Howard Dean and protesters at Moran Town Hall 8-25-09

[arepadetrigo]

Howard Dean is one of history's biggest losers. Only Algore tops him for sadness and stupidity. 

[wiedatis]

Just for kicks:

Merriam-Webster presents...

•Main Entry: so·cial·ism

•Pronunciation: \ˈsō-shə-ˌli-zəm\

•Function: noun

•Date: 1837

1 : any of various economic and political theories advocating collective or governmental ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods

[MrExnihilo]

Universal healthcare is being pushed by a president who smokes and a surgeon general who's obese.

Try gaining some credibility before TRYING to cram this bill down our throats.

[sgsfdgfsdfsdfsddf]

cramming? I suppose when they are elected it is cramming....

[garybsg]

You are confused. But, I mean this without hostility, if you can research socialism and really think about it, you may see how the US has been turning the wrong way. I hope you do honestly.

[sgsfdgfsdfsdfsddf]

You dont know the meaning of socialism or communism? lol

[garybsg]

Ok, what is it?

[garybsg]

Hurry to wikipedia

[sgsfdgfsdfsdfsddf]

How does it feel to have a comparable health care system to third world countries?

You get all your information from Glenn Beck

[MrExnihilo]

How would it feel having to wait for months, if not years, for medical attention necessary to save or prolong your life? Or to be told by some gov't healthcare board, "Sorry, but according to our cost-benefit analysis, your age precludes you from receiving medical care. However, we ARE willing to refer you to end-of-life counseling (hospice, or something comparable).

That's what those who support this healthcare are trying to push. And that's why there's so much outrage over this bill.

[sgsfdgfsdfsdfsddf]

are dictators anything special when people like you vote?

[sgsfdgfsdfsdfsddf]

So are you comparing USSR to Liberals because of some economic policies? LOL and Republicans support torture

[garybsg]

This is fucking dumbest statement I have ever heard. Read Karl Marx, Engels, Stalin and Mussolini. FDR's New Deal including National Labor Relations Act, National Recovery Act, Public Works Administration, Banking Acts all gotten from Mussolini an Italian fascist/socialist. The purpose was state control of the economy. You really need to read history and stop watching MSNBC.

[sgsfdgfsdfsdfsddf]

Socialism and communism is not for state control... its for the control of the workers

[sgsfdgfsdfsdfsddf]

In Europe it still means that

Stalin fought against the liberals and that is what it meant then

Im sorry but if a book is talking about the Russian Revolution or Stalin a "Liberal" is a democrat... democrat as in democracy or a republican sorta

[gfrabizi]

America and Europe are greatly different! U.S. Republican is not the same as a Republican in Ireland. (is use what I know). though some policies may be similar, the two deal with different attitudes, policies, direction, etc.

[sgsfdgfsdfsdfsddf]

You make things up change them a bit to make it look good. probably because you listen to Glenn Beck or Bill oreilly...

+

[garybsg]

Socialism is state intervention or control for the social good. The US government has financial control of GM like Amtrak. The Obama admin fired the president of GM. So much for no control. Obama handed over Chrysler's stock to the UAW as political gratuity and screwed the bond holders(I was one) out of their money. You neither understand socialism or capitalism. As Stalin called liberal Americans "useful idiots".

[sgsfdgfsdfsdfsddf]

Obama has socialized nothing...

Do you know what a Liberal American was during Stalins time?

So if Stalin called a Liberal American an idiot he was talking about democrats or people that wanted free press and limited government

Still means that...

You are a Glen Beck idiot

[gfrabizi]

uh..what are you talking about? Republics for the longest time have had the political view point of limited govt.

[sgsfdgfsdfsdfsddf]

What is a Republics?

Look up what a Liberal is and it will say "someone who believes in limited government and free press"

And that is what it meant in Russia then and probably still does

[gfrabizi]

the meaning of titles among politics changes often. Furthermore your claim to definition could not be any further, which could be expressed through what 'laws' libral left have placed and attempted to place on us all.fairness doctrine for example;govt. requirement restricting freedom of speech so their opinion may be heard. thats oppression.not free press and not limited govt.

[sgsfdgfsdfsdfsddf]

the stupidity of conservatives change meanings to what YOU want it to mean

[gfrabizi]

how could this be an ounce of truth when liberals support socialism, same as stalin and ussr. you confuse what was stated with your idea as to what was meant.

[sgsfdgfsdfsdfsddf]

you are confused it seems because what you just said had no meaning...

You dont know what Socialism is or what a Liberal... proof is that you think Obama's healthcare plan is socialism... also think the bailout is Socialism

[garybsg]

Let me help you. The free market means free, no government force. Communism, socialism(liberalism) all have the same belief " the individual is subordinate to the state". Please look it up so we don't have to argue on this unarguable point, total ignorance when you don't understand what your democratic party stands for. .

[garybsg]

Notice you avoided the whole issue of the democratic party not touching trial lawyers association. Whatever. Second, your logic if a company makes profit the should justify the government taking it over. This would lead to a complete collapse of the US economy as any profitable company could be a target of the US government. The public option(my neighbor pay for me) is absolutely socialism, you are not American, you are a socialist and living in the wrong country.

[sgsfdgfsdfsdfsddf]

Well you dont know what Socialism is... Socialism would not try to make competition with a public option

[garybsg]

Of course, socialism eliminates competition so that the government can have total control.

Total control, total power, total subordination of its people.

[sgsfdgfsdfsdfsddf]

and thats not Obama's plan

[garybsg]

THAT IS EXACTLY OBAMA'S PLAN

[sgsfdgfsdfsdfsddf]

okay seeing things when they are not there is not good...

[garybsg]

I'm seeing things? Obama is:

1. Nationalizing the financial industry(TARP)

2. Nationalizing the banking industry(TARP)

3. . Nationalized the auto industry(GM, Chrysler) and almost got Ford.

4. and trying to NATIONALIZED health care.

5. Currently looking at controlling the internet, talk radio(enemy) support newspapers(friend) etc....

You don't want to see this or admit that the man is a mad dog socialist. Self delusion is not good guide for your life.

[sgsfdgfsdfsdfsddf]

you dont know what Nationalizing is anyways

A bailout is not nationalizing

nationalizing is not a socialist thing...

[garybsg]

Socialism is government "control", "regulation" and intervention for the social good in direct contrast to hands-off free market. A bailout is absolute control over a company that should have gone to the creditors as in GM's case. Likewise Chrysler owed billions to its creditors and Obama gave it to the UAW a total undermining of a long history of contract law and absolute violation of the free market. You neither understand socialism or capitalism. You must be listening to MSNBC.

[gfrabizi]

it doesn't matter what his plan is cause thats the outcome...how could a tax paying citizen afford the better private health care and pay for someone elses public health care? its going to happen no matter what.

[tedm82]

You can tell who the "astroturfers" are, they have the nice mass produced company printed signs!

[Ambassador1000]

Whoever said go to Russia, has missed the point about European and Canadian systems. No one said anything about modeling Russia. Read up on current events before making illiterate statements and exhibiting petty childish behavior. For anyone hollering about how healthcare reform is unconstitutional, they should wake up and realize that the whole world is leaving them behind in the dark ages.

[dsl1017]

Funny, this is how a congressman and idiot dean can run a healthcare townhall, imagine them actually running healthcare. Also, it's interesting that they have all these laid off union people there to support them cuz the idiots have destroyed the economy and there are no jobs. But leave it the unions to blindly support the democrats. Who's hands are out?

[mgds12]

Yes, let's fight to keep Carefirst and Aetna! Because they are such honest, hard working companies out to serve YOU, not their shareholders. Who are these people that have had such amazing experiences with private insurance that they can't possibly fathom a better system? In all seriousness, I'd really like to know. Are you even aware that you are fighting on behalf of insurance companies??

[garybsg]

OH and the fucking government is better!!!! DUMBSHIT GO TO RUSSIA

[mgds12]

Do you have one of those Cadillac health plans we keep hearing about? Can I have one too?

[dsl1017]

As a matter of fact I do. No one gave it to me, I work for it, but you think it should be given to you. Find out what you can achieve through hard work, its amazing. Pull your hands back, roll up your sleeves, and fucking work

[mgds12]

I am one of those hard working small business owners that Republicans love to talk about. You know...the backbone of our economy? You probably have a federal plan, meaning that MY tax dollars are paying for your health plan. It seems that many of the people against the public option are getting their benefits through the federal dime. How ironic. You're welcome.

[Ambassador1000]

As a small business owner, you wouldn't switch to a cheaper government plan to cover your employees, rather than pay ever increasing premiums to the thieving insurance companies and CEO's who make millions of dollars out of our blood and tears? That's kind of ironic too.

[mgds12]

It would be ironic! To be clear, I am in favor of the public option and would most certainly choose it if it were available.

[Ambassador1000]

Thanks.

[garybsg]

Mgds12 this may come as a shock to you but you too can have a Cadillac heath plan. It's called GO TO WORK AND PAY FOR IT.

Hey unlike the Cadillac the heath plan is not owned by the government.

[mgds12]

Hey garybsg, do you read? I am a small business owner! I thought Republicans loved us?

[dsl1017]

I have a federal plan? You apparently can't read.  Apparently, you're not a very good at running your small business. So I guess you owe me the thanks, cuz I actually pay taxes cuz I work hard and I'm good at what I do, apparently you're not. Don't hold that against me, or others.

[mgds12]

Good grief, that doesn't even make any sense. I can't understand your grammar, spelling, or logic. I'm glad you have good health insurance, you probably need it to treat your mental disorder.

[dsl1017]

Ok, I didn't think you could read. Have fun running your business on youtube. I'm gonna spend the rest of the day workin for my healthcare.

[garybsg]

Great then you should believe in self reliance and hard work and not hand outs from your neighbor, your competition or your government. Not in this country.

[mgds12]

So, you are basically saying that you don't believe in small businesses. My insurance premiums went up by 38% this year. No amount of hard work can make that sort of yearly increase sustainable. Larger companies also saw huge increases in premiums, but if your employer pays for your insurance, you wouldn't be aware of that. What you would see are more layoffs and stagnant or falling wages. And it is directly linked to the healthcare crisis, because employers have to find a way to break even.

[garybsg]

Nice try but not buying it. You want to cut premiums, cut cost of healthcare. How? Cut enormous cost of malpractice insurance. That would take a giant chunk out of healthcare. Who has blocked tort reform for the last 50 years? DEMOCRATS. Why? Because they get an enormous amount of money from the TRIAL LAWYERS ASSOCIATION. The idea that if the market place can't provide a service cheap enough have the government provide it is funny. Kinda like our educational system the most expensive on earth.

[mgds12]

Why are insurance companies (all of them, not just health) recording record profits? If the actual cost of healthcare and malpractice is as high as you say, you would think that insurance companies would be hurting. This is not the case. The public OPTION is the only way to keep insurance companies honest and keep costs down for everyone. I would think that would be something conservatives would like.

[garybsg]

Thirdly read the Declaration of Independence it say " government is formed to protect rights" Right to life, liberty and pursuit of happiness. It does NOT say the government is formed to pay for food stamps, college education or HEALTHCARE.

[sgsfdgfsdfsdfsddf]

HEalth care the most expensive in what Country? America and

the government seems to run it better in every country that does it....

[garybsg]

BTW look at all stats on dying from colon cancer, prostate cancer, diabetes, etc from socialized western Europe, The US beats every single one and in some case has double the survival rates

[sgsfdgfsdfsdfsddf]

so America does it better in some cases? but overall who lives the longest? not USA

[dsl1017]

Good point, the government has done a great job with social security, medicare, medicaid, the post office, the "stimulus" has been phenomenal, cash for clunkers, the deficit. Only 1.9 trillion off in thier predictions. Oh, by the way, my private insurance has been phenomenal, you get what you pay for. I'm sure your medicaid is much better than my private insurance.

[okefixico]

haha Moran's panties were in a wad. Goober elitist boobs.

[dmbpearl]

Keep up the good work people! Fight these politicians every step of the way. It brings a smile to my face seeing democracy like this in action. We can beat these union thugs... they're dying off, so keep up the good fight Americans.

[3star2nr]

these people have no sense of decency

[AcrossThePond40]

All of the 'professional' signs.....courtesy of our tax dollars.

[3star2nr]

actually its due to doations to Howard's organizations.

And what about the anit obama signs and buses thats being funded by your insurance premiums.

keep defending insurance companies sheep

[rascalcap1]

There was an equal number of both. Except the pro government option people, I heard were organized by Obama/Union/DNC affiliated groups. All there with their printed signs perhaps on the taxpayers' dime. ORGANIZED. The other side was just concerned folk who came in their cars and took time from their jobs.

[bogie1062]

So true rascal. The union folks were let into a side door while the rest of us waited in line for hours. Many were bused in and they were many, many premade signs. So staged. Unbelievable. A guy in front of me actually said it is a known fact that the US has the *worst* health care in the world. Didn't you see Sicko? OMG and these people vote.

[mgds12]

I was at this meeting. There were BY FAR more supporters of the public option then opponents. The anti-reformers were just more loud and obnoxious, to make up for their meager numbers.

[TimH1955]

I was at the meeting too and you are either totally dilusional or a total liar as there were FAR FAR more opponents of Dean and other liberal democrats than supporters! Who are you trying to fool? The video supports what I'm saying.

[CLONG3]

Dean says no tort reform cause we didn't want to take on trial lawyers, but of course we don't mind fucking the shit out of the common man.

[3star2nr]

you do know your working for the insurance companies right?

Your paying them and working for them, to fuck yourself.

How does it feel to be a tool?

[johndubbya77]

ha ha ha i love it howard dean got made to look like an ass once again

[3star2nr]

And you get to pay high premiums and kill your own family members by fighting down legislation to help your family.

How does it feel to be a pawn for the insurance companies?

[Ambassador1000]

The only people who look like ass are those who whine like ugly spoiled brats.

[johndubbya77]

Oh please 3star you mean to tell me you can pinpoint in the constitution where it says the taxpayers of this country requires the government to pay for health insurance for everyone in this country. You tell me where you can find it and you win the argument. Also how am I killing my family when I work and I pay for health insurance. My family is happy and healthy and you sir are an ignoranus