Shut the fuck up you pricks why the hell does every tennis video have to be a place for a bunch of 4.0 club players to start an argument about some technique or some player. Couldn't the time be better spent practicing the technique that you think works best rather than criticizing some other guy's opinion?
Just do a simple google search for Tony07UK and you'll find pages of search results for him opening accounts online and commenting about tennis. He says the same thing repeatedly to promote the virtues of modern tennis. And when he wants to create the illusion that in those forums people are agreeing with him or if he wants to bolster his own comments, he switches to his 2nd account under user name MattScottUK.
Dude, don't listen to Tony07UK. He knows a lot about tennis, but unfortunately his campaign against the classical technique of moving forward and stepping in to a shot to add power is nothing but a smear and a platform for him to talk about the advantages of the modern stroke.
He knows the classical technique works but decides to smear it anyways as a "false teaching" even though he admits the technique works.
By the way, Tony07UK is the same user as MattScottUK.
@miltyu97 What are you on about mate? Moving forward is not limited to any 'classical' technique, neither is it really a technique because moving forwards into a shot is a strategy and is used by players to gain an advantage by approaching the net or to get dominance in the mid-court area. No one is disputing that players step into the ball.
Come on guys - think about it! If you were to automatically step into every single ball in a rally .. you would eventually ratchet yourself towards the net. Moving forwards is a choice and depends on the quality of the shot from your opponent. Neither do you want to be constantly shifting backwards and forwards by replaying a coaching instruction. Watch the Youtube clips of Nadal practising indoors at Mayfair. One clip focuses on his footwork - please go and watch it!
@miltyu97 Players don't lean forward you wally! Watch the US Open right now - both Nadal and Djokovic are running side to side, sliding diagonally backwards, lifting and rotating - no one is 'leaning' in! You understand nothing about modern tennis.
Play is live at w w fromsport com/v-0/4/70/v-47029 h t m l
@miltyu97 Leaning forward does not increase power you dumbell! How many times do you need it to be explained to you? Players are upright, they lift .. and rotate - they do not lean? Watch the match now between Nadal + Djokovic .. it's being broadcast live. Let me know if either player leans in when they play a shot - it's a stupid coaching instruction. Later go to FYB and check the 5 fundamentals of playing a forehand .. then get back to me. Go take a sports science class .. then get back to me.
@miltyu97 If you watch pro players like Sampras, Federer etc. (any that play one-handed backhands) Henin ... you'll notice that they don't have to lean forwards to play an effective shot. Body mass has nothing to do with a tennis stroke - look at the variety of tennis players from petite to large frame.
It is a myth that you have to lean into a shot - many top pro players can clearly be seen leaning backwards, hitting off the back foot ... and even running away from the net hitting the ball between their legs. So much for your theory that one has to step into the ball or lean forwards - it's a false teaching and no such instruction is given in Modern Tennis.
@miltyu97 Study the video clips on Youtube and watch when and under what circumstances a player decides to move forwards on their groundstrokes. Surely you can't be that stupid!?
@caranchorga Yes, you don't have to step in, lean forward, move your body towards a tennis ball on each shot - it is NOT taught. It doesn't even happen on EVERY ball in a tennis rally.
@caranchorga I've seen this video .. and plenty more! Go study weight transfer, body rotation & lift .. also watch at what point in a rally when a player decides to move forwards into a ball and what he does next. Do you actually play tennis?
@Tony07UK Every ball is hit defferently, depending on the pace and how you play your ball. Of course not every ball is played leaning forward, but when you're taking control over the point you want to give your opponent as less recovery time as possible. That's one of the moments when you DO want to lean forward. It all depends on the ball you're playing and how you wanna play it.
I've played tennis for over 12 years. Played COSAT and Futures, before coming to a Div I team.
@caranchorga Leaning forwards does not improve your shots. I can reference 2 websites that explain in bio-mechanical terms why leaning forwards is not taught by coaches who understand the basic principles of tennis technique. It's a tennis teaching myth that players should lean when playing any type of shot. Leaning is a last resort option .. same as diving for a ball. It's not a key feature to improve the pace, spin or anything to do with how a ball should be hit.
You're putting words into my mouth and making arguments by knocking absurd extremes that I didn't claim.
No, you don't HAVE TO lean forward to play an effective shot. Besides, an "effective" shot varies on the situation.
Also you're misrepresenting what I said about body mass. I didn't say massive people hit better strokes (that's absurd)-it's a matter of using your core (which has more MASS than the arms alone) to help generate power.
That's the issue when you try to explain something out of 500 symbols... Obviously, many people aren't at first able to think strictly about what is written and only infer the conclusions they imply; and we are not even talking about getting this information out of a youtube comment.
And, yes, the kinetic energy generated by yourself moving forward does make a considerable difference in pace. At least, that's what Newton said about dynamic inertia!
@GueorguiJoukov If you were observant you'd notice that this guy does not move forwards on his backhand - he is in fact generating power by lifting his body. In Modern Tennis terms it is called 'Vertical Power'. Watch the video again and see how he lifts upwards as he plays the stroke. 'dynamic inertia' simply refers to a body either remaining at rest or continuing to move unless acted on by a force .. so what's your point? Kinetic energy is energy of motion ..
@GueorguiJoukov ... in this case the kinetic energy generated in the lift is transferred into the stroke. Watch the guy's footwork - all strokes are generated from the ground upwards.
Relax. I'm talking about greater inertia with greater mass. I didn't think there would be someone like you here picking apart words and worrying about semantics rather than focusing on the message.
@miltyu97 If you start talking physics make sure you first understand the subject matter. You really don't know what you're talking about - tennis is about transfer of energy & momentum. The weight (mass) of a tennis racquet has more significance than the weight (mass) of the person swinging it. For those who are confused about the issue or common teaching about stepping into the shot, the key elements are 1) weight transfer from one foot to the other which facilitates body rotation and lift ..
So which is easier to apply: energy transfer to the ball that wants to go forward while you lean backwards OR energy trnasfer to the ball that wants to go forward while you lean forward?
The simple fact is Nadal and Federer hit hard DESPITE leaning backwards, not BECAUSE they lean backwards.
Leaning into your shot is not a false teaching; and no one said that is the ONLY way to hit hard.
@miltyu97 .. this coiling action generates the stroke from the ground upwards - in Modern Tennis terms this lift is referred to as 'vertical power'. In cases where the player moves forwards by stepping into the ball, the power is still in the lift - research has shown that a step forward of 5mph only adds this same amount to the impact velocity between the ball and the racquet strings .. there is no significant increase in ball velocity or power by stepping forwards - this has been documented.
Again, no one is saying leaning into the ball is the ONLY way to generate power.
Twisting works wonderfuly too.
How about do both?? Your favorite example Federer does both when he can. It just depends on the situation. But to say leaning forward is a "false teaching" is, well, a false teaching.
@miltyu97 'Twisting'? Are you being technical? When you say 'lean' describe the body position .. are you saying lean as in tilting forwards? There's a difference between stepping into a shot and leaning into a shot. Players generate a stroke by standing upright, lifting & rotating their bodies .. Google search pictures of pro forehands. Find a picture of a pro leaning .. maybe to do up their shoelaces.
@miltyu97 Observe how many pros actually shift their bodies sideways - the wiper motion of the racquet follow through is also sideways. More strokes are played from body rotation (not 'twist') and transferring body weight sideways (not forwards).
When You lean, which part of You does the leaning? Are you saying get your head nearer to the ball and tilt your whole body? You sound daft!
@miltyu97 2) However, when a player steps in to take the ball on the rise (early) this reduces the reaction time that the opponent has to prepare for the next shot, hence, this action is perceived as a faster shot and is definately advantageous. If you hit a ball against a brick wall at 40mph .. and the wall moves towards you at 5mph, you have a rebounding ball coming at you at less than 45mph after the first bounce. The priority of a tennis player is to generate power by lifting and they use ..
@miltyu97 Power does not really come from body mass, neither is it advantageous to step in at 5mph to gain extra pace on the ball. Players are actually upright and lifting when they hit a ball - the body rotation and footwork often actually take a player sideways from which they recover. Watch rallies of top pros at any tournament. Reference me any website pics that show players leaning forwards and I will tell you what the situation entails.
@miltyu97 How many times are you pretending to be thick? No! Leaning anywhere does not add power to the ball! How does leaning add power? How many extra mph is added to the ball velocity by 'leaning' forwards. How much more topspin is added by leaning in? You dumbell! Leaning forwards is good if you want to do up your laces! When players hit the ball they are upright - not leaning, they rotate their hips and shoulders - they do not 'twist'. You are the thickest person to understand basic physics
@miltyu97 .. appropriate footwork as they find necessary in a given situation. If you observe the various rallies between pros, both players try to move their opponent laterally along the baseline keeping the ball as deep as possible. Both look for the opportunity of taking the first short ball and coming forward for an attacking shot, with the possibility of taking a position at the net when the opponent has been forced into defensive play.
@miltyu97 Many top pros still hit aggressively and often play winners from seemingly defensive and impossible situations - witness Nadal, Federer, Djokovic and others. Many balls hit on the run are played by players running laterally (along the baseline) - some even lean backwards. The 'tweener' shots have players running away from the net, playing the ball with their backs to the opponent ~ although rare it shows that the requirement to lean forwards on all shots is a false teaching.
Sorry to break it to you, but just because you keep repeating that "false teaching" doesn't make it so. Utilizing body mass intertia is a more efficient way of generating power than NOT utilizing body mass inertia. It's as simple as that.
Yes, Nadal and Federer can hit powerful shots in all sorts of ways, but does that mean amateurs can?? No. Does everyone have muscles like Nadal?? No. Does everyone have the timing and technique like Federer?? No.
@miltyu97 You are confusing 'inertia' with 'energy' - they are not the same thing. A body at rest has inertia - a moving body has inertia; study Newton's Laws of motion.
All bodies have mass - why don't You explain exactly what You mean because by simply stating 'body mass inertia' you have not explained what point you are trying to make. Then you get even more confused by claiming you get 'free energy' and try to associate it with inertia. You do not know what you are talking about.
@miltyu97 Don't forget that it is the racquet that makes contact with the tennis ball - if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing ~ big deal! The power is in the lift and in the technique used to accelerate the racquet. If you want more power .. get a heavier racquet; pros use racquet weights up to 340g and add lead tape. Amateurs can improve their game by copying the pros. Now you're sounding really stupid! Muscles like Nadal aren't a requirement to play tennis ..
Stupid?? YOU were the one to suggest leaning into a shot is "false teaching." If you can say right here right now that leaning forward would NOT increase the power of this guy's shot, then you'd be the one that's stupid.
But of course you won't say leaning forward won't add power to this guy's shot, because it would. You're just trying to get on your soap box about the virtues of twisting.
@miltyu97 ... but studying his technique will reveal more about how he hits the ball than having physical strength. If you have an eye for detail go study 1) the grip that Nadal uses 2) the reverse forehand brush that Nadal uses extremely well to exaggerate the topspin. Sure you have to have good physical conditioning and strength as most top pros do - it's part of the training. Again .. yawn! Whether you're a beginner or club player .. you learn timing and technique as you practise.
@miltyu97 Again no! Why do you keep asking the same question? Go to a sports college and ask a Professor of sports science. Go to a tennis academy that teaches modern tennis and studies videos of the pros playing. Modern Tennis does not teach what you are claiming as one of its principles. Only really duff stupid coaches who can't play themselves still propagate tennis myths with outdated instruction that makes beginners look and play like beginners for months. Do you lean forward?
@miltyu97 ... but studying his technique will reveal more about how he hits the ball than having physical strength. If you have an eye for detail go study 1) the grip that Nadal uses 2) the reverse forehand brush that Nadal uses extremely well to exaggerate the topspin. Sure you have to have good physical conditioning and strength as most top pros do - it's part of the training. Again .. yawn! Whether you're a beginner or club player .. you learn timing and technique as you practise.
Great, why don't we simply go by your "false teaching" then. People learning to play and amateurs should simply be Nadal or Federer. That would be easy, right?
@miltyu97 Top pros are the ones to copy, yes! If you were starting up in business and wanted a model plan to follow .. you would copy and use the same principles of an existing and successful business plan ... right? .. or not?
@miltyu97 Body mass does not equal free energy - you sound really confused! Go study some physics and sports science .. you make yourself look like an absolute fool!
You can't bring yourself to say it, because you realized that by admitting that my suggestion to the guy in the video to lean into his shots WOULD add power to his shot; and by admitting that you would be completely eatting your own words about calling that technique a "false teaching" for the past two days!
@miltyu97 I've told you you're wrong. Find an example of a teacher, instructor or coach .. or any text on the Internet that agrees with your theory and let me know. I've already told you about the FYB tennis website as an example - go check the 5 fundamentals that all top pros do to hit a successful forehand. Nowhere is it mentioned that they have to lean in to the ball. I can reference you documented information that anyone can look up - please do the same research for me. Thanks!
@miltyu97 Listen you wally before you make yourself sound even more ridiculous in front of every person that can read my post. To the right of this video and below is a column of other video listings - check the following: Federer - Backhand - New Slow-Motion, Richard Gasquet Slow-Motion Topspin Backhand, Roger Federer Backhand Analysis .. all links can be accessed from this page. You and anyone else reading this can check these videos to see if you are right or I am wrong. Simple!
@miltyu97 The answer to your question is in the videos to the right. Try them - you will observe that when playing a stroke, professional players lift their bodies and rotate to accelerate the racquet. Note the position of the footwork ~ the front leg is often seen braced, away from the direction of the swing - hence, players are actually leaning back and away from the net as a result of this body rotation and upward lifting. Then the feet recover for the next shot.
@miltyu97 The guy in the above video is playing his backhand stroke on similar principles - he first turns his shoulders then he lifts his body as he plays the stroke, although he is not using enough body rotation as the pros do. If I were coaching him this is the point I would work on - coiling the hips and shoulders for better body rotation as can be seen in Federer's and Gasquet's videos. Leaning in would not generate any more power .. why not? Because if it did .. why don't the pros do it?
Understandably now you're lying to save face. On top of that, you're contradicting YOURSELF when you say "Leaning in would not generate any more power".
This is what you said yourself "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing"
Would you like to revise your answer now? Would leaning forward into the shot add power to the shot for the guy in the video? Yes or no?
@miltyu97 Does the leaning Tower of Pisa generate power? What is your obsession with this leaning? Are you describing a player leaning so that his head and shoulders are leaning forwards over his feet - please describe in which direction You say that players lean when they play a tennis shot? Then send me a video showing this .. if you can. You are confused between the issue of whether a player moves forwards and steps into a shot and your silly obsession with leaning.
@miltyu97 Leaning does not generate power. Why should a player lean? In those videos I referenced for you - do you see those players leaning .. forwards to generate more power? No! .. because they generate power by lifting and not by leaning - if anything, when they finish their stroke, they're leaning backwards because of their body rotation and foot stance. When a person steps forwards and continues to move forwards, the speed of the step is added to the velocity of the racquet at contact.
Hm? What was that you posted on my channel page "Clock me the time frame and I will analyze it"?
OK, how about YOU, Tony07UK saying "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing". When did you say this? One day ago according to YouTube.
You do know who Tony007UKs is, right? Can you analyze that? I can. It means not even YOU believe it's a "false teaching."
@miltyu97 When you lean against a wall .. is anything moving? Can you lean at 5mph? Why should leaning generate any power? Moving parts generate speed and power .. velocity, spin, inertia, momentum - wow! it's match point! Isn't physics fun!
You daft bimbo .. why don't you get your crayons out and go color in a book.
@miltyu97 Yes, carry on .. make your point .. I know what I've written. Let's also hear your comments on the videos I've asked you to look at .. and send me a website link from anywhere that agrees with your theory. I'll be waiting! Tell me please more about this leaning theory of yours .. how are you getting on with your coloring book?
P.S. I said 'move' .. and you say 'lean' - explain yourself?
@miltyu97 Players do step into the ball when they're moving forwards. Some coaches also say to lean in and many beginners stoop or tilt when trying to do this but it is misunderstood. There is no documentation or instruction from any tennis authority that I have seen that teaches players to lean forward when playing a shot. On the contrary professional players keep their bodies upright and lift from the knee bend as they play their stroke. The student in the above video is playing correctly.
There's nothing you said that I disagree with so far. I was only holding Tony07UK accountable for his repeated lying.
I suggested to the player in the video to step into the ball/move forward/lean into the shot to add power. Tony07UK repeated countless times that this was a "false teaching".
But even he HIMSELF admitted that "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing."-TOTALLY contradicting his disingenuous smear campaign against the technique.
@miltyu97 What technique/teaching are you talking about? Stepping in and moving forwards are different from leaning. I've seen most of the videos here and all pro players get power from lifting as they play their shot, you don't see them leaning forwards at all. I'm going to send you some articles to your channel as website links here get blocked. Read the article on Body Balance by Rhys Thomas - the home page has video clips of Borg, McEnroe and Federer showing how they're balanced when playing
@miltyu97 Here are some quotes from the article: 'Every tennis professional teaches balance at some level. We see students leaning too far one way or the other, making their performance sporadic at best. Through position or stroke work, we get them back on balance and they see and feel improvement, but they go right back to leaning again.' From Rule 2 'If the head and upper body are leaning, rotation throws the body further off balance.' This is an excellent article showing drills (with pictures
@miltyu97 I'm also sending a 2nd article by Mark Papas on Revolutionary Tennis which also shows that 'leaning' is a false teaching. Note this quote: 'If you pick up a box and lean side to side or bend over, you lose strength.' Study the whole section to understand the basic principles.
@miltyu97 Here is another quote from the same article: 'A popular idea in tennis teaching is to lean into the ball, .. This means your torso extends sideward beyond the width of the hips and out past the knee and foot, a clear indication of losing balance. .. shows vertical balance, not leaning sideward into the ball, no leaning over ..' When you have read these get back to me and let me know what you think.
@miltyu97 Yet another quote reads: 'Leaning into the ball not only means you're losing strength from the body, but your timing also suffers because your vision is impaired.' When you have fully understood these articles you can answer your own question as to whether the guy in the video should be leaning in or if he will get more power by doing so. I think you should have read what Tony07 was saying because he actually answered your questions many times.
I don't know what you're talking about. I never asked you any question (unless you're using a new user name). I don't want to have the same conversation with you about ANOTHER conversation I had with SOMEONE ELSE.
Let Tony07 speak for himself. If he wants to lead a smear campaign against a certain technique in tennis calling it a "false teaching" and then turn around and ADMIT it DOES WORK, then let him admit he was being disingenuous.
@miltyu97 I've simply read your postings here - you keep asking the same question and as the other guy seems to have given up, I've sent you articles that I've found that show how to properly balance to hit a tennis ball. I thought that was being helpful. This is an open forum and we can all learn from it. Best of luck!
Open learning forum. Sadly that's not what Tony07UK used it for leading a smear campaign against certain technques.
Tony07UK, with the same profile pic as you and similar profile name "seems to have given up." Wonder why. It was such an easy yes/no question he kept avoiding.
He probably "gave up" since he knew I caught him contradicting himself and he would have to eat ALL his campaign of words smearing a technique as "false teaching" before he admited it worked.
@miltyu97 You sound obsessed with some Tony guy when he hasn't even posted here! Can you state what this false teaching claim of yours is about? It appears that you agree that leaning isn't the same as tilting or being off balance .. so what is it, in your opinion?
@miltyu97 You've lost! You keep sidestepping the issue and haven't even answered very basic questions. Leaning in is a false teaching - moving forwards and stepping in is a strategic choice to advance to the net. Stepping in is not compulsory on every shot as you have suggested, neither is leaning in or forwards. You've had this explained to you many times. You have repeated no end that the speed of a 5mph step can add a mere 5mph to the ball speed .. so what?
@miltyu97 P.S. How did you get on with the articles that I sent you? I think that is the basis here and not anyone's personal opinion. If you can find similar information I'd be pleased to read it. I'm an MTI level 3 instructor and I also travel to tennis centres and Academies to teach and evaluate coaches and modern coaching techniques. I understand where you're coming from but the idea that you persist with is actually outdated and even misunderstood by coaches from years ago. All the best!
I never disagreed there are other methods to add power. I never said one way is always better than another.
But for someone (like Tony07UK) to campaign against that technique saying it's a "false teaching" is simply being disengenuous, because it DOES add power, even he admitted to it.
My "persisence" wasn't to promote a technique over others but to have someone own up to their hypocracy, which they've yet to do.
@miltyu97 Which technique are you talking about? If you have read the articles which I recommended - do you still think that leaning somehow adds power or is beneficial? The official view presented in those two articles shows that what you believe isn't correct. Leaning whichever way, is not taught in modern tennis and any coach who implies 'leaning' is actually promoting a false teaching. Could you please let me know where you got this idea - did you ever have tennis coaching years ago?
The classical closed stance stroke transfers weight from the back leg to the front leg in a forward linear fashion. There are several ways of calling this technique. One of which is called "leaning into a shot". Another is "stepping into a shot".
There has always been a componenet of bending the knees and lifting during the stroke whether classical or modern.
You can find videos for a classical groundstroke. It's not "modern" but it doesn't mean it's a "false teaching."
@miltyu97 A closed stance has never been referred to as leaning into a shot - there is a difference between leaning and stepping forwards. If you step .. why should you lean? I think you're confused - leaning is a false teaching, it's not part of some older established technique. I have many books on coaching tennis and while the closed stance is examined and compared to the open stance, no documentation exists which mentions leaning as beneficial.
@miltyu97 I agree. Let's get to the point of your claim that leaning was taught and was beneficial because of some technicality. Can you reference a book that you have read or an Internet article that I can look up to verify anything remotely suggesting that leaning has an advantage in tennis compared to not leaning?
@miltyu97 Can you suggest how leaning forwards could benefit the guy in the above video? The articles I have referenced for you show technically + scientifically that leaning during the stroke making process and at contact with the ball, is a poor technique. At ball contact the stroke needs to accelerate and to achieve this to it's optimum the body needs to lift - not to lean. The knees are used in this lifting process as you have correctly mentioned.
Leaning into a shot DOES NOT mean make yourself angled off vertical or off balance. IT'S JUST ANOTHER WAY OF SAYING stepping into a shot.
Not even Tony07UK, who led a campaign to discredit the technique by calling it "false teaching" misunderstood me. He constantly interchanged usage of the term step forward and lean forward.
Wait, why is your prfile image the same as Tony07UK??? You're the same guy??!!
@miltyu97 O.k now you're the one who is not making yourself very clear on what you are saying. You have often grouped leaning, moving, stepping into your sentences without proper clarification as to what you really mean. You cannot interchange the terms step and lean, which is why I want you to explain yourself without going off at a tangent - keep to the point. Leaning into a shot is NOT another way of saying stepping into a shot; stepping requires movement. These are two separate issues.
"Now I'm the one..." wait a second. Who ARE you? Are you the same guy as Tony07UK or not?
1)You both have the same profile picture.
2) You both have similar user names.
3)I haven't heard back from Tony07UK since he got caught contradicting himself trying to smear a technique and then admitting that it worked.
3)And conveniently you seem to be trying to help him avoid the subject of him contradicting himself by smearing a technique and then admitting it works.
@miltyu97 You must be very confused as no one else is using my profile picture here as I've checked the last few posters and the Tony guy doesn't even look like me! Are you on drugs or something? I've asked you some very simple questions which you keep avoiding. You keep going off at a tangent and are avoiding the issue of clarifying the difference between moving into a stroke by stepping and leaning into a stroke. Just keep to the point and explain the difference between leaning and not leaning
Now you're turning into more of a compulsive liar. You have the same picture on both of your accounts! Look!! You're caught RED HANDED. Give it up already!!
@miltyu97 Leaning IS a false teaching - get used to it. I'm glad you admitted you have no answers. You cannot even differentiate between different techniques or dare mention the words because you're scared of being wrong. You have been thoroughly exposed for your ignorance and my clear and logical explanations together with documented articles (that anyone can access to study) have tied you up in knots to the point where you cannot even speak or say the words for fear of contradicting yourself!
It's such a false teaching that you admitted that it works. You said "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing." But somehow it's false??
You've been trying to change the subject to talk about the virtues of other techniques ever since I caught you contradicting yourself.
You were in denial since then. You're in denial now. You deny saying it. You deny you contradicted yourself. You deny your own identity using 2 YT accounts to troll.
@miltyu97 What are you referring to? You're deliberately mixing things up - you've changed from your original topic in these listings which was 'leaning' and now you're claiming that moving forwards is false. No posting here says that moving forwards is false - it is a choice, it is a strategy to advance to the net. Keep to the point - you claimed that leaning in gives power and that the player in the video should do it. I've proved you wrong and supplied two articles that show leaning is wrong.
@miltyu97 You're talking rubbish and deliberately mixing up statements from various postings. Be clear on what you're saying and don't change the subject. Leaning is different from stepping and moving. Don't confuse the issue. I have supplied you with two articles available on the Internet with videos and pictures. You should study them before making any further ignorant and stupid comments. Your statements are contradictory and it appears you are confused or drunk.
"Don't change the subject?" What about you? The only thing I ever wanted was for you to admit that you contradicted yourself. Instead you wrote novels' worth about other stuff trying to mask your error.
Your error was this: Your smear campaign saying moving forward or stepping in to a shot is a "false teaching" was bogus since even you YOURSELF admitted "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing."
Anything but an admission from you would be off topic!
@miltyu97 To make it really easy for you just give your opinion in a simple statement. I will tell you directly if it's correct or not - don't make up things which I have not said. Everything I have stated in these postings is consistent and can be verified by anyone checking the listing. Your comments however, are vague, contradictory and mixed up. You cannot even answer a simple question and avoid the main issue by side-stepping. What are you afraid of?
You already ADMITTED that "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing."
So you think it works!! You don't actually believe your smear campaign against stepping in or moving forward during a shot via calling it a "false teaching."
BUT you think it works only mildly so. You think there's a much better way to add power. No one disagrees. But you just can't admit contradicted yourself and even switched accounts in attempts to mask your error.
@miltyu97 If a ball can already be accelerated to 80mph .. an extra 5mph isn't the issue, but topspin is because the ball has to be kept in court. Go learn how to generate topspin because you have missed the whole point of this discussion. Let's repeat - leaning in is a false teaching and you won't find it documented anywhere. Have you provided me with a reference for your claim? No - you haven't, therefore, you've lost!
@miltyu97 Your original issue was leaning in, but now you're avoiding it - I wonder why? Don't forget you were also claiming more power by utilising leaning, stepping etc. I have been specific with you and differentiated between leaning and moving (stepping) - while you keep mixing these up. I've tried to help you with the leaning issue (balance) by sending you two articles on the subject which you can study on the Internet. It has explanations, videos & pictures.
Wrong. The original issue is you campaigning against moving forward, stepping in, leaning in to a shot via calling it a "false teaching." Then you contradicted your campaign by saying "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing."
So which is it? Is it "false" or does it add 5mph to your swing?
I haven't gone off topic AT ALL. I've asked you this 17 odd times now.
So, which is it, tennis master sensei guru genius?
@miltyu97 ... and yes, if the shot requires the body to move forward that is what they do they move forward. The pros move their body weight according to the situation. You should do the same. Check out the website Tennis Warrior (Google search)
@miltyu97 ... ball velocity by itself isn't the issue either - hit hard & flat, the ball will soon go out. To hit hard with control and still have a safety margin to clear the net, you need to hit with topspin. This in turn dictates how you use your body. Pro players aren't bothered by adding a few extra mph to a ball which they can already hit quite fast - the issue is control and placement. Do you actually play tennis?
Hey, that sounds very familiar. Where have I heard you say that before? Let me see. Oh right! When you logged in as Tony07UK you wrote:
Tony07UK
3 weeks ago
@caranchorga I've seen this video .. and plenty more! Go study weight transfer, body rotation & lift .. also watch at what point in a rally when a player decides to move forwards into a ball and what he does next. Do you actually play tennis?
@MattScottUK Hey, I was taught to lean in when hitting a shot because it helps the swing. I'm not a strong player so have to lean for added strength. What's wrong with that? Hattie
@HarrietJonesPhd Hi Hattie, .. are you sure? At what point are you leaning? You probably lean forwards and then jerk upwards as I have seen many beginners do because the timing and stroke have not been developed. I'm going to send you 2 articles (links) which you can read on two different websites. Both studies show that leaning actually causes loss of power - you need to be lifting (vertical power) which is taught in modern tennis. You can even get tutorial DVDs from the MTI website. Matt
Hey, I don't know how you were raised, but I was taught not to lead smear campaigns like the one you're holding calling things "false teachings" even though you know and openly admit they work. I was also taught when you do get called out on your contradiction, to be a man and admit it. That way you can carry on with your life with self respect and a shred of dignity intact. But you're different. How come you can't own up to your own contradictions...even online??
@miltyu97 Go to w x 3 tenniswarrior * com myths - myth-weightfoward
Here is a quote:
Myth - You should move your body weight into the ball on all of your shots.
Truth - 'What do the pros do? Simple! If the shot requires the body to move backward that is what they do they move backward. If the shot requires the body to move sideways that is what they do they move sideways.
@miltyu97 You have also contradicted yourself in your last comment as you are the one who is now interchanging 'leaning' and 'stepping' by saying they're the same thing! Now would you kindly explain for all to see what exactly do you mean by leaning as opposed to not leaning if it isn't defined as 'angled off vertical or off balance'. Then we can get to the issue of whether the guy in the above video should be doing what you are suggesting. Your next answer will now clarify the whole issue.
Why isn't Ton07UK speaking for himeself (unless you're the same guy who is using a different user name to try to get out of having to admit you've been caught contradicting youself)?
He understood me just fine up until I pointed out he contradicted himself saying "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing" after and endless campaign of calling the same technique a "false teaching."
If he wants to smeared it was false, why did he admit it works?
@miltyu97 What technique are you talking about re: 'moving forwards at 5mph .. and adding 5mph to the ball' .. what's wrong with that? No posting here is contradicting stepping forwards into the ball. Are you understanding what you're reading or are your comments meant for someone else? You appear to be confused about what you're talking about.
There you go again Tony07UK, smearing and going on the attack to save from having to admit you've been called out on your contradition during your smear campaign.
@miltyu97 Without going off at a tangent and avoiding the issue can you simply answer the question - what contradiction & what smear campaign? The postings I have read all seem logical - only you appear to be confused!
@miltyu97 State the technique which you're referring to - now you're being very vague and have stopped mentioning leaning, stepping, moving etc. What technique is it that you are claiming to be false?
You were the one who smeared as a "false teaching" a technique only to admit it worked later on.
You know which one-you are the one who are the one to smear it, deny smearing it, admit it works, then log in to your 2nd account to try to change the subject.
It's over, man. The more you talk about it, the more people will be able to read that you have 2 accounts and make pretend to bail yourself out when called out on contraditions. Just stop.
@miltyu97 So you admit you've lost the plot. You know that leaning is a false teaching because it has been proved to you. You can't even bring yourself to say it and be specific - you are lost for words. Even the simple recent questions you cannot answer directly because your ashamed of yourself for not being able to do any research and find anything to back up your original claim. All you have done is sidestep my questions because you've realised you have no answers left.
You're the one who is debating YOURSELF! You log into Tony07UK to lead a smear campaign against a technique calling it a "false teaching" then turn around and admit it WORKS!
And when called out on that, you switch to your second account and try to dig yourself out of the hole!
You are LITERALLY debating with yourself with two accounts!
@miltyu97 ... erm, I may have missed something here but have you avoided answering any of my questions in my previous replies that have helped to educate you? I'm waiting for your answers and anything you can reference on the whole Internet about tennis instructions that supposedly tell a player to lean into a shot for more power. I'd be really excited to here this from someone else apart from You! Ha! ha! Tell me about your nice crayons ~ what colors do you have? Hee! hee!
Hey, you can try to distract from the original topic with countless tangents, but I'm going to stay on topic.
I'll remind you AGAIN what we're talking about. 1) I suggested to the guy in the video to lean forward to add power to his stroke. 2) you said that was "false teaching." 3) to test that I asked you if you thought leaning forward would add power to this guy's shot or not. 4) you avoided this question to no end and tried repeatedly to change the subject like you're doing now.
"Don't change the subject?" What about you? The only thing I ever wanted was for you to admit that you contradicted yourself. Instead you wrote novels' worth about other stuff trying to mask your error.
Your error was this: Your smear campaign saying moving forward or stepping in to a shot is a "false teaching" was bogus since even you YOURSELF admitted "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing."
Anything but an admission from you would be off topic!
@miltyu97 Moving and stepping forward to play a shot is NOT a false teaching - why do you keep claiming that it is? I have explained to you many times that moving and stepping are strategic options when a player wants to advance to the net. It is not an issue of power because whether one steps or not, power comes from the lift. The main issue is to create topspin to keep the ball in court .. not to add a measly few mph to the ball. Coaches emphasize stroke production to produce topspin ...
Why do I claim you are calling stepping in/moving forward during a shot a "false teaching?" Uhh because you said it you?? You've been saying it for weeks now? Is that good enough a reason??
I mean just yesterday you said to me:
MattScottUK
1 day ago
@miltyu97 Leaning IS a false teaching - get used to it.
And yet you continually admit, I continually remind you, that you admitted that "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing."
@miltyu97 Are you still confused about the difference between leaning and stepping in/moving? Leaning in is not a recognised technique and is not taught in modern tennis - Fact. Stepping and moving depends on the situation - it is NOT compulsory to move in on every shot as you have claimed. The guy in the above video does not have to step or move in to the ball to play the shot. He is doing exactly what the pros do - he is lifting his body to generate power.
@miltyu97 I only know what I've studied from authoritative sources ~ unlike you who have only voiced your opinion and can't back it up with any references which we can all see. You keep grouping terms together deliberately to confuse the issue - moving forward and stepping in to play a shot is a choice made by the player depending on the situation. Do you understand this? There is plenty of information available on moving and stepping forwards. The issue of leaning is separate ...
@miltyu97 Leaning in IS a false teaching because as I have shown you with two articles (website links previously sent to you), the issue of leaning is to do with balance and posture. Your suggestion that players can get more power from leaning is wrong - professional players do not lean, they lift their bodies to generate more power and in doing so add topspin to their shots. This is documented in authoritative sources. Sorry that you keep losing this discussion.
OK, great!! So if leaning into a shot/moving body weight forward during a shot/stepping in to a shot IS a "false teaching" according to you....
why do you contradict yourself by saying "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing"? Because adding power to a swing would mean it's not a false teaching. It's either it "adds 5mph..." or it's "false." You can't have it both ways.
@miltyu97 You're still wrong mate! You're grouping things together which are different, so you're confused about leaning - which IS a false teaching and moving forward and stepping which is a different issue and is NOT compulsory on every shot as you have suggested, but depends on the situation. In some rallies you cannot move forwards or step into the ball .. you will see this in professional games if you watch the videos. You play the shot that the situation demands. Sorry you lose again!
@miltyu97 That is correct! It still holds and I'll repeat it - "you don't have to step in, lean forward, move your body towards a tennis ball on each shot" - I will confirm that this is absolutely right. Some coaches may use these terms together and while they appear to have similar meanings, one can find very good study articles on tennis technique which really help to understand the essential elements of tennis and also to dispel the myths.
@miltyu97 I have learnt a lot from researching Internet articles and studying video clips. I also play and teach tennis every week - there are things which I read in an American tennis book years ago and used some of the tips in my lessons during the '80s. On reflection some of this instruction was not correct. I have since learned more about modern tennis techniques and methods and took an MTI training course. I now have a much wider perspective of things which even I believed and taught ...
@miltyu97 ... and I'm prepared to admit that some things were wrong. These were my early days of coaching tennis .. I even had some of my students standing on one leg while practising serves, so that they could become more aware of balance. Even now I keep researching to find as much info as I can and correlate it all together to see what is really true and what works. I have stacks of e-mails with website links - if you're interested in reading them give me your e-mail address ...
I'm FULLY aware of the modern technique of tennis strokes. I read up and learn from the pros too. I even play both types of shots regularly-depending on the shot (no one argues one shot is the best always).
But that doesn't make the old teaching "false." It does work. You can find many ways to make a shot work, but that doesn't mean the old way is "false."
@miltyu97 ... and I will send you the whole lot - there are 9 e-mails to date. By the way - the statement "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing" is not contradictory. It is valid yet there will be situations in a rally where you don't need an extra 5mph on the ball and also you will not be able to move or step in especially if your opponent is keeping the shots deep and pinning you behind the baseline or wide out of court. It all depends on the situation.
Yes of course it's valid. That was my whole point all along! I'm glad to finally hear you agree.
It was just that you kept saying it was a "false teaching" I had to point out that you contradicted by saying "if you move your body forward at 5mph..you add 5mph to your swing."
I'm glad you are beginning to concede that point, because no one said to do one technique or another EVERY situation.
On 16 different occasions now, you have either repeated or been reminded that you admitted, IN YOUR OWN WORDS, "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing" - totally contradicting your smear campaign to discredit the technique as a "false teaching."
It's your own words versus your own words no matter whether you log into MattScottUK or Tony07UK.
Shall we make it 17 occasions? Or are you going to admit your contradiction this time?
Shut the fuck up you pricks why the hell does every tennis video have to be a place for a bunch of 4.0 club players to start an argument about some technique or some player. Couldn't the time be better spent practicing the technique that you think works best rather than criticizing some other guy's opinion?
hattrickster33 1 year ago
Just do a simple google search for Tony07UK and you'll find pages of search results for him opening accounts online and commenting about tennis. He says the same thing repeatedly to promote the virtues of modern tennis. And when he wants to create the illusion that in those forums people are agreeing with him or if he wants to bolster his own comments, he switches to his 2nd account under user name MattScottUK.
Split personality or trolling?
miltyu97 1 year ago
snoozyboi,
Dude, don't listen to Tony07UK. He knows a lot about tennis, but unfortunately his campaign against the classical technique of moving forward and stepping in to a shot to add power is nothing but a smear and a platform for him to talk about the advantages of the modern stroke.
He knows the classical technique works but decides to smear it anyways as a "false teaching" even though he admits the technique works.
By the way, Tony07UK is the same user as MattScottUK.
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 What are you on about mate? Moving forward is not limited to any 'classical' technique, neither is it really a technique because moving forwards into a shot is a strategy and is used by players to gain an advantage by approaching the net or to get dominance in the mid-court area. No one is disputing that players step into the ball.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
Come on guys - think about it! If you were to automatically step into every single ball in a rally .. you would eventually ratchet yourself towards the net. Moving forwards is a choice and depends on the quality of the shot from your opponent. Neither do you want to be constantly shifting backwards and forwards by replaying a coaching instruction. Watch the Youtube clips of Nadal practising indoors at Mayfair. One clip focuses on his footwork - please go and watch it!
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
Oh no, having to recover to optimal court position after a shot? Who wants to do that, right?
So would leaning forward increase the power of this guy's shot or not? You've dodged the question enough times.
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 Players don't lean forward you wally! Watch the US Open right now - both Nadal and Djokovic are running side to side, sliding diagonally backwards, lifting and rotating - no one is 'leaning' in! You understand nothing about modern tennis.
Play is live at w w fromsport com/v-0/4/70/v-47029 h t m l
and atdhe net / watchtv h t m l
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 Leaning forward does not increase power you dumbell! How many times do you need it to be explained to you? Players are upright, they lift .. and rotate - they do not lean? Watch the match now between Nadal + Djokovic .. it's being broadcast live. Let me know if either player leans in when they play a shot - it's a stupid coaching instruction. Later go to FYB and check the 5 fundamentals of playing a forehand .. then get back to me. Go take a sports science class .. then get back to me.
Tony07UK 1 year ago
Flush. ;]
Harmonikz 1 year ago
This is obviously an amateur!
Tony07UK 2 years ago
I guess this is a neat backhand, good follow through. But you should stem your feet on the court to accelerate your ball.
lokitkit 2 years ago
Nice stuff.
How about taking more advantage of your body mass by leaning into the shot? That way you can get free energy just by body mass.
miltyu97 2 years ago
@miltyu97 If you watch pro players like Sampras, Federer etc. (any that play one-handed backhands) Henin ... you'll notice that they don't have to lean forwards to play an effective shot. Body mass has nothing to do with a tennis stroke - look at the variety of tennis players from petite to large frame.
Tony07UK 2 years ago
It is a myth that you have to lean into a shot - many top pro players can clearly be seen leaning backwards, hitting off the back foot ... and even running away from the net hitting the ball between their legs. So much for your theory that one has to step into the ball or lean forwards - it's a false teaching and no such instruction is given in Modern Tennis.
Tony07UK 2 years ago
There you go again with knocking absurd extremes that I didn't claim.
No you don't HAVE TO lean into a shot. Yes you CAN hit a shot leaning any other way. No one claimed otherwise.
But if given a choice, players that wants to hit with more power more efficiently, will almost always move forward on a ground stroke.
You want to talk about modern tennis, what better example than Federer. When he can, he's always trying to move his mass forward with his groundies.
miltyu97 2 years ago
@miltyu97 Study the video clips on Youtube and watch when and under what circumstances a player decides to move forwards on their groundstrokes. Surely you can't be that stupid!?
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK it's a false teaching????
youtube.com/watch?v=yo_zuz7bcLQ&feature=related
caranchorga 1 year ago 18
@caranchorga Yes, you don't have to step in, lean forward, move your body towards a tennis ball on each shot - it is NOT taught. It doesn't even happen on EVERY ball in a tennis rally.
Tony07UK 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Tony07UK
No, you lost.
Because you are repeating saying that it is a "FALSE TEACHING" like a mantra, but ADMITTED 3 TIMES NOW that it works!!!
THAT'S IT! GAME, SET, AND MATCH!
Anything but an admission of your contradiction now would be off topic!
miltyu97 1 year ago 4
@caranchorga I've seen this video .. and plenty more! Go study weight transfer, body rotation & lift .. also watch at what point in a rally when a player decides to move forwards into a ball and what he does next. Do you actually play tennis?
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK Every ball is hit defferently, depending on the pace and how you play your ball. Of course not every ball is played leaning forward, but when you're taking control over the point you want to give your opponent as less recovery time as possible. That's one of the moments when you DO want to lean forward. It all depends on the ball you're playing and how you wanna play it.
I've played tennis for over 12 years. Played COSAT and Futures, before coming to a Div I team.
caranchorga 1 year ago
@caranchorga Leaning forwards does not improve your shots. I can reference 2 websites that explain in bio-mechanical terms why leaning forwards is not taught by coaches who understand the basic principles of tennis technique. It's a tennis teaching myth that players should lean when playing any type of shot. Leaning is a last resort option .. same as diving for a ball. It's not a key feature to improve the pace, spin or anything to do with how a ball should be hit.
Tony07UK 7 months ago
You're putting words into my mouth and making arguments by knocking absurd extremes that I didn't claim.
No, you don't HAVE TO lean forward to play an effective shot. Besides, an "effective" shot varies on the situation.
Also you're misrepresenting what I said about body mass. I didn't say massive people hit better strokes (that's absurd)-it's a matter of using your core (which has more MASS than the arms alone) to help generate power.
miltyu97 2 years ago
@miltyu97
That's the issue when you try to explain something out of 500 symbols... Obviously, many people aren't at first able to think strictly about what is written and only infer the conclusions they imply; and we are not even talking about getting this information out of a youtube comment.
And, yes, the kinetic energy generated by yourself moving forward does make a considerable difference in pace. At least, that's what Newton said about dynamic inertia!
GueorguiJoukov 1 year ago
@GueorguiJoukov If you were observant you'd notice that this guy does not move forwards on his backhand - he is in fact generating power by lifting his body. In Modern Tennis terms it is called 'Vertical Power'. Watch the video again and see how he lifts upwards as he plays the stroke. 'dynamic inertia' simply refers to a body either remaining at rest or continuing to move unless acted on by a force .. so what's your point? Kinetic energy is energy of motion ..
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@GueorguiJoukov ... in this case the kinetic energy generated in the lift is transferred into the stroke. Watch the guy's footwork - all strokes are generated from the ground upwards.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 Body mass does not = free energy!
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
Relax. I'm talking about greater inertia with greater mass. I didn't think there would be someone like you here picking apart words and worrying about semantics rather than focusing on the message.
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 If you start talking physics make sure you first understand the subject matter. You really don't know what you're talking about - tennis is about transfer of energy & momentum. The weight (mass) of a tennis racquet has more significance than the weight (mass) of the person swinging it. For those who are confused about the issue or common teaching about stepping into the shot, the key elements are 1) weight transfer from one foot to the other which facilitates body rotation and lift ..
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
Energy transfer. OK, now you're talking.
So which is easier to apply: energy transfer to the ball that wants to go forward while you lean backwards OR energy trnasfer to the ball that wants to go forward while you lean forward?
The simple fact is Nadal and Federer hit hard DESPITE leaning backwards, not BECAUSE they lean backwards.
Leaning into your shot is not a false teaching; and no one said that is the ONLY way to hit hard.
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 .. this coiling action generates the stroke from the ground upwards - in Modern Tennis terms this lift is referred to as 'vertical power'. In cases where the player moves forwards by stepping into the ball, the power is still in the lift - research has shown that a step forward of 5mph only adds this same amount to the impact velocity between the ball and the racquet strings .. there is no significant increase in ball velocity or power by stepping forwards - this has been documented.
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
Again, no one is saying leaning into the ball is the ONLY way to generate power.
Twisting works wonderfuly too.
How about do both?? Your favorite example Federer does both when he can. It just depends on the situation. But to say leaning forward is a "false teaching" is, well, a false teaching.
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 'Twisting'? Are you being technical? When you say 'lean' describe the body position .. are you saying lean as in tilting forwards? There's a difference between stepping into a shot and leaning into a shot. Players generate a stroke by standing upright, lifting & rotating their bodies .. Google search pictures of pro forehands. Find a picture of a pro leaning .. maybe to do up their shoelaces.
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
So is that a yes? Or are you backpedalling to mask your mistake?
miltyu97 1 year ago 3
@miltyu97 Observe how many pros actually shift their bodies sideways - the wiper motion of the racquet follow through is also sideways. More strokes are played from body rotation (not 'twist') and transferring body weight sideways (not forwards).
When You lean, which part of You does the leaning? Are you saying get your head nearer to the ball and tilt your whole body? You sound daft!
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 2) However, when a player steps in to take the ball on the rise (early) this reduces the reaction time that the opponent has to prepare for the next shot, hence, this action is perceived as a faster shot and is definately advantageous. If you hit a ball against a brick wall at 40mph .. and the wall moves towards you at 5mph, you have a rebounding ball coming at you at less than 45mph after the first bounce. The priority of a tennis player is to generate power by lifting and they use ..
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
That's a whole other story. I was only suggesting an efficient way of increasing the power of the shot in the video.
Timing and strategy for the next ball is a whole different matter.
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 Power does not really come from body mass, neither is it advantageous to step in at 5mph to gain extra pace on the ball. Players are actually upright and lifting when they hit a ball - the body rotation and footwork often actually take a player sideways from which they recover. Watch rallies of top pros at any tournament. Reference me any website pics that show players leaning forwards and I will tell you what the situation entails.
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
You're dodging the question....again.
Would leaning into the shot add power to this guy's shot? Yes or no?
miltyu97 1 year ago 5
@miltyu97 How many times are you pretending to be thick? No! Leaning anywhere does not add power to the ball! How does leaning add power? How many extra mph is added to the ball velocity by 'leaning' forwards. How much more topspin is added by leaning in? You dumbell! Leaning forwards is good if you want to do up your laces! When players hit the ball they are upright - not leaning, they rotate their hips and shoulders - they do not 'twist'. You are the thickest person to understand basic physics
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 .. appropriate footwork as they find necessary in a given situation. If you observe the various rallies between pros, both players try to move their opponent laterally along the baseline keeping the ball as deep as possible. Both look for the opportunity of taking the first short ball and coming forward for an attacking shot, with the possibility of taking a position at the net when the opponent has been forced into defensive play.
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
Different but related topic.
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 Many top pros still hit aggressively and often play winners from seemingly defensive and impossible situations - witness Nadal, Federer, Djokovic and others. Many balls hit on the run are played by players running laterally (along the baseline) - some even lean backwards. The 'tweener' shots have players running away from the net, playing the ball with their backs to the opponent ~ although rare it shows that the requirement to lean forwards on all shots is a false teaching.
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
Sorry to break it to you, but just because you keep repeating that "false teaching" doesn't make it so. Utilizing body mass intertia is a more efficient way of generating power than NOT utilizing body mass inertia. It's as simple as that.
Yes, Nadal and Federer can hit powerful shots in all sorts of ways, but does that mean amateurs can?? No. Does everyone have muscles like Nadal?? No. Does everyone have the timing and technique like Federer?? No.
miltyu97 1 year ago 17
@miltyu97 You are confusing 'inertia' with 'energy' - they are not the same thing. A body at rest has inertia - a moving body has inertia; study Newton's Laws of motion.
All bodies have mass - why don't You explain exactly what You mean because by simply stating 'body mass inertia' you have not explained what point you are trying to make. Then you get even more confused by claiming you get 'free energy' and try to associate it with inertia. You do not know what you are talking about.
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 Don't forget that it is the racquet that makes contact with the tennis ball - if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing ~ big deal! The power is in the lift and in the technique used to accelerate the racquet. If you want more power .. get a heavier racquet; pros use racquet weights up to 340g and add lead tape. Amateurs can improve their game by copying the pros. Now you're sounding really stupid! Muscles like Nadal aren't a requirement to play tennis ..
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
Stupid?? YOU were the one to suggest leaning into a shot is "false teaching." If you can say right here right now that leaning forward would NOT increase the power of this guy's shot, then you'd be the one that's stupid.
But of course you won't say leaning forward won't add power to this guy's shot, because it would. You're just trying to get on your soap box about the virtues of twisting.
miltyu97 1 year ago 17
@miltyu97 ... but studying his technique will reveal more about how he hits the ball than having physical strength. If you have an eye for detail go study 1) the grip that Nadal uses 2) the reverse forehand brush that Nadal uses extremely well to exaggerate the topspin. Sure you have to have good physical conditioning and strength as most top pros do - it's part of the training. Again .. yawn! Whether you're a beginner or club player .. you learn timing and technique as you practise.
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
Yes, yes, yes. All side subjects that you feel you have superior knowledge to enlighten the ingnorant masses. We all bow down to you.
So would leaning forward increase this the power on this guy's shot or not? Yes or no?
miltyu97 1 year ago 5
@miltyu97 Again no! Why do you keep asking the same question? Go to a sports college and ask a Professor of sports science. Go to a tennis academy that teaches modern tennis and studies videos of the pros playing. Modern Tennis does not teach what you are claiming as one of its principles. Only really duff stupid coaches who can't play themselves still propagate tennis myths with outdated instruction that makes beginners look and play like beginners for months. Do you lean forward?
Tony07UK 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@miltyu97 ... but studying his technique will reveal more about how he hits the ball than having physical strength. If you have an eye for detail go study 1) the grip that Nadal uses 2) the reverse forehand brush that Nadal uses extremely well to exaggerate the topspin. Sure you have to have good physical conditioning and strength as most top pros do - it's part of the training. Again .. yawn! Whether you're a beginner or club player .. you learn timing and technique as you practise.
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
Great, why don't we simply go by your "false teaching" then. People learning to play and amateurs should simply be Nadal or Federer. That would be easy, right?
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 Top pros are the ones to copy, yes! If you were starting up in business and wanted a model plan to follow .. you would copy and use the same principles of an existing and successful business plan ... right? .. or not?
Tony07UK 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@miltyu97 Body mass does not equal free energy - you sound really confused! Go study some physics and sports science .. you make yourself look like an absolute fool!
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
You already said that yesterday, remember?
Or are you a trolling tennis instructor with an agenda to devalue leaning forward in tennis?
You still haven't answered me. Would leaning forward increase the power of this guy's shot? Yes or no?
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 I can't believe you're still asking the same question! Go watch the US Open live .. it's on now!
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
Hahahaha! You can't bring yourself to say it!
You can't bring yourself to say it, because you realized that by admitting that my suggestion to the guy in the video to lean into his shots WOULD add power to his shot; and by admitting that you would be completely eatting your own words about calling that technique a "false teaching" for the past two days!
Now we know who was being "false."
miltyu97 1 year ago 5
@miltyu97 I've told you you're wrong. Find an example of a teacher, instructor or coach .. or any text on the Internet that agrees with your theory and let me know. I've already told you about the FYB tennis website as an example - go check the 5 fundamentals that all top pros do to hit a successful forehand. Nowhere is it mentioned that they have to lean in to the ball. I can reference you documented information that anyone can look up - please do the same research for me. Thanks!
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 Listen you wally before you make yourself sound even more ridiculous in front of every person that can read my post. To the right of this video and below is a column of other video listings - check the following: Federer - Backhand - New Slow-Motion, Richard Gasquet Slow-Motion Topspin Backhand, Roger Federer Backhand Analysis .. all links can be accessed from this page. You and anyone else reading this can check these videos to see if you are right or I am wrong. Simple!
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 The answer to your question is in the videos to the right. Try them - you will observe that when playing a stroke, professional players lift their bodies and rotate to accelerate the racquet. Note the position of the footwork ~ the front leg is often seen braced, away from the direction of the swing - hence, players are actually leaning back and away from the net as a result of this body rotation and upward lifting. Then the feet recover for the next shot.
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 The guy in the above video is playing his backhand stroke on similar principles - he first turns his shoulders then he lifts his body as he plays the stroke, although he is not using enough body rotation as the pros do. If I were coaching him this is the point I would work on - coiling the hips and shoulders for better body rotation as can be seen in Federer's and Gasquet's videos. Leaning in would not generate any more power .. why not? Because if it did .. why don't the pros do it?
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
Understandably now you're lying to save face. On top of that, you're contradicting YOURSELF when you say "Leaning in would not generate any more power".
This is what you said yourself "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing"
Would you like to revise your answer now? Would leaning forward into the shot add power to the shot for the guy in the video? Yes or no?
miltyu97 1 year ago 10
@miltyu97 Does the leaning Tower of Pisa generate power? What is your obsession with this leaning? Are you describing a player leaning so that his head and shoulders are leaning forwards over his feet - please describe in which direction You say that players lean when they play a tennis shot? Then send me a video showing this .. if you can. You are confused between the issue of whether a player moves forwards and steps into a shot and your silly obsession with leaning.
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 Leaning does not generate power. Why should a player lean? In those videos I referenced for you - do you see those players leaning .. forwards to generate more power? No! .. because they generate power by lifting and not by leaning - if anything, when they finish their stroke, they're leaning backwards because of their body rotation and foot stance. When a person steps forwards and continues to move forwards, the speed of the step is added to the velocity of the racquet at contact.
Tony07UK 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Tony07UK
Hm? What was that you posted on my channel page "Clock me the time frame and I will analyze it"?
OK, how about YOU, Tony07UK saying "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing". When did you say this? One day ago according to YouTube.
You do know who Tony007UKs is, right? Can you analyze that? I can. It means not even YOU believe it's a "false teaching."
miltyu97 1 year ago 15
@miltyu97 When you lean against a wall .. is anything moving? Can you lean at 5mph? Why should leaning generate any power? Moving parts generate speed and power .. velocity, spin, inertia, momentum - wow! it's match point! Isn't physics fun!
You daft bimbo .. why don't you get your crayons out and go color in a book.
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
Your false anger isn't masking your error nor your self-contradiction. You aren't fooling anyone.
You said "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing"
So you can pretend you didn't say that all you want, but it's right here in black and white that you did say that. Just be a man and admit it.
miltyu97 1 year ago 5
@miltyu97 Yes, carry on .. make your point .. I know what I've written. Let's also hear your comments on the videos I've asked you to look at .. and send me a website link from anywhere that agrees with your theory. I'll be waiting! Tell me please more about this leaning theory of yours .. how are you getting on with your coloring book?
P.S. I said 'move' .. and you say 'lean' - explain yourself?
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
Of course you know what you've written. I've also reminded you countless times, since you're not man enough to admit you contradicted yourself.
On the one hand you repeated countless times, in your own words "step into the ball or lean forwards - it's a false teaching"
On the other hand you said, in your own words "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing".
So would leaning into the shot ADD POWER OR NOT for the guy in the video? It's a simple yes or no.
miltyu97 1 year ago 17
@miltyu97 Players do step into the ball when they're moving forwards. Some coaches also say to lean in and many beginners stoop or tilt when trying to do this but it is misunderstood. There is no documentation or instruction from any tennis authority that I have seen that teaches players to lean forward when playing a shot. On the contrary professional players keep their bodies upright and lift from the knee bend as they play their stroke. The student in the above video is playing correctly.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
There's nothing you said that I disagree with so far. I was only holding Tony07UK accountable for his repeated lying.
I suggested to the player in the video to step into the ball/move forward/lean into the shot to add power. Tony07UK repeated countless times that this was a "false teaching".
But even he HIMSELF admitted that "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing."-TOTALLY contradicting his disingenuous smear campaign against the technique.
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 What technique/teaching are you talking about? Stepping in and moving forwards are different from leaning. I've seen most of the videos here and all pro players get power from lifting as they play their shot, you don't see them leaning forwards at all. I'm going to send you some articles to your channel as website links here get blocked. Read the article on Body Balance by Rhys Thomas - the home page has video clips of Borg, McEnroe and Federer showing how they're balanced when playing
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 Here are some quotes from the article: 'Every tennis professional teaches balance at some level. We see students leaning too far one way or the other, making their performance sporadic at best. Through position or stroke work, we get them back on balance and they see and feel improvement, but they go right back to leaning again.' From Rule 2 'If the head and upper body are leaning, rotation throws the body further off balance.' This is an excellent article showing drills (with pictures
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 I'm also sending a 2nd article by Mark Papas on Revolutionary Tennis which also shows that 'leaning' is a false teaching. Note this quote: 'If you pick up a box and lean side to side or bend over, you lose strength.' Study the whole section to understand the basic principles.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 Here is another quote from the same article: 'A popular idea in tennis teaching is to lean into the ball, .. This means your torso extends sideward beyond the width of the hips and out past the knee and foot, a clear indication of losing balance. .. shows vertical balance, not leaning sideward into the ball, no leaning over ..' When you have read these get back to me and let me know what you think.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 Yet another quote reads: 'Leaning into the ball not only means you're losing strength from the body, but your timing also suffers because your vision is impaired.' When you have fully understood these articles you can answer your own question as to whether the guy in the video should be leaning in or if he will get more power by doing so. I think you should have read what Tony07 was saying because he actually answered your questions many times.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
I don't know what you're talking about. I never asked you any question (unless you're using a new user name). I don't want to have the same conversation with you about ANOTHER conversation I had with SOMEONE ELSE.
Let Tony07 speak for himself. If he wants to lead a smear campaign against a certain technique in tennis calling it a "false teaching" and then turn around and ADMIT it DOES WORK, then let him admit he was being disingenuous.
miltyu97 1 year ago 2
@miltyu97 I've simply read your postings here - you keep asking the same question and as the other guy seems to have given up, I've sent you articles that I've found that show how to properly balance to hit a tennis ball. I thought that was being helpful. This is an open forum and we can all learn from it. Best of luck!
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
Open learning forum. Sadly that's not what Tony07UK used it for leading a smear campaign against certain technques.
Tony07UK, with the same profile pic as you and similar profile name "seems to have given up." Wonder why. It was such an easy yes/no question he kept avoiding.
He probably "gave up" since he knew I caught him contradicting himself and he would have to eat ALL his campaign of words smearing a technique as "false teaching" before he admited it worked.
miltyu97 1 year ago 27
@miltyu97 You sound obsessed with some Tony guy when he hasn't even posted here! Can you state what this false teaching claim of yours is about? It appears that you agree that leaning isn't the same as tilting or being off balance .. so what is it, in your opinion?
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
You are the same user as Tony07UK. It's as clear as day.
He hasn't posted here? Do a word search for Tony07UK and you'll find over 60 hits.
miltyu97 1 year ago 16
@miltyu97 Right, you need your eyesight checked - what colour top am I wearing in my profile picture?
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
You need your BRAIN checked.
You are wearing one shirt in one account profile pic and you are wearing another shirt in the other account profile pic.
Big deal! It's still a picture of the same person!
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 You're mad! You said the pictures were the same. Now you're saying that the shirts are different. For your info I'm wearing a jumper.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 If you type Tony07UK into the Youtube search box nothing comes up - you're crazy! It says No videos found for “Tony07UK"
MattScottUK 1 year ago
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@MattScottUK
Press "view all comments".
Do a word search (not a video search like you pretend to mistaken me saying) for "Tony07UK" and you'll find over 60 hits in the comment section.
miltyu97 1 year ago 16
@miltyu97 You've lost! You keep sidestepping the issue and haven't even answered very basic questions. Leaning in is a false teaching - moving forwards and stepping in is a strategic choice to advance to the net. Stepping in is not compulsory on every shot as you have suggested, neither is leaning in or forwards. You've had this explained to you many times. You have repeated no end that the speed of a 5mph step can add a mere 5mph to the ball speed .. so what?
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 P.S. How did you get on with the articles that I sent you? I think that is the basis here and not anyone's personal opinion. If you can find similar information I'd be pleased to read it. I'm an MTI level 3 instructor and I also travel to tennis centres and Academies to teach and evaluate coaches and modern coaching techniques. I understand where you're coming from but the idea that you persist with is actually outdated and even misunderstood by coaches from years ago. All the best!
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
You misunderstood again.
I never disagreed there are other methods to add power. I never said one way is always better than another.
But for someone (like Tony07UK) to campaign against that technique saying it's a "false teaching" is simply being disengenuous, because it DOES add power, even he admitted to it.
My "persisence" wasn't to promote a technique over others but to have someone own up to their hypocracy, which they've yet to do.
Thanks, best to you too.
miltyu97 1 year ago 2
@miltyu97 Which technique are you talking about? If you have read the articles which I recommended - do you still think that leaning somehow adds power or is beneficial? The official view presented in those two articles shows that what you believe isn't correct. Leaning whichever way, is not taught in modern tennis and any coach who implies 'leaning' is actually promoting a false teaching. Could you please let me know where you got this idea - did you ever have tennis coaching years ago?
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
The classical closed stance stroke transfers weight from the back leg to the front leg in a forward linear fashion. There are several ways of calling this technique. One of which is called "leaning into a shot". Another is "stepping into a shot".
There has always been a componenet of bending the knees and lifting during the stroke whether classical or modern.
You can find videos for a classical groundstroke. It's not "modern" but it doesn't mean it's a "false teaching."
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 A closed stance has never been referred to as leaning into a shot - there is a difference between leaning and stepping forwards. If you step .. why should you lean? I think you're confused - leaning is a false teaching, it's not part of some older established technique. I have many books on coaching tennis and while the closed stance is examined and compared to the open stance, no documentation exists which mentions leaning as beneficial.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
Old techniques does not equal "false teaching."
If more efficient techniques exist, that still doesn't mean a technique is "false teaching."
If current trends teach other techniques (which clearly you and I know they do), that still doesn't mean it's a "false teaching."
If an old technique works, but a newer technique works better, that doesn't mean the old technique is a "false teaching."
miltyu97 1 year ago 15
@miltyu97 I agree. Let's get to the point of your claim that leaning was taught and was beneficial because of some technicality. Can you reference a book that you have read or an Internet article that I can look up to verify anything remotely suggesting that leaning has an advantage in tennis compared to not leaning?
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 Can you suggest how leaning forwards could benefit the guy in the above video? The articles I have referenced for you show technically + scientifically that leaning during the stroke making process and at contact with the ball, is a poor technique. At ball contact the stroke needs to accelerate and to achieve this to it's optimum the body needs to lift - not to lean. The knees are used in this lifting process as you have correctly mentioned.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
Leaning into a shot DOES NOT mean make yourself angled off vertical or off balance. IT'S JUST ANOTHER WAY OF SAYING stepping into a shot.
Not even Tony07UK, who led a campaign to discredit the technique by calling it "false teaching" misunderstood me. He constantly interchanged usage of the term step forward and lean forward.
Wait, why is your prfile image the same as Tony07UK??? You're the same guy??!!
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 O.k now you're the one who is not making yourself very clear on what you are saying. You have often grouped leaning, moving, stepping into your sentences without proper clarification as to what you really mean. You cannot interchange the terms step and lean, which is why I want you to explain yourself without going off at a tangent - keep to the point. Leaning into a shot is NOT another way of saying stepping into a shot; stepping requires movement. These are two separate issues.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
"Now I'm the one..." wait a second. Who ARE you? Are you the same guy as Tony07UK or not?
1)You both have the same profile picture.
2) You both have similar user names.
3)I haven't heard back from Tony07UK since he got caught contradicting himself trying to smear a technique and then admitting that it worked.
3)And conveniently you seem to be trying to help him avoid the subject of him contradicting himself by smearing a technique and then admitting it works.
miltyu97 1 year ago 28
@miltyu97 You must be very confused as no one else is using my profile picture here as I've checked the last few posters and the Tony guy doesn't even look like me! Are you on drugs or something? I've asked you some very simple questions which you keep avoiding. You keep going off at a tangent and are avoiding the issue of clarifying the difference between moving into a stroke by stepping and leaning into a stroke. Just keep to the point and explain the difference between leaning and not leaning
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
Now you're turning into more of a compulsive liar. You have the same picture on both of your accounts! Look!! You're caught RED HANDED. Give it up already!!
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 I've gone back 3 weeks to the last posting of the guy 'Tony' that you have a crush on. He's wearing a blue shirt - are you colour blind?
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
You changing shirts is STILL YOU.
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 You're obsessed with something! I've always worn a brown jumper in my picture.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
So you wore a different color shirt in the 2 photos. Big deal?
That's how pathetic your disguise is: you wore a different color shirt?? LOL!!!
Even superman put on GLASSES when he wanted to be a journalist for heaven's sake!
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 Leaning IS a false teaching - get used to it. I'm glad you admitted you have no answers. You cannot even differentiate between different techniques or dare mention the words because you're scared of being wrong. You have been thoroughly exposed for your ignorance and my clear and logical explanations together with documented articles (that anyone can access to study) have tied you up in knots to the point where you cannot even speak or say the words for fear of contradicting yourself!
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
It's such a false teaching that you admitted that it works. You said "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing." But somehow it's false??
You've been trying to change the subject to talk about the virtues of other techniques ever since I caught you contradicting yourself.
You were in denial since then. You're in denial now. You deny saying it. You deny you contradicted yourself. You deny your own identity using 2 YT accounts to troll.
miltyu97 1 year ago 20
@miltyu97 What are you referring to? You're deliberately mixing things up - you've changed from your original topic in these listings which was 'leaning' and now you're claiming that moving forwards is false. No posting here says that moving forwards is false - it is a choice, it is a strategy to advance to the net. Keep to the point - you claimed that leaning in gives power and that the player in the video should do it. I've proved you wrong and supplied two articles that show leaning is wrong.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 You're talking rubbish and deliberately mixing up statements from various postings. Be clear on what you're saying and don't change the subject. Leaning is different from stepping and moving. Don't confuse the issue. I have supplied you with two articles available on the Internet with videos and pictures. You should study them before making any further ignorant and stupid comments. Your statements are contradictory and it appears you are confused or drunk.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
"Don't change the subject?" What about you? The only thing I ever wanted was for you to admit that you contradicted yourself. Instead you wrote novels' worth about other stuff trying to mask your error.
Your error was this: Your smear campaign saying moving forward or stepping in to a shot is a "false teaching" was bogus since even you YOURSELF admitted "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing."
Anything but an admission from you would be off topic!
miltyu97 1 year ago 2
@miltyu97 To make it really easy for you just give your opinion in a simple statement. I will tell you directly if it's correct or not - don't make up things which I have not said. Everything I have stated in these postings is consistent and can be verified by anyone checking the listing. Your comments however, are vague, contradictory and mixed up. You cannot even answer a simple question and avoid the main issue by side-stepping. What are you afraid of?
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
You already ADMITTED that "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing."
So you think it works!! You don't actually believe your smear campaign against stepping in or moving forward during a shot via calling it a "false teaching."
BUT you think it works only mildly so. You think there's a much better way to add power. No one disagrees. But you just can't admit contradicted yourself and even switched accounts in attempts to mask your error.
miltyu97 1 year ago 10
@miltyu97 If a ball can already be accelerated to 80mph .. an extra 5mph isn't the issue, but topspin is because the ball has to be kept in court. Go learn how to generate topspin because you have missed the whole point of this discussion. Let's repeat - leaning in is a false teaching and you won't find it documented anywhere. Have you provided me with a reference for your claim? No - you haven't, therefore, you've lost!
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
"Another 5mph isn't the issue"???
It's the ONLY ISSUE. Because you are repeating saying that it is a "FALSE TEACHING" like a mantra, but ADMITTED 3 TIMES NOW that it works!!!
Anything but an admission of your contradiction now would be off topic!
miltyu97 1 year ago 8
@miltyu97 Your original issue was leaning in, but now you're avoiding it - I wonder why? Don't forget you were also claiming more power by utilising leaning, stepping etc. I have been specific with you and differentiated between leaning and moving (stepping) - while you keep mixing these up. I've tried to help you with the leaning issue (balance) by sending you two articles on the subject which you can study on the Internet. It has explanations, videos & pictures.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
Wrong. The original issue is you campaigning against moving forward, stepping in, leaning in to a shot via calling it a "false teaching." Then you contradicted your campaign by saying "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing."
So which is it? Is it "false" or does it add 5mph to your swing?
I haven't gone off topic AT ALL. I've asked you this 17 odd times now.
So, which is it, tennis master sensei guru genius?
miltyu97 1 year ago 6
@miltyu97 ... and yes, if the shot requires the body to move forward that is what they do they move forward. The pros move their body weight according to the situation. You should do the same. Check out the website Tennis Warrior (Google search)
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 ... ball velocity by itself isn't the issue either - hit hard & flat, the ball will soon go out. To hit hard with control and still have a safety margin to clear the net, you need to hit with topspin. This in turn dictates how you use your body. Pro players aren't bothered by adding a few extra mph to a ball which they can already hit quite fast - the issue is control and placement. Do you actually play tennis?
MattScottUK 1 year ago
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@MattScottUK
Hey, that sounds very familiar. Where have I heard you say that before? Let me see. Oh right! When you logged in as Tony07UK you wrote:
Tony07UK
3 weeks ago
@caranchorga I've seen this video .. and plenty more! Go study weight transfer, body rotation & lift .. also watch at what point in a rally when a player decides to move forwards into a ball and what he does next. Do you actually play tennis?
miltyu97 1 year ago
@MattScottUK Hey, I was taught to lean in when hitting a shot because it helps the swing. I'm not a strong player so have to lean for added strength. What's wrong with that? Hattie
HarrietJonesPhd 1 year ago
@HarrietJonesPhd Hi Hattie, .. are you sure? At what point are you leaning? You probably lean forwards and then jerk upwards as I have seen many beginners do because the timing and stroke have not been developed. I'm going to send you 2 articles (links) which you can read on two different websites. Both studies show that leaning actually causes loss of power - you need to be lifting (vertical power) which is taught in modern tennis. You can even get tutorial DVDs from the MTI website. Matt
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
Hey, I don't know how you were raised, but I was taught not to lead smear campaigns like the one you're holding calling things "false teachings" even though you know and openly admit they work. I was also taught when you do get called out on your contradiction, to be a man and admit it. That way you can carry on with your life with self respect and a shred of dignity intact. But you're different. How come you can't own up to your own contradictions...even online??
miltyu97
miltyu97 1 year ago 5
@miltyu97 Go to w x 3 tenniswarrior * com myths - myth-weightfoward
Here is a quote:
Myth - You should move your body weight into the ball on all of your shots.
Truth - 'What do the pros do? Simple! If the shot requires the body to move backward that is what they do they move backward. If the shot requires the body to move sideways that is what they do they move sideways.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 You have also contradicted yourself in your last comment as you are the one who is now interchanging 'leaning' and 'stepping' by saying they're the same thing! Now would you kindly explain for all to see what exactly do you mean by leaning as opposed to not leaning if it isn't defined as 'angled off vertical or off balance'. Then we can get to the issue of whether the guy in the above video should be doing what you are suggesting. Your next answer will now clarify the whole issue.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
Why isn't Ton07UK speaking for himeself (unless you're the same guy who is using a different user name to try to get out of having to admit you've been caught contradicting youself)?
He understood me just fine up until I pointed out he contradicted himself saying "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing" after and endless campaign of calling the same technique a "false teaching."
If he wants to smeared it was false, why did he admit it works?
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 What technique are you talking about re: 'moving forwards at 5mph .. and adding 5mph to the ball' .. what's wrong with that? No posting here is contradicting stepping forwards into the ball. Are you understanding what you're reading or are your comments meant for someone else? You appear to be confused about what you're talking about.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
There you go again Tony07UK, smearing and going on the attack to save from having to admit you've been called out on your contradition during your smear campaign.
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 Without going off at a tangent and avoiding the issue can you simply answer the question - what contradiction & what smear campaign? The postings I have read all seem logical - only you appear to be confused!
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
Without going off at a tangent?
1)You log in as Tony07UK, call a technique a "false teaching" several times, then you admit the technique works.
2) I call you out on it.
3) You don't man up to your contradiction.
4) You log in as MattScottUK and make pretend to defend YOURSELF as SOMEONE ELSE via your 2nd YouTube account.
You went SO far off on a tangent that you HAD AN OUT OF BODY EXPERIENCE switching to a different account to pretend to continue the conversation!
miltyu97 1 year ago 5
@miltyu97 State the technique which you're referring to - now you're being very vague and have stopped mentioning leaning, stepping, moving etc. What technique is it that you are claiming to be false?
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
You're losing your marbles.
You were the one who smeared as a "false teaching" a technique only to admit it worked later on.
You know which one-you are the one who are the one to smear it, deny smearing it, admit it works, then log in to your 2nd account to try to change the subject.
It's over, man. The more you talk about it, the more people will be able to read that you have 2 accounts and make pretend to bail yourself out when called out on contraditions. Just stop.
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 So you admit you've lost the plot. You know that leaning is a false teaching because it has been proved to you. You can't even bring yourself to say it and be specific - you are lost for words. Even the simple recent questions you cannot answer directly because your ashamed of yourself for not being able to do any research and find anything to back up your original claim. All you have done is sidestep my questions because you've realised you have no answers left.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
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@MattScottUK
"Confused about what I'm talking about"?
You're the one who is debating YOURSELF! You log into Tony07UK to lead a smear campaign against a technique calling it a "false teaching" then turn around and admit it WORKS!
And when called out on that, you switch to your second account and try to dig yourself out of the hole!
You are LITERALLY debating with yourself with two accounts!
miltyu97 1 year ago 8
@miltyu97 ... erm, I may have missed something here but have you avoided answering any of my questions in my previous replies that have helped to educate you? I'm waiting for your answers and anything you can reference on the whole Internet about tennis instructions that supposedly tell a player to lean into a shot for more power. I'd be really excited to here this from someone else apart from You! Ha! ha! Tell me about your nice crayons ~ what colors do you have? Hee! hee!
Tony07UK 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
Hey, you can try to distract from the original topic with countless tangents, but I'm going to stay on topic.
I'll remind you AGAIN what we're talking about. 1) I suggested to the guy in the video to lean forward to add power to his stroke. 2) you said that was "false teaching." 3) to test that I asked you if you thought leaning forward would add power to this guy's shot or not. 4) you avoided this question to no end and tried repeatedly to change the subject like you're doing now.
miltyu97 1 year ago
Comment removed
miltyu97 1 year ago
@Tony07UK
"Don't change the subject?" What about you? The only thing I ever wanted was for you to admit that you contradicted yourself. Instead you wrote novels' worth about other stuff trying to mask your error.
Your error was this: Your smear campaign saying moving forward or stepping in to a shot is a "false teaching" was bogus since even you YOURSELF admitted "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing."
Anything but an admission from you would be off topic!
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 Moving and stepping forward to play a shot is NOT a false teaching - why do you keep claiming that it is? I have explained to you many times that moving and stepping are strategic options when a player wants to advance to the net. It is not an issue of power because whether one steps or not, power comes from the lift. The main issue is to create topspin to keep the ball in court .. not to add a measly few mph to the ball. Coaches emphasize stroke production to produce topspin ...
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
Why do I claim you are calling stepping in/moving forward during a shot a "false teaching?" Uhh because you said it you?? You've been saying it for weeks now? Is that good enough a reason??
I mean just yesterday you said to me:
MattScottUK
1 day ago
@miltyu97 Leaning IS a false teaching - get used to it.
And yet you continually admit, I continually remind you, that you admitted that "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing."
miltyu97 1 year ago 5
@miltyu97 Are you still confused about the difference between leaning and stepping in/moving? Leaning in is not a recognised technique and is not taught in modern tennis - Fact. Stepping and moving depends on the situation - it is NOT compulsory to move in on every shot as you have claimed. The guy in the above video does not have to step or move in to the ball to play the shot. He is doing exactly what the pros do - he is lifting his body to generate power.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
Since you're such a tennis genius, master, guru, yoda, sensei, let's see what we can learn from you.
You campaign like a mantra that stepping in/moving forward/leaning into a shot is a "false teaching."
So why did you admit that it works by saying "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing."
So which is it master sensei guru yoda genius?
I'll keep my fingers crossed that you won't avoid this SAME question for the 20th time.
miltyu97 1 year ago 2
@miltyu97 I only know what I've studied from authoritative sources ~ unlike you who have only voiced your opinion and can't back it up with any references which we can all see. You keep grouping terms together deliberately to confuse the issue - moving forward and stepping in to play a shot is a choice made by the player depending on the situation. Do you understand this? There is plenty of information available on moving and stepping forwards. The issue of leaning is separate ...
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@miltyu97 Leaning in IS a false teaching because as I have shown you with two articles (website links previously sent to you), the issue of leaning is to do with balance and posture. Your suggestion that players can get more power from leaning is wrong - professional players do not lean, they lift their bodies to generate more power and in doing so add topspin to their shots. This is documented in authoritative sources. Sorry that you keep losing this discussion.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
OK, great!! So if leaning into a shot/moving body weight forward during a shot/stepping in to a shot IS a "false teaching" according to you....
why do you contradict yourself by saying "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing"? Because adding power to a swing would mean it's not a false teaching. It's either it "adds 5mph..." or it's "false." You can't have it both ways.
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 You're still wrong mate! You're grouping things together which are different, so you're confused about leaning - which IS a false teaching and moving forward and stepping which is a different issue and is NOT compulsory on every shot as you have suggested, but depends on the situation. In some rallies you cannot move forwards or step into the ball .. you will see this in professional games if you watch the videos. You play the shot that the situation demands. Sorry you lose again!
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
Old wise one, YOU were the one to say "you don't have to step in, lean forward, move your body towards a tennis ball on each shot"!
Old wise one, you were the one treating those as synonymous! (because THEY ARE in tennis lingo) How come you weren't parsing words in that way then???
How come you pretend those are different NOW?
Is it only because I caught you contradicting yourself by saying "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing"??
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 That is correct! It still holds and I'll repeat it - "you don't have to step in, lean forward, move your body towards a tennis ball on each shot" - I will confirm that this is absolutely right. Some coaches may use these terms together and while they appear to have similar meanings, one can find very good study articles on tennis technique which really help to understand the essential elements of tennis and also to dispel the myths.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
But if it adds 5mph to your swing, THAT MEANS THE TEACHING IS NOT FALSE!!
That's the whole point! It does work, it is NOT FALSE. There may be better ways to add power but that doesn't mean it's somehow "false!"
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 I have learnt a lot from researching Internet articles and studying video clips. I also play and teach tennis every week - there are things which I read in an American tennis book years ago and used some of the tips in my lessons during the '80s. On reflection some of this instruction was not correct. I have since learned more about modern tennis techniques and methods and took an MTI training course. I now have a much wider perspective of things which even I believed and taught ...
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
Good for you! But no one is attacking your credentials. The messenger has nothing to do with the merits of the message itself.
An old technique does not mean a "false" one.
If another new technique seems to work better in some situations or even all situations that still doesn't mean the older one is "false".
If more advanced techniques are taught (which they are) that still doesn't mean the older one is "false."
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 ... and I'm prepared to admit that some things were wrong. These were my early days of coaching tennis .. I even had some of my students standing on one leg while practising serves, so that they could become more aware of balance. Even now I keep researching to find as much info as I can and correlate it all together to see what is really true and what works. I have stacks of e-mails with website links - if you're interested in reading them give me your e-mail address ...
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
I'm FULLY aware of the modern technique of tennis strokes. I read up and learn from the pros too. I even play both types of shots regularly-depending on the shot (no one argues one shot is the best always).
But that doesn't make the old teaching "false." It does work. You can find many ways to make a shot work, but that doesn't mean the old way is "false."
miltyu97 1 year ago
@miltyu97 ... and I will send you the whole lot - there are 9 e-mails to date. By the way - the statement "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing" is not contradictory. It is valid yet there will be situations in a rally where you don't need an extra 5mph on the ball and also you will not be able to move or step in especially if your opponent is keeping the shots deep and pinning you behind the baseline or wide out of court. It all depends on the situation.
MattScottUK 1 year ago
@MattScottUK
Yes of course it's valid. That was my whole point all along! I'm glad to finally hear you agree.
It was just that you kept saying it was a "false teaching" I had to point out that you contradicted by saying "if you move your body forward at 5mph..you add 5mph to your swing."
I'm glad you are beginning to concede that point, because no one said to do one technique or another EVERY situation.
miltyu97 1 year ago
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@Tony07UK
"Another 5mph isn't the issue"???
It's the ONLY ISSUE. Because you are repeating saying that it is a "FALSE TEACHING" like a mantra, but ADMITTED 3 TIMES NOW that it works!!!
Anything but an admission of your contradiction now would be off topic!
miltyu97 1 year ago 2
@Tony07UK
On 16 different occasions now, you have either repeated or been reminded that you admitted, IN YOUR OWN WORDS, "if you move your body forwards at 5mph .. you add 5mph to your swing" - totally contradicting your smear campaign to discredit the technique as a "false teaching."
It's your own words versus your own words no matter whether you log into MattScottUK or Tony07UK.
Shall we make it 17 occasions? Or are you going to admit your contradiction this time?
miltyu97 1 year ago 4