Jesus and Joseph Smith had 12 apostles... think about that

[imtherealthing]

He just keeps getting fatter and uglier since he left the TRUTH...the Darkness in him has done this to him.

[Takenata]

@imtherealthing Has done what to him? Made him a free man? And what does his weight have ANYTHING to do with salvation? Also, instead of attacking him personally like a child...why not try to disprove the things he says. If he left the "TRUTH" as you put it, give us some facts and prove it.

[imtherealthing]

@Takenata

John 15: 18 If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you.

That about sums it up for the anti-mormons..they HATE Jesus Christ because they hate us.

[imtherealthing]

@Takenata

Want to know how the "debate" is going between your false christian faith and the TRUTH? Then google this:

Evangelical Neglect:

Losing the Battle and Not Knowing It?

Carl Mosser and Paul Owen

1997 Evangelical Theological Society Far West Annual Meeting

April 25, 1997

[imtherealthing]

@Takenata

The Latin:

maxim ignoramus et ignorabimus

Meaning "we do not know and will not know"

That about sums it up for you anti-mormons.

2 Tim. 3: 7

Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth

[imtherealthing]

@Takenata

Regarding good ole Shawn:

Titus 1:16 They profess that they know God; but in WORKS they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

[imtherealthing]

@Takenata

We do not "worship Joseph Smith". We venerate him like any other people do with the prophets of the Bible. We can go into any Chrsitian church and in thier Sunday Schools or service where they read/hear/talk of PROPHETS. The stories of Daniel, Moses, John the Baptist, etc.

As a MATTER of "FACT" we see how important "PROPHETS" are to the Jews to this day. They venerate them so much so that they are no different than the Christians of the first 3 centuries who did the same.

[imtherealthing]

@Takenata

2 Tim. 4: 3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;



[imtherealthing]

@Takenata

1 Pet. 5: 8

Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:

Acts 28: 22

But we desire to hear of thee what thou thinkest: for as concerning this SECT [cult], we know that every where it is spoken against.

[imtherealthing]

@Takenata

Book of Mormon

2 Nephi 33:6

“I glory in plainness; I glory in truth; I glory in my Jesus, for he hath redeemed my soul from hell.”

[Takenata]

@Takenata Wow...keyboard bombing is SO effective lol First off, I am no "anti-mormon", quite honestly I would LOVE to see them join the body of Christ, if someday they decide to apologize for much of their past transgressions. Secondly I never said you worshipped JS, not sure where that came from. Also I wish to make a point that my post was about you attacking him as a person. "fatter and uglier"...how mature. Your reply bombing was in no way effective as you barely addressed my question.

[dorisfenella]

Something terrible happened to the Bible

"However, you may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you. You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land. You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance. You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way." (Leviticus 25:44-46)

[asskicker0322]

Joseph Smith was a serial rapist.

[BrotherOrmond]

THe LDS is start Apostasy! except Joseph Smith.

[trencher7]

This is just siully. Jesus organized his church with 12 apostles and not before during OT times. Why would we expect Moses to have them?

[djm376]

This guy has certainly failed to mention that the Old Testament prophets did not have apostles simply because Christ's church was not organized until Jesus Christ came to earth.

[lilbeaveymac]

@djm376 but jesus wasnt a prophet with apostles,hes God.You missed the point...

[crazy456eyes]

love this one

[perez85tkd]

True same goes for the apostolic church

[perez85tkd]

Funny joke

[hammerogod]

A Mormon Bishop got on an elevator on the 10th floor, (he was heading to the lobby) on the 8th floor a beautiful woman walked in. (they were alone) On the way to the lobby the gorgeous woman hit the stop button. She turned to the Bishop and said:

"Can you make me feel like a true woman?"

The Bishop said: "I sure can" and excitedly took off all his clothes, he then threw them in the corner of the elevator. He turned to the woman pointed to the clothes and said:

"Now fold them".

[80sgirlzrock]

@r8rfanizme. So it's either nepotism or inbreeding, or both!

[r8rfanizme]

@80sgirlzrock All of the above

[r8rfanizme]

In a way, you are right about the epistles. but the epistles, to me, pointed out where the early churches and believers were getting it wrong, and helps a believer recognize a proper, (not true) church within the body of Christ, and quite frankly, the LDS doesn't cut the mustard. Revelation is a different story, however. I wish I had a better understanding of it. I plan on that one soon.

[r8rfanizme]

I am not surprised that a Mormon would laugh about the bible and the gift of the Holy Ghost.

you are right, there are things in the bible after the death of Jesus and the actshey are part of inspired letters to churches, and if you ask me, The holy bible would be fine without them. there is not any new Doctrine there, as opposed to the filth tat came out of JS mouth

[peaceliberty4all]

@r8rfanizme "I am not surprised that a Mormon would laugh about the bible and the gift of the Holy Ghost."

Really, I was laughing at the bible & the Gift of the Holy Ghost or at your resoning?

I am surprised you would say the bible would be fine without those other books as those other books are the most quoted of all books by "Christians" and I think most believers of the bible would disagree that we don't need the NEW revelations that are found in the book of Revelations.

[r8rfanizme]

The Holy Bible and the Holy Ghost is the mouthpiece for the lord today. The need for prophets ended with the Gift of the Holy Ghost.

[peaceliberty4all]

@r8rfanizme LOL then why was there continuing scriptures and revelation and new apostles called after the Gift of the Holy Ghost was given?

[peaceliberty4all]

@r8rfanizme Take your time answering. I am a little irritable today and it is coming through in my posts so I'm going to sign off for a while. I apologize.

[r8rfanizme]

let me answer a Question with a question. after the death of Jesus, who was the "president?

[peaceliberty4all]

@r8rfanizme Nice, a question with a question and how much ridicule would I get had I done that?

I'll let you wade through my posts as I already answered that down thread.

[r8rfanizme]

Source:

The Mormon Hierarchy: Extensions of Power, based on LDS genealogy records.

Looks like a tight knit group.

I would agree with J Gordon Kimball. Where is the "worthy" fresh blood? is this the true church, or an extended family business? I knew that a few was related here or there, but.........WOW

[peaceliberty4all]

@r8rfanizme I knew of all the family connections you pointed out. I guess Abraham, Isaac and Jacob are false prophets as well since they were related, right? Or could it be that "greatness" can run in families? Perish the thought.

And some of those relations were pretty far removed IMO.

Still don't see what that has to do with anything or why you insist on deflecting.

[r8rfanizme]

Joseph B. Wirthlin : -son of former presiding bishop Joseph L Wirthlin

-brother of Richard B Wirthlin

-1st cousin of Gordon B Hinckley

wife: Elisa Young Rogers Wirthlin

-she is related to fourteen General Authorities

Russell M. Nelson : -4th cousin of Rulon G Craven

Jeffrey R. Holland : -2nd,3rd cousin or grand nephew to nine General Authorities

wife: Patricia Terry Holland

-she is related to one General Authority

[peaceliberty4all]

@r8rfanizme I'm trying to figure out what them being related has to do with anything? (most LDS are aware there are relations) Maybe you could at least answer that for me since you clearly don't have an answer for my other questions.

[peaceliberty4all]

And here's a question for ya why did they call more apostles even after Christ died but then apostles didn't continue? We can look to history to see how the gospel was perverted after the apostles died. But nope no need to have a mouth piece for the Lord or someone called by him to oversee his church. God is not a God of confusion nor would he just let things run a muck under his direction. Clearly after the apostles were killed man took over.

[r8rfanizme]

Dallin H. Oaks : -2nd great grand nephew of Martin Harris Book of Mormon witness

M. Russell Ballard : -nephew of former patriarch Joseph F Smith

-grandson of former apostle Melvin J Ballard and Hyrum M Smith

-grand nephew of former LDS president Joseph Fielding Smith

-3rd cousin of emeritus patriarch Elder G Smith

-great grandson of LDS president Joseph F Smith

-2nd great grandson of presiding patriarch Hyrum Smith

-3rd great grandson of presiding patriarch Joseph Smith, Sr

[r8rfanizme]

David B. Haight : -1st cousin once removed of wife of John C Carmack

-2nd cousin once removed of H Verlan Andersen former seventy

-3rd cousin of wife of John E Fowler

-3rd cousin of F Arthur Kay former seventy

wife: Ruby Mildred Olson Haight -she is not related to any General Authorities

Neal A. Maxwell : -first cousin twice removed of O Leslie Stone,former seventy

-wife: Colleen Fern Hinckley Maxwell

-1st cousin once removed from Gordon B Hinckley

-related to four other General Authorities

[r8rfanizme]

Boyd K. Packer : -3rd cousin of wife of C Max Caldwell

wife: Donna Edith Smith Packer

-3rd great gdaughter of apostle Luke S Johnson

L. Tom Perry : -nephew of former seventy's president Alma Sonne

-4th cousin once removed of Earl C Tingey

-4th cousin of wife of Richard C Edgley

wife: Barbara Taylor Dayton Perry

-2nd great grand daughter of President John Taylor

[r8rfanizme]

James E. Faust : -1st cousin, twice removed of former apostle Richard R Lyman

-3rd cousin of former seventy's president Marion D Hanks

-3rd cousin once removed of Gordon B Hinckley

-3rd cousin once removed of former seventy's president S Dilworth Young

-3rd cousin twice removed of former LDS president George Alber Smith

-great grand nephew of former apostle Spencer W Kimball

-2nd great grandson of former apostle Amasa M Lyman

wife: Ruth Wright Faust - related to four General Authorities

[r8rfanizme]

1st presidency/apostles circa 2003, intresting Gordon B. Hinckley : -1st cousin of Joseph B Wirthlin -1st cousin of Richard B Wirthlin -nephew of former apostle Arza A Hinckley -1st cousin, once removed of wife of Neal A. Maxwell -1st cousin, twice removed of John H Groberg -3rd cousin, once removed of James E Faust Thomas S. Monson : -2nd cousin, once removed of Graham W Doxey -3rd cousin, once removed of wife of M Russell Ballard -3rd cousin, once removed of Spencer J Condie

[r8rfanizme]

I find this interesting as well

"Some people say a person receives a position in this church through revelation, and others say they get it through inspiration, but I say they get it through relation. If I hadn't been related to Heber C. Kimball, I wouldn't have been a damn thing in this church." - J.Golden Kimball after he was called to First Council of the Seventy in 1892

[peaceliberty4all]

@r8rfanizme Yeah we know that none of the apostles Christ called were related, right? And I'm guessing J. Golden Kimball was joking when he made that statement as many of the brethren often do. But you interpret it how you want just like Christ preached to the gentiles and immaculate conception is about Christ. lol.

Are you not going to answer the questions I posed? Instead just do what you always do and deflect by quoting or bringing up mormon stuff when you don't have an answer?

[peaceliberty4all]

interesting also to note that so long as the apostles were alive we had continuing scriptures but when they died that ended. Now why was that? And if Christ finished the work and revelation was no longer needed why was their any scripture, revelation, or work after him at all?

[peaceliberty4all]

And here's a question for ya why did they call more apostles even after Christ died but then apostles didn't continue? We can look to history to see how the gospel was perverted after the apostles died. But nope no need to have a mouth piece for the Lord or someone called by him to oversee his church. God is not a God of confusion nor would he just let things run a muck under his direction.  Clearly after the apostles were killed man took over.

[peaceliberty4all]

"went to establish his church" LOL exactly Shawn so when Christ church was re-established or restored makes sense he would again have a head (prohet) let's remember Peter was the head after christ died, and 12 apostles. Nope don't remember an official church being spoken of in the OT (maybe that's why there wasn't a need for apostles) but Christ sure established one as Shawn just pointed out when he was on the earth and he had 12 apostles.

[80sgirlzrock]

@r8rfanizme. Hahahaha, I love that one! How bout this one? The Catholics don't acknowledge Hanukkah and the Jews don't acknowledge Easter, and the Mormons don't acknowledge each other when they are in Mesquite, NV. : ).  Please, no offense to Catholics or Jews, I'm decedents of both, that was a total burn on Mormons and their hypocrisy.

[r8rfanizme]

@80sgirlzrock A teacher tells her first grade class to bring a religious item of their faith for show and tell.

The next day, Muhammad stands up and says, "I am a Muslim, and this is a prayer rug." Next, Issac stands up and says, "I am Jewish, and this is a dradle." Next was Mary. She gets up and says, "I am catholic, and these are rosary beads." Last was Alma. He stands up and says, "I am a Mormon, and this is a casserole plate"

[zhbvenkhoReload]

I just believe in the elders.

[taaronemore74]

John 14:6

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

So who is this Joseph Smith guy again? ...No need to answer that...

[r8rfanizme]

Q: Why do you always take two Mormons with you when you go fishing?

A: Because if you only take one, he'll drink all your beer!

[zane1963]

Utah mormon, the church is true concerning what? That it exsists? What is true about the LDS church? Is it's doctrines true? Are all it's foundational doctrines true? And what are they true too.

[TheJpgr1958]

The followers of Jesus ran away from Him; but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet...When they can get rid of me, the devil will also go." (History of the Church, Vol. 6, p. 408, 409 Need I say more???

[UtahMormon90]

@TheJpgr1958 I know The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is true. You are taking those quotes out of context. The Prophet Joseph Smith wasn't putting down Jesus, he was simply talking about the Great Apostasy and how the LDS church will never break apart. I have a testimony in the truth, as usual, you only testify in hate an criticism. I will pray for your lost and pathetic soul.

[rpavich]

@UtahMormon90

Quote:

...."he was simply talking about the Great Apostasy...."

What great apostasy?

Can you describe it and tell me how you know it happened?

[r8rfanizme]

@rpavich yes, UM, I need a good laugh

[UtahMormon90]

@rpavich After Jesus established His church, many people rejected His teachings to the point where there was a great falling away. Then Joseph Smith prayed to know which church was true an that is when God and Jesus appeared to the boy Prophet and from there the Gospel was restored to the Earth. I know The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is true. I testify that it changes lives. The Gospel was restored and is open to anybody who is OBEDIENT to follow God's word. God Bless.

[a68rebel]

@UtahMormon90 Jesus said the Church he established would NEVER be taken from the Earth.

[anthonysfirstandlast]

@UtahMormon90 It's funny how that is the only thing you Mormons testify to. You never testify to the bible or Jesus Christ being true representations of God. It's all about your church and you can't seem to see through that and see what being a true Christian is about. Gods word? More like your fake prophets words.

[Exodus314IAM]

@UtahMormon90 "an that is when God and Jesus appeared to the boy Prophet"? Are you sure or was it a Angel that came to him in the first vision? maybe it is the account of many Angels? Are you sure you understand what the truth is? Joseph Smith could not remember who came to him in the first vision so how can you take what he said as truth?

[eeikman]

@UtahMormon90 It's been a couple of days now, so what is set in the floor of the Wilkinson Student Center from the main North entrance? Are you a real BYU student? C'mon!

[rpavich]

@UtahMormon90

What you just described was not the "100% falling away" that must have happened for the LDS church to have to "restore" the gospel...what you described happened then and is still happening....even in the LDS church...

Q: Because the FLDS and the RLDS split (fell away) from the main LDS church....does that mean that your LDS doctrine is lost and must be restored by someone?

Of course not...so why would you think that the original gospel was lost and needed to be restored?

[2011neesh]

@rpavich can you tell me how you know God is real? have you seen Him?.... if you haven't seen God but you know He is real, i wont disrespect you for that....

[rpavich]

@2011neesh

I know that the God as described in the bible is real because of the impossibility of the contrary.

No other worldview can supply the necessary preconditions for knowledge, the laws of logic, absolute morals, etc.

That also includes the god of the LDS faith.

[2011neesh]

@rpavich what about charles darwin's views?

[rpavich]

@2011neesh

It also includes Charles Darwin's views.

[2011neesh]

@rpavich well at least we agree on something...

[rpavich]

@2011neesh ,

Yes....there is that :)

[eeikman]

@UtahMormon90 You're doing a fairly decent job developing this false personna. You will admit to what you really are when you get bored with it, won't you?

[Exodus314IAM]

@UtahMormon90 "I will pray for your lost and pathetic soul" is this the normal reply mormons give? So you are judging because you are perfect? you have kept all the commandments right?

Seek the truth, seek God not gods! seek the true Jesus (God) not Jesus the brother of Satan.

[TheJpgr1958]

"Come on! ye prosecutors! ye false swearers! All hell, boil over! Ye burning mountains, roll down your lava! for I will come out on top at last. I have more to boast of than ever any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I.

[rpavich]

@TheJpgr1958

And that's what their prophet thought of the Son of God....

not much.

What an arrogant man-centered religion.

[carkunkula]

@rpavich yah and how would the MORmONS feel if I named a pig Joseph Smith, called it a MORmON prophet and put it on TV to incessantly t oink about MORmON doctrine.