You're welcome. You've chosen a great song and a unique one as well. This song which was removed from the remixed version of this CD is really not Kansas. It's more or less John Elefante and his brother. He was only with the band for a couple of years but he was an excellent singer and musician. You should check out his solo stuff and I highly recommend anything else from Kansas.
@rickyon I feel funny replying to my own reply but I've recently heard some new info about this song. Dino Elefante plays the bass guitar. Rich Williams plays the guitar parts and Phil Ehart plays the drums. So,in fact it's more of a Kansas song than I thought although I've always thought of it as a Kansas song anyway.
Thanks rickyon,that explains a lot. Guess it would make sense to have the song removed. And just a quick F.Y.I.--J.Brown was also called "the most controverisial figure of the 19th century." But that guy on the cover looks very little like him...matter of fact he looks kind of freaky the more you look at it..LOL-- wonder what the symbolism on the cover is all about?
You're welcome. I think that the cover is saying the same thing as the Wizard of Oz. Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain, things are not as they seem. Just a guess. I'm sure other things can be inferred from what you see there.
Ok,this song is not on the "Best of Kansas" CD that I have. Maybe there is a VERY best of...CD??Or maybe simply the Volume 2 version. But it's not on the one that features this cover with the man with long blond beard. Incidentally,does anyone know who this character is supposed to be,and wasn't he featured also on their very first album cover?Just wondering...
O.K. Let's take these questions in reverse order. Yes that is the same guy featured on the 1st album cover. He is John Brown a famous figure in Kansas history. This is the original release of this CD from 1984 (10 yr.anniversary) You have the 2nd release of this CD from 1994 (20 yr. anniv.) When the band got together to remaster this recording Walsh was back in the band and Elefante was gone so they removed this song. I hope that clears things up.
OK, as a very long time fan of Kansas (I'm 41), I would say that JE was an excellent choice to be the new singer. In hindsight, I would say that God placed him there (Got the clout of being in Kansas and the 2 hits..FFWF and PTGT...and the musical insight/knowledge) and then used him elsewhere. I however never ever liked Perfect Lover..glad its not on the re-release GHits. Sounds way to much like Petra...not KANSAS!
always liked this one and the chorus nails the essence of Kansas. He never could fill the shoes of walsh but very talented in his own right. I can't recall which release it's from, but I believe that walsh ended up singing the play the game a few years ago and he did it so well it's as if it was his song all along. That could just be the involvement of Kerry once again.
Rickyon, I was just reading your synopsis of this. Interesting to hear that Dino played the guitar parts. The thing that puzzles me is this: I hear distinctive keyboard timbres that Kerry often used (the ppg waves synth, for example and those synth marimba tones). Are you sure Kerry didn't play keys on this? Some sounds are used on Timeline (listen to the patches before the Perfect Lover chorus). Great song tho !
Whoa! You're talking way above my pay grade with that keyboard stuff! I'm positive that I have the information right. Maybe Kerry had rubbed off on Elefante by this time, He had been in the band for 2 years. I know that Livgren would influence me greatly if I were around him for 2 years. Elefante and his brother had and still have a world famous recording studio and are capable of producing anything. Those guys are very successful sharp cats!
Hehe, sorry bout that. I am a keyboard guy myself. I definitely hear the textures and "ideas" of Kerry in the keyboard parts. If you listen to Kerry's keyboard playing on David Pack's solo 1985/86 album's title track ("Anywhere You Go" you will hear what I mean. Same keys used there and the same style of playing. However, you may be utterly correct :) My ears just detected those subtleties.
Rick, how would you rate the Elefante years w/ Kansas? VC carries merit, but to me DM with the exception of "Incident On A Bridge" and End Of Age",(both KL tunes) is weak. I saw the a VC show in mid 82, RS looked liked he was ready to get out of there and was just going through the motions. The band just seemed without direction on that tour. The DM tour was worse
As I stated before I am a Kansas whore so anything Kansas is great to me. I'm not saying that I don't recognize poor performance or lackluster effort with the writing and arranging I am just not the right person to ask to judge anything that they do because I'm too close to the subject! I loved Elefante's voice and I would say that you are close to what I feel on the 2 albums. VC was good, DM was average. Robby did get out of there a year later. I think the writing was on the wall.
Number 3, on what chart? This song was not even a top 40 single..... Once again Rick is right. ONLY John and Dino play on this song. However, John was still a member of Kansas along with Rich and Phil at the time it was released. Back in the 80's, having a single to go with a "Best Of" was the way to market the album. The album also has a cut up Song For Americia on it, missing one of the middle keyboard solo's. Your France 78 find is amazing Rick. Keep them coming
I just thought of a good analogy ( only took me 5 months! See how much you slow down when you get old!) Let's say Kerry Livgren wrote a song, recorded all the parts maybe along with a couple other non Kansas members and they used it on one of the Kansas albums. Let's say between the years of 1986 and 1989 (any year would do really) Even though it is on a Kansas album you could not say that it is a Kansas song because Kansas did not do it! This is pretty much what occurred with "Perfect Lover".
Nice analogy Rick. I agree with that. Kansas was pretty much dead by the time this came out. Kerry and Dave were def out of Kansas by this time, in fact Kerry had been gone over a year by the time this came out. This tune may or may not have been in the pipeline with Phil and Rich. It is what it is.... I can also say for certain that this song was not a top 40 song
When they did this tune, Kerry and Dave had already left the band with just John, Phil and Rich and Dino Elefante contributing. Great tune! They should have left it on the newer issue of "The best of Kansas. Good intelligent discussion!
Please re-read the info section. I said that this is the best Kansas song that is NOT a Kansas song. Even though it was on the 1984 "Best Of " CD Noone from Kansas plays on the song! It was written produced and recorded by the Elefante brothers. Jon plays all the instruments and his brother contributes on guitar. Jon sings lead and all the backing vocals. You are right that it is very hard to choose a favorite Kansas tune! Mine is "Song For America". I like your YT channel....Rick
I love this 1984 song, have the LP. However, Jon Elefante was a Kansas member at this point (he was on 1982s Vinyl Confessions) while he brother did join the band in 1983 Drastic Measures album). So, to say "noone from Kansas plays on the song" is not quite true. Noone but the Elefante brothers perhaps.
Come on! You know what I mean! Kerry ,Phil, Dave,Robbie and Rich. None of those guys played on this song. You could take any popular band and the same thing would apply. It would be like David Lee Roth doing a song by himself and saying that it's a Van Halen record. This is a solo effort that happens to be done by an awesome singer who was in Kansas at the time. Technically you're right but I think you get the gist of my statement.
Hey Anton, you have the original 1984 C.D. release it was later remastered(in 1994) and the song was removed. Where did you read that info? If this was meant for Kansas the band why didn't he bring it to them and have the band do it? Maybe he did but the band split up before they had a chance!
Soon as I re-check my info I will get back to you. But the song definitely doesn't sound like a Kansas song, it sounds like something Survivor might have put out.
You're right! Perehaps if you compare it to "Fight Fire With Fire" or "Play The Game Tonight" or some other song that Elefante wrote while with Kansas. The guitars are really fat and crunchy and the childs piano is weird but definitely cool. The bass is very heavy!
I have the 1984 version cd. The Elefante Bros. made two songs under the Kansas logo, and you just mentioned them. Did they cut both of them out of the 1999 version or just "Perfect Lover" ?
You are right Rick. The band reviewed the cd in 1999 and took "Perfect Lover" off the cd. It was not originally a part of "Drastic Measures as the others were. It was added a a new single to a Kansas greatest hits cd. I just wonder how it got on there ? Even though on the Billboard charts it got as high as #3.(and that may be the answer).
Yeah and when the remastering was done Elefante wasn't a part of it so he didn't have a say. At the time this song was brand new and a reunion wasn't in the picture yet. Maybe they thought, it's new and kind of a bonus and of course your point about it reaching #3 in the charts helps.
Actually, a couple of his songs. But my point is that there are some key points in this song that sound like Squire's style. This song is one of my favorites.
Drummer executing some wicked syncopation. The pauses add so much.
85Funkadelic 3 months ago in playlist 85Funkadelic's favorites
It is, and thanks ..
ccyclops 11 months ago
Hey rickyon, I saw what you posted about the song, and I thought I would clarify ... Dino played bass only, and I did the guitar, Phil played drums.
ccyclops 11 months ago
Thank you for the clarification. I will change the info section. If this is who I think it is then who am I to argue!
rickyon 11 months ago
Thank you so much for uploading this. This is one of my long time Kansas songs (I'm 13, and I've loved it since 5). I love this song so much.
animationgirly 1 year ago
You're welcome. You've chosen a great song and a unique one as well. This song which was removed from the remixed version of this CD is really not Kansas. It's more or less John Elefante and his brother. He was only with the band for a couple of years but he was an excellent singer and musician. You should check out his solo stuff and I highly recommend anything else from Kansas.
rickyon 1 year ago
@rickyon I feel funny replying to my own reply but I've recently heard some new info about this song. Dino Elefante plays the bass guitar. Rich Williams plays the guitar parts and Phil Ehart plays the drums. So,in fact it's more of a Kansas song than I thought although I've always thought of it as a Kansas song anyway.
rickyon 11 months ago
@rickyon I saw Kansas live over the weekend and wondered why they didn't play this song? :(
bodyandsmarts 7 months ago
There are a lot of songs that Kansas won't play anymore and this is very high on the list.
rickyon 7 months ago
Thanks rickyon,that explains a lot. Guess it would make sense to have the song removed. And just a quick F.Y.I.--J.Brown was also called "the most controverisial figure of the 19th century." But that guy on the cover looks very little like him...matter of fact he looks kind of freaky the more you look at it..LOL-- wonder what the symbolism on the cover is all about?
Puritan40 1 year ago
You're welcome. I think that the cover is saying the same thing as the Wizard of Oz. Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain, things are not as they seem. Just a guess. I'm sure other things can be inferred from what you see there.
rickyon 1 year ago
See corrected response above.
rickyon 11 months ago
Ok,this song is not on the "Best of Kansas" CD that I have. Maybe there is a VERY best of...CD??Or maybe simply the Volume 2 version. But it's not on the one that features this cover with the man with long blond beard. Incidentally,does anyone know who this character is supposed to be,and wasn't he featured also on their very first album cover?Just wondering...
Puritan40 1 year ago
O.K. Let's take these questions in reverse order. Yes that is the same guy featured on the 1st album cover. He is John Brown a famous figure in Kansas history. This is the original release of this CD from 1984 (10 yr.anniversary) You have the 2nd release of this CD from 1994 (20 yr. anniv.) When the band got together to remaster this recording Walsh was back in the band and Elefante was gone so they removed this song. I hope that clears things up.
rickyon 1 year ago
@rickyon dang, that can really mess a guys brain up!
cooldudebailey 1 year ago
OK, as a very long time fan of Kansas (I'm 41), I would say that JE was an excellent choice to be the new singer. In hindsight, I would say that God placed him there (Got the clout of being in Kansas and the 2 hits..FFWF and PTGT...and the musical insight/knowledge) and then used him elsewhere. I however never ever liked Perfect Lover..glad its not on the re-release GHits. Sounds way to much like Petra...not KANSAS!
AmericanFireBrand 1 year ago
always liked this one and the chorus nails the essence of Kansas. He never could fill the shoes of walsh but very talented in his own right. I can't recall which release it's from, but I believe that walsh ended up singing the play the game a few years ago and he did it so well it's as if it was his song all along. That could just be the involvement of Kerry once again.
4graces 1 year ago
The first Kansas' song I loved (except Dust in the wind)
miiirskiii 1 year ago
yeah, i love it too. its johns voice. simply stunning!
MAGNUM2F 1 year ago
Rickyon, I was just reading your synopsis of this. Interesting to hear that Dino played the guitar parts. The thing that puzzles me is this: I hear distinctive keyboard timbres that Kerry often used (the ppg waves synth, for example and those synth marimba tones). Are you sure Kerry didn't play keys on this? Some sounds are used on Timeline (listen to the patches before the Perfect Lover chorus). Great song tho !
sunboyfun 2 years ago
Whoa! You're talking way above my pay grade with that keyboard stuff! I'm positive that I have the information right. Maybe Kerry had rubbed off on Elefante by this time, He had been in the band for 2 years. I know that Livgren would influence me greatly if I were around him for 2 years. Elefante and his brother had and still have a world famous recording studio and are capable of producing anything. Those guys are very successful sharp cats!
rickyon 2 years ago
Hehe, sorry bout that. I am a keyboard guy myself. I definitely hear the textures and "ideas" of Kerry in the keyboard parts. If you listen to Kerry's keyboard playing on David Pack's solo 1985/86 album's title track ("Anywhere You Go" you will hear what I mean. Same keys used there and the same style of playing. However, you may be utterly correct :) My ears just detected those subtleties.
sunboyfun 2 years ago
Rick, how would you rate the Elefante years w/ Kansas? VC carries merit, but to me DM with the exception of "Incident On A Bridge" and End Of Age",(both KL tunes) is weak. I saw the a VC show in mid 82, RS looked liked he was ready to get out of there and was just going through the motions. The band just seemed without direction on that tour. The DM tour was worse
2manifest2 2 years ago
As I stated before I am a Kansas whore so anything Kansas is great to me. I'm not saying that I don't recognize poor performance or lackluster effort with the writing and arranging I am just not the right person to ask to judge anything that they do because I'm too close to the subject! I loved Elefante's voice and I would say that you are close to what I feel on the 2 albums. VC was good, DM was average. Robby did get out of there a year later. I think the writing was on the wall.
rickyon 2 years ago
Number 3, on what chart? This song was not even a top 40 single..... Once again Rick is right. ONLY John and Dino play on this song. However, John was still a member of Kansas along with Rich and Phil at the time it was released. Back in the 80's, having a single to go with a "Best Of" was the way to market the album. The album also has a cut up Song For Americia on it, missing one of the middle keyboard solo's. Your France 78 find is amazing Rick. Keep them coming
2manifest2 2 years ago
I just thought of a good analogy ( only took me 5 months! See how much you slow down when you get old!) Let's say Kerry Livgren wrote a song, recorded all the parts maybe along with a couple other non Kansas members and they used it on one of the Kansas albums. Let's say between the years of 1986 and 1989 (any year would do really) Even though it is on a Kansas album you could not say that it is a Kansas song because Kansas did not do it! This is pretty much what occurred with "Perfect Lover".
rickyon 2 years ago
Nice analogy Rick. I agree with that. Kansas was pretty much dead by the time this came out. Kerry and Dave were def out of Kansas by this time, in fact Kerry had been gone over a year by the time this came out. This tune may or may not have been in the pipeline with Phil and Rich. It is what it is.... I can also say for certain that this song was not a top 40 song
2manifest2 2 years ago
When they did this tune, Kerry and Dave had already left the band with just John, Phil and Rich and Dino Elefante contributing. Great tune! They should have left it on the newer issue of "The best of Kansas. Good intelligent discussion!
eaglewheels1995 2 years ago
Favorite song from these guys!! Even if it's NOT a Kansas song. Thanks for posting!
jhei2112 2 years ago
You're welcome!
rickyon 2 years ago
This is very good, but not the best Kansas-song. It's too hard to decide wich song is the best :)
Bubbelibooh 2 years ago
Please re-read the info section. I said that this is the best Kansas song that is NOT a Kansas song. Even though it was on the 1984 "Best Of " CD Noone from Kansas plays on the song! It was written produced and recorded by the Elefante brothers. Jon plays all the instruments and his brother contributes on guitar. Jon sings lead and all the backing vocals. You are right that it is very hard to choose a favorite Kansas tune! Mine is "Song For America". I like your YT channel....Rick
rickyon 2 years ago
I love this 1984 song, have the LP. However, Jon Elefante was a Kansas member at this point (he was on 1982s Vinyl Confessions) while he brother did join the band in 1983 Drastic Measures album). So, to say "noone from Kansas plays on the song" is not quite true. Noone but the Elefante brothers perhaps.
azgrunge 2 years ago
Come on! You know what I mean! Kerry ,Phil, Dave,Robbie and Rich. None of those guys played on this song. You could take any popular band and the same thing would apply. It would be like David Lee Roth doing a song by himself and saying that it's a Van Halen record. This is a solo effort that happens to be done by an awesome singer who was in Kansas at the time. Technically you're right but I think you get the gist of my statement.
rickyon 2 years ago
I have the Best of Kansas cd and it is on it. According to what I have been reading Jon Elefante made this his last effort before he left the band.
ALaudun 2 years ago
Hey Anton, you have the original 1984 C.D. release it was later remastered(in 1994) and the song was removed. Where did you read that info? If this was meant for Kansas the band why didn't he bring it to them and have the band do it? Maybe he did but the band split up before they had a chance!
rickyon 2 years ago
Hey Anton, correction!, I meant to say it was remastered in 1999.
rickyon 2 years ago
Soon as I re-check my info I will get back to you. But the song definitely doesn't sound like a Kansas song, it sounds like something Survivor might have put out.
ALaudun 2 years ago
You're right! Perehaps if you compare it to "Fight Fire With Fire" or "Play The Game Tonight" or some other song that Elefante wrote while with Kansas. The guitars are really fat and crunchy and the childs piano is weird but definitely cool. The bass is very heavy!
rickyon 2 years ago
I have the 1984 version cd. The Elefante Bros. made two songs under the Kansas logo, and you just mentioned them. Did they cut both of them out of the 1999 version or just "Perfect Lover" ?
ALaudun 2 years ago
You are right Rick. The band reviewed the cd in 1999 and took "Perfect Lover" off the cd. It was not originally a part of "Drastic Measures as the others were. It was added a a new single to a Kansas greatest hits cd. I just wonder how it got on there ? Even though on the Billboard charts it got as high as #3.(and that may be the answer).
ALaudun 2 years ago
Yeah and when the remastering was done Elefante wasn't a part of it so he didn't have a say. At the time this song was brand new and a reunion wasn't in the picture yet. Maybe they thought, it's new and kind of a bonus and of course your point about it reaching #3 in the charts helps.
rickyon 2 years ago
Survivor? Maybe. Actually, I hear some Billy Squire style in it.
azgrunge 2 years ago
You like Billy Squire ?
ALaudun 2 years ago
Actually, a couple of his songs. But my point is that there are some key points in this song that sound like Squire's style. This song is one of my favorites.
azgrunge 2 years ago
Well it went to #3 on the charts so it was very popular at the time.
ALaudun 2 years ago
thanks for posting this!
PaHillLL 2 years ago
You're welcome!
rickyon 2 years ago