Tibetan Refugee Part Three

[Kalzang59]

you did well,martin thank you very much for the posting tibetan cause.

[Vanhouser]

To see Tibet for yourself (look and think critically from multiple sides w/o prejudice): What are the two official Sino-Tibetan languages in TAR of China if Standard Tibetan is not taught at home and schools or used in the news and media in Tibet? The concerns for the lost of Tibetan language and culture are not in TAR of China but in the Ladakh region, India, where Tibetan vernacular is supplanted by English and Hindi.

[martinifilm]

And have you ever been to Ladakh? Yeah, Ladakh is Tibet WITHOUT THE CHINESE SOLDIERS. Yes, Tibetans free and happy without the nonsense the Chinese have been forcing on them including Han businessmen. But then you should go to Tibet sometime and see for yourself. Or better yet, sit back and watch the film and allow Tibetans to speak for themselves. Shame on you for pretending you care about Tibet. Free China; Free Tibet.

[martinifilm]

Forget that you nothing of Tibetan history, nor have ever been there. From 1906 to 1949, the Tibetans had a good relationship with the British and kicked the Chinese out under the 13th Dalai Lama. Once China is free of the communist thugs that rule the billion people - 4% belong to the party - then Tibet will be free. Free China and you will free Tibet. India deserves credit for letting them stay, but Tibetans would prefer their own autonomous region within China. Boo hao.

[holybank]

Precisely, if good British relationship meant military invasion of Tibet, extortion and indemnity, and the lost of Tibetan lives without basic human rights, self-determination, education and technology, and constitutional protection, then the 17 Point Agreement for a strong Chinese national security and defense did not conflict with Tibetan identity and freedom at the turn of 20th century, in 1951-1959, and still does not today.

[holybank]

With Tibetan heritage preserved and culture flourishing, Tibetan self-determination and basic human rights realized as well as China reunited, Tibet in 50 short years also has become a beacon of democracy and economic progress. By what track record can the two reigns of absentee western Tibetan theocratic government since the 1900s with western armed resistence and delulsional cold war propaganda that caused suffering and division to her peoples add value to Free Tibet and China?

[martinifilm]

Short answer: go to Tibet. There's no democracy there. Are you dreaming? Oh sorry, China has banned foreigners from going to Tibet. Not much freedom there either. Every Han businessperson I interviewed (ten) said they hated Tibet, their food, their culture and can't wait to return home. Once China is free, Tibet will be free, mark my words. Once there is a China that has two parties, Tibet will become a place for tourists - and Tibetans. Oh, try Bhutan, Mustang or Nepal for examples. India too.

[martinifilm]

If China had any influence over Tibet in 1906, why'd they let the British march all the way to Lhasa? The Amban was a stooge, as they had been for centuries. China is still pissed because the Tibetans conquered Beijing centuries ago. Tibet should claim they own China. Your arguments, like those of China over Tibet are full of nonsense and hot air. I've been there. I've seen for myself. I suggest you do the same.. unless China won't allow you to go because you are a foreigner. Or Richard Gere.

[ourlegacy]

Tibetans with Chinese citizenship have more self determination, freedom, human rights, n cultural/political autonomy and stability than they had under British-CIA Tibet (caste system and human bondage). Stop fooling yourselves and the world and look at history. A British or American Tibet is and will not be free Tibet or Tibet independence. Since you don't want what the Chinese has to offer, why not stay in Dharamsala for autonomy and observe your Buddhist precepts to liberate yourselves.

[martinifilm]

Yes stop fooling yourself indeed. Stop posting under different aliases - no one wants to hear your nonsense about Tibet being free under Chinese rule. China has only been a communist dictatorship for 60 years. You think it will last 100? once the goons in Beijing are gone, once people in china can vote for who they want in office, they will turn their attention away from Tibet. China can't even rule the 10 yards they claim to own in India. Tibetans just want the Han to go home, that's all. Soon

[ourlegacy]

How is it that Tibetan "'refugees"' or secessionists mistreated in China who supposedly cannot learn their native language (claimed by martinfilm) speak Tibetan whereas the overseas/Indian Tibetans where Tibetan is taught speak English?

For world peace, do not support Free Tibet propagand and nonviolence NGO color revolutions. We have been lied to long enough.

[martinifilm]

The people in this documentary speak for themselves. Just because Tibetan is not taught in schools in Tibet (only taught for a fee!!) that doesn't mean children wouldn't learn it. Chinese children learned and spoke Chinese even while being ruled by the Japanese. Get off your ass and go to Tibet and see for yourself. Or open a book. This film has monks, a doctor and others who were tortured and abused by Chinese overlords, not just children. Shame on you for pretending you care about Tibet.

[Vanhouser]

When have compulsory primary education or bi-lingual education, subsidized bording schools, private schools, school voucher programs, and non-profit private financial endowment universities in the west ever created or caused secessionists, illegal immigrants, or refugees of torture, abuse, cultural genocide and oppression? Your Tibetan refugee film is just another delusional cold war propaganda and not a truth-seeking documentary.

Few people around the world would have trouble identifying

[martinifilm]

Why don't go to Tibet sometime and see for yourself? Or better yet, go to India sometime and see for yourself? Have you met any Tibetans? Ask them. This doc allows people to speak for themselves, and no amount of your nonsense will keep people from seeing the truth - that China is being abused by their government - and once it becomes free, so will Tibet. Meanwhile, I'll let the Tibetans speak for themselves, thanks.

[swordofpakistan]

free tibet,boycott china

[JAYA3477]

people from the free world cannot visit outside of the tourist machine as an individual..it is prohibitited all visits are part of a government approved tour group and staying in government approved hotels

[arafel1964]

I want a free Tibet, I want that the Chinese government respect human rights in the Tibet and in China! I do not hate Chinese, I am against dictatorship, against opression of the government and his supporters who respect nothing or anybody to the advantage of anybody as you!

FREE TIBET!!!!

[JamesBayernHindle]

Large populations of Han, Hui, Salar, Monpa, Lhoba, Mongol, Qiang, Dongxiang, Pumi, Lisu, & some several dozen other peoples live in this region. The common phrase, "One People, One Nation", associated with the Free Tibet movement, is not only a lie but a chillingly racist & fundamentally fascist one.

w w w . international. ucla . edu/article . asp?parentid=2732

w w w . examiner. com /x-1000-DC-Independent-Conserv­ative-Examiner~y2009m3d10-Why-­you-shouldnt-care-about-Tibet

delete spaces!

[ChinaKillsTibetans]

The evil communist party is racist. Chinese in China can travel the World, but Tibetans are stuck in PRISON Tibet. Please watch the video

Escape from Tibet

watch?v=1AedSjjH3LI

and learn about young Tibetans risking their lives escaping PRISON Tibet (the largest prison in the World) to FREEDOM and a better education.

Tibetans have NO FREEDOM in Tibet.

[JBhuddaRevolt]

war is in the mind

[ChinaKillsNuns]

Do you know the cause of the Cultural Genocide of Tibetan Culture and

all manner of human rights ABUSES in Tibet

that are happening in Tibet in 2009 is ?????

[ChinaKillsNunsLoots]

The chinese communist party is the cause of the problems in Tibet. To learn about the Cultural Genocide of Tibet please watch

The Destruction of Serthar Buddhist Institute in Tibet

watch?v=hONQ7Ygfyt0

and learn that the chinese communist partys Cultural Revolution never stopped in Tibet. It is still going.

[yakmanok]

Genetic science proves that we tibetans are related to Han chinese and other mongoloid people of central and east asia. Culturally we are really close to Chinese. Just observe the official ceremonial dresses, mores, customs and even spoken language from a linguistic point of view. Politically for the most part tibetans have lived free of chinese interference, an independent country.

[martinifilm]

Yes, my ignorance can be tolerated. Because I moderate this page. And I will always have the last word. So let me repeat. You are out of your mind. You are a deluded fool who believes the lies told by the Chinese govt. about Tibetans. The Tibetans have never been, nor will never be genetically linked to the Chinese, nor will their country every be considered part of China by anything thinking individual. However, Mongols are genetically linked to the Apache so put that in your peace pipe bubba.

[martinifilm]

Not very compassionate sounding, am I? Perhaps you are not a deluded fool. Perhaps you are just a fool. Or deluded. There's a difference between ignorance and stupidity. The former can be cured. I did mean to say "any thinking individual" above, my fingers got the best of me. Have a good life, please post somewhere else where your rants about Tibet are not moderated. Here, you see, this so called 'journalist' has the last word, and it is "see ya later." Or to put it another way "Boo hao."

[martinifilm]

By the way, there is not such thing as Chinese Tibetans. It's like saying Italian Germans, or Russian French - you're either Russian or French. The Tibetans have never been, nor will never be genetically linked to the Chinese - and as long as they continue to occupy their nation illegally, they'll be looked upon as interlopers, who are illegally occupying another's country. But it's just a matter of time before the worldwide recession hits chinese banks and they run out of tibet.

[ThelandIIove]

martinfilm

>nor will never be genetically linked to the Chinese

Your ignorance cant be tolerated since you are a so-called journalist.

Tibetan and the rest of Chinese ethnics are Proto-Mongol, they are strongly genetically related (DNA gm M118), also so-called Tibetans are mainly 3 groups of peoples, amdo, u-tsang and kham, they look different, and they speak different dialects.

You should do your homework before trying to mislead people and stir up heat between Chinese ethnics.

[ChinaKillsTibetans]

compulsive liar ThelandIIove

Tibetans are NOT chinese. Stop insulting Tibetans. Go and watch

Discussion on Tibet: Part 1

and learn that Tibetans have NEVER considered themselves to be Chinese. And the Chinese have NOT considered the Tibetans to be Han people. Since the invasion of Tibet, Tibetans have NEVER thought of themselves as Chinese in any way.

[ThelandIIove]

Martinfilm

Good effort! Sorry, I dont want to be pain. I just want to ask one question;

From 59' to 2 min, the girl talked only three sentences (Total about 10 seconds), but the exiled translator talked 1 min about the story of beating, actually the girl says nothing about the beating, did the translator fabricate the story himself? Has he cheated on you?

[martinifilm]

I edited it for the English speaking audiences. The girl spoke of the beating at the beginning of her story. If you want to hear the interview without the edit, the film is available through amazon and netflix. The translator translated everything the interviewees said. If you don't like what they're saying, take it up with the Chinese govt.

[ThelandIIove]

No thanks, I am not interested in home made videos. You should added the missing part if you have it, otherwise it sounds like a false statement.

I am here to find out the truth, but your anger attitude has already put me off. Are all journalists like you?

[martinifilm]

If you're not interested in "home made videos" youtube is not for you. Sorry you don't like my attitude. If you want the whole interview, buy the film. You don't have to take my word the translation reflects what she said entirely. Aren't that many Tibetan speaking people watching youtube. But that's because the Chinese won't let them watch youtube from Drapchi. They monitor and block emails and websites from the internet cafes in Lhasa. And I'm not a journalist, never said I was.

[ThelandIIove]

Martin

I mean your video is "home made videos", I am not interest to buy it.

I knew Tibetans were able to use internet cafes before the March riot, if it was banned after the riot, I reckon it is reasonable, every country will do the same for restoring the order.

[ThelandIIove]

By the way, the exiled claimed that the internet cafes in Lhasa are destroying Tibetan cultures, it seems to be a hypocrite statement.

I think without Dalai and exiles interfere, Chinese Tibetans are happier.

[ChinaKillsNuns]

compulsive liar ThelandIIove

Tibetans are NOT chinese. Millions of people around the world love His Holiness the Dalai Lama.

The communists should not have interfered and invaded independent Tibet in the first place.

Also remember Tibetans are refugees not exiles.

[ChinaKillsNuns]

60 years of chinese communist party oppression of the Tibetan people is why the riots happened.

Do you and the chinese communist party expect every young Tibetan male who knows about the 60 years of oppression of his people to roll over and play dead for the next 1000 years, while communists continue to INVADE, LOOT, Genocide Tibetan Culture and do all manner of human rights abuses in Tibet ???

[kilanggula]

to many in the world , use any reason to go to their dream land - the west - economic refugee .

any excuse as long as go to west. west will not welcome you if you are no value to them.

[martinifilm]

I've met many refugees (immigrants as well) who live in the west who would disagree with you. The main feature of the West is.. "nobody cares." No one cares if you come, no one cares if you go. That could be liberating to someone who wants to get away from people telling them what to do, it can be lonely for someone who will miss the human contact with other people who care about their welfare. It is what you make it. the film "In America" is a good example.

[martinifilm]

The best way to free Tibet is to free China. Once citizens are able to vote for their leaders (and punish the incompetent ones who allow schools to be built poorly in an earthquake zone) the good will of the Chinese people will return to what it was in the past; mutual respect for their neighbors, the Tibetans. But first we must work together to help China become free of a totalitarian government. Democracy for all. Free China = Free Tibet.

[119967chado]

A another relative of mein who was involved in the 88 uprising had his ribcage broken by being stomped upon repeatedly. You can actually see the deformity even when he wears a t shirt! And imagine i used to make fun of him. Thats how peacefull ythe Chinese treat their tibetan brothers

[martinifilm]

Yawn.

[ytb9911]

haha, sterilization. Tibetans are not subject to 1 child policy. That's why Tibetan's population increase rate in the last 30 years are the fastest ever. Much higher than before 1950. In the hundreds of years before 1950, the increase rate was at .05%, almost no increase. The last 50 years, that number was between 1 -2%, due to drastically improved health system. This population increase rate is many times higher than nation's average. Who's lying here?

[martinifilm]

My friend, I appreciate you being passionate about the subject. all i can say is "go to Tibet." I interviewed 12 Han shopkeepers for my latest documentary. All of them said they hate Tibet, they hate Tibetan food, and Tibetans. The only reason they stay is for the money. Once the money is gone, they will leave and go home. That's ok. The US found a way to take over Hawaii and Puerto Rico and still make them feel respected.

[fchen8]

No one interfered with your so called interviews? Hey I am surprised. "The US found a way to take over Hawaii and Puerto Rico and still make them feel respected." This is disgusting and telling me everything about your mind. It seems to me you fell love into Tibetan Buddhism first (nothing wrong with it, actually myself is pretty close to that). You lost objectivity in your documentary.

[MeyulDOTcom]

hey chinese shit, at least let us(tibetans) live peacefully here. already u've lives of tibetans misserable in tibet.

[ytb9911]

MeyulDOTcom ,

Please learn how to write better English from Indians before you post here. Seems Dalai Lama not teaching you that. Sorry...

[MeyulDOTcom]

Better english? lol.. just missed one word in the last sentence.(..already u've "made").

wow! u have guts to say Dalai Lama, chinese govt might shoot u for that. lol.

His Holiness teaches us to be compassionate (of course we lose temper as we are after all human beings) and to love chinese people like u who does nothing but hate his holiness.

"a lie told a hundred times becomes the truth" - MAO

[ytb9911]

MeyulDOTcom , lol? for what? Would Chinese government shoot any one saying Dalai Lama is a chronic liar? probably not. Would Chinese government shoot someone rioting and stabbing people on the streets? Better be. lol.

[martinifilm]

Try to be compassionate meyudotcom, your eneny can one day be your friend through the power of compassion. Once those in China get the chance to learn the truth about Tibet and the Dalai Lama, instead of the mistruths they now hear, once they travel to Tibet to see for themselves, their opinion will change. After the great war in 1945 the Allies made Germans visit concentration camps to see conditions for themselves. They were ashamed. The same will happen one day.

[ytb9911]

martinifilm,

You have some guts to compare the situation in Tibet to what Germans did to Jews. You know what? You are a mouthpiece of Dalai liar lama for sure.

[martinifilm]

Let's see. Since the invasion of Tibet, over 1 million dead from starvation, torture, relocation. Drapchi prison holding thousands or political prisoners. I apologize to any Germans I may have offended. Go to Tibet and check it out for yourself, my friend.

[ytb9911]

People, this 1 million number has been discredited by every single independent researcher who had access to Dalai liar's data. Research found that there is substantial evidence even to support 1/10 of that number. According to the liar, there were 1.2 million Tibetan man died. However , there were only 2.3-2.4 million Tibetans in China in late 1950's. Today, there are 6 million Tibetans in China. Are you telling me that they have some baby machines?

[martinifilm]

From Wikipedia entry on Tibet: "There were many casualties, perhaps as many as 400,000. This figure is a calculation made from census reports which show 200,000 "missing" from Tibet. (Chinese estimates) put a figure of 800,000 deaths and alleges as many as 10% of 2.8 million Tibetans were interned, with few survivors. Chinese demographers have estimated that 90,000 of the 300,000 "missing" Tibetans fled the region." What number would make you happy ytb? 500K dead is ok? Or only 400K?

[ytb9911]

I would have to say these people are pretty lazy. Even when they make up stuff and expect the whole world to be looking at the data, they didn't bother to think stuff through and make it a little bit more realistic. But, what do you expect? The people in the temples mostly don't even get basic education that equivalent to elementary school. All they do day long is just arguing about crap.

[martinifilm]

Wow. You are annoyingly ignorant. Pick up a book my friend. Monasteries were traditional places for education, in India, Tibet and China. Buddhism flourished in China and moved on to Japan. China has a long and rich history with monasteries. Go into one some day and contemplate why you were put on the earth with so much rancor. You have nothing better to do than rage against Tibet? Get a life.