Religion is hardly a small matter it is still the cause of many wars and a great tool to use to as a weapon. Don`t be fooled this is not a problem just in the past
mary, anne, elizabeth, or katherine were no saints but all four just fought for what they believed what was right although their actions had consquences
@littlemisssunnydale. It wasn't just Henry that saw and made Elizabeth a bastard, but also the Catholic church and the others of the Catholic religion that saw Elizabeth as a bastard. Despite the fact that Henry named in his will Mary and Elizabeth as successors to the throne after their half-brother Edward, they were still considered bastards under the English law since he made both girls bastards after annulling the marriages he had with their mothers (Catherine of Aragon and Anne Boleyn).
@evaperonfan you have to remember that neither of them were god sent. Elizabeth lied about a change in religion, but remember that during Henry's reign, Mary did too. She signed the act of supremacy.
@evaperonfan I don't think Elizabeth looks like a saint here. She comes across as very conniving and deceitful to me, doing and saying whatever it takes to become the next queen.
Elizabeth was the greatest queen ever, along with her mother and Eleanor of Aquitiane. I shudder to think where progress, Anglo Saxon society, and women's status in Anglo societies would be if it weren't for those great women!
Great scene. You can actually see that they care for each other, yet cannot trust each other. Amazing acting. This portrayal of Mary really moved me. She looks so worn, haunted and sad. But she has her mother's dignified bearing and firmness. Two great ladies, despite it all. (And I love both Anne AND Katharine. IMHO Henry's best wives)
There seem to be many people that argue that Elizabeth lied to Mary about accepting the catholic faith..
But, looking back through history, they seemed to forget that, even if Elizabeth did lie to Mary, Mary did the exact same thing. She signed the Act of Supremecy, which named England a Protestan nation,, and yet continued to practice the catholic faith..
If you really look, without bias, she and her sister are not far apart. They were people in a compranising situation. No more.
Both sisters appear to have been able to attack the other - although one recent historian on Mary has tried to downplay this it is evident from the primary sources that neither sister trusted the other and as Mary immensely disliked having Elizabeth as her successor, so Elizabeth was prepared to defame Mary posthumously. Both were Tudors, and so quite capable of bearing grudges! Unfortunately the actions are both are often overlooked.
I like both Mary and Elizabeth. I wish that they'd been able to just set aside their differences, and behave as sisters. They could have been a great comfort to one another as they'd both had traumatic lives.
@littlemisssunnydale exactly. There lives were made around the grudges they held. Mary for Anne Boleyn. Elizabeth for her father. and as much as you'd like to say not, I'm sure they both envived thier brother. They were made to fight. It's what tudors did.
both elizabeth and mary killed alot of people mary killed luthrens and baptist elizbeth killed jews and catholics but mary killed far less people and most them wre a threat to her throne mary and elizbeth never got alone they needed to go to a shrink but ther were few good shrinks in the 1550's
Wrongo coolbrian. Mary killed over 300 people in 4 years, mostly for heresy and non conformity to the roman church. Elizabeth killed about 50 over her entire 45 year reign. And then, usually only if they were a threat to the stability of the kingdom. Everyone killed Jews, and Jesuits as well. They were both persecuted groups at the time.
I liked the argument between the sisters as they were strong, clever women who believed in their own faiths. It's a shame that Mary couldn't get along with her half sister.
Two incredible strong women who were the daughters of two equally strong women. It's a tragedy that they had to be enemies because of differences of faith that nowadays are considered nothing.
I am very partial to Katherine of Aragon but she could have gone silently if she hadn't protested Henry would have set her up very look at Anne of Cleves when he divorced her she did not make one
objection the divorce and in the end was made a very rich woman by Henry....if Katherine would have silently agreed to live in the country and agree to the divorce things would have maybe turned out a lot different
Yes, but she had been raised from childhood with the idea that being queen of England was her vocation and her right. She was married to Henry for over 20 years; they had several children and she felt she was his rightful queen. You don't throw everything meaningful in your life just to "go down easily." It broke her heart not to see Mary, but she felt that she needed to be true to her principles and set an example for her daughter.
true enough but what real mother puts a man b4 her child? katherine had no chance she clearly knew how strong willed henry was and had been. even if he did go w/ the pope's decision and take her bak y would she think she was going to b treated properly? she wouldn't have been. he'd have despised her. and one way r another due to his father's words he'd have gotten a new wife and a son out of her even if that mean killing katherine.
Henry would never have killed Katherine sure he killed anne but she was a nobody before him just the daughter of a coutier of little influence or wealth but katherine was the daughter of great kings a Queen beloved by her people and the aunt of the holy roman emperor. He may banish her, divorce her but he would never have killed her. There would have been too much repercussions the emperor would have been forced to act the pope would have called all good catholic kings to act.
i don't think the pope would've gotten further involved if he killed katherine. if they'd forced him to take katherine back i sincerly think he would've gotten rid of her
Catherine Of Aragon and Anne Of Cleves situations were very different. Catherine was from Spanish and English royalty, had been Henrys wife and Queen for several years and had had children (only Mary survived). Anne was Henrys wife for only a short time and the marriage wasn't consumated (she probably didn't like being married to Henry either) so she really had nothing to lose. Catherine, however, had everything to lose, so I don't blame her in the least for fighting for her and Marys rights.
KARENJADE: Anne's marriage to Henry was not considered legal but it was certainly consummated. Anne was the future Queen Elizabeth's mother. Anne had several other pregnancies with Henry, but all were stillborn or died at birth.
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I feel sorry for Mary. No pitty for Elizabeth. Because Mary has the true right to the throne. If mary was queen earlier none of this shit would have ever happened. it's really king henrey the viii's fault. i mean....kathrine of aarogon never had sex with aurther, because she never got preggo his his son. it was henreys choice to marry kathrine, and she DESERVED to be married. i think she is still the true queen.
im not here to start an argument. just saying what i think. its a good video (:
Elizabeth's mother was a descendant of a King of England. The six wives of Henry VIII are descendant from King Edward I. All of them were relatives between themselves and Henry.
why r we ppl arguing over shit that happened so frecking long ago. mary and her mom were legit according to the rules of royality england chose to to ignore this
Don't care about how the treatment of Catherine of Aragon affected Mary? Fine, then we shouldn't care about Anne Boleyns fate either. Sorry, but no matter your one sided bias, Mary was no bloody monster and Elizabeth was no angelic saint.
It's you who's biased towards Anne and Elizabeth. What do you think Anne wanted to do to Mary and Catherine? What do you think happened to those who refused to revere Anne as Queen over Catherine? What do you think happened to Catholics who spoke out against their churches being looted and destroyed and their priests being killed? What do you think happened to the Pilgrims of Grace? Stop seeing things in just black and white. Mary was no saint, but she was no monster either. Same as Elizabeth.
Maybe I'm biased towards Anne and Elizabeth because they did a lot of good for England whereas Mary did squat? Katharine may have been a great queen, but her daughter was a demon from Hell.
Mary was no demon from Hell. You just refuse to see past the Marian Persecutions and what caused them. Even Marys reign had their upsides if you'd get past your biased towards Anne and Elizabeth. Don't forget all Mary had to do was snap her fingers and Liz could have wound up just like Anne while Mary Stuert took the throne. Instead, Mary left Liz everything. If anything, Mary set a foundation for Liz.
Mary killed many protestant... but she wasnt a demon from hell, she did the same thing Elizabeth did, she stand on her believes and fight for them.
Elizabeth kill catholics when she was queen, but since she took england to the Golden Age, not many remember that, but it was wrong too.
Remember Thomas Moor? He was hang because he didnt sign the oath, you really believe Anne wasnt involved on it? he was against her!!. Anne did not treat Mary as a saint, she put her away from his mother
I like Anne I believe she was great ... And im not bias, because in fact, Im Christian, and i understand Mary and Katherine.
The four of them were queen of England, they were great and specials on their own, but Anne wasn't a jewel, she separate a mother from her child... And if something is truth is that Katherine and Anne love their daughters.
Anne did good things, shes very complicated. But still, you cant justify her actions GoddessofHyrule, she wasnt a good stepmother either
Yup, looked after Elizabeth through her childhood, refused to have her excecuted in spite of the urgings of her councillers and the threat Elizabeth posed to her. Real cruel.
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Sorry, but Mary was a heck of allot sweeter to Elizabeth, a figurehead of rebellion against her, then Henry, Anne and Edward were to her. You need to look at history with a broader, less one sided view.
Actually Mary was very beautiful a sa young girl, just look at her poirtraits of her as a achild and a teen! Sadly she was sick most of the time, and the stress and mental abuse she suffered took its toll on her looks
I thought Mary Did not like Elizabeth. She hated her didn't She?? And Mary was ugly, and she did look older then she was. Go Look at what Philip said about her. Nobody wrote about how beautiful Mary looked (No offense to Mary) they only worte about how she looked always looked sad and serious she never smiled. She always worried soo she must have looked older then what her really age was.
Well, Mary did say she was old enough to die. And she does look 50 or older, but she couldnt have been, because she was 42 when she died so in this vid she must have been about 40.
Ugh, they give Mary no dignity in this video. I greatly doubt that Mary looked that old or that hideous. I know that you can't make the characters perfectly in a show, but at least try to hire decent looking actors. It's probably more likely that Mary was much prettier than Elizabeth anyways.
Not the real Mary, Glenda Jackson's resemblance to Elizabeth was natural but Daphne Slater played the part under the condition that her anglo-saxon look would not be altered to match the half-spaniard look of Queen Mary. Mary's hair wasn't even red, it was painted red in portraits at the insistance of Queen Katherine to make her daughter look more "english", nor she had grey/blue eyes.
It's a serie of 6 episodes made for TV by the BBC in 1971 called: "Elizabeth R", starring Glenda Jackson, as of today it's considered the most accurate portrayal of Queen Elizabeth's life. A great production.
Well Mary confronted their brother king Edward when he forbade her to go to mass, threatening to bring the Holy Roman Empire upon him, while Eliza here converts to catholicism to stay in her sister's favor.
would you rather lie and become a ruler or tell the truth and be beheaded or burnt. and she didn't keep the charade going for long. in about two months she abandoned the church, which was one of many causes of her imprisonment.
partscmidt, I think you are missing the point about Mary. It is true people rejoiced when she stepped on the throne but till the end of her reign they hated her, because she felt more Spanish than English and was really a fanatic Catholic, killing her subjects for their belief.
My firm conviction (and of many historians too) is that Mary's reign was a disaster and the only lucky thing about it is that it lasted for only 5 years.
History always tends to favor the winners. Considering Catherine Of Aragon, is it any wonder Mary felt more love for her Spanish roots?.
And Protestants were looting and destroying Catholic churches and murdering Catholic priests (even during Elizabeths reign) not to mention it was on Protestant teachings that Henry discarded Catherine and Mary, so no surprise what happened when Mary took the throne.
Mary did not feel more Spanish than English. Her detractors and propagandists accused her of this because she married a Spaniard who forced her to do some unpopular things like go to war with France. In this war Britain lost Calais: an oversea's possession. Upon this lost, Mary declared, "when I die, Calais will be found next to my heart."
Historians are now starting to reexamine Mary's reign and she set the foundation for Elizabeth's rule. In fact, Elizabeth kept many of Mary's laws.
Well, I didn't exactly mean that as a bad thing; I always figured Mary cherished her Spanish roots because of her mother, though I see what you mean about it being negatively propagandized. And yes, I agree Mary set the foundation for Elizabeths rule.
In this clip Mary keeps complaining she is unloved, but that wasn't true. As Will Durant says: "The Council sent out heralds to proclaim Mary Tudor queen. England received the tidings with wild rejoicing. All through that summer (1553) night bells caroled and bonfires blazed. The people brought out tables and food, and picnicked and danced in the streets." The only ones who hated her were the Protestants, still a minority then, though a financially powerful one.
Actualy Elizabeth did not kill becose of religon,that is a fact,and she was truly tollerant towords catholics.
Mary was not as tollerant when she grew up towords protestants it could be blamed becose of her fathers treatment of her and her mother.
As some said it is Henry who is the real blame,well actualy half of that is tru,it was Anne Bolyn who mmanipulated Henry into getting her will,and we all know how much she hated Mary and Cathrine of Aragon.
Though there is no debating that Elizabeth herself was a tolorant queen, Catholic priests could still be killed simply for being such. English Catholics were in effect denied the practice of their religion. This effective persecution was codified by numerous laws, including the 1585 law, An Act against Jesuits, seminary priests and such other like disobedient persons'.
Sadly, it was due to the issue of religion. Mary took care of her younger siblings and loved them when they were little, but as they grew older and were seperated Edward and Elizabeth turned to the Protestant religion while Mary remained Catholic. Edward even tried his darndest to bully his big sister into converting.
Mary was a fanatical bigot. Because of her deeds Catholicism was hated in England for nearly 400 hundred years. That fact alone says all we need to know about her.
Mary had good personal reason to hate the Protestant faith, though I certainly don't condone the Marion Persecutions. However, even "Saint" Tomas More burned Protestants, Edward was a fanatical Protestant who tried to bully Mary into converting, and even though Elizabeth herself was known to be tolorant, just as many Catholics were persecuted and killed during her reign. I have no love for Martin Luthor either.
This is my problem with Martin Luthor; He had a significant influence on German antisemitism by his harsh anti-Jewish statements and writings. Later, these were used by the Nazis in their antisemitic propaganda. So there you go.
Well, I'm Lutheran, so I'm divided in my opinion. I like the fact that he taught salvation by grace, which is one of the main tenets of my faith. But I agree with you on his anti Semitism. He was also very misogynistic. He said it didn't matter if a woman died in childbirth, because that was what they were made for. He also boasted that he hit his wife to correct her.
@ninthwave No, it says all we need to know about the bias of Protestant historians who wrote the history books and did all they could to demonize Catholics and the Church, and that included Mary. They conveniently forgot about all the Catholic martyrs who died for their faith. There is no evidence that Mary was hated by the people during her reign. 400 years of Protestant propaganda and bigotry has created that image, which most fair historians have rejected as incorrect.
people need to stop saying mary tudor was a cruel she was not king henry did the same thing he made catholics become prostant and he shut down monastarys and she was not cruel to elizabeth
I agree - this is a superb portrayal of Mary Tudor. It shows very well just why Mary and Elizabeth could never be friends, no matter how hard they tried to be.
This is still the best screen representation of Mary Tudor - England's first and most under-rated queen! A lot better than Kathy Burke's bizarre 'cockney' grotesque a few years ago.
AndromedaMariaCarmen just emailed me a comment saying Katherine of Aragon deserved what she got.
That message very much disturbs me, who the hell deserves that?
AndromedaMariaCarmen,listen sweety be a little more tolerant and read some more of the facts, your not right just because your side won in the history books of their own making.
I've read about the Tudors for a half a decade now, and I have my opinions as you do. And what's wrong with me hating Catherine of Aragon- just because you like her doesn't mean I have to.
Good Lord,some of these AB fanatics smoketh the crack.
Queen Katherine,in no way deserved what happened to her.She lies today as a Queen and still respected centuries later.She stood her ground with grace and dignity.Out of all of KH8 wives,she is my favorite.For her to say somethin like that indicates pure foolishness.
I don't care one bit for Anne Boleyn,but I would never say she deserved to be murdered.
what was Mary and Elizabeths realtionship like? in this film it seems that dispite their differences they truely loved each other as sister should but in many other films Mary is shown to hate Elizabeth,
Their relationship was complex. Hate is too strong an emotion because certainly there was signs of affection at different times. Rather it was a conflicting relationship with a significant amount of uneasiness between the two. Mary may have viewed her sister as an anomaly; so someone not to be trusted and was out to undo her work. Elizabeth may have viewed Mary as unfair and certainly development resentment towards her. Both could be petty and vindictive.
Definition of Anglicanims: The question often arises as to whether the Anglican Communion should be identified as a Protestant or Catholic church, or perhaps as a distinct branch of Christianity altogether. The official position of the Anglican Communion is that, like the Roman Catholic and Orthodox communions, it is a full and distinct branch of the "One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church," created by Christ" From Wikipedia
We must not forget that both were daughters of Henry. I don't think they loved her father. How could Elizabeth love Henry, the murderer of her mother'
Mary was merely defending what she believed was right. She was unable to see that times had changed and that England was not the same country as when she was born. You forget that she was raised by her mother, Catherine of Aragon. In Mary's mind, Protestantism was associated with her mother's suffering.
I don't condone what Mary did. I was raised Catholic but I'm pretty much of an atheist now. But I find it unfair all the hatred directed at Mary, as if 16th century English Protestants had been saints or something or something like that. Many English people seem to have put Henry VIII on a pedestal ... but just the thought of all the people he killed, just because he wanted a son ... now THAT really pisses me off!!
Elizabeth killed as many Catholics as Mary did Protestants, so that argument holds no weight unless you want to hold Elizabeth accountable for the murder of Catholics in her reign.
After all, both of them learned at the feet of the bloodthirsty Henry VIII.
Do you like the fact that Elizabeth murdered far more Catholics during her reign than Mary did Protestants? Mary's life teetered on the edge of a knife for years during her childhood because of her father's infatuation with Anne the bitch and you honestly think there would be no post-traumatic stress from that, and the horrible conditions her mother was under during her last years?
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An "amazing woman" who destroyed the lives of the *rightful* Queen and heir of England for her own selfish wants?. As much as I pitied her fate, she got a darned good taste of her own medecine when replaced by Jane Seymore.
Oh so it was Anne who had the power to destroy Mary and Katharine? Silly me, I thought it was the king who had the power to do all of that, especially since that same king was Mary's father and Katharine's husband. Why don't you assign blame where it belongs and recognize that Anne was just another one of Henry's victims?
No, Anne only flaunted her adulterous relationship with Henry, encouraged him to get rid of Catherine and Mary so she could become queen, treated Mary like dirt and encouraged her servents to abuse her, openly wished for Catherine and Marys deaths, then celebrated upon Catherines death. True, she was a victim in the end, but, if not for the execution, I'd say she got exactly what she dished out.
No, but it was Anne who condoned and encouraged Henry to throw out Catherine and Mary so he could be free to marry her and make her queen. It was Anne who encouraged her servants to abuse Mary and who openly celebrated Catherines death.
True though, she was a victim in the end, and I sympathize with her ending fate.
Henry dismissed his wife of his own accord and was certainly the one behind his daughters ill treatment. He continued to treat Mary badly after Annes death; in fact his treatment of her became worse following May 1536
It is very convenient to blame Anne for the actions taken against Katherine and Mary instead of blaming the actual culprit Henry. Yet he was the man who called for the celebrations following Katherines death. Even Chapuys noted the Kings joyful response.
You just don't get it. YOU JUST DON'T GET IT! Anne didn't kill a single person. Mary killed almost 300 people! Anne also helped kick start the Reformation, helped save lives from Henry, I could go on and on, yet you just hate her because she replaced Katharine!
I do get it. It's you who don't. Many were killed because of the Protestant Reformation and for refusing to revere Anne as Queen over Catherine; In fact just as many perished then and during the pilgrimage of Grace as during the Marian Persecutions, if not more so. And Anne did nothing; it was Henrys lust for her and wanting a son that triggered the reformation.
And I dislike Anne because she was an usurper and pretender who meddled where she had no business, as well as an awful stepmother.
Ok I understand. But Anne's charities and reforms were important. Stop seeing Anne as a monster when she was a very complex woman, the same as Katharine. The fact that you won't even acknowledge Henry's other wives as queens shows that you're biased too!
I never said Anne was a monster; I said she was an usurper, pretender and awful stepmother who let her ambition get the better of her and reached far to high; Thus it cost her big time in the end.
All right. Personally, we'll have to agree to disagree. I view Anne as one of England's best QUEENS along with her daughter, Elizabeth, Eleanor of Aquitiane, and Philippa of Hainault.
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hahaha "amazing" serpent..seducing a married man only for her ambicious..
Divided a country, a family and finally she had the end that she wanted for Catherine and Mary karma!
And she wasn´t protestant..in fact she hasn´t faith,she only wish power
And rememeber, during all his reign Henry was a devoted catholic..Henry only declares that the head of the England church is the king not the pope..England hasn´t the same religion process the rest of Protestants countries
She was CENTURIES ahead of her time- your precious Katharine was about 300 years behind! I don't understand all the anti-Anne stuff- she was a woman more of our time than hers how DARE you hate a woman so far ahead of her time- it's women like YOU that keep the rest of us from advancing forward in society! And if my comment is thumbed down, it'll just show that women WANT to remain subordiante to men! Go to Hell and worship Katharine there!
a woman who uses the sex to obtain position? thats is be 300 years in the future? wow! go, go prostitutes to the power..and Catherine was only a loyal subject and devoted mother and wife and the best queen of those times, cultivated, smart, loyal to her country and people..yak!
in the next elections I will vote Cicciolina! an amazing woman!
Get your facts straight! Anne refused Henry's advances because she saw what happened to her sister. She refused him until he offered her the crown- you blame the woman, just like any anti feminist does! Catherine did nothing except take Henry's abuse! Anne promoted charities and helped bring in the Reformation, and also saved many lives from execution. Read an actual biography of her, don't just get your sources from Phillipa Gregory! Or try Robin Maxwell! Anne- rules. Catherine- doormat trash!
She was the real daughter of Queen Isabel of Castile. Like her mother, she fights for her rights.Unfortunately,she was not as a practical politician as her father King Fernando.
did nothing except take henrys abuse? did she not also help charities? was a skilled regent? was intelligant? was caring? saved lives from exacution(she is actually remebered in a street ballad for this)? managed to manage a whole household on her own at a young age with extremely little money in a foreign counrty in which she spoke little of the language - a language which she learned during that time. cont...
there is no need to get so angry and hope tht people go to hell, katherine wasnt 300 yrs behind, she was a conempary - and there is nothing wrong with being with the times. it isnt her fault that women in scoiety arent advancing - which they are - just because she "dares" not to like anne boleyn, thats her choice and others, as it it yours not to like katherine
a doormat? did education for women in england not become fashionable through her influence? did she not support colleges?she was fiesty and stood up for her and her daughters rights, for others and defied henry. trash? no she was far from that, she is a wonderful rolemodel.
To judge the behavior and moral conduct of people living in the middle of the 16th century by today's standarts is plane stupid and idiotic. History is written for the future generations to learn and evolve, not to judge them, they did what they did because that's what they knew and beleived in those days. You are nobody to judge them, you are most wellcome to analyse and learn from this events but keep your little personal "trial" and "convition" for your own family, will you?.
Religion is hardly a small matter it is still the cause of many wars and a great tool to use to as a weapon. Don`t be fooled this is not a problem just in the past
jennie38USA 6 months ago
"Why must we trouble ourselves over this small matter of religion?"
lewisbreland 6 months ago
Well, Elizabeth is portrayed in here as a hypocrite, i agree.
She was a great queen, one of the best, but i think that´s the reason people forget she was a human, just like Mary.
Mary suffer the exact same thing when Edward was king.
BeckytaSU 8 months ago
mary, anne, elizabeth, or katherine were no saints but all four just fought for what they believed what was right although their actions had consquences
NARUTO1553 11 months ago
@littlemisssunnydale. It wasn't just Henry that saw and made Elizabeth a bastard, but also the Catholic church and the others of the Catholic religion that saw Elizabeth as a bastard. Despite the fact that Henry named in his will Mary and Elizabeth as successors to the throne after their half-brother Edward, they were still considered bastards under the English law since he made both girls bastards after annulling the marriages he had with their mothers (Catherine of Aragon and Anne Boleyn).
tropicsgoddess 1 year ago
Neither Mary nor Elizabeth are to blame! It's all their fathers fault. As the saying goes... Our children pay for our sins!
princessewhiterose 1 year ago
I hate the way they portray Mary and make Elizabeth look out to b e a saint. In reality it was the opposite.
evaperonfan 1 year ago
@evaperonfan you have to remember that neither of them were god sent. Elizabeth lied about a change in religion, but remember that during Henry's reign, Mary did too. She signed the act of supremacy.
zrtproductions 1 year ago
@evaperonfan I don't think Elizabeth looks like a saint here. She comes across as very conniving and deceitful to me, doing and saying whatever it takes to become the next queen.
cricketrecords 1 year ago
Elizabeth was the greatest queen ever, along with her mother and Eleanor of Aquitiane. I shudder to think where progress, Anglo Saxon society, and women's status in Anglo societies would be if it weren't for those great women!
evaperonfan 2 years ago
Great scene. You can actually see that they care for each other, yet cannot trust each other. Amazing acting. This portrayal of Mary really moved me. She looks so worn, haunted and sad. But she has her mother's dignified bearing and firmness. Two great ladies, despite it all. (And I love both Anne AND Katharine. IMHO Henry's best wives)
Elisabetta611 2 years ago 4
There seem to be many people that argue that Elizabeth lied to Mary about accepting the catholic faith..
But, looking back through history, they seemed to forget that, even if Elizabeth did lie to Mary, Mary did the exact same thing. She signed the Act of Supremecy, which named England a Protestan nation,, and yet continued to practice the catholic faith..
If you really look, without bias, she and her sister are not far apart. They were people in a compranising situation. No more.
zrtproductions 2 years ago
what movie is this?
justinemarcelo 2 years ago
It's a television series called Elizabeth R
zrtproductions 2 years ago
mary didn't exactly hate elizabeth its just with her mom and her sisters mom negative randevou well one thing led to another
girlingreensocks 2 years ago
what movie is this scene from?
geosephine 2 years ago
Mary seems really nice really- it's the laws of the church, not her that made her a bad person. She just really loves her religion.
Roxanneactress 2 years ago
The Actress playing Elizabeth here also played her in "Mary, Queen of Scots"
I know this isn't from that movie though...
kellys1999 2 years ago
is this a movie??
vmpregrl 2 years ago
what name is this movie?
Vacammcc 2 years ago
Mary was so cruel to Elizabeth.
AnaliaHyrule 2 years ago
Actually, the more you read into their relationship...Elizabeth was the cold one.
LNor19 2 years ago
Both sisters appear to have been able to attack the other - although one recent historian on Mary has tried to downplay this it is evident from the primary sources that neither sister trusted the other and as Mary immensely disliked having Elizabeth as her successor, so Elizabeth was prepared to defame Mary posthumously. Both were Tudors, and so quite capable of bearing grudges! Unfortunately the actions are both are often overlooked.
littlemisssunnydale 2 years ago
I agree, littlemisssunnydale.
AnaliaHyrule 2 years ago
I like both Mary and Elizabeth. I wish that they'd been able to just set aside their differences, and behave as sisters. They could have been a great comfort to one another as they'd both had traumatic lives.
gapeachjessica 2 years ago
@littlemisssunnydale exactly. There lives were made around the grudges they held. Mary for Anne Boleyn. Elizabeth for her father. and as much as you'd like to say not, I'm sure they both envived thier brother. They were made to fight. It's what tudors did.
zrtproductions 1 year ago
@littlemisssunnydale Yeah but Elizabeth didn't burn 300 innocent people alive.
jpr11011 1 year ago
@jpr11011 she burned 5 and hanged many more
SophieGizzy 1 year ago
when was this filmed?
CatherineSuffolk 2 years ago
This was a BBC production around 1970-71.
Still the best Elizabeth portrayal, in my opinion, by Glenda Jackson
mari66101 2 years ago
anyone know where i can watch the whole thing
12from12 2 years ago
both elizabeth and mary killed alot of people mary killed luthrens and baptist elizbeth killed jews and catholics but mary killed far less people and most them wre a threat to her throne mary and elizbeth never got alone they needed to go to a shrink but ther were few good shrinks in the 1550's
coolbrian15 2 years ago
Wrongo coolbrian. Mary killed over 300 people in 4 years, mostly for heresy and non conformity to the roman church. Elizabeth killed about 50 over her entire 45 year reign. And then, usually only if they were a threat to the stability of the kingdom. Everyone killed Jews, and Jesuits as well. They were both persecuted groups at the time.
wylloughbye 2 years ago
is this from "the 6 wives of henry 8"?
KrunkPrincess15 2 years ago
It's from Elizabeth R.
ollierat9 2 years ago 2
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5:45 is probably the only moment mary was kind to her little sister
squirrelflight5 2 years ago
I liked the argument between the sisters as they were strong, clever women who believed in their own faiths. It's a shame that Mary couldn't get along with her half sister.
Karkaroff26 2 years ago 10
Two incredible strong women who were the daughters of two equally strong women. It's a tragedy that they had to be enemies because of differences of faith that nowadays are considered nothing.
ollierat9 2 years ago 14
I am very partial to Katherine of Aragon but she could have gone silently if she hadn't protested Henry would have set her up very look at Anne of Cleves when he divorced her she did not make one
objection the divorce and in the end was made a very rich woman by Henry....if Katherine would have silently agreed to live in the country and agree to the divorce things would have maybe turned out a lot different
fugh88 2 years ago 2
not only that she would've also been with her daughter. you took the words right out of my mouth!
KrunkPrincess15 2 years ago
Yes, but she had been raised from childhood with the idea that being queen of England was her vocation and her right. She was married to Henry for over 20 years; they had several children and she felt she was his rightful queen. You don't throw everything meaningful in your life just to "go down easily." It broke her heart not to see Mary, but she felt that she needed to be true to her principles and set an example for her daughter.
wheresolive 2 years ago
true enough but what real mother puts a man b4 her child? katherine had no chance she clearly knew how strong willed henry was and had been. even if he did go w/ the pope's decision and take her bak y would she think she was going to b treated properly? she wouldn't have been. he'd have despised her. and one way r another due to his father's words he'd have gotten a new wife and a son out of her even if that mean killing katherine.
KrunkPrincess15 2 years ago
Henry would never have killed Katherine sure he killed anne but she was a nobody before him just the daughter of a coutier of little influence or wealth but katherine was the daughter of great kings a Queen beloved by her people and the aunt of the holy roman emperor. He may banish her, divorce her but he would never have killed her. There would have been too much repercussions the emperor would have been forced to act the pope would have called all good catholic kings to act.
trinapinks 2 years ago
i don't think the pope would've gotten further involved if he killed katherine. if they'd forced him to take katherine back i sincerly think he would've gotten rid of her
KrunkPrincess15 2 years ago
Catherine Of Aragon and Anne Of Cleves situations were very different. Catherine was from Spanish and English royalty, had been Henrys wife and Queen for several years and had had children (only Mary survived). Anne was Henrys wife for only a short time and the marriage wasn't consumated (she probably didn't like being married to Henry either) so she really had nothing to lose. Catherine, however, had everything to lose, so I don't blame her in the least for fighting for her and Marys rights.
Karenjade 2 years ago 3
KARENJADE: Anne's marriage to Henry was not considered legal but it was certainly consummated. Anne was the future Queen Elizabeth's mother. Anne had several other pregnancies with Henry, but all were stillborn or died at birth.
emeraldvenus 2 years ago
you are right. Sadly, revisionism here on YT is widespread.
AnaliaHyrule 2 years ago
It was ashame Mary couldn't let the past go and be friendly to Elizabeth.
AnaliaHyrule 2 years ago 4
The tune is called "My lady Carey's dompe"
YeOldeTune 2 years ago
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I feel sorry for Mary. No pitty for Elizabeth. Because Mary has the true right to the throne. If mary was queen earlier none of this shit would have ever happened. it's really king henrey the viii's fault. i mean....kathrine of aarogon never had sex with aurther, because she never got preggo his his son. it was henreys choice to marry kathrine, and she DESERVED to be married. i think she is still the true queen.
im not here to start an argument. just saying what i think. its a good video (:
morgasumsxD 2 years ago
so that undoes all the good Elizabeth did for England?
AndromedaMariaCarmen 2 years ago
No it doesnt.
But you root for Henrey viii ?
Elizabeth's mother wasnt even of royal blood.
she didnt deserve it.
morgasumsxD 2 years ago
Elizabeth's mother was a descendant of a King of England. The six wives of Henry VIII are descendant from King Edward I. All of them were relatives between themselves and Henry.
YeOldeTune 2 years ago
I've also heard that Henry VIII's wives were all related but I don't know exactly how other then Anne Boleyn and Catherine Howard were first cousins.
mrsmarmite 2 years ago
why r we ppl arguing over shit that happened so frecking long ago. mary and her mom were legit according to the rules of royality england chose to to ignore this
fleurgi 2 years ago
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AndromedaMariaCarmen 3 years ago
Don't care about how the treatment of Catherine of Aragon affected Mary? Fine, then we shouldn't care about Anne Boleyns fate either. Sorry, but no matter your one sided bias, Mary was no bloody monster and Elizabeth was no angelic saint.
Karenjade 3 years ago
the one with the bias is you. You're the one that goes around about how awful Anne is when Anne killed *no one* and yet treating Mary as a saint.
GoddessofHyrule 2 years ago
It's you who's biased towards Anne and Elizabeth. What do you think Anne wanted to do to Mary and Catherine? What do you think happened to those who refused to revere Anne as Queen over Catherine? What do you think happened to Catholics who spoke out against their churches being looted and destroyed and their priests being killed? What do you think happened to the Pilgrims of Grace? Stop seeing things in just black and white. Mary was no saint, but she was no monster either. Same as Elizabeth.
Karenjade 2 years ago
Maybe I'm biased towards Anne and Elizabeth because they did a lot of good for England whereas Mary did squat? Katharine may have been a great queen, but her daughter was a demon from Hell.
GoddessofHyrule 2 years ago 2
Mary was no demon from Hell. You just refuse to see past the Marian Persecutions and what caused them. Even Marys reign had their upsides if you'd get past your biased towards Anne and Elizabeth. Don't forget all Mary had to do was snap her fingers and Liz could have wound up just like Anne while Mary Stuert took the throne. Instead, Mary left Liz everything. If anything, Mary set a foundation for Liz.
Karenjade 2 years ago
Mary killed many protestant... but she wasnt a demon from hell, she did the same thing Elizabeth did, she stand on her believes and fight for them.
Elizabeth kill catholics when she was queen, but since she took england to the Golden Age, not many remember that, but it was wrong too.
Remember Thomas Moor? He was hang because he didnt sign the oath, you really believe Anne wasnt involved on it? he was against her!!. Anne did not treat Mary as a saint, she put her away from his mother
BeckytaSU 2 years ago
her* sorry..
I like Anne I believe she was great ... And im not bias, because in fact, Im Christian, and i understand Mary and Katherine.
The four of them were queen of England, they were great and specials on their own, but Anne wasn't a jewel, she separate a mother from her child... And if something is truth is that Katherine and Anne love their daughters.
Anne did good things, shes very complicated. But still, you cant justify her actions GoddessofHyrule, she wasnt a good stepmother either
BeckytaSU 2 years ago
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GoddessofHyrule 2 years ago
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AndromedaMariaCarmen 3 years ago
Yup, looked after Elizabeth through her childhood, refused to have her excecuted in spite of the urgings of her councillers and the threat Elizabeth posed to her. Real cruel.
Karenjade 3 years ago
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AndromedaMariaCarmen 3 years ago
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Sorry, but Mary was a heck of allot sweeter to Elizabeth, a figurehead of rebellion against her, then Henry, Anne and Edward were to her. You need to look at history with a broader, less one sided view.
Karenjade 3 years ago
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AndromedaMariaCarmen 3 years ago
Actually Mary was very beautiful a sa young girl, just look at her poirtraits of her as a achild and a teen! Sadly she was sick most of the time, and the stress and mental abuse she suffered took its toll on her looks
katharinethequene 3 years ago 3
I thought Mary Did not like Elizabeth. She hated her didn't She?? And Mary was ugly, and she did look older then she was. Go Look at what Philip said about her. Nobody wrote about how beautiful Mary looked (No offense to Mary) they only worte about how she looked always looked sad and serious she never smiled. She always worried soo she must have looked older then what her really age was.
HondurasTLCLeftEye 3 years ago
Well, Mary did say she was old enough to die. And she does look 50 or older, but she couldnt have been, because she was 42 when she died so in this vid she must have been about 40.
britneystars2 3 years ago
Ugh, they give Mary no dignity in this video. I greatly doubt that Mary looked that old or that hideous. I know that you can't make the characters perfectly in a show, but at least try to hire decent looking actors. It's probably more likely that Mary was much prettier than Elizabeth anyways.
deejaney 3 years ago
i agree they made Mary look like 50 but according what i've heard Elizabeth apparently was the prettier one.
coolmonkey934 3 years ago 2
Not the real Mary, Glenda Jackson's resemblance to Elizabeth was natural but Daphne Slater played the part under the condition that her anglo-saxon look would not be altered to match the half-spaniard look of Queen Mary. Mary's hair wasn't even red, it was painted red in portraits at the insistance of Queen Katherine to make her daughter look more "english", nor she had grey/blue eyes.
mcmlxvi 3 years ago
What is this from?
littlemissmoo14 3 years ago
It's a serie of 6 episodes made for TV by the BBC in 1971 called: "Elizabeth R", starring Glenda Jackson, as of today it's considered the most accurate portrayal of Queen Elizabeth's life. A great production.
mcmlxvi 3 years ago
Poor Mary. Her counselors picked at her until she saw enemies in everyone...like her father before her.
Serenityluver 3 years ago 2
This comment has received too many negative votes show
elizabeth was a little weasel
Glosuraban 3 years ago
How so?
zrtproductions 3 years ago
Well Mary confronted their brother king Edward when he forbade her to go to mass, threatening to bring the Holy Roman Empire upon him, while Eliza here converts to catholicism to stay in her sister's favor.
Glosuraban 3 years ago
*expresses desire to convert, she doesn't actually convert (poor Mary died soon and childless), still it shows the weasel like part of her nature.
Glosuraban 3 years ago
would you rather lie and become a ruler or tell the truth and be beheaded or burnt. and she didn't keep the charade going for long. in about two months she abandoned the church, which was one of many causes of her imprisonment.
zrtproductions 3 years ago
The lady who played mary really looks like mary I in potraits of the real mary.
Hariszain111 3 years ago 6
a beautiful portrayal, not only of Elizabeth, But also of Mary.
zrtproductions 3 years ago 8
The person who plays Mary is a great actress!
hahaha2531 3 years ago 8
Which movie is this from? It seems somewhat familiar.
WLDB 3 years ago 2
It's called Elizabeth R from 1971 there are 6 two hour episodes it was a british mini series.
Jameremail 3 years ago 6
Thanks, I'll have to go looking for it now. It looks like it was well done.
WLDB 3 years ago
partscmidt, I think you are missing the point about Mary. It is true people rejoiced when she stepped on the throne but till the end of her reign they hated her, because she felt more Spanish than English and was really a fanatic Catholic, killing her subjects for their belief.
My firm conviction (and of many historians too) is that Mary's reign was a disaster and the only lucky thing about it is that it lasted for only 5 years.
haleas 3 years ago
History always tends to favor the winners. Considering Catherine Of Aragon, is it any wonder Mary felt more love for her Spanish roots?.
And Protestants were looting and destroying Catholic churches and murdering Catholic priests (even during Elizabeths reign) not to mention it was on Protestant teachings that Henry discarded Catherine and Mary, so no surprise what happened when Mary took the throne.
Karenjade 3 years ago
Mary did not feel more Spanish than English. Her detractors and propagandists accused her of this because she married a Spaniard who forced her to do some unpopular things like go to war with France. In this war Britain lost Calais: an oversea's possession. Upon this lost, Mary declared, "when I die, Calais will be found next to my heart."
Historians are now starting to reexamine Mary's reign and she set the foundation for Elizabeth's rule. In fact, Elizabeth kept many of Mary's laws.
Rayarena 3 years ago
Well, I didn't exactly mean that as a bad thing; I always figured Mary cherished her Spanish roots because of her mother, though I see what you mean about it being negatively propagandized. And yes, I agree Mary set the foundation for Elizabeths rule.
Karenjade 3 years ago
In this clip Mary keeps complaining she is unloved, but that wasn't true. As Will Durant says: "The Council sent out heralds to proclaim Mary Tudor queen. England received the tidings with wild rejoicing. All through that summer (1553) night bells caroled and bonfires blazed. The people brought out tables and food, and picnicked and danced in the streets." The only ones who hated her were the Protestants, still a minority then, though a financially powerful one.
partschmidt 3 years ago
That was when she began her reign. Her popularity did not last, especially after her much frown upon marriage.
cheapvodka 3 years ago
@cheapvodka What is the evidence that her popularity did not last with the people?
cricketrecords 1 year ago
Does anybody know the name of the melody Elizabeth is playing on the harpsichord?
haleas 3 years ago
"My lady Carey's dompe"
YeOldeTune 2 years ago
Actualy Elizabeth did not kill becose of religon,that is a fact,and she was truly tollerant towords catholics.
Mary was not as tollerant when she grew up towords protestants it could be blamed becose of her fathers treatment of her and her mother.
As some said it is Henry who is the real blame,well actualy half of that is tru,it was Anne Bolyn who mmanipulated Henry into getting her will,and we all know how much she hated Mary and Cathrine of Aragon.
Flohaug81 3 years ago 3
Though there is no debating that Elizabeth herself was a tolorant queen, Catholic priests could still be killed simply for being such. English Catholics were in effect denied the practice of their religion. This effective persecution was codified by numerous laws, including the 1585 law, An Act against Jesuits, seminary priests and such other like disobedient persons'.
Karenjade 3 years ago
I think Mary did love Elizabeth but Mary at the end of her life went insane and forgot how much she cared for Elizabeth
kaybbayyy2362 3 years ago
Sadly, it was due to the issue of religion. Mary took care of her younger siblings and loved them when they were little, but as they grew older and were seperated Edward and Elizabeth turned to the Protestant religion while Mary remained Catholic. Edward even tried his darndest to bully his big sister into converting.
Karenjade 3 years ago
what movie is this?
mcc1202577 3 years ago
fantastic acting. love that :D
viperxeon 3 years ago
Mary was a fanatical bigot. Because of her deeds Catholicism was hated in England for nearly 400 hundred years. That fact alone says all we need to know about her.
ninthwave 3 years ago 4
Mary had good personal reason to hate the Protestant faith, though I certainly don't condone the Marion Persecutions. However, even "Saint" Tomas More burned Protestants, Edward was a fanatical Protestant who tried to bully Mary into converting, and even though Elizabeth herself was known to be tolorant, just as many Catholics were persecuted and killed during her reign. I have no love for Martin Luthor either.
Karenjade 3 years ago
what's your problem with Martin Luther?
AndromedaMariaCarmen 3 years ago
This is my problem with Martin Luthor; He had a significant influence on German antisemitism by his harsh anti-Jewish statements and writings. Later, these were used by the Nazis in their antisemitic propaganda. So there you go.
Karenjade 3 years ago 3
Well, I'm Lutheran, so I'm divided in my opinion. I like the fact that he taught salvation by grace, which is one of the main tenets of my faith. But I agree with you on his anti Semitism. He was also very misogynistic. He said it didn't matter if a woman died in childbirth, because that was what they were made for. He also boasted that he hit his wife to correct her.
AndromedaMariaCarmen 3 years ago
@ninthwave No, it says all we need to know about the bias of Protestant historians who wrote the history books and did all they could to demonize Catholics and the Church, and that included Mary. They conveniently forgot about all the Catholic martyrs who died for their faith. There is no evidence that Mary was hated by the people during her reign. 400 years of Protestant propaganda and bigotry has created that image, which most fair historians have rejected as incorrect.
cricketrecords 1 year ago
Sigh. What is up with all the anti-Anne comments?
littlemisssunnydale 3 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
it just shows how far women have to go, littlemisssunnydale.
AnaliaHyrule 2 years ago
people need to stop saying mary tudor was a cruel she was not king henry did the same thing he made catholics become prostant and he shut down monastarys and she was not cruel to elizabeth
mileylover02 3 years ago
I agree - this is a superb portrayal of Mary Tudor. It shows very well just why Mary and Elizabeth could never be friends, no matter how hard they tried to be.
vonkvetch 3 years ago 2
its a very fair view on poor, tragic mary tudor who will always stand in elizabeths shadow
FlashGORDONXVFFR 3 years ago
This is still the best screen representation of Mary Tudor - England's first and most under-rated queen! A lot better than Kathy Burke's bizarre 'cockney' grotesque a few years ago.
Wansteadskyblue 3 years ago 2
The tune played on the virginals is "My Lady Carey's Dompe." A dompe was a dance. The composer is anonymous but may have been Hugh Aston.
sjnepomuk 3 years ago
AndromedaMariaCarmen just emailed me a comment saying Katherine of Aragon deserved what she got.
That message very much disturbs me, who the hell deserves that?
AndromedaMariaCarmen,listen sweety be a little more tolerant and read some more of the facts, your not right just because your side won in the history books of their own making.
ClassiJazz 3 years ago 3
I've read about the Tudors for a half a decade now, and I have my opinions as you do. And what's wrong with me hating Catherine of Aragon- just because you like her doesn't mean I have to.
AndromedaMariaCarmen 3 years ago
I'm sorry I offended you, but I have my opinions as you do. And I like Elizabeth and Anne, and I'm not fond of Catherine and Mary.
AndromedaMariaCarmen 3 years ago
Good Lord,some of these AB fanatics smoketh the crack.
Queen Katherine,in no way deserved what happened to her.She lies today as a Queen and still respected centuries later.She stood her ground with grace and dignity.Out of all of KH8 wives,she is my favorite.For her to say somethin like that indicates pure foolishness.
I don't care one bit for Anne Boleyn,but I would never say she deserved to be murdered.
Kitty273 3 years ago
I got question did Catherine of Aragon died of cancer or perhaps Heart disease the black heart that sound some kind of heart disease
Kellyannk308 3 years ago
From which movie are this scenes?
HerminePotter 3 years ago
A Masterpiece Theater presentation from the 1970's called Elizabeth R. Was fantastic!
PomfretAli 3 years ago
what was Mary and Elizabeths realtionship like? in this film it seems that dispite their differences they truely loved each other as sister should but in many other films Mary is shown to hate Elizabeth,
I cant imaging hating my sister
shsajsajjdhdahdsahja 3 years ago
Their relationship was complex. Hate is too strong an emotion because certainly there was signs of affection at different times. Rather it was a conflicting relationship with a significant amount of uneasiness between the two. Mary may have viewed her sister as an anomaly; so someone not to be trusted and was out to undo her work. Elizabeth may have viewed Mary as unfair and certainly development resentment towards her. Both could be petty and vindictive.
littlemisssunnydale 3 years ago
All the anglican people pretend wants to disparage Mary Tudor, and Elizabeth appear as a saint
vicvandort 3 years ago
I feel so bad for these sisters their father made it so hard
laader01 3 years ago
im taking classes to become catholic i will soon belong to the true church
coolbrian15 3 years ago
get over Anne Boleyn Mary!
AndromedaMariaCarmen 3 years ago
Definition of Anglicanims: The question often arises as to whether the Anglican Communion should be identified as a Protestant or Catholic church, or perhaps as a distinct branch of Christianity altogether. The official position of the Anglican Communion is that, like the Roman Catholic and Orthodox communions, it is a full and distinct branch of the "One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church," created by Christ" From Wikipedia
astrofabio68 3 years ago
We must not forget that both were daughters of Henry. I don't think they loved her father. How could Elizabeth love Henry, the murderer of her mother'
phaers 3 years ago
It's a pity that religion came between two sisters. All animosity was for that reason alone. Such a waste.
Iluthra 3 years ago 3
Mary was merely defending what she believed was right. She was unable to see that times had changed and that England was not the same country as when she was born. You forget that she was raised by her mother, Catherine of Aragon. In Mary's mind, Protestantism was associated with her mother's suffering.
CondorFlyingHigh 3 years ago 5
that doesn't excuse what she did. And I'm Protestant, so Mary just pisses me off!
AndromedaMariaCarmen 3 years ago
I don't condone what Mary did. I was raised Catholic but I'm pretty much of an atheist now. But I find it unfair all the hatred directed at Mary, as if 16th century English Protestants had been saints or something or something like that. Many English people seem to have put Henry VIII on a pedestal ... but just the thought of all the people he killed, just because he wanted a son ... now THAT really pisses me off!!
CondorFlyingHigh 3 years ago 4
Elizabeth killed as many Catholics as Mary did Protestants, so that argument holds no weight unless you want to hold Elizabeth accountable for the murder of Catholics in her reign.
After all, both of them learned at the feet of the bloodthirsty Henry VIII.
katie9918 3 years ago
i like mary more because anne boelynn was kinda cruel to her
CCBRWN93 3 years ago
do you like the fact that all mary did was persecute protestants when she became queen? do you have a justification for that?
AndromedaMariaCarmen 3 years ago
and she did it well
CCBRWN93 3 years ago
did what well?
AndromedaMariaCarmen 3 years ago
Do you like the fact that Elizabeth murdered far more Catholics during her reign than Mary did Protestants? Mary's life teetered on the edge of a knife for years during her childhood because of her father's infatuation with Anne the bitch and you honestly think there would be no post-traumatic stress from that, and the horrible conditions her mother was under during her last years?
katie9918 3 years ago
Anne was NOT a bitch- Anne was an amazing woman!
AndromedaMariaCarmen 3 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
An "amazing woman" who destroyed the lives of the *rightful* Queen and heir of England for her own selfish wants?. As much as I pitied her fate, she got a darned good taste of her own medecine when replaced by Jane Seymore.
Karenjade 3 years ago
What a vile thing to say.
littlemisssunnydale 3 years ago
True though.
Karenjade 3 years ago
Oh so it was Anne who had the power to destroy Mary and Katharine? Silly me, I thought it was the king who had the power to do all of that, especially since that same king was Mary's father and Katharine's husband. Why don't you assign blame where it belongs and recognize that Anne was just another one of Henry's victims?
tianabarone 3 years ago 3
No, Anne only flaunted her adulterous relationship with Henry, encouraged him to get rid of Catherine and Mary so she could become queen, treated Mary like dirt and encouraged her servents to abuse her, openly wished for Catherine and Marys deaths, then celebrated upon Catherines death. True, she was a victim in the end, but, if not for the execution, I'd say she got exactly what she dished out.
Karenjade 3 years ago
No, but it was Anne who condoned and encouraged Henry to throw out Catherine and Mary so he could be free to marry her and make her queen. It was Anne who encouraged her servants to abuse Mary and who openly celebrated Catherines death.
True though, she was a victim in the end, and I sympathize with her ending fate.
Karenjade 3 years ago
Henry dismissed his wife of his own accord and was certainly the one behind his daughters ill treatment. He continued to treat Mary badly after Annes death; in fact his treatment of her became worse following May 1536
It is very convenient to blame Anne for the actions taken against Katherine and Mary instead of blaming the actual culprit Henry. Yet he was the man who called for the celebrations following Katherines death. Even Chapuys noted the Kings joyful response.
littlemisssunnydale 3 years ago
man shut the fuck up,how dare u say that about anne boleyn
jenwho2 3 years ago
She was an amazing woman beacuse she got what she wanted. She wanted to be Queen and got it.
YeOldeTune 2 years ago
all of Henry's wives were true queens.
AnaliaHyrule 2 years ago
Anne was the true queen.
GoddessofHyrule 2 years ago
No. Elizabeth aside, Anne was just an usurper and a pretender.
Karenjade 2 years ago
You just don't get it. YOU JUST DON'T GET IT! Anne didn't kill a single person. Mary killed almost 300 people! Anne also helped kick start the Reformation, helped save lives from Henry, I could go on and on, yet you just hate her because she replaced Katharine!
GoddessofHyrule 2 years ago 3
I do get it. It's you who don't. Many were killed because of the Protestant Reformation and for refusing to revere Anne as Queen over Catherine; In fact just as many perished then and during the pilgrimage of Grace as during the Marian Persecutions, if not more so. And Anne did nothing; it was Henrys lust for her and wanting a son that triggered the reformation.
And I dislike Anne because she was an usurper and pretender who meddled where she had no business, as well as an awful stepmother.
Karenjade 2 years ago 5
Ok I understand. But Anne's charities and reforms were important. Stop seeing Anne as a monster when she was a very complex woman, the same as Katharine. The fact that you won't even acknowledge Henry's other wives as queens shows that you're biased too!
GoddessofHyrule 2 years ago 2
I never said Anne was a monster; I said she was an usurper, pretender and awful stepmother who let her ambition get the better of her and reached far to high; Thus it cost her big time in the end.
Karenjade 2 years ago
All right. Personally, we'll have to agree to disagree. I view Anne as one of England's best QUEENS along with her daughter, Elizabeth, Eleanor of Aquitiane, and Philippa of Hainault.
GoddessofHyrule 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
hahaha "amazing" serpent..seducing a married man only for her ambicious..
Divided a country, a family and finally she had the end that she wanted for Catherine and Mary karma!
And she wasn´t protestant..in fact she hasn´t faith,she only wish power
And rememeber, during all his reign Henry was a devoted catholic..Henry only declares that the head of the England church is the king not the pope..England hasn´t the same religion process the rest of Protestants countries
astrofabio68 3 years ago
She was CENTURIES ahead of her time- your precious Katharine was about 300 years behind! I don't understand all the anti-Anne stuff- she was a woman more of our time than hers how DARE you hate a woman so far ahead of her time- it's women like YOU that keep the rest of us from advancing forward in society! And if my comment is thumbed down, it'll just show that women WANT to remain subordiante to men! Go to Hell and worship Katharine there!
AndromedaMariaCarmen 3 years ago
and what kind of "advance" she represents..?
a woman who uses the sex to obtain position? thats is be 300 years in the future? wow! go, go prostitutes to the power..and Catherine was only a loyal subject and devoted mother and wife and the best queen of those times, cultivated, smart, loyal to her country and people..yak!
in the next elections I will vote Cicciolina! an amazing woman!
I think you check you values, lady...
astrofabio68 3 years ago
Get your facts straight! Anne refused Henry's advances because she saw what happened to her sister. She refused him until he offered her the crown- you blame the woman, just like any anti feminist does! Catherine did nothing except take Henry's abuse! Anne promoted charities and helped bring in the Reformation, and also saved many lives from execution. Read an actual biography of her, don't just get your sources from Phillipa Gregory! Or try Robin Maxwell! Anne- rules. Catherine- doormat trash!
AndromedaMariaCarmen 3 years ago
because I`m feminist , I think the woman who uses seduction or sex to achieve her goals is playing under the patriarcal world rules...
Katherine was a queen who defends her child legitimates rights to the throne of England even being a woman..
who was more advanced woman.."andromeda"?
Use your brain not your fundamentilsm to talk
astrofabio68 3 years ago
She was the real daughter of Queen Isabel of Castile. Like her mother, she fights for her rights.Unfortunately,she was not as a practical politician as her father King Fernando.
waltraute74 3 years ago
Wasn't it Queen Isabella and King Ferdinand?
littlemissmoo14 3 years ago
The very same. But their real names in spanish are Isabel, you call her Isabella, and Fernando,you say Ferdinand.
waltraute74 3 years ago
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evaperonfan 2 years ago
did nothing except take henrys abuse? did she not also help charities? was a skilled regent? was intelligant? was caring? saved lives from exacution(she is actually remebered in a street ballad for this)? managed to manage a whole household on her own at a young age with extremely little money in a foreign counrty in which she spoke little of the language - a language which she learned during that time. cont...
katharinethequene 3 years ago
agreed!
katharinethequene 3 years ago
there is no need to get so angry and hope tht people go to hell, katherine wasnt 300 yrs behind, she was a conempary - and there is nothing wrong with being with the times. it isnt her fault that women in scoiety arent advancing - which they are - just because she "dares" not to like anne boleyn, thats her choice and others, as it it yours not to like katherine
katharinethequene 3 years ago 2
a doormat? did education for women in england not become fashionable through her influence? did she not support colleges?she was fiesty and stood up for her and her daughters rights, for others and defied henry. trash? no she was far from that, she is a wonderful rolemodel.
katharinethequene 3 years ago
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AndromedaMariaCarmen 3 years ago
To judge the behavior and moral conduct of people living in the middle of the 16th century by today's standarts is plane stupid and idiotic. History is written for the future generations to learn and evolve, not to judge them, they did what they did because that's what they knew and beleived in those days. You are nobody to judge them, you are most wellcome to analyse and learn from this events but keep your little personal "trial" and "convition" for your own family, will you?.
mcmlxvi 3 years ago 2