Any links to a photo of Pre-Columbian Hebrew script? Is it Old Hebrew-Ugaritic from Jaredite times, or Assyrian-influenced Second Temple/early Modern Hebrew from Nephite times?
You know there is one other thing to consider..... Well throughout the ages there have been a number of alternative calenders. Because of this there is an inconsistent measurement of Time it's self. When we start going back in time. We would need to keep changing the measurements or we will be shooting off unrealistic numbers of years, months, and days.
Can you prove other wise? Let me guess... you are going to point to his 14 y/o wife? The one that was nothing more then a marriage that her dad wanted not JS? I would love to indulge your bigotry and hatred... but if JS was indulging in endless sex like i'm sure you believe where are all his heirs? We only have one line and that is from Emma. Most if not all JS marriage are debatable.
“Did you ever hear of abortion being practiced in Nauvoo?"
"Yes. There was some talk about Joseph getting no issue from all the women he had intercourse with. Dr. Foster spoke to me about the fact. But I don't remember what was told about abortion. If I heard things of the kind, I didn't believe in them at that time. Joseph was very free in his talk about his women. (Continued, See next post)
Cont, "He told me one day of a certain girl and remarked, that she had given him more pleasure than any girl he had ever enjoyed. I told him it was horrible to talk like this." (Interview with Wm. Law. March. 30, 1887; THE DAILY TRIBUNE: SALT LAKE CITY, SUNDAY MORNING, JULY 31, 1887
William Law had good reason to dislike JS.After all his wife asked JS to marry her because Law as an adulterer.After that Law was a personal enemy to JS.Even though he believed in the LDS church he believe JS was a fallen prophet. I wouldnt give credit to words against a man who his wife wanted to leave him for.
Come up with better propagandists that dont have a personal hate to propagate.
If you believe abortion as a a common practice then there is little you will not believe
Could you please make a similar video about the Book of Abraham and how the Egyptologists explain the figures so different from Joseph? You know those people who have studied the ancient texts for years on end and have seen the similar "facimiles" as Joseph has printed on the Pearl of Great Price? Thanks,
@interstellarwonder - it's interesting you would mention that because in the Book of Mormon we learn that those that were Nephites but who were dissenters of the faith made a "Mark" on their own bodies and would color them as such.
"And the Amlicites were distinguished from the Nephites, for they had marked themselves with red in their foreheads after the manner of the Lamanites; nevertheless they had not shorn their heads like unto the Lamanites." Alma chapter 3:4
Seeing that the people of the BoM are not Jews.... this is not proof of anything. But seeing that the 10 lost tribes of Israel were taken away to the east... and the American Indians are related to Asians.... this would be in the positive for the LDS... Way to show your ignorance of the facts.
Do you have another one? Or are you done liking like the fool?
Now before yo get you panties in a bunch... The people of the BoM were of the tribe of Joseph... not Judas (or Jews). You can call any child of Israel a Jew... but this is not the same as them being from the tribe of Judah. You can consider yourself learned on this subject now...
@Sk8er408 still there should be a higher score with the alignment. also the analysis of the mito-dna tells us another story.
also the book describes plant and animals that simply did not lived in america. like grapes (2Ne15:2,4,3Ne14:16) or Elephants. the book mentions metallurgical engineering countless times. still not a single pre-columbian object made of metal was found. surprising since the book mentions wars with millions of soldiers taking part.
@ctrlaltWOOT - If the Bible were so complete, why did the writers not give clues as to where the arc of Noah would be, the burial place of Abraham? Why is there no record of "Joseph" in Egypt? A plausibly Identified location for Mt. Sanai (There are 20 possible peaks where this could have happened but Archaeology has been unable to produce even the locations of certain cities such as "Sodom and Gomorrah" and so forth. Before getting into a BOM argument, know your own problems with the Bible.
@parachutepants101 Sorry for the delay, vacationed. Anyways, there is nothing wrong with "praising" someone. And for you to conclude your idea of "the bible doesn't mention dinosaurs, therefore it is false" only shows your lack of reasoning. Build up an argument out of specultion with zero proof. You sure destroyed that strawman!
@parachutepants101 "How about you prove there is a God". How about you prove there isn't one? Really, I can tell you "looked" and "studied" evidence and came to the "conclusion" that there is no God because the ever changing "science" "proves" it. If we are going to debate, lets do it on grounds that we can actually back up and both consider circumstantial.
@parachutepants101 Alright then, I'll answer it. You can do the response given by LDSLIFE. Things that I consider evidence is the creation of the universe.
@blackmamba54321 Part 1... I quote Carl Sagan "When someone approaches me with a theory or story, it's obvious that one should follow that with fact and evidence defending that theory. Religion avoids that. They use no evidence, proof, or logical thought. Instead of answering life questions with the honest answer of I don't know. They say "Because God et cetra" They respond with sayings like "Because I believe", "I feel it", and use the word Faith to justify their beliefs. Faith by definition...
@parachutepants101 Religion:1. a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, especially when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs. cont...
@parachutepants101 cont... Faith: confidence or trust in a person or thing: faith in another's ability.
Whether you like it or not, Atheism is a religion. One does not need to believe in God to be "religious". Its great you can quote someone of somewhat importance of views such as these quotes present, but your logic contradicts itself. I see no point in arguing someone who is closed minded.
@blackmamba54321 Part 1....I'm rather open minded. I've read the Bible, The Book of Mormon, and even the Qur'an. I've considered many religions and I assure you I didn't become an Atheist overnight. I struggled with it for quite some time. But my knowledge and logical thinking is what makes me what I am. And Atheism is not a religion in the same sense as most would consider. Considering religion by definition is a belief in how we got here, then some would consider it one. But we don't...
@blackmamba54321 Part 2.... gather to worship as most would expect of common religions. Saying Atheism a religion is like saying "not collecting stamps" is a hobby. It's just not true.
@blackmamba54321 Part 2.... is believing in something without rational thought, without logic, without proof. Therefore, I see no reason to listen to them rant on about their otherwise ridiculous stories."
4 spelling errors on the slide at 5:20! --- But of course, everything else in this clip is accurate and true? Not a chance! You (Mormons) are being deceived! Go read up at: MormonCurtain. com; then come back and report. Your church is a gigantic hoax!
Nice, I'm examining mormonism and surprisingly have found "proof" of fraud so often mentioned as matter of common knowledge impossible to find. It has an elegant cosmology and retains practices that seem most consistent with new findings of the quashed scriptures such as the newly found books of Enoch which parallel the papyrus blow for blow, also re-establishing some of these works to their importance before rome took over after seeing the saints proved problematic and radical. One love, MrM
@cbl2928 - Im not trying to argue, but have u read the old testament about holy garments used by priests? Aarons sons were stricken dead because they entered the holy temple without it.
As for becoming Gods, what good father has ever not wanted his children to be as good or better than him? I know that nothing would make me prouder as a father than for my children to follow my advice, learn from my teaching and become greater than I. Just sayin.
@ZorroTech88 He's trolling on the "How Joseph Smith Wrote the Book of Mormon" vid also. Its clear he has a bone to pick with us and not other "christians".
@parachutepants101 "If you were intelligent, maybe you would know", haha, I knew that was the kind of response I would get. You think your intelligent? Get over yourself.
@blackmamba54321 I don't mean to sound self-righteous here but I'm quite confident that I'm smarter than you. Please, continue avoiding the debate at hand.
@parachutepants101 - true to the truths for which martyrs have perished. What sort of people receive your praises? Basketball stars? Political leaders? There's a lot of praise going on. Which of those role models in life do you praise and are they praise worthy? Compared to Obama, I can't think of anyone else more praise worthy. Just ask those of the Obama team.
Who do you praise? Who have you ever clapped for or cheered?
The answer better be nobody if no one deserves the praises of men.
My praises go to the Lord and to his anointed servants
because if it were not for them, the restoration of the Lords gospel could not take place as it has been previously outlined that it would take place in Acts 3: 19-23 ...
now, being that time of a "Restitution of All Things."
@THELDSLIFE Our differences in "praise" varies drastically. If you want to waste the little time you have on this earth on something as idiotic as religion be my guest. Even though it's been dis-proven. Read about Horus. The entire Bible is plagiarized.
@parachutepants101 If you choose to believe the Bible was plagiarized, then that's your choice. We believe there are problems with the Bible, true, but in translation only. But the Bible is only evidence of the living God and it would seem to me that you don't yet have faith in that concept; that we are literally children of God and that there is a master creator in charge of the cosmos. If it were anything other than your idea of being "Controlled" or that u can't live your life, I'd agree.
@THELDSLIFE What you just said might seem fine and normal to most but to me was absolutely psychotic. All this belief in a Master Creator and Children of God is crazy. Step back and listen to yourself. Lost in translation? Bullshit. Did you even look up Horus? Christianity just scares you into believing otherwise you'll go to hell. You're so called "God" is completely hypocritical and man-made. He's a jealous God who destroyed his own creation of Earth multiple times. And why didn't he mention..
@THELDSLIFE anything about dinosaurs or other galaxies? Because man didn't have any knowledge of any of that then. Face it, God doesn't exist. Religion is all a lie.
@ZorroTech88 It's absolutely true. cbl2928 is clueless, and his narrow minded atheist world has him stumbling like a fish out of the water. And he doesn't attack other Christians. His only attack is on the chuch that Jesus Christ restored.
@Robyshileileh Now that is the definition of condescension, right there. What do you mean when you say "their level"? Is being skeptical a bad thing? Are you somehow above evidence? They would't be wasting their time AT ALL if they had some objective, hard evidence; some proof that could explain all of the blatant contradictions, inconsistencies, and problems with science. I do not appreciate people trying to put others down for not buying into and challenging their delusions/baseless claims.
@LDS4Life71 Well, it is true that I do not believe in the existence of any God(s). Certainly not in your three gods. But you call me a liar when you can prove a god's existence.
Nice video. I have found the same in my own research: elephant tusks and bones being found at the bottom of sinotes, etc. Most of the claims are dumb. These people could do a google search and find this stuff out before they post in error. Scientists are finding ancient African trinkets in meso-America and how about the popol vuh? All fascinating and testimony strengthening stuff to people who haven't obligated themselves to fight against the LDS faith. "Girl don't go away mad, girl j..."
I looked into a dirty gym sock and saw god telling me that the BOM is crap. Dude don't get mad, it's not me who said it, GOD said it. I'm just the humble messenger.
So how does any of this prove the BOM is an acurate archeological record again? Where can I go see Nephite and Lamanite artifacts? The Hill Cumorah was suppose to ahve thousands killed, so how many arrrowheads,spears,chariots etc...have been found there? just curious.
@Gideon6640man The lands are in the yukatan peninsula, and the cities there were given spanish names, but orignally had different names, and the iconography is proof.
@Gideon6640man The Smithsonian is NOT christian. It is the cult of bohemia. You can't use the Smithsonian unless yo want to be laughed out of the room.
@LDS4Life71 Typical..Liar? you don't know me so don't pretend to ok?show me where I lied...but stop evading and answer the question, a direct and choerent one at that.
@Gideon6640man There is NO rapture, and it's NOT biblical, but the doctrines of men just as your false faith. Evangelicals are living a lie, and NOT born again. For the baptism doth save us, and not just saying "i believe in Jebus, the three headed morphing goo god of Neoplatonism from the pagan Constantine.
Again find the true and biblical resurrected God of the bible, and not some mere ghostie. Luke 24:34-39
LOL, all the "evidence" is from their art, not actual physical evidence. Hopefully my drawing of fish people will convince people hundreds of years from now that mermaids existed.
@MengoMango google "Mounting Evidence for the Book of Mormon - Ensign Jan 2000," by Daniel E. Peterson. It's a scholarly article and includes info and references about Mesoamerica. At the start, B. H. Roberts reminds us, “The power of the Holy Ghost…must ever be the chief source of evidence for the Book of Mormon. All other evidence is secondary.…No arrangement of evidence, however skillfully ordered; no argument, however adroitly made, can ever take its place.”
@THELDSLIFE Art is part of culture, but that has nothing to do with physical evidence. If you can say that the supposed paintings of "white people" are evidence that they existed in North America, then the paintings of the Mayan gods are evidence that the Mayan gods also exist. Bright red people also must have existed in North America.
@THELDSLIFE So Lord of the Rings "defines" the English culture?? There is a reason why the mainstream scientific community does not support Book of Mormon claims (they actually contradict a lot of them), and no, it is not because they are "anti-mormon".
wtf??? thats two white boys kneeling to the black man.. how can you try to lie when im looking right at your so call evidence???? 1.02 in the video ...so stupid...
Just because its in the shape of a cross doesn't mean it's a crucifix.
Sorry, it's from Mexico (it plainly states that under the piece) and many can grow and do grow goatees.
Yeah, I deny the link to elephants and Mormonism. Every 3rd grader knows there were mammoths and Mastodons in the Americas. Many scientists believe they became extinct much much later than 9000 years ago they migrated into south America because of the ice age.
@THEINVENTABLETHREAT Hey genius, there are three species of elephant in the amazon jungle today, and they were hunted by the Mayans while they were yet indigenous up there, but the elephant moved south to avoid the ice age, and they survived.
@LDS4Life71 Hey genius, There are no elephants in the Amazon today. Indigenous "up there?" Mayans lived 1300 miles below the ice flow. Thomas Jefferson was told by Indians that they hunted mammoth around the great lakes. I have a real education, not LDS brainwashing. Believe whatever you're told, I really don't care, it's actually amusing. We have genetic science that totally blows LDS theory out of the water.
@LDS4Life71 Look it up, read a damn book, article, scientific journal about ancestry and genes if you're so damn interested in archeology and science. You're obviously not interested in facts because they conflict with your religious views. You'd rather believe a man that stuck his head in a hat, from which, he talked to god, than get an education.
@LDS4Life71 So the Book of Mormon > bodies of scientific literature and decades of research. Got it. "I know"="It makes me feel good, so I am going to take it as absolute truth in spite of bodies of scientific research to the contrary and many, many other incompatible religious views, such as Islam, Judaism, Catholicism, Protestantism, etc. all making similar claims citing similar sources, with just as much sincerity and conviction". Got it.
@LDS4Life71 - why is it that people just don't want to believe? Why wouldn't you want to believe? Why would additional information from the house of Israel be threatening and not supportive of the one fact that Jehovah is the one true God? If you had more than 1 son, would you only favor the one or would you speak to the other as well? If that information had not been made known to the rest of the world, one would not assume you loved the one son and not the other. Am I missing something?
@THELDSLIFE Sure, it sounds nice. But that doesn't make it true. Some people find Mormonism totally objectionable because it makes extremely radical claims, like humans can become Gods, you need to wear funny, uncomfortable, magic underwear, and you have to participate in extremely bizarre cultist rituals. There are PLENTY of reasons why people would object to Mormonism. Not to mention that science demonstrates that the BOM is not what it claims to be, and the Book of Abraham is molarchy.
@cbl2988 You are just a liar, and a mocker. You have nothing, but your atheistic gullible lies. Pity The LORD will see you in the afterlife, and you wont like how you are treated.
@LDS4Life71 I gave you plenty of material with a visual mapping of human migrations from National Geographic based on genetic markers. Have you gotten around to it or are you going to pretend that doesn't exist either?
What a load of nonsense! Listen to real archeologist, historians, geneticits, ect. None give any credence to the Book of Mormon. We have a pretty clear picture of what happened in the Americas before Columbus and none of it fits the Book of Morons. These LDS people just cherry-pick things out of context to try to cast doubt on what is agreed upon by the vast majority of archeologists. Have any of these LDS people published anything in a peer reviewed scientific journal supporting the BOM? NO...
Yea, i say unto all that these arguments should end. If thou doth not believe in Christ ye should not hate those which do believe in his name, but if ye do believe in his name as i, thou should not hate those which do not for love is the way of the Lord Jesus Christ. Let us argue no more for there is nothing to argue about, i watch these videos and view the comments and they sadden me insomuch that i do cry, there is enough hate in the world today. Let us love one another <3
@THELDSLIFE That's it typical LDS cultist, when the BOM is shown to be false attack the Bible or Christ himself...let me just say this Jesus was a hsitrical figure , even the Jews who rejected him acknowledge that where as Nephi,Lehi,Laman & charlie Brown are make believe....
Some seek after signs and wonders because they seek an occasion to excuse their unbelief. There were people in Jesus’ day who “tested” Him by seeking a sign (Matthew 16:1) Since they specified that the sign be “from heaven,” they most likely wanted something spectacular, similar to Elijah’s calling down fire from the sky (1 Kings 18:38) or Isaiah’s causing the sun to reverse course (Isaiah 38:8). They simply hoped He would attempt it and fail in the attempt.
It does not good arguing with an atheist. No matter what evidence you present to them, they will dismiss it. Remember Laman and Lemuel? An angel could appear to these people and they would still deny it. Rely only on your own experience and testimony. DO NOT listen to those who's only intent is to drag others down with them.
@cevansroxy I find it funny how you say "DO NOT listen to those who's only intent et cetra." Seems a bit narrow minded doesn't it? Don't listen to anyone. Don't question the outrageous stories you've been told. If you do, you will burn in hell.
@parachutepants101 - Ask God. He will confirm the truth of additional information about Israel. See James 1:5-6, 1 John 5:9 - But ask in faith... because if you already think you know your own answers, nothing God will say could matter.
you have been deceived by the father of lies, for many false prophets will arise. there is no solid evidence, you are clutching for straws. with the bible there is massive proof. do not add or take anything from this(bible) book.
When Joesph Smith "plagerized" from the King James bible he also copied the error from it as well not to mention its in old english just for example. Why does a linguistical relationship exist between native American languages and Asian (Siberian) languages? How did the Book of Mormon language evolve so rapidly into non-related Indian languages? Indo-European is much older than the Book of Mormon time period, yet vestiges of Indo-European exist through all of Europe and parts of Asia?
This is BULLSH@T! Just like when old Joe said he was translating the Egyptian Scrolls....HE LIED! They found the scrolls in the 60's and they said nothing about Abraham.....Mormon Religion = BULLSH@T!
@maitreyaisthebeast - is this what a book told you to believe? Just because something is written, the it must be true if it suits you. Most of the people who write "Anti-Mormon" stuff quit or were excommunicated from the church. You mean to tell me this? THAT YOU WILL LET SOMEONE WHO WAS FOUND UN-FIT FOR THE CHURCH OR WAS A QUITTER OF THE CHURCH ACTUALLY DO YOUR THINKING FOR YOU?
@THELDSLIFE Maybe you should do some thinking and not let a group of men determine your salvation. Who says to what extent is living sinless sufficient for maintaining a LDS membership? Men, not God. God says come to me as you are, I could see David being excommed for wanting to sin with Bathsheba...he would never have been saved had he joined mormonism eh? I am not ex mormon I am a seeker of truth.
@THELDSLIFE "Most of the people who write "Anti-Mormon" stuff quit or were excommunicated from the church....THAT YOU WILL LET SOMEONE WHO WAS FOUND UN-FIT FOR THE CHURCH OR WAS A QUITTER OF THE CHURCH ACTUALLY DO YOUR THINKING FOR YOU?"
wow. many "quitters", if not most, leave because the church no longer passed the sniff test for them. many exmo's describe similar nagging intuitions about specific issues with lds history and doctrine that they eventually come to realize as justified.
@plunderpunk - what you say here is no different than the Atheist who has no faith in anything. Are you an Atheist? Do you subscribe to what other men say just because they have a PHD next to their names? Do you choose to believe that there was a "Great Flood" as the Bible records or follow after the words of an intellectual who will suggest there never was one?
For the most part, people like hearing the denials and the doubts be affirmed by other men.
@THELDSLIFE each person on this planet has the basic human right to freedom of will. this freedom allows them to live their lives as they please. this includes changing our paths. you, theldslife, participate in a theist tradition. ALL traditions are man made constructs. if a specific tradition doesn't suite an individual, that individual has the fore mentioned freedom to leave it. naturally, strict adherents to the left tradition are likely to warn of dire consequences to the leaver.
@plunderpunk - Traditions of the God of Israel were not man made. They were man-perpetuated... and this was done so that mankind would know to whom they should turn for a remission from their transgressions and for a hope for a better world after we pass on from this life to the next.
This life is the time for men to prepare to meet God and the time to perform our labors.
If this is too difficult for men to discover and become enlisted for the work set before us, never such happiness to know.
@THELDSLIFE "Traditions of the God of Israel were not man made. They were man-perpetuated...
Man made, man-perpetrated... what's the difference? More importantly, what makes that difference different from say, the hundreds of other Gods through out history? Popularity?
@plunderpunk - the difference is: Prophets see God and God tells them the truth about our reasons for being here. They feel that it is in our best interests to let us know about the plan. Even though we did not live during the days of Adam, Moses, or even Jesus Christ, does not mean that we would have to SEE things to believe them. A certain requirement of faith is in order. The God of Israel, being the one true God and father of us all is something that ALL men must come to grips with.
@THELDSLIFE man must act as a prophet and other men must decide if that man will be recognized as such MANY have claimed to have HIS word reveled to them, namely the prophets of the hundreds of other Gods you don't believe in. this is a social process. involving certain theist customs to work out the details. it inevitably comes down to faith, like you said. religious faith. something useful to those participating in theist traditions. as for the rest of us, not so useful.
@THELDSLIFE "The God of Israel, being the one true God and father of us all is something that ALL men must come to grips with." unfortunately for the god of isreal, most folks either already recognize their regional deities, or don't follow a theist tradition. reading up on the early history of the jews is pretty fascinating. they are are cited as the first group to claim their god was above all over gods. ballsy, huh?
@plunderpunk - as sure as the sun sets and rises, there is a god. And if there is no God, then we are not... for if there was no God, then there would be no earth nor any reason to make one for those, his children, where we all could dwell and move towards eternity continuously progressing towards eternal increase and a perfectness of knowledge which awaits those who seek after him in the cosmos. this life is the test. We are here to be tested to see whether we will seek after universal truth!
@THELDSLIFE "as sure as the sun sets and rises, there is a god." all deity worshipers think this. you may believe as you wish. freedom of will allows for this. as for me, i will let observable certainties guild my existence. the theist view of a life after this life is a faith based tradition that the natural world simply doesn't require. all creatures are products of the natural world, including humans. how these creatures decided to define their world is how gods were invented and refined.
@iknorock23 - according to whom? People who write books and squabble over the things they don't understand? Admit something to your self... the ideas about or against the Book of Mormon are not your own. Instead of rely on the words of men or the opinions of others, take your questions to the source. And in the Bible, read this verse and then get back to me. 1 John 5:9 (First John is later on in the New Testament labeled as 1 john, 2 john and 3 john...) Then pose the RIGHT questions...
@THELDSLIFE I am an atheist. I follow logic. I do not believe the Bible, the BoM, the Koran, the Rig Veda, or any other "holy book" is divinely inspired. My ideas about religion as a whole and their books are my own. Who are you to suggest I can't have an original thought? If you really believe ancient tribes of Israel who didn't have the technology to sail across the Mediterrean, had the technology to sail across the ATLANTIC OCEAN, I'm sorry, but I can't take you seriously.
@iknorock23 - people have been un inspired, un informed, and un original. There are some people who still believe that Edison was the only one who invented the "Light Bulb" when we know that this technology was here for centuries during the reign of the Egyptians. Evidence of Eastern people traveling over to the new world is VERY well known and not hiding in some archives.
Check into the Arabic Writings found in Colorado at Black Rock. This should be a good start to wrap your mind around.
@THELDSLIFE You cannot assert that Egyptians had light bulbs from the discovery of The Baghdad Battery. And if Ancient Israelites had traveled into the New World, they would have needed to make pitstops, no? Therefore, we should be able to find Israelite artifacts in North Africa, Spain or Portugal, but we don't, because this never happened. If God wanted us to truly believe any religion was "right" he would have made it abundantly clear, but he doesn't, because he doesn't exist.
@THELDSLIFE Hahaha, an all powerful God. Ever heard of Epicurus's trilemma? Your all powerful God is neither good nor omnipotent. In fact, he doesn't even exist.
@iknorock23 - whatever. good luck in the oblivion and obscurity that awaits you and the nothingness that your energy will transform into... because as we both now know, it's all just a happy accident where we get to come to earth, jerk off, and then die.
@THELDSLIFE The nothingness that awaits me most likely also awaits you. If you think that the purpose of religion is just so I'll be alright in the 'Afterlife' (something which has yet to be proven to exist), then I say it's not worth it. And yes, the very creation of this Earth is a product of pure chance, "a happy accident".
@austinx I am an R.N. with a degree in Nursing. I also have an A.D. In IT Tech. I make more money in a Day that you make in a Month. I am a Pilot and own and fly my own plane. I have raised 6 children and 3 of them are Professional Engineers (2 work for Mercedes Benz) I own my home, paid for. I have zero Credit debt, cards paid off. I own 2 cars, new, both fully paid for. I am in perfect health and live in one of the most beautiful areas of New Mexico. Yeah..I fail at life. Ya fucking idiot.
I overheared some sectular geologists talking and they found physical proof for the book of mormon, swords, coins, pottery, maps, building foundaeshuns, scrolls, weapons, knives, ancient figures, statues of lehi and his sons, but the most shocking evidence was a room filled with what might be regarded as...penis sheathes...not very long or big in diameter...much like a pencil that's been sharpend too much! but there was a startaling lack of evidence for the existance of the females.
When Joseph Smith clearly said that the events related in the BoM occurred in New York (the area of Hill Cumorah specifically) why is anything found or related to Meso-America at issue?
You had to take Joseph's story and move it 1000's of mile south then look high and low for supporting data.
You failed to find anything non-conjectural, provable or substantial after major searching and vast expenditure of money.
And then failed to submit anything for peer review.
The headdress is a 'leaf nosed bat', The sculpture of the beared man is clearly of an asiatic person and not Hebrew at all. Still no Mormon evidence...sorry guys.
Matthew chapter five is lifted whole out of the Bible and placed into the BoM. The sermon on the mount was given from Jesus to the native Americans (Josephite exiles who speak reformed egyptian) In it Jesus tells them that whosoever shall compel the to go a mile go with him twain. ( 3 Nephi 12:41, Matthew 5:41) This refers to a Roman law that allows soldiers to require non citizen subjects to carry their gear for a mile, only making sense if they had ever been under Roman occupation.
The problems with authenticating the BoM are much hairyer than you Mormons might think. You see whole chapters are identical, word for word, to the King James translation of the Bible. First we know that either the brittish translators discovered the golden plates, copied them, and then put them back or Joseph Smith plagerized. Additionally, Mormons have to prove that the Roman Empire was in control of portions of the Americas as well. Why? Read my next post!
I've asked repeatedly for physical1 evidence confirming any person, place or event in the BOM. The answers are "it exists" (but will not be named). There there are absurd claims - DNA "went away", Hebrew in Indian languages, Indians did not originate in Asia, Incans had silk and other non-proofs.
Why not one ruin, weapon, road, city, chariot, horse, pig or cow skeletons,etc. When asked about the phony Book of Abraham papyri, the fact that JS created a bogus book is ignored;
Columus discribed white indian tribes with beards and so did many other explorers, and they did so through out the 1500's before the Catholic invation. Read "Voices from the Dust." The author covers this and the hebrew lanquage in totem, and how Hebrew words can be found in every native language. How white skinned natives were found in high levels of government and religion.
I just finished watching a Nat Geo (I think) show on some tribes that put on mud and clay head-dresses and the ancient reason was that coming to one battle their ancestors fell in the mub, when they appeared in battle, they appeared white, scaring the other tribe away, and the tradition continues, hundreds of yrs later., So white= mud? Paint? albino? ash? leprosy?
The ignorance of Christianity is part of the reason for war against the europeans, as their religion was foreign to them!
This is good evidence. the critics can not deny every piece of this evidence. ELEPHANTS! WHEELS! CEMENT! WOW!
Angelspeaks2u 3 days ago
@Angelspeaks2u - deny they shall still surely try.
THELDSLIFE 3 days ago
@Angelspeaks2u I did see a Glenn Beck clip where some old
Hebrew tabs were found in the mid west
DoinDabzByTheSlabs 9 hours ago
Any links to a photo of Pre-Columbian Hebrew script? Is it Old Hebrew-Ugaritic from Jaredite times, or Assyrian-influenced Second Temple/early Modern Hebrew from Nephite times?
trilobright 4 weeks ago
You know there is one other thing to consider..... Well throughout the ages there have been a number of alternative calenders. Because of this there is an inconsistent measurement of Time it's self. When we start going back in time. We would need to keep changing the measurements or we will be shooting off unrealistic numbers of years, months, and days.
OtakuDeju 1 month ago
It is obvious the the Book of Mormon was a fraud written by a pedophile.
Farmerat911 1 month ago
@Farmerat911
I love ignorant people... they think they are smart and witty when they are just really they are just regurgitating the same thing over and over.
Sk8er408 1 month ago
@Sk8er408
John Smith wasn't a pedophile?
Farmerat911 1 month ago
@Farmerat911
Can you prove other wise? Let me guess... you are going to point to his 14 y/o wife? The one that was nothing more then a marriage that her dad wanted not JS? I would love to indulge your bigotry and hatred... but if JS was indulging in endless sex like i'm sure you believe where are all his heirs? We only have one line and that is from Emma. Most if not all JS marriage are debatable.
Sk8er408 1 month ago
“Did you ever hear of abortion being practiced in Nauvoo?"
"Yes. There was some talk about Joseph getting no issue from all the women he had intercourse with. Dr. Foster spoke to me about the fact. But I don't remember what was told about abortion. If I heard things of the kind, I didn't believe in them at that time. Joseph was very free in his talk about his women. (Continued, See next post)
Farmerat911 1 month ago
Cont, "He told me one day of a certain girl and remarked, that she had given him more pleasure than any girl he had ever enjoyed. I told him it was horrible to talk like this." (Interview with Wm. Law. March. 30, 1887; THE DAILY TRIBUNE: SALT LAKE CITY, SUNDAY MORNING, JULY 31, 1887
Farmerat911 1 month ago
@Farmerat911
Sorry for destroying all your research into the perfect proof that JS is an evil man.
Sk8er408 1 month ago
@Farmerat911 1800s was very much know for yellow journalism.
mormondefender26 3 weeks ago
@Farmerat911
William Law had good reason to dislike JS.After all his wife asked JS to marry her because Law as an adulterer.After that Law was a personal enemy to JS.Even though he believed in the LDS church he believe JS was a fallen prophet. I wouldnt give credit to words against a man who his wife wanted to leave him for.
Come up with better propagandists that dont have a personal hate to propagate.
If you believe abortion as a a common practice then there is little you will not believe
Sk8er408 1 month ago
Could you please make a similar video about the Book of Abraham and how the Egyptologists explain the figures so different from Joseph? You know those people who have studied the ancient texts for years on end and have seen the similar "facimiles" as Joseph has printed on the Pearl of Great Price? Thanks,
hesanflicka 1 month ago
1:03 that is body paint they are wearing
interstellarwonder 1 month ago
@interstellarwonder - it's interesting you would mention that because in the Book of Mormon we learn that those that were Nephites but who were dissenters of the faith made a "Mark" on their own bodies and would color them as such.
"And the Amlicites were distinguished from the Nephites, for they had marked themselves with red in their foreheads after the manner of the Lamanites; nevertheless they had not shorn their heads like unto the Lamanites." Alma chapter 3:4
THELDSLIFE 1 month ago
and now make a video about all the things which proof joseph smith wrong. XD
khosrow 2 months ago
@khosrow
Like what???
Sk8er408 2 months ago
@Sk8er408 like all the genetical proofs that nativ americans and jews are not related. and dont tell me its inacurate i work with it every day.
khosrow 2 months ago
@khosrow
Seeing that the people of the BoM are not Jews.... this is not proof of anything. But seeing that the 10 lost tribes of Israel were taken away to the east... and the American Indians are related to Asians.... this would be in the positive for the LDS... Way to show your ignorance of the facts.
Do you have another one? Or are you done liking like the fool?
Sk8er408 2 months ago
@khosrow
Now before yo get you panties in a bunch... The people of the BoM were of the tribe of Joseph... not Judas (or Jews). You can call any child of Israel a Jew... but this is not the same as them being from the tribe of Judah. You can consider yourself learned on this subject now...
Sk8er408 2 months ago
@Sk8er408 still there should be a higher score with the alignment. also the analysis of the mito-dna tells us another story.
also the book describes plant and animals that simply did not lived in america. like grapes (2Ne15:2,4,3Ne14:16) or Elephants. the book mentions metallurgical engineering countless times. still not a single pre-columbian object made of metal was found. surprising since the book mentions wars with millions of soldiers taking part.
khosrow 2 months ago
@khosrow
Says who? We are all descended from Adam and then thought Noah... I think you need to start attacking the bible for a failure of DNA proof...
You don't understand the evidence or the argument... You have to make things up to even be able to claim it is evidence... They are not Jews...
Sk8er408 2 months ago
@khosrow Did you really intent to say "all" the things that prove joseph wrong? That would be a lengthy video! ;)
boydslittlefactory 1 month ago
@boydslittlefactory indeed the list would be endless XD
khosrow 1 month ago
@THELDSLIFE Thats a loaded question, I guarantee he will dismiss your answer
blackmamba54321 2 months ago
@ctrlaltWOOT - If the Bible were so complete, why did the writers not give clues as to where the arc of Noah would be, the burial place of Abraham? Why is there no record of "Joseph" in Egypt? A plausibly Identified location for Mt. Sanai (There are 20 possible peaks where this could have happened but Archaeology has been unable to produce even the locations of certain cities such as "Sodom and Gomorrah" and so forth. Before getting into a BOM argument, know your own problems with the Bible.
THELDSLIFE 2 months ago
@parachutepants101 Sorry for the delay, vacationed. Anyways, there is nothing wrong with "praising" someone. And for you to conclude your idea of "the bible doesn't mention dinosaurs, therefore it is false" only shows your lack of reasoning. Build up an argument out of specultion with zero proof. You sure destroyed that strawman!
blackmamba54321 3 months ago
@blackmamba54321 Okay, instead of me disproving with stories of Krishna, Mithra, and Horus. How about you prove that there is a God.
parachutepants101 2 months ago
@parachutepants101 "How about you prove there is a God". How about you prove there isn't one? Really, I can tell you "looked" and "studied" evidence and came to the "conclusion" that there is no God because the ever changing "science" "proves" it. If we are going to debate, lets do it on grounds that we can actually back up and both consider circumstantial.
blackmamba54321 2 months ago
@blackmamba54321 You're avoiding the original statement.
parachutepants101 2 months ago
@parachutepants101 Alright then, I'll answer it. You can do the response given by LDSLIFE. Things that I consider evidence is the creation of the universe.
blackmamba54321 2 months ago
@parachutepants101 Now prove there isn't one
blackmamba54321 2 months ago
@blackmamba54321 Part 1... I quote Carl Sagan "When someone approaches me with a theory or story, it's obvious that one should follow that with fact and evidence defending that theory. Religion avoids that. They use no evidence, proof, or logical thought. Instead of answering life questions with the honest answer of I don't know. They say "Because God et cetra" They respond with sayings like "Because I believe", "I feel it", and use the word Faith to justify their beliefs. Faith by definition...
parachutepants101 2 months ago
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@parachutepants101 Religion:1. a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, especially when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs. cont...
blackmamba54321 2 months ago
@parachutepants101 cont... Faith: confidence or trust in a person or thing: faith in another's ability.
Whether you like it or not, Atheism is a religion. One does not need to believe in God to be "religious". Its great you can quote someone of somewhat importance of views such as these quotes present, but your logic contradicts itself. I see no point in arguing someone who is closed minded.
blackmamba54321 2 months ago
@blackmamba54321 Part 1....I'm rather open minded. I've read the Bible, The Book of Mormon, and even the Qur'an. I've considered many religions and I assure you I didn't become an Atheist overnight. I struggled with it for quite some time. But my knowledge and logical thinking is what makes me what I am. And Atheism is not a religion in the same sense as most would consider. Considering religion by definition is a belief in how we got here, then some would consider it one. But we don't...
parachutepants101 2 months ago
@blackmamba54321 Part 2.... gather to worship as most would expect of common religions. Saying Atheism a religion is like saying "not collecting stamps" is a hobby. It's just not true.
parachutepants101 2 months ago
@parachutepants101 Awesome. I'm quoting that from now on.
amaxamon 2 months ago
@amaxamon Be my guest. Which part are you quoting exactly? I said quite a bit.
parachutepants101 2 months ago
@blackmamba54321 Part 2.... is believing in something without rational thought, without logic, without proof. Therefore, I see no reason to listen to them rant on about their otherwise ridiculous stories."
parachutepants101 2 months ago
4 spelling errors on the slide at 5:20! --- But of course, everything else in this clip is accurate and true? Not a chance! You (Mormons) are being deceived! Go read up at: MormonCurtain. com; then come back and report. Your church is a gigantic hoax!
Jinxterman69 3 months ago
@Jinxterman69 - thank you for pointing out the spelling error. Have you ever heard the poem, "The Builder?" I'll share it with you in PM.
THELDSLIFE 3 months ago
@THELDSLIFE What author?
gotyourtongue 3 months ago
Nice, I'm examining mormonism and surprisingly have found "proof" of fraud so often mentioned as matter of common knowledge impossible to find. It has an elegant cosmology and retains practices that seem most consistent with new findings of the quashed scriptures such as the newly found books of Enoch which parallel the papyrus blow for blow, also re-establishing some of these works to their importance before rome took over after seeing the saints proved problematic and radical. One love, MrM
MetanoidAndroid 3 months ago
@cbl2928 - Im not trying to argue, but have u read the old testament about holy garments used by priests? Aarons sons were stricken dead because they entered the holy temple without it.
As for becoming Gods, what good father has ever not wanted his children to be as good or better than him? I know that nothing would make me prouder as a father than for my children to follow my advice, learn from my teaching and become greater than I. Just sayin.
BTW @THELDSLIFE Thanks for the awesome video
ZorroTech88 3 months ago
@ZorroTech88 He's trolling on the "How Joseph Smith Wrote the Book of Mormon" vid also. Its clear he has a bone to pick with us and not other "christians".
blackmamba54321 3 months ago
@blackmamba54321 Or maybe he's just intelligent and is against all religion, like any rationally, logically thinking person would be.
parachutepants101 3 months ago
@parachutepants101 "like any rationally, logically thinking person would be", and whats that supposed to mean?
blackmamba54321 3 months ago
@blackmamba54321 If you were intelligent, maybe you would know.
parachutepants101 3 months ago
@parachutepants101 "If you were intelligent, maybe you would know", haha, I knew that was the kind of response I would get. You think your intelligent? Get over yourself.
blackmamba54321 3 months ago
@blackmamba54321 I don't mean to sound self-righteous here but I'm quite confident that I'm smarter than you. Please, continue avoiding the debate at hand.
parachutepants101 3 months ago
@parachutepants101 Try me bud.
blackmamba54321 3 months ago
@blackmamba54321 Okay, while we're here on a religious video, let's debate that. Mormons. Good or bad?
parachutepants101 3 months ago
@parachutepants101 Great.
blackmamba54321 3 months ago
@blackmamba54321 Honestly? You believe being a Mormon is the smart thing to do with your life? Praising a man from Missouri.
parachutepants101 3 months ago
@parachutepants101 - true to the truths for which martyrs have perished. What sort of people receive your praises? Basketball stars? Political leaders? There's a lot of praise going on. Which of those role models in life do you praise and are they praise worthy? Compared to Obama, I can't think of anyone else more praise worthy. Just ask those of the Obama team.
THELDSLIFE 3 months ago
@THELDSLIFE Who said I praise anyone?
parachutepants101 3 months ago
@parachutepants101 - men and women in this world receive praise.
Who do you praise? Who have you ever clapped for or cheered?
The answer better be nobody if no one deserves the praises of men.
My praises go to the Lord and to his anointed servants
because if it were not for them, the restoration of the Lords gospel could not take place as it has been previously outlined that it would take place in Acts 3: 19-23 ...
now, being that time of a "Restitution of All Things."
God keeps his promises.
THELDSLIFE 3 months ago
@THELDSLIFE Our differences in "praise" varies drastically. If you want to waste the little time you have on this earth on something as idiotic as religion be my guest. Even though it's been dis-proven. Read about Horus. The entire Bible is plagiarized.
parachutepants101 3 months ago
@parachutepants101 If you choose to believe the Bible was plagiarized, then that's your choice. We believe there are problems with the Bible, true, but in translation only. But the Bible is only evidence of the living God and it would seem to me that you don't yet have faith in that concept; that we are literally children of God and that there is a master creator in charge of the cosmos. If it were anything other than your idea of being "Controlled" or that u can't live your life, I'd agree.
THELDSLIFE 3 months ago
@THELDSLIFE What you just said might seem fine and normal to most but to me was absolutely psychotic. All this belief in a Master Creator and Children of God is crazy. Step back and listen to yourself. Lost in translation? Bullshit. Did you even look up Horus? Christianity just scares you into believing otherwise you'll go to hell. You're so called "God" is completely hypocritical and man-made. He's a jealous God who destroyed his own creation of Earth multiple times. And why didn't he mention..
parachutepants101 3 months ago
@THELDSLIFE anything about dinosaurs or other galaxies? Because man didn't have any knowledge of any of that then. Face it, God doesn't exist. Religion is all a lie.
parachutepants101 3 months ago
@ZorroTech88 It's absolutely true. cbl2928 is clueless, and his narrow minded atheist world has him stumbling like a fish out of the water. And he doesn't attack other Christians. His only attack is on the chuch that Jesus Christ restored.
LDS4Life71 3 months ago
Dont waist your time and energy arguing with Atheists, They only want to bring you down to their level.
Robyshileileh 3 months ago
@Robyshileileh Now that is the definition of condescension, right there. What do you mean when you say "their level"? Is being skeptical a bad thing? Are you somehow above evidence? They would't be wasting their time AT ALL if they had some objective, hard evidence; some proof that could explain all of the blatant contradictions, inconsistencies, and problems with science. I do not appreciate people trying to put others down for not buying into and challenging their delusions/baseless claims.
cbl2988 3 months ago
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@LDS4Life71 Well, it is true that I do not believe in the existence of any God(s). Certainly not in your three gods. But you call me a liar when you can prove a god's existence.
cbl2988 3 months ago
Nice video. I have found the same in my own research: elephant tusks and bones being found at the bottom of sinotes, etc. Most of the claims are dumb. These people could do a google search and find this stuff out before they post in error. Scientists are finding ancient African trinkets in meso-America and how about the popol vuh? All fascinating and testimony strengthening stuff to people who haven't obligated themselves to fight against the LDS faith. "Girl don't go away mad, girl j..."
joeyslaptop 3 months ago
@LDS4Life71 What "lies" are you referring to? Can you at least once substantiate your claims?
cbl2988 3 months ago
@cbl2988 The biggest lie is that you feel that God doesn't exist. Atheism is a disease for the gullible and naive.
LDS4Life71 3 months ago
@LDS4Life71 Skeptical=gullible. Got it.
cbl2988 3 months ago
I looked into a dirty gym sock and saw god telling me that the BOM is crap. Dude don't get mad, it's not me who said it, GOD said it. I'm just the humble messenger.
THEINVENTABLETHREAT 3 months ago
So how does any of this prove the BOM is an acurate archeological record again? Where can I go see Nephite and Lamanite artifacts? The Hill Cumorah was suppose to ahve thousands killed, so how many arrrowheads,spears,chariots etc...have been found there? just curious.
Gideon6640man 3 months ago
@Gideon6640man The lands are in the yukatan peninsula, and the cities there were given spanish names, but orignally had different names, and the iconography is proof.
LDS4Life71 3 months ago
@LDS4Life71 No I mean REAL proof like you would put in a museum like the Smithsonian.
Gideon6640man 3 months ago
@Gideon6640man The Smithsonian is NOT christian. It is the cult of bohemia. You can't use the Smithsonian unless yo want to be laughed out of the room.
LDS4Life71 3 months ago
@Gideon6640man The real proof I'd really like to see is an evangelical that isn't a liar, and a hypocrit.
LDS4Life71 3 months ago
@LDS4Life71 Typical..Liar? you don't know me so don't pretend to ok?show me where I lied...but stop evading and answer the question, a direct and choerent one at that.
Gideon6640man 3 months ago
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@Gideon6640man There is NO rapture, and it's NOT biblical, but the doctrines of men just as your false faith. Evangelicals are living a lie, and NOT born again. For the baptism doth save us, and not just saying "i believe in Jebus, the three headed morphing goo god of Neoplatonism from the pagan Constantine.
Again find the true and biblical resurrected God of the bible, and not some mere ghostie. Luke 24:34-39
LDS4Life71 3 months ago
LOL, all the "evidence" is from their art, not actual physical evidence. Hopefully my drawing of fish people will convince people hundreds of years from now that mermaids existed.
MengoMango 3 months ago
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@MengoMango google "Mounting Evidence for the Book of Mormon - Ensign Jan 2000," by Daniel E. Peterson. It's a scholarly article and includes info and references about Mesoamerica. At the start, B. H. Roberts reminds us, “The power of the Holy Ghost…must ever be the chief source of evidence for the Book of Mormon. All other evidence is secondary.…No arrangement of evidence, however skillfully ordered; no argument, however adroitly made, can ever take its place.”
LDS4Life71 3 months ago
@MengoMango - art and sculpture is EVERYTHING because it defines the culture.
THELDSLIFE 3 months ago
@THELDSLIFE Art is part of culture, but that has nothing to do with physical evidence. If you can say that the supposed paintings of "white people" are evidence that they existed in North America, then the paintings of the Mayan gods are evidence that the Mayan gods also exist. Bright red people also must have existed in North America.
MengoMango 3 months ago
@THELDSLIFE So Lord of the Rings "defines" the English culture?? There is a reason why the mainstream scientific community does not support Book of Mormon claims (they actually contradict a lot of them), and no, it is not because they are "anti-mormon".
cbl2988 3 months ago
wtf??? thats two white boys kneeling to the black man.. how can you try to lie when im looking right at your so call evidence???? 1.02 in the video ...so stupid...
SonnyKarlyle 3 months ago
Let me do a little critique.
1:02 The people aren't white they are multicolored.
1:26 600-2000 years ago. Native Americans, Buddhists, Hindus, used the "swastika" design. I guess they were Hitler youth?
1:58 Many natives throughout the Americas can and do grow goatees...lol
2:30 Yeah, there called Wooly mammoths and Mastodons that migrated south after the ice age.
3:10 who says natives didn't know what a wheel was...rednecks?
3:47 Yeah, that's a modern replica
4:44 Metal Relief- it's common
THEINVENTABLETHREAT 4 months ago
@THEINVENTABLETHREAT
Nice try on the multi color.
Hitler copied it... not the other way around.
That is with the mixed blood. And it was talking about central and south America.
Wrong.
First you claim it... now you deny it... typical.
Sk8er408 4 months ago
They are multi-colored
Just because its in the shape of a cross doesn't mean it's a crucifix.
Sorry, it's from Mexico (it plainly states that under the piece) and many can grow and do grow goatees.
Yeah, I deny the link to elephants and Mormonism. Every 3rd grader knows there were mammoths and Mastodons in the Americas. Many scientists believe they became extinct much much later than 9000 years ago they migrated into south America because of the ice age.
THEINVENTABLETHREAT 3 months ago
@THEINVENTABLETHREAT Hey genius, there are three species of elephant in the amazon jungle today, and they were hunted by the Mayans while they were yet indigenous up there, but the elephant moved south to avoid the ice age, and they survived.
your information is way outdated.
LDS4Life71 3 months ago
@LDS4Life71 Hey genius, There are no elephants in the Amazon today. Indigenous "up there?" Mayans lived 1300 miles below the ice flow. Thomas Jefferson was told by Indians that they hunted mammoth around the great lakes. I have a real education, not LDS brainwashing. Believe whatever you're told, I really don't care, it's actually amusing. We have genetic science that totally blows LDS theory out of the water.
THEINVENTABLETHREAT 3 months ago
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LDS4Life71 3 months ago
@THEINVENTABLETHREAT Elephant remains have been found in central and south america.
LDS4Life71 3 months ago
@THEINVENTABLETHREAT name your source, oh we have genetic science that totally blows LDS theory out of the water.
you got nothing, liar.
LDS4Life71 3 months ago
@LDS4Life71 - /watch?v=yY4RmIRoLNs
THELDSLIFE 3 months ago
@THELDSLIFE plz don't forget to upload that video by Joseph Allen PhD. I would like to know how also.
LDS4Life71 3 months ago
@LDS4Life71 Look it up, read a damn book, article, scientific journal about ancestry and genes if you're so damn interested in archeology and science. You're obviously not interested in facts because they conflict with your religious views. You'd rather believe a man that stuck his head in a hat, from which, he talked to god, than get an education.
THEINVENTABLETHREAT 3 months ago
@THEINVENTABLETHREAT I have and it was written by people that know more than they do. I know it was by the power of God, and I have one thanks.
LDS4Life71 3 months ago
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cbl2988 3 months ago
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@LDS4Life71 So the Book of Mormon > bodies of scientific literature and decades of research. Got it. "I know"="It makes me feel good, so I am going to take it as absolute truth in spite of bodies of scientific research to the contrary and many, many other incompatible religious views, such as Islam, Judaism, Catholicism, Protestantism, etc. all making similar claims citing similar sources, with just as much sincerity and conviction". Got it.
cbl2988 3 months ago
@LDS4Life71 - why is it that people just don't want to believe? Why wouldn't you want to believe? Why would additional information from the house of Israel be threatening and not supportive of the one fact that Jehovah is the one true God? If you had more than 1 son, would you only favor the one or would you speak to the other as well? If that information had not been made known to the rest of the world, one would not assume you loved the one son and not the other. Am I missing something?
THELDSLIFE 3 months ago
@THELDSLIFE Sure, it sounds nice. But that doesn't make it true. Some people find Mormonism totally objectionable because it makes extremely radical claims, like humans can become Gods, you need to wear funny, uncomfortable, magic underwear, and you have to participate in extremely bizarre cultist rituals. There are PLENTY of reasons why people would object to Mormonism. Not to mention that science demonstrates that the BOM is not what it claims to be, and the Book of Abraham is molarchy.
cbl2988 3 months ago
@cbl2988 You are just a liar, and a mocker. You have nothing, but your atheistic gullible lies. Pity The LORD will see you in the afterlife, and you wont like how you are treated.
LDS4Life71 3 months ago
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@LDS4Life71 You know nothing.
THEINVENTABLETHREAT 3 months ago
@LDS4Life71 I gave you plenty of material with a visual mapping of human migrations from National Geographic based on genetic markers. Have you gotten around to it or are you going to pretend that doesn't exist either?
cbl2988 3 months ago
What a load of nonsense! Listen to real archeologist, historians, geneticits, ect. None give any credence to the Book of Mormon. We have a pretty clear picture of what happened in the Americas before Columbus and none of it fits the Book of Morons. These LDS people just cherry-pick things out of context to try to cast doubt on what is agreed upon by the vast majority of archeologists. Have any of these LDS people published anything in a peer reviewed scientific journal supporting the BOM? NO...
veritasEtjusticia 4 months ago
Yea, i say unto all that these arguments should end. If thou doth not believe in Christ ye should not hate those which do believe in his name, but if ye do believe in his name as i, thou should not hate those which do not for love is the way of the Lord Jesus Christ. Let us argue no more for there is nothing to argue about, i watch these videos and view the comments and they sadden me insomuch that i do cry, there is enough hate in the world today. Let us love one another <3
At0m1cA1 4 months ago
there's nothing solid about Jesus Christ either and yet men are compelled to believe that he is the redeemer.
THELDSLIFE 5 months ago
@THELDSLIFE That's it typical LDS cultist, when the BOM is shown to be false attack the Bible or Christ himself...let me just say this Jesus was a hsitrical figure , even the Jews who rejected him acknowledge that where as Nephi,Lehi,Laman & charlie Brown are make believe....
Gideon6640man 3 months ago
@Gideon6640man - You're entitled to your wrong opinion.
THELDSLIFE 3 months ago
Some seek after signs and wonders because they seek an occasion to excuse their unbelief. There were people in Jesus’ day who “tested” Him by seeking a sign (Matthew 16:1) Since they specified that the sign be “from heaven,” they most likely wanted something spectacular, similar to Elijah’s calling down fire from the sky (1 Kings 18:38) or Isaiah’s causing the sun to reverse course (Isaiah 38:8). They simply hoped He would attempt it and fail in the attempt.
cevansroxy 5 months ago
It does not good arguing with an atheist. No matter what evidence you present to them, they will dismiss it. Remember Laman and Lemuel? An angel could appear to these people and they would still deny it. Rely only on your own experience and testimony. DO NOT listen to those who's only intent is to drag others down with them.
cevansroxy 5 months ago 8
@cevansroxy I find it funny how you say "DO NOT listen to those who's only intent et cetra." Seems a bit narrow minded doesn't it? Don't listen to anyone. Don't question the outrageous stories you've been told. If you do, you will burn in hell.
parachutepants101 2 months ago
@parachutepants101 - Ask God. He will confirm the truth of additional information about Israel. See James 1:5-6, 1 John 5:9 - But ask in faith... because if you already think you know your own answers, nothing God will say could matter.
THELDSLIFE 2 months ago
you have been deceived by the father of lies, for many false prophets will arise. there is no solid evidence, you are clutching for straws. with the bible there is massive proof. do not add or take anything from this(bible) book.
lunabranwen 7 months ago
When Joesph Smith "plagerized" from the King James bible he also copied the error from it as well not to mention its in old english just for example. Why does a linguistical relationship exist between native American languages and Asian (Siberian) languages? How did the Book of Mormon language evolve so rapidly into non-related Indian languages? Indo-European is much older than the Book of Mormon time period, yet vestiges of Indo-European exist through all of Europe and parts of Asia?
wachnathan 8 months ago
what is this music please??
ulula97 8 months ago
This is BULLSH@T! Just like when old Joe said he was translating the Egyptian Scrolls....HE LIED! They found the scrolls in the 60's and they said nothing about Abraham.....Mormon Religion = BULLSH@T!
maitreyaisthebeast 8 months ago
@maitreyaisthebeast - is this what a book told you to believe? Just because something is written, the it must be true if it suits you. Most of the people who write "Anti-Mormon" stuff quit or were excommunicated from the church. You mean to tell me this? THAT YOU WILL LET SOMEONE WHO WAS FOUND UN-FIT FOR THE CHURCH OR WAS A QUITTER OF THE CHURCH ACTUALLY DO YOUR THINKING FOR YOU?
THELDSLIFE 8 months ago
@THELDSLIFE Maybe you should do some thinking and not let a group of men determine your salvation. Who says to what extent is living sinless sufficient for maintaining a LDS membership? Men, not God. God says come to me as you are, I could see David being excommed for wanting to sin with Bathsheba...he would never have been saved had he joined mormonism eh? I am not ex mormon I am a seeker of truth.
israelside 7 months ago
@THELDSLIFE "Most of the people who write "Anti-Mormon" stuff quit or were excommunicated from the church....THAT YOU WILL LET SOMEONE WHO WAS FOUND UN-FIT FOR THE CHURCH OR WAS A QUITTER OF THE CHURCH ACTUALLY DO YOUR THINKING FOR YOU?"
wow. many "quitters", if not most, leave because the church no longer passed the sniff test for them. many exmo's describe similar nagging intuitions about specific issues with lds history and doctrine that they eventually come to realize as justified.
plunderpunk 6 months ago
@plunderpunk - what you say here is no different than the Atheist who has no faith in anything. Are you an Atheist? Do you subscribe to what other men say just because they have a PHD next to their names? Do you choose to believe that there was a "Great Flood" as the Bible records or follow after the words of an intellectual who will suggest there never was one?
For the most part, people like hearing the denials and the doubts be affirmed by other men.
It makes sinning feel more bearable.
THELDSLIFE 6 months ago
@THELDSLIFE each person on this planet has the basic human right to freedom of will. this freedom allows them to live their lives as they please. this includes changing our paths. you, theldslife, participate in a theist tradition. ALL traditions are man made constructs. if a specific tradition doesn't suite an individual, that individual has the fore mentioned freedom to leave it. naturally, strict adherents to the left tradition are likely to warn of dire consequences to the leaver.
plunderpunk 6 months ago
@plunderpunk - Traditions of the God of Israel were not man made. They were man-perpetuated... and this was done so that mankind would know to whom they should turn for a remission from their transgressions and for a hope for a better world after we pass on from this life to the next.
This life is the time for men to prepare to meet God and the time to perform our labors.
If this is too difficult for men to discover and become enlisted for the work set before us, never such happiness to know.
THELDSLIFE 6 months ago
@THELDSLIFE "Traditions of the God of Israel were not man made. They were man-perpetuated...
Man made, man-perpetrated... what's the difference? More importantly, what makes that difference different from say, the hundreds of other Gods through out history? Popularity?
plunderpunk 6 months ago
@plunderpunk - the difference is: Prophets see God and God tells them the truth about our reasons for being here. They feel that it is in our best interests to let us know about the plan. Even though we did not live during the days of Adam, Moses, or even Jesus Christ, does not mean that we would have to SEE things to believe them. A certain requirement of faith is in order. The God of Israel, being the one true God and father of us all is something that ALL men must come to grips with.
THELDSLIFE 6 months ago
@THELDSLIFE man must act as a prophet and other men must decide if that man will be recognized as such MANY have claimed to have HIS word reveled to them, namely the prophets of the hundreds of other Gods you don't believe in. this is a social process. involving certain theist customs to work out the details. it inevitably comes down to faith, like you said. religious faith. something useful to those participating in theist traditions. as for the rest of us, not so useful.
plunderpunk 6 months ago
@THELDSLIFE "The God of Israel, being the one true God and father of us all is something that ALL men must come to grips with." unfortunately for the god of isreal, most folks either already recognize their regional deities, or don't follow a theist tradition. reading up on the early history of the jews is pretty fascinating. they are are cited as the first group to claim their god was above all over gods. ballsy, huh?
plunderpunk 6 months ago
@plunderpunk - it's easy to claim the truth when at last it will be confirmed.
THELDSLIFE 6 months ago
@THELDSLIFE "it's easy to claim the truth when at last it will be confirmed."
again, a theist stand by. as for me, my happiness is based in my life in reality: the sun rises,
the sun sets; i show affection to my loved ones and they show it back; i do well at work and
am rewarded by my superiors; i discuss points of interest and debate with my friends and
associates and we are enriched by it. i am a perfectly content individual as those are my rewards!
plunderpunk 6 months ago
@plunderpunk - as sure as the sun sets and rises, there is a god. And if there is no God, then we are not... for if there was no God, then there would be no earth nor any reason to make one for those, his children, where we all could dwell and move towards eternity continuously progressing towards eternal increase and a perfectness of knowledge which awaits those who seek after him in the cosmos. this life is the test. We are here to be tested to see whether we will seek after universal truth!
THELDSLIFE 6 months ago
@THELDSLIFE "as sure as the sun sets and rises, there is a god." all deity worshipers think this. you may believe as you wish. freedom of will allows for this. as for me, i will let observable certainties guild my existence. the theist view of a life after this life is a faith based tradition that the natural world simply doesn't require. all creatures are products of the natural world, including humans. how these creatures decided to define their world is how gods were invented and refined.
plunderpunk 6 months ago
@THELDSLIFE And what, then, are Mormons here for?
moparmonster1965 5 months ago
@maitreyaisthebeast partly right... all religion=bullsh@t
FUwogs 7 months ago
Comment removed
locreous 8 months ago 2
@locreous - google Book of Mormon and Nahom
THELDSLIFE 8 months ago
I honestly can't believe Mormons really believe this stuff. There's just SO many things wrong the BoM, it's almost not even worth debating.
iknorock23 8 months ago
@iknorock23 - according to whom? People who write books and squabble over the things they don't understand? Admit something to your self... the ideas about or against the Book of Mormon are not your own. Instead of rely on the words of men or the opinions of others, take your questions to the source. And in the Bible, read this verse and then get back to me. 1 John 5:9 (First John is later on in the New Testament labeled as 1 john, 2 john and 3 john...) Then pose the RIGHT questions...
THELDSLIFE 8 months ago
@THELDSLIFE I am an atheist. I follow logic. I do not believe the Bible, the BoM, the Koran, the Rig Veda, or any other "holy book" is divinely inspired. My ideas about religion as a whole and their books are my own. Who are you to suggest I can't have an original thought? If you really believe ancient tribes of Israel who didn't have the technology to sail across the Mediterrean, had the technology to sail across the ATLANTIC OCEAN, I'm sorry, but I can't take you seriously.
iknorock23 8 months ago
@iknorock23 - people have been un inspired, un informed, and un original. There are some people who still believe that Edison was the only one who invented the "Light Bulb" when we know that this technology was here for centuries during the reign of the Egyptians. Evidence of Eastern people traveling over to the new world is VERY well known and not hiding in some archives.
Check into the Arabic Writings found in Colorado at Black Rock. This should be a good start to wrap your mind around.
THELDSLIFE 8 months ago
@THELDSLIFE You cannot assert that Egyptians had light bulbs from the discovery of The Baghdad Battery. And if Ancient Israelites had traveled into the New World, they would have needed to make pitstops, no? Therefore, we should be able to find Israelite artifacts in North Africa, Spain or Portugal, but we don't, because this never happened. If God wanted us to truly believe any religion was "right" he would have made it abundantly clear, but he doesn't, because he doesn't exist.
iknorock23 8 months ago
@iknorock23 - yeah, they did make pit stops, probably... but let me ask you one thing. Is anything too IMPOSSIBLE for an all powerful God to do?
THELDSLIFE 8 months ago
@THELDSLIFE Hahaha, an all powerful God. Ever heard of Epicurus's trilemma? Your all powerful God is neither good nor omnipotent. In fact, he doesn't even exist.
iknorock23 8 months ago
@iknorock23 - whatever. good luck in the oblivion and obscurity that awaits you and the nothingness that your energy will transform into... because as we both now know, it's all just a happy accident where we get to come to earth, jerk off, and then die.
THELDSLIFE 8 months ago
@THELDSLIFE The nothingness that awaits me most likely also awaits you. If you think that the purpose of religion is just so I'll be alright in the 'Afterlife' (something which has yet to be proven to exist), then I say it's not worth it. And yes, the very creation of this Earth is a product of pure chance, "a happy accident".
iknorock23 8 months ago
@iknorock23 - Eat, Drink and be Merry! For Tomorrow we DIE!
THELDSLIFE 8 months ago
@austinx I hate it when they comment not knowing all the facts too.
LDS4Life71 9 months ago
@austinx
Golden Plates or it didn't happen.
hammerogod 9 months ago
hammerogod 9 months ago
I overheared some sectular geologists talking and they found physical proof for the book of mormon, swords, coins, pottery, maps, building foundaeshuns, scrolls, weapons, knives, ancient figures, statues of lehi and his sons, but the most shocking evidence was a room filled with what might be regarded as...penis sheathes...not very long or big in diameter...much like a pencil that's been sharpend too much! but there was a startaling lack of evidence for the existance of the females.
JSeely218 9 months ago
When Joseph Smith clearly said that the events related in the BoM occurred in New York (the area of Hill Cumorah specifically) why is anything found or related to Meso-America at issue?
You had to take Joseph's story and move it 1000's of mile south then look high and low for supporting data.
You failed to find anything non-conjectural, provable or substantial after major searching and vast expenditure of money.
And then failed to submit anything for peer review.
And you expect me to listen?
hammerogod 9 months ago
@hammerogod - why not? You listen to everyone else without ANY reproach. Why not me?
THELDSLIFE 9 months ago
@THELDSLIFE
~You answered a question with a question.
~Instead of giving me clear and definitive answers you assumed a defensive posture.
~I stated facts and you called it 'reproach'.
Your arguments and apologetics are weak and less than wholly satisfying.
I won't discount any possibilities until and unless they fail to meet 2 crucial criteria.
~They have to be proven within a reasonable framework.
~They have to be consistent with each other within that framework.
2 Words: Peer Review
hammerogod 9 months ago
@hammerogod - I can't answer questions you already have your own answers for.
THELDSLIFE 9 months ago
@THELDSLIFE
Are you claiming to be a Mind Reader?
How do you know that I have any answers at all?
Obviously you don't or you would have answered my question by now.
It seems that you are evading the very simple question I asked.
Let me ask it another way.
Why is research being done in "Meso-America" when Joseph said that Hill Cumorah (in New York state..U.S.A.) was the site of the Battles etc?
It doesn't make sense...it reeks of cutting off the toes to make the shoe fit...and it is deceptive.
hammerogod 9 months ago
The headdress is a 'leaf nosed bat', The sculpture of the beared man is clearly of an asiatic person and not Hebrew at all. Still no Mormon evidence...sorry guys.
foresigns 9 months ago
Matthew chapter five is lifted whole out of the Bible and placed into the BoM. The sermon on the mount was given from Jesus to the native Americans (Josephite exiles who speak reformed egyptian) In it Jesus tells them that whosoever shall compel the to go a mile go with him twain. ( 3 Nephi 12:41, Matthew 5:41) This refers to a Roman law that allows soldiers to require non citizen subjects to carry their gear for a mile, only making sense if they had ever been under Roman occupation.
amathrax 9 months ago
The problems with authenticating the BoM are much hairyer than you Mormons might think. You see whole chapters are identical, word for word, to the King James translation of the Bible. First we know that either the brittish translators discovered the golden plates, copied them, and then put them back or Joseph Smith plagerized. Additionally, Mormons have to prove that the Roman Empire was in control of portions of the Americas as well. Why? Read my next post!
amathrax 9 months ago
I've asked repeatedly for physical1 evidence confirming any person, place or event in the BOM. The answers are "it exists" (but will not be named). There there are absurd claims - DNA "went away", Hebrew in Indian languages, Indians did not originate in Asia, Incans had silk and other non-proofs.
Why not one ruin, weapon, road, city, chariot, horse, pig or cow skeletons,etc. When asked about the phony Book of Abraham papyri, the fact that JS created a bogus book is ignored;
smb12321 9 months ago 2
@smb12321 - it all depends on who you want to listen to and who you consider is credible. Only ONE voice has the ultimate say... 1 John 5:9
THELDSLIFE 9 months ago
@THELDSLIFE
...."it all depends on who you want to listen to"....
Yes, it does.
The evidence is ignored on both sides of the argument and each side only seems to listen to it's own "Scholars".
LDS "Scholarship" is far too agendized to be trusted and the real "Scholars" are ignored by the LDS.
It's a no win situation.
Unless the average Mormon can see the flaw(s) at the roots of Mormonism all the "Scholarship' in the world is not going to matter.
hammerogod 9 months ago
Columus discribed white indian tribes with beards and so did many other explorers, and they did so through out the 1500's before the Catholic invation. Read "Voices from the Dust." The author covers this and the hebrew lanquage in totem, and how Hebrew words can be found in every native language. How white skinned natives were found in high levels of government and religion.
foxx13533 10 months ago
I just finished watching a Nat Geo (I think) show on some tribes that put on mud and clay head-dresses and the ancient reason was that coming to one battle their ancestors fell in the mub, when they appeared in battle, they appeared white, scaring the other tribe away, and the tradition continues, hundreds of yrs later., So white= mud? Paint? albino? ash? leprosy?
The ignorance of Christianity is part of the reason for war against the europeans, as their religion was foreign to them!