Saddleback Church Civil Forum - Obama & McCain 7 of 17

[samuelhggns]

This is to all of the scientist and non beleivers out there. Look at it this way. "Something" or Someone created the ability to CREATE. Atoms and neutrons didn't just pop out of no where. The big bang didn't happen out of no where with out someone creating it. Please think about what I just said. I will be praying for all of you.

[tenderglo4]

that seems a little like sarcasm but thanks for your prayers and please try not to degrade people

[eod4me]

Creation is just a human conception, created by humans right along with the concept of a creator. Science doesnt conspire against religion, it is a systematic method of defining the observed relationships between phenomena. A key aspect of a scientific theory is that it can be disproved. Religious experience is purely subjective and can never be disproved. This invalidates it as a scientific theory. Dont try to use the big bang theory to justify your susperstitions when you dont understand it.

[FujinKage]

There is God and there is Satan. God is not the only one with power. Satan is the ruler of the earth and Christians are the Kingdom of God on Earth. When someone has a miscarriage its not the work of God or even God allowing it. God and Satan can only do what you allow them to do. What really sucks are generational curses(When you or someone in your generational line screw up and invite Satan in and give him the authority to cause that). The good news is those babies automatically go to heaven.

[theguyfromaustralia]

Question: Is it true you can get more info on stemcells from an umbilical cord than an embryo ?

[MeredithStephanie]

... the moment of conception you become living and you then have a spirit.. and that is being alive in my eyes...

[MeredithStephanie]

Its sad that they just throw around words like discarded embryos

and such

they are babies

they are humans

they dont deserve it

any of us could of been a discarded embryo

God cares for all life

[life0is0just0a0ride]

an embryo is not a baby it isnt even a fetus. and how does "god" care for all life. many women have miscarriages. God doesnt seem to be caring alot for does embryo's and fetus's?

[MeredithStephanie]

Just because a woman has a miscarraige doesn't mean God didn't care for them....God allows things to happen for a reason that sometimes we just can't understand.... But all sin happens because of the Fall of Adam and Eve in the garden... after that Satan became ( spiritually) the ruler of the earth..

[MeredithStephanie]

until Jesus came and died and rose again for us to be saved and have eternal life with him and Heaven and a personal relationship with Him here... God is active in our lives... God doesn't want people to have miscarraiges but God gave us freewill and allows us to make our own decisions.. whether we chose to submit ourselves to His authority and follow Him and seek His help is up to us.... I don't understand all of the reasons why God lets things like that happen.. but he is NOT the cause of it

[MeredithStephanie]

I have lost family members and have had aunts and uncles who have had miscairrages.. its hard... but I know that the spirit of that baby is with God now and one day I can ask Him why He allowed those things to happen....

[life0is0just0a0ride]

im sorry to hear that about your family. i really mean it. but if god created us then he surely can also be the cause. i understand your belief but belief isnt logical to law. you cant judge a person as a murder just because they dont hold that belief.

[MeredithStephanie]

Thank you. I appreciate that. But I don't see the people as murderers at all. I feel bad for them... because they are lost and don't see the blessing having a child is. And God isn't a ""belief"" , he is Truth, he is reality.... whether someone chooses to believe in GOd or not is their deal and I can't force anyone to make that decision...

[MeredithStephanie]

but just because someone doesn't believe in GOd or in HIs word.. doesnt make it any less true... I am secure in the Truth and I know that one day ""every knee with bow and every tounge will confess""... Until then I can only try to show poeple the Truth in the most loving way I can and fight for the Truth with all my might

[MeredithStephanie]

.....But I respect you and your decisions... even though I don't know you I am going to pray for you :).... you seem to be really intelligent... and that is definitly a gift GOd gave you ....

[theguyfromaustralia]

God allows these things to happen as a form of judgment. You hate christians you hate God. The world can do without bigots like you.

[life0is0just0a0ride]

i dont hate christians, i hate people who say something is clear cut when its not, at what point was i insulting christians if meredithstephanie is calming that abortion is murder than surely god is liable under the same word when it comes to miscarriage. and when you said i hate god how is that even possible i dont believe there is a god so automatically you think i hate him, dude wtf? do you hate fairies and mermaids? ofcourse not cause to you there not real.

[theguyfromaustralia]

Strawman. God doesn't cause miscarriages but he ordains them (which means he allows them to happen as a form of judgment) so, no, God is not under the same word.

When fairies and mermaids affect the way we follow a calendar or have world wide national holidays and multi denominational churches in their name, then it's something to think about...Since when do people claim the world was made by fairies? Those arguments you use are boring and old, time to think of new ones.

[life0is0just0a0ride]

i was saying it's hard to hate something you do not believe in. thats why i used fairies as an analogy.

not sure why your rambling on about world wide national holiday and multi-denominational churches these things dont come in to it. you cant hate something you dont believe in.

are you saying if people made national holidays and multi-denominational views on fairies and you didnt believe in fairies you'd hate fairies. ofcourse not. if you think that then maybe you need help.

[quaternio]

I just fell in love with you, life0is0just0a0ride.

[life0is0just0a0ride]

dont tell my girlfriend, lol

[TheBeatyBunch]

you just compared my lord and my savior to fairies and mermaids...and miscarriages can not be prevented...40 million abortions can be prevented...40 million innocent lifes there are better methods than abortion like adoption...this is why obama and mccain both are trying to change this method...obama is more in favor of legalizing it then cutting down on the numbers and finding a solution later...while mccain wants to just get rid of it altogether right away...

[jjmcoates]

Obama, Abortion rates have fallen since Bush has been in office and since republicans started passing pro life laws around the USA.

The Guttmacher Institute, reports a more than 25% decline from 1990 to 2005 in the abortion rate, with the number of abortions down 9% since the year 2000 and down to the levels of 30 years ago.

[soloman81]

I don't see any reason not to fund the research. Embryos aren't people. An embryo doesn't suffer, or feel pain.

[MissPolitico]

McCain just wiped the floor with the big phony O. Lol... another great example of O's lack of substance. Good job Mr. Change. Hope is not a strategy...

[VcTaCerto]

Let's open up the debates for other candidates, too.

[CindyForDrunks]

Why are the McCains pretending to be so worried about campaign issues like abortion and a woman's choice with her own body but continually lobby against Mothers Against Drunk Driving who also protects the American public young and old from drunk driver deaths and crashes. Well abortions don't effect liquor sales in Arizona, so they can pretend to be concerned, Interesting-NOT.

[RMBVP]

use stem cells from umbilical cords, THAT is what should be done...

[visionep]

Wait a second...

"Human life begins at conception"

Creating extra embryos is creating humans that these people would rather see murdered than be used for reasearch or stored indefinitely until a willing mother could be found.

They quote the 40 million abortions number, I wonder how many hundreds of millions of embryos have been discarded from fertility clinics trying to help people get pregnant.

[arubberball]

The question is SHOULD THE GOVERNMENT FUND THE RESEARCH! NO is the only answer!