Dr. Stephen Uhl speaks for a moment about theistic disorder

[OutOfTheBoxThinker]

Bill Gates? Seriously? Your best example of a good atheist is a guy who earned a fortune almost entirely by stealing ideas from others and monopolising and industry to the point it limits progress and creative freedom, just because he spends some amount of his vast wealth on charity for the purpose of marketing. With friends like you, who needs an enemy?

[ProcInc]

Wow, Cameron and Comfort were brutalised.

They were way out of their depth here

[morthim]

false. you THINK that christian views are false because of what the claims are. it is based on verifiable evidence, therefor not a belief.

also you can prove there is no god-X, by showing any two attributes of said god as contrary. therefor the idea/notion of said god is invalid. the more detail that exists for said god, the higher probability of being falsifiable. only the idea of god which exists in your brain is not falsifiable logically.

[ZarlanTheGreen]

The contradictions of christianity, and the apparent evil of their god, is actually, not necessarily an argument against the christian god.

If he isn't omnipotent, omniscient, honest and loving, it would still make sense.

It would be kinda funny, if a religion would be formed, based on the christian god being true, but that he is a evil, lying bastard, who isn't all powerful and knowing at all, and that he didn't like Adam and Eve's eating the fruit of knowledge, because we would rival him.

[BSintolerant]

They are not as delusional as much as selfish. They think they get something remember. I'd like to see them muster up faith without their rewards. Not likely.

[niceskepticchick79]

this guy's been discredited and doesn't practice psych anymore. if this is the best you can do you are truly pathetic

[dracorndraken]

Yes, yes, lets listen to something people called Raptorjesus say. Or Pedobear, or Mudkipzlover99.

[Phillygt1027]

Bill Gates is going to hell.

Why?

Not because he's an atheist

Its because Windows SUCKS

Thank you.

[debswildhoney]

Make sense from what perspective, conditions, experience?

I think calling a person who believes in God clinically delusional is irrational and irresponsible. Labeling is a weak attempt here to put an organic and messy concept in a neat little box with a bow.

[ColoradoMikeyS]

"I think calling a person who believes in God clinically delusional is irrational and irresponsible"

What else would you call an adult who has an imaginary friend?

[stratocasterz]

This guy hasnt renewed his medical licence since 1976.

[ColoradoMikeyS]

"This guy hasnt renewed his medical licence since 1976"

So in 1976 all his knowledge just flew out of his brain?

[RabidApeForRRS]

"So in 1976 all his knowledge just flew out of his brain?"

You're being dishonest. In absence of peer reviewed literature we have just have one person expressing an personal opinion, not a fact. His opinion is counter to the APA opinion which doesn't support imposing one's own religious/spiritual, antireligious/spiritual, or other values, beliefs and world views on their patients. (APA Resource Document 200604 Religious/Spiritual Commitments and Psychiatric Practice, Dec 2006)

[Doublebug1]

God is a fucking Paradox!

[Doublebug1]

Give it up Christians!

[BeatBuddy]

I believe in fairies.

[schmiggen]

I am a fairy. Err, wait, no -- I'm a dragon. Dragons are a bit more badass. Yeah, I'm a dragon. I believe in dragons.

[BeatBuddy]

Even dragons have a soft side.

[schmiggen]

I am a fairy dragon ;)

[HumbleOrthodox]

The claims of this video are obviously false for anyone that takes the time to think about it. This PhD was not equating Theism with a "mental disorder", just things that "make no sense". Brian offered a simplistic ad absurdum to one Theological notion of God and the Doctor simply responded that "Yes, it makes no sense, therefore what doesn't make sense and is believed is a mind disorder", not that "Theism is a mental disorder".

[HumbleOrthodox]

Note also, that the Doctor makes no attempt to suggests that Theism correlates with "contradictory" or "not making sense". He even explicitly states that a God concept is not logically impossible, which then rules out the accusation of self contradiction. He simply agreed with you that your concept of God (derrived from your own interpretations of particular arguments) didn't make any sense.

[HumbleOrthodox]

And for a final statement, I would believe many PhDs would disagree with this particular Doctor on his claims that "what doesn't make any sense" and is believed equates to a mental disorder. It might make someone ignorant or just overly emotional, but it doesn't make them have a mind disorder. For one, I think the claims in this video don't "make any sense", but I'm not calling you out as mentally unstable.

[Birdtrooper]

Huhuh, THERE IS A GOD ! THERE IS A GOD ! See because: things exist & we know right from wrong for it was given to us in a magic book that says it's the word of God + penises were obviously designed to fit in the human hand ergo there's a God and atheist are morons with no evidence for their heathen religion ...except science, and we all know science is invalid & was created by Satan to trick us.

[drahyden]

Of course Religion based theism somethimes may incite people in to a morality beak thiouht, but this two cannot be linked together as cause and effect because of the low succes rate that this has on belivers. Religion theists are more likely to comit a divine judgement than a Divine interception of godness in the world. Religious theists are more likely to sacrifice themselves for the ideal of the greater good as precentend in hteir point of view than Atheists.

[bubblesort]

Your typos make the first sentence illegible.

"Religious theists are more likely to sacrifice themselves for the ideal of the greater good as precentend in hteir point of view than Atheists."

Do you have any evidence supporting this claim?

[bubblesort]

Sorry, I meant that as a response to drahyden.

[drahyden]

three numbers: 9/11

2 words: the crusades

1 movie: Jesus Camp

How you ever heard of a atheist with a bomb jumping in to a plane? How you ever hared of atheist suicidal bombers?

[bubblesort]

I see your point. I am an atheist, btw. I just do not think that we have the evidence to support the statement that atheists are less likely than theists to sacrifice themselves.

The crusades weren't all suicide missions, although some were. "Jesus Camp" might be a great work of non-fiction horror but nobody died in it. 9/11 is an example of theists sacrificing themselves, though.

[drahyden]

Yep, but if you closely examine the kids of the Jesus camp you´ll get a good idea of what they are capable of doing in the name of their religion.

[HumbleOrthodox]

Understandably the Crusades had some terrible moments, but the first inciting of the Crusades was to protect against Muslim invaders whom were forcibly attacking other colonies and empires at the time. There are similar exceptions noted with 9/11 and suicide bombers...who do not commit these acts soley based on religion, but out of desperation of preservation (as noted with recent studies of the Tamil Tigers).

[drahyden]

The first cusade was against the Catars. This people bleived in a God of love and in the ways of Jesus as a greater Teacher. They preached on the streets freely and didnt steel, or kill. They were the best theistic religion ever to put foot on the earth. Then the GOOD Compassionate Christans organised the first crusade to kill them and offered their lands as rewards along with eternal salvation to their soldiers. More accurate the Pope Inocence the third.

[drahyden]

The Tamil tigers event when watched carefully it is understanded why this peole do what they do. Sirlanka Goberment has been extremely cruel to the Tamil people killing thousends and thousends. The liders of the movement have organised the terrorist group as a cult of liberation with a sturcture similar that of a religious point of view. Even if they have a atheistic influence most of the people that join are hindus or muslims. Again we stomp with the problem of Social liders pushig a agenda.

[HumbleOrthodox]

To further my point, this only shows some examples of individuals that have done certain things due to religious ideology, not that theistic religion in general produces these atrocities, unless you wish to commit a dicto simplictor. The same sort of faiths also incite people to create hospitals, care for the poor, sick, and hungry, and better their own lives.

[drahyden]

I agree with you on this point. Religion doesnt make people go and kill other peole the same way video games doesnt do that either. People who are touched by this ideals and interpret them in a fundamentalist and extreme way AND are guided by religious liders with violent Agendas are the ones that commit this attrocities. Please dont tell me that 9/11 didnt have a important religios component.

[HumbleOrthodox]

It didn't. Really, 9/11 was more about preserving a way of life due to feeling threatened. While many Muslim Extremists try to justify their actions through religion even further (by citing a Divine Authority), their main goal is to protect their way of life.

Like I said, go and find that study on the Tamil Tigers.

[drahyden]

So are3 you telling me that people that make all the good stuff in the name of religion wouldnt do it otherwise, that they dont really want to help but they just want to please their deity to buy their pass in to heaven? If religion wasnt there this people would just be selfish?

[HumbleOrthodox]

No. I'm saying that for any belief, even in such things that have nothing to do with religion or God, people can do good or bad.

It's the nature of humanity. A religion that preaches peace should not be dismissed because someone misuses it for war.

[drahyden]

"People can do good or bad... it's the nature of humanity."

That my friend is really a very wise statement. Ofcourse it is the nature of humans to be that way because we evolved this capacity, because it was the best way to survive as a specie. That is our nature.

[BeatBuddy]

Yes indeed, man as a species has a dual nature. The Bible itself recognizes this, and it has been used as a perrenial theme in Poe, Whitman, Stevenson, Highsmith, and Wilde. This is a fact that is universally recognized, God or no God.

[drahyden]

Exactly, the only problem with some, and certainly i dont mean all, religious people is that they dwell in the realms of Absolutes. A childish black and white for allmost everything. When every issue has its shades of gray, if you know what i mean.

[Chaotheist]

"Exactly, the only problem with some, and certainly i dont mean all, religious people is that they dwell in the realms of Absolutes. A childish black and white for allmost everything."

Wow. That almost reminds me of a specific sanctimonious douchenozzle liar who may or may not have made this video.

Maybe next time he'll interview a "Dr." with a current license.

[DancesWithDeath]

A license to practice & a phd aren't the same thing. He has a current PhD, just 'cuz he isn't practicing on actual patients doesn't render his opinion in any sense any less than if he were. It doesn't make him right, either, of course, but it certainly doesn't make him wrong.

[Chaotheist]

I put it in quotation marks because he gave up practicing actual medicine for the abomination that is pop psych (which is what "Imagine No Superstition" is). Of course the dude's an actual doctor.

He's also a douche who wrote a shitty book in service of a hypothesis that is increasingly unsupportable.

[ColoradoMikeyS]

"Maybe next time he'll interview a "Dr." with a current license."

Ad hominem, the staple of religious retards who can't create a logical argument.

[Chaotheist]

Perhaps you are unfamiliar with what "ad hominem" means.

Perhaps you would care to explain how disagreeing with the man automatically makes my argument a religious one.

[RabidApeForRRS]

Improper use of logical fallacies is a staple of Rational™ Atheism. Dr. Uhls unsupported statement is just as weak as RaptureJ. The DSM-IV TR clearly defines delusion as a false belieffirmly sustained despite what almost everyone else believes despite INCONTROVERTIBLE and OBVIOUS PROOF or EVIDENCE to the contrary (e.g. it is not an article of religious faith) (DSM-IV delusion p765). If you believe something someone tells you without critical review, it's a sign of being foolish idiot!

[drahyden]

Now adressing to the Tamil tigers i have finaly got in to the matter. Suicide Terrorism is a potent tool used by ideologys to get their followers to kill themselves in the name of theis cause. Not every ideology is capable to acomplish this, for Suicide bombing to occur Stong emotional and social pressure causses the brewing for this effect.

[HumbleOrthodox]

Yes, and the primary motivation of many of the suicide bombers in the middle east is that they feel threatened by Western powers; they feel as though they are losing their way of life and they use their religion to justify their actions further.

[drahyden]

The quran is plagued with the "kill the infidels" statement. The bible is plagued with ridiculous laws that motivate a violent stupid and hatefull way of living. It is a ciclical issue, People use their religion to justify their actions, adn their religion uses people to proced those actions.

[HumbleOrthodox]

All I'm seeing here are arguments from outrage without any real intellectual expose of the claims being made. While I may agree with you that the Quaranic account is riddles with inconsistent commands due to some tampering from Muhammeds progressively hateful personality later in his years, I do not see this within the Biblical accounts. And even then, an educated Muslim may be able to prove me wrong in that regard.

[drahyden]

Ok, then let me ask you how much cattle have you sacrificed to god in the past year? So much contradictions in the bible wich you can expect from a man writen document not the word of god. The bible supports slavery, murder, sexism and surrender of the mind. There so many examples i dont know were to start.

[HumbleOrthodox]

Once again, Arguments from Outrage without any sort of intellectual explanation on the matter.

If you TRULY wish to approach this subject intelligently and with an open mind you will message me and we can discuss these moral "contradictions" and whatnot. If not, then don't continue commenting on the subject.

[drahyden]

Ok, i apologise if it sounded as Outrage... Wasnt intended that way, but if you want we can discuse this subject more intelligently, and civilised. What do you think? I have really good reasons for not beliving in god, but im still open to further evidence if you can provide, how about it up to the challenge?

[HumbleOrthodox]

I would like that :)

Thank you.

[drahyden]

The problem with this middle eastern fighters that want to preserve their way of living is that they acctually want to impose it in to other people. Now let me ask YOU, are you willing to die for the preservation of your faith?

[HumbleOrthodox]

Yes, but if that means you believe I am willing to die to impose my faith on others than you are sadly misinterpreting my position.

[drahyden]

Not at all, im not talking about imposing, even my comment said preserving...

[BeatBuddy]

That seems to be the nature of imperialism, that the survival of something cherished is deemed at stake, and those who make this claim are the agressors. History is rife with countless examples.

[drahyden]

Your right, i dont think at all that that is a good way of managing things. Im in favor of social evolution, wich history has given a very good record indeed.

[philhellenes]

Believing in something that makes no sense just about covers it. I think the vast majority just SAY they believe it to be part of a "club". It's herd mentality. It may be slow to make an impact on the numbers of the theistic herd but atheists may one day reach a critical mass and become the herd. The tipping point could be rapid when it happens.

[xJediHowieX]

I've always thought most people were atheists but just could not admit it to themselves. After reading and listening to Dan Dennett I was kinda right...they don't believe in God they believe in belief in God.

[NotABoeing747]

Fucking ridiculous...

[TheDude0fLife]

Is a belief in astrology a mental disorder, Or just a false belief?

[drahyden]

If you are willing to put your life on your belif in astrology, then yes it is a mental disorder.

[TheDude0fLife]

Good answer, I think theism can be a mental disorder, but more often it isn't depending upon how much affect it has on one's behavior.

[drahyden]

But at the same time Special religion based theism is more dangerous than a belif in astrology because of the nature of the interaction of their members. It is dangeraous in the sense that it plants ideas in to minds of people when they are most bulnerable and in search for thruth and modify their behaivior in a violent way.

[HumbleOrthodox]

Are you willing to put your life on the line for your opposition to religious views?

[drahyden]

Please develope this issue, Can you explain differently the question?

Ill try to anwser it as i could understand it ok?

If by eny destiny shift i find myself captured by a muslim extremist group that has a gun on my head and the only thing i have to say is that i belive in Allaha to get out of there you bet ill be singing prayers to Alaha until im out of there.

[HumbleOrthodox]

Well, that wasn't my point, but your example was a pretty good expose of the shallowness that many people have regarding their beliefs these days.

My point was that you oppose religion. If you truly believe religion is detrimental to society then why aren't you willing to die to oppose it?

[drahyden]

The same reason im an atheist, I belive i only have one chance in this life. Yes im terrified of dieing because i dont think that something as stupid as saying that you belive in a Immaginary friend to save your life is shallow. I think is stupid to put someone in that possition, but thats not my call. On the other hand i am willing to die for something importat: like a friend in danger, or a familiy member in mortal peril.

[HumbleOrthodox]

You still haven't answered my question. Are you or are you not willing to die to stop the reign of religion?

[schmiggen]

HumbleOrthodox, that's a stupid question. Does dying in some weird, arbitrary way, promote the cause of someone who is against a reign of religion? If people are turned off of mainstream religion though compassion for a martyr, then a true counter-religion end has not been achieved.

[HumbleOrthodox]

It wasn't a stupid question for the sole reason that Drahyden previously used the act of maryrdom as a form of evidence produced to view religion in a negative light, and I quote:

[schmiggen]

@HumbleOrthodox again:

Being killed for openly expressing your lack of religious belief and not backing down from it is a silly thing from both sides: one should have the sense to preserve oneself (a reason i think there are so many "closet atheists"), and others should have the sense to avoid violence.

So, is your question a threat? Why do you ask?

[HumbleOrthodox]

No, it wasn't a threat, though I'm sure that the New Atheists would have that to be the case so as to further justify their paranoia.

The sheer act of not expressing what one truly believes for the sake of perserving oneself is a prime example of the shallowness of the New Atheists thinking. I suppose you cannot blame them for having no true reason to value anything other than how their emotions lead them, but it is very telling.

It's called dignity and integrity.

[schmiggen]

You missed the point. I don't live by Atheism and devote myself to something outside of myself; I am not second to my beliefs. My emotions aren't my guide either, although obviously they can influence me if I am not wary.

I would not stand on a volcano about to erupt so that I might from the height make known how I think. In the same way, I would not waste my life in the face of those who can not tolerate me. I treasure my ability to think more than the result of that thought.

[drahyden]

I allready anwsered the question. I value my life more than enything else in this planet. I am not willing to die just to change the minds of some delluded people, because Reason is the most powerfull weapon a atheist has not the emotional impact of martirium. If i was to sacrifica myself to end something as stupid as religion it would put me at the same level as that wich i fight to erradicate, when i think i am way much higher than this kinds of uncivilised tactics.

[drahyden]

And what good could me dieing would do to the purpose of erradicating Religion anyway? When i could do somany things alive that are much more prodiuctive than that to that purpuse. And again i have to tell you, i would sacrifice myself for something important to me. A son a sibling or a friend.

[calvin8hobbs]

So if someone believes something that doesn't make sense, whats the solution? Oh yeah, I remember, drug them up to the eyeballs till they agree with you. I've changed my mind. That's a genius plan Sapient.

[codexbiohazard]

I'm a Deist. Whats your thoughts on Deist?

[WizardJim]

Check out the Youtube user "JohnLArmstrong", he's a Deist and kicks ass too.

[drahyden]

Deists are the best theist there are, Good for you.

[AtheistAaron]

Wait, there's a THEIST using Raptor Jesus as a handle? Does that person understand the irony - neverfuckingmind.

[Navitron]

Lol he probably thought it was funny :P

[AtheistAaron]

Raptor Jesus rules! He died for YOU!