Carl Sagan - God And Gods

[kingofmilwaukee6969]

Carl Sagan speaks.... unfortunately few listen.

[basejump8]

@Tylergbred indeed

[mothurman]

What if they say god created himself? Do you say the universe created itself? or what?

[Ryat51]

@mothurman go 7 or 8 minutes in to part 2 of Curiosity: Did God create the Universe?

Mathematical Standpoint? Yeah. Observational Standpoint? Who knows! Maybe it didn't create itself, but just kind of appeared. As Gods are supernatural, it may as well be possible they can purposely create themselves. The documentary takes the overall stance that while Gods are somewhat possible, they may not be a necessity.

[beastzero13]

@XRightWingChristianX 1) Show me the law that says matter can't have existed eternally (Actually, now that i think about , there are these two laws called the conservation of law and the conservation of mass. Hmmmmmm, that means that either matter and energy are eternal or that some weird unexplainable things happened that violated natural laws). 2) The argument is that if we have to assume that something is eternal, why would we invent something (god) instead of preexisting things (universe).

[knowwaie]

The law is called 'cause and effect'.

If the effect is finite then the cause must be infinite. Which is the reason why you must conclude that the universe or something within it is eternal.

[SincereCreature]

PERFECT.

[Piticli0969]

how I miss this man!

[yxrcbszg]

I wonder if Alan and Carl walk and talk  philosophy together

[procommenter]

As had the priests of science (knowledge) who'd preached and sermonized from their pulpits, during the reign of Caesars, about sacred linkages betwixt simians & humans (sans evidential relics); and beneficial mutations; and about the randomness of all systemic interactions: His Holy Eminence Bishop of futility and defeatism, the Pastor Carl Sagan, also waxed religiously & intimately of things that occurred billions & billions & billion of years before his birth beneath a pool table.

[TFrills]

Why are people saying bad things? Its not the religion itself that drives spiritual human proggress, its the circumstance that a religion can create. The same God that guides Carl Sagan on his journey to enlightenment is the same one that guides all of us, including the laws of nature. You could say that the laws of nature are God, and they always have existed and always will.

[S1W2E3D]

he is trully something else

[DiseasedMoss]

Some things cannot be answered with simple logic.

God is such a thing. God cannot be understood with logic but with faith he can.

[retrogamerist]

@DiseasedMoss Then faith is no longer an explanation or understanding. This faith is based on feeling yes? Feelings do not make things true.

[DiseasedMoss]

@retrogamerist



In the case of faith it does.

[retrogamerist]

@DiseasedMoss But whether you feel something or not, does not make it true.

[DiseasedMoss]

@retrogamerist You cannot feel faith, only understand it. It is another logic itself where God makes everything possible. Why is A not B? Because logic says so. Why is God there? Because faith says so.

[retrogamerist]

@DiseasedMoss Logic (from the Greek λογική logikē) is the formal systematic study of the principles of valid inference and correct reasoning. Faith is belief or action without reason or evidence or sometimes even opposing it. Therefore faith cannot be another logic in itself.

[DiseasedMoss]

@retrogamerist You know what I mean. It's another form of reasoning. Maybe it isn't logic. But it's another "thing" that makes God possible. God is possible, maybe not through logic, but through faith. Many other things are possible in such a way, like things that happened in the Bible. If someone cannot understand it, he cannot understand the result. Much like logic. Maybe it isn't logic, but it's a form of reasoning that can be compared to it.

[retrogamerist]

@DiseasedMoss Doesn't make it sensical or just.

[DiseasedMoss]

@retrogamerist But it does. Why? Because of faith.

If you cannot comprehend it, you cannot see it.

[retrogamerist]

@DiseasedMoss Faith is based on no evidence. Therefore is nonsensical reasoning, if a type of reasoning at all. Cannot comprehend or see what?

[FilipC124]

@DiseasedMoss What you are saying is: You must be delusional to believe in god.

[rhinnawi95]

I love how he explains this. He doesn't go for attacking opposing views or imposing his on others, but presents it like it is: big questions, mysteries. Now I'm a Christian, so I do believe in a creator of the universe out of nothing (I believe God to have lived outside of space and time), but there's no questioning how much respect this man has earned, and how far science has come these days. It truly is marvellous.

[Ralokone]

a profound thought Mr Sagan

I believe in god, and I cant say I disagree with what he is saying.

Does gods exsistence really matter, exsisting or not however things exsist that is how things are supposed to be, the way things always were, and always will be.

[RedstarRevolution101]

I wish I could have met Carl Sagan

[nephildevil]

god always existed, god created the universe, the universe always existed, first there was nothing that exploded and then became everything, ...if u think too deep it's all hilarious, yay for the selfmindfuck thing

[scyntho121]

Why don't we all just stfu and become Buddhist?

“Do not live thoughtlessly, in distraction and with deluded aims, outside the universal law.”

[TheBlackStatic]

@theothertroll  trollers be trollin

[TrollAndStuff]

@theothertroll this is hilarious.

[spyclanhectic]

@theothertroll Charles Darwin was actually a retard... His science was based on observation alone... alll science was until lavoisier came along

[iliveon]

@theothertroll lol you are arrogant to claim you have a book that I must follow my life by. You are nothing but a mammal

[TedTurnersGhost]

@theothertroll Your YouTube name has "troll" in it so whatever you say is automatically wrong. There is no God. Simple as that. Carl Sagan can say what he wants... He's a lot better than you... At everything... And he's not even alive anymore... That definitely says something about you...

[kingslice75]

Really good points here. And Sagan doesn't pretend to have all the answers. I think at the time there was still doubt as to whether or not the universe was forever expanding. As he said, these are not easy questions. Belief in God and belief in the Big Bang may not necessarily clash. One can believe in both.

By the way, is he moving during this scene? It looks weird. :)

[nowareman]

@TheBlackStatic  Thou foolish being

[kyrinky]

everytime i watch a Carl Sagan video i see atheists picking on religious ppl.....I as a christian am ashamed of christians that are always debating about the existence of God....if ppl dont want to believe there totally free to not believe.....and i am pretty sure that there is a very intelligent atheist out there that is ashamed of atheists arguing with christians so congratulations u out there! there is something a lot of us need and is tolerance...

[drkdrgn82]

@kyrinky tolerance will come when the bigotry of all religious "faiths" ( I use the term loosely), are put to an end. One human is in no way shape or form better than any other. I AM an Atheist, and I am proud to be a free thinking free willed being. I know I will be hated, ridiculed, force fed some propaganda and ultimately return to nothing when my life comes to its end. Only through open eyes and minds will peace be attained, not by sitting in some building deemed holy by another human.

[knowwaie]

"tolerance will come when the bigotry of all religious "faiths" are put to an end."

... Who is the bigot?... The hypocrisy here is mind numbing.

[Yami845]

*Sigh* Yes there are many religions and many thoughts on how anything exists at all, weather it be a man sitting on a cloud talking to people through a burning bush, or something more penetrating like the Force. But we must all agree that our future is more then just arguing over how or when life came to be on this little blue planet.

[MyRealNameIsntCledus]

@MrAmIAnonymous I've not heard of the theory of a multiverse. A sea of infinite universes is a fascinating thought. I see the point you made. I will have to look up this theory sometime.

[TopsuLoL]

Sagan is god.

[tommygray17]

@XRightWingChristianX, You're username really says it all. You know, I truly feel bad for ignorant people such as yourself. That's all I care to say, because if I were to go deeper into detail about how idiotic you seem it would most likely confuse you, as you obviously are too close-minded to understand.

[MyRealNameIsntCledus]

A Universe that has always existed is philosophically impossible. If the past is infinite, the present can never be reached. The Bible is a document that contains both literal language and poetic language. A big debate amongst Jewish and Christian thinkers is whether the initial Creation account of Genesis is literal or poetic. Whatever the case may be, the fact that the fine tuning of the Universe seems to suggest a designer is a point that is evaded much to often.

[icecremer]

If god always existed then why did he decide after forever (literally) to create something and suddenly make it important, also, if he is omnipotent, how come it took him a week to create everything is a week, also seeing as a days is a unit of measurement that is calculated by measuring the sun which was created on the fourth day? admit it, the Bible, Quran and the Torah, are all filled with a huge amount of flaws and holes, which humans who came later try to fix.

[ImxNeon]

HI MISS KING!

[KingADuhYeti]

@XRightWingChristianX your channel name says it all...

[flyingscience]

If you are a Carl sagan fan you will know why he is shown in front of a glowing tee imagery while discusing the ultimate question of Origins . Archtype imagery of a tree ands to the primate mind and yes even subconsciously to humans . Trees where home , shelter , food sources place to sleep and have sex safely and raise young .Note the religious imagery / concept of Tree of life and burning bush overlaping . Sagan talked more about it in Dragons of Eden? Looks like Pandoras glowing trees .

[2CSST2]

@XRightWingChristianX Are you a troll or are you that stupid and ignorant. Because a delusional nobody just like you are thinks the universe couldn't have always existed doesn't make it above the laws of physics. (science doesn't have any laws you idiot all its theories are falsifiable). Forget it, you will never bring anything to science or even understand it correctly.

[Longhornzrock96]

Smoke weed. Every day.

[doctorw2]

@thatamazinggeek i was glad i was able to amuse you however if a person observes the patterns within nature and the cosmos you begin to see that all the geometric shapes and forms that exist are concepts that require mathmatical computation and application which is indicative of an intelligence now the word GOD is an ambigious concept that means many things to many people accourding to their cultural perspectives all i am trying to convey is that GOD may not be anything like what is in religion.

[Quintinohthree]

@doctorw2

Mathematics is used to describe the universe. Physical laws can be expressed in mathematical terms. An example: F=ma. Our ability to describe such laws and our observation of them being correct is not indicative of any sort of intelligence.

What could be indicative of intelligence would be some sort of arbitrariness: that in some cases we can observe F=ma but in other cases F=Tma^2 and we can find no other descriptions of the observation, even though there is no difference.

[doctorw2]

@Quintinohthree mathmatics define the universe though we just decipher its language there has to be something that is maintaining the primary equations of the cosmos and keeping them constant or else the universe would be just a jumbled soup of chaotic energy and matter with no planets,stars or anything else. atoms,ions,and cells are mathmatical concepts that had to be conceived from an intelligence that is alien and infinitly much more complex than our own.

[Quintinohthree]

@doctorw2

So just because you don't know what's actually making these laws be as they are (if it even has to be something), you are going to say it's not just anything but an intelligent being?

These laws are descriptions of the interactions of particles. These particles interact as they do because of their properties. Easy explanation, it works, is accepted and it involves no infinitely complex intelligent being.

[doctorw2]

@Quintinohthree the making of laws requires constructive thought and power to intiate them in reality nothing should exist at all water for example should have no substance or taste but yet it does and there should be no reason that life evolved on earth yet its here and not elsewhere within our solar system that is. i dont know why scientists can not see the big picture here there is an intelligence in the universe that is doing things for a purpose we cant understand.

[Quintinohthree]

@doctorw2

Laws describe, they don't prescribe. Intelligence is required to make them, but the interactions described in them are as they are because of the properties of the few particles that exist within our universe.

[doctorw2]

@Quintinohthree the properties and everything else should not exist is my point yet they do and nothing works on its own impetus there has to be some catalyst which activates the principle of cause and effect for a purpose. to say that the particles of anything interact on their own becuase thats just the way there supposed to be is faulty reasoning something determined that they should react that way.

[Rest1nOnePiece]

@doctorw2

Human's intelligence itself is a reflection of relations(laws) exist in nature (space,time,movement, reason->result) at a higher level than animals and this higher level achieved through the evolution process. Other choice is regarding relations-laws exist in nature a reflection (''creation'') of an absolute intelligence(God). Second choice is a ''human-forming'': we see human figures-forms in-before-out of- universe, instead of considering humans and their brains as forms of Cosmos.

[doctorw2]

@thatamazinggeek no my information comes from observation and logical reasoning.

[freakfiend32]

@XRightWingChristianX actually you Christians are the ones putting on the truly tragic 'comedy'

[andromidius]

@XRightWingChristianX Fail. You're assuming physics says that subatomic particals have a finite lifespan. They don't. Atoms and high forms of matters do. Energy is eternal, and can only be transferred or stored. Hense, there's nothing in physics that disagrees with the eternal universe concept. Go back to school and study more please.

[1tabligh]

We can raise precisely the same objection against the atheists and ask them, "If we follow the chain of causality back, we will ultimately reach the primary cause. Let us say that cause is not God, but matter. Tell us who created primary matter. You who believe in the law of causality, answer us Ws: if matter is the ultimate cause of all things, what is the cause of matter?

You say that the source of all phenomena is matter-energy; what is the cause and origin of matter-energy?"

[soundmanian]

Religion is a sickness.

[freakfiend32]

@soundmanian religion is a mental handicap placed upon us by our ancestors

[batistaker123]

@XRightWingChristianX Energy is neither created nor destroyed. A God creating this energy has never been shown and disproves what modern science has taught.

[AreteZoe]

@TheBlackStatic

Not to take sides, but it's simple to list negativity out of anything. There are many positives that religion has helped mold and control, part of that is people. One could reply science with Nuclear weapons, Biological warfare, drugs, etc. Both religion and science have goals to help people, how we as individual humans interpret and react to that is entirely our fault. Just like if I were to watch a youtube video that encouraged me to act upon my beliefs, it's me, not youtube.

[dragonmasterlance123]

@XRightWingChristianX Christians always reject that a universe could come from nothing yet you fail to ever supply the simple answer of "where did god come from?" Was he always there? Did he create himself? Did he just appear out of nowhere?? If an all knowing, all powerful being (capable of creating trillions upon trillions of forms of life and further trillions upon trillions of stars,planets etc,) can suddenly just "appear" one day. Why couldnt the universe just "appear" one day??

[Neueregel]

no need for a creation !!

[jake21893]

a god is possible but all our religions are made up bullshit.

[SteveDutchy]

god is invented by humans. the more you learn about humans, the more you understand how stupid they really are

[Theliving777]

I love Jesus Christ

[TheBlackStatic]

@Theliving777 I love Jebus

[Nuclear12331]

@Theliving777

This is sad with negative votes.

[deeppurple28]

@Theliving777 Fuck your God You mindless drone!

[PSNTheWinged]

@Theliving777 i do not see why your comment received negative votes.

[doctorw2]

GOD is sentient energy all things in the cosmos are made up of energy and energy is not created or destroyed the universe is an expansion of the conciousness of the creator it was not made out of nothing.

[Neueregel]

@doctorw2 god=myth

[doctorw2]

@Neueregel GOD is no myth but human perspectives and concepts of GOD make it seem so.

[basketballakev]

@XRightWingChristianX

Close your book of fables, open a science book, read Carl Sagan or Steven Hawkings, watch the Science Channel, or Discovery, or PBS but first you have to pull your head out of your bible and the real challenge, open it to reality open it to possibilities that don't come from a 3000+ year old book written when man thought the world was flat and the earth the center of the universe.

You no longer live in the stone age, it is time your mind caught up!

[54321Adela]

Does anyone know what part of Rigveda this is? I´d like to read it.

[goog2k]

The religion of the future will be a cosmic religion. It should transcend personal God and avoid dogma and theology. Covering both the natural and the spiritual, it should be based on a religious sense arising from the experience of all things natural and spiritual as a meaningful unity. Buddhism answers this description .. If there is any religion that could cope with modern scientific needs it would be Buddhism.

-- Albert Einstein

[guidowigger]

exactly! the answer pleases both sides of this conflict.

[Bjorkerman]

There are no Gods, all we have is Energy that flows all over the universe... You must believe in something real. Wake up ppl!

[Desdenova262]

My favorite saying from a greek, over 2, 000 yrs ago.

Is god is willing to prevent evil, but not able?

Then he is not omnipotent.

Is he able, but not willing?

Then he is malevolent.

Is he both able and willing?

Then whence commeth evil?

Is he neither able nor willing?

Then why call him god?

Epicurus......BC 341-270.

[phildirt3]

man is he missed

[trekgeek1]

If god is "nature" or the "universe" or "physical laws" then there is no god. We already have words for these. They are called "nature", "universe" and "physical laws". By saying that is what god is, you are trying to load the word with something else. If I say "nature is god", how have I changed the word "nature"? What's different now? If nothing, then it's pointless to say it. If it did change, how? When theists say "god is love" they don't mean it, they still slip in supernatural things.

[blkcpdconure]

the conversation between goog2k and TheBlackStatic sounds a lot like the teachings of Alan Watts. Look up a video by him that is about the concept of nothing. I think you would enjoy it.

[TheBlackStatic]

@blkcpdconure Alan Watts is the sh*t ;D

[Andreazor]

@TheBlackStatic

I just watched that video of him talking about this "nothingness" philisophy, and that's just what it is. It doesn't feel very scientific, it feels fuzzy and some times illogical. I love Carl Sagan and the stuff he's said, it's profound and very intelligent, but I found this Alan Watts to not be at all as interesting because it wasn't really any form of revelation or deep insight to me. Maybe I'm a bit wierd and I've though so much about this on my own that I find it trivial?

[diogotomediogo]

this is the perfect speech

[g07denslicer]

his face is weird

[AJBfc]

I honestly dont think we will ever find an answer to that question. However, if we ever do, i think its fair to say we will have peaked as a civilization. After all what other question is more important to answer?

[flubno]

It sucks that humans don't have the brain power to figure the universe out. Kinda leaves us in a lurch. I hope people one day realize that when they say God must have done it. It's the same as saying that there must be some kind of Super Wizzard that did all this. That's the best explanation we can imagine ? It's sounds like a theory made by someone that didn't know anything about the universe would say. I hope we can do better one day. Brainwashing Religions are slowing us down, holds us back

[HannahZepplg]

@flubno Religions are evil i agree :) ... people use it to propagate their evil intentions. Not all religious people are necessarily brainwashed though. :)

Also, there is a difference between being a religious fanatic and to have a certain spirituality. Faith is not always ignorance. To have faith in something "bigger" than us... turns out to be almost a more "humble" attitude. People can have faith without blindly follow a religion.

[HannahZepplg]

@flubno I mean... faith is the ability to believe in that which you can not prove. Personally... I believe "God" is the Universe itself... But can i prove it? no one can prove it .. so it´s also faith :)

[flubno]

@HannahZepplg Yeah, it just sucks that no one can prove anything. Charles Darwin put it best when he said all we got to chose from are a couple of vauge ideas.

[HannahZepplg]

@flubno Oh man... Darwin is one of my idols... a great mind! :D In 1859 he was way ahead of his time. btw tomorrow is his 202nd birthday! :D

[ApplePwnzMicrosoft]

what song is that in the background?

[jonpaulmoen]

is he on a dolly?

[PUMKINMANforever]

I wonder if he's standing on something to move him back like that?

[iciavosser]

My opinion: it could be that our big mistake is in thinking that our limited intellect should be able to logically pursue this question to it's end. I think it's quite clear that we can't even define the universe or our existence, and it could be that our logic cannot reach far enough to understand God, or what God is, or why God may have created the universe. Or, conversely, it may also be beyond us to understand the origins or meaning of our souls and the universe without a god's influence.

[ErectProficy]

@iciavosser Why strive to understand God? He does not exist.

[parquar]

@iciavosser Most atheists conclude that we don't know, which is the most true of statements regarding purpose to the universe. Unless you are talking about human afterlife, moral judgements, etc, there is no reason to even confuse things by using the word God just to describe purpose or what we do not know.

[iciavosser]

@parquar  I agree.

[amorphousguy]

Sagan makes the point that religious people consistently miss.

[cloudsquirrel]

@amorphousguy

...and routinely ignore as well. The religious do this intentionally because they WANT for their to be a god. They cannot concieve of the point of their existence without a god having created them for a special purpose. It is the height of both fear and conceit that they cling to, causing delay and fatigue to the evolution of the entire human race.

Miss you Carl. Your existence made mine richer and happier.

[flyingscience]

Why is Carl under the glowing tree as shown in Avatar .I'm smelling a theme here .Still working on the walking trees in Lord of the Rings but it will come to me .I'm of to carve my loves name in a tree .Knock on wood!

[TheBlackStatic]

haha oh well.... this recording of Sagan was made in the 70s so.... maby they loved this scene ;)

[flyingscience]

To the primates mind the Tree is where you get food , have sex and sleep safely ,in short a tree is like God in archetype symbols which we still have subconsciously.

[flyingscience]

As the tree of life or the tree of Darwin . Note the sun fading in and out giving Carl an angelic glow while talking about origins .

[flyingscience]

1 Carl was talking about God while standing in front of the one image God looks like in both science and religion .

God as the burning bush and God as a primates home ,shelter , sleep ,food source -a tree!

[goog2k]

Maybe god is just Nature, or Cosmos, or Reality. Why does god need to be a big daddy up in the sky?

Carl said, "We are star stuff." and "a way for the cosmos to know itself."

In fact, all the atoms on earth and in our bodies came from supernova that blew up over 5 billion years ago.

Really, aren't we all just walking, talking stardust -- this cosmos become AWAKE and looking it back at itself? -- and aren't we intimately connected to it all?

Happy New Year!

enjoy the dance

[TheBlackStatic]

Im personaly a agnostic.. because the closer you look at things the more they seem to dissapear ;)

however... i have experianced way to much to not belive that there is more to life then just this realety.

[goog2k]

I think it's even more simple than that. We think we're separate from everything because that's what we need to survive as living organisms, but fundamentally it's a mistake of our relative conceptual mind.

On the deepest level we are always one with this world.

[TheBlackStatic]

so what you are saying is that.. we are all connected like one consiousness experiencing it self subjectively?

[goog2k]

Metaphorically, I think of it more like we're all bubbles of consciousness floating on the same ocean of existence.

So, what are you BlackStatic -- the water, the ocean, or the bubble?? -- and what's your relationship to all the other bubbles of consciousness.

[TheBlackStatic]

funny you shuld mention the bubbles... i have always seen my mood and feelings as if it all took place in a bubble of my own consiousness, and i culd pop the bubble when ever i wanted.. like.... instantly change the mood... becaus i was so aware of what i was feeling... guess im the bubble

[goog2k]

Of course, but aren't you also the water and the ocean too?

Where does the bubble come from? Where does it go after it pops?

Have you ever separated from the ocean?

And aren't you intimately connected to all the other bubbles??

[Obsulution]

@TheBlackStatic NOOO MY NIGGGGA! if you POP ur fukkin bubble of consciousness you will DIE DONT DO IT

[TheBlackStatic]

@goog2k or walking talking chemical waste lol depends how you look at it :P

[goog2k]

@TheBlackStatic Sounds kinda smelly . . .

but at least it's chemical waste that laughs.

[alex39977]

@goog2k Then why call it god?

[goog2k]

@alex39977 I agree completely. God is a loaded word implying a supernatural anthropomorphic big daddy up in the sky.

However, our source is very profound -- the infinite, boundless ground of being from which we all emerge and all return.

I prefer "Nature", Cosmos, or Reality or eastern concepts like Tao and Sunyata.

[alex39977]

@goog2k To me is outrageous how many scientists like Carl , hawking, and Einstein need to appease the public by giving the word god a meaning . Some say its the laws of nature others say that it may be a being that just stood in the sidelines after the big bang, it seems as if they were pressured to say many of these things for they have no reason to honor a idea that has kept science in the closet in much of man kinds history.

[goog2k]

@alex39977 I know Einstein, Sagan, & Hawking didn't/don't believe in a silly fairy tale sugar daddy up in the sky -- but they use the word "god" to relate to people who do.

I'll send you a few quotes.

Science is the TRUTH because it works. Don't worry about semantics too much.

[ToxxinProductions]

@goog2k wrong einstein was jewish :D

[goog2k]

@ToxxinProductions LOL!!! Yes, he had Jewish parents, dummy.

The idea of a personal God is an anthropological concept which I am unable to take seriously.

-- Albert Einstein, 1946

I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it.

-- Albert Einstein, 1954

Oops???

[ToxxinProductions]

@goog2k W/e lol i know he believed in god and i remember jews coming up when i researched him once xD COLLISION OF THOUGHTS FTW.

[goog2k]

@ToxxinProductions The idea of a personal God is an anthropological concept which I am unable to take seriously.

-- Albert Einstein, Letter to Hoffman and Dukas, 1946

Oops!!! LOL!

[ToxxinProductions]

@goog2k hmm. Then why did he hate that atheists used his name to support themselves?

[goog2k]

@ToxxinProductions LOL!

I've already explained and given you quotes. Jeez, please re-read.

Einstein was very spiritual but he DID NOT believe in a fairy tale personal god. He didn't separate "spiritual" from nature, the universe, or even himself.

He believed, "a religious sense arising from the experience of all things natural and spiritual as a meaningful unity."

In other words: Nature, this Universe, and each of us, including YOU, are part of ONE spiritual wholeness we call Reality.

LOL!!!

[flyingscience]

he never mantioned the flying spaghetti monster once -blasphemy! check out my "flying spaghetti monster boomerangs " or how to paint FLS on anything "videos 1

[supertoxicman]

this guy is pritty awesome

[elmoscarcan]

NIce!!!