i think cuz they are dumb ass, so they can't tell the difference between pyramid scheme, and a healthy legal network marketing company.. if those ppl that says USANA doesn't work, but are able to give me the income USANA gave me every week, double up, 4 times up each year, and are able to help me help ppl getting same money as i do, and being healthier and healthier. I follow that person, and quit USANA. (However, i believe none of those failures are able to, so go back and fix yourself first)
@samuel408 search this on google "The Topsy Turvy Life of Barry Minkow Takes Another Plunge" the host on the link you gave is a convict who's specialty publishing false information.
Today was judgment day for Minkow, 45. Miami federal judge Patricia Seitz sentenced Minkow to five years in prison for the fraud, and he was ordered to pay $583 million in restitution
USANA is not a Pyramid Scheme, FYI Pyramid scheme means = non-sustainable business model. USANA has been in the Network Marketing Industry for 19 years. USANA is listed in New York Stock exchange. USANA MANUFACTUREs it's own products unlike other Network Companies. Our products are not cheap but they are worth every penny you spend.
Funny how you guys are so negative...i tell you us here in the Philippines,we're getting rich because of USANA....USANA makes our dreams come true! I love being with USANA..and most of all.I AM VERY HEALTHY! I thank Dr. Myron Wenz!
For a real opportunity to earn GOOD money email me at: foster_236@hotmail.com and I will send you an Eligibility Form for you to fill out. If all is well then you can start working on my team ASAP!
please look at those successful ppl, and ask them why they succeed, and see what they did and learn from them. why you keep on focusing on those failurs? why you wanna be a failure, too? so you learn from the failures?
the difference between failures and successful ppl, is only they think differently.. your negative thoughts won't influence a bit to those successful ppl.
No. The difference between those that "fail" at USANA and those that "succeed" is that those that "succeeded" have managed to support their "USANA Business" by recruiting others into this pyramid scheme.
to sean... you can ask those ppl who quit, did they take products everyday? did they really day what they have to do? USANA sells nutritional supplements not medicine. I thought only medicine you feel it right away and sometimes with side effects. Some ppl did join USANA, but what did they do? they sit at home doing nothing, thinking money will come out from no where. I don't feel suprised if they fail.
♣♣♣♣♣♣♣♣♣♣♣♣♣♣♣♣♣♣♣♣ I know a business with a powerful business plan than USANA. The name of the company is Market America. USANA copied the compensation plan from this business but only pays half that this company pays. Email me at chkfgm@hotmail.com if you need more info. and we can meet in person. This applies only if you live in New York City.
if USANA is so good, explain to me why they were sued in 2008? and if the people are suppose to be helping others in and outside the company...how come yesterday I was stalked, screamed at, and followed to my home all because I didn't give them my money? Just think about that.
Here's something to think about. Almost everyone who joins USANA will quit in the first year. USANA sells almost 90% of its product to Distributors. If the product is so good why do people not only quit but stop purchasing the product? Because it's about recruiting not product sales. The products don't sell on their own.
@FarmGiraffe You did well! You had 99% chances to not make money anyway. Very tough business. The supplements are good although they'll wipe out your checking account. Life force Multiple tablets on Amazon.com were rated as good as USANA but they cost 31$... FOR THREE MONTH SUPPLY!!!!! Compared to USANA's 50$ A MONTH Essentials...
@amazingdany yeah u said 99% not and it is xactly y there is only 1 % of the U.S population that is rich cuz they worked smarter, then again there is 4% that r finantialy independent. check out the 100 college graduate test mayb that will help
Regarding the compensation system, I do not see how it is fair that someone has to balance legs of income. It appears designed to enable the company to take as much as they can and give as little as they can in return. On commission I get a percentage of what I sell, but with USANA if sales are $80,000 in one leg, but $4,000 in the other leg, you only get commission on the combined amount of $8,000. They still get $84,000. It's hard work and a gamble for the distributor. Appears immoral to me.
@USANAK ...wow buddy! For a guy whose incurable condition was put into remission by USANA's products you sure don't seem very grateful. You've posted this identical spiteful message on a large number of videos. Too bad you don't know what you are talking about.
I'll bet not too many people do you favors anymore.
First, the product is good; been using it for years. Put my incurable medical condition into remission. If I stop using it the symptoms return.
HOWEVER, the company is awful! For example, took over 3 hours, 5 calls, to put in an order today. Simple or not every time you call its a major event. Super poor service! Korea or Australia, same thing.
I do NOT recommend USANA as a business. They are awful! If I ever find another product that does the same thing for me I will dump USANA with glee.
But i've noticed that this HGMercury guy has over 20 comments posted! Who does that? very suspiscious. Don't engage- it's like oxygen to a flame or debating w/ a 5 yro. USANA reps need to relax! LOL!
You're just the kind of guy that USANA preys upon. The kind that doesn't want to ask questions. You'll drink the kool-aid and do what you're told. Good luck with your USANA business ;)
I see you're already talking to jdfm27 and are subscribing to successwithusanas channel. If you don't want an open discussion about the company you can message me.
You USANA people need to relax. I've known about USANA for a couple years now cause my friend has lupus and the pills are helping, my colleugue at work quit her teaching job cause she's making so much money w/ her USANA business. These are people i highly respect and trust. Me and some friends are thinking of doing some network marketing- still researching.
How about we all calm down here for a second. We're actually missing out on why we started discussing in the first place. We were talking about comparing two products - one from USANA and one from a competitor. How about we do that? USANA Pure Rest vs WorldWide Labs Melatonin. I mentioned this earlier but it seems it might have been overlooked.
If you want to also talk about who makes money in USANA we can do that too.
Yes, WorldWide labs has a very good product and extemely cheap. The issue is, does that make USANA a scam.
Well, for comparison, lets take TrueStar Health Products, a non-mlm who's melatonin is much more expensive than USANA. Many companies on the web sell melatonin for considerably more than WorldWide Labs. Are they all scams?
Why don't you find a product that compares to the essentials, since that is USANA's main product. Why did you pick melatonin to compare against?
Someone else was already asking for a comparison on it You said pick a product. Why are you now upset I didn't pick the one you want?
I'm sorry but what are you trying to get at? You said find a product which was cheaper than something by USANA. I've done that and you want to shift the playing field?
I don't know enough about TrueStar Health at the moment to comment about whether or not I think it's a scam.
You're switching your argument. First you asked me to find you a product to compare with USANAs. I've done that. Now you're trying to compartmentalize the various problems, dubious awards, questionable behavior which takes place in USANA in an effort to justify how its not a scam. Kind of ridiculous.
not only are the products great, there opertunity is even better, i have joined with usana and 6 weeks later, im making an extra $1000+ a month and its just growing every week. you can make more than $1000 a week, if you put your heart into it. if you like to join ill help you with all the info you need just leave me a private message.
jdm27ef - Still waiting for your response about USANA admitting they haven't been checked by the FDA for Drug GMPs. You seem to keep missing that one.
its cool, i laughed because you just helped me get a pay checked hehe thats why I am laughing. while you want to bash on USANA and didnt get anything LOL
I didn't help you get a paycheck. The people you suckered in with your false information did. I also didn't get nothing. I got to watch you twist in the wind as you failed to provide anything which legitimizes your business instead resorting to the same old lies that every other USANA Rep tosses around.
Still waiting for
- An explanation of USANAs mandatory 4 week purchase
- A legitimate scientific study which refutes the findings that USANA is over-priced
LOL i didnt even contact that person, that person did LOL
explanation for 4 week autoship and its not mandatory its optional. you can pay for it and build your business or if you dont feeling building your business you can turn it off
ATHLETE take our products, Olympic athletes, Jennifer Azzi, i mean if our product is not that good why would you think pro athletes take our product that they know that their medals can get taken away if they were get tested and get a positive for illegal substance
That person contacted me because of this comments, and its that person who contacted me so i didn't scam that person. He wanted to be in scam! do you now understand it?
LOL
4 week autoship is optional.
Pro athletes takes our product, Jennifer Azzi, The whole WTA women tennis association, Werner Berger, oh BEAT FREAKS from MTV, we are even in Oscar pre party, MTV Movie awards, Winter Olympic Athletes, and even LARRY KING
I doubt any person contacted you and if they did its because of the misinformation you've been writing here. That's if this person exists. Which I doubt. You've lied enough already that I doubt you'd stop now.
Autoship is optional but required to make commissions. Why? People just dump it on eBay.
Everything you mentioned involves USANA either paying or giving their product away. Do you not know what a scientific study is?
It's like saying Nike is the best because Tiger Woods uses their products. It's ridiculous. Tiger Woods uses their products because they pay him. It has nothing to do with quality. He could prefer something else but would be unable to use it because of his sponsorship deal.
Still waiting on any legitimate scientific study that explains USANAs inflated product price. Seriously doubt there is any but you'll never say it.
ok go ahead doubt it, it doesnt matter to you anyways lol. Here a quick advice don't rely on your research and go to your doctor and ask him what is PDR and what are the stuff that you need to be in it. I believe your not in medical field and that's the reason you are misinformed. Oh and just let you know we dont have to pay anyone to take our product and that'show we are legitimate. You dont have to believe you know its your choice.
I would suggest you actually read about the PDR and stop believing everything your USANA upline tells you. You didn't even acknowledge the fact there are over a dozen supplement manufactures in the PDR and not just USANA as you claimed. You even got GMP wrong.
You don't pay to sponsor. Do you not know how sponsorship works? Truth be told if I could get USANA products for free I'd take them too. They're not worthless they're just not worth what USANA is charging for them.
I find it somewhat bizarre that you would claim I don't know it when you were the one who wrongfully claimed that USANA was the only Supplement Manufacturer in the PDR, when you wrongfully implied the FDA was responsible for the PDR, falsely stated that GMP manufacturing was essential for being included in the PDR when USANA itself has admitted that it has not been proven to manufacture to GMPs.
So far I've demonstrated I have considerably more knowledge about the PDR than you do.
Food and Drug Administration. The PDR is a private publication of Thomson Reuters. What the FDA does do is inspect Drug Manufactures every two years. I have found no information anywhere which says that they specifically inspect the PDR or that they have any direct involvement with it. This would exclude USANA who manufactures a Food product.
well you need to ask professional, i got my info from my professor. FDA regulate PDR because all of the medicine we get from our DR cost hella money and if the medicine is cheap that means the material that they use to make the medicine is crap. why would you pay for something that is crap, that's why FDA regulate PDR.
Here's where you're confused. The FDA regulates Drug Manufacturers and they are supposed to investigate them every two years. This happens whether or not they're in the PDR. The FDA does not investigate on behalf of the PDR because a Branch of the Government is not going to perform such a function for a private company like Thomson Reuters - the Publishers of the PDR. The PDR is a product catalog put out by Thomson Reuters in which Manufacturers of Drugs and Supplements can pay to have their
USANA makes Supplements which are treated as Food by the FDA. That's why they have not undergone GMP testing as if they were Drugs. The FDA is not going to make an exception because USANA - or any other Supplement Manufacturer - pays to be included in the PDR.
You claim that you need to manufacture to GMP quality to be in the PDR but USANA even admits that they have not been inspected for this by the FDA. Explain this.
jdm27ef....I'm a USANA Distributor as well but unfortunately, I have to agree with HGMercury8077. For vitamin makers, the PDR is basically a marketing tool. You pay and you get listed simple as that.
I would suggest you stop arguing with this guy because he obviously has a USANA bias and you are making it worse by presenting arguments that aren't true.
USANA has a lot going for it and nothing to apologize for. If HGMercury doesnt like the company, don't join or buy the products.
but I'm no more biased than anyone who loves USANA. The difference is in what we have to back it up.
I think two separate independent sources reaching the conclusion that USANA has an over-priced product is a legitimate cause for concern especially when nothing shows the contrary.
I'd like to hear what you mean by "USANA has a lot going for it"
I think they have plenty to apologize for. For example the way they handle their companies stock in order to bleed the company of its profts. Are you aware that they were fined for taking too much money out of the company to pad the wallets of their executives? That they have lied about why Ladd McNamara handed in his medical license. That they never openly stated that Myron Wentz renounced his US Citizenship. That they refuse to release their drop out rate.
That shareholders - as few as there are - had to learn that the company had the majority shares of its stock parked in Lichtenstein from someone investigating the company. That the products are over-priced. That almost everyone involved loses money. You know things like that.
"USANA is NOT Certified by the FDA for Pharmaceutical GMPs"
It will take you to a Facebook page which have two quotes by USANA. In both quotes they admit that they have not been investigated by the FDA to make sure they comply with Drug GMPs. Links to where these quotes are taken from are supplied with them. One is to a filing made by USANA to the SEC and the other is hidden away on their web-site.
jdm27ef - I'm still waiting for an explanation about what you mean when you say that USANA is the only supplement in the PDR that is "public base"
I'd also like to hear your explanation of USANA not being tested for Drug GMPs by the FDA and yet still being included in the PDR despite what you claim to have heard from your professor.
Yours is the same old schtick as every other opponent of MLM. USANA fought these battles already and won. Barry Minkow tried his best to give USANA a black eye and was sanctioned by the courts for making false allegations. Why do you think his videos are no longer up?
As for price, what is "too high"? Have you gone into a naturopath office lately and compared the price of other high end nutritionals to USANA? What are you comparing USANA to?
You make a big deal of USANA's founder giving up his US Citizenship. So what? How does that impact USANA's customers in any way. Thanks to Barry (and I do mean "thanks" because he did USANA a favor), USANA has been investigated by the SEC and found to be perfectly legitimate and above board.
As I said, I'm not going to argue with you. You have your concerns, we get it. MLM isn't for everyone and obviously isn't for you. What are you expecting to achieve by all of your posturing?
It impacts the shareholders and Distributors. Wentz image is an essential part of the USANA marketing mix.
The SEC also failed to catch Bernard Madoff the first time around.
What I hope to achieve is to educate people about the lies being spread by USANA Distributors in order to sell their over-priced products and disastrous business scheme. Look at all the misinformation in your posts. You don't know the facts and are spreading falsehood which contribute to the problem.
You're right. I admit it...USANA has brainwashed all the thousands of Distributors to be human rip-off machines. We mindlessly go out and bilk the public by selling products that are much more expensive than the Wal-Mart Brands.
Great that we have heroes like you to come to the rescue. Good thing for USANA that all the successful distributors in the company didn't talk to you first. They might never have joined knowing that you can't make any money.
I think USANA supplies the information and you (Distributors) fail to think critically about it or question it. You mindlessly take it in and assume it means something it doesn't. Then you repeat it in order to get others to join. Sort of like all the incorrect statements you made about the Minkow vs. USANA court case.
All the successful Distributors? Do you mean the tiny minority that makes a profit off of recruitment instead of retail? What kind of business does that sound like to you?
DUDE STFU with the scientific shit you aint scientist and you will never know even you reaserch it too many times, WHO FUCKN CARES!!! its not like you want to join or something. WE GOT SCAMED AND YOU DIDNT HAPPY! LOL omg this KID
LOL TINY minority successful? WOW get your facts right USANA produces 72 millionairs every year and compare that to other company hahahah YEAH tell me im not right.
Lol, giving up? I thought you knew how to handle people like me. I thought you had plenty of scientific backing.
You're not right. In fact you're embarrassingly wrong but at least you're showing consistency. When you break down the numbers only 1% are earning money in USANA.
USANA doesn't produce 72 millionaires a year. It has had 72 Distributors clear at least a million in commissions over their entire time at USANA. Remember that they also made that money mostly through recruitment.
here ill do a little presentation to you kk. 17 years in the business we are public base which means government regulate us we are in 15 different countries we market products to athletes we featured in oprah Robert G Allen said that USANA is recesion proof USANA is been #1 for 10 years in a row in Network marketing magazine we are in PDR we feature on other magazines we are science base company CAll our corporate for more info kk ill even leave the number for you 18889509595
HGMercury8077...I don't get why you are making such a big deal about the drug GMP's. USANA doesn't say they are audited by the FDA. How could they since the FDA doesn't do those audits on nutritional companies.
The only claim USANA makes is that they manufacture to drug GMP standards. Is your argument that you just don't believe them? If you won't take their word or go to USANA and see for yourself it seems there is no possible way to provide the proof you want is there?
You're new to the argument so I'll fill you in. jdm27ef has been claiming that the PDR shows that USANA has a product of quality. I've been disagreeing because the PDR is a sales tool manufacturers can buy into. He's claimed that you need to meet Drug GMPs to be in the PDR which you clearly don't since USANA themselves openly admits it. Really this who thing has been about jdm27ef avoiding any real conversation or providing any decent scientific backing for USANA.
Whether or not USANA actually manufactures to Drug GMP is a different story. I've read their claims and even they can't justify their high cost. By their argument even the cheapest brands are made to Drug GMP.
My issue is this - The Courts and an independent report show determined USANA to be over priced. If USANA is a science based company I'd like to see some science justifying their cost. Right now the costs just seems to justify a pyramid scheme were almost every fails to make a profit.
Let's put jdm27's arguments aside for a bit. He is one Distributor among thousands and it is really unfair to judge USANA on his arguments.
You spend a lot of time saying that USANA Distributors are all lying and then say that USANA is a pyramid scheme which means either you are also lying or are ignorant as to what constitues a "pyramid" or "ponzi" scheme, which a legal MLM is not.
As for price, give me an example of what you are comparing USANA to so that we can talk apples to apples.
To clear the air a bit I'm not judging USANA on jdm27's arguments. I'm judging USANA based on how it operates.
I don't believe I said that all USANA Distributors are liars but if I did let me clarify. Many of the ones I am reading from are spreading false information. They may know they are or they may be ignorant either way they're responsible.
I'm familiar with what a product-based pyramid scheme looks like in fact let me describe one for you in my next response post.
What do you call a company which sells an "opportunity" to make money which involves signing more people up to sell the opportunity of selling more people up. In this company there is a product which those participating are required to purchase a set amount of every 4 weeks. Almost 90% of all product sales are made by these required purchases. Of those involved only 1% are making money.
I call it a Network Marketing company, the same as everyone else, and the government calls it perfectly legitimate and legal. USANA is not doing business any different than any other Network Marketing company.
In addition, your comment about those involved having to purchase a set amount of product every month is wrong...there is no set amount. As for the 90% and 1% claim, I've heard that before but haven't seen evidence of it. Where did you get your numbers from?
My friend who recently join USANA told me she has to buy the exact amount of product every month...and has to order a large amount of it when she registered at the first place.
I'm interested in this MLM business....but I don't really understand how it works for USANA.
Can you make it clear buy "having to purchase a set amount of product every month is wrong...there is no set amount." for me?
Dogruns...USANA requires Distributors to be on Autoship each month. There is no requirement to spend a "set" amount...you can buy the cheapest item in USANA's inventory if you want to.
If your autoship is less than 100 points (about $130.00 US), you can not participate in the compenation plan. You should wait until your business generates sufficient sales to make you money before spending 100 points per month. It is an extremely fair system.
As I live in Thailand, I'm not sure I can trust the distributor here.
What I heard from her is, I have to pay around $700 US to create an account and around $150 US every month. (Sorry I don't know the actual amount in US dollars cuz she told me in Thai Baht.) Plus, I need to find "4 downline people" in 6 weeks to be qualified.
With regard to the amount you have to buy in order to get into the business...yes, depending on if you want 1 or 3 business centers you have to spend anywhere from $200 to $600 U.S. in product. This is a one time purchase which can be paid for over time.
Keep in mind that USANA has a very generous return policy. Distributors who don't feel the business is for them can return all unused product. Again, it doesn't get any more fair than that.
dogruns...There is no "need" to find 4 people in 6 weeks. If you were to achieve this goal, it would make you a "platinum pacesetter" which is a nice title to have and comes with some benefits, but it is certainly not mandatory.
There are no mandatory conditions within USANA to enroll a certain amount of Distributors within a period of time.
Your main goal, if you join should be to find a few people who are product users. These people secure your business and guarantee a steady stream of income. Anyone you sign up should be encouraged to do the same.
It sounds like the Distributor you are talking with requires some training herself. Please take the time to question what she says. Nobody benefits when someone signs up to USANA based on untrue statements. That's how negative impressions of MLM get started.
Funny that it would be considered legitimate when it's not obeying the FTC 5 Customer rule. I don't know the operation of every other Network Marketing company.
In order to receive a commission every Distributor had to purchase a set quota every 4 weeks on which they receive no commission. Check out eBay to see how much people really want their USANA products.
Are you actually complaing that USANA doesn't give commissions for personal use product? Don't you know that it would be illegal to do that. That would encourge Distributors to purchase product in order to elevate themselves in the compensation plan, something USANA strictly forbids.
My god man, have you no scruples. I'm starting to lose my respect for you.
Nope and you know I'm not. My complaint is that its obvious that product sales are almost entirely driven by people wanting to make commissions instead of an actual desire for the product. Another red flag of a product based pyramid scheme.
Your statement that product sales are driven by a desire for commissions distorts the facts. There are no commissions paid on personal use product and there are many Distributors and Preferred Customers who purchase product, not to participate in the commission plan, but because they like the product.
Besides, all MLM's have a similar system so your argument is against the industry as a whole and not just USANA. I still say you have an agenda in bashing USANA.
If the Distributor doesn't meet their 4 week sales quota they lose all commission points. These purchases account for around 90% of product sales in USANA. I've heard USANAs "Our sale force are volunteers" pitch but the stats do not support it.
Say what you will. There's nothing I can say to you here that's going to change it.
The numbers come from USANAs filings to the SEC as well as their promotional material. You have to read through the fine print very carefully and then break the numbers down but as soon as you do it's easy to see that almost everyone is failing to make money in their USANA business.
No, your 1% number doesn't come from the SEC filings or the USANA promotional material. They come from Jon Taylor, an anti-mlm zealot who has published quite a bit of very questionable and misleading information about USANA.
Gee Jon...does being called out on your mission to slam USANA for fun and profit upset you? Your response seems to indicate that it does. No need to look him up...just look in the mirror.
By the way, my math is just fine. That why I know yours is BS.
You're delusional but I kind of already figured that out. Tell me what percentage of people in USANA make a profit at the end of the day and where you got your information from.
Also I think you know that when I said "a set amount." I was referring to the number of Sales Points a Distributor has to purchase in order to be qualified to receive commissions.
How exactly would I know that what you meant when you said a "set amount" referred to points required to achieve commission when that isn't what you wrote? Am I supposed to read your mind?
I think you are just trying to cover for the fact that I caught you making another of your misleading statements.
How do you want to do a comparison? I'm asking for independent scientific evidence where USANA has been evaluated and determined to be superior. The only test I've stumbled across which someone else pointed to was the one done at the University of Alberta. It was a test for disintegration and while USANA passed so did many cheaper brands. The test also made reference to USANAs "potency guarantee" which was signaled out amongst other products and described in this manner
One product claimed that it meets specifications for potency, uniformity and disintegration as appropriate. However no specifications of appropriate were given.
"This study showed that there are products sold on the Canadian market which use statements on their label which are difficult to define. However, such terms and statements seem to be used to add pseudo-scientific and unjustified value to the product; such statements should be avoided."
With regard to your scientific study, there isn't one...simple as that. Which independent organization would you think would fund such a study? Your request is ridiculous.
As I understand it, USANA uses the Comparative Guide to say they have ranked as the best and I know there are some very persuasive arguments to show the comparative guide is flawed.
The question is, does that mean USANA is not a good product? I don't think it does.
The request is ridiculous? It's ridiculous for a science based company to provide scientific evidence that explains the cost of their products?
Which independent organization? Take a look at any legitimate scientific journal which features studies. Universities etc. Are you not familiar with the studies these groups conduct?
Saying the Comparative Guide is flawed is a complete understatement and it's not a scientific evaluation.
I never said it's bad just that it looks overpriced.
Yes...your request is ridiculous. Why would any of these scientific journals publish a study to show that USANA is better? What would be their motivation to do so? And if an idependant organization hasn't done such a study, how is that USANA's fault?
Secondly, if USANA commissioned and paid for the study would you accept is as being independent? You are getting so desperate to make your argument against USANA that you are losing your common sense.
You really dont know about scientific journals or studies do you? Ive found one reference to USANA in a scientific study which tested other products. In that study they refered to USANA among others - as employing pseudo-scientific language to provide unjustified value to their products. You know that perceived value thing?
Whether or not I would accept a study paid for by USANA would depend on where it was published and how they promoted the conclusions of that study.
Interesting...you dodge the question of what organization would fund a study the likes of which you have been asking for by making some ignorant remark about my knowledge of scientific studies. You're very good at deflecting questions.
Since I don't know the basis for that study or the specifics of what they studied, I can't comment. A lot of your arguments are like that. You point out the negative while ignoring anything that may get in the way of your take on the issue.
Not quite as good as you. I already explained the type of organizations which do testing. Researchers in Universities for example.
That's true. I point to the negative because it just so happens that the only legitimate sources are seeming to say negative things. That Myron Wentz has a PhD doesn't really present overwhelming evidence to counter act the claims that USANA is overpriced.
I'm going to type this slowly so you can understand it. Explaining that universities do research isn't quite the same as explaining why a University would do this research in a non-biased manner in support of USANA, which is what you are asking for.
The fact that you can't understand that USANA is priced somewhat higher based on Dr. Wentz's credentials isn't really my concern. Perhaps you should take a marketing course.
I read that first joke in another message board. You USANA guys really have nothing original to say.
I'm asking for an independent study which shows USANA being capable of producing results that outstrip the competition. Universities FOR EXAMPLE do product testing all the time. Look for the study by University of Alberta.
I understand marketing. That's what USANA has in spades. Legitimate scientific backing and a sustainable business plan... not so much.
In the absence of scientific study or the comparative guide, the only method we have to see if USANA is superior is to compare side by side against other similar products.
To do so is fairly easy....read the labels, compare ingredients and check on the web sites to see if the manufacturing processes are similar. I've done this and have found products similar to USANA but not for much cheaper and, in some cases more expensive. You should do the same and let us know what you find.
With regard to cost, there is also the issue of the value a consumer places on a product. Personally, knowing Dr. Wentz's scientific background and credentials along with the independent testing done to ensure potency, etc, I am willing to pay somewhat more for this product than for other similar ones.
Placing a higher value on a product based on "perceived value" is common across many industries. I peronally don't feel cheated in buying a product that I feel has some advantages.
I would totally agree with you that perceived value is the reason why people are willing to pay more for USANA. How does this perceived value get developed? I think a lot of it comes from people spreading incorrect information about the products. I think ignorance amongst Distributors is the greatest marketing tool USANA has going for it.
I think I explained how the perceived value got developed. It's a fairly simple concept and has nothing do with ignorance among the Distributors.
Speaking of ignorance where is the evidence I asked you for regarding the 1%statement you made earlier. It's a little two-faced to be accusing other of supplying incorrect information without ponying some up yourself.
Wow! Talk about audacity. You actually have the arrogance to claim perceived value works under the circumstances you alone have dictated and then not even recognizing the irony accuse me of being two-faced. Two-faced for not supplying you with information WHICH I ALREADY DID. I told you already the numbers come from analyzing the SEC filings of the company as well as USANAs promotional material. If you want a more detailed account well have to take this conversation somewhere.
I don't believe I set any standard by which perceived value works. It's a fairly simple principle which you obviously have difficulty grasping.
YOU SUPPLIED ME WITH INFORMATION? Are you kidding? What you gave me was an opinion by Jon Taylor, a paid anti-MLM zealot whose mission in life is to slam the MLM industry. Excuse me for thinking that maybe his numbers are a wee bit biased.
You rejected the fact perceived value can come from Distributors lying about USANAs products like jdfm27 was doing. When you lie about the product to give it a perceived benefit which doesn't actually exist you're contributing to the value of perception.
First, with regard to the lying, I think that jdfm27 was misinformed, not lying. Neither is good but one is considerably worse than the other.
And I simply disagree with you on the value of the product. I think that Dr. Wentz's input into the product design warrants a higher price.
Are you attacking USANA because you don't agree with the basics of marketing? I recently bought Kirkland batteries at Costco. They are made by Duracell but are 1/2 the price. Is Duracell a scam?
He might have been misinformed at the start but as soon as he had the opportunity to read USANAs own words on the matter and still refused to continue he was lying.
No because they're selling a product not a scam. I like your analogy though since it pretty much conforms to what I've been saying. USANA is no better than what you can find in stores but they market themselves really well (with the help of poorly informed distributors) making people think it's worth the extra cost.
Are you and taylvb64 the same person? This is freakishly weird. You both use the same phrase too "anti-MLM zealot." What would the opposite be?
I told you the numbers come from USANAs SEC filings and their promotional material. If you want a direct link I can't provide it here. Go through their average earnings and do the math. That'll be a good start.
The phase anti-MLM zealot is a fairly common one. I've seen it used a number of times.
In that same vein, the numbers you quoted came from the SEC filing (by Jon Taylor) who made up his own version of the numbers while ignoring the fact that the real numbers pointed to a 12.1% Distributor retention rate over 10 years. He chose instead to print biased numbers based on an opinion from Ron Glover. A former USANA Distributor now with another company. In other words, he lied.
It's nice that you have so much faith in Dr.Wentz but that doesn't really pass for scientific proof. Plus you have to remember he's renounced his US citizenship, owns the company through a parent company in Lichtenstein, raids the companies stock to make massive profits in such a way that the companies best interests are not being looked out for.
You mention independent testing for potency. Please go into detail. This sounds like the kind of things I've been asking for.
Again, I don't really care where Dr. Wentz chooses to call home. As for the stock raids, I have to admit I'm not familiar with that one. Can you point me out where to look to get that information?
with regard to potency testing, look up the web-site for informed choice. This is an independent test lab that certifies products for athletic use and confirms potencies through laboratory testing.
Perhaps when you've done that we can put the whole "independent study" issue behind us.
Thats fine that you dont care but his having renounced his citizenship and having moved his assets to Lichtenstein should cause you to wonder. Information on officer selling can be found at Reuters, Forbes or through the company SEC filing. Can't supply links here.
I searched the Informed Choice website with Google and found no references to potency.
If youre willing to concede that theres no verifiable scientific evidence behind USANAs prices we can. So much for "science based."
Are you guys seriously the same person? You use the same phrases, reference the same people and seem to be interchangeable when it comes to responses.
You wrote an e-mail to who? Informed Choice? Sorry but I'd like to check for myself. I'm still looking into the Informed Choice testing I just thought I'd mention that I found no reference to potency in case you or OomPappaBoomPa wanted to add more info. So far it seems to just check for banned substances.
The officer selling in USANA, or where Dr. Wentz hangs his hat is of no concern to me or, apparently to the SEC who investigated USANA and found no problems. But it wouldn't do for you or your argument to just accept that fact would it? Particularly not if it gets in the way of your agenda.
You said earlier that the Informed Choice info was the type you were looking for. You sure didn't spend much effort in digging up the facts from them did you? Why is that?
You're trying to justify USANA using Wentz credentials. I merely responded with their being several things which should have people concerned about Wentz.
I haven't finished yet I just found no reference to potency.
Of course we justify USANA on Wentz's credentials. It was Dr. Wentz who developed the products. In case you missed it, that's pretty much what USANA was founded on.
You are trying to make USANA out to be a bad company, in part because Dr. Wentz no longer resides in the US. I suppose every other company in the world that has foreign stockholders is also in your scam radar. Give us a break.
None of this matters because you have an agenda to pursue that goes beyond a simple dislike of USANA. There are thousands of MLM's out there. Many are very shady and you've made the stupid comment that USANA is the scummiest one out there. You're never clarified your motivations for your attacks.
You're like the guy standing on the airport runway yelling "YOU'LL NEVER GET THAT THING TO FLY" at all the planes.
Please continue to call me a zealot. I love it. Its nice to see that you don't stray too far from your herd.
Good luck with your mission to make it big in USANA. Just remember to look down every once and a while to see how many people you're stepping on to make your big pay day.
Also I didn't say that USANA hasn't produced 72 millionaires. I said they don't produce 72 millionaires A YEAR - which is what you claimed. That would require USANA to make 72 new people millionaires every year.
This is probably an ESL issue so it's understandable but since you're probably selling this scheme to English speakers it presents a problem.
LMAO i thought your smarter than me hahah, you don't know what is public base is? damn no wonder you don't know what you talking about.
PUBLIC BASE means you don't need prescription from doctor to get it. also get your facts updated maybe all the facts that you saw is old its 2009 already so where are the facts that says we are bad. LOL
You're just making things up. "Public Base" is just two words you stuck together to try and describe something. That's okay though since I'm use to you making things up.
Nutritional Supplements are regulated like Food and like food you don't need a prescription to get any of them so you've either been misinformed or you're lying. True things might have changed since 2009 (your story certainly is changing quite rapidly) but the fact is you're still don't know what you're talking about.
I never said that USANA is bad. I said it's overpriced and that nearly everyone who gets involved in the business will lose money.
I'll tell you AGAIN where I got the info that it's over-priced. It comes from a court ruling in which USANA twice failed to prove that their products offered superior quality and from a consumer report show called La Facture which tested their prodcuts and concluded they cost 2-3 times more than comparable products without providing any additional quality.
I'm still waiting on any scientific evidence which contradicts the findings by the courts and by the report show. Anytime you're ready. If USANA is a science based company it shouldn't be so hard to find a scientific study which proves this.
I see you're being very selective of what you choose to discuss about the court case. First - None of Minkows allegations were found to be false. In fact USANA lost 4 of the 5 claims they brought against Minkow and were required to pay his court costs. Those costs far exceeded the sanction issued against Minkow. A sanction the courts reduced after USANAs lawyers were found to be asking way too much for their time.
Minkow was allowed to keep his videos up but he and USANA made a secret deal to end the final claim USANA had against Minkow. This was a claim of stock manipulation. A claim in which USANA said there were multiple parties involved but failed to name any. They also failed to show any forward movement on that claim deciding instead to make a sealed deal with Minkow which included their dropping their charges and Minkow leaving them alone. Personally I think they paid him off.
Actually, USANA didn't win any of their battle against Minkow. They lost all their claims except for one which they decided to settle with him. The details of the settlement are closed but what is known is that it included Minkow agreeing to leave USANA alone.
The point is that USANA isn't offering you high end nutritionals. They're offering you the same product you can get off of the store shelves for much cheaper but they wrap it in marketing to give the appearance of quality.
LOL dude i think this person is just digging up old old old stuff that is had nothing to do with usana just to make an excuses for not doing it ahahah. i see there are people here that are educated about MLM industry and about usana
Take a second and think about what you just wrote. You've just said "there are people here that are educated about MOM industry and about usana." That person just told you that you were wrong and I was right about the PDR. Are you willing to admit you don't know what you're talking about yet?
LOL is that all you have against me ahahaha damn i need more proof that i am in pyramid scheme this is not enough you keep telling me all this stuff but how can you tell your not scientist nor government LMAO
No, no, no. I have nothing against you. I actually feel sorry for you. It's just that I don't know I'm supposed to communicate everything to you when you can barely read or write. If I had the time I guess could make you a pop-up boo
99% fail in USANA.
I'm making more money selling physical products for Amazon than all my (wasted) years in network marketing.
amazingdany 3 weeks ago
Robert Kiyosaki
MegaJane37 2 months ago
i think cuz they are dumb ass, so they can't tell the difference between pyramid scheme, and a healthy legal network marketing company.. if those ppl that says USANA doesn't work, but are able to give me the income USANA gave me every week, double up, 4 times up each year, and are able to help me help ppl getting same money as i do, and being healthier and healthier. I follow that person, and quit USANA. (However, i believe none of those failures are able to, so go back and fix yourself first)
frances0130 4 months ago
Comment removed
frances0130 4 months ago
USANA, Simply the BEST! Let me show u how.... 0916-5914004 ronsync (Philippines)
ronsync 4 months ago
@samuel408 search this on google "The Topsy Turvy Life of Barry Minkow Takes Another Plunge" the host on the link you gave is a convict who's specialty publishing false information.
Today was judgment day for Minkow, 45. Miami federal judge Patricia Seitz sentenced Minkow to five years in prison for the fraud, and he was ordered to pay $583 million in restitution
xxbane66 6 months ago
USANA is not a Pyramid Scheme, FYI Pyramid scheme means = non-sustainable business model. USANA has been in the Network Marketing Industry for 19 years. USANA is listed in New York Stock exchange. USANA MANUFACTUREs it's own products unlike other Network Companies. Our products are not cheap but they are worth every penny you spend.
xxbane66 6 months ago 4
USANA IS A PYRAMID SCAM!!!!!!!!!! You make money by recruiting people not selling those expensive products! /watch?v=91UW5JMcyFc&feature=related
samuel408 6 months ago
Comment removed
mcaqkino 6 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
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apple11111able 6 months ago
Funny how you guys are so negative...i tell you us here in the Philippines,we're getting rich because of USANA....USANA makes our dreams come true! I love being with USANA..and most of all.I AM VERY HEALTHY! I thank Dr. Myron Wenz!
tesslovesmusicvid 6 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
For a real opportunity to earn GOOD money email me at: foster_236@hotmail.com and I will send you an Eligibility Form for you to fill out. If all is well then you can start working on my team ASAP!
foster2367 7 months ago
99% of associates never make a profit:
bit . ly/jo2pTU
kooljosh100 8 months ago
kiyosaki just shared about the cash flow quadrat, did he mention anything about usana in this video? i have seen the same video in amway as well.
Ugaindran 10 months ago
@Ugaindran exactly... that's because they both use the same system and both of them are up in the stock market.
ceslovesrock 6 months ago
Why does everyone always drop shit in this video? Seriously, who lets their laptop bag fly out the window of a taxi cab.
ErieComics 1 year ago
Contact me to become a retailer today!!
mikesmith694 1 year ago
please look at those successful ppl, and ask them why they succeed, and see what they did and learn from them. why you keep on focusing on those failurs? why you wanna be a failure, too? so you learn from the failures?
the difference between failures and successful ppl, is only they think differently.. your negative thoughts won't influence a bit to those successful ppl.
frances0130 1 year ago
No. The difference between those that "fail" at USANA and those that "succeed" is that those that "succeeded" have managed to support their "USANA Business" by recruiting others into this pyramid scheme.
HGMercury8077 1 year ago
@HGMercury8077 if its a pyramid scheme the justice system would have shut it down, plus schemes dont sell products
mgk22 8 months ago
to sean... you can ask those ppl who quit, did they take products everyday? did they really day what they have to do? USANA sells nutritional supplements not medicine. I thought only medicine you feel it right away and sometimes with side effects. Some ppl did join USANA, but what did they do? they sit at home doing nothing, thinking money will come out from no where. I don't feel suprised if they fail.
frances0130 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
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tigernov6 1 year ago
Comment removed
phearthis85 1 year ago
if USANA is so good, explain to me why they were sued in 2008? and if the people are suppose to be helping others in and outside the company...how come yesterday I was stalked, screamed at, and followed to my home all because I didn't give them my money? Just think about that.
phearthis85 1 year ago
@phearthis85
there are always people who don't do things the way they are suppose to right..
if America is such a nice place to live in, how come i see murders on the news everyday?
yet America is one of the most recognize country in the world right?
seanliucool 1 year ago
@seanliucool
Here's something to think about. Almost everyone who joins USANA will quit in the first year. USANA sells almost 90% of its product to Distributors. If the product is so good why do people not only quit but stop purchasing the product? Because it's about recruiting not product sales. The products don't sell on their own.
HGMercury8077 1 year ago
i love investing :D Though I refused to participate in Usana :p
FarmGiraffe 1 year ago
@FarmGiraffe You did well! You had 99% chances to not make money anyway. Very tough business. The supplements are good although they'll wipe out your checking account. Life force Multiple tablets on Amazon.com were rated as good as USANA but they cost 31$... FOR THREE MONTH SUPPLY!!!!! Compared to USANA's 50$ A MONTH Essentials...
amazingdany 1 year ago
@amazingdany yeah u said 99% not and it is xactly y there is only 1 % of the U.S population that is rich cuz they worked smarter, then again there is 4% that r finantialy independent. check out the 100 college graduate test mayb that will help
SlaughterEmAll 1 year ago
hi friend, Robert didnt say usana can do. Cuase Robert is an Amway distributor.
If you want to do direct selling. Do Amway.
casuccess 1 year ago
Regarding the compensation system, I do not see how it is fair that someone has to balance legs of income. It appears designed to enable the company to take as much as they can and give as little as they can in return. On commission I get a percentage of what I sell, but with USANA if sales are $80,000 in one leg, but $4,000 in the other leg, you only get commission on the combined amount of $8,000. They still get $84,000. It's hard work and a gamble for the distributor. Appears immoral to me.
USANAK 1 year ago
@USANAK ...wow buddy! For a guy whose incurable condition was put into remission by USANA's products you sure don't seem very grateful. You've posted this identical spiteful message on a large number of videos. Too bad you don't know what you are talking about.
I'll bet not too many people do you favors anymore.
OomPappaBoomPa 1 year ago
First, the product is good; been using it for years. Put my incurable medical condition into remission. If I stop using it the symptoms return.
HOWEVER, the company is awful! For example, took over 3 hours, 5 calls, to put in an order today. Simple or not every time you call its a major event. Super poor service! Korea or Australia, same thing.
I do NOT recommend USANA as a business. They are awful! If I ever find another product that does the same thing for me I will dump USANA with glee.
USANAK 1 year ago
But i've noticed that this HGMercury guy has over 20 comments posted! Who does that? very suspiscious. Don't engage- it's like oxygen to a flame or debating w/ a 5 yro. USANA reps need to relax! LOL!
bonzojpaul 2 years ago
It' suspicious to engage in an open debate?
You're just the kind of guy that USANA preys upon. The kind that doesn't want to ask questions. You'll drink the kool-aid and do what you're told. Good luck with your USANA business ;)
I see you're already talking to jdfm27 and are subscribing to successwithusanas channel. If you don't want an open discussion about the company you can message me.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
You USANA people need to relax. I've known about USANA for a couple years now cause my friend has lupus and the pills are helping, my colleugue at work quit her teaching job cause she's making so much money w/ her USANA business. These are people i highly respect and trust. Me and some friends are thinking of doing some network marketing- still researching.
bonzojpaul 2 years ago
How about we all calm down here for a second. We're actually missing out on why we started discussing in the first place. We were talking about comparing two products - one from USANA and one from a competitor. How about we do that? USANA Pure Rest vs WorldWide Labs Melatonin. I mentioned this earlier but it seems it might have been overlooked.
If you want to also talk about who makes money in USANA we can do that too.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Yes, WorldWide labs has a very good product and extemely cheap. The issue is, does that make USANA a scam.
Well, for comparison, lets take TrueStar Health Products, a non-mlm who's melatonin is much more expensive than USANA. Many companies on the web sell melatonin for considerably more than WorldWide Labs. Are they all scams?
Why don't you find a product that compares to the essentials, since that is USANA's main product. Why did you pick melatonin to compare against?
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
Someone else was already asking for a comparison on it You said pick a product. Why are you now upset I didn't pick the one you want?
I'm sorry but what are you trying to get at? You said find a product which was cheaper than something by USANA. I've done that and you want to shift the playing field?
I don't know enough about TrueStar Health at the moment to comment about whether or not I think it's a scam.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
You're switching your argument. First you asked me to find you a product to compare with USANAs. I've done that. Now you're trying to compartmentalize the various problems, dubious awards, questionable behavior which takes place in USANA in an effort to justify how its not a scam. Kind of ridiculous.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
not only are the products great, there opertunity is even better, i have joined with usana and 6 weeks later, im making an extra $1000+ a month and its just growing every week. you can make more than $1000 a week, if you put your heart into it. if you like to join ill help you with all the info you need just leave me a private message.
haydenchatton 2 years ago
jdm27ef - Still waiting for your response about USANA admitting they haven't been checked by the FDA for Drug GMPs. You seem to keep missing that one.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
its cool, i laughed because you just helped me get a pay checked hehe thats why I am laughing. while you want to bash on USANA and didnt get anything LOL
jdm27ef 2 years ago
I didn't help you get a paycheck. The people you suckered in with your false information did. I also didn't get nothing. I got to watch you twist in the wind as you failed to provide anything which legitimizes your business instead resorting to the same old lies that every other USANA Rep tosses around.
Still waiting for
- An explanation of USANAs mandatory 4 week purchase
- A legitimate scientific study which refutes the findings that USANA is over-priced
That's just for starters!
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
LOL i didnt even contact that person, that person did LOL
explanation for 4 week autoship and its not mandatory its optional. you can pay for it and build your business or if you dont feeling building your business you can turn it off
ATHLETE take our products, Olympic athletes, Jennifer Azzi, i mean if our product is not that good why would you think pro athletes take our product that they know that their medals can get taken away if they were get tested and get a positive for illegal substance
jdm27ef 2 years ago
Why should you be required to buy any product?
That's not a scientific study. Do you not know what a scientific study is?
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Oh and "LOL i didnt even contact that person, that person did LOL" makes no sense. If you could please rephrase it I'll respond.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
damn.... i feel bad for you, can't even read? LOL
here let me rephrase it:
That person contacted me because of this comments, and its that person who contacted me so i didn't scam that person. He wanted to be in scam! do you now understand it?
LOL
4 week autoship is optional.
Pro athletes takes our product, Jennifer Azzi, The whole WTA women tennis association, Werner Berger, oh BEAT FREAKS from MTV, we are even in Oscar pre party, MTV Movie awards, Winter Olympic Athletes, and even LARRY KING
jdm27ef 2 years ago
Only when the person can't write.
I doubt any person contacted you and if they did its because of the misinformation you've been writing here. That's if this person exists. Which I doubt. You've lied enough already that I doubt you'd stop now.
Autoship is optional but required to make commissions. Why? People just dump it on eBay.
Everything you mentioned involves USANA either paying or giving their product away. Do you not know what a scientific study is?
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
It's like saying Nike is the best because Tiger Woods uses their products. It's ridiculous. Tiger Woods uses their products because they pay him. It has nothing to do with quality. He could prefer something else but would be unable to use it because of his sponsorship deal.
Still waiting on any legitimate scientific study that explains USANAs inflated product price. Seriously doubt there is any but you'll never say it.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
ok go ahead doubt it, it doesnt matter to you anyways lol. Here a quick advice don't rely on your research and go to your doctor and ask him what is PDR and what are the stuff that you need to be in it. I believe your not in medical field and that's the reason you are misinformed. Oh and just let you know we dont have to pay anyone to take our product and that'show we are legitimate. You dont have to believe you know its your choice.
jdm27ef 2 years ago
I would suggest you actually read about the PDR and stop believing everything your USANA upline tells you. You didn't even acknowledge the fact there are over a dozen supplement manufactures in the PDR and not just USANA as you claimed. You even got GMP wrong.
You don't pay to sponsor. Do you not know how sponsorship works? Truth be told if I could get USANA products for free I'd take them too. They're not worthless they're just not worth what USANA is charging for them.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
You also didn't address the fact USANA themselves have admitted that they have not been certified for GMPs in the U.S.
If it were a requirement to be in the PDR, which it is not, then how would you explain this?
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
IDk what you get your info but damn you need to really ask professionals on this cause you dont know it. sigh.......
jdm27ef 2 years ago
I find it somewhat bizarre that you would claim I don't know it when you were the one who wrongfully claimed that USANA was the only Supplement Manufacturer in the PDR, when you wrongfully implied the FDA was responsible for the PDR, falsely stated that GMP manufacturing was essential for being included in the PDR when USANA itself has admitted that it has not been proven to manufacture to GMPs.
So far I've demonstrated I have considerably more knowledge about the PDR than you do.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
In all seriousness how do you explain what you've been saying here when it has been proven false?
You claimed USANA was the only Supplement Manufacturer in the PDR and then I provided you with a list of 29 other manufacturers who appear within it.
You claimed that GMP was a requirement for being included in the PDR but USANA even admits to not being inspected for GMP by the FDA.
How do you explain this? Where are you getting your information from?
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
yeah i just re read my comment and yes i did say it but its a typo i ment is we are the only supplements in the PDR that are public base.
and yes i did say FDA regulates PDR every 2 years.
answer this do you know what is FDA means?
if so how come you dont know that PDR is regulated by FDA?
I get my info from my professor in my college about the PDR. also from the scientist that created the supplements.
jdm27ef 2 years ago
What do you mean by public base?
Food and Drug Administration. The PDR is a private publication of Thomson Reuters. What the FDA does do is inspect Drug Manufactures every two years. I have found no information anywhere which says that they specifically inspect the PDR or that they have any direct involvement with it. This would exclude USANA who manufactures a Food product.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
well you need to ask professional, i got my info from my professor. FDA regulate PDR because all of the medicine we get from our DR cost hella money and if the medicine is cheap that means the material that they use to make the medicine is crap. why would you pay for something that is crap, that's why FDA regulate PDR.
jdm27ef 2 years ago
Here's where you're confused. The FDA regulates Drug Manufacturers and they are supposed to investigate them every two years. This happens whether or not they're in the PDR. The FDA does not investigate on behalf of the PDR because a Branch of the Government is not going to perform such a function for a private company like Thomson Reuters - the Publishers of the PDR. The PDR is a product catalog put out by Thomson Reuters in which Manufacturers of Drugs and Supplements can pay to have their
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
products listed.
USANA makes Supplements which are treated as Food by the FDA. That's why they have not undergone GMP testing as if they were Drugs. The FDA is not going to make an exception because USANA - or any other Supplement Manufacturer - pays to be included in the PDR.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
You failed to explain the issue of GMP.
You claim that you need to manufacture to GMP quality to be in the PDR but USANA even admits that they have not been inspected for this by the FDA. Explain this.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
give me a link that usana said this LOL, there is no way you can buy your self in the PDR.
jdm27ef 2 years ago
jdm27ef....I'm a USANA Distributor as well but unfortunately, I have to agree with HGMercury8077. For vitamin makers, the PDR is basically a marketing tool. You pay and you get listed simple as that.
I would suggest you stop arguing with this guy because he obviously has a USANA bias and you are making it worse by presenting arguments that aren't true.
USANA has a lot going for it and nothing to apologize for. If HGMercury doesnt like the company, don't join or buy the products.
taylvb64 2 years ago
but I'm no more biased than anyone who loves USANA. The difference is in what we have to back it up.
I think two separate independent sources reaching the conclusion that USANA has an over-priced product is a legitimate cause for concern especially when nothing shows the contrary.
I'd like to hear what you mean by "USANA has a lot going for it"
Of course if you'd rather not that's fine.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
I think they have plenty to apologize for. For example the way they handle their companies stock in order to bleed the company of its profts. Are you aware that they were fined for taking too much money out of the company to pad the wallets of their executives? That they have lied about why Ladd McNamara handed in his medical license. That they never openly stated that Myron Wentz renounced his US Citizenship. That they refuse to release their drop out rate.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
That shareholders - as few as there are - had to learn that the company had the majority shares of its stock parked in Lichtenstein from someone investigating the company. That the products are over-priced. That almost everyone involved loses money. You know things like that.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Cut and paste this phrase into Google.
"USANA is NOT Certified by the FDA for Pharmaceutical GMPs"
It will take you to a Facebook page which have two quotes by USANA. In both quotes they admit that they have not been investigated by the FDA to make sure they comply with Drug GMPs. Links to where these quotes are taken from are supplied with them. One is to a filing made by USANA to the SEC and the other is hidden away on their web-site.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
jdm27ef - I'm still waiting for an explanation about what you mean when you say that USANA is the only supplement in the PDR that is "public base"
I'd also like to hear your explanation of USANA not being tested for Drug GMPs by the FDA and yet still being included in the PDR despite what you claim to have heard from your professor.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Yours is the same old schtick as every other opponent of MLM. USANA fought these battles already and won. Barry Minkow tried his best to give USANA a black eye and was sanctioned by the courts for making false allegations. Why do you think his videos are no longer up?
As for price, what is "too high"? Have you gone into a naturopath office lately and compared the price of other high end nutritionals to USANA? What are you comparing USANA to?
taylvb64 2 years ago
You make a big deal of USANA's founder giving up his US Citizenship. So what? How does that impact USANA's customers in any way. Thanks to Barry (and I do mean "thanks" because he did USANA a favor), USANA has been investigated by the SEC and found to be perfectly legitimate and above board.
As I said, I'm not going to argue with you. You have your concerns, we get it. MLM isn't for everyone and obviously isn't for you. What are you expecting to achieve by all of your posturing?
taylvb64 2 years ago
It impacts the shareholders and Distributors. Wentz image is an essential part of the USANA marketing mix.
The SEC also failed to catch Bernard Madoff the first time around.
What I hope to achieve is to educate people about the lies being spread by USANA Distributors in order to sell their over-priced products and disastrous business scheme. Look at all the misinformation in your posts. You don't know the facts and are spreading falsehood which contribute to the problem.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Buddy....you are way too uptight and really need to find yourself a hobby.
taylvb64 2 years ago
Friend, you're way to ignorant to be lecturing anyone on USANA.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
You're right. I admit it...USANA has brainwashed all the thousands of Distributors to be human rip-off machines. We mindlessly go out and bilk the public by selling products that are much more expensive than the Wal-Mart Brands.
Great that we have heroes like you to come to the rescue. Good thing for USANA that all the successful distributors in the company didn't talk to you first. They might never have joined knowing that you can't make any money.
taylvb64 2 years ago
I think USANA supplies the information and you (Distributors) fail to think critically about it or question it. You mindlessly take it in and assume it means something it doesn't. Then you repeat it in order to get others to join. Sort of like all the incorrect statements you made about the Minkow vs. USANA court case.
All the successful Distributors? Do you mean the tiny minority that makes a profit off of recruitment instead of retail? What kind of business does that sound like to you?
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
DUDE STFU with the scientific shit you aint scientist and you will never know even you reaserch it too many times, WHO FUCKN CARES!!! its not like you want to join or something. WE GOT SCAMED AND YOU DIDNT HAPPY! LOL omg this KID
LOL TINY minority successful? WOW get your facts right USANA produces 72 millionairs every year and compare that to other company hahahah YEAH tell me im not right.
jdm27ef 2 years ago
Lol, giving up? I thought you knew how to handle people like me. I thought you had plenty of scientific backing.
You're not right. In fact you're embarrassingly wrong but at least you're showing consistency. When you break down the numbers only 1% are earning money in USANA.
USANA doesn't produce 72 millionaires a year. It has had 72 Distributors clear at least a million in commissions over their entire time at USANA. Remember that they also made that money mostly through recruitment.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Have you checked out those quotes yet where USANA says they haven't been checked for Drug GMPs?
Still waiting to hear your response to that. I'm sure it'll be classic.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
jdm27ef 2 years ago
Here's my response to your presentation
- Court says your products are over-priced
- Independent testing agrees
- Read Forbes article Hard to Swallow
- Read the National Business Review articles
- Your potency guarantee is nonsensical jargon
- BofA says your industry is the second worst industry for turning a profit.
- You pay to be in the PDR (Why can't you figure that out?)
- Only 1% profit
- If you're a science based company why have you been unable to provide me with ONE scientific source?
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
HGMercury8077...I don't get why you are making such a big deal about the drug GMP's. USANA doesn't say they are audited by the FDA. How could they since the FDA doesn't do those audits on nutritional companies.
The only claim USANA makes is that they manufacture to drug GMP standards. Is your argument that you just don't believe them? If you won't take their word or go to USANA and see for yourself it seems there is no possible way to provide the proof you want is there?
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
You're new to the argument so I'll fill you in. jdm27ef has been claiming that the PDR shows that USANA has a product of quality. I've been disagreeing because the PDR is a sales tool manufacturers can buy into. He's claimed that you need to meet Drug GMPs to be in the PDR which you clearly don't since USANA themselves openly admits it. Really this who thing has been about jdm27ef avoiding any real conversation or providing any decent scientific backing for USANA.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Whether or not USANA actually manufactures to Drug GMP is a different story. I've read their claims and even they can't justify their high cost. By their argument even the cheapest brands are made to Drug GMP.
My issue is this - The Courts and an independent report show determined USANA to be over priced. If USANA is a science based company I'd like to see some science justifying their cost. Right now the costs just seems to justify a pyramid scheme were almost every fails to make a profit.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Let's put jdm27's arguments aside for a bit. He is one Distributor among thousands and it is really unfair to judge USANA on his arguments.
You spend a lot of time saying that USANA Distributors are all lying and then say that USANA is a pyramid scheme which means either you are also lying or are ignorant as to what constitues a "pyramid" or "ponzi" scheme, which a legal MLM is not.
As for price, give me an example of what you are comparing USANA to so that we can talk apples to apples.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
To clear the air a bit I'm not judging USANA on jdm27's arguments. I'm judging USANA based on how it operates.
I don't believe I said that all USANA Distributors are liars but if I did let me clarify. Many of the ones I am reading from are spreading false information. They may know they are or they may be ignorant either way they're responsible.
I'm familiar with what a product-based pyramid scheme looks like in fact let me describe one for you in my next response post.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
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HGMercury8077 2 years ago
What do you call a company which sells an "opportunity" to make money which involves signing more people up to sell the opportunity of selling more people up. In this company there is a product which those participating are required to purchase a set amount of every 4 weeks. Almost 90% of all product sales are made by these required purchases. Of those involved only 1% are making money.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
I call it a Network Marketing company, the same as everyone else, and the government calls it perfectly legitimate and legal. USANA is not doing business any different than any other Network Marketing company.
In addition, your comment about those involved having to purchase a set amount of product every month is wrong...there is no set amount. As for the 90% and 1% claim, I've heard that before but haven't seen evidence of it. Where did you get your numbers from?
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
My friend who recently join USANA told me she has to buy the exact amount of product every month...and has to order a large amount of it when she registered at the first place.
I'm interested in this MLM business....but I don't really understand how it works for USANA.
Can you make it clear buy "having to purchase a set amount of product every month is wrong...there is no set amount." for me?
dogruns 2 years ago
Dogruns...USANA requires Distributors to be on Autoship each month. There is no requirement to spend a "set" amount...you can buy the cheapest item in USANA's inventory if you want to.
If your autoship is less than 100 points (about $130.00 US), you can not participate in the compenation plan. You should wait until your business generates sufficient sales to make you money before spending 100 points per month. It is an extremely fair system.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
There's a lot more I have to learn about this!
As I live in Thailand, I'm not sure I can trust the distributor here.
What I heard from her is, I have to pay around $700 US to create an account and around $150 US every month. (Sorry I don't know the actual amount in US dollars cuz she told me in Thai Baht.) Plus, I need to find "4 downline people" in 6 weeks to be qualified.
Is it true?
dogruns 2 years ago
With regard to the amount you have to buy in order to get into the business...yes, depending on if you want 1 or 3 business centers you have to spend anywhere from $200 to $600 U.S. in product. This is a one time purchase which can be paid for over time.
Keep in mind that USANA has a very generous return policy. Distributors who don't feel the business is for them can return all unused product. Again, it doesn't get any more fair than that.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
sorry you've already answer the questions but how about getting 4 new people in 6 weeks? Why is that?
dogruns 2 years ago
dogruns...There is no "need" to find 4 people in 6 weeks. If you were to achieve this goal, it would make you a "platinum pacesetter" which is a nice title to have and comes with some benefits, but it is certainly not mandatory.
There are no mandatory conditions within USANA to enroll a certain amount of Distributors within a period of time.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
Your main goal, if you join should be to find a few people who are product users. These people secure your business and guarantee a steady stream of income. Anyone you sign up should be encouraged to do the same.
It sounds like the Distributor you are talking with requires some training herself. Please take the time to question what she says. Nobody benefits when someone signs up to USANA based on untrue statements. That's how negative impressions of MLM get started.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
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dogruns 2 years ago
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OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
Funny that it would be considered legitimate when it's not obeying the FTC 5 Customer rule. I don't know the operation of every other Network Marketing company.
In order to receive a commission every Distributor had to purchase a set quota every 4 weeks on which they receive no commission. Check out eBay to see how much people really want their USANA products.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
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taylvb64 2 years ago
Are you actually complaing that USANA doesn't give commissions for personal use product? Don't you know that it would be illegal to do that. That would encourge Distributors to purchase product in order to elevate themselves in the compensation plan, something USANA strictly forbids.
My god man, have you no scruples. I'm starting to lose my respect for you.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
Nope and you know I'm not. My complaint is that its obvious that product sales are almost entirely driven by people wanting to make commissions instead of an actual desire for the product. Another red flag of a product based pyramid scheme.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Your statement that product sales are driven by a desire for commissions distorts the facts. There are no commissions paid on personal use product and there are many Distributors and Preferred Customers who purchase product, not to participate in the commission plan, but because they like the product.
Besides, all MLM's have a similar system so your argument is against the industry as a whole and not just USANA. I still say you have an agenda in bashing USANA.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
If the Distributor doesn't meet their 4 week sales quota they lose all commission points. These purchases account for around 90% of product sales in USANA. I've heard USANAs "Our sale force are volunteers" pitch but the stats do not support it.
Say what you will. There's nothing I can say to you here that's going to change it.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
The numbers come from USANAs filings to the SEC as well as their promotional material. You have to read through the fine print very carefully and then break the numbers down but as soon as you do it's easy to see that almost everyone is failing to make money in their USANA business.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
No, your 1% number doesn't come from the SEC filings or the USANA promotional material. They come from Jon Taylor, an anti-mlm zealot who has published quite a bit of very questionable and misleading information about USANA.
You wouldn't be familiar with him would you?
taylvb64 2 years ago
Actually it does. How good are your math skills? Go through USANAs average earnings. Try really, really hard.
Anti-MLM Zealot did you learn that at a recruitment meeting? Very.... cultish.
I'll be sure to look him up. BTW is his work questionable and misleading because its hard for you to understand?
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Gee Jon...does being called out on your mission to slam USANA for fun and profit upset you? Your response seems to indicate that it does. No need to look him up...just look in the mirror.
By the way, my math is just fine. That why I know yours is BS.
taylvb64 2 years ago
You're delusional but I kind of already figured that out. Tell me what percentage of people in USANA make a profit at the end of the day and where you got your information from.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
I don't know Jon and neither do you. But i'm pretty sure it's more than the 1% BS you've been throwing around.
It's easy to demand information from me while providing none of your own to back your ridiculous claims.
victay64 2 years ago
Also I think you know that when I said "a set amount." I was referring to the number of Sales Points a Distributor has to purchase in order to be qualified to receive commissions.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
How exactly would I know that what you meant when you said a "set amount" referred to points required to achieve commission when that isn't what you wrote? Am I supposed to read your mind?
I think you are just trying to cover for the fact that I caught you making another of your misleading statements.
taylvb64 2 years ago
Actually I wasnt talking to you.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
How do you want to do a comparison? I'm asking for independent scientific evidence where USANA has been evaluated and determined to be superior. The only test I've stumbled across which someone else pointed to was the one done at the University of Alberta. It was a test for disintegration and while USANA passed so did many cheaper brands. The test also made reference to USANAs "potency guarantee" which was signaled out amongst other products and described in this manner
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
One product claimed that it meets specifications for potency, uniformity and disintegration as appropriate. However no specifications of appropriate were given.
"This study showed that there are products sold on the Canadian market which use statements on their label which are difficult to define. However, such terms and statements seem to be used to add pseudo-scientific and unjustified value to the product; such statements should be avoided."
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
With regard to your scientific study, there isn't one...simple as that. Which independent organization would you think would fund such a study? Your request is ridiculous.
As I understand it, USANA uses the Comparative Guide to say they have ranked as the best and I know there are some very persuasive arguments to show the comparative guide is flawed.
The question is, does that mean USANA is not a good product? I don't think it does.
See next post.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
The request is ridiculous? It's ridiculous for a science based company to provide scientific evidence that explains the cost of their products?
Which independent organization? Take a look at any legitimate scientific journal which features studies. Universities etc. Are you not familiar with the studies these groups conduct?
Saying the Comparative Guide is flawed is a complete understatement and it's not a scientific evaluation.
I never said it's bad just that it looks overpriced.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Yes...your request is ridiculous. Why would any of these scientific journals publish a study to show that USANA is better? What would be their motivation to do so? And if an idependant organization hasn't done such a study, how is that USANA's fault?
Secondly, if USANA commissioned and paid for the study would you accept is as being independent? You are getting so desperate to make your argument against USANA that you are losing your common sense.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
You really dont know about scientific journals or studies do you? Ive found one reference to USANA in a scientific study which tested other products. In that study they refered to USANA among others - as employing pseudo-scientific language to provide unjustified value to their products. You know that perceived value thing?
Whether or not I would accept a study paid for by USANA would depend on where it was published and how they promoted the conclusions of that study.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Interesting...you dodge the question of what organization would fund a study the likes of which you have been asking for by making some ignorant remark about my knowledge of scientific studies. You're very good at deflecting questions.
Since I don't know the basis for that study or the specifics of what they studied, I can't comment. A lot of your arguments are like that. You point out the negative while ignoring anything that may get in the way of your take on the issue.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
Not quite as good as you. I already explained the type of organizations which do testing. Researchers in Universities for example.
That's true. I point to the negative because it just so happens that the only legitimate sources are seeming to say negative things. That Myron Wentz has a PhD doesn't really present overwhelming evidence to counter act the claims that USANA is overpriced.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
I'm going to type this slowly so you can understand it. Explaining that universities do research isn't quite the same as explaining why a University would do this research in a non-biased manner in support of USANA, which is what you are asking for.
The fact that you can't understand that USANA is priced somewhat higher based on Dr. Wentz's credentials isn't really my concern. Perhaps you should take a marketing course.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
I read that first joke in another message board. You USANA guys really have nothing original to say.
I'm asking for an independent study which shows USANA being capable of producing results that outstrip the competition. Universities FOR EXAMPLE do product testing all the time. Look for the study by University of Alberta.
I understand marketing. That's what USANA has in spades. Legitimate scientific backing and a sustainable business plan... not so much.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
In the absence of scientific study or the comparative guide, the only method we have to see if USANA is superior is to compare side by side against other similar products.
To do so is fairly easy....read the labels, compare ingredients and check on the web sites to see if the manufacturing processes are similar. I've done this and have found products similar to USANA but not for much cheaper and, in some cases more expensive. You should do the same and let us know what you find.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
How about USANAs Pure Rest compared with WorldWide Labs Melatonin.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
With regard to cost, there is also the issue of the value a consumer places on a product. Personally, knowing Dr. Wentz's scientific background and credentials along with the independent testing done to ensure potency, etc, I am willing to pay somewhat more for this product than for other similar ones.
Placing a higher value on a product based on "perceived value" is common across many industries. I peronally don't feel cheated in buying a product that I feel has some advantages.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
I would totally agree with you that perceived value is the reason why people are willing to pay more for USANA. How does this perceived value get developed? I think a lot of it comes from people spreading incorrect information about the products. I think ignorance amongst Distributors is the greatest marketing tool USANA has going for it.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
I think I explained how the perceived value got developed. It's a fairly simple concept and has nothing do with ignorance among the Distributors.
Speaking of ignorance where is the evidence I asked you for regarding the 1%statement you made earlier. It's a little two-faced to be accusing other of supplying incorrect information without ponying some up yourself.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
Wow! Talk about audacity. You actually have the arrogance to claim perceived value works under the circumstances you alone have dictated and then not even recognizing the irony accuse me of being two-faced. Two-faced for not supplying you with information WHICH I ALREADY DID. I told you already the numbers come from analyzing the SEC filings of the company as well as USANAs promotional material. If you want a more detailed account well have to take this conversation somewhere.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
I don't believe I set any standard by which perceived value works. It's a fairly simple principle which you obviously have difficulty grasping.
YOU SUPPLIED ME WITH INFORMATION? Are you kidding? What you gave me was an opinion by Jon Taylor, a paid anti-MLM zealot whose mission in life is to slam the MLM industry. Excuse me for thinking that maybe his numbers are a wee bit biased.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
You rejected the fact perceived value can come from Distributors lying about USANAs products like jdfm27 was doing. When you lie about the product to give it a perceived benefit which doesn't actually exist you're contributing to the value of perception.
You can't have your cake and eat it to.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
First, with regard to the lying, I think that jdfm27 was misinformed, not lying. Neither is good but one is considerably worse than the other.
And I simply disagree with you on the value of the product. I think that Dr. Wentz's input into the product design warrants a higher price.
Are you attacking USANA because you don't agree with the basics of marketing? I recently bought Kirkland batteries at Costco. They are made by Duracell but are 1/2 the price. Is Duracell a scam?
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
He might have been misinformed at the start but as soon as he had the opportunity to read USANAs own words on the matter and still refused to continue he was lying.
No because they're selling a product not a scam. I like your analogy though since it pretty much conforms to what I've been saying. USANA is no better than what you can find in stores but they market themselves really well (with the help of poorly informed distributors) making people think it's worth the extra cost.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Are you and taylvb64 the same person? This is freakishly weird. You both use the same phrase too "anti-MLM zealot." What would the opposite be?
I told you the numbers come from USANAs SEC filings and their promotional material. If you want a direct link I can't provide it here. Go through their average earnings and do the math. That'll be a good start.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
The phase anti-MLM zealot is a fairly common one. I've seen it used a number of times.
In that same vein, the numbers you quoted came from the SEC filing (by Jon Taylor) who made up his own version of the numbers while ignoring the fact that the real numbers pointed to a 12.1% Distributor retention rate over 10 years. He chose instead to print biased numbers based on an opinion from Ron Glover. A former USANA Distributor now with another company. In other words, he lied.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
I guess you hear that phrase a lot in the groups you run with.
SEC filing by Jon Taylor? What are you talking about? I'm talking about USANAs filings.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
It's nice that you have so much faith in Dr.Wentz but that doesn't really pass for scientific proof. Plus you have to remember he's renounced his US citizenship, owns the company through a parent company in Lichtenstein, raids the companies stock to make massive profits in such a way that the companies best interests are not being looked out for.
You mention independent testing for potency. Please go into detail. This sounds like the kind of things I've been asking for.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Again, I don't really care where Dr. Wentz chooses to call home. As for the stock raids, I have to admit I'm not familiar with that one. Can you point me out where to look to get that information?
with regard to potency testing, look up the web-site for informed choice. This is an independent test lab that certifies products for athletic use and confirms potencies through laboratory testing.
Perhaps when you've done that we can put the whole "independent study" issue behind us.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
Thats fine that you dont care but his having renounced his citizenship and having moved his assets to Lichtenstein should cause you to wonder. Information on officer selling can be found at Reuters, Forbes or through the company SEC filing. Can't supply links here.
I searched the Informed Choice website with Google and found no references to potency.
If youre willing to concede that theres no verifiable scientific evidence behind USANAs prices we can. So much for "science based."
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Really, well I wrote an e-mail to them and asked if they did those checks...they do. Sorry if that gets in the way of your mission Jon.
taylvb64 2 years ago
Are you guys seriously the same person? You use the same phrases, reference the same people and seem to be interchangeable when it comes to responses.
You wrote an e-mail to who? Informed Choice? Sorry but I'd like to check for myself. I'm still looking into the Informed Choice testing I just thought I'd mention that I found no reference to potency in case you or OomPappaBoomPa wanted to add more info. So far it seems to just check for banned substances.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
The officer selling in USANA, or where Dr. Wentz hangs his hat is of no concern to me or, apparently to the SEC who investigated USANA and found no problems. But it wouldn't do for you or your argument to just accept that fact would it? Particularly not if it gets in the way of your agenda.
You said earlier that the Informed Choice info was the type you were looking for. You sure didn't spend much effort in digging up the facts from them did you? Why is that?
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
You're trying to justify USANA using Wentz credentials. I merely responded with their being several things which should have people concerned about Wentz.
I haven't finished yet I just found no reference to potency.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Of course we justify USANA on Wentz's credentials. It was Dr. Wentz who developed the products. In case you missed it, that's pretty much what USANA was founded on.
You are trying to make USANA out to be a bad company, in part because Dr. Wentz no longer resides in the US. I suppose every other company in the world that has foreign stockholders is also in your scam radar. Give us a break.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
It is a warning sign. Lets break down some
- CEO Renounces US Citizenship
- Founder owns company out of a parent company in Lichtenstein
- Company Executives have lies on their resumes and nothing is done
- Company severs relationship with Auditor they used for over a decade because Auditor asked to take closer look at the books
- Simultaneous selling of stock by Executives and purchasing by Corporation
- Company fined for overcompensating executives
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
How serious of a look have you actually taken at this company? Have you gone beyond the marketing?
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
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OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
None of this matters because you have an agenda to pursue that goes beyond a simple dislike of USANA. There are thousands of MLM's out there. Many are very shady and you've made the stupid comment that USANA is the scummiest one out there. You're never clarified your motivations for your attacks.
You're like the guy standing on the airport runway yelling "YOU'LL NEVER GET THAT THING TO FLY" at all the planes.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
I have an agenda just like you have an agenda. The difference is I'm not trying to make money at mine.
I've clarified my motivation time and again you just refuse to listen to it because it doesn't fit your need.
If statistics showed that 99% of planes failed I probably would.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
So long HGMercury8077...your circular arguments are making me dizzy.
My mother told me never to argue with an idiot. They just drag you down to your level and beat you with experience. I should have listened.
Actually, I don't really think you are an idiot, just a zealot who is incapable of seeing beyond your preconceived ideas.
Good luck in you mission. It won't make the slightest bit of difference to USANA in the long run.
OomPappaBoomPa 2 years ago
There you go again with that passive aggression.
Please continue to call me a zealot. I love it. Its nice to see that you don't stray too far from your herd.
Good luck with your mission to make it big in USANA. Just remember to look down every once and a while to see how many people you're stepping on to make your big pay day.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
So long OomPappaBoomPa. No matter what name you were writing to me under
victay64
taylvb64
OomPappaBoomPa
It was always hilarious and informative. Though not in the way you wanted it to be. ;)
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
LOL who said im giving up, you know you already lost and you still saying shit about usana LOL. you are the one should give up.
how would you know that usana didnt produce 72 millionaires LOL. are you part of usana LOL
jdm27ef 2 years ago
I lost? Really? Correct me if I'm wrong but we were arguing about the PDR. So far you claimed
USANA was the only supplement in it - You were wrong
USANA was the only non-prescription supplement in it -You were wrong
The FDA regulates everyone in the PDR - You were wrong
You need to meet Drug GMPs to be in the PDR - You were wrong
Even your USANA friend agreed that the PDR is a sales tool. Your own side is against you.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Also I didn't say that USANA hasn't produced 72 millionaires. I said they don't produce 72 millionaires A YEAR - which is what you claimed. That would require USANA to make 72 new people millionaires every year.
This is probably an ESL issue so it's understandable but since you're probably selling this scheme to English speakers it presents a problem.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
LMAO i thought your smarter than me hahah, you don't know what is public base is? damn no wonder you don't know what you talking about.
PUBLIC BASE means you don't need prescription from doctor to get it. also get your facts updated maybe all the facts that you saw is old its 2009 already so where are the facts that says we are bad. LOL
jdm27ef 2 years ago
You're just making things up. "Public Base" is just two words you stuck together to try and describe something. That's okay though since I'm use to you making things up.
Nutritional Supplements are regulated like Food and like food you don't need a prescription to get any of them so you've either been misinformed or you're lying. True things might have changed since 2009 (your story certainly is changing quite rapidly) but the fact is you're still don't know what you're talking about.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
I never said that USANA is bad. I said it's overpriced and that nearly everyone who gets involved in the business will lose money.
I'll tell you AGAIN where I got the info that it's over-priced. It comes from a court ruling in which USANA twice failed to prove that their products offered superior quality and from a consumer report show called La Facture which tested their prodcuts and concluded they cost 2-3 times more than comparable products without providing any additional quality.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
I'm still waiting on any scientific evidence which contradicts the findings by the courts and by the report show. Anytime you're ready. If USANA is a science based company it shouldn't be so hard to find a scientific study which proves this.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
I see you're being very selective of what you choose to discuss about the court case. First - None of Minkows allegations were found to be false. In fact USANA lost 4 of the 5 claims they brought against Minkow and were required to pay his court costs. Those costs far exceeded the sanction issued against Minkow. A sanction the courts reduced after USANAs lawyers were found to be asking way too much for their time.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Minkow was allowed to keep his videos up but he and USANA made a secret deal to end the final claim USANA had against Minkow. This was a claim of stock manipulation. A claim in which USANA said there were multiple parties involved but failed to name any. They also failed to show any forward movement on that claim deciding instead to make a sealed deal with Minkow which included their dropping their charges and Minkow leaving them alone. Personally I think they paid him off.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
OMG!! LMAO do you know who is barry minkow LOL if you do pls tell me you know what happen to him ahahahahah
jdm27ef 2 years ago
He's making money taking on other pyramid schemes.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
Actually, USANA didn't win any of their battle against Minkow. They lost all their claims except for one which they decided to settle with him. The details of the settlement are closed but what is known is that it included Minkow agreeing to leave USANA alone.
The point is that USANA isn't offering you high end nutritionals. They're offering you the same product you can get off of the store shelves for much cheaper but they wrap it in marketing to give the appearance of quality.
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
LOL dude i think this person is just digging up old old old stuff that is had nothing to do with usana just to make an excuses for not doing it ahahah. i see there are people here that are educated about MLM industry and about usana
jdm27ef 2 years ago
Take a second and think about what you just wrote. You've just said "there are people here that are educated about MOM industry and about usana." That person just told you that you were wrong and I was right about the PDR. Are you willing to admit you don't know what you're talking about yet?
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
LMAO! thats all i can say, kk thanks bud for this though! LOL
jdm27ef 2 years ago
What's the matter? I thought you knew how to handle guys like me?
Is lying and avoiding the topic how you do it? LOL, you must work for USANA's Head Office or Marketing Departement or something!
HGMercury8077 2 years ago
LOL is that all you have against me ahahaha damn i need more proof that i am in pyramid scheme this is not enough you keep telling me all this stuff but how can you tell your not scientist nor government LMAO
jdm27ef 2 years ago
No, no, no. I have nothing against you. I actually feel sorry for you. It's just that I don't know I'm supposed to communicate everything to you when you can barely read or write. If I had the time I guess could make you a pop-up boo