Thanks for your comment. While, yes, in North Wales for example, the people can be shown to have a genetic heritage which predates the rest of Britain, I fear you muddy the water somewhat. These older groups were not 'Celts' per se... 'The Celts' is not a good description for them. It also doesn't make them 'Basque' these describe linguistic groupings as much as anything else. Why do we feel the need to create these broad identities with such certainty? The reality is much more subtle.
@MsFinnmaccool Thanks for your comment. I am aware that Keltoi is a Greek word, hence I spelled it in the Greek manner (with a K) however Caesar, Strabo and other educated Romans used Greek terminology in various texts when referring to the various people's of Europe en masse. Naturally he mentions the Gauls in his Wars Diaries, however the term 'Celtus' a Latinosed 'Keltoi' was in common use amongst this who had received a broader ie Greek education. Thanks for watching!
It was not the Vikings. The Vikings had hazel to auburn hair yes. But Norwegians were considered the "scandinavian race", which had red hair, as admited by Arian christians in first millenia, throught Europe.
So the red hair is a scandinavian dominant trait, yes. That's where the Scythians "roamed down" to all parts of Europe, including Asia (called the Dii) and the New World (white indians found by the spanish conquistadores).
I had red hair as a child, too, and yellow eyes. I don't know if these are celtic features. It's possible I resemble my Czech grandfather? He had blonde reddish hair, and red beard. Just like my uncles who inherited the red beard from him, and blonde hair, and blue or blue-green eyes ...
And like anything, we Americans screwed it up even more. American Celtics are located on the northeastern fringe of America and are primarily tall dark-skinned men who play a curious game with a ball and two hoops.
Wow, you're brave to bring up this topic!!! Some remarks, though: the word CELTOI was coined by the Greeks, not the Romans. The Romans called this same culture GALLIC, and understood them to be the inhabitants of roughly present-day France and the Alps. However, Romans called the inhabitants of North-western Spain Celts or Celt-iberian. Some areas of Europe were given names derived from GALLIC because settled by peoples known as celtic by the Romans, e.g. Galicia (spain), Gallatia (Turkey)
@alflayla5 Haha... Brave indeed! I am aware that Keltoi is Greek, hence I spelt it with a 'K' and not a 'C'. It originally referred to a small group just North of the Greek City-States. It eventually came to be a slang term amongst Greeks and educated Romans for much of the rest of Europe.
The Gauls were certainly identified by the Romans too, yes... I've had many many people message me about the Galatians referencing the book in the Bible.
@Archaeos0up This is something that I've read, but I can't remember where right now: bands of celtic warriors sometimes went raiding towards the East of Europe; famously, they tried to raid the Apollo shrine at Delphi, but it was a huge disaster (which Greeks attributed to Apollo); some bands ended up as settlers in eastern lands such as Galatia (Turkey) and Galizia (Poland). I might have read this in "Simon James, 1999, The Atlantic Celts: Ancient people or modern invention?"
@Archaeos0up Simon James is a great archaeologist and one of my heroes. It's ironical that what Romans considered quintessentially Celtic -France, Switzerland, heartland of LaTenne- is never thought of as "celtic" in the theme-parkish, Disneyish ready-made simplifications that we in the Western cultures accept as our "identities"
@alflayla5 Here's a good quote: "This, then, is what I have to say about the people who inhabit the dominion of Gallia Narbonensis, whom the men of former times named 'Celtae'; and it was from the Celtae, I think, that the Galatae as a whole were by the Greeks called Keltoi" (Strabo 4, 1, 14)
So it was all Chinese Whispers leading to catch all terms and generalisations... Very Modern! Haha!
@alflayla5 Some of your points are not very accurate: 1) Galicia (Spain) comes from CALLAECIA, most authors think this ethimology has nothing to do with GALIA nor GALATIA. 2) Celtiberians lived in Central-East (Ebro) Iberia, Numantines were Celtiberians and inscriptions have been found in a Celtic language in this area. 3) Some people called Celtici lived in South Western Iberia.
The subject of the peoples in pre-Roman Iberia is complex an there is not a clear picture.
@ferjavato This is from the GEOGRAPHY OF STRABO about Galicia -the Artabrians, who live in the neighbourhood of the cape called Nerium, which is the end of both the western and the northern side of Iberia. But the country round about the cape itself is inhabited by Celtic people- What it has in common with Galia or Galatea is the same root as "gaul", an ethnologically charged name given either by Romans or the inhabitants of the places. Numantia is definitely in the NORTHERN third of Iberia.
Sort of the same difficulty exist for germanic ancestry. Germania didn't really exist, but was created on paper by Romans. I personally became increasingly confused after digging deeper into my local ancestry (Holland - many different tribes, lots of migration and poor sources)
I've never been one to trust Roman sources, but in regards to the ideal of Celts and such. The closest thing one could hope to arrive at is the Pict's, Irish and Welsh tribes as they at best - well, perhaps not as much Wales - kept the Romans at bay one way or another. Whether this is due to Romes own crumble, the specific tribes abilities or what-not, it doesn't really matter.
As for our Skirts, I think you'd be forgetting the few hundred other years my peps ran about in those :P
@spr65 Thanks for your comment. Actually, the people in North Wales have the oldest DNA in Britain... ie unlike the Picts and people in Ireland, they were there before and after the Roman period! Mainly cos it's hard to flush them out of Snowdonia!
Re: Kilts, yes the Scottish have worn them for a long time, afterall they were banned after the Jacobite revolt! However they were invented by people in what is now Northumberland, trousers are the true legacy of the Iron Age!
@Archaeos0up No arguments in regards to Wales holding the 'purest' DNA - I use that loosely for our isle. Heck, I've even heard the theory that Ireland's people are originally Welsh themselves.
But as it were, when people refer to the 'Celts', they're generally thinking of a war driven people, primitive yet not so. If we're to look for the types of people, with the knowledge that the idea is almost fantasy, the closest we can get to anything to our minds story, is the Picts.
Whilst it's faulty to come out and say, these are the Celts which have been written about, talked about and dreamed about. At the same time, they hold enough stereotypical notions - from the little we actually know about them - for themselves to be mistaken for these mystical 'Celts'.
Mind you, if we're to go on about this when someone asks a simple question about said 'Celts', I think we'd bore their socks off with the nitty-gritty detail that has to be paid.
So, with that in mind, you could easily forgive a non-historian type fellow to gather that the Picts and whatever other 'brutish' type people, are what they've been taught to expect. Not correct, but it would at least interest them to find out more hopefully.
As for the trousers, totally agree.
Perhaps the 'new-age' Celtic writers thought this sudden boom for all things ancient, was a grand way to slip in a little banned piece of a past life back to the now?
@spr65 Thanks for your lengthy response. I am sure you're aware that there's no such thing as 'pure' DNA... I would never use that term. I said 'oldest'.
With regards to your other points... That's why I made this video to discuss the complexities and challenge a simplistic view of the 'Celtic World' in a way which hopefully doesn't bore their socks off. Cheers! Archaeosoup.
When I was in high school I was reading a book a book about the Celts. A number of other students thought I was reading a book about seaweed (kelp). : /
@monkeytail2002 I understand that you're being tongue in cheek, but that's essentially the problem... Most people assume that they have ONE root and their roots can be defined in modern Geo-Political terms.
It's never that simple, sadly and as for highland blood... the last of the Picts lived in the lowlands and then seemingly dissipated :p
You've probably read 'Blood of the Isles' by Prof. Bryan Sykes about the genetic makeup of the British.. if not - I recommend that and his other books.
In researching my upcoming YouTube series that will investigate the hypothesis that the Apostle Paul was epileptic, I came across an academic source that claimed that the Galatians of Asia Minor (among whom Paul established a church) were Celts, with the word "Galatian" being related to the word "Gaul". If they were not, in fact, Celts, have you any idea what they should be called when discussing their roots?
@markdzima Their roots were, as hinted, Gaulish... However, yes, there is a tendency to use the word Celt anyway. In reality, Celt has become a word which has meaning by association. It's one of the supreme ironies of Iron age Archaeology.
The opening chapter of most books on 'The Celts' is essentially an apology for using the term! Haha!
Thanks for your Comment and good luck with your series!
here in ireland there's a lot of confusion, the education system is to blame though even now a cobbled and romantic invention is still taught and lots of discusions on our forums with very vexed people.
I'm Welsh and a Celt, nuff said! Oh, Happy St. David's Day :)
christosuk77 12 hours ago
Thanks for your comment. While, yes, in North Wales for example, the people can be shown to have a genetic heritage which predates the rest of Britain, I fear you muddy the water somewhat. These older groups were not 'Celts' per se... 'The Celts' is not a good description for them. It also doesn't make them 'Basque' these describe linguistic groupings as much as anything else. Why do we feel the need to create these broad identities with such certainty? The reality is much more subtle.
Archaeos0up 1 week ago
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what we do know is that the celts are genetically basque,the original western europeans
MiamiDolphinsClyde10 1 week ago
@MsFinnmaccool Thanks for your comment. I am aware that Keltoi is a Greek word, hence I spelled it in the Greek manner (with a K) however Caesar, Strabo and other educated Romans used Greek terminology in various texts when referring to the various people's of Europe en masse. Naturally he mentions the Gauls in his Wars Diaries, however the term 'Celtus' a Latinosed 'Keltoi' was in common use amongst this who had received a broader ie Greek education. Thanks for watching!
Archaeos0up 1 week ago
Just a quick corection. It was the Greeks who useed the term Keltoi in the 5th century BCE Thr Romans refered to the Gauls as Galli.
MsFinnmaccool 1 week ago
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It was not the Vikings. The Vikings had hazel to auburn hair yes. But Norwegians were considered the "scandinavian race", which had red hair, as admited by Arian christians in first millenia, throught Europe.
So the red hair is a scandinavian dominant trait, yes. That's where the Scythians "roamed down" to all parts of Europe, including Asia (called the Dii) and the New World (white indians found by the spanish conquistadores).
Soveraine 1 month ago
Of course there was. The Scythian empire was 100% Celtic.
Sorry folks. Celticism is real.
Soveraine 1 month ago
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I had red hair as a child, too, and yellow eyes. I don't know if these are celtic features. It's possible I resemble my Czech grandfather? He had blonde reddish hair, and red beard. Just like my uncles who inherited the red beard from him, and blonde hair, and blue or blue-green eyes ...
Soveraine 1 month ago
red hair, green eyes celts rule!
conor845 5 months ago
@conor845 Did you even watch the video? Haha
Archaeos0up 5 months ago
@Archaeos0up yep, those who are identified in modern times as celts, who have green eyes and red hair are good people
conor845 5 months ago
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@conor845 You mean blue eyes? The Celts were a division of Scythians, in east europe, who fled from the Huns invasion.
Just like the Eastern Germanic Goths of Arhaimar or Oium Reich are the Goths of Nordic Mythology, who conquered Sweden and Denmark.
Soveraine 1 month ago
And like anything, we Americans screwed it up even more. American Celtics are located on the northeastern fringe of America and are primarily tall dark-skinned men who play a curious game with a ball and two hoops.
tctheunbeliever 6 months ago
Wow, you're brave to bring up this topic!!! Some remarks, though: the word CELTOI was coined by the Greeks, not the Romans. The Romans called this same culture GALLIC, and understood them to be the inhabitants of roughly present-day France and the Alps. However, Romans called the inhabitants of North-western Spain Celts or Celt-iberian. Some areas of Europe were given names derived from GALLIC because settled by peoples known as celtic by the Romans, e.g. Galicia (spain), Gallatia (Turkey)
alflayla5 6 months ago
@alflayla5 Haha... Brave indeed! I am aware that Keltoi is Greek, hence I spelt it with a 'K' and not a 'C'. It originally referred to a small group just North of the Greek City-States. It eventually came to be a slang term amongst Greeks and educated Romans for much of the rest of Europe.
The Gauls were certainly identified by the Romans too, yes... I've had many many people message me about the Galatians referencing the book in the Bible.
Thanks, as ever, for your insightful comments! :D
Archaeos0up 6 months ago
@Archaeos0up This is something that I've read, but I can't remember where right now: bands of celtic warriors sometimes went raiding towards the East of Europe; famously, they tried to raid the Apollo shrine at Delphi, but it was a huge disaster (which Greeks attributed to Apollo); some bands ended up as settlers in eastern lands such as Galatia (Turkey) and Galizia (Poland). I might have read this in "Simon James, 1999, The Atlantic Celts: Ancient people or modern invention?"
alflayla5 6 months ago
@alflayla5 Yes! That's a great book! :D
As you were saying the other day, it's a luxury to discuss these things via YouTube!
Thanks again for your comments!
Archaeos0up 6 months ago
@Archaeos0up Simon James is a great archaeologist and one of my heroes. It's ironical that what Romans considered quintessentially Celtic -France, Switzerland, heartland of LaTenne- is never thought of as "celtic" in the theme-parkish, Disneyish ready-made simplifications that we in the Western cultures accept as our "identities"
alflayla5 6 months ago
@alflayla5 Here's a good quote: "This, then, is what I have to say about the people who inhabit the dominion of Gallia Narbonensis, whom the men of former times named 'Celtae'; and it was from the Celtae, I think, that the Galatae as a whole were by the Greeks called Keltoi" (Strabo 4, 1, 14)
So it was all Chinese Whispers leading to catch all terms and generalisations... Very Modern! Haha!
Archaeos0up 6 months ago
@alflayla5 Some of your points are not very accurate: 1) Galicia (Spain) comes from CALLAECIA, most authors think this ethimology has nothing to do with GALIA nor GALATIA. 2) Celtiberians lived in Central-East (Ebro) Iberia, Numantines were Celtiberians and inscriptions have been found in a Celtic language in this area. 3) Some people called Celtici lived in South Western Iberia.
The subject of the peoples in pre-Roman Iberia is complex an there is not a clear picture.
(I am not a professional)
ferjavato 4 months ago
@ferjavato This is from the GEOGRAPHY OF STRABO about Galicia -the Artabrians, who live in the neighbourhood of the cape called Nerium, which is the end of both the western and the northern side of Iberia. But the country round about the cape itself is inhabited by Celtic people- What it has in common with Galia or Galatea is the same root as "gaul", an ethnologically charged name given either by Romans or the inhabitants of the places. Numantia is definitely in the NORTHERN third of Iberia.
alflayla5 4 months ago
awesome video! thank you :)
nordic84 6 months ago
Sort of the same difficulty exist for germanic ancestry. Germania didn't really exist, but was created on paper by Romans. I personally became increasingly confused after digging deeper into my local ancestry (Holland - many different tribes, lots of migration and poor sources)
thomazz2000 6 months ago
I've never been one to trust Roman sources, but in regards to the ideal of Celts and such. The closest thing one could hope to arrive at is the Pict's, Irish and Welsh tribes as they at best - well, perhaps not as much Wales - kept the Romans at bay one way or another. Whether this is due to Romes own crumble, the specific tribes abilities or what-not, it doesn't really matter.
As for our Skirts, I think you'd be forgetting the few hundred other years my peps ran about in those :P
spr65 6 months ago
@spr65 Thanks for your comment. Actually, the people in North Wales have the oldest DNA in Britain... ie unlike the Picts and people in Ireland, they were there before and after the Roman period! Mainly cos it's hard to flush them out of Snowdonia!
Re: Kilts, yes the Scottish have worn them for a long time, afterall they were banned after the Jacobite revolt! However they were invented by people in what is now Northumberland, trousers are the true legacy of the Iron Age!
Thanks for watching!
Archaeos0up 6 months ago
@Archaeos0up No arguments in regards to Wales holding the 'purest' DNA - I use that loosely for our isle. Heck, I've even heard the theory that Ireland's people are originally Welsh themselves.
But as it were, when people refer to the 'Celts', they're generally thinking of a war driven people, primitive yet not so. If we're to look for the types of people, with the knowledge that the idea is almost fantasy, the closest we can get to anything to our minds story, is the Picts.
spr65 6 months ago
@Archaeos0up -Continued-
Whilst it's faulty to come out and say, these are the Celts which have been written about, talked about and dreamed about. At the same time, they hold enough stereotypical notions - from the little we actually know about them - for themselves to be mistaken for these mystical 'Celts'.
Mind you, if we're to go on about this when someone asks a simple question about said 'Celts', I think we'd bore their socks off with the nitty-gritty detail that has to be paid.
spr65 6 months ago
@Archaeos0up - One last continue -
So, with that in mind, you could easily forgive a non-historian type fellow to gather that the Picts and whatever other 'brutish' type people, are what they've been taught to expect. Not correct, but it would at least interest them to find out more hopefully.
As for the trousers, totally agree.
Perhaps the 'new-age' Celtic writers thought this sudden boom for all things ancient, was a grand way to slip in a little banned piece of a past life back to the now?
spr65 6 months ago
@spr65 Thanks for your lengthy response. I am sure you're aware that there's no such thing as 'pure' DNA... I would never use that term. I said 'oldest'.
With regards to your other points... That's why I made this video to discuss the complexities and challenge a simplistic view of the 'Celtic World' in a way which hopefully doesn't bore their socks off. Cheers! Archaeosoup.
Archaeos0up 6 months ago
"red hair is a red herring"
The important part is that it's red LOL :-D
boenrobot 6 months ago
When I was in high school I was reading a book a book about the Celts. A number of other students thought I was reading a book about seaweed (kelp). : /
Arikiel 6 months ago
@Arikiel Haha! Brilliant! That actually made me laugh!
Archaeos0up 6 months ago
I sir am a Pict. I supercede your Celticness :P
monkeytail2002 6 months ago
@monkeytail2002 Thanks for the comment! Though genetically speaking you're probably not a Pict... ;p
Archaeos0up 6 months ago
@Archaeos0up Oh I dunno. Good highland blood runs through me :P
monkeytail2002 6 months ago
@monkeytail2002 I understand that you're being tongue in cheek, but that's essentially the problem... Most people assume that they have ONE root and their roots can be defined in modern Geo-Political terms.
It's never that simple, sadly and as for highland blood... the last of the Picts lived in the lowlands and then seemingly dissipated :p
Archaeos0up 6 months ago
@monkeytail2002 Just as I am not a 'Celt'!
Archaeos0up 6 months ago
don't tell those things to a modern 'pagan', they gets quite riled about it.:)
MacNutz2 6 months ago
You've probably read 'Blood of the Isles' by Prof. Bryan Sykes about the genetic makeup of the British.. if not - I recommend that and his other books.
AuntieDiluvian 6 months ago
@AuntieDiluvian I have indeed! I am a big fan of 'The Seven Daughters of Eve' as well.
Archaeos0up 6 months ago
@Archaeos0up me too - wonderful book.
AuntieDiluvian 6 months ago
In researching my upcoming YouTube series that will investigate the hypothesis that the Apostle Paul was epileptic, I came across an academic source that claimed that the Galatians of Asia Minor (among whom Paul established a church) were Celts, with the word "Galatian" being related to the word "Gaul". If they were not, in fact, Celts, have you any idea what they should be called when discussing their roots?
markdzima 6 months ago
@markdzima Their roots were, as hinted, Gaulish... However, yes, there is a tendency to use the word Celt anyway. In reality, Celt has become a word which has meaning by association. It's one of the supreme ironies of Iron age Archaeology.
The opening chapter of most books on 'The Celts' is essentially an apology for using the term! Haha!
Thanks for your Comment and good luck with your series!
Archaeos0up 6 months ago
here in ireland there's a lot of confusion, the education system is to blame though even now a cobbled and romantic invention is still taught and lots of discusions on our forums with very vexed people.
yellowlabrador 6 months ago