing knew about master Osaka ?? I didnt hear any thing about him since a long time

[fredkarat]

best of the best .for shihan osaka. great master .oss. bow.

[brinnonvallere]

i enjoy watching him move....solid

[ediblecognition]

Kata gives you the tools you need to fight with but doesn't tell you how to react to a live opponent. Kumite shows you how to react to specific opponents - but through experience, with little technical knowledge gained. Kihon lets you develop the motor function skill required for both kata and kumite. Everything is intertwined - and necessary, at least to represent karate. Otherwise it's like saying that my severed leg, on its own, can kick your ass.

16 years shotokan karate, 5 yrs wc, bjj.

[dchokee]

kata = kumite.  both (done correctly) require speed, power, focus, spirit, and good form. the only difference is whether your opponents are tangible or not.

[shimokai]

Kata peformed how it should be,no flashy movements like todays compertitions,excellent.

[rcadag]

i have seen Osaka Sensie twice but haven't had the opportunity to watch him do kata. by the way, does anybody know where I could find a video Aihara sempai? That is if anybody here still remember him.

[EASEDIGEST]

Kata as kancho kanazawa describes is beuty,Art,Philosophy,building character,building inner strength and decipline of the mind.even though the form of the kata will not be used as practiced in selfdefence,but the individual technique modyfied to the situation can be used.

[hssp900]

the grammer and wording of your posts is so bad it makes it difficult to get to grips with what you are trying to say,you seem to be saying ,kata has no value other than as a warm up excersise,and wkf style tag scoring has some worth as a martial art. perhaps you should try kickboxing?

[hssp900]

firstly i was quoting the wkf rules in my post to 4 adventurer,secondly if as you say kata was diguised to be a dance to fool the chinese it clearly was not intended to be a dance was it.you need to read the posts more clearly, think things through a bit more, your logic is flawed.

[4dventurer]

Kata merely serves one aspect of karate - and that is light cardio exercise (or tough cardio depending on effort). And that is it.

If you only practise kata you will not be able to defnd yourself or be successfu at kumite. Regardless of continenet style or organization never have I seen anyone in a way that it resembles kata. And the muth about secret techniques discipline ettiquette....please be serious.

And in reagrds to kata rules in the WHF vs JKA: everyone wants to see a "perfect" kata.

[budokanboy]

After reading your post I find it hard to believe that you are a serious practioner of budo. Only a novice would make such an uniformed statement.

[4dventurer]

30 years Shotokan,Sandan.

20 years Wado Ryu,Shodan

15 years Goju Ryu,Shodan

17 years Bo,Nidan.

Trained under Ochi,Brennan,Asai,Valera, Thompson and many more.

You are always a novice in Karate because you constantly train. So you saying I am a novice is right - but dead wrong regarding my time practising karate. Pair the top kumite practicioners vs the top kata practioners in a fight and the kumite guy will win - execptions granted. If not, why have kumite in the first place?

[budokanboy]

I don't want to get off on a rant here, but I've also trained with Ochi in 1978,79,80. Your training record is quite impressive. However the only real training you recieved was in Shotokan.

I trained with Nishiyama Sensei since 1983 until his unfortunate demise.

I merely commented because I find you comment to way off base. YOur Idea that Kata is nothing more that light or heavy cardio training couldn;t be farther from the truth. A Kata is a fight with oneself to perfect technique. No more

[4dventurer]

What technique do you try to perfect with kata? I am sure it is none that you can use in a kumite. Nobody, and I mean nobody becomes a good fighter with kata only - however, you can become an excellent fighter with kumite only.

Kata teaches you nothing that is conducive to fighting. Kata is translated as form - showing best form, not showing best fighting.

And claiming that my shotokan training was the only real training I received - is the air very thin up there on your high horse?

[budokanboy]

I really wanted to blast after that last comment. However I'm through with it. You have your opinion and I have mine

A good Shotokan instructor could straighten out your training.

If you want to respond go ahead. i'm really bored with this back and forth banter.

Is Hoffman and Butkin still around the DJKB???

[Heath8433]

Juergen Hoffman ist still around in DJKB coaching the team of Siegburg. Met them a few times in competition, splitt records.

Why could a shotokan instructor straighten me out? Ever heared about Teruo Kono (Wado Ryu) trained under him. And I feel he made me a more rounded Karateka.

Regarding kata:there is no applicable value for kata in a fight.Would be equivalent to let a boxer only shadow box and then sent him into a ring against a real opponent. No one in his right mind would do that.

[budokanboy]

You're killing me with this Kumite idea of yours. We are just going to have to agree to disagree.

Glad to hear Hoffman is still around. He used to have a mean gyaku tsuki.

As far as the Shotokan remark goes I'm just prodding you. Let it go.

I feel Kumite is a waste of time in traditional karate. Karate Kumite is good when the practitioners have advance to a level of compentency, but most fighters have perverted the art all together.

after 30 years of kata I learn something new ea day

[4dventurer]

Hoffman, Osterkamp, Glad are still active in Ochi's DJKB.

For me the essence of Karate is Kumite. Most karatekas are unable to defend themselves with what they learn in kata.

I learn more in facing a breathing living opponent/partner instead of an imaginary one.

Only in face-to-face combat/kumite you can find out how good of a karateka you are.

However, Kumite is a "Do" that lots of karateka avoid, because they are afraid to learn something about themselves they rather not.

[insaneguitarfreak]

Hi, I´m Facundo and I am 1st dan in ShitoRyu but I stopped practising. I used to train kata A LOT. I know one thing about kata. Most people ignore that katas were traditionally developed by masters as a help to remember fighting techniques, the ones that are under the name of Bunkai (literally "the study of war"). 1 movement can represent numerous techniques. Not many people know that Katas hold hidden knowledge, everything that has to do with kyusho which is the most exquisite side of karate.

[insaneguitarfreak]

I am 1st dan but I quit karate 2 years ago. I Remember some things, and I used to train kata a lot. I know one thing about kata. Most people ignore that katas were traditionally developed by masters as a help to remember numerous techniques, the ones that are under the name of Bunkai (the real meaning of a kata "step"). 1 movement can have several meanings, so it can represent numerous techniques. Not many people know that Katas hold "secret" knowledge, everything that has to do with kyusho

[budokanboy]

You are a very smart person. Get back into the dojo.

[4dventurer]

"Secret" knowledge? About what? Punching holes in the air? What good does that do if folks practising karate are not able to hit something with "resistance" like bags and mitts and possibly oponents?

One thing i observed is this: when the UFC and MMA became very popular and all the "traditionalists" got their butt whooped, suddenly Bunkai became the holy grail of karate. For me nothing else but an attempt to keep karate interseting - for commercial reasons.

[farorin]

MMA and UFC are not real effective fighting fool. MMA and UFC is rolling around on the floor, the rules favour grapplers, and as such, grapplers generally win over strikers.

[4dventurer]

Than greco-roman wrestling, grapling and judo must also be ineffective. Ever observed how many fights end on the ground?

MMA and UFC are not real effective - but Kata is?

Go to the next MMA/UFC studio and challenge the guys there to a sparring match. But do not forget to bring lots of ice to coll your bruised body and ego.

[Javahype456]

Dude, you're an idiot, Kata, if you know anything about the subject, is basically, an imaginary battle among invisible opponents. It's a technique practice session that emphasizes form and not function. There really are no traditionalists anymore and the men you see in the UFC and MMA are anything but traditional. They've mixed every possible fighting style and made it a mess. The very fact that you're using what you saw in these UFC and MMA tournaments to evaluate Karate is idiotic.

[4dventurer]

Karate in its purest form was, is and always will be fighting - against living, breathing, punching, kicking opponents, and not imaginary ones. And that is why Kata praticioners can't fight - execpt against their imaginary foes.

And if you know anything about karate, you know that throws, joint locks, arm bars , sweeps etc are part of karate, too.

But calling me an idiot. Seems to me you know little about the subject . Kata has no prupose for fighting.

[farorin]

I have fought MMA idiots before, so your first reply to my comment is crap. If I fight them with there rules, no doubt I'll have higher change of loss, as they have the advantage. But when fighting with my rules, or very limited/no rules, its a different matter. Kata is not an imaginary battle among imaginary foes, kata is the foundation of powerful and smooth technique, timing, accuracy, co-ordination, and proper body mechanics.

[4dventurer]

If kata is so important as you claim, why sparring? According to your reasoning no need for it. Kata is basis for kata, nothing else. Reading about riding a bike does not replace riding a bike. Same with fighting. kata has no purpose for fighting. I have never seen the great Ali to kata in the ring, or Dominique Valera for example. Why? Because they would have gotten their behind whipped. Kata teaches you nothing about fighting. that is why you train kumite separately.

[farorin]

Kata teaches you technique, transitions, power, finness, and skills. It is different to sparring and teaches different things. Sparring builds timing, distance, and the ability to read moves. Saying kata is useless, is like saying that shadow boxing and combination practice is useless, or that a speedbag is useless. I am not saying kata is the ONLY thing you need to practice, but it I am saying it is the basis of technique and is thus very important.

[mallardgreen]

Why have three legs to a stool, instead of only one. Kata teaches body mechanics, conditioning, controlling center of gravity, body shifting, expansion and contraction or relaxing and tensing of muscle groups, all directly applicable in fighting. It isn't all of karate, but there is much to be gained from it.

[IrishMystique]

..learning karate without kata i.e. kumite only, limits the scope of the art in a way that would eventually see it die out. Properly taught, in a manner that recognizes the reality of the self-defense situation, kata can enhance the practitioner's ability to cope with violent attacks. This is predicated on the requirement that the practitioner must devote equal time to kumite, kata, and kihon in order to gain the skill required for self-defense.

[deadguy29]

Kata has its place in karate and fighting practice. One of its purposes is to practice strikes and techniques that are not allowed in sparring (groin strikes, eye poking, open hand strikes to the throat, etc.) It's done in an organized way and of course there are other benefits like those mentioned in several previous responses. Keep an open mind, that's what really matters...

[insaneguitarfreak]

At least that is what my Sensei used to teach me, and that´s how I see kata. Nevertheless I totally agree with you, kata alone isn´t enough. They ended up as technique exercises thanks to many people that don´t give a shit about tradition. For example, "Full Contact Karate" is Karate but without Kata. I mean without all the traditional knowledge. Ok with Fullcontact, but I always try to look for the roots of the things, and I believe that Kata is the root of karate.

Best wishes.

[4dventurer]

Kata is not the root of karate. The need for self defense is - due to laws that did not allow common folks to bear weapons. the root of karate? (I hope i spell it right) Ikken hasetsu.

And geographically spoken, karate originated possibly in ancient Greece, traveled via India and China to Japan and Okinawa.

Tradition? What is tradition? Not challenging the status quo? Not so in my book. Tradition is to push the envelop and not to pointlessly focus on deep Kiba Dachis (just one example)

[farorin]

Greece? Where the hell do you get that idea?

[4dventurer]

Do your research.

maybe the word "Pankration" rings a bell.

[PircioM]

Sir I have been in the martial arts for 6 years. I have practiced in 5 seperate styles, and all the styles i have practiced in have said the same thing. SO unless about 5 master instructors lie, I believe I am telling the truth. Also on a side note. If I am to take you seriously try using correct grammar.

[hssp900]

six years, you have not even scratched the surface, I hope you and your friends enjoy your dance lessons.

[bbhaz]

im 12 nd hav been doing karate for six years so dnt use that excuse

[budokanboy]

I've been training since 1968 and I find your comments to be that of an uninformed beginner.

[katasochin]

ok i think i get it now. you are not competent in kata,but feel the need to put down people who are(osaka),you seem to have an inferiorty complex about the jka a group i have not even mentioned in my posts. you think,

kata has no traditional values and principles to it. case closed.

[4dventurer]

Wrong.I do not put down Osaka I just compare performance incl. speed, dynamics, accuracy, power etc. Todays atheletes are light years ahead of the standard that was top in the past. If that would not be the case, karate would not have developed. But it has.

I have no problem with JKA but JKA is not the holy gral in karate. Ask all the former JKA deciples that left and formed their own organizations.

Traditional value does not equate fighting abilities.

[hssp900]

kata is not a dance or theatrical performance it must adhere to traditional values and principles. WKF RULES. you do not even know the rules of the karate you love so much, the rest of your post is just gibberish, good luck with your phoney karate , keep bouncing.

[4dventurer]

You are impying to much. I enjoy kata for workout purposes, nice break from kihon and kumite. What i do not enjoy if someone equates traditional values and principles" to it. Principle value in traditional karate = senior instructors with ruined hips and knee joints.

Another thing I detest is your thinking in organizations. Biggest BS ever.I always visit clinics with the best instructors & tourneys with best atheletes. They never have & never will be JKA only. But that is your rubbish thinking.

[PircioM]

Actually hssp900, kata were developed to be dances. The Chinese were occupying japan and to suppress revolutions they outlawed the Martial Arts. And in order to teach the martial arts, the instructors had to teach a dance or "kata" to teach the students the martial arts, and all the while keeping under the radar. And many times kata were performed in front of the enemy during festivals to prove that what they were doing was harmless.

[Jorell1000]

Wow. Thanks for that information. It makes me want to learn Kata even more now.

[PircioM]

Hey no problem. Always glad to give information on probably the most misunderstood but helpful aspects to the martial arts to this day.

[hssp900]

i understand why you like this wkf style kata,

it is much easier to do it very fast, using the little tricks, gi slapping to simulate power,long dramatic pauses for effect,of course the faster you do it the harder it is to see bad technique,maybe when you mature,and your karate progresses, you will see this bullshit for what it is.by the way i am sure sensei sakumoto would not like to be included with the likes of milon, fugazza, valdesi ect.

[4dventurer]

Kata is a performance and should be traeted as such. Nothing mystical about kata. Take a kata only performer and let him fight against a kumite fighter. The kumite will win.

Claiming that kata prepares for kumite is afar stretch at best. Kata is not fighting but a mere aspect of karate. In your terms: just bs.

I know why you do not like the best kata performers do theur kata - because they do not think in "organizations" like you do, they think about competing against the best.

[katasochin]

4dventurer kime is correct breathing, technique, power, focus, locking ect.. put into each technique. kime is a japanese word there is no exact english translation. you think that boxers don't use technique, breathing, snap, power ect in their punches? as for your junkie hero michael milon and the likes of luka valdesi and other wkf competitors they train to be sportsman and win medals so they train to be super fast and athletic but do not train to do proper budo karate.

[4dventurer]

I just comment to one aspect you mention: locking technique.

Who in his right mind would abprubtly stop a technique? remember the way you train is the way you fight. Boxers dont lock techniques thus, KO power.

Karate is primarily about fighting. It was developed to fight, to win to disarm and diable, even kill. But atleast to fight.

Lots of folks are just philosophers. Ask them for a nice kumite, randori -they always have a reason not to.

You find the truth on the mat nowher else.

[rodoShaolin2]

each time I see this vid i think in Osaka as a model for us.

Oss, Osaka Sensei is a great master

[drumass23]

I'm a 2nd kyu with the JKA and ISKF (USA) and think Osaka's kata performances are gold. Obviously there are other karate-ka's that are great as well. I'm surprised that those who bash Osaka aren't offering up examples of performances they think are better (along with an explanation as to why).

-Dru

[hssp900]

i'm sure there is no place for kime in the wkf (World Karate Fakes), they are far to busy posing.

[4dventurer]

Go fight them in a tournament. What? You can't because JKA wouldnt sanction it? Rest my case.

[hssp900]

and your great example of karate do, milon a drugs cheat ,sums you up. rest my case.

[4dventurer]

So much for the character building of supposedly JKA karateka like you.

Nobody said that Milon was without mistakes. His kata was stellar trouncing that of Osaka, in speed, atheletecism, power and focus. Same with Sakumoto who would have owned Osaka in any kata competition day and night.

JKA = high moral loss, but harder fall. Thus, the splitt of JKA. Rest my case, again.

Still didnt answer why a "kime" punch in karate exerts less power than a "kime-less" punch in boxing.

[katasochin]

you show how little you know 4dventurer by not understanding what real kime is!! this is what is lacking in wkfkarate, no understanding of kihon, kime, correct hip movement ect. but total emphasis on slapping, posing and making stupid noises just to please the crowed.

[4dventurer]

Well, you still did not exlain what "real" kime is. Because you cant.

I tell you what it is: a myth.

Sports research has shown that any boxer exerts more power without kime than any karateka with kime. How is that possible? very simple: because kime is a concept without practical value. And if there is indeed a kime: please look at the JKA kumite fights on youtube. Constant contact to the face, people knocked over. By highly trained JKA guys with kime and control - or the lack thereoff.

[katasochin]

4dventurer, you are an idiot. how can you even compare sensei osaka's kata to milon or fugazza's. osaka sensei's kata is on a different planet.he has real kime and does not need to hit himself or make stupid noises and his kihon is perfect. you obviously have no real understanding of proper karate. p.s the wkf means nothing to real karateka from any style!!

[4dventurer]

katasochin, you calling me an idiot shows what a tolerant and educated individual you are. Nothing and nobody is perfect. Not even Osaka.Even JKA preaches repetition because there is no end to it. Thus, perfection impossible to achieve. WKF karatekas there are from all styles - thus, real competition. The EAKF Shotokan atheletes got their butts whooped in the mid-early 80s when the shift and competition with the WUKO happened.By the way what is real kime? And what is wrong kime?

4dventurer

[straussy73]

I had this guy over for a bbq once. He was very nice.

[9hellokitty5]

karate 4ever

[charger089]

He's incredible! Fast and strong.

[12tibet]

your right rodoShaolin2 Osaka Sensei is a legend.and a have trained with him many times

[rodoShaolin2]

Osaka Sensei is a legend. I hope can meet him some day. His techique is spectacular.

[aiko4321]

His sochin is nice

[davefarber]

This is empi... or are you saying for us to go look at his sochin?

[aiko4321]

Pls watch the complete vidoe b4 u comment. Thnks

[davefarber]

I am sorry. Please forgive. My youtube pauses every once in a while and I thought it was over... But you are right.. He does a VERY good Sochin.

[madgecic]

this just proves why mr. osaka is known as one of the best kata champs of all time......although the empi wasn't as good as the goju and sochin

[Toxeh]

His Sochin was definitely the best of the three!

[christopherfarrell]

inspirational.

[fradenand]

gracias...

osaka un verdadero maestro...

en la pagina oficial de la JKA dejo una frase que es de las que mas me ha llegado...

simplemente dice "Always do your best and let fate do the rest"..

[empowered2win]

lol sugarphallus... this is 1982, perfection of kata was not osaka sensei's key component, he was involved heavily in kumite and demonstration work for Masatoshi Nakayama.

[SugarPhallus]

Have to say, his Enpi looked like a bit of a joke (it put me in mind of middle-aged orange belt). But the other two showed me why he's got his reputation. Not as sharp or agile as the WKF champs, but more powerful. Just depends on what you find more impressive.

[llanosdesignz]

Please forgive me but WKF kata champs aren't impressive especially if you take the time to break down their timing, rhythm and kime of their katas.

The spirit of impressing an audience has led the WKF to give birth to that type of "show off" kata feel.

In the end, they are exceptional athletes but no pure karatekas and certainly not true KATA or KUMITE Champions.

Yahara, Kagawa, Yamamoto, Osaka, these just to mention a few are real champions.

[basrawy69]

you are right, Osaka is not just an excellent kata karateka or x JKA champion in Kumite, he is the best teacher there is in JKA. Believe me I have trained with most of them From Nakayama and down.

[4dventurer]

What a bunch of hogwash!

Today's karatekas are technically and atheletically light years ahead than the folks that hit their prime in the late 70s early 80s.

People thinking in terms of JKA vs WKF etc are nothing else but stuck in a one way, never having competeted against good guys - regardless which karate organization.

Osaka, who might have been spectecular in the 80s, is nothing else but an avarage athelete today.

4dventurer

[IEKUKATAKA]

If your reasoning is applied through time, the karate-ka during the formative years were virtual nothings. One of todays best is Kawasoe who said he could never feel he was competent as long as Osaka was alive. You must be young and your reasoning shows it. Besides, if he were only average, did he not make a contribution? Was he not earnest in his training, devoted, hard working, and respectful. America regards those that have celebrity, Japan values those that have heart and personal values.

[4dventurer]

You are implying to much.I merely compared Osaka's kata performance to todays standards. And in this comparison he is merely average - in terms of speed, power,flow, atheltecism.

I am also not American, I am German. Trained many years under Hideo Ochi and other instructors.

Kawasoe's statements are typical for the japanese attitude towards their seniors - its borderline submissive.

Age is relative. I am 42.30 years Shotokan (JKA & WKF) Sandan. Also 15 years Goju Ryu & Wado Ryu.

[IEKUKATAKA]

I really can not relate to Osaka being characterized as average by any standard. However, given the number of performances I see that regard flash as important I can understand your position. His kata performance was based on the fundamental principles of stance connection, posture, technique effectiveness, body dynamics etc. It is funny you describe Japanese decorum as near submissive when people in your nation are forced to use terms like "Herr Doctor Professor Eric von Verbotenschwein". ;)

[4dventurer]

Check for Michel Milon or Carlo Fugazza - and compare them to Osaka's kata. It is like day and nite.

Nowadays the karate world is dominated by Eurpeans in Kumitd and Kata.

We Germans do not have a nation, we have country. And in my 42 years you are the first I hear say that I am forced to say "Herr Doktor Professoe Erik von Verbotenschwein". Lil prejeduiced aren't you?

And only because Osaka's performance and atheleticism is average compared to todays karatekas.

[IEKUKATAKA]

If you need to believe the karate world is dominated by Europeans it is fine with me. That is like saying the Mercedes Benz world is dominated by Ford. I can understand how you can feel that way and use domination as the operative verb. As far as my being prejudiced, if observation through time and stating the facts about stiffness and a need for strict hierarchical honorifics is prejudiced, ok. European karate, second rate, however, you will never know it, egotism quenches reality.

[4dventurer]

Look at the results of the world champioships. Results do not lie.

Japanese fighters used to have a bonus were near "untouchable". that changed with the appearance of Frank Brennan - and changed even further with the emergence of the WUKO and WKF. Karateka of all styles competed against each other - unlike the old JKA where there was only Shotokan.

As you correctly said: egotism quenches reality.

[IEKUKATAKA]

No sir, I will not look at any tournament stats because karate is not in tournaments. You see, I studied karate in Japan where karate really exists. Kumite has become a sport and you believe it is karate. Believe what you like, I know better. If someone modified a Porche and called it a Chevy you would shriek and cry foul. The JKA made a mistake with tournament kumite, Funakoshi warned it would send the wrong message and he was right, you got the message and believe it. Karate is not a sport.

[4dventurer]

Karate not only exists in Japan. Kumite is a part of karate. An important one. I have seen so many Dojo guys talking about the "Do" never compete and - and poop their pants when they have to go the "DO" all the way. You are claiming that I confuse karate with kumite. I do not. And a Porsche is as much as a vehicle as a Chevy.

Karate not a sport? Debateable.

Under one aspect kartae is this: hit your oponent hard and faster than you can. Kill with one punch. Sound familiar?

4dventurer

[Teefax]

Very interesting. You can see that he is more happy with Sochin than with Enpi (look at the jump in Enpi). I was surprised to see that, in sochin dachi, his forward foot is turned inwards. I have learnt it should be straight forward (as in zenkutsu dachi).

[KhmerKomSot]

Perfection! Thanks for posting!

[LethalGuppy]

hes great...i really like his personal touch by doing this stuff

[cptautistic]

Sensei Osaka is still the best great video.

[R0CKY44]

Awesome, thanks for posting!

[katasochin]

exellent!!!