You have no desire to know the real truth, because if you did, your conscience will convict you of your sin. You need to study both book and see who is telling the truth. Bible can be proven and Koran can be proven to be faults doctrine period. Jesus came to save, while Mohammed kill many for his god which is Lucifer the Satan himself. This doctrine came from Satan and none other. At the end Jesus wins, all knees shall bow before him and confess he alone is true MESSIAH.
Jesus didn't kill people, Allah thru so call prophet Mohammed killed many. Jesus never married, Mohammed had many wives. Jesus didn't insult, Mohammed insulted many, Jesus didn't own slaves, Mohammed had many slaves doing his dirty work of deception. Jesus said we are created in the image of God, Mohammed says it is a blaspheme, because Allah had no image. Jesus said we are children of God, Mohammed says it is blaspheme because Allah has no children. Wow!..which side you rather be on..Da
Also why would G-D (Blessed Be He) first give His word (the Torah) in front of millions of people (as even the Koran admits), and then replace them with the koran or any other book given to 1 person (supposedly) with no witnesses and only through an angel (Gavriel) (not G-D Himself)? Also in the Torah G-D Himself writes that He will never replace the nation of Israel with another nation, why would G-D then become a hypocrate G-D forbid, according to these other religions?
Your talking about the cristian bibles (their are many). Besides that their are many versions of the koran also. The Torah is the same. If you check they all have the same words and letters. Also check this video watch?v=tQxk19XmvTQ Its just a little about the Torah vs. Koran.
I wouldnt blame the christians for believing that Jesus was god...I would blame the church and the gibrish rubbish they though...When the church took over during the dark ages they ruined their own book to their vain desires...How could they've done such to something that should mean so much to them, and all of us...How dare they???
It's worth noting at this point I am not trying to convert you to Christianity, and I apologise for taking up so much of the comments' section, but I wanted to explain why I don't think youcan be intellectually honest, read the Bible from back to front, study it, comparing the relevant passages for Christ's person and conclude He didn't think Himself God. You might have some different views on why He was wrong to think that, but there's no real room for suggesting He didn't at least think it.
Christ distinguishes Himself as having intimate knowledge of the Father above and beyond any other natural or supernatural creation; He corrects the Torah; He fulfills all the prophecies expected of the Messiah/Son of God/Lord, and creates the new law to live by and standard for salvation. He did not come just as a prophet, and this is exemplified by His resurrection, and conquering of death for all of those who should believe in Him. If this is not so, then, as Paul says, we are fools.
Also, another point here is that the Trinity doesn't detract from the fact Christianity and Judaism is a monotheism. We have the three persons, the Father, Christ and the Holy Spirit but they all share the same essence, and that is what we call God. For instance, 1+1+1 =3 but 1x1x1 = 1. What is the chemical make-up of water and ice? H2O...
If you want to say Christ was mistaken, that's your call, but it's inaccurate to claim Christ didn't think Himself Christ. When He was performing His miracles, He spoke with His own authority. He didn't receive the power from the Father, they were Jesus' own miracles. He spoke and they were so, whether He was healing the sick, or driving out demons.
and Christ answers: "Iam; and you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the power and coming with the clouds of heaven." He is then persecuted for blasphemy. So, here, in clear declaration, jesus Christ affirms Himself as Lord.
If you read the Bible back to front you will realise that Christ refers to earlier prophecies made in the Old Testament to establishHiomself as Lord. Such as when He refers to Himself as "The son of man", he is referring to the vision of Daniel: "and behold with the clouds of heaven there came one like a son of man... And to him was given dominion and glory and Kingdom.
Ww also have Mark's account of His trial in which we have the priest asking Him: Are you the Christ, the Son of the Blessed?
surly having a video tittled the bible vs the koran creates yet another devide between two religions in todays hostile climate towards different religions and the tolerence of them? nice.
Pt. 2 But only having the Law means nothing. It's in vain if you do not obey the Law. James 1:22. Barnabas was rejected not because it mentions Muhammad but because it was proven to be a fraud by western scholars for centuries. It's not in your interest as a muslim to quote from Barnabas because it forbids having more than 1 wife while the quran allows 4, it's vocabulary is not 1st century, also allows the eating of pork. So even as a muslim you should see the problems with the book of Barnabas.
Ok, so theres quite a bit you posted on several videos so if I miss some key points, remind me, heh.
Ok, so for Gospel of Barnabas, it's just like the rest of the Bible, theres some truth in it and some falsehood. The Gospel of Jesus was 100% true. However, the Bible we have today is completely different and has been changed over time. Even Christians admit, these aren't God's words, rather they have been compiled by John, Luke, Matt, etc...some people we don't even know who they were..
Pt.1 I previously posted a very disrespectful comment and wish to apologize. I just read a book called Inside Islam by Reza F. Safa. After reading this book I felt convicted and learned how conterproductive attacks are in searching for the Truth. That said however I still beleive the Bible is more reliable than the Quran. You said Jeremiah 8:8 states the Bible has been changed over time I disagree. Jer. 8:8 is just stating the backslidden state of Isreal. The scribes boasted of having the Law.
Apology accepted, thank you for apologizing. But simply by having Jeremiah 8:8, wouldnt that mean parts of the Old Testament have been changed from the original Torah of Moses, wouldn't you agree?
I would say that a translation of the Koran those not have the same status as the Arabic. I would say that some Muslims would read the Koran different to day than for a 1000 years ago for instance.
To a certain extent, you're absolutely correct and this shows the importance of learning classical Arabic. Indeed, I'm not an Arab and Arabic is not my mother-tongue, but once I started studying classical Arabic, in all honesty, I was and still am absolutely blown up by the miraclous nature of the Koran. It's definitely true that you don't see the impact when just reading a translation of the meaning of the Koran.
Jeremiah 8:8 (King James Version) 8How do ye say, We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us? Lo, certainly in vain made he it; the pen of the scribes is in vain.
IT WAS NOT SAYING THE BIBLE IS CORRUPT ITS WAS SAYING THAT THE MEN OF THERE AGE WAS TRYING TO MAKE THE LAW INTO THERE OWN NOT THAT THE SCRIPTURES WERE CHANGED
Islam claims that Allah is the same God who was revealed in the Bible. . . . then if the Bible and the Qur'an have differing views of God, then Islam's claim is false. Don't forget that Muhammad claimed in Suras 2:87, 29:46, 32:23, 5:44, 6:154, 6:155 that Allah confirmed the Torah (Taurat) and Christian Gospel (Injeel) (Surah 2:87, 5:46, 5:68, 29:46 and 43:63). So, if the Torah and Gospel are correct, all the errors in the Qur'an shown below make the Qur'an false.
Both the Bible and the Koran are good for toilet paper and kindling to start a fire. Both are fairytales that the gullible believe to be true. Fuck Islam, Fuck Christianity and Fuck Judaism!!!
Since the Bible came before the Koran, and since there is every reason to believe that the Bible was kept uncorrupted, Muslim theologians have lots of explaining to do with regard to such contradictions and errors in their Book
THE Koran IS IN ENGLISH U CAN FIND IT ON THE INTERNET ALSO THERE IS A PASTOR ON TV WHO IS CHALLENGING MUSLIMS TO READ THE BIBLE CUZ HE IS READYING THE KORAN IN ENGLISH YOU CAN GET IT FROM ANY LIBRARY MAN WHY DONT YOU TALK TO ME ARE YOU SCARED CUZ I HAVE MY FACTS STRAIGHT AND YOU DONT PEOPLE DONT BELIEVE HIM PLZ
The original Quran is in Arabic. When it is in English, it is a translation of the meaning of the Quran. Why? B/c whenever you translate something, it is prone to human tendency and error. Therefore, the authentic Quran is only in Arabic. The English Qurans that are available are good and they are the translation of the meaning of the Quran. This is the reason why there are not 30+ different versions of the Quran, like there are of the Bible today. Instead theres only one Quran!
I do own a copy of the Bible at home. I haven't read it cover-to-cover, but I have read parts of it. Why don't you read the Red Bible which has the words of Jesus in red? You will see Jesus is preaching true monotheism, not a religion of man-god, God having a son, 3in1, 1in3 or any of this other nonsense.
i think what you are doing in the name of your faith is very up front and i think people need to be like this more often, i would argue however that if your debate lies in the diffrence between the two incredibly reliable historical documents you should not be so single minded, i still am confused on why iv seen people & family physically healed in the name of jesus, iv also had in-counter with demons that flee when i rebuke them in his name, does this happen in islam? please reply to me.
Thanks for stopping by. Excorism is real and it does exist. Demon possessions do occur and there are exorcisms for them in Islam, like there are in Christianity as well. However, let me tell you why they "work" in the name of Jesus. Obviously, when a demon possess someone, it is an evil creature (there are 'good' versions of demons, let's not call them that, in Islam, we'd refer to them as jinn). However, good jinn tend to do their own thing and stay away from humans.
Now, when an evil jinn (or demon as we'll refer to them) possess a human, their goal is evil. What's the worst sin that can be committ? The worst sin that can be committed is to worship other than the One True God. Therefore, when a demon is told to exit someone's body in the name of other than the One True God, the demon has succeeded in his goal of having the person he possessed and the people around him committ a grave sin, that of worshipping the creation and not the Creator.
That is why when someone is 'healed' in the name of Jesus, the demon runs away b/c he accomplished his goal and has nothing further he wants to do.
This isn't to say Jesus is not a great person in Islam. On the contrary, Jesus is beloved in Islam and he is the Messenger of God and we believe in his virgin birth. However, we just don't worship him. Instead, we worship the One True God, the Creator of the Heavens and Earth. Any more questions, please dont hesitate to ask.
There's no guarentee here in any of the verses that the true word of God here would remain unchanged by humans. After all, just by simple translation alone, man has managed to use his words in an effort to 'describe' God's word. But when translation of translations are taken (i.e. Aramaeic to Greek to English), human errors have changed this. Does a promise exist from God to preserve his word for the Christians?
The Quran came and abrogated the Bible. People distorted the Bible to suit their needs. Regardless, even now, the Bible doesn't EXPLICITLY mention the trinity anywhere. These ideas of man-god, saint worship, and God having a son are additions to the real message of Jesus.
The trinity is a Roman Catholic invention; one I do not adhere to. I believe in the Oneness of God as do many Christians.
God most certainly came to earth as a man which man is the Son of God. To deny this is to accuse God of not being able to do the impossible. Gabriel told Mary when he told her she would have a Son by the Holy Ghost, he said that nothing is impossible with God.
Jesus didn't have a message, HE himself was the message. He was the Word made flesh.
If you reject the trinity but believe in the prophethood of Jesus, then this is exactly what Islam preaches. However, we don't worship Jesus or call him God. We call him the Messiah (see my video, "Jesus the Messiah in Islam"). We believe in the virgin birth as Gabriel gave the glad tidings of a righteous son to Mary. We don't anthropormorphize God. How could God die for 3 days?
God didn't die; the man Jesus did. That is why Jesus cried My God my God why have you forsaken me? God left Jesus and he gave up the ghost and there was darkness and he died alone for you and for me and all people.
So what was Jesus, 50% God, 50% human? You realize the 100%-100% arguement some Christians use is troublesome. I mean, when Jesus eat and slept, what was he?
Pt.1 You do realize that when you 'say' God's word (the Bible) has been changed, you're calling God a liar don't you? God's promises to protect and keep his Word are all throughout the Bible. Deut.4:2 Psalm 89:34 Prov.30:5-6 Isaiah 40:8 Jeremiah 1:12 Matth.5:18/24:35 Mark 13:31 Luke 21:33. Whenever there's a debate between the quran and the Bible the Bible is always the book in question. The real question is what are you going to to about all of the contradictions and errors in the quran?
Pt.2 If the Bible is not trustworthy then why do Muslims like you and Mohammad keep quoting from it?! You just don't like what it says. So you take a little here and leave a little there. The quran is the corrupted book. Why is it that we trust the translation of Poetry,Mathematics, or any of the Sciences for conveying the meanings of one language to another, but we in our arrogance claim that the God of the Universe and everything else we don't know about can't protect His Word!? I wish Muslims
Like I said earlier, there is some truth in the Bible and some falsehood. I only quote from it to show you some truth, I wouldn't take my law from the Bible b/c of its mixing of truth with falsehood.
@coolguymuslim That isn't true. By stating it is true and it is false what you are doing is deceptive. It mysteriously becomes true when it fits your goals (whatever it may be) and it becomes false once it goes agains't what you believe in. Isn't that hypocritical to pick and choose? Also the koran itself says that the Torah (Bible) is more authoritative then it (check that video I provided earlier it says the sura and verse).
@coolguymuslim The Koran came 600 years after Jesus and claimed to know that Christianity was a lie based on the word of one man only and this man,by his own admission and writings about him,was bewitched and possessed by demons.That should be the end of the story,but sadly it is not.
Pt.3 ...would either take the Bible for what it says or leave it. The Spirit of the God of the Bible and the god of the quran are totally different. The Muslims simply did what many religions have done before and after the Bible. They took certain elements of another Faith and intertwined them into their already existing religion. In pre-islamic Arabia Allah was the Chief Deity of Muhammad's tribe the Quraysh. All he did was get rid of the other gods (idols) his people were worshiping and made
When I say Allah, I mean the Creator of the Heavens and the Earth. the Lord of of me and you and the God that Moses, Jesus and Muhammad all prayed to. If you understand aramic, the word for god would also be what? Allah
Pt.4 ...his family's pagan moon good (Allah) the greatest of all the other pagan idols. That's why they say allahu akbar. Allah is the greatest. Salmon Rushdee wrote about this in his book The Satanic Verses in which Muhammad had a hard time converting his pagan tribe, so he allowed Allah's 3 daughters (Al-Lat, Al-Uzza, and Al-Manat) to be worshiped too! Sura 53:19. Then as always they were mysteriously abrogated. The Archeological evidence of this is overwhelming for anyone who cares to look.
In fact, the Bible, itself, claims to hve changed over time. If you believe EVERY verse of the Bible to be of God's word, then surely, you must believe:
'How can you say, "We are wise for we have the law of the LORD," when actually the lying pen of the scribes has handled it falsely?' (Jeremiah 8:8)
And this verse that I pasted here is obviously one, I couldnt quite get to the hundreds of different editions out there.
BTW, could you tell me which edition is the word of God?
About Jeremiah 8:8 God is telling Jeremiah that the PEN of the scribes has handled falsely, but it didn't change what God told us through Jeremiah the prophet. God spoke to us in the OT through the Prophets, not the scribes. The Talmud is here today because of tradition but we still have the word of God as it came from God through the prophets and Jesus the illustrated edition.
There are 7 editions of the Divine Law as I showed above.
That's exactly the thing! I'm not claiming that God spoke thru the scribes or anything. And I'm not doubting the Prophets lied. What I'm saying is that the Prophets spoke the truth, but when they died and it was the job of the laymen to continue the message of truth, there were scribes involved in passing on the message and over time, the message got distorted!
I'm not looking to justify the Koran thru the Bible. I firmly believe in the Koran just like you firmly believe in the Bible. What I'm saying is that the message of Jesus was true. And some of the followers of Jesus after his death were rightly guided just like the followers of Moses after his time.
However, those who followed Moses but them rejected Jesus (i.e. Jews) were considered misguided after Jesus appears since the law of Moses was abrogated, to a sense. Similiarly, Muhammad came and the true followers of Jesus accepted him as a prophet and the law of Jesus had became abrogated. The message of Jesus was true. With Muhammad, the message of Islam was not the message for mankind. Islam is not preserved for the Arabs, it's for mankind. Less than 20% of Muslims are Arab.
Just fyi, Muslims believe Jesus never died. God saved Jesus before he was put on the cross. Jesus will return before the end of times, break the cross and kill the anti-christ. Muslims don't believe Jesus died for our sins, rather every person is responsible for him or herself and no soul shall bear the burden of another.
Jesus never abrogated the Law of Moses. Matthew 5:17 "Think not that I am come to destroy the Law, or the Prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill." Luke 24:27 Then beginning at Moses and all the Prophets, he (Jesus) expounded unto them in all the Scriptures the things concerning himself. This is what Jews and Muslims still have a problem with. The Jews say the Messiah has not yet come and the Muslims claim Jesus is Messiah, but either ignore or don't understand who the Messiah is.
If you get a chance, please watch two of my other videos, "Jesus the Messiah in Islam" and "Is Jesus the Son of God?" I'd like to get your thoughts on those. It gives you the Islamic perspective of how Jesus was a word of God.
Right, but the different editions differ soo much. If you look at a 7th-day adv. edition, Jeremiah 8:8 is a completely different verse. Which one, according to mainstream christians, conveys what Jesus truly said? Is it the Bible that has the red highlighting?
Right, but it doesn't specify that the current day Bible would remain intact. In fact, may Christians in Arabia during the time of Prophet Muhammad accepted Islam based on the fact that they believed Islam was a continuation of what was to come, not just a new religion. It was the means of how the words of God would continue to stand forever.
It seems to me that we are just going to have to agree to disagree. You believe that Jesus is God and I believe in One God. And I firmly believe that Jesus and Muhammad were Prophets of God and not divine themselves.
The Koran was written decades after the prophet died, from vocal memory of other religious leaders in the peninsula. Only verses remembered by many where written down. That does not proof that those words where the exact words of the prophet or just popular verses passed down from person to person, which may have actually been modified overtime as well. This is true in every religion: Words can bless or damn. Words came from God, period. God gave men the power to bless or damn by the word.
People had written Verses from the Quran here and there, but yes it was compiled after the death after the Prophet died. It was compiled during the caliphate of Abu Bakr who died two years after the Prophet. However, the test to determine whether or not a verse was put in the 'official' quran was whether multiple people had memorized it. But there were numerous people who had memorized the entire Quran to the point that there was no difference of opinion in the text of the Quran
by any of the companions to the point that tajweed (the art and way that the Prophet recited each and every letter was verified). There are different qiraat and ahruf of the Quran, but none that differ or contradict. If you are more interested in this topic, may I suggest the book, "An Introduction to the Sciences of the Quraan" by Abu Ammar Yasir Qadhi.
Then why are there soo many different versions of the Bible? Which one was around 2000 years ago? Is every verse in the Bible absolutely true and correct without any errors? If so, what are your thoughts on Jeremiah 8:8, the verse in the Bible which states the Bible has been changed over time...
Well, it is spelled with the letter kahf in Arabic and the letter 'q' may be closer to that, but I figured I would use alternate spellings incase someone searching for Quran spelled it Koran instead.
You have no desire to know the real truth, because if you did, your conscience will convict you of your sin. You need to study both book and see who is telling the truth. Bible can be proven and Koran can be proven to be faults doctrine period. Jesus came to save, while Mohammed kill many for his god which is Lucifer the Satan himself. This doctrine came from Satan and none other. At the end Jesus wins, all knees shall bow before him and confess he alone is true MESSIAH.
sungmee45 3 months ago
Jesus didn't kill people, Allah thru so call prophet Mohammed killed many. Jesus never married, Mohammed had many wives. Jesus didn't insult, Mohammed insulted many, Jesus didn't own slaves, Mohammed had many slaves doing his dirty work of deception. Jesus said we are created in the image of God, Mohammed says it is a blaspheme, because Allah had no image. Jesus said we are children of God, Mohammed says it is blaspheme because Allah has no children. Wow!..which side you rather be on..Da
sungmee45 3 months ago
Also why would G-D (Blessed Be He) first give His word (the Torah) in front of millions of people (as even the Koran admits), and then replace them with the koran or any other book given to 1 person (supposedly) with no witnesses and only through an angel (Gavriel) (not G-D Himself)? Also in the Torah G-D Himself writes that He will never replace the nation of Israel with another nation, why would G-D then become a hypocrate G-D forbid, according to these other religions?
extazy17 1 year ago
Your talking about the cristian bibles (their are many). Besides that their are many versions of the koran also. The Torah is the same. If you check they all have the same words and letters. Also check this video watch?v=tQxk19XmvTQ Its just a little about the Torah vs. Koran.
extazy17 1 year ago
I wouldnt blame the christians for believing that Jesus was god...I would blame the church and the gibrish rubbish they though...When the church took over during the dark ages they ruined their own book to their vain desires...How could they've done such to something that should mean so much to them, and all of us...How dare they???
Aaisha6095 1 year ago
Islam places life first
Christianity places love first
helpmetony 1 year ago
@helpmetony Islam places God first. Christianity places a prophet first.
gwu2011 7 months ago
@gwu2011 Where do you get your information from?
helpmetony 7 months ago
@gwu2011 Where do you get this conclusion from? The Quran?
helpmetony 7 months ago
Up next:
Star Wars VS. Star Trek: Understanding the Differences
Rationalific 2 years ago
Bible or Qurran .. its just Blah Blah Blag plz get into 2010
Aztian1 2 years ago
It's worth noting at this point I am not trying to convert you to Christianity, and I apologise for taking up so much of the comments' section, but I wanted to explain why I don't think youcan be intellectually honest, read the Bible from back to front, study it, comparing the relevant passages for Christ's person and conclude He didn't think Himself God. You might have some different views on why He was wrong to think that, but there's no real room for suggesting He didn't at least think it.
athlete117 2 years ago
Above all men, we are fools.
athlete117 2 years ago
Christ distinguishes Himself as having intimate knowledge of the Father above and beyond any other natural or supernatural creation; He corrects the Torah; He fulfills all the prophecies expected of the Messiah/Son of God/Lord, and creates the new law to live by and standard for salvation. He did not come just as a prophet, and this is exemplified by His resurrection, and conquering of death for all of those who should believe in Him. If this is not so, then, as Paul says, we are fools.
athlete117 2 years ago
Also, another point here is that the Trinity doesn't detract from the fact Christianity and Judaism is a monotheism. We have the three persons, the Father, Christ and the Holy Spirit but they all share the same essence, and that is what we call God. For instance, 1+1+1 =3 but 1x1x1 = 1. What is the chemical make-up of water and ice? H2O...
athlete117 2 years ago
If you want to say Christ was mistaken, that's your call, but it's inaccurate to claim Christ didn't think Himself Christ. When He was performing His miracles, He spoke with His own authority. He didn't receive the power from the Father, they were Jesus' own miracles. He spoke and they were so, whether He was healing the sick, or driving out demons.
athlete117 2 years ago
and Christ answers: "Iam; and you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the power and coming with the clouds of heaven." He is then persecuted for blasphemy. So, here, in clear declaration, jesus Christ affirms Himself as Lord.
athlete117 2 years ago
If you read the Bible back to front you will realise that Christ refers to earlier prophecies made in the Old Testament to establishHiomself as Lord. Such as when He refers to Himself as "The son of man", he is referring to the vision of Daniel: "and behold with the clouds of heaven there came one like a son of man... And to him was given dominion and glory and Kingdom.
Ww also have Mark's account of His trial in which we have the priest asking Him: Are you the Christ, the Son of the Blessed?
athlete117 2 years ago
yes: the quran was man-made 1400 years ago and the bible was man-made 2000 years old. That is the main difference.
But both books are full of lies and superstition. And they should be banned in order to save minds from their words of hatred.
JegHarEnLillePik 2 years ago
surly having a video tittled the bible vs the koran creates yet another devide between two religions in todays hostile climate towards different religions and the tolerence of them? nice.
zeusosullivan 2 years ago
Pt. 2 But only having the Law means nothing. It's in vain if you do not obey the Law. James 1:22. Barnabas was rejected not because it mentions Muhammad but because it was proven to be a fraud by western scholars for centuries. It's not in your interest as a muslim to quote from Barnabas because it forbids having more than 1 wife while the quran allows 4, it's vocabulary is not 1st century, also allows the eating of pork. So even as a muslim you should see the problems with the book of Barnabas.
jbbshalom1 2 years ago
Ok, so theres quite a bit you posted on several videos so if I miss some key points, remind me, heh.
Ok, so for Gospel of Barnabas, it's just like the rest of the Bible, theres some truth in it and some falsehood. The Gospel of Jesus was 100% true. However, the Bible we have today is completely different and has been changed over time. Even Christians admit, these aren't God's words, rather they have been compiled by John, Luke, Matt, etc...some people we don't even know who they were..
coolguymuslim 2 years ago
Pt.1 I previously posted a very disrespectful comment and wish to apologize. I just read a book called Inside Islam by Reza F. Safa. After reading this book I felt convicted and learned how conterproductive attacks are in searching for the Truth. That said however I still beleive the Bible is more reliable than the Quran. You said Jeremiah 8:8 states the Bible has been changed over time I disagree. Jer. 8:8 is just stating the backslidden state of Isreal. The scribes boasted of having the Law.
jbbshalom1 2 years ago
Apology accepted, thank you for apologizing. But simply by having Jeremiah 8:8, wouldnt that mean parts of the Old Testament have been changed from the original Torah of Moses, wouldn't you agree?
coolguymuslim 2 years ago
I would say that a translation of the Koran those not have the same status as the Arabic. I would say that some Muslims would read the Koran different to day than for a 1000 years ago for instance.
regards Jag.
JaguarOFcomedy 2 years ago
To a certain extent, you're absolutely correct and this shows the importance of learning classical Arabic. Indeed, I'm not an Arab and Arabic is not my mother-tongue, but once I started studying classical Arabic, in all honesty, I was and still am absolutely blown up by the miraclous nature of the Koran. It's definitely true that you don't see the impact when just reading a translation of the meaning of the Koran.
coolguymuslim 2 years ago
Jeremiah 8:8 (King James Version) 8How do ye say, We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us? Lo, certainly in vain made he it; the pen of the scribes is in vain.
IT WAS NOT SAYING THE BIBLE IS CORRUPT ITS WAS SAYING THAT THE MEN OF THERE AGE WAS TRYING TO MAKE THE LAW INTO THERE OWN NOT THAT THE SCRIPTURES WERE CHANGED
BE BLESSED
love4christx77 2 years ago
Comment removed
jbbshalom1 2 years ago 2
Islam claims that Allah is the same God who was revealed in the Bible. . . . then if the Bible and the Qur'an have differing views of God, then Islam's claim is false. Don't forget that Muhammad claimed in Suras 2:87, 29:46, 32:23, 5:44, 6:154, 6:155 that Allah confirmed the Torah (Taurat) and Christian Gospel (Injeel) (Surah 2:87, 5:46, 5:68, 29:46 and 43:63). So, if the Torah and Gospel are correct, all the errors in the Qur'an shown below make the Qur'an false.
love4christx77 2 years ago
Both the Bible and the Koran are good for toilet paper and kindling to start a fire. Both are fairytales that the gullible believe to be true. Fuck Islam, Fuck Christianity and Fuck Judaism!!!
brokensoul70 2 years ago 2
Since the Bible came before the Koran, and since there is every reason to believe that the Bible was kept uncorrupted, Muslim theologians have lots of explaining to do with regard to such contradictions and errors in their Book
love4christx77 2 years ago
I would encourage you to actually read the Quran before you make statements on issues you have no knowledge of.
coolguymuslim 2 years ago
THE Koran IS IN ENGLISH U CAN FIND IT ON THE INTERNET ALSO THERE IS A PASTOR ON TV WHO IS CHALLENGING MUSLIMS TO READ THE BIBLE CUZ HE IS READYING THE KORAN IN ENGLISH YOU CAN GET IT FROM ANY LIBRARY MAN WHY DONT YOU TALK TO ME ARE YOU SCARED CUZ I HAVE MY FACTS STRAIGHT AND YOU DONT PEOPLE DONT BELIEVE HIM PLZ
love4christx77 2 years ago
The original Quran is in Arabic. When it is in English, it is a translation of the meaning of the Quran. Why? B/c whenever you translate something, it is prone to human tendency and error. Therefore, the authentic Quran is only in Arabic. The English Qurans that are available are good and they are the translation of the meaning of the Quran. This is the reason why there are not 30+ different versions of the Quran, like there are of the Bible today. Instead theres only one Quran!
coolguymuslim 2 years ago
I do own a copy of the Bible at home. I haven't read it cover-to-cover, but I have read parts of it. Why don't you read the Red Bible which has the words of Jesus in red? You will see Jesus is preaching true monotheism, not a religion of man-god, God having a son, 3in1, 1in3 or any of this other nonsense.
coolguymuslim 2 years ago
i think what you are doing in the name of your faith is very up front and i think people need to be like this more often, i would argue however that if your debate lies in the diffrence between the two incredibly reliable historical documents you should not be so single minded, i still am confused on why iv seen people & family physically healed in the name of jesus, iv also had in-counter with demons that flee when i rebuke them in his name, does this happen in islam? please reply to me.
zachychan3 2 years ago
Hi Zach,
Thanks for stopping by. Excorism is real and it does exist. Demon possessions do occur and there are exorcisms for them in Islam, like there are in Christianity as well. However, let me tell you why they "work" in the name of Jesus. Obviously, when a demon possess someone, it is an evil creature (there are 'good' versions of demons, let's not call them that, in Islam, we'd refer to them as jinn). However, good jinn tend to do their own thing and stay away from humans.
(cont)
coolguymuslim 2 years ago
Now, when an evil jinn (or demon as we'll refer to them) possess a human, their goal is evil. What's the worst sin that can be committ? The worst sin that can be committed is to worship other than the One True God. Therefore, when a demon is told to exit someone's body in the name of other than the One True God, the demon has succeeded in his goal of having the person he possessed and the people around him committ a grave sin, that of worshipping the creation and not the Creator.
(cont)
coolguymuslim 2 years ago
That is why when someone is 'healed' in the name of Jesus, the demon runs away b/c he accomplished his goal and has nothing further he wants to do.
This isn't to say Jesus is not a great person in Islam. On the contrary, Jesus is beloved in Islam and he is the Messenger of God and we believe in his virgin birth. However, we just don't worship him. Instead, we worship the One True God, the Creator of the Heavens and Earth. Any more questions, please dont hesitate to ask.
Best,
Bilal
coolguymuslim 2 years ago
There are seven editions of God's word.
1.Written on nature (Psalm 119:1)
2.Written on conscience (Romans 2:15)
3.Written ion tablets of stone (Exodus 24:12)
4. Christ the living word (John 1:14)
5.The entire scriptures (Romans 15:4)
6. Written on the heart ( Hebrews 8:10)
7.Christians as living epistles (2 Corinthians 3:2-3)
zaidolga 3 years ago
There's no guarentee here in any of the verses that the true word of God here would remain unchanged by humans. After all, just by simple translation alone, man has managed to use his words in an effort to 'describe' God's word. But when translation of translations are taken (i.e. Aramaeic to Greek to English), human errors have changed this. Does a promise exist from God to preserve his word for the Christians?
(cont)
coolguymuslim 3 years ago
The grass withers, the flower fades: but the word of our God shall stand for ever.( Isaiah 40:8 )
is just one promise that God is the Keeper of his Word to preserve it and keep it pure and holy.
God oversaw and supervised the translaters as they wrote what he said.
zaidolga 3 years ago
What exactly are you implying that the Koran is not changed but the Bible is?
God is no respecter of persons, so why would he make sure the Koran wasn't changed, but he didn't care about the Old and New testaments?
That doesn't sound like God.
zaidolga 3 years ago
The Quran came and abrogated the Bible. People distorted the Bible to suit their needs. Regardless, even now, the Bible doesn't EXPLICITLY mention the trinity anywhere. These ideas of man-god, saint worship, and God having a son are additions to the real message of Jesus.
coolguymuslim 3 years ago
The trinity is a Roman Catholic invention; one I do not adhere to. I believe in the Oneness of God as do many Christians.
God most certainly came to earth as a man which man is the Son of God. To deny this is to accuse God of not being able to do the impossible. Gabriel told Mary when he told her she would have a Son by the Holy Ghost, he said that nothing is impossible with God.
Jesus didn't have a message, HE himself was the message. He was the Word made flesh.
zaidolga 3 years ago
If you reject the trinity but believe in the prophethood of Jesus, then this is exactly what Islam preaches. However, we don't worship Jesus or call him God. We call him the Messiah (see my video, "Jesus the Messiah in Islam"). We believe in the virgin birth as Gabriel gave the glad tidings of a righteous son to Mary. We don't anthropormorphize God. How could God die for 3 days?
coolguymuslim 3 years ago
There are not 3 persons in God. NO trinity.
God didn't die; the man Jesus did. That is why Jesus cried My God my God why have you forsaken me? God left Jesus and he gave up the ghost and there was darkness and he died alone for you and for me and all people.
zaidolga 3 years ago
So what was Jesus, 50% God, 50% human? You realize the 100%-100% arguement some Christians use is troublesome. I mean, when Jesus eat and slept, what was he?
coolguymuslim 3 years ago
Pt.1 You do realize that when you 'say' God's word (the Bible) has been changed, you're calling God a liar don't you? God's promises to protect and keep his Word are all throughout the Bible. Deut.4:2 Psalm 89:34 Prov.30:5-6 Isaiah 40:8 Jeremiah 1:12 Matth.5:18/24:35 Mark 13:31 Luke 21:33. Whenever there's a debate between the quran and the Bible the Bible is always the book in question. The real question is what are you going to to about all of the contradictions and errors in the quran?
jbbshalom1 2 years ago
Pt.2 If the Bible is not trustworthy then why do Muslims like you and Mohammad keep quoting from it?! You just don't like what it says. So you take a little here and leave a little there. The quran is the corrupted book. Why is it that we trust the translation of Poetry,Mathematics, or any of the Sciences for conveying the meanings of one language to another, but we in our arrogance claim that the God of the Universe and everything else we don't know about can't protect His Word!? I wish Muslims
jbbshalom1 2 years ago
Like I said earlier, there is some truth in the Bible and some falsehood. I only quote from it to show you some truth, I wouldn't take my law from the Bible b/c of its mixing of truth with falsehood.
coolguymuslim 2 years ago
@coolguymuslim That isn't true. By stating it is true and it is false what you are doing is deceptive. It mysteriously becomes true when it fits your goals (whatever it may be) and it becomes false once it goes agains't what you believe in. Isn't that hypocritical to pick and choose? Also the koran itself says that the Torah (Bible) is more authoritative then it (check that video I provided earlier it says the sura and verse).
extazy17 1 year ago
@coolguymuslim The Koran came 600 years after Jesus and claimed to know that Christianity was a lie based on the word of one man only and this man,by his own admission and writings about him,was bewitched and possessed by demons.That should be the end of the story,but sadly it is not.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
Pt.3 ...would either take the Bible for what it says or leave it. The Spirit of the God of the Bible and the god of the quran are totally different. The Muslims simply did what many religions have done before and after the Bible. They took certain elements of another Faith and intertwined them into their already existing religion. In pre-islamic Arabia Allah was the Chief Deity of Muhammad's tribe the Quraysh. All he did was get rid of the other gods (idols) his people were worshiping and made
jbbshalom1 2 years ago
When I say Allah, I mean the Creator of the Heavens and the Earth. the Lord of of me and you and the God that Moses, Jesus and Muhammad all prayed to. If you understand aramic, the word for god would also be what? Allah
coolguymuslim 2 years ago
Pt.4 ...his family's pagan moon good (Allah) the greatest of all the other pagan idols. That's why they say allahu akbar. Allah is the greatest. Salmon Rushdee wrote about this in his book The Satanic Verses in which Muhammad had a hard time converting his pagan tribe, so he allowed Allah's 3 daughters (Al-Lat, Al-Uzza, and Al-Manat) to be worshiped too! Sura 53:19. Then as always they were mysteriously abrogated. The Archeological evidence of this is overwhelming for anyone who cares to look.
jbbshalom1 2 years ago
In fact, the Bible, itself, claims to hve changed over time. If you believe EVERY verse of the Bible to be of God's word, then surely, you must believe:
'How can you say, "We are wise for we have the law of the LORD," when actually the lying pen of the scribes has handled it falsely?' (Jeremiah 8:8)
And this verse that I pasted here is obviously one, I couldnt quite get to the hundreds of different editions out there.
BTW, could you tell me which edition is the word of God?
coolguymuslim 3 years ago
About Jeremiah 8:8 God is telling Jeremiah that the PEN of the scribes has handled falsely, but it didn't change what God told us through Jeremiah the prophet. God spoke to us in the OT through the Prophets, not the scribes. The Talmud is here today because of tradition but we still have the word of God as it came from God through the prophets and Jesus the illustrated edition.
There are 7 editions of the Divine Law as I showed above.
zaidolga 3 years ago
That's exactly the thing! I'm not claiming that God spoke thru the scribes or anything. And I'm not doubting the Prophets lied. What I'm saying is that the Prophets spoke the truth, but when they died and it was the job of the laymen to continue the message of truth, there were scribes involved in passing on the message and over time, the message got distorted!
coolguymuslim 3 years ago
I understand your thought, but God is not an idiot who is controlled or lorded over by sinning faltering scribes.
Y\The issue here i you are looking for mistakes in the Bible to justify the Koran.
If God didn't preserve his word for the Hebrews as you imply then why would he preserve it for the Arabs?
Jesus Christ was the illustrated Word of God is the main point of the Bible.
zaidolga 3 years ago
I'm not looking to justify the Koran thru the Bible. I firmly believe in the Koran just like you firmly believe in the Bible. What I'm saying is that the message of Jesus was true. And some of the followers of Jesus after his death were rightly guided just like the followers of Moses after his time.
(cont)
coolguymuslim 3 years ago
(cont)
However, those who followed Moses but them rejected Jesus (i.e. Jews) were considered misguided after Jesus appears since the law of Moses was abrogated, to a sense. Similiarly, Muhammad came and the true followers of Jesus accepted him as a prophet and the law of Jesus had became abrogated. The message of Jesus was true. With Muhammad, the message of Islam was not the message for mankind. Islam is not preserved for the Arabs, it's for mankind. Less than 20% of Muslims are Arab.
coolguymuslim 3 years ago
Israel was expecting a fighting Messiah and not a loving forgiving Savior.
When Jesus came he was executed by the Roman government as prophesied in the Hebrew scriptures.
The Bible says that is the devil had known who Jesus was, he would not have crucified him.
zaidolga 3 years ago
Just fyi, Muslims believe Jesus never died. God saved Jesus before he was put on the cross. Jesus will return before the end of times, break the cross and kill the anti-christ. Muslims don't believe Jesus died for our sins, rather every person is responsible for him or herself and no soul shall bear the burden of another.
coolguymuslim 3 years ago
Jesus never abrogated the Law of Moses. Matthew 5:17 "Think not that I am come to destroy the Law, or the Prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill." Luke 24:27 Then beginning at Moses and all the Prophets, he (Jesus) expounded unto them in all the Scriptures the things concerning himself. This is what Jews and Muslims still have a problem with. The Jews say the Messiah has not yet come and the Muslims claim Jesus is Messiah, but either ignore or don't understand who the Messiah is.
jbbshalom1 2 years ago
Does Messiah mean we worship him? No rather, we follow him, thats whats meant by the Bible. We follow Jesus in his way of true monotheism.
coolguymuslim 2 years ago
'How can you say, "We are wise for we have the law of the LORD," when actually the lying pen of the scribes has handled it falsely?' (Jeremiah 8:8)
The "pen of the scribes" did not come to earth to die for us, but Jesus who was the Word made flesh came.
Jesus was the Word made flesh meaning that all God has to say he said in Christ.
zaidolga 3 years ago
If you get a chance, please watch two of my other videos, "Jesus the Messiah in Islam" and "Is Jesus the Son of God?" I'd like to get your thoughts on those. It gives you the Islamic perspective of how Jesus was a word of God.
coolguymuslim 3 years ago
I will watch them and give you my thoughts coolguymuslim.
zaidolga 3 years ago
coolguymuslim said..."BTW, could you tell me which edition is the word of God?"
They are all editions of the word of God.
Look up the verses I gave you.
Jesus Christ is the illustrated edition because he was the Word (what God said) made flesh.
zaidolga 3 years ago
Right, but the different editions differ soo much. If you look at a 7th-day adv. edition, Jeremiah 8:8 is a completely different verse. Which one, according to mainstream christians, conveys what Jesus truly said? Is it the Bible that has the red highlighting?
coolguymuslim 3 years ago
Regardless of what so called translaters do, it doesn't change who Jesus is. He is the mighty God in Christ.
He is the WORD of God made flesh (man)
zaidolga 3 years ago
Wait, is He God or is He the Word of God?
coolguymuslim 3 years ago
muslims also believe he is God's word (Be!) which became flesh (Isa) inside Maryam.
that's all it is, but i know we will never agree,because we can never make God a man and vice versa, which is typically of pagan origin.
TheCase4Utube 3 years ago
The grass withers, the flower fades: but the word of our God shall stand for ever. (Isaiah 40:8)
is a promise from God that what he says (His Word) will stand, meaning it cannot be thrown down or destroyed, changed or mistranslated.
There are ore but I gave one verse.
zaidolga 3 years ago
Right, but it doesn't specify that the current day Bible would remain intact. In fact, may Christians in Arabia during the time of Prophet Muhammad accepted Islam based on the fact that they believed Islam was a continuation of what was to come, not just a new religion. It was the means of how the words of God would continue to stand forever.
coolguymuslim 3 years ago
What I wish you would understand is that Jesus Christ IS the Bible.
He is the Old Testament made in to man. I am making it as clear as I can.
Everything God had to say he said IN Christ. God was IN Christ reconciling the world to himself. He is the mighty God in Christ.
zaidolga 3 years ago
It seems to me that we are just going to have to agree to disagree. You believe that Jesus is God and I believe in One God. And I firmly believe that Jesus and Muhammad were Prophets of God and not divine themselves.
coolguymuslim 3 years ago
The Koran was written decades after the prophet died, from vocal memory of other religious leaders in the peninsula. Only verses remembered by many where written down. That does not proof that those words where the exact words of the prophet or just popular verses passed down from person to person, which may have actually been modified overtime as well. This is true in every religion: Words can bless or damn. Words came from God, period. God gave men the power to bless or damn by the word.
sotosystems 3 years ago
People had written Verses from the Quran here and there, but yes it was compiled after the death after the Prophet died. It was compiled during the caliphate of Abu Bakr who died two years after the Prophet. However, the test to determine whether or not a verse was put in the 'official' quran was whether multiple people had memorized it. But there were numerous people who had memorized the entire Quran to the point that there was no difference of opinion in the text of the Quran
(cont)
coolguymuslim 3 years ago
(cont)
by any of the companions to the point that tajweed (the art and way that the Prophet recited each and every letter was verified). There are different qiraat and ahruf of the Quran, but none that differ or contradict. If you are more interested in this topic, may I suggest the book, "An Introduction to the Sciences of the Quraan" by Abu Ammar Yasir Qadhi.
coolguymuslim 3 years ago
I'm a Bible student. You are so way off, it is absurd. Collection of books? The Bible is the story of Jesus Christ and him alone.
The gospel is the birth, death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. Every copy of the Bible says this.
This hasn't changed...the story of Jesus Christ.
The Torah was given to Moses 2500 years before Muhammed was even born.
zaidolga 3 years ago
ur a student? come back wen ur finished . i think theres abit more in there after that bit .
minimoo303 3 years ago
Then why are there soo many different versions of the Bible? Which one was around 2000 years ago? Is every verse in the Bible absolutely true and correct without any errors? If so, what are your thoughts on Jeremiah 8:8, the verse in the Bible which states the Bible has been changed over time...
coolguymuslim 3 years ago
The scribes had nothing to do with hearing from the Lord,.
The Hebrew prophets were the ones who heard from God.
IE: Thus saith the Lord...or "the word of the Lord came to me"
Every verse in the Bible is absolutely true because God is not an idiot nor is His Word subject to man's error.
The Bible has not changed over time.
God does not live in time and what he said is with us today just as he gave it.
zaidolga 3 years ago
Well, it is spelled with the letter kahf in Arabic and the letter 'q' may be closer to that, but I figured I would use alternate spellings incase someone searching for Quran spelled it Koran instead.
coolguymuslim 3 years ago
there is not standard spelling right?
Koran
Qur'an
quran
iaremortal 3 years ago
Whoa, your beard is shorter than the last time I saw you.
AhmadL89 3 years ago