If one starts a conversation about health care reform, by stating that one does want health care reform, what good is having a conversation that person? When we say dialog we mean dialog with people Liberal or Conservative people who want to solve problems. Not people who just say: No.
@ lmcdowall "When we say dialog we mean dialog with people Liberal or Conservative people who want to solve problems. Not people who just say: No." If you want to build consensus, then build it. That involves talking with people regarding their concerns. If you don't want to build consensus, then don't build it; but don't *say* you are when you are not.
The health care debate is kinda like the Iraq war debate. If you disagree with the conservative point of view you are un- American...Look where that kind of thinking got us.... If a house is on fire you need to put out the fire. Is it debatalbe whether or not it is in the best interest of the house owner to put out the fire? Would you evan listen to that argument that some how the house should be allowed to burn? Of course not and thats the point.
These Tea Party types are rallting around people and ideas that do not help their interest or the interest of the nation as a whole because they are so terribly misinformed. It's like I said take alook at those two Frontline videos. We need to fix health care now. People who are against it are to be honest, useless. We need to fight to get the cost under control evan after this reform passes.
I can't think of a exceptable reason to be against health reform. It is in the best interest of the country. These Tea Party people all seem to think Obama is the dark overlord and health care is nothing more then a way to provide reparations or it's socialism. They know it's socialism because Glenn Beck went down to his local library and looked it up.You don't see the irony in that??? The local library is socialist in of it self it's for the common good and we all pay for it.
"I can't think of a exceptable reason to be against health reform." How can you consider yourself to in dialog with other people when you make these kinds of statements? This is exactly what I'm talking about. We need to give the other side the benefit of the doubt and be as charitable as possible. We need to work twice as hard to understand as we do to be understood. Otherwise, we just end up with polarized camps and very little gets done. If you honestly want change, help it to happen.
@MikeSarno Why should I try to understand the unreasonable. I'm not trying to have dialog so I can hear my own voice. I want to have dialog with people that understand the problem. If I was on a boat and it was taking on water and the Captain says :turn on the pumps! But one guy thinks it's a bad idea to turn on the pumps. Are you really going to start a dialog with that guy?
@ lmcdowall "Captain says :turn on the pumps! But one guy thinks it's a bad idea to turn on the pumps. Are you really going to start a dialog with that guy?" Even though the analogy presumes a chain of command which we don't have, and a previously encountered emergency for which a system has been developed and put into place, a good captain would probably want to know what the man's concerns are. There could be any number of reasons to NOT turn on those pumps at this time.
"You are wrong. These Tea baggers don't know wtf they are talking about, period." When you write comments like this, I get the feeling that you don't want dialog.
@MikeSarno I have said everything there is to be said. I have given different examples and explained it different ways. We just do not agree. And in my opinion you are wrong. That in no way means I never wanted to talk about it. What is does mean is that we discussed it at lenth and I determined that your point of view is wrong. As is my right. We both can't be right and I'm sure you support your point of view but I support mine as well.
@MikeSarno I do not want to argue with the captain about if we should turn the pumps on or not. The ship is going down and now it's time to act. Those who do not act will be saved from a watery death by those who had the guts to say : you are wrong turn on the dam pumps.
@MikeSarno Anyway I do not represent the entire Coffee Party. You can say I'm helping to polarize the country if you want but our country is on the brink and the Republicans just want us to crash and burn so they can say : see, I told Obama was no good. The fact is we need reform. It is not an opinion. The only real question is how do we reform. The Tea Party never wanted to talk about reform, they ruined the debate.
This is how it seems to me. If you do not have health care insurance then you need it,period. If you are protesting against health care reform and you don't have health care you are going against your best interest. It is not debatable. All those people with inadequate insurance/uninsured are a drain on the system. If you are blue collar and you do not have proper insurance and you get badly hurt, you are finished. You credit is gone you will take huge loses financially.
@MikeSarno You seem to being saying that, what I consider to me the interest of a person and what that person would consider to be in their interest are two different things. I could be wrong but it seems you are making that case. And what I am saying is that many people have a sckewed idea of what is in their best interest. I see people being terrified into being against health care reform.
The speaker doesn't have to suspend their opinions in order to listen to the opinions of others. I see his view that they are acting against their own interests as an admission that he has an opinion, not that the other guys opinion doesn't matter.
Firefighters do often make the call as to weather to put the fire out or let it burn itself out and so far the tea party seems to agree that there is a fire but they have yet to suggest a course of action other than to use less water.
Universal health care is not so much the issue, as is the polarized thinking that is being directed towards it. It is not the burdening crush of the cost of administering universal health care, but the method by which financial reimbursement is meted out not only to the health care practitioners but also the method by which it is established by the health care insurance providers. It needs as you say open minds, not opposing forces.
Excellent video MikeSarno. Thank you!
coffeepartyusa 1 year ago
If one starts a conversation about health care reform, by stating that one does want health care reform, what good is having a conversation that person? When we say dialog we mean dialog with people Liberal or Conservative people who want to solve problems. Not people who just say: No.
lmcdowall 1 year ago
@ lmcdowall "When we say dialog we mean dialog with people Liberal or Conservative people who want to solve problems. Not people who just say: No." If you want to build consensus, then build it. That involves talking with people regarding their concerns. If you don't want to build consensus, then don't build it; but don't *say* you are when you are not.
MikeSarno 1 year ago
The health care debate is kinda like the Iraq war debate. If you disagree with the conservative point of view you are un- American...Look where that kind of thinking got us.... If a house is on fire you need to put out the fire. Is it debatalbe whether or not it is in the best interest of the house owner to put out the fire? Would you evan listen to that argument that some how the house should be allowed to burn? Of course not and thats the point.
lmcdowall 1 year ago
These Tea Party types are rallting around people and ideas that do not help their interest or the interest of the nation as a whole because they are so terribly misinformed. It's like I said take alook at those two Frontline videos. We need to fix health care now. People who are against it are to be honest, useless. We need to fight to get the cost under control evan after this reform passes.
lmcdowall 1 year ago
@lmcdowall People who are against it are to be honest, are useless. We need to fight to get the cost under control evan after this reform passes.**
lmcdowall 1 year ago
I can't think of a exceptable reason to be against health reform. It is in the best interest of the country. These Tea Party people all seem to think Obama is the dark overlord and health care is nothing more then a way to provide reparations or it's socialism. They know it's socialism because Glenn Beck went down to his local library and looked it up.You don't see the irony in that??? The local library is socialist in of it self it's for the common good and we all pay for it.
lmcdowall 1 year ago
"I can't think of a exceptable reason to be against health reform." How can you consider yourself to in dialog with other people when you make these kinds of statements? This is exactly what I'm talking about. We need to give the other side the benefit of the doubt and be as charitable as possible. We need to work twice as hard to understand as we do to be understood. Otherwise, we just end up with polarized camps and very little gets done. If you honestly want change, help it to happen.
MikeSarno 1 year ago
@MikeSarno Why should I try to understand the unreasonable. I'm not trying to have dialog so I can hear my own voice. I want to have dialog with people that understand the problem. If I was on a boat and it was taking on water and the Captain says :turn on the pumps! But one guy thinks it's a bad idea to turn on the pumps. Are you really going to start a dialog with that guy?
lmcdowall 1 year ago
@ lmcdowall "Captain says :turn on the pumps! But one guy thinks it's a bad idea to turn on the pumps. Are you really going to start a dialog with that guy?" Even though the analogy presumes a chain of command which we don't have, and a previously encountered emergency for which a system has been developed and put into place, a good captain would probably want to know what the man's concerns are. There could be any number of reasons to NOT turn on those pumps at this time.
MikeSarno 1 year ago
You are wrong. These Tea baggers don't know wtf they are talking about, period.
lmcdowall 1 year ago
"You are wrong. These Tea baggers don't know wtf they are talking about, period." When you write comments like this, I get the feeling that you don't want dialog.
MikeSarno 1 year ago
@MikeSarno I have said everything there is to be said. I have given different examples and explained it different ways. We just do not agree. And in my opinion you are wrong. That in no way means I never wanted to talk about it. What is does mean is that we discussed it at lenth and I determined that your point of view is wrong. As is my right. We both can't be right and I'm sure you support your point of view but I support mine as well.
lmcdowall 1 year ago
@MikeSarno I do not want to argue with the captain about if we should turn the pumps on or not. The ship is going down and now it's time to act. Those who do not act will be saved from a watery death by those who had the guts to say : you are wrong turn on the dam pumps.
lmcdowall 1 year ago
@MikeSarno Anyway I do not represent the entire Coffee Party. You can say I'm helping to polarize the country if you want but our country is on the brink and the Republicans just want us to crash and burn so they can say : see, I told Obama was no good. The fact is we need reform. It is not an opinion. The only real question is how do we reform. The Tea Party never wanted to talk about reform, they ruined the debate.
lmcdowall 1 year ago
This is how it seems to me. If you do not have health care insurance then you need it,period. If you are protesting against health care reform and you don't have health care you are going against your best interest. It is not debatable. All those people with inadequate insurance/uninsured are a drain on the system. If you are blue collar and you do not have proper insurance and you get badly hurt, you are finished. You credit is gone you will take huge loses financially.
lmcdowall 1 year ago
Fair enough. You certainly can see it that way. What I see is different.
lmcdowall 1 year ago
@ lmcdowall And what is it you see? Please, help me to understand.
MikeSarno 1 year ago
@MikeSarno You seem to being saying that, what I consider to me the interest of a person and what that person would consider to be in their interest are two different things. I could be wrong but it seems you are making that case. And what I am saying is that many people have a sckewed idea of what is in their best interest. I see people being terrified into being against health care reform.
lmcdowall 1 year ago
The speaker doesn't have to suspend their opinions in order to listen to the opinions of others. I see his view that they are acting against their own interests as an admission that he has an opinion, not that the other guys opinion doesn't matter.
Firefighters do often make the call as to weather to put the fire out or let it burn itself out and so far the tea party seems to agree that there is a fire but they have yet to suggest a course of action other than to use less water.
smg1one 1 year ago
@smg1one The house will be ash by the time they deside to act.
lmcdowall 1 year ago
Universal health care is not so much the issue, as is the polarized thinking that is being directed towards it. It is not the burdening crush of the cost of administering universal health care, but the method by which financial reimbursement is meted out not only to the health care practitioners but also the method by which it is established by the health care insurance providers. It needs as you say open minds, not opposing forces.
MrVisions 1 year ago