you may wanna play up the Death + Chuck emphasis...either in your vid title or the description...I bet that would get you a lot more interest and exposure, even internationally!
I really like the show. I think the format of the show is really good and keeps things interesting. Nice work! And thanks for showing some footage of Into Eternity! Keep it up.
It's cool that people appreciate death metal's roots, but Death kind of latched on after bands like Possessed and Death Strike had already set the stage for Death Metal, so calling Chuck the sole creator of dm is a bit off in my opinion. Their influence in the early day's can't be denied though.I would love to see this show delve a bit deeper into the more underground and abrasive styles of metal, but good job regardless.
@fuckmehardersideways Sorry, but that is metal revisionism. First of all, Chuck himself never made the claim of inventing anything...but, truth be told, all credible metal writers have stated without fail that what Chuck began doing - even as early as Mantas/Death in his pre-Scream Bloody Gore days - was itself unique. We all know exactly what Possessed, Master, etc. were sounding like in those days. But one listen to SBG in '87 and we all knew that something was taking form that was new. ERIC
Well Master already had a Death Metal album in 85, and Possesed had a far more Death Metal sounding demo in 84 than Death did.The Mantas demo's still hadn't entirely escaped speed metal depending on were you draw that line. Not to mention that by 86 Morbid Angel had already released Abominations Of Desolation which was far less speed metal and more death metal oriented than any of the Death Material. Not trying to discredit Chuck, because he was definitely ONE of the originators.
@fuckmehardersideways It really depends on what a person considers 'death metal'. What the writers/critics agree on is that Scream Bloody Gore is a stand-alone document - a template for the entire genre; that it is set apart from records that came out within the three years prior. When I first met Chuck in 1987 and saw DEATH for the first time that summer, I knew instantly that his use of minor keys, melodic minor scales, etc. was a whole new ballgame. ERIC GREIF
Ah fair enough, i've heard more from fanzines,interviews with bands from the time and online sources that it was more so Possessed,Master and Morbid Angel(or even early Sepultura) that created the sound, and judging by the sonic elements like Morbid Angel's shifting tonal centers, the all around dissonant and warped sounds of those bands,that they had already started the foundation of Death Metal regardless of Death.
I just find it annoying that in Calgary most people forget to learn the full history of what was happening in the underground in the 80's, and just latch onto this motion that it was all Death and that the other, often even more innovative bands of the time barely even get recognition beyond a few.But yeah it definitely is a perspective thing,and the lines are blurred, i just think the whole development should be noted,not just one part of it.
@fuckmehardersideways Well, that is your opinion. I was there and I know what actually happened - and so do the metal writers who matter. When others like Paul Speckmann and Kam Lee apparently go around stating that they created death metal, I'm happy to know that while I was managing DEATH Chuck never uttered those words, ever. He was quietly confident of his place in metal, and the demographers & historians know, too. Anyone who challenges Chuck's innovations has no clue what they're saying.
Except your blinded by your own perspective and ego as Deaths manager,there are historical documents (aka the albums i mentioned and the fanzines ran by people actually involved,rather than outsiders) that disprove the idea that Death was the founding band.Also,those musicians themselves never stated that they were the sole inventors, and they would all credit Chuck as well, but as someone who joined on, not the sole creator of an entire genre that sprung up throughout the world.
@fuckmehardersideways There is no ego involved. I am a professional, and I was around that entire scene and watched it grow right before my eyes. Guys in the bands you mentioned are my friends. However, stating that DEATH were influenced by Sepultura is fantasy. Like the metal writers and demographers, I know the difference between the sound of Possessed and the sound of DEATH. Do you think they're from the same genre? Then you disagree with the metal historians. ERIC
@fuckmehardersideways Instead of arguing, why not just meet me for a beer if you're in Calgary? We can discuss our opinions. I'm promoting the Hate Eternal show at the end of June - you can be my guest.
But the fact remains that bands were doing Death Metal before and without the influence of Death,and there are many documents of this, despite what "historians" who latched on from the outside say or believe(often from media hype,rather than actual empirical evidence). I never said that Sepultura influenced Death,but they did make death metal earlier than Death,as did many other bands.Possessed's Seven Churches had more in common with the Death Metal sound than Scream Bloody Gore.
@fuckmehardersideways I actually don't consider Possessed death metal, and, actually, many writer & band friends don't either. And, as for Sepultura, if you believe they played 'death metal' before DEATH, then perhaps we're so far apart as to make any further discussion pointless. Max wrote fan letters to Chuck in the underground demo days at a time when the Brazilians were just picking up their instruments. My point is that SBG isn't the same genre as Possessed, Master, or Death Strike. ERIC
I find that the structural elements of death metal, along with the general riffing style that were the death metal standard are far more present in Beneath The Remains,Morbid Angels-AOD,Possesed's Death Metal, etc.Rhythmically Death barely escaped speed metal and were far more consonant/traditional metal melodically, and the riff lexicons of bands like Morbid Angel and Possessed, who used a more Wagnerian esq shifting tonal center to make more abrasive sounds is a primary factor.
@fuckmehardersideways 'Death barely escaped speed metal'? If your definition of 'death metal' is the earliest Sepultura, then there isn't really anything left to discuss. We disagree on the very definition. That metal fans around the world - and any book on the subject (even by folks around at the time) - completely & utterly disagree with you puts you firmly in a teeny tiny minority...Chuck Schuldiner is considered synonymous with death metal, and DEATH the ultimate death metal band. ERIC
Yes because their music still contained the primarily speed picking+pedal tone style, more traditional melodic elements and less abrasive like speed metal, were structural and as far as phrasing goes the bands i mentioned were developing the genre .Also many of the books and sources i read hail Death as just one of the numerous bands in the development and most credible Death Metal musicians(guys who didn't just latch on to the 90's trend) consider "Seven Churches" Death Metal.
Though i will stop spamming this page with argument because i agree with you, you obviously need to uphold the Death name and franchise, and it makes most sense for marketing to disregard obvious empirical data that points towards that Death was only a piece of the development of the genre. Of course the band you managed is the "ultimate death metal band", that doesn't sound biased at all,but people in the underground still remember the truth.So sorry to take your time.
@fuckmehardersideways I never cease to get tired of talking about this subject and don't consider the dialogue a waste of time - I appreciate it. I speak often of the importance of Seven Churches and, indeed, Chuck & I always sung its praises. Where I have gone way beyond what Chuck said about his own music is to point at the music DEATH created from the first album as being a variation of the genre Possessed were within. Like others, I consider SBG to be the archetypal genre document. ERIC
Ok well at this point i will agree to disagree on that, i see Abominations Of Desolation and Seven Churches as the archetype for what was to be Death Metal,maybe I'm in the minority on that one but the minority has it's reasons.My whole point was more so that Death was'nt the only thing to consider about Death Metal's roots and the early day's of dm and the attitudes Calgarians have.Not trying to discredit SBG or Chuck because the fact that he was important can't be denied.
@fuckmehardersideways I never deny the importance of the other bands of the period. I remember the first letters Max & Sepultura sent to Chuck and attending the first gigs of bands like Morbid Angel. I was in Florida to see firsthand much of the development of what was happening. I'm lucky being an old guy and agree everyone needs to be familiar with what really happened. Hope to buy you a beer & talk metal... ERIC
Alright fair enough,i was picking up a "Death was all that really mattered for the genre" kind of vibe from some of your comments, which is my biggest pet peeve with the subject(mainly from Calgary Metallers who don't even usually know who Deathstrike/Master is other than "some band with bad production"), so sorry if i was sounding standoffish.It was a very insightful conversation, and I'll be sure to come by and chat you up if i see you at a gig or anything.Cheers!-Andy
Not trying to be hostile, I'm just a nerd about this stuff, and the typical Death fanboyism beliefs don't really seem to match up with reality the more i delve into the history of the underground.I have learned that most "historians" and metal writers don't know what their talking about from lack of seeing the big picture .Like that "headbangers journey" among others,information needs to come from the mouth of bands those involved.If i can make it out i will attend normally and pay,thanks though
Thanks guys for covering the show. It was a frigging blast, and watching your reprt made me smile as I think about how kick ass the whole day was. ERIC
I love DEATH and all, but Eric and company are just milking away at Chucks' death.
progmetal1456 4 months ago
Im fucking pissed i could have gone, only if i was 18.. Fml
Pestilentich 8 months ago
impresionante !! me encantaria poder conocer a eric y hablar sobre chuck , death su musica y su vida ...soñar es gratis ! jaj
simplemente un genio ...espero poder seguir viendo este tipo de cosas gracias por subirlo !
inhumanform91 8 months ago
Awesome! May I ask where you found the long sleeve shirt?
keeponlivin81 8 months ago
@keeponlivin81 I got the shirt at the tribute show. I don't know if it's available online.
Kingbalor 8 months ago
@Kingbalor We only made a handful for the gig - now they're all gone! Collector's items, for sure... ERIC
orchardhill 8 months ago
VERY GOOD WORK! GUYS THANK YOU
Bergsieger14 8 months ago
Kick ass
kreefalicious 8 months ago
you may wanna play up the Death + Chuck emphasis...either in your vid title or the description...I bet that would get you a lot more interest and exposure, even internationally!
flamencodiablo007 8 months ago
keep up the good work boys!!!
flamencodiablo007 8 months ago
Thanks for all the support guys, 2000 views in less then a week!!! That is awesome!!!
ExtremeMetalTV 8 months ago
I really like the show. I think the format of the show is really good and keeps things interesting. Nice work! And thanks for showing some footage of Into Eternity! Keep it up.
Blubins 8 months ago
Scream bloody gore is the first pure death metal album.
Chips185 8 months ago
It's cool that people appreciate death metal's roots, but Death kind of latched on after bands like Possessed and Death Strike had already set the stage for Death Metal, so calling Chuck the sole creator of dm is a bit off in my opinion. Their influence in the early day's can't be denied though.I would love to see this show delve a bit deeper into the more underground and abrasive styles of metal, but good job regardless.
fuckmehardersideways 8 months ago
Comment removed
orchardhill 8 months ago
@fuckmehardersideways Sorry, but that is metal revisionism. First of all, Chuck himself never made the claim of inventing anything...but, truth be told, all credible metal writers have stated without fail that what Chuck began doing - even as early as Mantas/Death in his pre-Scream Bloody Gore days - was itself unique. We all know exactly what Possessed, Master, etc. were sounding like in those days. But one listen to SBG in '87 and we all knew that something was taking form that was new. ERIC
orchardhill 8 months ago
@orchardhill
Well Master already had a Death Metal album in 85, and Possesed had a far more Death Metal sounding demo in 84 than Death did.The Mantas demo's still hadn't entirely escaped speed metal depending on were you draw that line. Not to mention that by 86 Morbid Angel had already released Abominations Of Desolation which was far less speed metal and more death metal oriented than any of the Death Material. Not trying to discredit Chuck, because he was definitely ONE of the originators.
fuckmehardersideways 8 months ago
@fuckmehardersideways It really depends on what a person considers 'death metal'. What the writers/critics agree on is that Scream Bloody Gore is a stand-alone document - a template for the entire genre; that it is set apart from records that came out within the three years prior. When I first met Chuck in 1987 and saw DEATH for the first time that summer, I knew instantly that his use of minor keys, melodic minor scales, etc. was a whole new ballgame. ERIC GREIF
orchardhill 8 months ago
@orchardhill
Ah fair enough, i've heard more from fanzines,interviews with bands from the time and online sources that it was more so Possessed,Master and Morbid Angel(or even early Sepultura) that created the sound, and judging by the sonic elements like Morbid Angel's shifting tonal centers, the all around dissonant and warped sounds of those bands,that they had already started the foundation of Death Metal regardless of Death.
fuckmehardersideways 8 months ago
@fuckmehardersideways
I just find it annoying that in Calgary most people forget to learn the full history of what was happening in the underground in the 80's, and just latch onto this motion that it was all Death and that the other, often even more innovative bands of the time barely even get recognition beyond a few.But yeah it definitely is a perspective thing,and the lines are blurred, i just think the whole development should be noted,not just one part of it.
fuckmehardersideways 8 months ago
@fuckmehardersideways Well, that is your opinion. I was there and I know what actually happened - and so do the metal writers who matter. When others like Paul Speckmann and Kam Lee apparently go around stating that they created death metal, I'm happy to know that while I was managing DEATH Chuck never uttered those words, ever. He was quietly confident of his place in metal, and the demographers & historians know, too. Anyone who challenges Chuck's innovations has no clue what they're saying.
orchardhill 8 months ago
@orchardhill
Except your blinded by your own perspective and ego as Deaths manager,there are historical documents (aka the albums i mentioned and the fanzines ran by people actually involved,rather than outsiders) that disprove the idea that Death was the founding band.Also,those musicians themselves never stated that they were the sole inventors, and they would all credit Chuck as well, but as someone who joined on, not the sole creator of an entire genre that sprung up throughout the world.
fuckmehardersideways 8 months ago
@fuckmehardersideways There is no ego involved. I am a professional, and I was around that entire scene and watched it grow right before my eyes. Guys in the bands you mentioned are my friends. However, stating that DEATH were influenced by Sepultura is fantasy. Like the metal writers and demographers, I know the difference between the sound of Possessed and the sound of DEATH. Do you think they're from the same genre? Then you disagree with the metal historians. ERIC
orchardhill 8 months ago
@fuckmehardersideways Instead of arguing, why not just meet me for a beer if you're in Calgary? We can discuss our opinions. I'm promoting the Hate Eternal show at the end of June - you can be my guest.
orchardhill 8 months ago
@orchardhill
But the fact remains that bands were doing Death Metal before and without the influence of Death,and there are many documents of this, despite what "historians" who latched on from the outside say or believe(often from media hype,rather than actual empirical evidence). I never said that Sepultura influenced Death,but they did make death metal earlier than Death,as did many other bands.Possessed's Seven Churches had more in common with the Death Metal sound than Scream Bloody Gore.
fuckmehardersideways 8 months ago
@fuckmehardersideways I actually don't consider Possessed death metal, and, actually, many writer & band friends don't either. And, as for Sepultura, if you believe they played 'death metal' before DEATH, then perhaps we're so far apart as to make any further discussion pointless. Max wrote fan letters to Chuck in the underground demo days at a time when the Brazilians were just picking up their instruments. My point is that SBG isn't the same genre as Possessed, Master, or Death Strike. ERIC
orchardhill 8 months ago
@orchardhill
I find that the structural elements of death metal, along with the general riffing style that were the death metal standard are far more present in Beneath The Remains,Morbid Angels-AOD,Possesed's Death Metal, etc.Rhythmically Death barely escaped speed metal and were far more consonant/traditional metal melodically, and the riff lexicons of bands like Morbid Angel and Possessed, who used a more Wagnerian esq shifting tonal center to make more abrasive sounds is a primary factor.
fuckmehardersideways 8 months ago
@fuckmehardersideways ohh oops meant Bestial Devastation, not Beneath The Remains. Though Morbid Vision's would probably count as well.
fuckmehardersideways 8 months ago
@fuckmehardersideways 'Death barely escaped speed metal'? If your definition of 'death metal' is the earliest Sepultura, then there isn't really anything left to discuss. We disagree on the very definition. That metal fans around the world - and any book on the subject (even by folks around at the time) - completely & utterly disagree with you puts you firmly in a teeny tiny minority...Chuck Schuldiner is considered synonymous with death metal, and DEATH the ultimate death metal band. ERIC
orchardhill 8 months ago
@orchardhill
Yes because their music still contained the primarily speed picking+pedal tone style, more traditional melodic elements and less abrasive like speed metal, were structural and as far as phrasing goes the bands i mentioned were developing the genre .Also many of the books and sources i read hail Death as just one of the numerous bands in the development and most credible Death Metal musicians(guys who didn't just latch on to the 90's trend) consider "Seven Churches" Death Metal.
fuckmehardersideways 8 months ago
@fuckmehardersideways
Though i will stop spamming this page with argument because i agree with you, you obviously need to uphold the Death name and franchise, and it makes most sense for marketing to disregard obvious empirical data that points towards that Death was only a piece of the development of the genre. Of course the band you managed is the "ultimate death metal band", that doesn't sound biased at all,but people in the underground still remember the truth.So sorry to take your time.
fuckmehardersideways 8 months ago
@fuckmehardersideways I never cease to get tired of talking about this subject and don't consider the dialogue a waste of time - I appreciate it. I speak often of the importance of Seven Churches and, indeed, Chuck & I always sung its praises. Where I have gone way beyond what Chuck said about his own music is to point at the music DEATH created from the first album as being a variation of the genre Possessed were within. Like others, I consider SBG to be the archetypal genre document. ERIC
orchardhill 8 months ago
@orchardhill
Ok well at this point i will agree to disagree on that, i see Abominations Of Desolation and Seven Churches as the archetype for what was to be Death Metal,maybe I'm in the minority on that one but the minority has it's reasons.My whole point was more so that Death was'nt the only thing to consider about Death Metal's roots and the early day's of dm and the attitudes Calgarians have.Not trying to discredit SBG or Chuck because the fact that he was important can't be denied.
fuckmehardersideways 8 months ago
@fuckmehardersideways I never deny the importance of the other bands of the period. I remember the first letters Max & Sepultura sent to Chuck and attending the first gigs of bands like Morbid Angel. I was in Florida to see firsthand much of the development of what was happening. I'm lucky being an old guy and agree everyone needs to be familiar with what really happened. Hope to buy you a beer & talk metal... ERIC
orchardhill 8 months ago
@orchardhill
Alright fair enough,i was picking up a "Death was all that really mattered for the genre" kind of vibe from some of your comments, which is my biggest pet peeve with the subject(mainly from Calgary Metallers who don't even usually know who Deathstrike/Master is other than "some band with bad production"), so sorry if i was sounding standoffish.It was a very insightful conversation, and I'll be sure to come by and chat you up if i see you at a gig or anything.Cheers!-Andy
fuckmehardersideways 8 months ago
Not trying to be hostile, I'm just a nerd about this stuff, and the typical Death fanboyism beliefs don't really seem to match up with reality the more i delve into the history of the underground.I have learned that most "historians" and metal writers don't know what their talking about from lack of seeing the big picture .Like that "headbangers journey" among others,information needs to come from the mouth of bands those involved.If i can make it out i will attend normally and pay,thanks though
fuckmehardersideways 8 months ago
Awesome!
DoomMetalFan94 8 months ago
Go Chuck!
circleofhypocrisy 8 months ago
Great!
Dr3amerDaNnY 8 months ago
I hope they don't clean it up. I hate when they do that. Takes away the sound the band wanted at that time.
ancientmariner1984 8 months ago
@ancientmariner1984 Not necessarily, you can only get the sound your budget can pay for.
mepopo 8 months ago
Thanks guys for covering the show. It was a frigging blast, and watching your reprt made me smile as I think about how kick ass the whole day was. ERIC
orchardhill 8 months ago
Haha so many taboos name-wise. Its DEENER like WEENER and Greif like Life not Grief like Leaf.
DeathinHD 8 months ago
Hey you guys should check out local Calgary band /watch?v=Lptjbz03zfM
nordicstrike 8 months ago