FOOD NEWS: Michael Pollan: In Defense Of Food

[Locrian08]

Brilliant: Let's listen to someone who is not a medical doctor, did not study physiology/biochemistry/nutrit­ion, and is not able to conduct a scientific literature review, about whether it's safer to consume concentrated fat from another mammal's milk or to consume a product made of vegetable oil that doesn't contain trans fat and is low in saturated fat. Oh great Pollan please tell us are vaccines safe? Do they cause autism? Should pregnant women take multi-vitamins? What a charlatan!

[ciciliciousnyc]

Hi #UN#, Let's stay in touch with my vlog channel ! Feel free to Subscribe, Like, Comment, and make Favorite to @ciciliciousnyc! <3

[zuhallem]

It appears to me that this is a platform for "want to be eggheads" to spout off about things they know little about. (you know who you are).

Do the right thing and eat only true organic foods and you in turn will likely lead a healthier and probably a longer life.

[veganath]

@zuhallem Organic, yes it can confer health! But only if u don't bastardize the superior nutritional value of it with the use of fire..

[xMusicIsMyPassionx]

Instead of trying to figure out what's wrong with basic food and how we can make it "better", we should be more concerned with getting this mutated crap off our shelves and getting back to what has worked for centuries. Traditional food with a balanced diet, combined with moderate, regular exercise, will always be the way to go. It is, after all, what nature intended. And nature has this uncanny ability of being right.

[HunterMann]

Butter, most is now made from milk that comes from corn fed cows. I think we need to stop our addiction to corn products, especially the genetically modified corn that is the most common now.

[drmiggins]

butter is real food? is it not the mass processed secretion from a cows udder?

[linguinegirl]

@drmiggins Don't be a butter hater, hon - butter is churned cream; it's usually pasteurized, but otherwise unprocessed, with no more than two ingredients, namely pasteurized cream (plus salt, if it's "salted"). These days you can even find homemade butter in some grocery stores.

[HunterMann]

@linguinegirl Most butter is made from cream form cows that are corn fed. Cows cannot process corn. Cow milk, even organic milk(and yes, even the milk in your Ben&Jerry's) comes from a dairy industry that uses obscene amounts of water and is the largest source of methane gas which is doing ozone damage. Less dairy, better planet.

[HunterMann]

@drmiggins Yes, and dairy cows are kept in an altered state so that they keep lactating so they will give milk. It is not natural for a cow to produce milk all year long. We have really screwed up so much of nature.

[shaxincat]

@drmiggins organic, unpasteurized, unhydrogenated butter made by you out of whole organic unpasteurized unhydrogenated milk is real food.

[ArthurDentopolis]

Also there is an entire branch of science, biology, devoted to explaining the alledgedly "far too complex" "LIFE / N ATURE".

[ArthurDentopolis]

Actually there are a lot more tools used by science to study nature. A microscope would not even enter into analyzing something in chemistry as the subjects of study (atoms and molecules) are far to small for even an electron microscope. You seem to have things a bit backwards with regards to what I have said, and quite frankly I have to wonder how much of what I said was actually read by you. If you want to debate then this needs to be moved somewhere with a longer allowed post.

[MindofaJedi]

@ArthurDentopolis Where did you get the idea that chemists don't use microscopes ? Have you ever been to a refining plant ? They employ hundreds of chemists , and along with chromatographs and other tools , they have dozens of microscopes . The study of atoms and molecules too small to be seen with an electron microscope , is called quatum physics . Electron microscopes can however can "see" molecules like hydrocarbons . I take it you have no scientific backround whatsoever .

[ArthurDentopolis]

Quantum physics does not deal with "atoms and molecules too small to be seen with an electron microscope" it studies the component particles of atoms and in turn the component particles of those component particles. Electron microscopes can see some large molecules which includes some, but not all, hydrocarbons so on that note I was somewhat mistaken. The other tools you mention such as chromatographs or mass spectrometers are far more useful for analyzing chemicals than microscopes though.

[ArthurDentopolis]

As to my having or not having a scientific background you are mistaken. I do not yet hold a degree in any scientific field, but I am currently enrolled in a university and am seeking a degree in biology. I took Chemistry 1, AP Chemistry, Biology 1, IB Biology, Physics 101, and Anatomy and Physiology 101 in high school for what it's worth. May I ask just what your credentials relating to science are?

[ArthurDentopolis]

A large portion of the pharmaceutical industry's products show how a useful compound found in nature can be refined so that a person does not have to consume large amounts of the plant it comes from which may have adverse affects in and of itself (try eating large quantities of willow bark the next time you have a headache). Of course there are other problems with big pharma.

[ArthurDentopolis]

It has been replicated laboratories all over the world, and not only has it not been debased or destroyed with regard to human medicinal use it has been improved. By changing it to acetylsalicylic acid instead the medical benefits are maintained and the side effects are reduced.

[greatbydesign33]

As usual. YOU ARE WRONG. And did you say "side effects reduced"? Medicine from nature gives you no ill side effects.

[ArthurDentopolis]

These need to be monitored and test rigourously before being allowed use in foods. To often this has not been done, and sometimes they should not be allowed in foods even if they are deemed safe. As to, "Man can debase and destroy it, but man can not replicate it.", if you are talking about chemical compounds found in nature this is plainly wrong. For example, salicylic acid, the active ingredient in aspirin, is found naturally in willow bark.

[greatbydesign33]

@ ArthurDentopolis. You try to sound intelligent but you are steeped in ignorance. If your paradigm is based on what a scientist can see under a microscope, and your knowledge stops at chemical compounds and compositions, dry statistics and empirical data -SADLY, you have already failed at understanding what food is. And you are too small minded to see that LIFE / NATURE is far too complex to be relegated under a microscope. And you think you have the answers. You have a lot of growing up to do.

[ArthurDentopolis]

I concluded this as butter is full of saturated fat and also contains more fat per serving. Despite that neither one should be consumed in excess and plain vegetable oil is probably bettter than both. Finally, I am not advocating making food in testubes. I have yet to see or hear of a loaf of bread being made in a test tube and do not think anyone is working on this. What they do make in labs are food additives and preservatives.

[greatbydesign33]

OMG - did you just say "vegetable oil" is better than butter? I hope people are too intelligent to listen to your stupidity. The Omega 6 ratio in vegetable oil alone is enough reason not to touch it. Not to mention the hydrogenation. ... Tell you what ArthurDentopolis - why don't you go eat all the margarine and crap you want, and let the rest of us eat healthy.

[ArthurDentopolis]

Instead it contains primarily polyunsaturated and monounsaturated fats with the low naturally occuring levels of trans fats. Next, if you are going to say that margarine causes all of those things I would like to see the peer reviewed articles which reflect such. That is however somewhat irrelevant as what I was arguing for was not that margarine is healthy in and of itself, but rather that when compared to consuming the same amount of butter a person would be better off with margarine.

[greatbydesign33]

LIAR

[veganath]

Real food disappeared the day we started using fire to destroy it!! Raw food is the only real food, the consensus reached by every other species on the planet (except humans)!!

[hinesdawg18]

@veganath That's because every other species lacks the advanced brain physiology to even comprehend such capability. I am not an expert, but please don't act like pigs have the capability to engineer nutrition but make an intelligent choice to eat organically. They also eat, sleep, and live in their own feces, should we do that as well? Think before you make an argument like that.

[veganath]

@hinesdawg18 Interestingly we are selective in our admission to being similiar to other species of animals, I would assume from ur comment that u are not in agreement with the use of animals for medical research since we are so so different that the resultant derived data would be irrelevent to human pysiology & psychology?

[veganath]

You sighted pigs, did u know that pigs are considered the best species for xenotransplantation because pig organs are similar in size & physiology to human organs and pig insulin has been shown to work effectively in humans? So which is it, we so much are like other animals to the point of volunteering them for horrendous medical experiments with no consideration for their welfare or we aren't the same & by inference we should use fire to destroy the nutritional qualities of the food we eat??

[hinesdawg18]

@veganath You totally convoluted my comments into a different theory to support your argument. Thats called a false premise. I simply stated that their BRAIN physiology is different. As far as testing on animals I have no problem with that. Their DNA structure is similar enough to get viable results.

[hinesdawg18]

@veganath You totally convoluted my comments into a different theory to support your argument. Thats called a false premise. I simply stated that their BRAIN physiology is different. As far as testing on animals I have no problem with that. Their DNA structure is similar enough to get viable results. I bet you are one of those people who talks to your dog like they really comprehend the english language.

[hinesdawg18]

@veganath I'm not trying to be mean spirited but people have to stop personifying animals like this is some kind of George Orwell novel. There are so many more human issues that could benefit from the passion and commmitment shown here. I feel like some people llive in a bubble in some safe little community and are oblivious to the real issues of humanity. Disease, war, terrorism, government corruption, constitutional bastardization. And we have people protesting for animals. Seriously.

[veganath]

@hinesdawg18 Veganism would actually solve ALL of the human issues u feel need preferential attention. The underlying cause of most disease is that humans are out of balance with the natural order of life. For example coronary heart disease, osteoporosis, cancers, diabetes,etc are attributable to meat/dairy consumption. As for war/terrorism, we claim to abhor the escalation of violence in our world yet don't make an effort to minimize the unnecessary violence in our personal lives. Love ALL life

[SaraVittelli]

This guy is AMAZING!!! lol.. im serious

[MindofaJedi]

Pesticides , flouride in water , and antibiotic saturated meats are killing us all slowly . The butter that our granparents ate is different than our butter made from Growth Hormone injected grain fed cattle . It was much healthier 50 years ago . Margarine is more similar to tuperware than food .

[greatbydesign33]

@MindofaJedi TRUE. very TRUE.

[Inness54]

See Locavore Commercial Take on You Tube; it's the real deal!

[menderfire9]

Good video. We should eat food, not edible chemistry sets. But don't you think that the whole mess really begins in the early 1930's with the Swift and Hunt insanity replacing lard with hydrogenated Crisco and Spry that they capitalized off the backs of promoting it to Jews who were open game because of their resistance to lard (from the pig). Anyway do your study regarding Crisco and Spry or whatever it is called today..... Eat less oil of any kind. Get your fat from eating a WHOLE food.

[adorejunk]

yes like VIRGIN COCONUT OIL, just make sure it is unrefined and smells faintly like coconut. Absolutely delish and it is a good sat fat, great for frying and better than butter on toast. try it. Plus it helps the people in the tropical countries earn a living, and is vegan. WIN WIN WIN

[menderfire9]

I am a total freak for COCONUT OIL. I lived in the West Indies in the '80's and 90's and the Rastas made it. We used it for everything, cleaning our skin as well as eating. It stays liquid at 78degrees so it never hardens in your arteries. BE

[menderfire9]

BE totally sure that you buy COLD PRESSED organic coconut oil because the "expelier pressed" coconut oil has been destroyed of it's enzimes and other good healing qualities because the process causes a destructive amount of HEAT in the making. You want to have z-best which costs about $10. for 16 ounces (and if you aren't into frying y foods but use a spoon of it every day as you should it should last you 30 days (just a dumb guess)

Anyway, get healthy everyone!

Respect

[greatbydesign33]

get the RAW ORGANIC kind.

[tattypatty]

Liked his book. I wish he would have covered the other side though: The idiots who keep promoting 'super foods' Like acai and goji at 30 bucks a bottle,,,,

[markjhf]

It may be a problem, that people promote acai and goji as some miracle food, but come on. It's hardly some oppressive industry that's got society in a choke hold, killing us slowly. You got to pick your battles, so having the book try and cover every issue that can possibly exist in the food industry is just silly. I think he did a fantastic job with In Defense Of Food. You want a book about the overpriced super-foods, then buy that book (u can write it), don't complain about this one though.

[524ej]

How much research has Michael Pollan done to become an expert on this subject? He is a writer who makes his living selling stories.

[maynardhs79]

All the research in the world is no good if you can't tell the story so that people are willing to listen.

[killwhitey88d]

you need to read the book that started in defense of food, thats where his research is. Ominvores Delimma

[russttu]

Eat butter? That's Pollan's solution? i wonder if his solution to eat butter is in any way derived from his hugely anti-corporate ideology?

It amazes me that a Professor of Journalism has the gall to portray himself as a food expert and suggest that butter is better for people than modern margarine.

In the face of countless studies, he suggests that cholesterol laced butter is healthier for you than omega-3 zero trans fat margarine.

[lrbrose]

maybe you should look up what cholesterol actually does, outside of the "corporate diet dictocrats" say. Margarine is highly processed, trans fat or not. Ever heard of Weston A. Price?

[nubbs]

had you before you read omnivore's dilemma? non hydrogenated margarine is healthier than a stick of cow fat you call butter.

[slavantiquity]

But people have eaten butten for centuries, so I guess it can't be that bad. Maybe you should take life and the world as it is, it's never perfect. People are screwing up their lives by taking it too seriously and the current nutritionist mass hysteria is an example of it.

[skeletonmom]

Moderation is the key for everything. Butter is not a food group, but a flavor enhancer like spices. Most people eat butter like food-in large quantities. Would you eat huge gobs of pepper? No, because it is a CONDIMENT. But, I see people having the same problem with mayonnaise, ketchup, salt and sugar. That is one of many reasons why society is having problems with obesity, high blood sugar, diabetes, etc.

[awesome220]

you don't know what you are talking about

[2hotinaz]

So, you prefer eating chemicals rather than real foods? That's the mindset that is causing so many problems in our food system.

[2hotinaz]

This was addressed to russttu, who is promoting margarines.

[memacnoca]

my husband is a huge fan of this man. He wants us to start to follow his books. Are you finding with your condition (I looked at your profile) that eating the chemically manufactured food makes you feel worse? And did you see Dr Oz two days ago and Oprah yesterday with Michel Pollan?

And I to love youtube

[ArthurDentopolis]

@2hotinaz

Eating foods versus eating chemicals is a false dichotomy. The fact of the matter is that foods "organic" or not are chemical in composition. That is to say that things like glucose, starch, and fat are all chemicals in addition to things which most critics of processed foods call chemicals.

[2hotinaz]

@ArthurDentopolis: While this is true, there are some (many) chemicals that do NOT belong in the human body. They might be toxic, or simply not able to be processed by our digestive systems. The argument here is for eating actual food, not processed chemicals disguised as food. I'm 65, have eaten ONLY butter rather than margarine my entire adult life, and my cholesterol counts, etc. are extremely good for my age. I do believe in eating 'whole' foods always.

[ArthurDentopolis]

I would not argue that all chemicals be allowed into the body. My issue is that people will point at a food additive and say that it is bad simply on the basis of being a chemical rather than stating the pertinent deleterious health effects. I also thing there are many things (margarine among them) that get a bad rap simply because they are relatively speaking new (compared to something like wheat or rice).

[ArthurDentopolis]

The problem with this approach is that all the species plant and animal that have been domesticated have been significantly altered to better meet the wants of humans through artficial selection. Therefore while the chemicals found in a banana, a tomato, or the milk of a cow are the probably the same as those that were present in their non-domesticated ancestors the proportions are quite likely different.

[ArthurDentopolis]

As to butter v. margarine, the point is not whether or not a person can live to a old age and still be healthy consuming one over the other, but rather whether or not people consuming one over the other tend to be healthier as a whole. This remains to be seen as margarine has for most of its existence been of a different nature than what is the norm today. It was hydrogenated which added trans fat which has been shown to be in fact worse than saturated fat.

[ArthurDentopolis]

Margarine has since improved, and it of course still has the benefit of not containing cholestorol. Ultimately though my judgment on the matter is that a person should not be consuming very much of either butter or margarine, but if you have to margarine is probably better.

[greatbydesign33]

@ArthurDentopolis - You are a complete IDIOT who knows NOTHING about health or nutrition. NOTHING. You should keep your bad advice to yourself.

[ArthurDentopolis]

Ad hominem much? First, I did not say that hydrogenation was healthy. You are right that hydrogenation is done to further the profits of the food companies rather than health, but I did not disagree with that in my previous posts. I said that the hydrogenation that all margarine used to undergo added saturated and trans fat which I clearly stated as being a negative with regard to a person's health. Today there is margarine availible that is not hydrogenated.

[greatbydesign33]

@ArthurDentopolis - You really are a dummy aren't you? Margarine gets a bad rap? Are you JOKING? The real reason why food companies use hydrogenated oils has everything to do with profits and nothing to do with your health. Margarine causes cancer, birth defects, heart disease, diabetes, liver disease and much more. Margarine alters the structure and flexibility of cell membranes throughout your body, causing cell-by-cell disintegration of your health.

[greatbydesign33]

@ArthurDentopolis - The key difference is chemicals from nature vs. chemicals from a lab. To say that food is chemicals in the context you are trying to construe or misconstrue is not logical, ethical or moral because you are negating the fact that food from nature involves millions of years of evolution which modern man can not duplicate in a lab.

Man can debase and destroy it, but man can not replicate it. How dare you try to compare food from a lab with food from nature. How dare you!

[MindofaJedi]

@ArthurDentopolis , Incorrect, fat , glucose and starch are not chemicals under any definition of the word . Chemical implies manmade , a substance created through chemistry . RBGH is a chemical , aspartame is a chemical (originally used as ant poison ) . Red #5 is a chemical . Organic usually refers to no sythetic pesticides or chemical ripening agents or in meat , that the animals are not injected with hormones . Apples , carrots , beef - these are also NOT chemicals .

[theTRUTHprincess]

nice vid!

are you familiar with NaturalNews? it has amazing info on food and nutrients. it sheds a truthful light on a wicked FDA and polluted system in cotrol of our food.

another great resource is:

HONESTFOODGUIDE,org

[AdamsSeed]

My physical health has been compromised and I want it back. Sadly I know little about how to cultivate mother earth. Is there a good source for simple gardening?

[cookingupastory]

There are many sites/channels, I'm sure, here on youtube that would help you out. The first 2 that come to mind are GardenGirltv and ibwhite. Or, put in some keywords and explore. Visit a library. Lots of books on starting a garden. Growing your own food - if you can - is a great experience. I highly recommend it!

[Jitpring]

@AdamsSeed Did you ever find the source you were seeking? And has your health improved?

[SuperRegisteredUser]

@AdamsSeed What a nice way of saying you're a fat fuck. I'll remember that the next time I speak to fat people, or "locomotively impaired" people.

[SBARTSTV]

organic parkay

[zomar]

Earth Balance. It's like butter, only not bad for you.

[dma1106]

Omnivore's Dilemma, is one of the most important books of our time.

Eat food mostly plants, not too much...is the way:)

[2Halifaxion2]

google weston price foundation

[slavantiquity]

Agreed. It's sad how low we sank that now we have to debate and try to make people eat normal food again... Even food hasn't been spared from this world in which we are the tool of the politicians and corporations who rule by controlling our minds. Sick modern shit.

[evilhenny2000]

I grew up in tunisia a third world country and poor poeple were not obese like here , because it was the inverse if you were poor in my country you ate dishes made out of vegetables lots of it and small pieces of meat. and they taste so good. When i try to make them here it costs so much more then just eating processed :( sad

[cookingupastory]

Last year I had many vegetables freshly picked from a friends garden. They were so good. This year, bit by bit, I am beginning to grow my own.

And I agree with you, evilhenny2000, sad that it is much less expensive (in this country, at least) to eat processed foods than fresh fruit and veggies.

[Riko1980]

i plan to grow my own vegtables someday , hopefully sooner than later, if i had my own way i'd have my own goat or cow and milk it but lol not going to make a farm in my back garden anytime soon (sigh).

[cookingupastory]

If you can, when you're able to start planting, consider some chickens. Fresh eggs and lots of great manure for composting. Just a thought!

[fantasysports6]

i've had to read/write about pollan - it's repetitive and pointless

[z900030]

BULL BULL AND MORE BULL Im moving to Mexico if is not too late! or Europe parle frances?

[nicanicabad]

Oh this one is fantastic too!! Thanks so much for this series!

[cookingupastory]

Thanks, nicanicabad! 2 more parts to be posted! If you have a chance to hear him, go! There is more to his talk than I am posting here on YT and I found it all very interesting. He has learned so much in his research and explains it so well.

[nicanicabad]

I LOVE your channel!

I'm in the 'zone' at the moment. I'm 48, and in trianing and losing.

[WaltersMama]

I love butter! defend butter!

eat real food!

[nicanicabad]

Butter is my number one food, period.

[cookingupastory]

I grew up with margerine, but as soon as I was on my own, it was real butter!

[mrktwn]

I remember my mother saying when we were children, "only eat things that rot and eat them before they do" Words to live by. Thanks mom.

[henname]

lol excellent rule

[cw505]

i told my "u.s. politics" instructor what i was doin my final paper on(why americans eat garbage and wonder why they are fat) and he just wrote down "in defense of food" and told me to write a report on it. i have always explained briefly to people: "if you can't pronounce it then DON'T EAT IT!!"

[cookingupastory]

Always a good one to go by, cw505.

[formerfatguyblog]

Rebecca, thank you for the video. I'm just reading Michael's book right now. Nice to hear an interview with him

[sunnysavage]

awesome video Rebecca!

*yey...keep up the great work. aren't we lucky!

lotsa love, ~sunny

[WeeMiniMoose]

"Food like substance"! Haha! I love that term, because that's exactly what I Can't Believe It's Not Butter, and what seems the vast majority of our diets contain.

[henname]

fascinating, can't wait for the rest!

[dmccoig]

Very cool, I like the injection of her husband into the story. I also learned a great deal about the government's role in food labeling.

Thanks much for an interesting glimpse.

(I normally only read books on history and railroads. oh and the civil war, but I'll check out Michael's book.)

[cookingupastory]

It's been amazing to learn of the governments role in how our food has been produced over the past 40+ years. Reading his books has been quite educational. You might want to check out 'Omnivore's Dilemma'...it has history, food history.

[ochagirl]

Butter is a milk product, even though you shouldn't eat gobs of it. Butter is just the fatty portion of milk, sometimes with salt added.

I'll put olive oil, where I can, on my potatoes, not margarine, since margarine just melts into oil anyways.

While I try to eat healthier, the organic, vegetarian (I'm not a veg, btw) microwavable meals by Amy's are processed and processed even more in the microwave. Cooking stuff isn't "evil", but people need to start incorporating raw veg into their diets.

[cookingupastory]

I discovered I like raw vegetables. Not everyday (yet), but on occasion. And this is a big step up because every vegetable I ate was cooked in some way, except for those carrot sticks in my lunch. You know, broccoli has such a different flavor in its natural raw state, and it's good!

[bursasiua]

raw food, vegetable or animal, is very difficult to digest and you get almost no nutrients from it (very bad for children and teenagers... an other fact is all vegetarians are lame

[cw505]

kinda agree with the latter. gotta have a fat, juicy steak every now and then. however, eating raw vegatables is way good for your digestive track and you DO absorb all kinds of nutrients.

[Mousse4200]

lol, yay meat!

[magnoid]

yeah, looking forward to the subsequent parts :)

[eltearpdx]

LOVE IT -

"Eat Food, Not Too Much, Mostly Plants" is now posted on my fridge.

[gabriellesunheart]

My only beef with this video is that Debras kids favorite food is white bread. And how did they get the white bread in the first place... the parents. My kids eat only whole grain and preferably sprouted grain breads. And they taste much better and are alot better for you. I just do not get white bread in the first place!

[dionysusstar]

I think part of the point of the video is that what one person thinks is healthy at one point in time is often found to be not healthy and vice versa. Bread of a variety of forms has been around for a very long time. I think the enriched sugar that is in most breads is not good...but white bread or whole grain bread can be real food and should be eaten...as in most things, in moderation. We should make sure our bread is made from real foods and preferably bake it ourselves.

[gabriellesunheart]

White bread is not real food. It just is not. Sorry I am not going to back down on that. In most european history the only people that ate white bread were the royalty because it was so hard to refine it.

[gabriellesunheart]

But now adays you see just any kid eating white bread ...all the time. And we wonder why obesity is such an issue. If you ask me anything that is refined is not a real food. It is altered dramatically. Do not kid yourself! White bread, white sugar, white rice... it is all mechanically altered. Yuk!

[magnoid]

It's kind of funny, white bread, and white rice for that matter, where introduced after industrialization when the refining process was more efficient/inexpensive. Consequently there were pandemics of malnutrition, so the government mandated nutrient enrichment in common foods. This makes sense... remove the nutritious part of a grain (bran, germ, etc), then add something back to replace it. Why not just keep the grain whole in the first place?

[gabriellesunheart]

Exactly its not about health...our current governement wants fat unhealthy people to sell drugs too. It is a shame!

[gabriellesunheart]

Loved it as always... you left me wanting more!

XOXO

[thegasworks]

Great video!

[dionysusstar]

lol@ tofu bacon! Awesome video...I had no idea about the laws that were repealed for imitation labeling. I think our food information should be easily understood and transparent. Our government should not be at the whim of big business...it should have the best interest of it's citizens in mind, not profits for someone else.

[cookingupastory]

I remember when the word 'imitation' was used. Then it disappeared. I never wondered why! Oh, what goes on behind closed doors! I agree with you, dionysusstar.