Chiropractor Abuse Stroke Legislation

[LUVMETA]

Stroke happens be aide the patient is already at risk of having one. Im careful with my clients If they have risk factors for it. diabetes, smokers, heart disease.... It's the same thing if u go to an hair dresser and turning your head from side to side that can cause it too... Do more researching. Chiros that cause it trigger.

[hiodr]

more medical anti-chiropractic propaganda. of course, what do you expect when every two minutes they interrupt the program for a few more dope ads.

[drsoandso]

@hiodr so... simply requiring that chiropractors have their malpractice claims be reportable to the public the same way MD/Do's do is somehow "anti-chiropractic propaganda"?

Seriously?

I would think that if half the claims made here about how safe manipulation is, that you would welcome such a level playing field as one more way to prove your position on the matter. Why is there even a question about doing this? Why wasnt it done a long time ago?

[hiodr]

@drsoandso who do you think you're kidding? medical people get away with destroying lives all the time and it's just routine. let them clean up their own stinking act. (as if they were actually interested in the public good.)

[drsoandso]

@hiodr is that some kind of answer to the question I was asking or are you just ranting?

Is that your reasoning for not having malpractice claims against chiropractors reportable to the general public?

Seriously... thats your position?

And you wonder why chiropractic has remained on the lunatic fringe for over a century... sad...

[hiodr]

@drsoandso i'll tell you about the lunatic fringe. a freaking medical doctor's patient had a stroke during surgery and died. he put "chiropractic stroke" as the cause of death. he and his assistant thought it was funny. i heard about it from his dentist friend. lying bastards. but then their whole "profession" of pushing drugs on already sick people is pretty much just one big lie, isn't it?

[drsoandso]

@hiodr so is that your reasoning for not wanting malpractice claims against chiropractors reportable to the public... Im still confused... is that your reasoning or just your ranting?

You heard about something some surgeon supposedly did from a dentist friend so the medical profession just one big lie... follows the usual chiropractic reasoning I guess, but still, I would thing you might at least make the pretense of offering a rational argument to support your apparent opposition. Just saying.

[chiropractic47]

@drsoandso Medicine has been on the verge of lunacy since parmaeutical companies began writing the curricula in medical schools and padding the palms of MD's. The chiropractic witch hunt serves as a convienient distraction for Medical Madness.

[jersey1969krw]

why is it that other practitioners that perform the same cervical manipulation aren't under attack. the notion it's because chiropractors do it the most is nonsense. the procedure is said to be dangerous although very rare. currently some M.D.'s and P.T.'s perform high velocity low amplitude cervical manipulation just like chiropractors. i encourage people to read a recent danish study showing the connection between taking NSAIDs and stroke in healthy people.

[Cael551]

@jersey1969krw

The answer is simple, GP/MD dont have a monopoly on health care anymore and they are upset and being unable to establish any actual DIRECT casual link between chiropractic and stroke have taken to fear mungering and word of mouth.

[chiropractic47]

@Cael551 You hit the nail on the head....Big Medicine and Pharma are behind the chiropractic witch hunt.

[wbfree]

Proper upper cervical care would eliminate even the small chance of stroke that may be present. They don't move your neck only your atlas and nothing else and only if it needs it...not just when you walk in their office and they give you an adjustment. Nope, Upper Cervical doctors are even more do no harm than most chiros imho.

[jersey1969krw]

i will remind people that some physical therapists and osteopathes perform cervical manipulation. i would also encourage people to read the literature/research regarding the safety of cervical manipulation. i would remind people how common stroke is and the potential link to various medications/lifestyle. i'm not sure there's a proven (direct) cause and effect of stroke by cervical manipulation. i believe it will be shown these people were at pre stroke status/vulnerability.

[egodiosest]

stroke is common enough... in the ELDERLY, but in younger people it is very rare.

Risk of Vertebrobasilar Stroke and Chiropractic Care published in European Spine Journal

showed a increased risk of stroke in those aged under 35 odds ratio (3-12 ) especially in the 1st 24 hrs. unfortunately you had to read through the actual paper to see this not the abstract.

[globalenslavement]

the average person as a better chance of getting a stroke after visiting there barber than a chiropractor. These people need to research how many people are on meds in this country and how many people are dead because of them.

[chiropractic47]

global..., thank you! You put it bluntly and in undenial terms...MD misdiagnosis and health management, surgeries, and prescription drugs are perhaps the leading cause of death in the U.S. Chiropractic killed noone last year. MD's pay anywhere between $65,000 and $300,000/year malpractice insurance. DC's (doctors of chiropractic) pay $1500/year. Malpractice insurance is all about "RISK" and "CLAIMS MADE". Chiropractic!

[9pt9]

@jersey1969krw - It is a proven fact that chiropractic adjustments DO NOT INCREASE STROKE RISK

SPINE MAGAZINE- 2/15/2008 VOL 33 ISSUE 4 PP 176-183

[kobidobidog]

The stroke was caused be a full spine chiropractic manipulator, or a diversified. Diversifieds are full spine even though they call themselves upper cervical. Diversifieds twist the neck while attempting to adjust. never associate upper cervical specific, with full spine manipulators. Find an upper cervical specific practitioner (upcspine). some upper cervical specific use an activator. I discourage this. I tell them to learn Duff method a way of measuring, And use Tytron scanner.

[docsrocks]

There is no evidence of causation.  There is a temporal relationship, that's all. Diversified is a full spine technique, one of a hundred. The 'twist' you're talking about is probably less than 5 degrees once the position is held. UC using an activator? You have you techniques confused. A number use an instrument, but that's not it. Activator is a full spine technique. Never heard of the 'Duff' method.

[hiodr]

@docsrocks the Duff method is essentially hio method.

[TotemSaint]

What I really love (note the sarcasm flag,) is that they say MDs have less scrutiny then DCs, and yet, MDs kill roughly 100,000 people every year with medical mistakes, and close to 500,000 people (that's half a million) when you account for drugs and procedures done correctly, and gone wrong. Did anyone forget the 'above all else, do no harm?' If you where really about saving lives, put the MDs out of business. You'll get much more bang for your buck.

[kobidobidog]

Upper cervical specific doctors are not associated with full spine chiropractors.

[docsrocks]

A few that take the system as a cult might agree with you, but most of the ones I know who use it also.....adjust full spine on many patients. Surprise.

[powerprodoctions]

An UPPERCERVICAL DOCTOR, WOULD NEVER CRACK YOUR NECK,OR ANOTHER PART OF YOUR BODY .NEVER OR THEY ARE NOT A TRUE UPPER CERVICAL DOCTOR THE LIGHT TAP ON YOUR ATLAS WOULD NOT DENT THE SKIN OF A GRAPE, BUT WILL KEEP YOU BALNCED AND PREVENT DISTURBANCE FROM PRESSURE ON YOUR BRAIN STEM SO ALL MESSAGES SENT FROM YOUR HARD DRIVE THE BRAIN STEM ARE UNINTERUPTED. A CHIROPRACTOR CAN BE INJURIOUS WHEN CRACKING PEOPLES BODIES .UPPER CERVICAL IS THE COMPLETE OPPOSITE .THE WORLD NEEDS TO KNOW THE DIFFERENCE.!

[kobidobidog]

keep telling the truth I am an Enlightened patient.mine does the light toggle recoilAnd can measure with precision from the x rays he takes precisely the position of the atlas is and where it has to be, And exactly how to get it there. And can measure you for improvements over time.

[docsrocks]

So if you bump into something, you need to go back. Every time, right? After every workout, practice, workday, etc... Sounds reasonable.

[uRturdz]

I just went to have my back checked, i've never agreed to have him manipulate my neck, he did... he said he was going to stretch out my back, but while talking to me he pushed forward on my head and before i could say anything, "crack, crack" i was shocked... he didn't even say what he was going to do and i knew about the dangers and had no intention of any neck manipulation. Now I'm worried and have no way to check via MRI for damage, or stroke unless i visit the ER.

[docsrocks]

Good God, that's not even a good lie. You were laying face down, he pushed on your head and your neck cracked? Liar.

[hiodr]

need to open a hotline for medical related deaths and injuries. answering the calls would provide full-time employment for thousands of people. the profession already supports thousands of malpractice lawyers and malpractice insurers.

[drwilby]

Oops, she said she was in for shoulder pain...perhaps a precursor to the "stroke"....HMMMMM. If the chiro is worth his salt, he would have and probably did an exam and did find misalignments. It would be unethical to not adjust.

[drwilby]

What is the health history of this person? How does she know it was from an adjustment? I farted after I was adjusted, does that mean it was from the adjustment?

[docsrocks]

She was probably told that by someone making a temporal association rather than a causal one. Such is the case with neck911.

[whatupessay]

Lupita Dr. Chavez where'd you go is this the right ferum area on youtube

[docchavez44]

whatupessay RICe is rest ice chiropracticsucks and elevation

[mg200442000]

This is Bullshit !!! Everytime a doctor of any kind attempts to help someone, there is a chance of harm. Compaired to medical care proceedure & risk/ benifit ratio, chiropracitc care doesn't even come close to medicine when it comes to adverse reactions to treatment.

[LUVMETA]

? is do you have valid research about upper cervical adjustment causing strokes?

[cj1965]

there is no reporting mechanism for this--only *voluntary*.

How many fractures are caused by chiropractor adjustments? I can think of 6 in less than 2-years I've personally encountered in the ER. Apparently osteoporosis isn't part of the professions screening process either.

[LUVMETA]

in every profession you have the good and the bad. if a patient suffered from a stroke chances were that the patient was going to have one regardless and if that patient was adjusted then that would have trigger the stroke, even if the patient was going to for instance get hair wash or something extending the head back and turning side to side will trigger that as well.

[swoobtonzoop]

that is such bullshit, chiropractors hyper-extend the neck with violent force sometimes and there are delicate arteries and nerves to take account of, but they don't because they aren't even real doctors, just quacks.

[LUVMETA]

and that's your opinion sweetie not here to argue with you... so peace to you and its not quack..

have a bless day

[docsrocks]

Yep. Risk of Vertebrobasilar Stroke and Chiropractic Care: Results of a Population-Based, Case-Control and Case-Crossover Study

Cassidy JD, et al. Spine. Vol. 33, No. 4S, pp. S176-S183

And you're just a vindictive idiot.

[owentimo]

GO back to mopping the floor at Burger King you little bitch!

[docsrocks]

cj,

Risk of Vertebrobasilar Stroke and Chiropractic Care: Results of a Population-Based, Case-Control and Case-Crossover Study

Cassidy JD, et al. Spine. Vol. 33, No. 4S, pp. S176-S183

Fractures are a possibility, especially in older people, but considering compression fractures can occur spontaneously, don't get too dramatic. It occurs far less often than an ER doctor telling an auto accident victim to put heat therapy on a fresh injury.

[cj1965]

But why would you risk adjusting someone with osteoporosis? This is different than a spontaneous fracture, it is unnecessary exposure to risk of serious injury. Putting heat on a fresh injury, while not wise, it is not as detrimental compared to a pathologic fracture.

[docsrocks]

Point is, it may not even take force to cause such a fracture. And what level of osteoporosis are you talking about? I doubt if most chiropractors would use a common force technique with severely osteoporotic patients. I won't say it can't happen, but it can happen in some people with very little force, and I get the idea you really don't know how little force is used in adjusting, outside of exaggerated horror stories. Like this video. 6 in 2 years, serving what population?

[SilverCountdown]

o my god... that's why after I went to the chiropractor I feel WORSE...

I'm gonna open a law suit...

[chiropractic47]

@SilverCountdown A medical doctor will cause your stroke.

[moonknight9]

been in the business for over 10 years, never heard of it happening to anyone I've met... But there is always someone who knows a guy whose friend's cousin was adjusted and then died or whatever... Accidents happen, gotta train to avoid them, ever take a Tylenol? Now that stuff IS dangerous...