Look any Country that sends its jobs off shore and then fails to slap duties on the products coming back ? Well that country doesn't deserve to survive.
The wages for the mexicans may have gone down but also the americans too. Subsidized workers in factories earn half of what union workers right next to him is earning, with no benefits! This keeps heading towards putting us into 3rd World LABOR FORCE status.
The eleven point side agreement to NAFTA was put forward a Bill Clintons Solution to allow freedom of association witch includes unions regardless of status which was supposed to imply legal or illegal immigration status. But if you can't legally be employed in the country that doe not help and if you are a legal guest worker that is way to vague. If I am wrong on my facts please correct me. I do my best to understand, but NAFTA seems to be the real problem not the poor in the 3 countries.
What I find so bad is that BOTH side sold us this bill of goods. I do wish I was educated about this a little more. Can anyone point me in a better direction that is not either left or right, but truthful?
In the debate a few weeks back, Hillary was asked if she remembered Ross Perot's speeches against NAFTA just before Bill Clinton got in and passed Bush's NAFTA.
She laughed along with the nervous democratic party audience and said all she recalled "were some charts".
The charts Perot put up showed exactly what would happen with NAFTA. Working Americans wages dropped, while Canadian and Mexican workers wages got much higher. Oh-- and the rich CEO class made record profits.
wh aren't these congressmen/women, not puting these ceo's in jail or at least fining them? the have the power to do so. what are the waiting for? they are all the same, liars.
"wh aren't these congressmen/women, not puting these ceo's in jail or at least fining them? the have the power to do so. what are the waiting for? they are all the same, liars."
there are no unions in Mexico, they pay them about $7 a day to make cars...ect. do you think that is fair??? They put all the US workers out of work and now they are ripping off the Mexican workers.....the only one who wins are the rich corporations and the stock brokers....
Exactly, Reagan was responsible for Nafta and Nixon was responsible for opening up free trade with China...all our jobs our being outsourced to India, China and other foreign countries...this is the beginning of the end of America as a great country...our economy is going down in flames...
Oh, we give plenty of responsibility to Bill Clinton. No question. He did not consult Labor and did not put any labor protections into this agreement, which does more to benefit the investing class than the working class.
Yes, it lowered wages in the US, but it did nothing to improve wages in Mexico, on average about $7 a day.
These workers still live in poverty.
And when US-subsidized crops were shipped into Mexico 1.3 million Mexican farmers were ran out of business because they couldn't compete. So do you think those undocumented imigrants are highly skilled factory workers or are they less skilled ag workers?
Stupid? It's the Bush trade policy that's stupid.
Bush SR. signed Nafta. Clinton Expanded the day lights out of it, and Bush Jr. is on a massive rampage doubling even Clinton's expansion. The U.S. has lost at least 13 million middle class jobs since 91-92. And yes, Mexico ag is screwd too from the corruption. End nafta now, elect RP, get rid of the entire elected establishment in washington.
mmgg33 - "I'm pretty sure you mean the Clinton trade policy." No pal,Clinton started it with NAFTA..Bush has been busy putting other trade agreement through that expand this bullshit into China and whatever other countries these corporations can exploit
There is a great video of NAFTA and GATT being denounced by Sir James Goldsmith on the Charlie Rose Show. Pasting "Charlie Rose November 15 1994" into your YouTube search window will bring it up.
HEAVY exploitation going on.I know of a guy that got a whole house done and he didnt even have to pay the workers!He offered them tents food and portable power and they agreed.
If a Drug lord can easily corrupt a politician just imagine a allaince of coorpations.Who ever controls the money controls the goverment i think karl marx said that
This is not a Republican or Democrat issue. This is an issue regarding the enslavement of labor for the profit of a few at the multi-national corporate level. Democrats as well as Republicans are equally resoponsible for this indescriminate abuse of power at the expense of human beings. The whole situation stinks!
The problem is not Free Trade. Trade is good. What is going on is NOT trade. Its out sourcing and off shoring to avoid rules and regulations. NAFTA would work if the companies were obligated to meet the same rules in every country. The problem is NOT profits, but that those profits are NOT shared with the employees. We get back to having consistent rules there.
Are you forgetting something??These corporations are doing this because they can exploit cheap labor..All they can do with the US and any other country is drive wages to the bottom
If this is some great deal for corps. and nobodie, then we shouldnt support it. We need to look at Mexicos policy too , its not possible the US messes up EVERY country in the world and the little 2 bit country is just completley innocent, just a pawn in Bushs imperial empire. <----Thats a bunch of bull HOW about MEXICO cleans up itys act instead of blaming everything on ourselves
The ONLY people that are winning are the multi-national corporations. ALL THE MONEY GOES TO THE TOP. The senior managers, shareholders and outragously overpaid CEO's resulting in a huge pay gap from "everyone else" in the corporation. It all goes to the top. The rich get richer off the backs of the bruised.
NAFTA has had an unexpected bonus (I think) for corporations and key business. Since 2000 we have seen the biggest surge of illegal immigration in US history. Look no futher than NAFTA. Why do you think all these poeple are coming here? Becuase they want to "invade" us? No. It's becuase they need work. The reciprocal effect of NAFTA is depressing US wages and costing more taxes in the form illegal immigration.
america does not support free trade. free trade is absent of predatory pricing and needs government controls to stop monopolies. america does not stop either of these economic tactics.
NAFTA is not about free trade!!!. It's government forced "free trade". Anyone who thinks NAFTA is free trade is a moron. It's not based on voluntary mutual agreement..
Also, one thing that does make Mexico unique is the border it shares with the US. We are creating economic refugees in Mexico and the rest of Latin America (thanks to CAFTA). Why do you think these people are leaving their homes, working for illegal bosses in this country and mailing the money back to their families? Building fences isn't the answer. Building trade policies that lift all working people is.
If it's not Mexico, it's China. Seriously, NAFTA is not the problem - it is corporate ethics and consumers NOT caring enough. Consumers want stuff cheaper, but they complain when companies exploit the ability to do it. Stop buying junk at walmart if you don't like it - but you will pay more.
NAFTA is the problem because there are no safeguards for workers in that country. Relying on "corporate ethics" have gotten us where we are today. We need trade agreements that offer global standards nice "everyday low prices." Global standards will help raise the bar to America's level, not force American workers to compete with Third World abusive labor practices. You are right about one thing, though. Americans do need to stop buying junk at Wal-Mart!
How is a company that goes to Mexico any different then one going to China? Believe me, if it's not one, it's the other, and there is no free trade agreement with China. America, being such a massive consumer driven nation, needs to encourage the supply to come to them and free trade allows this.... (next reply)
It's called exploiting cheap labor,Why would they pay your ass 15.00 an hour when they can get the same job done for a dollar a day??it's all about their profits
continuation (order may be wrong)...Maybe you're right, they need to select certain countries that have labour laws and general worker rights so that corporations stop exploiting this advantage. If they end up back pedalling on free trade it will eventually leave the country at a disadvantage in a globalizing world -- don't forget, NAFTA is more than Mexico... Canada is a vital trading partner.
Look any Country that sends its jobs off shore and then fails to slap duties on the products coming back ? Well that country doesn't deserve to survive.
dave777blaster 3 years ago 38
The wages for the mexicans may have gone down but also the americans too. Subsidized workers in factories earn half of what union workers right next to him is earning, with no benefits! This keeps heading towards putting us into 3rd World LABOR FORCE status.
hajqbvii 3 years ago 11
The eleven point side agreement to NAFTA was put forward a Bill Clintons Solution to allow freedom of association witch includes unions regardless of status which was supposed to imply legal or illegal immigration status. But if you can't legally be employed in the country that doe not help and if you are a legal guest worker that is way to vague. If I am wrong on my facts please correct me. I do my best to understand, but NAFTA seems to be the real problem not the poor in the 3 countries.
JonahTorn 3 years ago 5
@JonahTorn
Plus NAFTA was the foundation for the north american union.
jmjfanss 8 months ago
Our government is probably making a profit off of this project also. They are all working together. Greed is going to destroy this country.
cbreeze123 3 years ago 9
What I find so bad is that BOTH side sold us this bill of goods. I do wish I was educated about this a little more. Can anyone point me in a better direction that is not either left or right, but truthful?
grassyknollblues 3 years ago 5
I can see thier won't be no Middle Class!!!...rich and Poor...
wmbdm 3 years ago 8
In the debate a few weeks back, Hillary was asked if she remembered Ross Perot's speeches against NAFTA just before Bill Clinton got in and passed Bush's NAFTA.
She laughed along with the nervous democratic party audience and said all she recalled "were some charts".
The charts Perot put up showed exactly what would happen with NAFTA. Working Americans wages dropped, while Canadian and Mexican workers wages got much higher. Oh-- and the rich CEO class made record profits.
LeeCountyArkansas 4 years ago 4
Other than the overall state of affairs getting poorer on all sides, yeah. That shit's fucked up, son.
Killuminati!
Wu Tang!
bobbygnosis 3 years ago 9
wh aren't these congressmen/women, not puting these ceo's in jail or at least fining them? the have the power to do so. what are the waiting for? they are all the same, liars.
efrisco 4 years ago
"wh aren't these congressmen/women, not puting these ceo's in jail or at least fining them? the have the power to do so. what are the waiting for? they are all the same, liars."
Because they all work for the same team. Their's.
kelim92 3 years ago 8
So, does anybody want to DO something?
dnHooligan 4 years ago
"So, does anybody want to DO something?"
Start your own business. Shop from local farmers and your local community.
kelim92 3 years ago 9
there are no unions in Mexico, they pay them about $7 a day to make cars...ect. do you think that is fair??? They put all the US workers out of work and now they are ripping off the Mexican workers.....the only one who wins are the rich corporations and the stock brokers....
Kisinkona 4 years ago 6
Gawd damn it....we are NOT going to take it anymore!
Kisinkona 4 years ago 5
I protested against the false claims of Nafta and I'm still protesting the Nafta agreement.
BLESSEDone333 4 years ago
Whatever happened to truth and justice? It seems the "American Way" has become greed and exploitation.
dnHooligan 4 years ago 2
Actually Reagan opened the door on this... the others followed and it's gotten bigger and worse ever since. Now it is on OUR doorstep.
NikkouDaisuke 4 years ago 3
Exactly, Reagan was responsible for Nafta and Nixon was responsible for opening up free trade with China...all our jobs our being outsourced to India, China and other foreign countries...this is the beginning of the end of America as a great country...our economy is going down in flames...
Kisinkona 4 years ago
So you give no responsibility to Bill Clinton for signing it into law. Interesting
tjlawson20 4 years ago 3
Oh, we give plenty of responsibility to Bill Clinton. No question. He did not consult Labor and did not put any labor protections into this agreement, which does more to benefit the investing class than the working class.
TeamsterPower 3 years ago
As Ross Perot said,the clinton nafta plan would do nothing but push big business into the chinese labor market.
Looks like he was right.
tfox03 4 years ago 6
imagine how different this country would be if we elected ross perot. i doubt wed be in as much trouble as we are now
densefawg 4 years ago
Good to know. I'll read up on it.
mmgg33 4 years ago
Yes, it lowered wages in the US, but it did nothing to improve wages in Mexico, on average about $7 a day.
These workers still live in poverty.
And when US-subsidized crops were shipped into Mexico 1.3 million Mexican farmers were ran out of business because they couldn't compete. So do you think those undocumented imigrants are highly skilled factory workers or are they less skilled ag workers?
Stupid? It's the Bush trade policy that's stupid.
TeamsterPower 4 years ago
I'm pretty sure you mean the Clinton trade policy.
mmgg33 4 years ago
Yes, no argument, Clinton signed NAFTA. But Bush the first got it rolling and Bush II is expanding it in Peru, with CAFTA and is pushing for Panama.
TeamsterPower 4 years ago
Bush SR. signed Nafta. Clinton Expanded the day lights out of it, and Bush Jr. is on a massive rampage doubling even Clinton's expansion. The U.S. has lost at least 13 million middle class jobs since 91-92. And yes, Mexico ag is screwd too from the corruption. End nafta now, elect RP, get rid of the entire elected establishment in washington.
b101aa2 4 years ago 4
mmgg33 - "I'm pretty sure you mean the Clinton trade policy." No pal,Clinton started it with NAFTA..Bush has been busy putting other trade agreement through that expand this bullshit into China and whatever other countries these corporations can exploit
pcjunkie54 4 years ago
Listen to the video...she said the nafta agreement that was started by the First Bush administration....
Kisinkona 4 years ago
Don't know if you've been asked already but, where can I get a copy o' this?
funnyguise 4 years ago
email me your contact info and I'll see if I can get a copy for you.
TeamsterPower 4 years ago
There is a great video of NAFTA and GATT being denounced by Sir James Goldsmith on the Charlie Rose Show. Pasting "Charlie Rose November 15 1994" into your YouTube search window will bring it up.
neothomist1275 4 years ago
HEAVY exploitation going on.I know of a guy that got a whole house done and he didnt even have to pay the workers!He offered them tents food and portable power and they agreed.
DanteAGU 4 years ago
Money talks people?
USRLA 4 years ago
If a Drug lord can easily corrupt a politician just imagine a allaince of coorpations.Who ever controls the money controls the goverment i think karl marx said that
USRLA 4 years ago
Ron Paul was against nafta right from the start by the way...
Ron Paul08
FlingNdirt 4 years ago 4
So is Kucinich.
but I still dig all RON PAUL issues.
apballard 4 years ago
Don't just thank clinton, thank the CFR too. Its maainly there fault.
Jarvald 4 years ago 4
This is not a Republican or Democrat issue. This is an issue regarding the enslavement of labor for the profit of a few at the multi-national corporate level. Democrats as well as Republicans are equally resoponsible for this indescriminate abuse of power at the expense of human beings. The whole situation stinks!
jimmyhoopstahoe 4 years ago 9
Thank you!
You forgot to mention it spells the loss of American jobs!
bruin03 4 years ago
NAFTA Signed in 93 when into affect in Jan 94.................Thanks Clinton
monkeyboyjh 4 years ago 3
The problem is not Free Trade. Trade is good. What is going on is NOT trade. Its out sourcing and off shoring to avoid rules and regulations. NAFTA would work if the companies were obligated to meet the same rules in every country. The problem is NOT profits, but that those profits are NOT shared with the employees. We get back to having consistent rules there.
CMOSjockey 4 years ago
Are you forgetting something??These corporations are doing this because they can exploit cheap labor..All they can do with the US and any other country is drive wages to the bottom
pcjunkie48 4 years ago
If this is some great deal for corps. and nobodie, then we shouldnt support it. We need to look at Mexicos policy too , its not possible the US messes up EVERY country in the world and the little 2 bit country is just completley innocent, just a pawn in Bushs imperial empire. <----Thats a bunch of bull HOW about MEXICO cleans up itys act instead of blaming everything on ourselves
MSVLian 4 years ago
You really are one ignorant dickhead..I believe that you don't have a clue what your talking about
pcjunkie48 4 years ago
The ONLY people that are winning are the multi-national corporations. ALL THE MONEY GOES TO THE TOP. The senior managers, shareholders and outragously overpaid CEO's resulting in a huge pay gap from "everyone else" in the corporation. It all goes to the top. The rich get richer off the backs of the bruised.
LeftLiberalSoCal 4 years ago
NAFTA has had an unexpected bonus (I think) for corporations and key business. Since 2000 we have seen the biggest surge of illegal immigration in US history. Look no futher than NAFTA. Why do you think all these poeple are coming here? Becuase they want to "invade" us? No. It's becuase they need work. The reciprocal effect of NAFTA is depressing US wages and costing more taxes in the form illegal immigration.
LeftLiberalSoCal 4 years ago
Rise of the Socialist Democratic Republics of Latin America
USRLA 4 years ago
america does not support free trade. free trade is absent of predatory pricing and needs government controls to stop monopolies. america does not stop either of these economic tactics.
ertert12345 4 years ago
corporate ethics..thats a laugh..there is no such thing as corporate ethics. You are treating the syptom not the cause.
Figure out witch corps. are doing this and refuse to bye there products.This would be a good start.
brotherblues2112 4 years ago
(NAFTA/SPP/PNAC) think tanks alll hang them like saddam.traitors
conspiracymedia 5 years ago
NAFTA is not about free trade!!!. It's government forced "free trade". Anyone who thinks NAFTA is free trade is a moron. It's not based on voluntary mutual agreement..
dagnome1984 5 years ago
Also, one thing that does make Mexico unique is the border it shares with the US. We are creating economic refugees in Mexico and the rest of Latin America (thanks to CAFTA). Why do you think these people are leaving their homes, working for illegal bosses in this country and mailing the money back to their families? Building fences isn't the answer. Building trade policies that lift all working people is.
TeamsterPower 5 years ago
If it's not Mexico, it's China. Seriously, NAFTA is not the problem - it is corporate ethics and consumers NOT caring enough. Consumers want stuff cheaper, but they complain when companies exploit the ability to do it. Stop buying junk at walmart if you don't like it - but you will pay more.
mneeve 5 years ago
NAFTA is the problem because there are no safeguards for workers in that country. Relying on "corporate ethics" have gotten us where we are today. We need trade agreements that offer global standards nice "everyday low prices." Global standards will help raise the bar to America's level, not force American workers to compete with Third World abusive labor practices. You are right about one thing, though. Americans do need to stop buying junk at Wal-Mart!
TeamsterPower 5 years ago
How is a company that goes to Mexico any different then one going to China? Believe me, if it's not one, it's the other, and there is no free trade agreement with China. America, being such a massive consumer driven nation, needs to encourage the supply to come to them and free trade allows this.... (next reply)
mneeve 5 years ago
It's called exploiting cheap labor,Why would they pay your ass 15.00 an hour when they can get the same job done for a dollar a day??it's all about their profits
pcjunkie48 4 years ago
continuation (order may be wrong)...Maybe you're right, they need to select certain countries that have labour laws and general worker rights so that corporations stop exploiting this advantage. If they end up back pedalling on free trade it will eventually leave the country at a disadvantage in a globalizing world -- don't forget, NAFTA is more than Mexico... Canada is a vital trading partner.
mneeve 5 years ago
This is the truth. FUCK FREE TRADE! You free traders are such morons. Wake up and smell the coffee. Don't sell out your country.
pervert696 5 years ago