Too Much Talking: RPGs! Part 1

[mabans]

Shtrategically?

[InsightfulGamer]

So I do think it's a bit unreasonable to categorize only jRPGs as having similar design flaws and cliches, when wRPGs also share their own kind of similar design flaws and cliches.

[InsightfulGamer]

points and skill points to distrubute. You usually have a fairly low and reachable level or stat caps, but overall levels don't seem to make as much of a significant difference in these gamesas the jRPGs. They tend to have really cheesy battle systems. And they aren't as much about battles typically than jRPGs are. And of course jRPGs, we've heard all their cliches so I'm not going to list them. And of course not EVERY jRPG and wRPG follows these models exactly, but most do.

[InsightfulGamer]

when you talk about how jRPGs only share design flaws while wRPGs don't, I do not agree. I do agree that most jRPGs share similar flaws, but I feel wRPGs also have their flaws. Actually I would say that both jRPGs and wRPGs follow their own generic kind of model. In a wRPG you always play a nobody silent hero whom in the end you find out is an important somebody. You always have an allignment to choose from. You can always save almost anywhere in the game. You have your different stat

[InsightfulGamer]

I agree that the strategy for battles is very limited in most RPGs. Personally I really dislike this "elemental weakness" gimmick that almost every RPG has, where all you have to do is know the enemies weakness, and you can very easily cast the right spell to deal damage against the weakness. But I very much disagree with when you say that RPGs can only get so good, I think there's a lot of strategy and skill that can be put in RPGs to make them more complex. As well

[kayinnasaki]

Perhaps it was less clear, but my views are just that jRPGs has a genre have very flawed 'standards' and their flaws basically exist in every game.

wRPGs are pretty sad too, but it's harder to generalize. Fables alignment system is hilarious. Oblivion doesn't have prominent alignment system, but has dumb immersion breaking issues and a horrible leveling system. Morrowind is sorta okay but just has a terribly boring combat.. I'm not saying they're better then jRPGs.

[SailorMan69]

@kayinnasaki Haha. You sure know your wRPGs... Naming three of the most boring new console rpgs doesn't really cut it with me. Still I watched your video about competitive gaming (Re: Fighting Games Suck) so I doubt I could argue you to change your mind. Every genre has rather boring standards, it's really matter of which boring standards you can cope with most.

Still, being under mind control of Vecna in submerged temple filled with Arch-Liches is no joke tactically.

[kayinnasaki]

@SailorMan69

Well I don't remember the exact arguments in the video, but I'm pretty sure, like usual, my opinions on wRPG were that "They don't have the same flaws as jRPGs, they don't have the same consistent flaws (Besides hilarious obsession with morality), and aren't even the same genre. So pretty much, I don't care, because they'e not what I'm talking about. I would not make a video dedicated to wRPGs as I lack the same level of experience with them as I've had with. They just come up. D:

[siekensou77]

ff12 lacked one crucial thing (sure the gambit ystem removed manual play but you could turn that off) what it lacked was when you start an attack command, distance doesn't matter.. you can run but that wolf will still bite you even if you are a few character distances away...

[siekensou77]

Xenosaga, Grandia, Atelier project games (by GUST), Ar Tonelico, Star Ocean,Tales of series, i enjoy those a lot. Ar Tonelico, and Xenosaga are all very deeply thought out worlds. i enjoy ff12 mostly for its world and story (and S-E's main thing of media presentation capabilities). Mana Khemia (in the Atelier project series) offers a fun environment, bright characters, interesting story, and the alchemy system is interesting.

(now on to part two of your video :P good discussion btw)

[DrunkenSnake007]

I do like RPGs (only JRPGs btw), but I'm not going to flame you. I've seen few of yours videos and I get that you have pretty solid opinions on videogames... We just don't share the same one... So take care

[kayinnasaki]

Thats no problem at all. As you could see I made a point to have that discussion with people who disagree with me, but people who could adequately fight me back on the topic. I don't like pushing ideas on people, I like furthering thought!

Another thing I feel is that it's more important to try and understand why people like games, even if they seem bad or poorly designed. I could argue that RPGs are poorly designed, but I could not argue against people liking them! Fun is subjective after all!

[ChrisSRApplePie]

For me i too hate JRPG's. They are the dinosaur role-playing genre that needs a real overhaul.There are a handful of newer genre-spliced RPG's like Oblivion/Fable 2/Fallout3/Mass Effect, ect.That not only immerse you in it's fictional world but they let you play the game with a distinct level of interactivity that JRPGs haven't even got to yet and probably won't.A good RPG is one that you feel like the level of input to invest can alter the actual story arc of the game itself. LOL Rising Numbers

[RedMage90]

Final Fantasy is a poor example of an RPG. An RPG is about taking a part in the world around you, influencing it and seeing the consequences, which that series makes no attempt to do. Each story based decision is done for you. Therein lies the problem with most RPG video games. They are incapable of accommodating every scenario, and so they rely on numbers, which should not be the point of a game.

[kayinnasaki]

This is sort of a general jRPG thing though. The majority of the negative talk is on jRPGs, which yes, have those problems -- and others as well -- that don't apply to wRPGs and PnP RPGs (which I don't think we even touched on)

[bclxls]

What a dashing group of people! With such insightful views on the state of videogames, wot wot!

[Trahiz]

You know what's *really* dense about FFXII? The game designers.

[exo0O]

Dude, you would love Spoonyone and his FF7 rant series!

[powerup151]

I thought there was too much talking IN the RPGs.

[ShadowUltra]

I, just like you, don't like RPG games. Well, I don't like MMORPG games, those ones are totally boring. There are good MMOs, but no good MMORPGs. I remember playing some good single player RPGs, but there aren't many of those.

Aaanyway, nice video xD "Rising numbers RPG"

[joey9909]

If you split away the online play Single Player RPGs seem boring.

Kind of like Mass Effect.