Fortunately RPG has some 10 times smaller typical engagement range than this thing, and this machine is expected to operate on flanks or second line of armor division with tons of anti-infantry armament.
@krbosak True,true...But considering the warfare of today,its more of army vs guerrillan insurgents than army vs army.They also seem to have compromised ,armor for mobility.
@codename47ist The conclusion is that thing was conceived for symmetrical warfare and it might be waste of time to convert it into asymmetrical warfare from the point of view of developed countries. Same for coastal anti-ship battery and torpedo boats. If you start converting it into anti-infantry vehicle with some optional anti-tank capability, you will sooner or later get BMP-3 which btw shares the same chassis. For urban warfare still not enough, you get BMPT.
@tomaspruzina I have nothing against muslims just the extreme fanatics that like to kill the innocence, the British DID do that for 800 years until we got our freedom, but times have changed and they are now are closest friend and ally , i think that should turn to politics for answers not religion. we do not support the ira anymore because they started to act like the taliban , to be honest its religion that is the biggest killer and threat to anyone and thus it is why i dont believe in it.
@tomaspruzina your comment made no sense and from what i gathered you support insurgency plus you say i wouldn have the balls to do anything if my country invaded even though i volunteered to join my army reserve at 17 while still in school.
@BitnikGr You put missiles on a APC, why cant you just put a 30mm on that, and carry infantry in the back instead of being a bullet magnet with almost nothing to defend yourself with.
Today you can get more firepower with a platoon equipped with portable Modern anti tank / anti air weapons
@RaptorDiablo You are risking lives of that infantry... they have to operate outside of the vehicle and in most cases within the range of enemy tank effective range.
Also, you call it a stupid idea, but almost ALL armies in the world have tank-killers based on APCs. TOW armed Stryker variant, "Shturm" based on MTLB, M901 ITV with TOWs based on M113.
In APC you can't arm all 6-9 men with anti-tank weapons. Meaning they can't carry 15 ATGMs.
Furthermore, infantry carried ATGMs are lighter, with lighter warhead, meaning less penetration ability. Missile of Khrizantema is supersonic and cannot be carried by infantry AT team.
Mobility of self-propelled vehicle is much greater than APC with infantry squad, which has to dismount, scatter at hundreds yards from the vehicle and then get back again before moving to another point.
@PewPewPlasmagun Yes... The slower is the speed, the easier it is for APS (Arena, Trophy) to engage the incoming round. The slower is the speed, more time operator is pinned down.
Why do India, Russia develop hypersonic cruise missiles? For same reason. Much more difficult to intercept an object moving at 6Mach+.
of course. thats also the reason why jets can not shoot down tactical missiles- as the imbecilic nato command claimed in libya, where they destroyed scud missiles with their superjets.
even if it is an old tactical missiles- YOU CAN NOT SHOOT IT DOWN with the kind of air to air missiles that a fighterjet carries! dumbasses. it's too fast!
Yeah give an idiot an RPG 7 and tell him to hide among women and children or in urban area and you will be surprised what can be done especially when they believe there are virgins waiting for them
The rusians have their own MLRS that as you say can do both, but this is a dedicated tank killer that is a lot better than the us anti tank systems so i would feel a lot safer with this in a battel
@NigelGriff let me guess your american ?? What ever america has whether it be tow or jav the russians have their own substitute and at half the cost and weight of the US stuff...just look at the rpg 7 that has been in use for 50 years and is still effective today..
@wez46 The Kornet is a good weapon, but it is not really like the Javelin. The Kornet is not fire and forget, it weighs a good bit more and has a smaller warhead.
Also, the RPG7 is an unguided rocket. It doesn't really compare to anything here.
@wez46 Hey, I am not knocking the RPG 7, or it's current incarnation. That thing was/is a hell of a weapon. We've had Blackhawks downed by the damn thing after all.
@Elthenar Javelin has 2 great features. Fire and forget infrared guidance and top attack. But it also has 4 disadvantages. 1) 2.5km is within range of enemy tank gun. 2) Is not yet very reliable. Many misfires were reported. 3) Infra-red guidance is not reliable in non contrast environment. 4) Huge price. 120.000$?
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Kornet-EM and ED are fire-and-forget. Range is increased from 5 to 8-10km. Salvo with 2 Kornets defeat any hard-kill systems.
@BitnikGr As I said, the Kornet is not really like the Javelin. The Kornet EM is not man portable if I am not mistaken, btw. The Javelin is actually pretty reliable. The price tag per missile is only around 35,000$. The 120,000 is a complete weapon package.
The javelin isn't really needed much at this point though. The Taliban doesn't exactly have much heavy armor lol.
@Elthenar I suggest you read what you wrote before stuffing both your feet in your mouth...I qoute:a) It is not very reliable right now... many misfires were reported.Un qoute...Opppppppppppppps! Now go read through and start again.....
@NigelGriff Javelin range 2.5km (within enemy tank gun range). TOW range - 3.2km (within tank gun range). Khrizantema range - 6km (outside most of modern tank gun range). Anti-tank infantry team operate in open field. Khrizantema crew operates under armor protection. AT infantry team can't bring 16 missiles and can't change positions quickly. Khrizantema can.
The most important thing in anti-tank warfare is to stay out of their range. It is stupid to compare 2.5-3.2km with 6km range!
MLRS isn't used for targets in line of sight... or let's say at distances 2-3km. Compare MLRS with MLRS and anti-tank with anti-tank. Otherwise it is like comparing an orange with an apple.
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I am sure you can name US tank killer system with double guidance system, simultaneously attacking 2 different targets, or 1 target by 2 missiles in salvo, non-wire guided with range up to 6km...
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Or better stick with MegaBurgers you like so much :)))
Germany still is working on world Control. They never gave up this idea but they failed to do it openly during the war. Today they are using snitchers to infiltrate foreign countries and manipulate their population and their government. Preferably against each other. And they infiltrate the economy of other states. They are using brainwashing and steering techniques abroad to get rid of people not being pro german. As somebody said: We don´t have nukes so we have to do this.
Funny how the americans name everything with acronyms like FMTV (Family of Medium Tactical Vehicles), HEMTT (Heavy Expanded Mobility Tactical Truck) or even SHW (Solid Human Waste) = Shit!
Yet the russians name their tank killer after a flower! How cute! :D
@BitnikGr Wow! and we sell all art of weapons from simple Handweapon till Heavy tanks, Jets, Carriers for India. Can you build thats all and call it one of the best like ours? The point is, "Skandinavian88" said "Sweden has a better weapons". ok maybe you have something one or two things what good is but hey talking about a better weapons...
@RusFanatic Just like you are Russian Fanatic, he is a Swedish Fanatic. Just like everything Russian is best for you, everything Swedish is best for him. :)))
Objectively speaking, only CV-90 is indeed incredible vehicle, better than any other European and to some even better than American or Russian approach for IFV. Everything else are good, but not like World's best of the best.
Only in one matter it would be difficult for me to choose the winner. Swedish girls are just damn beautiful like Russian ones :) We can't stop admiring them here in Greece, every summer :)
Russias historic capture of a few square miles in only 4 days from a nation of a few million. Military manpower ..45000...lololol.
Russias C3 system broke down
Glosnass didnt work
One commander had to borrow a sat phone from a reporter to communicate Result .. the Russians go crying to France for the Mistral class and are still crying due to France holding off on technology transfer. Yep...technology transfer
...and we can't capture a few square miles of worthless desert in A'stan 3.500+ days against primitive towelheads with 140.000+ soldiers (not counting the ANA cowards)
...oh and in case you missed it...Libya is still holding out after over 100 days...without preparation time, without infrastructure like Yugoslavija had in 1999, without vegetation cover or a rugged geography
@brocalfur awful bold words. The issue is more civilian casualties and pacifying. If it was pure capture, NATO could simply level it. Besides, aren't you a kraut?
@StiviGun1 Approximate numbers of anti-tank units in Russian Army.
Shturm-S and -SM - 820
Konkurs on BRDM - 290
Rapira AT gun - 400
At least in 43 divisions.
Anti-tank forces are combined of anti-tank gun units and SP anti-tank missile units in ratio usually 1:3 and numbers are dividable to 6.
I don't know about numbers of Khrizantema, but in total all self-propelled anti-tank missile vehicles are about 1100-1300 of all versions all together.
Well it's not old and it is not "Slow". It is not a tank it is a defensive weapon/Support, which means it will always attack in "First-strike" situation.
It's very slow. It seems like it'd be extremely shitty in a quick firefight situation and only good for suprise attacks. I mean those arms seemed like they took a considerable time just to deploy. Judging by the quality of the video this must be old technology though. Pretty cool looking.
@VengefulMilk "and only good for suprise attacks." - Guess what. Since WWII all anti-tank self-propelled weapons are designed for surprise attack from ambush and not for tank duels. IS-100, ISU-122, Jagdpanther, British Archers... all of them were operating from covered positions. Whenever they were tried in open tank battles, (like Kursk) they 've suffered heavy losses.
Specifications of Bulava well published, for example by its General constructor Yuri Solomonov
izvestia. ru/person/article3140744/
And thanks for admiting that you are just clueless troll - instead of posting some ACTUAL technical information to prove your statements you just desperately trying to debate about my personal credibility LOL)))
Specifications of Bulava well published, for example by its General constructor Yuri Solomonov
izvestia. ru/person/article3140744/
And thanks for admiting that you are just clueless troll - instead of posting some ACTUAL technical information to prove your statements you just desperately trying to debate about my personal credibility LOL)))
Specifications of Bulava well published, for example by its General constructor Yuri Solomonov
izvestia. ru/person/article3140744/
And thanks for admiting that you are just clueless troll - instead of posting some ACTUAL technical information to prove your statements you just desperately trying to debate about my personal credibility LOL)))
No dummy - Iskander was NOT used - Tochka-U (predecessor of Iskander) was used on military objects around Gori - ONLY.
No satphones was used - CELLPHONES was used, and only because there was need to cooerinate with OSSETIAN MILITIA - which had no military comm hardware at all.
I repeat again idiot - Georgians used NATO comm, firearms, armoeed vehicles, training, tactics, uniform, UAVs, artillery - e t c - yet they failed war MISERABLY against much smaller Russian forces.
@MarshallJukov Actually, the Russian forces got their asses kicked on the ground in Georgia. That's why Russia resorted to indiscriminate bombing of cities, killing a lot of civilians. Get this through your head. If Russia hadn't used its air force, they would've suffered a very humiliating defeat on the ground in Georgia.
@StiviGun1 There were no ground battles "on the ground of Georgia". Since, Russians free Tskhinvali and moved to the South, Georgians forces fled toward capital. And this wasn't an organized retreat. They fled in panic without order, leaving everything behind... arms, tanks (12 were destroyed in action, 52 were captured intact), ammo.
Do you have footage of "indiscriminate" bombing and maybe you have even number of civilian casualties?
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There was only one case of bomb shell found in town of...
@BitnikGr The Russians entered with their ground forces in Georgia, what the hell are you talking about? There was a ground confrontation there which the Russians have won, that's true. But there was a ground confrontation.
Of cource we entered Georgia - AFTER georgian army attacked Ossetia and peacekeeper headquarters))) But there war NO ground combat in Georgia simply because on 12 august the entire georgian army FLED
@MarshallJukov There were ground fights between the Georgian army and the Russian army. They fled, but there were ground fights. I saw it on the news. The Georgians didn't flee immediately. They stood and fought for a while and when they saw they're being overwhelmed, then they fled. I remember very clearly there were ground fights in that conflict. The Georgians held their grounds for a while before fleeing.
Oh you saw it on the news))) Reuters i bet))) Sorry - there was noone to fight - all fled and abandoned their stuff in tact, whole WAREHOUSES of military equipment was salvaged by Ru army without a shot fired))) In Gori EVEN POLICE FLED so Russian army forced to keep an eye over civilian order for them LOL)))
Those rare footages of georgians actualy fighting was just FIRST TWO DAYS - when they felt they are unbeatable in fighting with pregnant women and children))))
@StiviGun1 Ground fight between units of Russian Army and Georgian army took place only in exit of Roksy tunnel and in Tskhinvali.
Overwhelmed is a favorite pussy excuse of modern SS lovers speaking about WW II. Georgian superiority in numbers and in equipment were much higher against Ossetian militia, than Russian 58th Army against Georgian one.
Ossetians were REALLY overwhelmed and they didn't fled! Because, they were fighting for their home!
@StiviGun1 Well, yes. If counting S. Ossetia as Georgian territory, as it was till 8.8.2008.
I meant that there was no ground confrontation outside of S. Ossetia, because they fled disorderly to Tbilisi.
And actually Russian Army did exactly what they had right to do! To push party which wanted to solve the problem by military means outside of control zone of peacekeepers. This party was the Georgian army. Ground confrontation didn't happened outside of marked by UN conflict zone.
Gori. This footage was presented by Georgian television. No victims, just some minor structural damage to the building exterior. Bomb was a cluster bomb of Soviet origin and was dropped from SU-25. But at that day, Russian Air Force had only 2 sorties against Vaziani Air Base, which is located far away from Gori. Even Georgian opposition says that this particular cluster bomb was dropped from Georgian SU-25, in order to blame Russia later in use of prohibited ammunition against...
@BitnikGr Georgian opposition. They are nothing but whores than would say anything just to win the election. Their claims have no value at all.
As for what the Russians claim, that the Georgians bombed their own cities, then you really are brainwashed. Of course the Russians would say this, it's not like they would admit they killed innocent people. But the truth is they did. They're in no way better than the Americans that they criticize and accuse of war crimes. Of course they wouldn't want
@BitnikGr the world to see their true face after they were making huge propaganda against the American "war crimes". But if you believe that, then you're an idiot.
@StiviGun1 Georgian opposition is actually US whores too. But anyhow, usually it is the opposition which says the truth, and it is usually a government, which tries to conceal it.
Russians didn't say anything about this event, they just show sorties of their SU-25 at that day. And they asked Georgians to show remaining of cluster bomb's case. Which they never did.
Fact is that only one single cluster bomb of unknown airforce was dropped in low density residential area of Gori with no casualties.
@BitnikGr Actually, the opposition is the one that doesn't say the truth. They're nothing but whores who's sole objective is to win the next elections. So their claims are far from being credible.
As for footage with Russian attacks on civilians on that, YouTube is full of them. All you have to do is search.
I don`t need to, for theese 3 years i studied every fake they came up with, just as ubiquitous fake Reuters photoes or Gori bombings with footage of destroyed Tskhinvali)) Sorry it simply does not goes this way. Russia did not bombed any civilian targets whatsoever.
@MarshallJukov "Russia did not bombed any civilian targets whatsoever" Again, just a simple statement with no proof to back it up. You say you don't need to go find the evidence that you bombed civilians in Georgia. Why? Because you're afraid that you'll see that you're full of shit?
Here's jus ONE of many evidence: watch ? v = q o D28V3lgSc. Of course, I know, that just like a sissy that you are, you'll call it "Georgian or Reuters propaganda". That's how brainwashed you are.
@StiviGun1 And you have FACE to show that lame video dumbass?))) 0:31 killed georgian soldier in Ossetia 0:40 Known Reuters fake foto 0:46 Tskhinvali hospital basement 0:50 Tskhinvali hospital basement 1:00 Known Reuters fake foto 1:13 same as 1:001:22-1:36 same as 1:002:38 same as 1:00 etc ZERO of autentic photographs and footages, LIKE THIS ONE watch?v=vsn0UlK8qkM watch?v=YRTTH90nwJM watch?v=5g40m8uU_ss Not to mention war080808 com Get lost already freak
@MarshallJukov government? So far, you didn't prove anything. Now I;m CONVINCED that all the footage that shows images with the Russian bombings in Georgia are true. If this is the type of "evidence" that you have, then it's more than certain that all the accusations that are brought to you are true.
@StiviGun1 Don't be stupid. Any modern Georgian Russian-hater puts fake videos, write misleading titles, description as he likes, he closes comments and rating and you call that a source?
No, my friend! I want it WRITTEN in PRESS! With NAMES of casualties! As you saw, in articles mentioned about Imedi scam, there are names of victims.
So, I am waiting from you now... how many, at which date, by what means were inflicted Georgian civilian casualties by Russian Army?
@BitnikGr There is plenty of footage with Gori being bombed by Russian planes. I know the difference between the Georgian language and the Russian language. And those people being bombed were speaking Georgian, not Russian and they were telling how the Russian air force is bombing them.
They could tell what they want in any language even martian, but no geniune footages or any other solid proof of Russian bombing of civilian targets in Georgia exists. Simply because there wasn`t any - otherwise all georgian/western propaganda employees would make a story of a century out of it. Period.
@MarshallJukov No solid proof of Russian bombings of civilians in Georgia? You really live in denial. Like I said, you can find a lot of proofs on the internet. But you even admitted that you won't look for it. This speaks for itself. You're just a brainwashed that prefers to live in denial. So sad.
@StiviGun1 Do you know difference between Ossetian language and Georgian language, smartass? Ossetia was bombed, not Russia. People there speak Ossetian, and you think it is Georgian!
Furthermore, from that footage, they didn't show any soldier, despite there were men in uniform. When one man with AK got in frame, they cut it fast in order to not show his uniform. In footage from real Gori, they show openly soldiers with Georgian markings on uniforms... But in footage of burning building,...
@BitnikGr OK, smartass, what is the difference between the Georgia language and the Ossetian language? Tell me. The Ossetians are Georgians and they speak the same language.
@StiviGun1 ... they cut off the single man with uniform as soon as he gets into the picture. Very neat!
There is a video from footage from Gori recorded by Western journalists. Footage taken from whole day from different part of the town. No panic, no smoke and fires, people are walking, public transport works fine... nothing like bombed city. Nothing like indiscriminate bombing. Nothing like leveled city... like Tskhinvali.
@BitnikGr And where is that footage "from Gori recorded by Western journalists"? Show it to me. Send me the URL. I've never seen a person that's so full of shit as you are.
You're talking about some soldier that was cut off from the frame. Where is that footage? Show it to me. Is this what they brainwash with in Russia? The "argument" about that soldier being cut off from the frame looks VERY MUCH like the type of propaganda your government makes. Come on. Show me that footage.
civilians. Only facts that it was only one single bomb, that it was dropped on outside district of Gori with smallest density of population, that Georgia used same type of SU-25 and had such bombs, that they didn’t show any external part of bomb with markings (which could discover their lie) leads to thinking that it was staged… as many other things. Georgia lost that war, but they won the PR and informational war.
Other case is when Spanish TV took footage of “Russia Today”...
from burning Tskhinvali and presented it as “burning Gori”. Of course, they apologized later to RT and its journalist, who recorded that footage, but millions of viewers have seen it already and believed in it.
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In fact more Georgian civilians have died, because of that nutcase Saakashvili, than any Russian actions.
First case happened when Georgian TV station “Imedi” have presented a braking news footage that Saakashvili is assassinated, that Russian forces invaded Georgia...
(again) and are moving toward capital. People panicked. Many run to the banks to withdraw money, others run to gas stations to fill up their cars, others moved to Georgian-Armenian borders. 2 elderly died because of heart-attack. Of course, it wasn’t true news. As channel tried to excuse later, they wanted to present a possible scenario and they had direct order from Saakashvili himself to not warn people, that this is not real events! Actually even White House blamed him for ...
Another case was a destruction of the monument in memory of Georgian soldiers, who fought in WW II. When Georgian veterans heard this, they got mad and organized meeting in order to prevent destruction of the monument. But they planned it for the exact day when demolishing was planned. So, Saakashvili ordered ASAP demolition, without necessary safety precautions. Monument was exploded by TNT charges day before it was planned. One woman with her...
@StiviGun1 ... child died, because of pieces of this monument flew hundred meters away. Area wasn’t evacuated, people were not informed! These are the only civilian casualties confirmed by Georgian sources since 8/8/2008, and they are direct responsibility (or actually total absence of it) of that stupid murderer, who eats ties.
List of victims of Ossetian civilians are published. More than 200 names of men and women of every age. Names of Georgian “civilian casualties” are unknown. Because...
@StiviGun1 :))) Brainless monkey, who hasn't ability to comprehend what he is reading!
Incidents caused by "Imedi" TV channel and demolishing of WW II monuments were in European and American Press and News. Do you want me to find statements of State Department where they blamed Saakashvili for irresponsibility of his decisions? Especially by ordering the report of Russian attack, without noting viewers that this is just a scenario and not real events.
Its really pointless to debate with this idiot. He has schizoaffective psychosis - denies everything that contradicts his imaginary world. I have strong suspicion that he likes to smoke some strong pot in order to obtain some new fantasies on subjects he trying to brag about.
@MarshallJukov There are a lot of trolling retards here on Youtube. Either pro-Russian, either pro-American. It doesn't matter. This one is not troll. But I am confident that his profile is lying about his real age and about his country. The way he speaks, I would say he is at least 50years old American, who's best years of youth past during Cold War era. People like him are just old dogs, who are too old to learn new tricks. They can't change their mentality, so they live in Cold War era yet.
@BitnikGr :))))) Actually, my friend, I am from Romania and I am 26 years old. And I don't live in the Cold War era. Or at least, if I do, than you do too. But the truth is I'm just saying some FACTS. And this doesn't mean that I live in the "Cold War era" at all.
@BitnikGr I know about that incident, you idiot. It was presented in the Romanian news too. But we were talking about the fact that the Russians bombed civilians in Georgia. And they don't admit it. They even have the nerve to say that the images and footage that shows how they bombed and killed civilians there it's just Georgia and Western propaganda.
@StiviGun1 How could you know about it, if you repeatedly was asking me for proofs, asshole?
It’s “you know shit” evidence N3.
Yeah, yeah… continue repeating this mantra 2000 per day and then may be someone will believe you. And only if he is mentally handicapped just like you are.
Still, you didn’t present any proofs except footage from a channel, which was already caught lying!
@StiviGun1 "On 16 March 2010, TIME placed the fake report at number one of the "Top 10 Shocking Hoaxes", ahead of the Ashley Todd mugging hoax, balloon boy hoax, KSJJ Ochoco Dam hoax, Sidd Finch hoax, 1938 The War of the Worlds radio hoax, Anna Anderson, Hitler Diaries hoax, Piltdown Man and the Great Stock Exchange Fraud of 1814."
@StiviGun1 Mr. "I know shit" Returns and Strikes again! Where from did I copy that text then? Or maybe you think that I remember Georgian names by heart?
time . com/time/specials/packages/article/0,28804,1931133_1931132_1972067,00 . html
Here is your link, stupid. And if you so brain damaged that you can't remove spaces around dots, then just google for "Top 10 Shocking Hoaxes".
Gaioz Odishelidze, an inhabitant of the village of Aragvispiri in the Dusheti district, died of a heart attack whilst watching the programme. According to his son, Odishelidze cried out "What the hell's going on?", before grabbing his chest and collapsing.
humanrights . ge/index . php?a=main&pid=11641&lang=eng - One More Person Died Because of Imedi Reportage!
Vano Nasaridze, a 75-year old refugee from Sukhumi living in Tbilisi, suffered a stroke whilst watching the broadcast.
@BitnikGr This still doesn't change the fact that the Russians bombed and killed innocent civilians in that conflict. Gori was bombed and people died. That's a fact.
@StiviGun1 That's only you and other "indiscriminate haters" say and it is actually YOU who can't back up your so called "facts" with sources... even Western ones, since you don't believe in anything written in Russian.
Again! I am asking you! Date? Numbers? Names? Where are they buried?
Because all the above are available in S. Ossetia. Where are 260 Georgian civilian casualties claimed by GEORGIAN state?
@BitnikGr My sources are all over YT. Like I said, you can type Russian bombings in Georgia and you'll find all the proofs you need. And you haven't shown any evidence to support your claims either.
@StiviGun1 This does change the fact that you called me a liar and I've proved all 4 deaths by stupid actions of stupid Saakashvili. Meanwhile you haven't backed up your claims about civilian losses neither with numbers, date, names... because there are no names! And it is you who lies!
@StiviGun1 French, British, EU, NATO, American TIME - everyone blamed Saakashvili for irresponsibility of his stupid actions. (Take in mind that all sources are not Russian, and I event didn't mentioned Russian response to this circus).
@BitnikGr Well, show me those "French, British, EU, NATO, American TIME sources". Show them. Prove your claims. But I know that just like a sissy that you are you'll just find any excuses not to do it.
@BitnikGr Well, if people were killed during that demolition, that's too bad and yeah, those who did it must be punished. But as far as that monument is concerned, GOOD. It's good that they destroyed it. The Russians were even bigger aggressors than the Germans, in specially after the war ended. Just ask the old people in the countries they "liberated" what the Russians did. How they raped, how they robed, how they killed. So fuck their monuments and their so called "heroes"!
That monument was not the the Russians moron LOL))) That was monument to GEORGIAN WW2 veterans.
And USSR wasn`t any kind of aggressor in WW2, nobody was raped or robbed either, nobody could come up with any solid fact to support rediculous nonsense Anthony Beevor came up with LOL))
And for a guy from Romania - an ally of nazis who commited numerous warcrimes in the Soviet Union, aspecialy in Odessa you have quite a big mouth.
@MarshallJukov Ahh, yes... I forgot that. Romania was a Nazi ally! That explains a lot.
Destruction of entire 6th army under Stalingrad was because Germans put these loosers to guard their flanks. Soviet Army counter-attack faced Bulgarian, Hungarian and Romanian units, who fled AS SOON AS they heard first Katyusha salvos (just like Georgians) and entire German Army with elite SS units fighting for Stalingrad got surrounded!
@BitnikGr RIBENTROP-MOLOTOV=THE PACT THAT YOU SIGNED WITH THE NAZIS. That is ALLIANCE. We didn't sign any pact with them. We simply went to get what was ours. You attacked us, you stole a part of OUR territory. We had all the rights to go against you.
As for the "Romania war crimes" you can repeat this bullshit all you want. It was you who were the aggressors and who committed atrocities in all the countries that you OCCUPIED.
@StiviGun1 you, you, you, you, you, you... you are like a whining bitch! What was yours? Stalingrad was yours? Odessa was yours?
My country didn't pact with anyone. My country fought against Mussolini's fascism and kicked their asses. My country then was occupied by Germans and Bulgarians. And we fought like partisans since then. Like every men who fights and dies for freedom! Polish, Yugoslavians, French, Greeks! Everyone fought!
Pussies surrendered without a fight and allied with Nazi. Pussy!
@MarshallJukov You can live in denial all you want. The fact that you OCCUPIED BY MILITARY FORCE a lot of countries in WW2 is a fact. So are the atrocities you so called "soldiers" committed there. In specially the rapes. In every country that yo occupied, old people talks about the rapes your soldiers committed.
As for Romania Being "allied with the Nazis", well, we were not the one that signed PACTS WITH THEM that allowed us to attack other countries. You did. And you were the ones that
@StiviGun1 Oh... so you want to say us that you are a covert Nazi lover and you prefer Nazi rule and you like fascism. You prefer to loose your freedom and civilian rights to "good" SS fellows and live like a mouse in your house, and to not have rights for basic education, medical health-care... Because your SS friends, will sure not give this to you, as a Slav you are.
@BitnikGr The communist regime, you idiot, was in no way better than the Nazi one. People lived in houses "like a mouse" and they were sent to prison anyway under the communist regimes. You go search for info about the atrocities the communists committed against the political prisoners. This happened in all the countries that USSR occupied after the end of WW2.
And you better go get some education boy. We are not a Slavic nation...
Political freedom is of course a great thing and essential basis for democracy. And by no way I would like to live in communist state today. But life was not as bad as you imagine. Probably it is you who lived "like a mouse".
But any comparison of political repressions with atrocities of Nazi against population is way too overstretched. Anyhow, representative democracy is not a real democracy. The only real democracy is a direct democracy and only Athens had it 500 BC.
I can even find that video footage about that single cluster bomb in outskirts of Gori.
Now, I dare you to find names and numbers of civilian casualties killed by "evil communist russians".
Otherwise, your brains are "indiscriminately bombarded" by shitloads of Western propaganda.
If you are really only 26, then I feel really sorry for you. You act like those ones Cold War brainwashed to the last cell of their brain and they can't think sceptically any more.
@BitnikGr Yeah, I want you to find those statements of the State department and prove your ridiculous claims. Because so far, you've only been full of shit. And this is not just about that 2008 conflict. It's about a country, Russia, who's history is full of aggression towards other states, towards it own people, full of inhuman treatment towards its own people and other peoples and about the fact that this country or any of its citizens doesn't have the right to talk about other countries'
@StiviGun1 "Russia, who's history is full of aggression towards other states" - WooHoo! Very well learned statement... Like a parrot! You are talking about facts? Ok. Do you want to count how many military invasions in other countries was done by US and by Soviet Union? Do you?
@BitnikGr Yeah, take you entire history, starting from the Kievan Rus and all the way to the breakup of the USSR. If you say that the US, in all its history invaded more countries than you, then you really are a hopeless brainwashed moron. Go learn about the genocides you committed in all those republics that you annexed and formed the USSR. Go learn about the hunger during the 1930 in Ukraine that killed more than 7 million people. You want me to continue?
God this vid again...its been shown that this system is beatable already and the new systems being brought in can defeat this system EASILY
Atak31 2 weeks ago
@Atak31 Vague, disputable statements are often called bullshit.
krbosak 2 weeks ago
So,what about anti-infantry weaponry,It is still susceptible to R.P.G.
codename47ist 1 month ago
@codename47ist
"It is still susceptible to R.P.G. "
Yes, also susceptible to nuke blast and torpedos.
Fortunately RPG has some 10 times smaller typical engagement range than this thing, and this machine is expected to operate on flanks or second line of armor division with tons of anti-infantry armament.
krbosak 2 weeks ago
@krbosak True,true...But considering the warfare of today,its more of army vs guerrillan insurgents than army vs army.They also seem to have compromised ,armor for mobility.
codename47ist 2 weeks ago
@codename47ist The conclusion is that thing was conceived for symmetrical warfare and it might be waste of time to convert it into asymmetrical warfare from the point of view of developed countries. Same for coastal anti-ship battery and torpedo boats. If you start converting it into anti-infantry vehicle with some optional anti-tank capability, you will sooner or later get BMP-3 which btw shares the same chassis. For urban warfare still not enough, you get BMPT.
krbosak 2 weeks ago
DOESN'T THE RAFAEL TANK MISSILE DEFENSE SYSTEM render Anti tank missiles obsolete? I thought it did alreadyyy!!
dalesalsa 2 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@dalesalsa "DOESN'T THE RAFAEL TANK MISSILE DEFENSE SYSTEM render Anti tank missiles obsolete?"
No.
It can be defeated with two missiles spaced 0.1s, even recent RPG can do that.
krbosak 2 weeks ago
what is the base a btr?
sgtdavidlopez 2 months ago
@sgtdavidlopez BMP :]
armedziak 2 months ago
wow!!!
arthas211083 3 months ago
1 meter- with ERA. without 1.25 meter.
PewPewPlasmagun 4 months ago
@tomaspruzina I have nothing against muslims just the extreme fanatics that like to kill the innocence, the British DID do that for 800 years until we got our freedom, but times have changed and they are now are closest friend and ally , i think that should turn to politics for answers not religion. we do not support the ira anymore because they started to act like the taliban , to be honest its religion that is the biggest killer and threat to anyone and thus it is why i dont believe in it.
wez46 4 months ago
@tomaspruzina your comment made no sense and from what i gathered you support insurgency plus you say i wouldn have the balls to do anything if my country invaded even though i volunteered to join my army reserve at 17 while still in school.
wez46 4 months ago
@tomaspruzina man your retarded
wez46 4 months ago
This is stupid.
RaptorDiablo 4 months ago
@RaptorDiablo Common. Admit it. You just can't understand it... so you easily call it "stupid". :)
BitnikGr 4 months ago
@BitnikGr You put missiles on a APC, why cant you just put a 30mm on that, and carry infantry in the back instead of being a bullet magnet with almost nothing to defend yourself with.
Today you can get more firepower with a platoon equipped with portable Modern anti tank / anti air weapons
RaptorDiablo 4 months ago
@RaptorDiablo You are risking lives of that infantry... they have to operate outside of the vehicle and in most cases within the range of enemy tank effective range.
Also, you call it a stupid idea, but almost ALL armies in the world have tank-killers based on APCs. TOW armed Stryker variant, "Shturm" based on MTLB, M901 ITV with TOWs based on M113.
In APC you can't arm all 6-9 men with anti-tank weapons. Meaning they can't carry 15 ATGMs.
...
BitnikGr 4 months ago
@RaptorDiablo ...
Furthermore, infantry carried ATGMs are lighter, with lighter warhead, meaning less penetration ability. Missile of Khrizantema is supersonic and cannot be carried by infantry AT team.
Mobility of self-propelled vehicle is much greater than APC with infantry squad, which has to dismount, scatter at hundreds yards from the vehicle and then get back again before moving to another point.
BitnikGr 4 months ago
@BitnikGr
but allegedly the penetration is same as infantry- carried AT-14 (kornet).
the speed is higher! so its the same kornet, only on an BMP-3?
PewPewPlasmagun 4 months ago
@PewPewPlasmagun Kornet is not supersonic :)
BitnikGr 4 months ago
@BitnikGr well thats true. does it make it that much less effective?
PewPewPlasmagun 4 months ago
@PewPewPlasmagun Yes... The slower is the speed, the easier it is for APS (Arena, Trophy) to engage the incoming round. The slower is the speed, more time operator is pinned down.
Why do India, Russia develop hypersonic cruise missiles? For same reason. Much more difficult to intercept an object moving at 6Mach+.
BitnikGr 4 months ago
@BitnikGr
of course. thats also the reason why jets can not shoot down tactical missiles- as the imbecilic nato command claimed in libya, where they destroyed scud missiles with their superjets.
even if it is an old tactical missiles- YOU CAN NOT SHOOT IT DOWN with the kind of air to air missiles that a fighterjet carries! dumbasses. it's too fast!
PewPewPlasmagun 4 months ago
@PewPewPlasmagun WRONG!
Atak31 2 weeks ago
Yeah give an idiot an RPG 7 and tell him to hide among women and children or in urban area and you will be surprised what can be done especially when they believe there are virgins waiting for them
wez46 5 months ago
what a piece of shit compared to our MLRS lol
MegaSteakburger 5 months ago
@MegaSteakburger shows how much you know you idiot. MLRS is an artillery piece. this is a anti tank system.
Hatinonthehaters 5 months ago
@Hatinonthehaters yes it is but a multiple launch rocket system can do both and this is a missile system the united states version is better
MegaSteakburger 5 months ago
The rusians have their own MLRS that as you say can do both, but this is a dedicated tank killer that is a lot better than the us anti tank systems so i would feel a lot safer with this in a battel
wez46 5 months ago
@wez46 Hardly better than US anti tank systems.
NigelGriff 5 months ago
@NigelGriff ha and you would know
wez46 5 months ago
@wez46 Javelin is far superior and man portable. Even TOW's are better weapon systems than this.
NigelGriff 5 months ago
@NigelGriff let me guess your american ?? What ever america has whether it be tow or jav the russians have their own substitute and at half the cost and weight of the US stuff...just look at the rpg 7 that has been in use for 50 years and is still effective today..
wez46 5 months ago
@wez46 Yeah, but you can't shoot and kill a main battle tank at 2km with an RPG-7.
NigelGriff 5 months ago
@NigelGriff yeah thats why they have the 9M133 Kornet that has a range of 5 kilometres
wez46 5 months ago
@wez46 The Kornet is a good weapon, but it is not really like the Javelin. The Kornet is not fire and forget, it weighs a good bit more and has a smaller warhead.
Also, the RPG7 is an unguided rocket. It doesn't really compare to anything here.
Elthenar 5 months ago
@Elthenar yeah i know its line of sight weapon but man those things took down merkavas
Yeah i know there un guided but i was just stating that its 50 years old and is still in use today
wez46 5 months ago
@wez46 Hey, I am not knocking the RPG 7, or it's current incarnation. That thing was/is a hell of a weapon. We've had Blackhawks downed by the damn thing after all.
Elthenar 5 months ago
@Elthenar Javelin is a very promising weapon... It has 2 good things:
a) Fire-and-forget infrared guidance b) top attack
But it has 4 bad things:
a) It is not very reliable right now... many misfires were reported.
b) Infrared guidance is difficult in "non-contrast" environment (making desert an ideal place for Javelins)
c) short range (2.5km is within fire range of enemy tank)
d) huge price! $120.000?!
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Kornet-EM/ED is fire and forget. Range increased from 5 to 8-10km. Double salvo against APS
BitnikGr 4 months ago
@Elthenar Javelin has 2 great features. Fire and forget infrared guidance and top attack. But it also has 4 disadvantages. 1) 2.5km is within range of enemy tank gun. 2) Is not yet very reliable. Many misfires were reported. 3) Infra-red guidance is not reliable in non contrast environment. 4) Huge price. 120.000$?
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Kornet-EM and ED are fire-and-forget. Range is increased from 5 to 8-10km. Salvo with 2 Kornets defeat any hard-kill systems.
BitnikGr 4 months ago
@BitnikGr As I said, the Kornet is not really like the Javelin. The Kornet EM is not man portable if I am not mistaken, btw. The Javelin is actually pretty reliable. The price tag per missile is only around 35,000$. The 120,000 is a complete weapon package.
The javelin isn't really needed much at this point though. The Taliban doesn't exactly have much heavy armor lol.
Elthenar 4 months ago
@Elthenar Wrong Javelin has a high reliability rate.
Atak31 2 weeks ago
@Atak31 I know, that is why I said that it is very reliable. I suggest that you read through and try again.
Elthenar 2 weeks ago
@Elthenar I suggest you read what you wrote before stuffing both your feet in your mouth...I qoute:a) It is not very reliable right now... many misfires were reported.Un qoute...Opppppppppppppps! Now go read through and start again.....
Atak31 2 weeks ago
@Atak31 Crap apologies thought I had clicked on someone replying to one of your threads and ended up messaging you.
Atak31 2 weeks ago
@Atak31 LOL, no problem man. I knew it was something like that.
Elthenar 2 weeks ago
@NigelGriff Neither with AT-4...
Compare comparable things...
BitnikGr 4 months ago
@BitnikGr No, but you can with a TOW or a Javelin
NigelGriff 4 months ago
@NigelGriff Javelin range 2.5km (within enemy tank gun range). TOW range - 3.2km (within tank gun range). Khrizantema range - 6km (outside most of modern tank gun range). Anti-tank infantry team operate in open field. Khrizantema crew operates under armor protection. AT infantry team can't bring 16 missiles and can't change positions quickly. Khrizantema can.
The most important thing in anti-tank warfare is to stay out of their range. It is stupid to compare 2.5-3.2km with 6km range!
BitnikGr 4 months ago
@MegaSteakburger this is a russian mlrs ya dumbass /watch?v=Sq-TRC_z7TQ&feature=related
Hatinonthehaters 5 months ago
@MegaSteakburger
Are you that dumb? You can't compare totally different things. And the Russian BM-30 eats MLRS for breakfast
brocalfur 5 months ago
@MegaSteakburger Man...
MLRS isn't used for targets in line of sight... or let's say at distances 2-3km. Compare MLRS with MLRS and anti-tank with anti-tank. Otherwise it is like comparing an orange with an apple.
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I am sure you can name US tank killer system with double guidance system, simultaneously attacking 2 different targets, or 1 target by 2 missiles in salvo, non-wire guided with range up to 6km...
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Or better stick with MegaBurgers you like so much :)))
BitnikGr 4 months ago
Nice name of flower for deadly weapon! :)
Incizz 6 months ago
So Russia has the transformers. Interesting.
KingBlocko 6 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Germany still is working on world Control. They never gave up this idea but they failed to do it openly during the war. Today they are using snitchers to infiltrate foreign countries and manipulate their population and their government. Preferably against each other. And they infiltrate the economy of other states. They are using brainwashing and steering techniques abroad to get rid of people not being pro german. As somebody said: We don´t have nukes so we have to do this.
See my channel.
wwwtotalitaerde 6 months ago
this is what i like in Russian weapon systems! simple, cheap and effective. Quantity does has a quality on their own!
SagothBaal 6 months ago
2:05 the second missile is a dud.
lanunselat 6 months ago
Funny how the americans name everything with acronyms like FMTV (Family of Medium Tactical Vehicles), HEMTT (Heavy Expanded Mobility Tactical Truck) or even SHW (Solid Human Waste) = Shit!
Yet the russians name their tank killer after a flower! How cute! :D
silvioatutube 7 months ago
@silvioatutube 2S1 "Gvozdika"
2S2 "Fialka"
2S3 "Akatsiya"
2S4 "Tulip" - 240 мм самоходный миномет
2S5 "Giacint"
2S7 "Pion"
2B9M "Vasilek"
BitnikGr 7 months ago
@Skandinavien88 really? who buy your weapons? where is your weapon on internation markt? Well...
RusFanatic 7 months ago
@RusFanatic CV-90 is the best exporting product of Swedish Military Industrual Complex.
They also have sold RBS-70 MANPADS, Draken and Gripen fighters. But the CV-90 is undoubtedly the best European made IFV today.
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr Wow! and we sell all art of weapons from simple Handweapon till Heavy tanks, Jets, Carriers for India. Can you build thats all and call it one of the best like ours? The point is, "Skandinavian88" said "Sweden has a better weapons". ok maybe you have something one or two things what good is but hey talking about a better weapons...
RusFanatic 6 months ago
@RusFanatic Just like you are Russian Fanatic, he is a Swedish Fanatic. Just like everything Russian is best for you, everything Swedish is best for him. :)))
Objectively speaking, only CV-90 is indeed incredible vehicle, better than any other European and to some even better than American or Russian approach for IFV. Everything else are good, but not like World's best of the best.
-
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@RusFanatic ...
Only in one matter it would be difficult for me to choose the winner. Swedish girls are just damn beautiful like Russian ones :) We can't stop admiring them here in Greece, every summer :)
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr thats right , thats right))
RusFanatic 6 months ago
Подписывайтесь!/Subscribe!
MilitaryofRussia 7 months ago
thats a piece of shit compared to my potato gun shooting a pipe bomb at you!
emoboy52893 7 months ago
this is comments to ATGM, not WMD. FAGS !!
some2guy 7 months ago
one Hrisantema = 14 tanks enemy
deadmen71 8 months ago
lol...that thing looks so ghetto
budrick3 8 months ago
Russias historic capture of a few square miles in only 4 days from a nation of a few million. Military manpower ..45000...lololol.
Russias C3 system broke down
Glosnass didnt work
One commander had to borrow a sat phone from a reporter to communicate Result .. the Russians go crying to France for the Mistral class and are still crying due to France holding off on technology transfer. Yep...technology transfer
hanstrutzel 8 months ago
@hanstrutzel Glonass is Work and stop fuking propaganda
Alexei55555 7 months ago
@hanstrutzel
...and we can't capture a few square miles of worthless desert in A'stan 3.500+ days against primitive towelheads with 140.000+ soldiers (not counting the ANA cowards)
...oh and in case you missed it...Libya is still holding out after over 100 days...without preparation time, without infrastructure like Yugoslavija had in 1999, without vegetation cover or a rugged geography
In reality nato turns into a laughing stock
brocalfur 7 months ago
@brocalfur awful bold words. The issue is more civilian casualties and pacifying. If it was pure capture, NATO could simply level it. Besides, aren't you a kraut?
redreaper2020 6 months ago
@hanstrutzel Trollolo!
You remember that that manpower of 45.000 attacked 3000 of peacekeepers and couple of thousands of militians. 45:5 is 9 to 1.
Only Southern Military Disctrict fought against them. 90.000 personnel. 90:45 is 2 to 1 ratio.
BitnikGr 6 months ago
How many of these systems does the Russian army have?
StiviGun1 8 months ago
@StiviGun1 Approximate numbers of anti-tank units in Russian Army.
Shturm-S and -SM - 820
Konkurs on BRDM - 290
Rapira AT gun - 400
At least in 43 divisions.
Anti-tank forces are combined of anti-tank gun units and SP anti-tank missile units in ratio usually 1:3 and numbers are dividable to 6.
I don't know about numbers of Khrizantema, but in total all self-propelled anti-tank missile vehicles are about 1100-1300 of all versions all together.
In best case Khrizantemas are not more than 70.
BitnikGr 6 months ago
Pointless piece of junk
Adats was a pointless piece of junk , hence hardly adopted,
Why is Russia always 3 steps behind?
hanstrutzel 8 months ago
Well it's not old and it is not "Slow". It is not a tank it is a defensive weapon/Support, which means it will always attack in "First-strike" situation.
9dissection9 8 months ago
It's very slow. It seems like it'd be extremely shitty in a quick firefight situation and only good for suprise attacks. I mean those arms seemed like they took a considerable time just to deploy. Judging by the quality of the video this must be old technology though. Pretty cool looking.
VengefulMilk 9 months ago
@VengefulMilk "and only good for suprise attacks." - Guess what. Since WWII all anti-tank self-propelled weapons are designed for surprise attack from ambush and not for tank duels. IS-100, ISU-122, Jagdpanther, British Archers... all of them were operating from covered positions. Whenever they were tried in open tank battles, (like Kursk) they 've suffered heavy losses.
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr I agree
VengefulMilk 6 months ago
oh, an old hull firing rockets...
MrOldCrow 9 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@hanstrutzel
You are the ONLY bullshit artist here, idiot.
Specifications of Bulava well published, for example by its General constructor Yuri Solomonov
izvestia. ru/person/article3140744/
And thanks for admiting that you are just clueless troll - instead of posting some ACTUAL technical information to prove your statements you just desperately trying to debate about my personal credibility LOL)))
Go fuck your own asshole fuckwit
MarshallJukov 9 months ago
@hanstrutzel
You are the ONLY bullshit artist here, idiot.
Specifications of Bulava well published, for example by its General constructor Yuri Solomonov
izvestia. ru/person/article3140744/
And thanks for admiting that you are just clueless troll - instead of posting some ACTUAL technical information to prove your statements you just desperately trying to debate about my personal credibility LOL)))
Go fuck your own asshole fuckwit
MarshallJukov 9 months ago
@hanstrutzel
You are the ONLY bullshit artist here, idiot.
Specifications of Bulava well published, for example by its General constructor Yuri Solomonov
izvestia. ru/person/article3140744/
And thanks for admiting that you are just clueless troll - instead of posting some ACTUAL technical information to prove your statements you just desperately trying to debate about my personal credibility LOL)))
Go fuck your own asshole fuckwit
MarshallJukov 9 months ago
Jesus fucking h christ on a pogo stick
Russians used Iskander.
They used borrowed sat phone because none of their junk worked
The Georgians has Russian wonder weapons end of story.
Face it Russia builds crap and the whole world knows it. Cars.. Junk.. Weapons .. Junk.... Youtube wannabe military channels ...Junk
hanstrutzel 9 months ago
@hanstrutzel
No dummy - Iskander was NOT used - Tochka-U (predecessor of Iskander) was used on military objects around Gori - ONLY.
No satphones was used - CELLPHONES was used, and only because there was need to cooerinate with OSSETIAN MILITIA - which had no military comm hardware at all.
I repeat again idiot - Georgians used NATO comm, firearms, armoeed vehicles, training, tactics, uniform, UAVs, artillery - e t c - yet they failed war MISERABLY against much smaller Russian forces.
MarshallJukov 9 months ago
@MarshallJukov Actually, the Russian forces got their asses kicked on the ground in Georgia. That's why Russia resorted to indiscriminate bombing of cities, killing a lot of civilians. Get this through your head. If Russia hadn't used its air force, they would've suffered a very humiliating defeat on the ground in Georgia.
StiviGun1 8 months ago
@StiviGun1 There were no ground battles "on the ground of Georgia". Since, Russians free Tskhinvali and moved to the South, Georgians forces fled toward capital. And this wasn't an organized retreat. They fled in panic without order, leaving everything behind... arms, tanks (12 were destroyed in action, 52 were captured intact), ammo.
Do you have footage of "indiscriminate" bombing and maybe you have even number of civilian casualties?
-
There was only one case of bomb shell found in town of...
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr The Russians entered with their ground forces in Georgia, what the hell are you talking about? There was a ground confrontation there which the Russians have won, that's true. But there was a ground confrontation.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1
Of cource we entered Georgia - AFTER georgian army attacked Ossetia and peacekeeper headquarters))) But there war NO ground combat in Georgia simply because on 12 august the entire georgian army FLED
MarshallJukov 6 months ago
@MarshallJukov There were ground fights between the Georgian army and the Russian army. They fled, but there were ground fights. I saw it on the news. The Georgians didn't flee immediately. They stood and fought for a while and when they saw they're being overwhelmed, then they fled. I remember very clearly there were ground fights in that conflict. The Georgians held their grounds for a while before fleeing.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1
Oh you saw it on the news))) Reuters i bet))) Sorry - there was noone to fight - all fled and abandoned their stuff in tact, whole WAREHOUSES of military equipment was salvaged by Ru army without a shot fired))) In Gori EVEN POLICE FLED so Russian army forced to keep an eye over civilian order for them LOL)))
Those rare footages of georgians actualy fighting was just FIRST TWO DAYS - when they felt they are unbeatable in fighting with pregnant women and children))))
MarshallJukov 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 Ground fight between units of Russian Army and Georgian army took place only in exit of Roksy tunnel and in Tskhinvali.
Overwhelmed is a favorite pussy excuse of modern SS lovers speaking about WW II. Georgian superiority in numbers and in equipment were much higher against Ossetian militia, than Russian 58th Army against Georgian one.
Ossetians were REALLY overwhelmed and they didn't fled! Because, they were fighting for their home!
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BitnikGr 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 ...
No money in the world will make a person to wish to loose his life. That's why Georgians fled AS SOON AS balance of power became not in their favor.
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 Well, yes. If counting S. Ossetia as Georgian territory, as it was till 8.8.2008.
I meant that there was no ground confrontation outside of S. Ossetia, because they fled disorderly to Tbilisi.
And actually Russian Army did exactly what they had right to do! To push party which wanted to solve the problem by military means outside of control zone of peacekeepers. This party was the Georgian army. Ground confrontation didn't happened outside of marked by UN conflict zone.
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 ...
Gori. This footage was presented by Georgian television. No victims, just some minor structural damage to the building exterior. Bomb was a cluster bomb of Soviet origin and was dropped from SU-25. But at that day, Russian Air Force had only 2 sorties against Vaziani Air Base, which is located far away from Gori. Even Georgian opposition says that this particular cluster bomb was dropped from Georgian SU-25, in order to blame Russia later in use of prohibited ammunition against...
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr Georgian opposition. They are nothing but whores than would say anything just to win the election. Their claims have no value at all.
As for what the Russians claim, that the Georgians bombed their own cities, then you really are brainwashed. Of course the Russians would say this, it's not like they would admit they killed innocent people. But the truth is they did. They're in no way better than the Americans that they criticize and accuse of war crimes. Of course they wouldn't want
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@BitnikGr the world to see their true face after they were making huge propaganda against the American "war crimes". But if you believe that, then you're an idiot.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 Georgian opposition is actually US whores too. But anyhow, usually it is the opposition which says the truth, and it is usually a government, which tries to conceal it.
Russians didn't say anything about this event, they just show sorties of their SU-25 at that day. And they asked Georgians to show remaining of cluster bomb's case. Which they never did.
Fact is that only one single cluster bomb of unknown airforce was dropped in low density residential area of Gori with no casualties.
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr Actually, the opposition is the one that doesn't say the truth. They're nothing but whores who's sole objective is to win the next elections. So their claims are far from being credible.
As for footage with Russian attacks on civilians on that, YouTube is full of them. All you have to do is search.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1
Russian attacks on civilians footages? YT is full of them? Then probably you will have no problems to give us an example?)))
MarshallJukov 6 months ago
@MarshallJukov Just type Russian bombings in Georgia and you'll find them.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1
I don`t need to, for theese 3 years i studied every fake they came up with, just as ubiquitous fake Reuters photoes or Gori bombings with footage of destroyed Tskhinvali)) Sorry it simply does not goes this way. Russia did not bombed any civilian targets whatsoever.
MarshallJukov 6 months ago
@MarshallJukov "Russia did not bombed any civilian targets whatsoever" Again, just a simple statement with no proof to back it up. You say you don't need to go find the evidence that you bombed civilians in Georgia. Why? Because you're afraid that you'll see that you're full of shit?
Here's jus ONE of many evidence: watch ? v = q o D28V3lgSc. Of course, I know, that just like a sissy that you are, you'll call it "Georgian or Reuters propaganda". That's how brainwashed you are.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
MarshallJukov 6 months ago
@MarshallJukov "Reuters fake photo". And other bullshits. Live in denial moron. This doesn't change the reality.
BYW, how do you know that that was Tskhinvali hospital basement? What do you base your shitty statements on, ha?
Are you fucking stupid? You showed me a vid with some soldiers firing. What about it? What's it supposed to prove, dumbass?
And what is the 2nd vid supposed to prove? You say it was shot in Tskhinvali. Do you have any proof. Or is this just that lame propaganda from your
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@MarshallJukov government? So far, you didn't prove anything. Now I;m CONVINCED that all the footage that shows images with the Russian bombings in Georgia are true. If this is the type of "evidence" that you have, then it's more than certain that all the accusations that are brought to you are true.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 Don't be stupid. Any modern Georgian Russian-hater puts fake videos, write misleading titles, description as he likes, he closes comments and rating and you call that a source?
No, my friend! I want it WRITTEN in PRESS! With NAMES of casualties! As you saw, in articles mentioned about Imedi scam, there are names of victims.
So, I am waiting from you now... how many, at which date, by what means were inflicted Georgian civilian casualties by Russian Army?
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr There is plenty of footage with Gori being bombed by Russian planes. I know the difference between the Georgian language and the Russian language. And those people being bombed were speaking Georgian, not Russian and they were telling how the Russian air force is bombing them.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1
They could tell what they want in any language even martian, but no geniune footages or any other solid proof of Russian bombing of civilian targets in Georgia exists. Simply because there wasn`t any - otherwise all georgian/western propaganda employees would make a story of a century out of it. Period.
MarshallJukov 6 months ago
@MarshallJukov No solid proof of Russian bombings of civilians in Georgia? You really live in denial. Like I said, you can find a lot of proofs on the internet. But you even admitted that you won't look for it. This speaks for itself. You're just a brainwashed that prefers to live in denial. So sad.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 Do you know difference between Ossetian language and Georgian language, smartass? Ossetia was bombed, not Russia. People there speak Ossetian, and you think it is Georgian!
Furthermore, from that footage, they didn't show any soldier, despite there were men in uniform. When one man with AK got in frame, they cut it fast in order to not show his uniform. In footage from real Gori, they show openly soldiers with Georgian markings on uniforms... But in footage of burning building,...
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr OK, smartass, what is the difference between the Georgia language and the Ossetian language? Tell me. The Ossetians are Georgians and they speak the same language.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 ... they cut off the single man with uniform as soon as he gets into the picture. Very neat!
There is a video from footage from Gori recorded by Western journalists. Footage taken from whole day from different part of the town. No panic, no smoke and fires, people are walking, public transport works fine... nothing like bombed city. Nothing like indiscriminate bombing. Nothing like leveled city... like Tskhinvali.
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr And where is that footage "from Gori recorded by Western journalists"? Show it to me. Send me the URL. I've never seen a person that's so full of shit as you are.
You're talking about some soldier that was cut off from the frame. Where is that footage? Show it to me. Is this what they brainwash with in Russia? The "argument" about that soldier being cut off from the frame looks VERY MUCH like the type of propaganda your government makes. Come on. Show me that footage.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 Watch this Reuters report:
wn . com/Russian_Invasion_of_Georgia_Civilian_Casualties_in_Gori
From 0:00 to 0:30 they speak that Russian jets started bombing military bases deep in Georgia and they are showing the footage from Tskhinvali!!!
0:38-0:58 is indeed Gori. Any destructions? Any smoke from fires? Running ppl in panic?
1:40-1:53 is same district and same house in Tskinvali again.
So, much about "coverage" by Reuters! :)))) Not to mention that they had to apologize later!
BitnikGr 6 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@BitnikGr Post the link on my homepage.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 ...
civilians. Only facts that it was only one single bomb, that it was dropped on outside district of Gori with smallest density of population, that Georgia used same type of SU-25 and had such bombs, that they didn’t show any external part of bomb with markings (which could discover their lie) leads to thinking that it was staged… as many other things. Georgia lost that war, but they won the PR and informational war.
Other case is when Spanish TV took footage of “Russia Today”...
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 ...
from burning Tskhinvali and presented it as “burning Gori”. Of course, they apologized later to RT and its journalist, who recorded that footage, but millions of viewers have seen it already and believed in it.
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In fact more Georgian civilians have died, because of that nutcase Saakashvili, than any Russian actions.
First case happened when Georgian TV station “Imedi” have presented a braking news footage that Saakashvili is assassinated, that Russian forces invaded Georgia...
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 ...
(again) and are moving toward capital. People panicked. Many run to the banks to withdraw money, others run to gas stations to fill up their cars, others moved to Georgian-Armenian borders. 2 elderly died because of heart-attack. Of course, it wasn’t true news. As channel tried to excuse later, they wanted to present a possible scenario and they had direct order from Saakashvili himself to not warn people, that this is not real events! Actually even White House blamed him for ...
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 ...
such “immature irresponsibility”.
Another case was a destruction of the monument in memory of Georgian soldiers, who fought in WW II. When Georgian veterans heard this, they got mad and organized meeting in order to prevent destruction of the monument. But they planned it for the exact day when demolishing was planned. So, Saakashvili ordered ASAP demolition, without necessary safety precautions. Monument was exploded by TNT charges day before it was planned. One woman with her...
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 ... child died, because of pieces of this monument flew hundred meters away. Area wasn’t evacuated, people were not informed! These are the only civilian casualties confirmed by Georgian sources since 8/8/2008, and they are direct responsibility (or actually total absence of it) of that stupid murderer, who eats ties.
List of victims of Ossetian civilians are published. More than 200 names of men and women of every age. Names of Georgian “civilian casualties” are unknown. Because...
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 ... the first question will be “where is he buried”… And S. Ossetians can show their graves. Georgians can’t!
So much about your belief in “indiscriminate bombing”.
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr Like I said, if you believe the Russians propaganda, then you're an idiot.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 :))) Brainless monkey, who hasn't ability to comprehend what he is reading!
Incidents caused by "Imedi" TV channel and demolishing of WW II monuments were in European and American Press and News. Do you want me to find statements of State Department where they blamed Saakashvili for irresponsibility of his decisions? Especially by ordering the report of Russian attack, without noting viewers that this is just a scenario and not real events.
Your brain melted during Cold War!
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr
Its really pointless to debate with this idiot. He has schizoaffective psychosis - denies everything that contradicts his imaginary world. I have strong suspicion that he likes to smoke some strong pot in order to obtain some new fantasies on subjects he trying to brag about.
MarshallJukov 6 months ago
@MarshallJukov There are a lot of trolling retards here on Youtube. Either pro-Russian, either pro-American. It doesn't matter. This one is not troll. But I am confident that his profile is lying about his real age and about his country. The way he speaks, I would say he is at least 50years old American, who's best years of youth past during Cold War era. People like him are just old dogs, who are too old to learn new tricks. They can't change their mentality, so they live in Cold War era yet.
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr :))))) Actually, my friend, I am from Romania and I am 26 years old. And I don't live in the Cold War era. Or at least, if I do, than you do too. But the truth is I'm just saying some FACTS. And this doesn't mean that I live in the "Cold War era" at all.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 Full of shits are your irreversibly damaged brains... my friend.
Read and learn:
en . wikipedia . org/wiki/2010_Georgian_news_report_hoax#International_reaction
"International Reaction"
geotimes . ge/index . php?m=home&newsid=20835
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BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr Yeah well, your shitty links don't work. Any other "sources" you have for me? Idiot...
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 LOL! Person who can't take out the spaces from a link, calls another one idiot!
REMOVE THE SPACES!
Youtube doesn't allow direct link publishing in comments. That's why its a common practice to place "spaces" around dots in the link!
Idiot!!!
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr I know about the spam on YoutTube, you moron. And I did remove the spaces. The link doesn't work. Post it on my homepage.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 You know shit actually! All links I've posted were working when I posted them!
Google for yourself "Imedi channel 2010 Georgian news report hoax". If you can't open links.
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr I know about that incident, you idiot. It was presented in the Romanian news too. But we were talking about the fact that the Russians bombed civilians in Georgia. And they don't admit it. They even have the nerve to say that the images and footage that shows how they bombed and killed civilians there it's just Georgia and Western propaganda.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 How could you know about it, if you repeatedly was asking me for proofs, asshole?
It’s “you know shit” evidence N3.
Yeah, yeah… continue repeating this mantra 2000 per day and then may be someone will believe you. And only if he is mentally handicapped just like you are.
Still, you didn’t present any proofs except footage from a channel, which was already caught lying!
BitnikGr 6 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@StiviGun1 Common! Admit it! You just don't want to see the truth :)))
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 "On 16 March 2010, TIME placed the fake report at number one of the "Top 10 Shocking Hoaxes", ahead of the Ashley Todd mugging hoax, balloon boy hoax, KSJJ Ochoco Dam hoax, Sidd Finch hoax, 1938 The War of the Worlds radio hoax, Anna Anderson, Hitler Diaries hoax, Piltdown Man and the Great Stock Exchange Fraud of 1814."
...
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr Well, show me that imaginary article from Time. I know you won't do it. You're just full of shit.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 Mr. "I know shit" Returns and Strikes again! Where from did I copy that text then? Or maybe you think that I remember Georgian names by heart?
time . com/time/specials/packages/article/0,28804,1931133_1931132_1972067,00 . html
Here is your link, stupid. And if you so brain damaged that you can't remove spaces around dots, then just google for "Top 10 Shocking Hoaxes".
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 ...
Gaioz Odishelidze, an inhabitant of the village of Aragvispiri in the Dusheti district, died of a heart attack whilst watching the programme. According to his son, Odishelidze cried out "What the hell's going on?", before grabbing his chest and collapsing.
humanrights . ge/index . php?a=main&pid=11641&lang=eng - One More Person Died Because of Imedi Reportage!
Vano Nasaridze, a 75-year old refugee from Sukhumi living in Tbilisi, suffered a stroke whilst watching the broadcast.
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr This still doesn't change the fact that the Russians bombed and killed innocent civilians in that conflict. Gori was bombed and people died. That's a fact.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 That's only you and other "indiscriminate haters" say and it is actually YOU who can't back up your so called "facts" with sources... even Western ones, since you don't believe in anything written in Russian.
Again! I am asking you! Date? Numbers? Names? Where are they buried?
Because all the above are available in S. Ossetia. Where are 260 Georgian civilian casualties claimed by GEORGIAN state?
BitnikGr 6 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@BitnikGr My sources are all over YT. Like I said, you can type Russian bombings in Georgia and you'll find all the proofs you need. And you haven't shown any evidence to support your claims either.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 This does change the fact that you called me a liar and I've proved all 4 deaths by stupid actions of stupid Saakashvili. Meanwhile you haven't backed up your claims about civilian losses neither with numbers, date, names... because there are no names! And it is you who lies!
But its ok... loosers always lie!
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 French, British, EU, NATO, American TIME - everyone blamed Saakashvili for irresponsibility of his stupid actions. (Take in mind that all sources are not Russian, and I event didn't mentioned Russian response to this circus).
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr Well, show me those "French, British, EU, NATO, American TIME sources". Show them. Prove your claims. But I know that just like a sissy that you are you'll just find any excuses not to do it.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@StiviGun1 I already did! Twice! But you are too brain damaged to see it.
en . wikipedia . org/wiki/2010_Georgian_news_report_hoax#International_reaction
Read the sources under each description of international reaction.
[33][52][53][54][55][56][57][55][58][59][37][60][61][62][63][64][13][65][66]
There are so many, that it is not possible to see them only deliberately.
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 news . bbc . co . uk/2/hi/8423034 . stm - "Two killed in Georgian war monument demolition blast"
The demolition was being carried out to make space for a new parliamentary building and reports suggest the two victims were hit by flying concrete.
The girl, said to be aged seven or eight, and her mother were killed when workers set off an explosion to take down the memorial.
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BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr Well, if people were killed during that demolition, that's too bad and yeah, those who did it must be punished. But as far as that monument is concerned, GOOD. It's good that they destroyed it. The Russians were even bigger aggressors than the Germans, in specially after the war ended. Just ask the old people in the countries they "liberated" what the Russians did. How they raped, how they robed, how they killed. So fuck their monuments and their so called "heroes"!
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1
That monument was not the the Russians moron LOL))) That was monument to GEORGIAN WW2 veterans.
And USSR wasn`t any kind of aggressor in WW2, nobody was raped or robbed either, nobody could come up with any solid fact to support rediculous nonsense Anthony Beevor came up with LOL))
And for a guy from Romania - an ally of nazis who commited numerous warcrimes in the Soviet Union, aspecialy in Odessa you have quite a big mouth.
MarshallJukov 6 months ago
@MarshallJukov Ahh, yes... I forgot that. Romania was a Nazi ally! That explains a lot.
Destruction of entire 6th army under Stalingrad was because Germans put these loosers to guard their flanks. Soviet Army counter-attack faced Bulgarian, Hungarian and Romanian units, who fled AS SOON AS they heard first Katyusha salvos (just like Georgians) and entire German Army with elite SS units fighting for Stalingrad got surrounded!
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr RIBENTROP-MOLOTOV=THE PACT THAT YOU SIGNED WITH THE NAZIS. That is ALLIANCE. We didn't sign any pact with them. We simply went to get what was ours. You attacked us, you stole a part of OUR territory. We had all the rights to go against you.
As for the "Romania war crimes" you can repeat this bullshit all you want. It was you who were the aggressors and who committed atrocities in all the countries that you OCCUPIED.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 you, you, you, you, you, you... you are like a whining bitch! What was yours? Stalingrad was yours? Odessa was yours?
My country didn't pact with anyone. My country fought against Mussolini's fascism and kicked their asses. My country then was occupied by Germans and Bulgarians. And we fought like partisans since then. Like every men who fights and dies for freedom! Polish, Yugoslavians, French, Greeks! Everyone fought!
Pussies surrendered without a fight and allied with Nazi. Pussy!
BitnikGr 6 months ago 2
@MarshallJukov You can live in denial all you want. The fact that you OCCUPIED BY MILITARY FORCE a lot of countries in WW2 is a fact. So are the atrocities you so called "soldiers" committed there. In specially the rapes. In every country that yo occupied, old people talks about the rapes your soldiers committed.
As for Romania Being "allied with the Nazis", well, we were not the one that signed PACTS WITH THEM that allowed us to attack other countries. You did. And you were the ones that
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@MarshallJukov attacked Poland and Romania in accordance with that pact.
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 Oh... so you want to say us that you are a covert Nazi lover and you prefer Nazi rule and you like fascism. You prefer to loose your freedom and civilian rights to "good" SS fellows and live like a mouse in your house, and to not have rights for basic education, medical health-care... Because your SS friends, will sure not give this to you, as a Slav you are.
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr
Romanians are not Slavics, but that does not matter, he can ask Italians of how they handle their allies when they don`t need them anymore.
MarshallJukov 6 months ago
@BitnikGr The communist regime, you idiot, was in no way better than the Nazi one. People lived in houses "like a mouse" and they were sent to prison anyway under the communist regimes. You go search for info about the atrocities the communists committed against the political prisoners. This happened in all the countries that USSR occupied after the end of WW2.
And you better go get some education boy. We are not a Slavic nation...
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 Do you want pictures with atrocities from Guantanamo base? Weren’t those prisoners political ones too?
Do you want pictures with atrocities from Iraqi prisons conducted by American soldiers?
WW II ended 65years ago. Do you believe that humans became more human since then?
...
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 ...
Political freedom is of course a great thing and essential basis for democracy. And by no way I would like to live in communist state today. But life was not as bad as you imagine. Probably it is you who lived "like a mouse".
But any comparison of political repressions with atrocities of Nazi against population is way too overstretched. Anyhow, representative democracy is not a real democracy. The only real democracy is a direct democracy and only Athens had it 500 BC.
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr Good to see someone who knows what he is talking about.
As you said representative democracy is not true democracy. The closest thing we can get to true democracy today, is the swiss model.
SAMER63 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 -
I can even find that video footage about that single cluster bomb in outskirts of Gori.
Now, I dare you to find names and numbers of civilian casualties killed by "evil communist russians".
Otherwise, your brains are "indiscriminately bombarded" by shitloads of Western propaganda.
If you are really only 26, then I feel really sorry for you. You act like those ones Cold War brainwashed to the last cell of their brain and they can't think sceptically any more.
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr Yeah, I want you to find those statements of the State department and prove your ridiculous claims. Because so far, you've only been full of shit. And this is not just about that 2008 conflict. It's about a country, Russia, who's history is full of aggression towards other states, towards it own people, full of inhuman treatment towards its own people and other peoples and about the fact that this country or any of its citizens doesn't have the right to talk about other countries'
StiviGun1 6 months ago
@StiviGun1 "Russia, who's history is full of aggression towards other states" - WooHoo! Very well learned statement... Like a parrot! You are talking about facts? Ok. Do you want to count how many military invasions in other countries was done by US and by Soviet Union? Do you?
BitnikGr 6 months ago
@BitnikGr Yeah, take you entire history, starting from the Kievan Rus and all the way to the breakup of the USSR. If you say that the US, in all its history invaded more countries than you, then you really are a hopeless brainwashed moron. Go learn about the genocides you committed in all those republics that you annexed and formed the USSR. Go learn about the hunger during the 1930 in Ukraine that killed more than 7 million people. You want me to continue?
StiviGun1 6 months ago