Nancy Pelosi is nothing but a YES person. She reminds me of the ole hawaiian doll that sits in the windshield of a car with its head bobbing up and down constantly. We the people should be voting on the issues.....we do not need corrupt congress and president that do not have our best interest at heart!
Hey Folks, the only public option we have is our unalienable Rights. That is, our Rights as seen through the prism of science (see my channel video); these Rights apply to all Life, from bacteria to humans, and Social systems, including Charles Darwin’s research; as in some Grand Unification principle for all Living-systems. Many realized the Laws of Nature trumps mortals in power; a new understanding of these Rights may help make this world a better place to live.
Lets throw congress and the senate out on the streets where the belong, and we can use the Internet and make our own decisions much better than they do.
Why do we need these corrupt organizations to do our decision making for US. They dont live in the same towns we do, they don't know the streets as we do, they don't remember having to choose between food or rent, so how can they decide for US?
@jeddah91 US Congress serves the Europeans, why else would we spend hundreds of billion on their defense?
Our dollars were used to build European infrastructure, and then turned around by European banks to by property in the USA. Americans own less then 40% of the industry in the US, and even less of our own debt.
@hamace The reason the federal reserve will NEVER EVER in billion years be transparent is they are protecting their "QUEEN BEE" The very same bee that ALL presidents BOW too, she has a ancient hidden secret.
When I talk to the CEO of a business, I speak in certain terms. When I speak to a fast food restaurant employee I speak in certain terms. I will identify myself with each of my posts here to give the courtesy to any who would like to respond. I will respond only if they do the same.
Example:
(me) I am an American. I believe in capitalism.
(you) I am an American. I believe in socialism.
or I am a Canadian and I believe in communism.
or I am from Finland and I don't what the fuck I believe in,
@TAMARLANE I've never had problems with it, but it's not perfect and it has had to be reformed.
this video might provide some context for how we see it - it's about the response to Daniel Hannan going on Fox News: news . bbc . co . uk / 1 / hi / uk_politics / 8201201 . stm (remove spaces)
Paid for by the govt.? Hmmm! Where does the government get it's money to pay for stuff? I know, I know Prof. Magoo! The TAXPAYERS! to quote someone else "Socialism is great until you run out of other people's money"---Margaret Thatcher
Bottom line is, this bill is only to mandate the purchase/taxation of Corporate Medical Insurance not only for those who can afford it but for those cannot afford it...nothing else. Fines will be handed out to those who cannot or refuse to buy. Up to a $3000 fine per individual and the threat of incarceration will be held over you and your loved ones head. Yet, they vote without debate for it and we pay the price. This is NOT representation by any means. It is simply a Corporate handout.
the public option and the bill in generral is a fraud and treason they are going to vote without bringing it to the floor this is taxation without representation
wow, i'm feeling down abt all of this and the posts I read here.... I think most folk here are seriously looking for the workable way, that most of us are, even with different views. But I am flat out losing my hope in human beings in general. The Obama admin? Cruel to get everyone so hyped up abt possibilities and then .... BTW, communism is only an ECONOMIC system--- SEPARATE from political system of gov. EX of DEMOCRATIC communism? First Christian community "held all things in common."
LET FREEDOM RING-LEGALIZE IT! legal weed = Free health care for everyone legal weed = More room for violent offenders in prison legal weed = Less trees cut for paper legal weed = Jump start for the economy legal weed = Streets paved with gold(well, maybe not streets paved with gold) ALL POSSIBLE BY TAXING THE USE OF THIS WONDERFUL PLANT! click my name for ringtone tell the CIA i left town! visit me @ jimmytheweed. com myspace. com/hotpancakesatnoon purevolume. com/jimmytheweed
"Initial story last August in the New York Times, no major media outlet has picked up this important story and investigated further.
Hopefully, that's changing. On Monday, Ed Shultz interviewed New York Times Washington reporter David Kirkpatrick on his MSNBC TV show, and Kirkpatrick confirmed the existence of the deal. Shultz quoted Chip Kahn, chief lobbyist for the for-profit hospital industry on Kahn's confidence that the White House would honor the no public option deal"
It is sad, It is official, The NY TImes reporter confirmed OBAMA MADE DEAL TO KILL PUBLIC OPTION: "Chip Kahn, chief lobbyist for the for-profit hospital industry on Kahn's confidence that the White House would honor the no public option deal "
The ball might be in Pelosi's court, but the bucks did stop at Obama's door.
No one trust the Government, yet they want to vote to have Government run health care. LMAO
So Medicare and Social Security are Bankrupt as we speak, yet the same people that came up with those ideas, those PONZI schemes, now want to do it to Health Care. LOL Yeah that's a real fix I can't wait for.
P.S Does anyone really want low priced health care when your life is at risk? You might save a buck, but then again you might die or lose mobility in something,
let me get this straight. the taxes i pay should be raised so that i can pay the healthcare for illegals, gluttons, abortions, smokers, rehab for drug users, etc. etc. and me paying for all of this would somehow make me "decent"? Which said facts are you calling lies here? Do you seriously think these are all lies? Seriously?
Why is there impression that the House needs to insert the PO when they already passed it first time?..... Senators needs to grow some balls and pass PO through up or down vote.
I have a theory why the speaker is oppose to PO currently. I think she realize that if PO was inserted, the progress of passing the bill would of been effected in terms of time.
Vote on the PUBLIC OPTION -- Polls indicate most of the America Public wants it -- if it fails, so be it -- BUT LET'S SEE WHO'RE THE CORPORATE WHORES AND WHO AREN'T!
Aww! Someone doesn't like my take on wealth redistribution from elitist leftists to pay for public option, darn I am soooo hurt (Sarcasm for those of you in the liberal Utopias of New York, California, D.C. and that great bastion of "Progressive" ideas....Detroit)
Josh my little child, Single payer will raise taxes, the demons (oops I mean democrats even admit it., or do you read?) Not a gov't handout? Who the hell pays for it? The user? REALLY? CBO says otherwise. ROTFLMAO!! Go push your worthless propaganda on more naive idoits They will believe your tripe. By the way;
We will replace those liberals with new blood next election. We will also replace all the republicans currently in office.All the incumbent congresspersons have let us down. they have caused/allowed this country to fall into disrepair. We will take our country back.
I agree, both parties are screwing us. The dems are just in power right now therefore are my current enemy. I am just as pissed off at the "Progressive" repubs. Term limits are such a great idea. Being in Congress is not supposed to be a lifetime appointment. We have created a ruling class by our own laziness. It's time to return to limited government. "Progressive" hunting season is about to start, and I can't wait until November!
there are many who agree this time around. I am just going along with some smarter people than I, who know how to do it. I am following their guidance. i call, email and demonstrate on the streets in San Diego.
We have term limits , sort of , if we get up off our lazy butts and go out and vote.
I feel for you living in California. At least you live in San Deigo which has a crumb of decency left. All the liberals have destroyed that state and now are moving here in droves to ruin this one with thier stupidity. Why? Because this state is ran by conservatives and is doing well in the recession. Go figure. Anyway, good luck with your fight!
California is over, in my opinion. When Obonehead stops paying extended unemployment benefits all hell is going to break loose here in California. I have children and grand children in San Diego County all on hot stand by to get out of dodge when it starts to crumble.
yes. it's correct about the corporate-run govt, strongly bipartisan corporatist corruption, but not correct about blaming Obama for every thing that's gone wrong. the titanic deficit that has come up in Obama's time in office was mainly already predicted to be where it is now without accounting for Obama's changes.
watch Reagan Republican economist Bruce Bartlett defend Obama's impact on the deficit: youtube . com / watch?v=MqlWinBICh4
Food is a human right. There is too much profit made in the food business. We must nationalize the food industry. Look at all the evil corporations making a profit from our food. Farming corporations, trucks and trains owned by big corporations. Look at the greedy corporations that profit from warehousing this food, the ones who profit from processing this food.. The evil corporations that package and advertise and sell in these filthy corporate food stores. Down with corporate profit on food.
I hate "Progressives, Communists, & Socialists. I do not know to which Corporatist democrats you are referring, but as for me, I love Corporations. Why? because they employ people, provide services & products (such as the computer you are using to write your cute comments), and provide revenue to the fed. gov. and states for "Progressives" to use to fund your worthless programs. Governments are the only place where there are obscene profits, as they produce nothing, only take.
@designerofdreams70 I like corporations, and true capitalism. Not socialism for the rich and capitalism for the poor, as health insurance companies who willfully kick off children due to preexisting conditions think the system is.
Do you really expect me to respond to such tripe? The government already denies more health services to the poor and elderly than ANY private insurance company. (Medicare and medicaid) C'mon give me a challenge! But the "kicking off children comment is cute, trying to evoke sympathy for nameless children against mean ole insurance companies. Good try. Not true, but good try.
@designerofdreams70 Seriously? You don't believe adults and children are kicked off due to preexisting conditions? Are you living in some sort of weird alternative dimension where AHIP is a branch of government?
Hey Josh are you living in a Utopia where government "takes care" of everyone with other peoples money? Insurance is not health care. Everyone has access to health care, you just have to PAY for it. Again, the federal government is the biggest denier of benefits to children, poor, and elderly, NOT the insurance companies. Insurance companies only provide a service. A hedge or bet against a risk. To repeat EVERYONE (by law) has access to health care in the USA. Yay capitalism!!!!
Not for long I fear. These communists are so convinced that there is a utopia out there that ehy are throwing everything to the wind. They are all in on this program and will probably prevail. They will prevail by lying and cheating to get there. I fear for my grands. I will willingly die for my beliefs, but not in confronting the downtrodden idiots out there, not fighting against the cannon fodder. I will confront those at the top. I always stated at the top when I was an IBM sales eng
They are surely feeling their oats now that they have an adminstration that actually shares their views. Marxism is now the norm in this White House. If you really want to know who Obama is, read his two books. He would make Karl Marx so proud. Unfortunately for these saps, they do not understand that the country is not Marxist and we will fight to the death to defend freedom and liberty over tyranny. We know their game and they can't stand it.
I can't bring myself to read these books. I think I know his so called "egalitarian" views which are probably right out of the Manifesto. Have you ever been to a "free beach" In my younger says I went a few time to the "red white and blue" beach. The only licensed nude beach in California at the time. On the beach everyone was nude, or not, not requred. In the parking lot above there would be a new Bentley, an old Volkswagon some trucks and dozens of every kind of automibiles and a few bicycles
Used to be that you couldn't really tell who drive up in the Bentley or the Volkswagon or the bicycle. It was truly an egalitarian experience.
Obama knows it is an impossible dream . He has to know. He must know. So, he is just a liar intent on the destruction of the existing system of government in
America.Systematically dismantling profit oriented business in favor of government control. It is communism. I have trouble understanding why our media is allowing it to happen.
The media has been taught by Marxist professors for over 30 years. It is easy to see why they side with the evil, they have been taught by evil. Over 80% of the media describes themselves as "Progressive" so they actually believe they will be protected by this administration. They are sadly mistaken. Once Fox news is eliminated they will focus on them and if they should step out of line, they will be taken care of as well. Only a matter of time. Such fools.
Thanks. I suppose I knew that the professors were all marxists. But I thought people were more like me, learned from experience too, not just university, and would evolve into more or less objective reporters of what they observe. I am embarrassed to be so naive at such an advanced age.
Remember, you are the product of your environment. If you hang around "Progressives" and work in "Progressive" enterprises, and you never expose yourself to other ideas or think for yourself, you will fall prey to those ideas. It is not entirely their fault. Elitism must produce an feeling of superiority to be successful. They are taught not to question superiors and to ridicule others that disagree with them as they are far more intelligent than the rest of us. I just feel sorry for them.
To understand someone, especially their views of the world you have to read or hear their own words. He openly admits he sought out the Marxist professors, radicals, and socialists at college. He then attended a church that also had those same "Social Justice" views for over 20 years. Makes it very easy to see with which side of history he prescribes to. He is a Marxist and must be stopped. Only the elite rich can afford to be Marxist, including Marx himself. Communism is evil.
Thanks for clearing my thoughts some. I knew some of these things. But I guess I am suffering some diminished capacity to put two and two together and think clearly anymore.
In this world you can be confused easily as information is approaching you from all sides and in every capacity it can. Go for a drive with the radio off, take a picnic by the beach, go for a hike in the forest. Get away from all media and you will feel better and be able to clearly analize the information. Do not believe either side, think for yourself and your gut will guide you. My wife and I love photography so we go out on photo expeditions to recharge. We need it in this day & age.
LOL! My wife gets on to me as well. In fact she told me several times just this morning to get off that computer. I listen as well as any man as you can see!
Food is a human right. There is too much profit made in the food business. We must nationalize the food industry. Look at all the evil corporations making a profit from our food. Farming corporations, trucks and trains owned by big corporations. Look at the greedy corporations that profit from warehousing this food, the ones who profit from processing this food.. The evil corporations that package and advertise and sell in these filthy corporate food stores. Down with corporate profit on food.
@TAMARLANE what planet are you living on? there ALREADY IS government food assistance, it's called FOOD STAMPS, so your analogy is a poor one (and when was the last time a corporation denied you food due to a "preexisting condition" -- oh right, never).
I forgot to add those corporations that concoct all the food additives that cause all these preconditions. And the corporations that develop the pesticides that are killing Americans. And the food corporations that have designed all the hybrid seeds, the genetically engineered seeds that are poisoning our people.
I left out quite few of these evil corporations that make profit on food, and make food cost so much that we must have a food stamp program for the people who can't pay for all that .
@TAMARLANE that's true, but it's not answering my question, which is do food companies deny food to people based on certain reasoning? again, the answer is no.
Are you stupid or something? Show me where I said food companies are going to deny anyone food.
I made an analogy between the corporations that bring us our food and the insurance industry. I received so many responses telling me what a good analogy that was I simply don't understand your take at all. You are one in a million.
Do you like/trust corporations?. Do you think their profits are evil?Are you a socialist/communist?
@TAMARLANE You didn't say that. I just think that because food companies don't kick people off due to preexisting conditions, there isn't a need to have govt food.
I like corporations and I don't think their profits are evil. I just think health insurance companies specifically need regulation and competition.
@TAMARLANE I'll be honest, I think a public option would be better than single payer, because it would keep costs down but unlike single payer would not be unfair competition. I accept that you might disagree, but I do think (as I'm sure you do) that some reform needs to happen, whether it be a system overhaul (like a public option or single payer) or insurance reform (specifically preexisting conditions).
The liberals talking point about preexisting conditions is designed to make people buy into a government run health care system. Do you know why preexisting conditions were excluded from normal insurance polices? Do you know what an actuary is and what an actuary does? An actuary is a bean counter that statistically considers the costs of things. Sort of like a race book in Vegas that figures the odds on your winning or losing, that is living or dying, and cost to protect you vs what you pay in
@designerofdreams70 Ironically, your point about computers could be better researched - the research for the Internet was funded 1/2 by NASA and 1/2 by DARPA, both govt agencies. the advance of microcomputers was led by, say it with me: NASA, during the Apollo program.
If you think progressive programs are "worthless", you should push for the abolition of Medicare and Medicaid, both programs originating in the JFK and LBJ administrations (please don't start with 'jfk was conservative' argument)
Wow! You are using military depts. as examples of "Progressive" programs? Really? I am glad we both agree that the miltary is great. Unfortunately the Military is not a "Progressive" program. By the way, it took the private sector to bring the microcomputer and the internet to you and me. That is why your computer reads DELL or APPLE and not ARPA (DARPA)or NASA. By the way, Yes I would eliminate both programs as they are corrupt and bankrupt. By the way JFK was a conservative. LOL!
@designerofdreams70 I never said DARPA or NASA were specifically progressive agencies. govt programs, which you seem to hate. Of course private corporations made the mass uptake of personal computers viable, and not the govt - I was just pointing out that govt can work. I at least respect your consistency in that you would abolish Medicare and Medicaid.
@designerofdreams70 "What we are now talking about doing most of the countries of Europe did years ago...We are behind every country in Europe pretty nearly...And those who say that what we are now talking about spoils our pioneer heritage should remember that the West was settled by two great actions of the federal government...This cooperation between an alert and progressive citizenry and a progressive government is what has made this country great."
Oh how cute, JFK quotes now, run out of TJ quotes? Hey oh smart one, he was also for tax cuts. He also spied on MLK, almost started WW-3, and was a son of a Hitler supporting criminal father. Trumpet him some more you moron. By the way his family was also RICH. I thought you hated rich people? Oh I forgot, you hate regular working rich people not the aristocracy, wait a minute.....
@designerofdreams70 you're just putting words in my mouth, again. I never, ever said I hate rich people. I just hate the fact that as part of their fiduciary responsibility to their shareholders, health insurance execs make decisions which result in people being denied coverage they have paid to be insured for simply because they had a preexisting condition they had no control over.
@designerofdreams70 In this respect England exhibits the most remarkable phenomenon in the universe in the contrast between the profligacy of it's government and the probity of it's citizens. And accordingly it is now exhibiting an example of the truth of the maxim that virtue & interest are inseparable.
@designerofdreams70 You didn't like the quote, I take it. I can bring up some of his other quotes on the separation of church and state. Or some quotes from the other founding fathers about why America would never, ever, ever torture. The idea that the founding fathers were die hard conservatives is ridiculous. They were essentially libertarians, and they would never have thought that kicking people off of healthcare they've paid for due to preexisting conditions was reasonable capitalism.
We can play the quote game all day, but let me quote one of the founding fathers one time only, "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." , "The U. S. Constitution doesn't guarantee happiness, only the pursuit of it. You have to catch up with it yourself.", "No nation was ever ruined by trade.", and finally " We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid."
@designerofdreams70 I agree with all of those, the first could be easily applied to the policies of the Bush administration and to a lesser extent the Obama administration
@designerofdreams70 It ends, as might have been expected, in the ruin of it's people, but this ruin will fall heaviest, as it ought to fall on that hereditary aristocracy which has for generations been preparing the catastrophe. I hope we shall take warning from the example and crush in it's birth the aristocracy of our monied corporations which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country.
Again what does this have to do with modern day Progressives? The modern day equivilant to the Aristocracy is what we have in Washington. Good Ole Thomas Jeff was against a Fed as well, are you? The Fed was and is a progressive idea. The corporation that is the Fedral government is also a bigger threat to liberty than any private sector company could imagine to be. Really? Is this all you got?
Seeing as how Glenn Beck often quotes TJ and since Karl Marx and Engels were not known at the time TJ was prez and the Communist manifesto was not published until 1848, 22 years after TJ's death then I doubt TJ could be considered a communist. Even by Glenn Beck Standards (which are pretty acurate by the way). I bet you hate that don't you. you sick twisted freak.
@designerofdreams70 I meant retrospectively, obviously. And really...Beck's standards are accurate?
"I'm just at home and I've recovering from some surgery that was scheduled and then went horribly arwy. It was one of the most, uh, eye-opening experiences of my life to receive healthcare in the US. This is one of the hospitals where the President of GE is going if they don't care about the Pres. of GE, do you really think they care about, you know, shlubs, that are just average working stiffs."
How wonderful you can quote Glenn Beck but you probably never watch his show, or listen to his radio program. you only know what Media matters tells you. Good job! Now as someone who does listen and watch his show, let me say this, You know nothing as to which you speak. I thought we were talking about health care insurance, not health care services. Is the government going to take over hospitals too? Wow! Now I am more scared! Those who run the DMV running hosipitals! God help us!
@designerofdreams70 "...No matter how much our healthcare would try to keep me down I'm back...Personal voyage through the nightmare that is our healthcare system. We seem to be a society or a system now in healthcare that is just trying to shove the patients out that door as fast as they can...Getting well in this country can actually almost kill you."
please do. the corruption is from both sides of the isle. write in for a Russ Feingold/Ron Paul ticket at the next election or something like that, and you'd get an uncorrupt government.
@TAMARLANE feingold is 1 of 100 senators, 1/2 of one of the three branches of government. paul was 1 of 435 representatives, 1/2 of the three branches of govt. it's a point george will made about all the hype surrounding scott brown's election - one senator or one representative doesn't have a large amount of power. since feingold is a strong progressive and paul is a strong libertarian, i.e. they actually care about what they believe, they get knocked down when it comes to chairmapships, etc.
@TAMARLANE If the few who care - Feingold, Sanders, Paul, etc. had resigned their jobs then they would have even less of a chance to have a positive impact. Senator Feingold has repeatedly introduced legislation to cut the deficit and achieve a balanced federal budget, for instance.
Had they resigned they would have retained their honor. As it is, they continued to draw a paycheck on the ruse that they were doing anything but spinning their wheels.
There may be others who tried but failed to make a difference too. Not interested in them.
Since I can't find your remark, I decided to reply to this one. Come to Oklahoma or Texas, we will welcome you, in fact we need you. To the Progressives though, I say take a left turn at Albuquerque. Taos & Santa Fe just love people like you. LOL!
1) i said a public option would be funded directly by its users' premiums, I did *not* say that about single payer. don't take quotes out of context.
2) single payer would be paid for through taxes, paid for by the public. if you think paying for a service is a handout, you need to try again
3) the word you mean to use is "run". CA has a (R) gov, NY is the heart of US finance, so will obviously be hit hard in a recession, and likewise Michigan is the heart of the auto industry
Dear Josh, The Public Option will lead to single payer, but let's just pretend it will not. The CBO states that the "cost" (read taxes) of the Senate's plan is $940 BILLION. We all know that the CBO is historically low on it's estimates. Since almost all of the non-insured that will use the so called "Public Option" are considered poor, the taxpayer will subsidize them to pay for their insurance. Therefore when the taxpayer "pays" for the insurance I do consider it a "handout"
As Nancy, Reid, Obama, and just about every progressive demoncrap has stated, the PO is the ground work for single payer. If you think otherwise you are ignoring their own words, deaf and blind, or just ignorant. You try and state that this dam bill is not paid for by taxes or tax payers? This flies in the face of the CBO report. You are not a good liar. Try again.
@designerofdreams70 I didn't say the current bill is not paid for with taxes, I said a public option wouldn't be. Don't distort my words.
And if a public option is the ground work for single payer - so what? That's the healthcare system of Australia, Canada, the UK, and New Zealand, some of the most strongly capitalist countries other than the United States. Australia is ranked above the United States in terms of economic freedom by THE HERITAGE FOUNDATION, yet it has single payer healthcare.
Economic freedom Josh? The US has the largest tax burden of any industrialized country. We are over regulated, over taxed, and deep in debt. That is why we are lower than the others, because of the tax and spend liberals (both repubs and dems Joshypoo). Adding health care to an already overburdened system will destroy it, just as the "progressives" have stated they desire or do you read? Overwhelm the system as Saul Alinsky would say. (Rules for Radicals circa 1971)
@designerofdreams70 In terms of tax revenue as a percentage of GDP, the United States has less taxation than Australia, Canada, New Zealand, the UK, Germany, France, Belgium, Sweden, and Denmark, to name a few (that is also Heritage Foundation data).
Those are all socialist countries aren't they> Are you a socialist/communist josh? You didn't answer the last time I asked you. Are you so ashamed of what you are that you won't proudly profess it?
@designerofdreams70 there are four countries in Britain, not just England. i happen to live in England but "England", "the UK", and "Britain" are not synonymous
What the hell are you talking about? I never said anything about England, Britain, or the UK! Or for that matter Wales, Scotland, or your close neighbor Ireland, but hey, thanks for playing. By the way why does a Britain care to be commenting on the US health insurance system HMMMM? Take care of your own mess before you meddle in our affairs.
English as the language you idiot! You see over here in the states we have ENGLISH classes, taught by ENGLISH professors. If you were a US citizen (American) you would know such things. I did not mention anything about the National Health System in Britain. i said clean up your own mess. In other words, Such your bloody trap about things from across the pond wanker. There did that clear it up Professor Magoo?
Thanks for sharing your views with me. It was not advice, and I apprciate that. I don't give advice myself, except to say what one on my mentors used to say to me. "Don't grow old".
My own personal accomplishment is realizing that one knows absolutely nothing at all, for sure. That is true wisdom
No problem! Great advice! One of my mentors (A college professor) said this to me "Never give up! Very simple yet so profound. He was a great man. He was a black man that served in WW2 and Korea. He never gave up and was a very successful man. He has a wonderful family and legacy now. My mother (a teacher) instilled in me the idea to think for myself, and my father (a butcher) instilled in me my work ethic. I am thankful for all of them!
LOL! Now that is a very strange combination! Did they ever meet? I bet it would be like "Hey you know that cow you vaccinated last month?" "Yeah" "Well your eating it right now." "Tasty" My dad had that kind of sense of humor . It rubbed off. LOL!
I always thought they sort of canceled each other out. I assume they met since they were my grandmother's parents and her husbands parents. The one with my last name was the butcher I think. Not sure. I always thought there might be a profound life's lesson involved, but could never think of one.
For your third point Your right present tense is "run" Oops, you got me. Since you like to play English Professor, let me play Government Professor & History Professor. Yes, California's Gov is a (R) BUT, All departments are funded and managed through the legislature. The governor does appoint heads of some agencies but most are not. The legislature is controlled by (D)'s. Therefore my statement is correct.
No Josh, the progressive's tried to make it into a Utopia, and we all see how that has worked out don't we. Maybe it has the largest death row because there are more people deserving to be on death row in CA. You know, like murderers, rapists, G-bangers and Michael Jackson wannabes. I know, maybe CA should send free them all and buy them a one way bus ticket to the town and neighborhood you live in since you seem to have a problem with it. I am sure you and your nieghbors wouldn't mind.
As for NY. You're right it is the heart of banking and finance of not just the US but the world though Hong Kong can lay claim to that as well. Sydney and London, as well as Switzerland may argue otherwise as well. Guess what! I was referring to NY's Government. High taxes and over zealous regulations have cause most of the wealthy to leave (read moved South).
Michigan is likewise in the same boat. It's problems go FAR beyond the auto industry, but we can visit that later.
@designerofdreams70 NY's govt is in a mess because it is full of corruption, two conservative Democrats briefly decided to play games and switch party control to the GOP, and the state is having trouble finding a governor that can stay without having a scandal of some sort (they would have done well to keep Spitzer, he had sex for goodness sake - it shouldn't be a crime).
@designerofdreams70 CBO states it will reduce the deficit by $138 BN over the first 10 yrs, and then $1.2 TRILLION in the next 10 yrs.
As for single payer, which is the most fiscally responsible option, there's nothing remotely 'socialist' about it, it's just the health care system of much of the rest of the capitalist world (all of the rest of the capitalist world has some sort of universal healthcare).
Yes Josh, by robbing medicare/ medicaid and cutting services of those same programs & double counting the revenues generated by new TAXES. Tell me Josh, how does something that costs $940 billion reduce the deficit? It's that new math I guess huh? Dear God, single payer not a "socialist" program? Do you believe your own lies? Your propaganda does fly with me but keep repeating what your progressive puppet masters have told you to say & you will find someone as dumb as you to believe it.
Democrats/Liberals/Progressives/Obama Administration = FAIL!!!!!! I am voting Independent or even republican for now on!!!!!! The Left is too weak to do anything!!!!!! If getting work done on capital hill was as easy as blaming Bush than Health Care would have been passed a year ago!!!!!!
That to secure these rights, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People ***to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government***, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.
No Cost Control Mechanism (Public Option) + Individual Mandate + Fine (fees) = Another Multi-Billion Dollar BailOut Bill for the private insurance industry every year !
Another disaster in the making...the debate of a lifetime has not ended yet.
Another thing, I notice all these rich elitist "progressives" all for the public option, except for themselves. Hmmm! I think since they believe in redistribution of wealth and are against the private sector we take ALL of their money, possesions, & businesses as a down payment on their beloved public option. I then would confiscate all the wealth of the Hollywood stars, Ted Turner & George Soros & disperse it 2 all the taxpayers . Hey! I am beginning 2 lovecommunism. Daddy needs a Bentley!
I thought it was about health care insurance reform, not a public option, Oops I almost was fooled by these leftist, lying, sacks of donkey dung. NOT! Communist Jackasses!
LET FREEDOM RING-LEGALIZE IT! legal weed = Free health care for everyone legal weed = More room for violent offenders in prison legal weed = Less trees cut for paper legal weed = Jump start for the economy legal weed = Streets paved with gold(well, maybe not streets paved with gold) ALL POSSIBLE BY TAXING THE USE OF THIS WONDERFUL PLANT! click my name for ringtone tell the CIA i left town! visit me @ jimmytheweed. com myspace. com/hotpancakesatnoon purevolume. com/jimmytheweed
Just one look at that botox-paralyzed, bug-eyed Nancy Pelosi or the recovering meth-addict Joe Biden, and you will quickly come to the conclusion that WE ARE SCREWED. The American Sheeple have become so addicted to pornography and video games that, in such a dopamine-depleted state, they have become DOCILE to the government-media complex. How is Obama any more qualified to be President than that fraud Sarah Palin? LOL.
Obama is bribing people to vote for stuff. Is this what our Govt. has finally collapsed to?
After this bill passes, I wouldn't doubt an Independent investigator presses charges on some of these Senators or even the President and his admin. Also I don't think Obama realizes the Supreme Court is the real power, not him. They will eventually crush him like a grape.
Ain't gonna happen -sorry. Move to Canada if you like second rate medical care with long lines and cold medication you have to put up your but (no kidding!)
Anyone who thinks it's ok for the government to take over any program or institution and administer it to the masses is a communist, plain and simple. All entitlements need to be phased out immediately and the cry-babys need to grow some balls. Paying for all the free loaders is now bankrupting the country for everyone. It must end.
I am for public option.The problem is the nazi-neocon liberal libtards I do not want.
Drop the the current trash we have and make it the people healthcare reform bill without all the jackass party trash.The republic of america has spoken to both parties on this issue.Time for smaller goverment and more free enterprise.
PS- Take a hint cnn demobrat morons and think about what you say.
what. you cant call some on a nazi liberal. that does not make sense. two different things completely. ones left and the other is far right. if you going to call some a moron, dont make yourself out to be one
Why the hell is taking over all Student Loans now attached to the Health Care bill? What a freak'n bunch of lying sneaking snakes! With one underhanded voting process they want to control the health care system and become the bank for all student loans. Don't think these same politicians won't stab you in the back when they run your health care.
As soon as we get this done, we need to move on to more important matters.
Food. Food is a RIGHT. Without the proper diet it negatively affects our health.
Why should we pay for the profits made by farmers, and field workers, and butchers, and truckers and warehouses and processing plants and packaging experts and advertisers and retail outlets. These are all owned by corporations making PROFIT. We dont need profit associated with our fundamental RIGHTS to have HEALTH CARE or FOOD.
Nancy Pelosi is nothing but a YES person. She reminds me of the ole hawaiian doll that sits in the windshield of a car with its head bobbing up and down constantly. We the people should be voting on the issues.....we do not need corrupt congress and president that do not have our best interest at heart!
vvinyard 7 months ago
Hey Folks, the only public option we have is our unalienable Rights. That is, our Rights as seen through the prism of science (see my channel video); these Rights apply to all Life, from bacteria to humans, and Social systems, including Charles Darwin’s research; as in some Grand Unification principle for all Living-systems. Many realized the Laws of Nature trumps mortals in power; a new understanding of these Rights may help make this world a better place to live.
Mike10four 1 year ago
Why is this woman not in prison?
jeddah91 1 year ago
Lets throw congress and the senate out on the streets where the belong, and we can use the Internet and make our own decisions much better than they do.
Why do we need these corrupt organizations to do our decision making for US. They dont live in the same towns we do, they don't know the streets as we do, they don't remember having to choose between food or rent, so how can they decide for US?
jeddah91 1 year ago
@jeddah91 US Congress serves the Europeans, why else would we spend hundreds of billion on their defense?
Our dollars were used to build European infrastructure, and then turned around by European banks to by property in the USA. Americans own less then 40% of the industry in the US, and even less of our own debt.
hamace 1 year ago
@hamace The reason the federal reserve will NEVER EVER in billion years be transparent is they are protecting their "QUEEN BEE" The very same bee that ALL presidents BOW too, she has a ancient hidden secret.
Follow the money
jeddah91 1 year ago
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jeddah91 1 year ago
When I talk to the CEO of a business, I speak in certain terms. When I speak to a fast food restaurant employee I speak in certain terms. I will identify myself with each of my posts here to give the courtesy to any who would like to respond. I will respond only if they do the same.
Example:
(me) I am an American. I believe in capitalism.
(you) I am an American. I believe in socialism.
or I am a Canadian and I believe in communism.
or I am from Finland and I don't what the fuck I believe in,
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
@TAMARLANE I'm British and I believe in capitalism
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Do you believe in government provided health care in Britain?
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
@TAMARLANE I've never had problems with it, but it's not perfect and it has had to be reformed.
this video might provide some context for how we see it - it's about the response to Daniel Hannan going on Fox News: news . bbc . co . uk / 1 / hi / uk_politics / 8201201 . stm (remove spaces)
joshatkins94 1 year ago
If you are in favor of government run health care, then you are not a capitalist. You are a socialist.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
@TAMARLANE I'm not in favor of having it run by the govt, like here. I'm in favor of a single payer where it is paid for by the govt.
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Paid for by the govt.? Hmmm! Where does the government get it's money to pay for stuff? I know, I know Prof. Magoo! The TAXPAYERS! to quote someone else "Socialism is great until you run out of other people's money"---Margaret Thatcher
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
this bill has no equilibrium with the mandates that means its "bad law" ask anyone at least with a public option it had equilibrium
CazyDayz 1 year ago
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CazyDayz 1 year ago
Goofy ass democrats.
saintsnbraves1 1 year ago
Obviously while im being filmed i want the public option, in congress with doors closed I go to the highest bidder.
there is your truth
jeddah91 1 year ago
Bottom line is, this bill is only to mandate the purchase/taxation of Corporate Medical Insurance not only for those who can afford it but for those cannot afford it...nothing else. Fines will be handed out to those who cannot or refuse to buy. Up to a $3000 fine per individual and the threat of incarceration will be held over you and your loved ones head. Yet, they vote without debate for it and we pay the price. This is NOT representation by any means. It is simply a Corporate handout.
Bronnster 1 year ago
Oh what tangled web we weave Nancy!
jeddah91 1 year ago
the public option and the bill in generral is a fraud and treason they are going to vote without bringing it to the floor this is taxation without representation
theygunaHATEME 1 year ago
wow, i'm feeling down abt all of this and the posts I read here.... I think most folk here are seriously looking for the workable way, that most of us are, even with different views. But I am flat out losing my hope in human beings in general. The Obama admin? Cruel to get everyone so hyped up abt possibilities and then .... BTW, communism is only an ECONOMIC system--- SEPARATE from political system of gov. EX of DEMOCRATIC communism? First Christian community "held all things in common."
etymon2 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
kindweed 1 year ago
Too "risky", wont happen.
Coldkilla9 1 year ago
"Initial story last August in the New York Times, no major media outlet has picked up this important story and investigated further.
Hopefully, that's changing. On Monday, Ed Shultz interviewed New York Times Washington reporter David Kirkpatrick on his MSNBC TV show, and Kirkpatrick confirmed the existence of the deal. Shultz quoted Chip Kahn, chief lobbyist for the for-profit hospital industry on Kahn's confidence that the White House would honor the no public option deal"
teleutube 1 year ago
It is sad, It is official, The NY TImes reporter confirmed OBAMA MADE DEAL TO KILL PUBLIC OPTION: "Chip Kahn, chief lobbyist for the for-profit hospital industry on Kahn's confidence that the White House would honor the no public option deal "
The ball might be in Pelosi's court, but the bucks did stop at Obama's door.
The PO is truly dead !
teleutube 1 year ago 2
Funny how on the news it said polls show 60% of the public didn't want this.
They don't trust the DemWitocrats or the republican'ts and the presiclown.
Backroom deals, lies, and Pelosi are the biggest problems with this whole thing.
Just dump it and forget it. We'll work on once we vote this circus out of town.
akracer1 1 year ago
ArtForCongress webs com
22 year old 2012 INDEPENDENT
put periods in the spaces
kryptoart87 1 year ago
No one trust the Government, yet they want to vote to have Government run health care. LMAO
So Medicare and Social Security are Bankrupt as we speak, yet the same people that came up with those ideas, those PONZI schemes, now want to do it to Health Care. LOL Yeah that's a real fix I can't wait for.
P.S Does anyone really want low priced health care when your life is at risk? You might save a buck, but then again you might die or lose mobility in something,
papavalium 1 year ago
Is government run health care going to raise your taxes? FACT:Yes.
Is grhc going to create more jobs? FACT:No.
Is grhc going to make you more healthy? FACT:No.
Is grhc going to create more health care rationing? FACT:Yes.
Is grhc going to create doctor and nurse shortages? FACT:Yes.
Is grhc going to be the same "Top Notch" health care that congress gets? FACT:No.
Is grhc going to save more lives? FACT:No.
Is grhc going to cost more than what you're paying the insurance companies now? FACT:Yes.
demonpreyer 1 year ago
Have you no sense of decency? Just going on with spreading your blatant lies I see. You make me sick.
kekemankek 1 year ago
let me get this straight. the taxes i pay should be raised so that i can pay the healthcare for illegals, gluttons, abortions, smokers, rehab for drug users, etc. etc. and me paying for all of this would somehow make me "decent"? Which said facts are you calling lies here? Do you seriously think these are all lies? Seriously?
whynotflip 1 year ago
Why is there impression that the House needs to insert the PO when they already passed it first time?..... Senators needs to grow some balls and pass PO through up or down vote.
I have a theory why the speaker is oppose to PO currently. I think she realize that if PO was inserted, the progress of passing the bill would of been effected in terms of time.
USB06 1 year ago
sell out your country just to pass something. you are the true meaning of pathetic.
1Guitarslayer 1 year ago
Vote on the PUBLIC OPTION -- Polls indicate most of the America Public wants it -- if it fails, so be it -- BUT LET'S SEE WHO'RE THE CORPORATE WHORES AND WHO AREN'T!
DillonX 1 year ago
Political coruption running rampant,by Obama administration.
OBAMASTINIAN 1 year ago
Aww! Someone doesn't like my take on wealth redistribution from elitist leftists to pay for public option, darn I am soooo hurt (Sarcasm for those of you in the liberal Utopias of New York, California, D.C. and that great bastion of "Progressive" ideas....Detroit)
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
oh, please read before you talk about the public option - you have no idea what it is.
wealth redistribution has nothing, whatsoever, to do with the public option.
a public option WOULD NOT be paid for with taxes. it would be PAID FOR BY ITS USERS. how can you not understand that? it's a fact, plain and simple.
it's NOT a govt handout.
as FDR said, "Repetition does not transform a lie into a truth."
CA has a (R) governor!
NY is the center of finance, so it obviously suffers in a recession.
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Josh my little child, Single payer will raise taxes, the demons (oops I mean democrats even admit it., or do you read?) Not a gov't handout? Who the hell pays for it? The user? REALLY? CBO says otherwise. ROTFLMAO!! Go push your worthless propaganda on more naive idoits They will believe your tripe. By the way;
New York is ran by liberals
California is ran by liberals
Michigan is ran by liberals
Illinois is ran by liberals
Therefore liberals are miserable failures.
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
We will replace those liberals with new blood next election. We will also replace all the republicans currently in office.All the incumbent congresspersons have let us down. they have caused/allowed this country to fall into disrepair. We will take our country back.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
I agree, both parties are screwing us. The dems are just in power right now therefore are my current enemy. I am just as pissed off at the "Progressive" repubs. Term limits are such a great idea. Being in Congress is not supposed to be a lifetime appointment. We have created a ruling class by our own laziness. It's time to return to limited government. "Progressive" hunting season is about to start, and I can't wait until November!
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
there are many who agree this time around. I am just going along with some smarter people than I, who know how to do it. I am following their guidance. i call, email and demonstrate on the streets in San Diego.
We have term limits , sort of , if we get up off our lazy butts and go out and vote.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
I feel for you living in California. At least you live in San Deigo which has a crumb of decency left. All the liberals have destroyed that state and now are moving here in droves to ruin this one with thier stupidity. Why? Because this state is ran by conservatives and is doing well in the recession. Go figure. Anyway, good luck with your fight!
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
California is over, in my opinion. When Obonehead stops paying extended unemployment benefits all hell is going to break loose here in California. I have children and grand children in San Diego County all on hot stand by to get out of dodge when it starts to crumble.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
Have you watched the "America Rising" video?
It is the best motivator I have seen on Youtube. Motivated many people, had about 3 million hits, and makes your blood boil.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
yes. it's correct about the corporate-run govt, strongly bipartisan corporatist corruption, but not correct about blaming Obama for every thing that's gone wrong. the titanic deficit that has come up in Obama's time in office was mainly already predicted to be where it is now without accounting for Obama's changes.
watch Reagan Republican economist Bruce Bartlett defend Obama's impact on the deficit: youtube . com / watch?v=MqlWinBICh4
joshatkins94 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Food is a human right. There is too much profit made in the food business. We must nationalize the food industry. Look at all the evil corporations making a profit from our food. Farming corporations, trucks and trains owned by big corporations. Look at the greedy corporations that profit from warehousing this food, the ones who profit from processing this food.. The evil corporations that package and advertise and sell in these filthy corporate food stores. Down with corporate profit on food.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
you hate progressives or you hate corporatist democrats? they're not the same thing.
joshatkins94 1 year ago
I hate "Progressives, Communists, & Socialists. I do not know to which Corporatist democrats you are referring, but as for me, I love Corporations. Why? because they employ people, provide services & products (such as the computer you are using to write your cute comments), and provide revenue to the fed. gov. and states for "Progressives" to use to fund your worthless programs. Governments are the only place where there are obscene profits, as they produce nothing, only take.
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 I like corporations, and true capitalism. Not socialism for the rich and capitalism for the poor, as health insurance companies who willfully kick off children due to preexisting conditions think the system is.
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Do you really expect me to respond to such tripe? The government already denies more health services to the poor and elderly than ANY private insurance company. (Medicare and medicaid) C'mon give me a challenge! But the "kicking off children comment is cute, trying to evoke sympathy for nameless children against mean ole insurance companies. Good try. Not true, but good try.
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 Seriously? You don't believe adults and children are kicked off due to preexisting conditions? Are you living in some sort of weird alternative dimension where AHIP is a branch of government?
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Hey Josh are you living in a Utopia where government "takes care" of everyone with other peoples money? Insurance is not health care. Everyone has access to health care, you just have to PAY for it. Again, the federal government is the biggest denier of benefits to children, poor, and elderly, NOT the insurance companies. Insurance companies only provide a service. A hedge or bet against a risk. To repeat EVERYONE (by law) has access to health care in the USA. Yay capitalism!!!!
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
designer
Not for long I fear. These communists are so convinced that there is a utopia out there that ehy are throwing everything to the wind. They are all in on this program and will probably prevail. They will prevail by lying and cheating to get there. I fear for my grands. I will willingly die for my beliefs, but not in confronting the downtrodden idiots out there, not fighting against the cannon fodder. I will confront those at the top. I always stated at the top when I was an IBM sales eng
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
They are surely feeling their oats now that they have an adminstration that actually shares their views. Marxism is now the norm in this White House. If you really want to know who Obama is, read his two books. He would make Karl Marx so proud. Unfortunately for these saps, they do not understand that the country is not Marxist and we will fight to the death to defend freedom and liberty over tyranny. We know their game and they can't stand it.
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
I can't bring myself to read these books. I think I know his so called "egalitarian" views which are probably right out of the Manifesto. Have you ever been to a "free beach" In my younger says I went a few time to the "red white and blue" beach. The only licensed nude beach in California at the time. On the beach everyone was nude, or not, not requred. In the parking lot above there would be a new Bentley, an old Volkswagon some trucks and dozens of every kind of automibiles and a few bicycles
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
Used to be that you couldn't really tell who drive up in the Bentley or the Volkswagon or the bicycle. It was truly an egalitarian experience.
Obama knows it is an impossible dream . He has to know. He must know. So, he is just a liar intent on the destruction of the existing system of government in
dismantling for profit businesses. Brazenly.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
America.Systematically dismantling profit oriented business in favor of government control. It is communism. I have trouble understanding why our media is allowing it to happen.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
The media has been taught by Marxist professors for over 30 years. It is easy to see why they side with the evil, they have been taught by evil. Over 80% of the media describes themselves as "Progressive" so they actually believe they will be protected by this administration. They are sadly mistaken. Once Fox news is eliminated they will focus on them and if they should step out of line, they will be taken care of as well. Only a matter of time. Such fools.
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
Thanks. I suppose I knew that the professors were all marxists. But I thought people were more like me, learned from experience too, not just university, and would evolve into more or less objective reporters of what they observe. I am embarrassed to be so naive at such an advanced age.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
Remember, you are the product of your environment. If you hang around "Progressives" and work in "Progressive" enterprises, and you never expose yourself to other ideas or think for yourself, you will fall prey to those ideas. It is not entirely their fault. Elitism must produce an feeling of superiority to be successful. They are taught not to question superiors and to ridicule others that disagree with them as they are far more intelligent than the rest of us. I just feel sorry for them.
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
To understand someone, especially their views of the world you have to read or hear their own words. He openly admits he sought out the Marxist professors, radicals, and socialists at college. He then attended a church that also had those same "Social Justice" views for over 20 years. Makes it very easy to see with which side of history he prescribes to. He is a Marxist and must be stopped. Only the elite rich can afford to be Marxist, including Marx himself. Communism is evil.
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
Thanks for clearing my thoughts some. I knew some of these things. But I guess I am suffering some diminished capacity to put two and two together and think clearly anymore.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
In this world you can be confused easily as information is approaching you from all sides and in every capacity it can. Go for a drive with the radio off, take a picnic by the beach, go for a hike in the forest. Get away from all media and you will feel better and be able to clearly analize the information. Do not believe either side, think for yourself and your gut will guide you. My wife and I love photography so we go out on photo expeditions to recharge. We need it in this day & age.
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
How easily I forget. I could have written the same observation myself at the end of summer when my wife an I return from out 3 month camping trip.
Last summer I made the mistake of taking my sirius satellite radio and listening to the news all summer.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
LOL! My wife gets on to me as well. In fact she told me several times just this morning to get off that computer. I listen as well as any man as you can see!
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
Food is a human right. There is too much profit made in the food business. We must nationalize the food industry. Look at all the evil corporations making a profit from our food. Farming corporations, trucks and trains owned by big corporations. Look at the greedy corporations that profit from warehousing this food, the ones who profit from processing this food.. The evil corporations that package and advertise and sell in these filthy corporate food stores. Down with corporate profit on food.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
@TAMARLANE what planet are you living on? there ALREADY IS government food assistance, it's called FOOD STAMPS, so your analogy is a poor one (and when was the last time a corporation denied you food due to a "preexisting condition" -- oh right, never).
joshatkins94 1 year ago
I forgot to add those corporations that concoct all the food additives that cause all these preconditions. And the corporations that develop the pesticides that are killing Americans. And the food corporations that have designed all the hybrid seeds, the genetically engineered seeds that are poisoning our people.
I left out quite few of these evil corporations that make profit on food, and make food cost so much that we must have a food stamp program for the people who can't pay for all that .
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
@TAMARLANE that's true, but it's not answering my question, which is do food companies deny food to people based on certain reasoning? again, the answer is no.
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Are you stupid or something? Show me where I said food companies are going to deny anyone food.
I made an analogy between the corporations that bring us our food and the insurance industry. I received so many responses telling me what a good analogy that was I simply don't understand your take at all. You are one in a million.
Do you like/trust corporations?. Do you think their profits are evil?Are you a socialist/communist?
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
@TAMARLANE You didn't say that. I just think that because food companies don't kick people off due to preexisting conditions, there isn't a need to have govt food.
I like corporations and I don't think their profits are evil. I just think health insurance companies specifically need regulation and competition.
joshatkins94 1 year ago
No one disagrees with you on that.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
@TAMARLANE I'll be honest, I think a public option would be better than single payer, because it would keep costs down but unlike single payer would not be unfair competition. I accept that you might disagree, but I do think (as I'm sure you do) that some reform needs to happen, whether it be a system overhaul (like a public option or single payer) or insurance reform (specifically preexisting conditions).
joshatkins94 1 year ago
The liberals talking point about preexisting conditions is designed to make people buy into a government run health care system. Do you know why preexisting conditions were excluded from normal insurance polices? Do you know what an actuary is and what an actuary does? An actuary is a bean counter that statistically considers the costs of things. Sort of like a race book in Vegas that figures the odds on your winning or losing, that is living or dying, and cost to protect you vs what you pay in
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 Ironically, your point about computers could be better researched - the research for the Internet was funded 1/2 by NASA and 1/2 by DARPA, both govt agencies. the advance of microcomputers was led by, say it with me: NASA, during the Apollo program.
If you think progressive programs are "worthless", you should push for the abolition of Medicare and Medicaid, both programs originating in the JFK and LBJ administrations (please don't start with 'jfk was conservative' argument)
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Wow! You are using military depts. as examples of "Progressive" programs? Really? I am glad we both agree that the miltary is great. Unfortunately the Military is not a "Progressive" program. By the way, it took the private sector to bring the microcomputer and the internet to you and me. That is why your computer reads DELL or APPLE and not ARPA (DARPA)or NASA. By the way, Yes I would eliminate both programs as they are corrupt and bankrupt. By the way JFK was a conservative. LOL!
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 I never said DARPA or NASA were specifically progressive agencies. govt programs, which you seem to hate. Of course private corporations made the mass uptake of personal computers viable, and not the govt - I was just pointing out that govt can work. I at least respect your consistency in that you would abolish Medicare and Medicaid.
joshatkins94 1 year ago
As I said, joshypoo, The military and NASA are NOT "Progressive" programs nimrod. But again, thanks for playing.
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 huh? what part of "I never said DARPA or NASA were specifically progressive agencies" don't you understand?
the JFK quote was in response to the "By the way JFK was a conservative."
instead of going ad hominen, could you actually respond to the quote itself -- or can you not refute them?
And yes, JFK was for tax cuts. He cut the top marginal rate from 91% to 70% - now THAT's conservative. /sarcasm
joshatkins94 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 "What we are now talking about doing most of the countries of Europe did years ago...We are behind every country in Europe pretty nearly...And those who say that what we are now talking about spoils our pioneer heritage should remember that the West was settled by two great actions of the federal government...This cooperation between an alert and progressive citizenry and a progressive government is what has made this country great."
- President John F. Kennedy (DEMOCRAT)
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Oh how cute, JFK quotes now, run out of TJ quotes? Hey oh smart one, he was also for tax cuts. He also spied on MLK, almost started WW-3, and was a son of a Hitler supporting criminal father. Trumpet him some more you moron. By the way his family was also RICH. I thought you hated rich people? Oh I forgot, you hate regular working rich people not the aristocracy, wait a minute.....
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 you're just putting words in my mouth, again. I never, ever said I hate rich people. I just hate the fact that as part of their fiduciary responsibility to their shareholders, health insurance execs make decisions which result in people being denied coverage they have paid to be insured for simply because they had a preexisting condition they had no control over.
joshatkins94 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 In this respect England exhibits the most remarkable phenomenon in the universe in the contrast between the profligacy of it's government and the probity of it's citizens. And accordingly it is now exhibiting an example of the truth of the maxim that virtue & interest are inseparable.
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Why are you quoting Thomas Jefferson? Are you actually trying to say that Thomas Jefferson was a progressive? Wow! Give me a break. NOT a good try.
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 You didn't like the quote, I take it. I can bring up some of his other quotes on the separation of church and state. Or some quotes from the other founding fathers about why America would never, ever, ever torture. The idea that the founding fathers were die hard conservatives is ridiculous. They were essentially libertarians, and they would never have thought that kicking people off of healthcare they've paid for due to preexisting conditions was reasonable capitalism.
joshatkins94 1 year ago
We can play the quote game all day, but let me quote one of the founding fathers one time only, "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." , "The U. S. Constitution doesn't guarantee happiness, only the pursuit of it. You have to catch up with it yourself.", "No nation was ever ruined by trade.", and finally " We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid."
Ben Franklin
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 I agree with all of those, the first could be easily applied to the policies of the Bush administration and to a lesser extent the Obama administration
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Japanese saying:
You are born drunk
and you die crazy.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 It ends, as might have been expected, in the ruin of it's people, but this ruin will fall heaviest, as it ought to fall on that hereditary aristocracy which has for generations been preparing the catastrophe. I hope we shall take warning from the example and crush in it's birth the aristocracy of our monied corporations which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country.
President Thomas Jefferson
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Again what does this have to do with modern day Progressives? The modern day equivilant to the Aristocracy is what we have in Washington. Good Ole Thomas Jeff was against a Fed as well, are you? The Fed was and is a progressive idea. The corporation that is the Fedral government is also a bigger threat to liberty than any private sector company could imagine to be. Really? Is this all you got?
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 I can only guess that by modern day Glenn Beck standards, Thomas Jefferson was a communist.
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Seeing as how Glenn Beck often quotes TJ and since Karl Marx and Engels were not known at the time TJ was prez and the Communist manifesto was not published until 1848, 22 years after TJ's death then I doubt TJ could be considered a communist. Even by Glenn Beck Standards (which are pretty acurate by the way). I bet you hate that don't you. you sick twisted freak.
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 I meant retrospectively, obviously. And really...Beck's standards are accurate?
"I'm just at home and I've recovering from some surgery that was scheduled and then went horribly arwy. It was one of the most, uh, eye-opening experiences of my life to receive healthcare in the US. This is one of the hospitals where the President of GE is going if they don't care about the Pres. of GE, do you really think they care about, you know, shlubs, that are just average working stiffs."
joshatkins94 1 year ago
How wonderful you can quote Glenn Beck but you probably never watch his show, or listen to his radio program. you only know what Media matters tells you. Good job! Now as someone who does listen and watch his show, let me say this, You know nothing as to which you speak. I thought we were talking about health care insurance, not health care services. Is the government going to take over hospitals too? Wow! Now I am more scared! Those who run the DMV running hosipitals! God help us!
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 "...No matter how much our healthcare would try to keep me down I'm back...Personal voyage through the nightmare that is our healthcare system. We seem to be a society or a system now in healthcare that is just trying to shove the patients out that door as fast as they can...Getting well in this country can actually almost kill you."
- Glenn Beck, January 2008
joshatkins94 1 year ago
please do. the corruption is from both sides of the isle. write in for a Russ Feingold/Ron Paul ticket at the next election or something like that, and you'd get an uncorrupt government.
joshatkins94 1 year ago
I will vote to replace those two jerks too. they were there and in office when all this crap came down. They managed to do nothing to stop it.
they failed
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
@TAMARLANE feingold is 1 of 100 senators, 1/2 of one of the three branches of government. paul was 1 of 435 representatives, 1/2 of the three branches of govt. it's a point george will made about all the hype surrounding scott brown's election - one senator or one representative doesn't have a large amount of power. since feingold is a strong progressive and paul is a strong libertarian, i.e. they actually care about what they believe, they get knocked down when it comes to chairmapships, etc.
joshatkins94 1 year ago
@joshatkins94 "paul was" -> is. typo.
joshatkins94 1 year ago
They were there when it all came down. I didn't near them kicking and screaming I didn't see them resigning their jobs in disgust.
The only person in congress now that I may not vote out of office is Scott Brown, because he wasn't there when it all came down.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
@TAMARLANE If the few who care - Feingold, Sanders, Paul, etc. had resigned their jobs then they would have even less of a chance to have a positive impact. Senator Feingold has repeatedly introduced legislation to cut the deficit and achieve a balanced federal budget, for instance.
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Had they resigned they would have retained their honor. As it is, they continued to draw a paycheck on the ruse that they were doing anything but spinning their wheels.
There may be others who tried but failed to make a difference too. Not interested in them.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
Since I can't find your remark, I decided to reply to this one. Come to Oklahoma or Texas, we will welcome you, in fact we need you. To the Progressives though, I say take a left turn at Albuquerque. Taos & Santa Fe just love people like you. LOL!
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
I was born in Oklahoma City, raised in Amarillo, TX.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
wow...how absurd.
1) i said a public option would be funded directly by its users' premiums, I did *not* say that about single payer. don't take quotes out of context.
2) single payer would be paid for through taxes, paid for by the public. if you think paying for a service is a handout, you need to try again
3) the word you mean to use is "run". CA has a (R) gov, NY is the heart of US finance, so will obviously be hit hard in a recession, and likewise Michigan is the heart of the auto industry
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Dear Josh, The Public Option will lead to single payer, but let's just pretend it will not. The CBO states that the "cost" (read taxes) of the Senate's plan is $940 BILLION. We all know that the CBO is historically low on it's estimates. Since almost all of the non-insured that will use the so called "Public Option" are considered poor, the taxpayer will subsidize them to pay for their insurance. Therefore when the taxpayer "pays" for the insurance I do consider it a "handout"
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
Your argument against a public option would be more reasonably applied to single payer, because a PO would not be funded through taxes.
joshatkins94 1 year ago
As Nancy, Reid, Obama, and just about every progressive demoncrap has stated, the PO is the ground work for single payer. If you think otherwise you are ignoring their own words, deaf and blind, or just ignorant. You try and state that this dam bill is not paid for by taxes or tax payers? This flies in the face of the CBO report. You are not a good liar. Try again.
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 I didn't say the current bill is not paid for with taxes, I said a public option wouldn't be. Don't distort my words.
And if a public option is the ground work for single payer - so what? That's the healthcare system of Australia, Canada, the UK, and New Zealand, some of the most strongly capitalist countries other than the United States. Australia is ranked above the United States in terms of economic freedom by THE HERITAGE FOUNDATION, yet it has single payer healthcare.
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Economic freedom Josh? The US has the largest tax burden of any industrialized country. We are over regulated, over taxed, and deep in debt. That is why we are lower than the others, because of the tax and spend liberals (both repubs and dems Joshypoo). Adding health care to an already overburdened system will destroy it, just as the "progressives" have stated they desire or do you read? Overwhelm the system as Saul Alinsky would say. (Rules for Radicals circa 1971)
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 In terms of tax revenue as a percentage of GDP, the United States has less taxation than Australia, Canada, New Zealand, the UK, Germany, France, Belgium, Sweden, and Denmark, to name a few (that is also Heritage Foundation data).
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Those are all socialist countries aren't they> Are you a socialist/communist josh? You didn't answer the last time I asked you. Are you so ashamed of what you are that you won't proudly profess it?
I am an American Capitalist. What are you?
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 for the data, google "heritage foundation economic freedom" and click on the second result, or use this link: bit . ly / cxGD2i
then click on the invidual country pages to find tax revenue as a percentage of GDP
joshatkins94 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 typo: invidual -> individual
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Thanks English Professor Magoo!
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 there are four countries in Britain, not just England. i happen to live in England but "England", "the UK", and "Britain" are not synonymous
joshatkins94 1 year ago
What the hell are you talking about? I never said anything about England, Britain, or the UK! Or for that matter Wales, Scotland, or your close neighbor Ireland, but hey, thanks for playing. By the way why does a Britain care to be commenting on the US health insurance system HMMMM? Take care of your own mess before you meddle in our affairs.
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 "Thanks English"
"By the way why does a Britain care to be commenting on the US health insurance system"
you mean "briton". and why do you care to comment about the NHS?
joshatkins94 1 year ago
English as the language you idiot! You see over here in the states we have ENGLISH classes, taught by ENGLISH professors. If you were a US citizen (American) you would know such things. I did not mention anything about the National Health System in Britain. i said clean up your own mess. In other words, Such your bloody trap about things from across the pond wanker. There did that clear it up Professor Magoo?
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
Even though you pretended to be coy and tried to be sly, I thoroughly enjoyed watching designerof freams eviscerate your sorry ass.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
HeHe! Thanks Tamarlane. You were a big help as well!
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
Thanks for sharing your views with me. It was not advice, and I apprciate that. I don't give advice myself, except to say what one on my mentors used to say to me. "Don't grow old".
My own personal accomplishment is realizing that one knows absolutely nothing at all, for sure. That is true wisdom
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
No problem! Great advice! One of my mentors (A college professor) said this to me "Never give up! Very simple yet so profound. He was a great man. He was a black man that served in WW2 and Korea. He never gave up and was a very successful man. He has a wonderful family and legacy now. My mother (a teacher) instilled in me the idea to think for myself, and my father (a butcher) instilled in me my work ethic. I am thankful for all of them!
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
One of my great grandfathers was a large animal veterinarian.
The other was a butcher.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
LOL! Now that is a very strange combination! Did they ever meet? I bet it would be like "Hey you know that cow you vaccinated last month?" "Yeah" "Well your eating it right now." "Tasty" My dad had that kind of sense of humor . It rubbed off. LOL!
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
I always thought they sort of canceled each other out. I assume they met since they were my grandmother's parents and her husbands parents. The one with my last name was the butcher I think. Not sure. I always thought there might be a profound life's lesson involved, but could never think of one.
TAMARLANE 1 year ago
For your third point Your right present tense is "run" Oops, you got me. Since you like to play English Professor, let me play Government Professor & History Professor. Yes, California's Gov is a (R) BUT, All departments are funded and managed through the legislature. The governor does appoint heads of some agencies but most are not. The legislature is controlled by (D)'s. Therefore my statement is correct.
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 your statement was that CA is a liberal utopia, which is crazy. it has the largest death row in the country, for starters.
joshatkins94 1 year ago
No Josh, the progressive's tried to make it into a Utopia, and we all see how that has worked out don't we. Maybe it has the largest death row because there are more people deserving to be on death row in CA. You know, like murderers, rapists, G-bangers and Michael Jackson wannabes. I know, maybe CA should send free them all and buy them a one way bus ticket to the town and neighborhood you live in since you seem to have a problem with it. I am sure you and your nieghbors wouldn't mind.
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
As for NY. You're right it is the heart of banking and finance of not just the US but the world though Hong Kong can lay claim to that as well. Sydney and London, as well as Switzerland may argue otherwise as well. Guess what! I was referring to NY's Government. High taxes and over zealous regulations have cause most of the wealthy to leave (read moved South).
Michigan is likewise in the same boat. It's problems go FAR beyond the auto industry, but we can visit that later.
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 NY's govt is in a mess because it is full of corruption, two conservative Democrats briefly decided to play games and switch party control to the GOP, and the state is having trouble finding a governor that can stay without having a scandal of some sort (they would have done well to keep Spitzer, he had sex for goodness sake - it shouldn't be a crime).
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Oh that's cute, just forget that the state was ran into the ground by liberal democrats for what 100 years? Give me a break LOL!
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
@designerofdreams70 CBO states it will reduce the deficit by $138 BN over the first 10 yrs, and then $1.2 TRILLION in the next 10 yrs.
As for single payer, which is the most fiscally responsible option, there's nothing remotely 'socialist' about it, it's just the health care system of much of the rest of the capitalist world (all of the rest of the capitalist world has some sort of universal healthcare).
joshatkins94 1 year ago
Yes Josh, by robbing medicare/ medicaid and cutting services of those same programs & double counting the revenues generated by new TAXES. Tell me Josh, how does something that costs $940 billion reduce the deficit? It's that new math I guess huh? Dear God, single payer not a "socialist" program? Do you believe your own lies? Your propaganda does fly with me but keep repeating what your progressive puppet masters have told you to say & you will find someone as dumb as you to believe it.
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
sorry, it wouldn't post then it showed up all at once.
whoopsie :(
tkcomputerservice 1 year ago
Democrats/Liberals/Progressives/Obama Administration = FAIL!!!!!! I am voting Independent or even republican for now on!!!!!! The Left is too weak to do anything!!!!!! If getting work done on capital hill was as easy as blaming Bush than Health Care would have been passed a year ago!!!!!!
BeingLiberal101 1 year ago
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tkcomputerservice 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
"This is for my friend, Kennedy. Aye!"
Well, don't that just speak volumes. Congress has turn into a gaggle of little princesses & princes.
What about what the people want?
Guess we don't matter.
No government run health-care. No, No, No Hell No!
The government has shown us what they will do, i.e. Social Security. Now we are supposed to give them another chance?
Remember, G. W. Bush said "I'll put a lock-box on Social Security". He & congress made up a war, then it was good-by lock-box !
tkcomputerservice 1 year ago
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tkcomputerservice 1 year ago
That to secure these rights, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People ***to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government***, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.
jayelefbee 1 year ago
It is time to name NAMES for the history books, and for the records : " WHO KILLLED THE PUBLIC OPTION ?"
The ball is in Pelosi's court, but the bucks stop at Obama's desk.
teleutube 1 year ago
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its not reform unless we have a Public Option!
imnotheretobelittle 1 year ago 2
Wake up and see the light, folks!
You don't need a PhD to see the plain truth:
No Cost Control Mechanism (Public Option) + Individual Mandate + Fine (fees) = Another Multi-Billion Dollar BailOut Bill for the private insurance industry every year !
Another disaster in the making...the debate of a lifetime has not ended yet.
teleutube 1 year ago 4
Another thing, I notice all these rich elitist "progressives" all for the public option, except for themselves. Hmmm! I think since they believe in redistribution of wealth and are against the private sector we take ALL of their money, possesions, & businesses as a down payment on their beloved public option. I then would confiscate all the wealth of the Hollywood stars, Ted Turner & George Soros & disperse it 2 all the taxpayers . Hey! I am beginning 2 lovecommunism. Daddy needs a Bentley!
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
We don't need a public option, we need more private competition and reduce health care costs.
mikejmoe 1 year ago
public cheaper, easier, no saying no to people.
imnotheretobelittle 1 year ago
how does a public option do this? Public option will bankrupt Americans and put the government on track towards socialism.
Besides, when was a patient at a hospital told no.
mikejmoe 1 year ago
I thought it was about health care insurance reform, not a public option, Oops I almost was fooled by these leftist, lying, sacks of donkey dung. NOT! Communist Jackasses!
designerofdreams70 1 year ago
Fascists
imnotheretobelittle 1 year ago
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kindweed 1 year ago
Just one look at that botox-paralyzed, bug-eyed Nancy Pelosi or the recovering meth-addict Joe Biden, and you will quickly come to the conclusion that WE ARE SCREWED. The American Sheeple have become so addicted to pornography and video games that, in such a dopamine-depleted state, they have become DOCILE to the government-media complex. How is Obama any more qualified to be President than that fraud Sarah Palin? LOL.
LORKops 1 year ago
Obama is bribing people to vote for stuff. Is this what our Govt. has finally collapsed to?
After this bill passes, I wouldn't doubt an Independent investigator presses charges on some of these Senators or even the President and his admin. Also I don't think Obama realizes the Supreme Court is the real power, not him. They will eventually crush him like a grape.
papavalium 1 year ago
Ain't gonna happen -sorry. Move to Canada if you like second rate medical care with long lines and cold medication you have to put up your but (no kidding!)
lenny380 1 year ago
Anyone who thinks it's ok for the government to take over any program or institution and administer it to the masses is a communist, plain and simple. All entitlements need to be phased out immediately and the cry-babys need to grow some balls. Paying for all the free loaders is now bankrupting the country for everyone. It must end.
RightWingTV 1 year ago
"Public Option"
"Fairness "Doctrine"
"Fannie Mae"
"Social Security"
Fannie Fascism & happy-sounding frauds -- Life Partners
TylerNull 1 year ago
I am for public option.The problem is the nazi-neocon liberal libtards I do not want.
Drop the the current trash we have and make it the people healthcare reform bill without all the jackass party trash.The republic of america has spoken to both parties on this issue.Time for smaller goverment and more free enterprise.
PS- Take a hint cnn demobrat morons and think about what you say.
PatriotTexas 1 year ago
what. you cant call some on a nazi liberal. that does not make sense. two different things completely. ones left and the other is far right. if you going to call some a moron, dont make yourself out to be one
imnotheretobelittle 1 year ago
Why the hell is taking over all Student Loans now attached to the Health Care bill? What a freak'n bunch of lying sneaking snakes! With one underhanded voting process they want to control the health care system and become the bank for all student loans. Don't think these same politicians won't stab you in the back when they run your health care.
stereokid 1 year ago
As soon as we get this done, we need to move on to more important matters.
Food. Food is a RIGHT. Without the proper diet it negatively affects our health.
Why should we pay for the profits made by farmers, and field workers, and butchers, and truckers and warehouses and processing plants and packaging experts and advertisers and retail outlets. These are all owned by corporations making PROFIT. We dont need profit associated with our fundamental RIGHTS to have HEALTH CARE or FOOD.
NotEasilyRegimented 1 year ago
For historical record, let's start naming NAMES now:
"WHO KILLED THE PUBLIC OPTION? "
A. The ball is in Pelosi's court, but the BUCKS stopped at Obama's desk.
Let us face the hash reality....the PO is dead.
teleutube 1 year ago
Government regulation is what makes health care so expensive. Bring the free market back.
Don't enslave the people.
BrettDunbar 1 year ago