Shinto Ryu Kenjutsu

[RKNELIAS]

My English is not really good but im asking if there´s a Kenjutsu or Kendo style where you use not only the sword, the sheat too to hit the oponent or defend yourself, and if it was used in real combat.

Thank you all.

[mekugi]

@RKNELIAS Yes.Yagyu Shingan Ryu comes to mind.

[Dizine456]

Miyamoto Musashi developed a style with in one hand a katana and in the other a bokuto. And I haven't seen schools who teach kata's or randori with two swords. If you wan't to learn this, I suggest you search for a traditional sensei in Japan. The founder of my school (Tomita Seiji Shihan) once mentioned if you wan't to learn this, it's best to go to japan, because elsewhere it's not authentic but made up by the sensei.

[mekugi]

@Dizine456 I believe that there has been a BIG misunderstanding somewhere. I have never, ever not once seen a bokuto/shinken combo. That stinks of rubbish. As for Nito randori: You haven't looked hard enough. Kendo did (does) Nito randori. Furthermore there were/are OTHER schools BEFORE Musashi Miyamoto that used nito. For example, Tenshinshoden Katori Shinto Ryu used Nito. There are also other schools as well WAY before Musashi that did it as well. You'd better re-check! .

[RedSamurai1991]

i dont see were u have the right to tell this person he/she is wrong when what u have said is not histrolly correct , i have spent my life time dedicated to learning and practiceing Bushido and Kenjutsu and made it a chour to study samurai history to its fullist. i do not say this to critersize but to make u relise that u are just as unexperinced in ur knowledge of Samurai and there sword technique/styles as the person u critizied.

[mekugi]

@RedSamurai1991 Who are you talking to? What is this about Samurai? Huh??

[RedSamurai1991]

@mekugi it was ment for the other commenter having ago at u or some1 elese i dont really know how to use this youtube crap

[mekugi]

@RedSamurai1991 Bushido is modern and was originally written in English by a Japanese Christian living in the United States...maybe you should check your history again?

[mekugi]

@Dizine456 Nito Kendo: youtube.com/watch?v=UN6G09JGix­0

[xXxstunner]

@Dizine456 Musashi usually fought with two bokens, his skills were so developed that he didn't even need swords to defeat his opponents.

[Kenzaki1010]

@johndreid: Niten Ichi Ryu do not have any techniques that involve 2 Longsword, they use 1 Longsword and 1 short sword (Wakazashi). Even Miyamoto Musashi himself can't carry 2 Katana each hand ^^

[TheHumbleNinja]

@Kenzaki1010 lol I think he meant one in each hand...

[ihaterobbie123]

Why is Niten Ichi Ryu getting a disproportionate amount of online attention? To answer a few questions people may have.

1. No, two sword style does not mean two DAITO wielded at the same time. I haven't seen a scrap of evidence to support the notion that Niten Ichi Ryu or nito kendo use two full size swords.

2. It's just one style, it's not the ultimate school that nobody can fight against, it's not special, it's just different.

Once you get that through your heads, have a proper discussion.

[RobertBrtka]

the oldest kenjutsu-ryu , Right?

[FredDude27]

@RobertBrtka

Not this particular ryu. This one is about 400 years old.

There is a still extant kenjutsu ryu with roots going back to the 14th-15th century called Maniwa Nen-ryu.

[mikeymarshful]

i know this is a weird question to ask here, but is there any ryuha that teaches 2 sword style with both daitos?

[mekugi]

@mikeymarshful Not that I know of. :-)

[mikeymarshful]

@mekugi alright thank you

[johndreid]

@mikeymarshful I think niten ichi ryu includes some techniques with dual longswords. It was developed by Musashi Miyomoto, but I don't know if it is respected by serious practitioners.

[mekugi]

@johndreid Never seen it. :-(

[Eshonion89]

@johndreid

Yeah, I've never heard of a "Musashi Miyomoto", too.

Miyamoto Musashi.

[mekugi]

@Eshonion89 Does that really matter?

[disturbedguywithagun]

@mekugi Hyōhō Niten Ichi-ryū is Miyamoto Musashi's dual sword style

[pdxrhythm]

@johndreid "Nito Ryu" two sword style for Kendo is very much alive and well...lots on line about it..

[nicostormUK]

@johndreid Erm, no there are no techniques in the hyoho niten ichi ryu that utilise 2 long swords, so no these techniques would not be respected by serious practitioners.

[cryodragoon]

@mikeymarshful

Aside hyoho niten ichi ryu, there is also katori shinto ryu that knows a few two sword kata.. A

watch?v=zPw0k6qYSF4&feature=re­lated

See the movie above for a first impression.. Plus some more kickass stuff as well as some of its history ;)

[mekugi]

@ksr1219 It's a trick, from what I gather...

[mekugi]

@ksr1219 While left hand forward is not the usual way to hold the sword, there are some schools that have techniques where the sword is held left forward. Shinkage ryu and Hoki ryu are two that come to mind immediatly.

[superRAZU]

Lovin the setting

[Edvardas06]

beuty

[D3mang3l]

with regard to left vs right:

your right handed persons right arm is both stronger and you have more control over it. Thus a right handed swordsman doesn't have to work as hard on accuracy, but they must overcome their tendency to use the right hand to "power" through a cut. When it is the left that should supply the most power.

A lefty on the other hand has the opposite issues. A strong cut, that takes more practice to get accurate. Either way, you hold the sword the same.

[merc041985]

awesome. ok. all you anime kids. learn something here. what u see on tv. IS NOT REAL.

[yamiyomizuki]

@merc041985 you know you can like anime and learn know real martial arts as well i am currently learning tai chi from a Shaolin monk but i am also into anime

[ric13713]

HI I Love this video.

I love this kata too, I practise this kata everyday.

Regards

[jung567]

i wish i can practice kenjutsu at least once :D it seems cool. I am learning kendo right now... but i should be glad for that atleast

[uker23]

Very nice.

[Boondocksaint1983]

very nice !!

[VegaEtereo]

Beautiful art.

[misterstubb]

dripping water included

[mekugi]

My regalia was totally covered in a fine-grained "gravel mud" after this demonstration, which impossible to get out.....oh the stains on white...the stains....

[Jahleim72Amaya]

pmsl....

The thought makes me cringe lol..

[dodgingaces]

man how id love to train at that ancient....dojo? shinto temple? im not sure but it beats training in a city park lol.

[mekugi]

Kumano Hongu....shrine.

[MrSasoreh]

MSR = Muso shinden ryu

SMR = Shinto muso ryu

And, being left handed was considered rude in ancient Japan, and people were forced to use the right hand. The famous samurai Musashi was said to be left handed.

[humrH2360]

More than that. He was ambidextrous. :3

[halorulesyourface]

is it possible to learn this left-handed?

[belikewater85]

regarding being left of righthanded. I practise Kendo and since the left hand is doing the cutting and the right hand is merely the guide of the sword I would say yes. Im told by my sensei we actually have an advantage...

[tubetubetube]

This is left-handed actualy. Most cut are done with the left hand holding the base of the tsuka(handle). The right hand near the tsuba(hand guard) is only use to support the blade.

In training, many technique are done left and right to work the entirer body. In the end, been left-handed or right-handed do not matter.

[Kunstdesfechtens]

@halorulesyourface Kenjutsu is only taught right-hand lead. Now, there is nothing stopping you from training the other hand lead on your own time if you choose to do so. I train koryu kenjutsu right-handed, and I'm left handed. I do European swordsmanship (German longsword, etc) left-handed; the old manuals specifically say it works for left-handed fighters, so that's my compromise.

[MrSwordhunter]

Love this.

This is also part of MSR Jodo .

[FredDude27]

If you mean "SMR", Shinto Muso Ryu, then yes :)

[owlbuo]

really nice videoi deeply wish i could learn kenjutsu = )

[Bikewer]

These would be the equivalent of "one-step" sparring techniques. A very basic and formalized training method

[Animetobi]

I take Goju Ryu and we are learning this ^.^

[mekugi]

Why?

[Animetobi]

Its part of are classes i guess

[josemiguelhurtado]

Thank you sensei

[MrDuke32]

Is this how samurai really use to fight?

[mekugi]

Hi!

This is not a fight. It's a demonstration of techniques. :-)

[hanaman1]

this amrtial art is the same as some samurai used in combat. but this is not how a samurai combat would look, this is a demo

[psychodelicious85]

Not really. Real samurais used to cut a head or hand in order to separate it from the opponent's body. ;)))

[HitoriStar]

Vid looks okay. I would like to learn Kenjutsu

[mrpotatoxd]

oh yes, me too

[mekugi]

Ummm...this is a Koryu school of Kenjutsu and not a Gendai (modern school) of Karate, and I think you mean Shito Ryu. Thanks.

[06a09]

shinto ryu is karate not iaido/kendo?? i dont understand i do shotokan karate and some guy teaches shinto ryu at my school he says its karate but karate translates as open hand and these guys are using weapons

[Shiakumu]

Shinto ryu is a swordsmanship school. shinto Muso ryu to correct this video. There is shotokan karate but i have never heard of shinto ryu karate, i don't there is. I study mostly Yagyu Shinkage ryu so i'm not exactly sure of shinto muso ryu.

[mekugi]

It's just called Shinto Ryu; some call it Kasumi Shinto Ryu. The name of the school itself, which focuses on the jo, is Shinto Muso ryu.

[hokulanithedog]

i think shito ryu is the style of karate

[twobitmage]

I think you're getting it confused with shito ryu.

[whitt088]

How come almost every martial arts video I see involves commentators going either into martial arts political arguments, or it involves arguing over who's style is better?

[FredDude27]

Its the standard "my daddy is better than your dadddy" argument. :)

[hellothereimasian]

because they dont actually practice or study battou or kenjutsu they just watch anime.

[RedSamurai1991]

@hellothereimasian u have hit the nail on the head there

[orhanc1]

Because they need people like us to wait untill they realise that everything is potentially useful. Every martial art is made to come in handy at some point or another. People need to see that no one martial art can cover everything.

[axonian]

@whitt088 thats how it is with martial arts dudes - they think their way is the only way thats why i get get called a fake martial artist sometimes because i create my own ways of expression - i dont really care for other styles however so it doesnt bother me what people say:)

[lesthatsrieste]

i cant believe you can turn down kendo that much. im a kendo kenshi, and for me is nothing like a sport, i know kenjutsu involves kendo, and kendo was the way for japanese to keep their tradition after the prohibition of kenjutsu and swords.. was the only way to keep teaching it at the moment. However for me kendo is a way of living and killing too.. if anyone around talks about kendo that bad it means two things: or you have never practice it/live it or if youre a kenjutsu kenshi, then you dont

[DaCootMan]

Kenjutsu doesent involve kendo......but kendo does involve some kenjutsu...

[Namiwakiru]

i practise tameshigiri, iaido, kendo and kenjutsu they cover the different areas of bushido im afraid kendo does fall into a sport even in japan hence for the name "the sport of our nation"

[confires]

i do iaido i am looking for some kenjutsu classes what r the fundamentles like??

[WahLumSevenStar]

Does Anybody know how much the dues are for the AUSKF? How much is the equipment on average?

[calvinliang1]

this sort of stuff is exclusive to dojos, yes? and dojos are like exclusive to japan? no?

[mekugi]

I don't believe so. There area lot of SMR dojo outside of Japan.

[FredDude27]

I noticed you live in the US. There are several SMR dojos in the US. I dont know which state you live in, but do a google search for "Phil Relnick" and "jodo" and you should find some contact information. And in turn you can find out if there is a dojo near you.

[LouaiTehPwnerer]

That's so much cooler then Kendo. It'd be nice to see a real Kenjutsu duel but I guess that'd be too dangerous.

[fernando13488]

there is no point in trying to compare kenjutsu and kendo, kendo it's just a sport, kenjutsu is an art

[Tomsense76]

?

If you study Kendo at an accredited school/dojo they should be teaching you long sword forms such as these. That's where you garner your actual techniques from. The All Japan Kendo Federation recognize ten such forms which need to be mastered before you can reach 1 Ryu.

[Aikidopoi]

Yeah, Kenjutsu is a lot older than kendo. The differance between the two is Kendo is a sport, Kenjutsu is for killing.

[Namiwakiru]

No, kenjutsu is the best discribed as the technical application between kendo and iaido, kendo has become a speed strike sport with simple strikes and defends while iaido through kata keeps traditional aspects without combat, kenjutsu helps to show the combat applications of iaido

[johnthehappyjohn]

It must be an incredible form of meditation. I practise Seitsi, but I think this is what I want to do. I looked, but the nearest Dojo is 14 miles away :(

[nicostormUK]

14 miles is nothing, if you really want to learn!

[Aikidopoi]

johnthehappyjohn,

Sorry, but do you mind if I ask what Seitsi is?

Most Japanese arts are a great form of meditation, if you focus on self development, it happens :)

[IshiYamaRyuSeattle]

Excellent video. Not only is the location absolutely stunning, but the movements are brilliantly executed and very fluid.

[mekkabon]

I really want to get into this..

[mekugi]

Hmm...send me a message through youtube.

[OkitaSojiFan]

such a gorgous temple behind them.

did i spell gorgous right?

[mekugi]

No you didn't spell it right, but everyone knows what you mean. Pedanticism is a useless thing, in my opinion. I guess it keeps a lot of snobs happy though.

[lORDELO2]

and as u try to sound all rightful and shit by being politely condescendent, u ended up forgetting how to spell it out right for her: "gorgeous" there u go, whole lot more useful than "Pedanticism is a useless thing" how can u expect her to understand that if she couldn't spell "gorgeous"? maybe u'r being a bit pedant urself

[mekugi]

I think you completely missed the sarcasm in Okita's comment. My point well illustrated~!

[FredDude27]

Hey Mekugi? Are the Kodachi-series of Shinto-ryu Kenjutsu generally NOT demonstrated publically?

[aWhym]

The master on the left was the uchi-tachi?

[mekugi]

Shidachi.

[BADAWYY]

Hmmm this style is defensive in it's nature. Look at the way they are controlling the enemy's sword and wrist movements.

[coldcuts05]

Youtube is filled with "do". You rarely see "jutsu"...too rough

[sleepykid156]

agreed, there are alot more Kendo vids than Kenjutsu vids

[violalord1]

lets all remember the difference between the suffix -do and -jutsu. I have no time for -do.

[rclarked]

good thats one less person I have to stand in line behind during keiko

[neutralwind]

I studies kashima shinto ryu actively until my teahcer died.

This is quite diffrent though...(kashima was the first derivitave of the original shinto kenjutsu)

[FredDude27]

Not many ryu today look like their ancestor school. The Shinto-ryu claims heritage from a set of kenjutsu kata that was passed onto Muso Gonnosuke from his teacher Sakurai Osumi-no-Kami. The shinto-ryu was created, according to some sources, by Tsukahara Bokuden himself and passed to Sakurai and then to Muso Gonnosuke who taught these 12 kata to his students.

[themouseofevil]

I don't understand why they take turns attacking rather than simultaneously. If they attacked and blocked each other rather than taking turns attacking it would be much more like real swordsmanship.

[mekugi]

There are simultanious attacks, baits, traps, counters and sub-counters! One just has to know what to look for and understand what is happening. Shinto Ryu kenjutsu is *real* swordsmanship, incidentally, by every sense of the concept. There is no chambarra (barra barra chan! The sound that swords make when they clash in the movies) because it isn't a theatrical performance nor a sporting event. :-)

[Schwertfechter]

Indeed, swordsmanship typically is about that one critical instant, so "real" swordsmanship tends to

be over in a second or two. This appears to be

student vs. teacher, so here and there we see some slowness.

[rclarked]

It's Kata. The actions are pre determined and one side is always the winner (shidachi) and the other always loses (Uchidachi)

[FredDude27]

Not necessarily. Some kata found in the Katori Shinto Ryu tradition does not always have a clear defined "winner.

[Xinsama]

I fail to see why this is "incredible". I can appreciate their skill, patience and foremost discipline, but... Just katas. Not hugely impressed.

[mekugi]

It's not legal to kill people anymore, and it's really not good for keeping training partners. So, while it isn't Jackie Chan flip-and-spin, and it doesn't usually appeal to the entertainment business, there are merits on other levels- some more appreciated by some.

[Zero98c]

I give you Hi five for a very well writen response

[flakelorenz02]

Why are they only white belts then?

and your not susposed to wear the skirts untill your brown at least

[mekugi]

Shinto Muso Ryu is a Koryu Bujutsu. That is to say, while the ZENKENREN Jo does use the Dan-i system, the koryu does not- it uses a Menkyo Kaiden system and belts are not a status symbol. The hakama thing is usually found in Aikido and Gendai (modern) schools, this is not related to aikido nor gendai.

[kensei87]

Another explanation is this:

A white attire is synonamous with being the most humble level of student. With that said, I've heard of even the greatest of masters wearing white to denote that they are still mere students in the grand scheme of things. The greatest masters are those who realize that they are still capable of learning and growth.

[brinanca]

Or, like in schools that I have experience with. The Senior students wear white top, black hakama, then senior students wear black top, and black hakama... then finally the most senior students wear white for both. That is the only sign of seniority I have seen in Kenjutsu schools. (although my experience is admittedly limited)

[seadawg93]

incredible!