This video makes much more sense if you are fluent in "stoned speak". Its really a beautiful language, easy and fun to learn....just smoke a spliff and watch this vid and if you laugh you ass off, you have learned "stoned speak"
and the thing is you can afford to see it "only as a matter of free speech" - that's white privilege speaking...you may not understand that you have it or that you can excercise it without contemplating consequences for people on the ground in those countries - work YOU would support - those folks CANT DO THAT WORK any more....
White priviledge? That is so arrogant. The people of Pakistan are autonomous, their leaders act on the world stage. You are spewing self-regarding imperialist bullshit. Once you leave your little bubble (i assume the states) you will realise that internationally other skin colours are in charge.
It has been a long time since i have stumbled across a comment as annoying as this one.
I am not so sure it was a failure that was being mocked, it was thunderf00ts' claim that pakistan censoring the site was a success. I agree, i don't see that as a sign of failure but I hardly see it as a sign of success - probably more a pragmatic decision to stop a whole load of trouble.
Now I actually had no problem with 'draw muhammad day', in fact i have drawn him and done a satirical vid on him, but I felt thunderf00t was one of those who started to give it a slant that it didn't need to have.
To my mind there are two groups relevant here:
1) Muslims who are offended by drawings of the prophet and don't think we should be allowed to draw him
2) Muslims who accept our right to satirise whoever we please in the west but still find it a bit offensive.
..I have absolutely no fucking beef with those in the second group - in fact I admire them because they are accepting the principle DESPITE the offence they feel. The crucial thing is the muslims in the second group might live in the west but have cousins, uncles, brothers living in muslim countries - i have exchanged comments and pms with several the last week and convinced some that that there are some honourable genuine reasons for us all to do this - it is not a case of ....
...picking on anyone or their religion, not a case of being offensive for its own sake but it is about demonstrating our right to uphold a centuries old western tradition of satirising prominent people, whoever they are. i have convinced a few and I like to think if they speak to their brothers/cousins in pakistan (or countrymen in Saudi Arabia in one case) that they will pass on these positive and genuine reasons. I cannot imagine a single muslim watching any of Thunderf00ts....
....videos and doing anything other than agreeing with their friends and relatives in Pakistan that this campaign is all about being as offensive as possible and that they are right to suspect the worst.
The campaign was/is a good idea but Thunderf00t hasn't done it, or relations between the muslim world and the west, any favours whatsoever.
There is a third group. Muslims who pay lips service to their religion but look to the west for popular culture/business/technology and the future. There are so many misconceptions about the muslim world. I spend quite a lot of time there, have friends there. They might be offended by my mohammed vid (cont)
...they would be by thunderf00ts. I can only take responsibility for my own. They will be more offended by the censorship they are now facing.
The idea that a great many muslims don't just play along like people in every other religion is false. If you are ever in Mumbai for example, the best late night bars are in the Muslim areas.
I have no objection to them being offended by your video (nor mine) but you know as well as i do that the same material can be taken in two totally different ways, depending on how it is presented.
I accept that this video is a defence of the event and not of Thunderf00ts involvement (as i read the comments i am getting that impression anyway) so I shall leave it because, as i say, I was pro- the event I just found his involvement very badly judged.
I agree with you on Thunderf00t, he went of the deep end. In all honest i had no idea that he had started this because i was overseas at the time. The first i heard of this was from Gotthatfunk. This video is half a defence of the idea, but also Coughlans childish take on it. His little spat with Tf00t spilling over and colouring his good sense.
"You appear to be throwing a few insults about yourself." - what did you expect, posting a vid like that? Allow me to be childish and reply with 'you started it' :)
Btw, I'm not necessarily disagreeing with what you're saying. That's just you assuming.
Ah well, throwing insults towards people that disagree seems to be common practice these days here on YT. I prefer polite disagreement - call me old fashioned.
Actually Coughlan started it, this is a response to him. You don't go and fight dragons in a puppy costume you know. He is confrontational by his nature, i thought i'd play by his own rules.
Yeah, the thing is he is usually pretty good and that makes this twice as bad. He seems more interested in his little spat with tf00t that the actual issue. Can a spat be completely one sided? He seems to have got no reaction from Mr Beardy - perhaps that is why he's so fucked off. lol
YES! I'm glad to see that someone else sees the point of the event and is as pissed off at the people who are blindly condemning it. When did we start believing that it was acceptable to bite our tongues to protect those who would cut them out? I favorited this video and I am going to feature it on my channel for a while. Nice one, Tip.
Well it just proves religion is a mental disorder and distorts reality. Its also interesting that the most war like religions come from the middle east, something to ponder perhaps
I don't know, the Hindus had countless empires that rose and fell by the sword in the name of one or other of their gods, south america was a river of blood under its various deities and african tribes as well as native americans lived lives of almost constant strife with their neighbours. Wherever it is religion is the difference humans use as an excuse to butcher each other.
You fuckwads. How great of a stretch is it to realize that this, to the Pakistani people, is an enlightenment. The sites that they love, perhaps the only places where they have freedom of speech/press have been banned by their government. Try and do that in any civilized country, and the people would start burning buildings. The open minded people of Pakistan will still find access to other cultures on other sites... and the ban will serve as a tangible proof that they are captive. VICTORY!
100% - It is about the application of pressure and i think for a few internet folk this is a pretty big achievement. Coughlan is only butthurt because he has been scoffing from the start.
Awesome - it's got nothing to do with the people. It's about their 'ideas', just as you said. And it's time we stopped side-stepping criticising Islam because the 'R' word gets thrown around and because some of the faithful are fanatics who threaten the lives of critics. It's all fair game and the more we speak against it, the more chance the people yoked with their beliefs have to get out from under. Obviously it takes way more than this but this is a great step.
Maybe if he did a series called "Why people don't do shit the muslim way" he would get all those folks that were needing him to tell them why people laugh at creationists back. I like what MrUnscientific said.
Didn't you, i'm sorry i seem to remember you drawing an analogy to three distinct types of complete failure in your vid and jumping up and down.
Hmmmmm.. perhaps i misunderstood.
You fight with Thunderf00t, whatever its merits has nothing to do with me or any of the other people who ran with this small idea and brought it to the attention of the global media. That is a win.
@coughlan666 Well, the US constitution also never says the words "separation of church and state", but that's the message it conveys anyway. Plus, you blame the people that participated in the Draw Muhammad campaign for the blocking of all those internet sites, but they weren't the ones that blocked those sites, the fundie fucktards that rule Pakistan were.
The biggest difference between blasphemy day and draw Mohammad day, to mind mind, is the fear factor. I believe that is why so many have made such a point of saying "not me", as frequently as possible. I do believe fear is part of this.
People are more afraid of the Muslim fundies than they are of the Christian fundies. Something that may change in times to come. I get the impression that many proud atheists will become silent atheists when the shit hits the fan close to them.
well, I guess you are upset with me then. I just don't think shouting "victory" for freedom of speech when censorship or banning occurs is productive.
I am well aware of the situation in Pakistan as I used to write back and forth with a documentarian from Pakistan named Sharmeen Obaid. I know it's not all some backward shit hole.
Sure, they could possibly rise up against the government... but is this honestly the best way to go about it?
I don't think any revolutions are going to come of this. It is about making the middle class, the people who are the real economic power in that country, start asking question. Pakistanis are hungry for modernity, especially with it booming india, their arch rivals. It is about asking the question, like i said.
@TipoftheSlung You actually bring up a great point talking about their arch rival, India. You'd think that rivalry would be plenty to provoke the necessary change.
Yeah, relations between them are so complicated though. There is intense jealosy in Pakistan about India's economy, whilst at the same time they are lambasted for their decadence and love affair with western culture. It is a common thing in my trips there to have the threat of nuclear strikes in the press but there are alliances forming betwwen the countries in things like sport and poplar culture. Truely bizarre!
What makes me laugh is the people who had him placed in elevation before he became "human" and started dabbling in humoUr - shite humoUr if I'm judging it (he says bravely) - but his attempt at it nonetheless, and then moved away from his "science stuff" and "Monsieur éducateur" tag, moving into "excessive anger and general mental issue anti-theist" territory, didn't only place him there through their own doing, up in the clouds in their own minds, but are now the loudest of all the dissenters.
I don't know, you have got to love a lot of what tf00t does, and i can't help feeling that if he had started his channel with only the last 10 vids he would still be popular. There is a bit of the tall poppy going on here.
I feel that's true from some (I think I've noticed it).
I personally feel that nobody - directly or indirectly - on here - should be representing Atheism. No Atheist should be in an elevated position, and if we can't escape this 'most subscribed too atheist leads us' thing...I'd prefer them well balanced and far less immature and angry and much much more worldly. This guy doesn't do it for me. Never has. I'm happy to leave him alone because he still won't be elevated by me.
To me this is a very simple issue. It is about defending freedom of expression in the face of those who would destroy that freedom for ever if they have their way. It wasn't atheists that blocked the net in Pakistan, it was the fundies that run their government. You know, the enemies of freedom and democracy. Maybe some of us forgot about them.
Good point. Other people are missing the point it is about censership. The fact that censership went up may help the cause bring it to the main stream media.
True. Also, the closing of access to certain websites is certainly a temporary event. But the content that caused the ruckus will remain. A futile attempt at best to shut the secular world out.
Great video, subbed.
modecom 1 year ago
@modecom
Thanks for that!
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
@coughlan666 You just want to make a name for yourself off TF's back. You're just a pathetic drama queen. Sad really.
modecom 1 year ago
This video makes much more sense if you are fluent in "stoned speak". Its really a beautiful language, easy and fun to learn....just smoke a spliff and watch this vid and if you laugh you ass off, you have learned "stoned speak"
FrankieArts 1 year ago
and the thing is you can afford to see it "only as a matter of free speech" - that's white privilege speaking...you may not understand that you have it or that you can excercise it without contemplating consequences for people on the ground in those countries - work YOU would support - those folks CANT DO THAT WORK any more....
CityzenJane 1 year ago
@CityzenJane
I'm sorry, i don't really understand. Are you suggesting i keep my mouth shut in solidarity with the opressed?
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
@CityzenJane
White priviledge? That is so arrogant. The people of Pakistan are autonomous, their leaders act on the world stage. You are spewing self-regarding imperialist bullshit. Once you leave your little bubble (i assume the states) you will realise that internationally other skin colours are in charge.
It has been a long time since i have stumbled across a comment as annoying as this one.
XXgodhaterXX 1 year ago
It's not the drawing Mohammad thing that bothers me. Blaspheme away! I just think people like tf00t got a bit giddy about it, is all.
bewarethelizards42 1 year ago
Good video, The point was always obvious, wasnt it?
lynus111 1 year ago
@lynus111
I thought so.
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
I am not so sure it was a failure that was being mocked, it was thunderf00ts' claim that pakistan censoring the site was a success. I agree, i don't see that as a sign of failure but I hardly see it as a sign of success - probably more a pragmatic decision to stop a whole load of trouble.
noelplum99 1 year ago
@noelplum99
Now I actually had no problem with 'draw muhammad day', in fact i have drawn him and done a satirical vid on him, but I felt thunderf00t was one of those who started to give it a slant that it didn't need to have.
To my mind there are two groups relevant here:
1) Muslims who are offended by drawings of the prophet and don't think we should be allowed to draw him
2) Muslims who accept our right to satirise whoever we please in the west but still find it a bit offensive.
You know...
noelplum99 1 year ago
@noelplum99
..I have absolutely no fucking beef with those in the second group - in fact I admire them because they are accepting the principle DESPITE the offence they feel. The crucial thing is the muslims in the second group might live in the west but have cousins, uncles, brothers living in muslim countries - i have exchanged comments and pms with several the last week and convinced some that that there are some honourable genuine reasons for us all to do this - it is not a case of ....
noelplum99 1 year ago
@noelplum99
...picking on anyone or their religion, not a case of being offensive for its own sake but it is about demonstrating our right to uphold a centuries old western tradition of satirising prominent people, whoever they are. i have convinced a few and I like to think if they speak to their brothers/cousins in pakistan (or countrymen in Saudi Arabia in one case) that they will pass on these positive and genuine reasons. I cannot imagine a single muslim watching any of Thunderf00ts....
noelplum99 1 year ago
@noelplum99
....videos and doing anything other than agreeing with their friends and relatives in Pakistan that this campaign is all about being as offensive as possible and that they are right to suspect the worst.
The campaign was/is a good idea but Thunderf00t hasn't done it, or relations between the muslim world and the west, any favours whatsoever.
PS: i generally wear slip-ons.
noelplum99 1 year ago
@noelplum99
There is a third group. Muslims who pay lips service to their religion but look to the west for popular culture/business/technology and the future. There are so many misconceptions about the muslim world. I spend quite a lot of time there, have friends there. They might be offended by my mohammed vid (cont)
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
@TipoftheSlung (cont)
...they would be by thunderf00ts. I can only take responsibility for my own. They will be more offended by the censorship they are now facing.
The idea that a great many muslims don't just play along like people in every other religion is false. If you are ever in Mumbai for example, the best late night bars are in the Muslim areas.
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
@TipoftheSlung
I have no objection to them being offended by your video (nor mine) but you know as well as i do that the same material can be taken in two totally different ways, depending on how it is presented.
I accept that this video is a defence of the event and not of Thunderf00ts involvement (as i read the comments i am getting that impression anyway) so I shall leave it because, as i say, I was pro- the event I just found his involvement very badly judged.
noelplum99 1 year ago
@noelplum99
I agree with you on Thunderf00t, he went of the deep end. In all honest i had no idea that he had started this because i was overseas at the time. The first i heard of this was from Gotthatfunk. This video is half a defence of the idea, but also Coughlans childish take on it. His little spat with Tf00t spilling over and colouring his good sense.
Anyway, peace.
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
There isn't a single argument in your video. Just a bunch of assumptions and insults. Judging You might want to work on that.
Judging from the company you are in, I assumed you were a nice bloke. It seems you're just another offensive, arrogant twat. Stand in line.
MisterScrutinizer 1 year ago
@MisterScrutinizer
You appear to be throwing a few insults about yourself.
Anyway, I thought my analysis of the effects of the ban in Pakistan was quite accurate, also likening this affair to blasphemy day. But there you go.
If you don't like it, you know where the door is etc etc
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
@TipoftheSlung
"You appear to be throwing a few insults about yourself." - what did you expect, posting a vid like that? Allow me to be childish and reply with 'you started it' :)
Btw, I'm not necessarily disagreeing with what you're saying. That's just you assuming.
Ah well, throwing insults towards people that disagree seems to be common practice these days here on YT. I prefer polite disagreement - call me old fashioned.
MisterScrutinizer 1 year ago
@MisterScrutinizer
Actually Coughlan started it, this is a response to him. You don't go and fight dragons in a puppy costume you know. He is confrontational by his nature, i thought i'd play by his own rules.
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
@TipoftheSlung Fair enough
MisterScrutinizer 1 year ago
@coughlan666
??Don't you watch you own videos??
You can't weasle out of it for fuks sake.
shakeltonkids 1 year ago
I was disappointed by cough's vid - but I find his weasel-y comments here to be even lamer still...
The little dick can be pretty funny, but right now he's just wrong and butthurt about it.
I mean, I understand the point cough is trying to make - he's just being a bit short-sighted and reactionary.
He should go back to being funny or something... whatever...
a2zdiy 1 year ago
@a2zdiy
Yeah, the thing is he is usually pretty good and that makes this twice as bad. He seems more interested in his little spat with tf00t that the actual issue. Can a spat be completely one sided? He seems to have got no reaction from Mr Beardy - perhaps that is why he's so fucked off. lol
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
YES! I'm glad to see that someone else sees the point of the event and is as pissed off at the people who are blindly condemning it. When did we start believing that it was acceptable to bite our tongues to protect those who would cut them out? I favorited this video and I am going to feature it on my channel for a while. Nice one, Tip.
6stringbadger 1 year ago
@6stringbadger Thanks Badge, that is really cool of you.
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
Well it just proves religion is a mental disorder and distorts reality. Its also interesting that the most war like religions come from the middle east, something to ponder perhaps
womblefree 1 year ago
@womblefree
I don't know, the Hindus had countless empires that rose and fell by the sword in the name of one or other of their gods, south america was a river of blood under its various deities and african tribes as well as native americans lived lives of almost constant strife with their neighbours. Wherever it is religion is the difference humans use as an excuse to butcher each other.
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
Thank you! Well said.
Christheatheist1 1 year ago
You fuckwads. How great of a stretch is it to realize that this, to the Pakistani people, is an enlightenment. The sites that they love, perhaps the only places where they have freedom of speech/press have been banned by their government. Try and do that in any civilized country, and the people would start burning buildings. The open minded people of Pakistan will still find access to other cultures on other sites... and the ban will serve as a tangible proof that they are captive. VICTORY!
dannybambino 1 year ago
@dannybambino
100% - It is about the application of pressure and i think for a few internet folk this is a pretty big achievement. Coughlan is only butthurt because he has been scoffing from the start.
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
Awesome - it's got nothing to do with the people. It's about their 'ideas', just as you said. And it's time we stopped side-stepping criticising Islam because the 'R' word gets thrown around and because some of the faithful are fanatics who threaten the lives of critics. It's all fair game and the more we speak against it, the more chance the people yoked with their beliefs have to get out from under. Obviously it takes way more than this but this is a great step.
AuntieDiluvian 1 year ago
@AuntieDiluvian
Cheers Auntie D.
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
Maybe if he did a series called "Why people don't do shit the muslim way" he would get all those folks that were needing him to tell them why people laugh at creationists back. I like what MrUnscientific said.
AnneOnAMoose 1 year ago
@coughlan666
Did you pay a lab to make a clone of you?
because You and TipoftheSlung look like you could be identical twins.
Obasiliasfilosofos 1 year ago
@Obasiliasfilosofos
Twins like DeVito and Arnie? I am six foot 3, and 245 pounds, although i do only live round the corner from him and one of our mums might be a slag.
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
@coughlan666
Didn't you, i'm sorry i seem to remember you drawing an analogy to three distinct types of complete failure in your vid and jumping up and down.
Hmmmmm.. perhaps i misunderstood.
You fight with Thunderf00t, whatever its merits has nothing to do with me or any of the other people who ran with this small idea and brought it to the attention of the global media. That is a win.
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
@coughlan666 Well, the US constitution also never says the words "separation of church and state", but that's the message it conveys anyway. Plus, you blame the people that participated in the Draw Muhammad campaign for the blocking of all those internet sites, but they weren't the ones that blocked those sites, the fundie fucktards that rule Pakistan were.
dioseolo 1 year ago
@MouseHusic
lol you're right no full stops.
*catches breath*
MrUnscientific 1 year ago
@coughlan666
Perhaps it was the bit where you drew the analogy to a losing football team? Go on tell me i didn't understand.
Whatever....
XXgodhaterXX 1 year ago
Wow. I am impressed.
You made me sit and reflect, Tip.
Don't do that again. Bad thinks come about when I sit and reflect (evil laugh).
TheTruePooka 1 year ago
@TheTruePooka
Mwah ha ha ha, now that i have that power i will continue to exercise it. On you and the cat.
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
The biggest difference between blasphemy day and draw Mohammad day, to mind mind, is the fear factor. I believe that is why so many have made such a point of saying "not me", as frequently as possible. I do believe fear is part of this.
People are more afraid of the Muslim fundies than they are of the Christian fundies. Something that may change in times to come. I get the impression that many proud atheists will become silent atheists when the shit hits the fan close to them.
macnutz 1 year ago
@macnutz
I hope that will not include either of us, Mac....
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
@TipoftheSlung I'm too old and too near death already. The threats don't scare me any more. Threats have a way of inspiring resistance in some folks.
macnutz 1 year ago
well, I guess you are upset with me then. I just don't think shouting "victory" for freedom of speech when censorship or banning occurs is productive.
I am well aware of the situation in Pakistan as I used to write back and forth with a documentarian from Pakistan named Sharmeen Obaid. I know it's not all some backward shit hole.
Sure, they could possibly rise up against the government... but is this honestly the best way to go about it?
tattooskin72 1 year ago
@tattooskin72
I don't think any revolutions are going to come of this. It is about making the middle class, the people who are the real economic power in that country, start asking question. Pakistanis are hungry for modernity, especially with it booming india, their arch rivals. It is about asking the question, like i said.
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
@TipoftheSlung You actually bring up a great point talking about their arch rival, India. You'd think that rivalry would be plenty to provoke the necessary change.
tattooskin72 1 year ago
@tattooskin72
Yeah, relations between them are so complicated though. There is intense jealosy in Pakistan about India's economy, whilst at the same time they are lambasted for their decadence and love affair with western culture. It is a common thing in my trips there to have the threat of nuclear strikes in the press but there are alliances forming betwwen the countries in things like sport and poplar culture. Truely bizarre!
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
What makes me laugh is the people who had him placed in elevation before he became "human" and started dabbling in humoUr - shite humoUr if I'm judging it (he says bravely) - but his attempt at it nonetheless, and then moved away from his "science stuff" and "Monsieur éducateur" tag, moving into "excessive anger and general mental issue anti-theist" territory, didn't only place him there through their own doing, up in the clouds in their own minds, but are now the loudest of all the dissenters.
MrUnscientific 1 year ago
@MrUnscientific
I don't know, you have got to love a lot of what tf00t does, and i can't help feeling that if he had started his channel with only the last 10 vids he would still be popular. There is a bit of the tall poppy going on here.
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
@TipoftheSlung
I feel that's true from some (I think I've noticed it).
I personally feel that nobody - directly or indirectly - on here - should be representing Atheism. No Atheist should be in an elevated position, and if we can't escape this 'most subscribed too atheist leads us' thing...I'd prefer them well balanced and far less immature and angry and much much more worldly. This guy doesn't do it for me. Never has. I'm happy to leave him alone because he still won't be elevated by me.
MrUnscientific 1 year ago
To me this is a very simple issue. It is about defending freedom of expression in the face of those who would destroy that freedom for ever if they have their way. It wasn't atheists that blocked the net in Pakistan, it was the fundies that run their government. You know, the enemies of freedom and democracy. Maybe some of us forgot about them.
macnutz 1 year ago
Is their government really democratic enough to actually listen to what their people have to say? thats a better question.
rexmundi6 1 year ago
@rexmundi6
Pakistan is lurching toward modernity on the shoulders of it middle class, you better believe the listen.
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
@TipoftheSlung i sure hope so, otherwise this could be very very bad!
rexmundi6 1 year ago
@coughlan666
Funny i thought that is exactly what you said, in two videos.
XXgodhaterXX 1 year ago 2
What is the difference between Blasphemy Day and Draw Mohammad Day?
Great question, TOTS. I'd like some answers from our fellow YouTubers.
AncientAtheist 1 year ago
@AncientAtheist
The difference is that one is a safe target and the other a brown target. I am a little disappointed in quite a few people at the moment.
TipoftheSlung 1 year ago
@TipoftheSlung
I somehow missed all this blasphemy day thing. So was blasphemy day specifically aimed at Christianity?
noelplum99 1 year ago
@coughlan666
Whatever. I did watch your video. Caveats aside, you pissed all over it.
gabiotta 1 year ago 2
Good point. Other people are missing the point it is about censership. The fact that censership went up may help the cause bring it to the main stream media.
Cheers Christine
christinepeace 1 year ago
True. Also, the closing of access to certain websites is certainly a temporary event. But the content that caused the ruckus will remain. A futile attempt at best to shut the secular world out.
WineisyourFriend 1 year ago