@711ATOM - Many thanks for the highly useful info. reg. sub 3m 15s times.If I can get course record times for 1600m for outer & inner ovals, that will be great. Tentatively I rate Deep Impact @ 142. I have written an article on `Importance of track characterestics in evaluating timeform ratings` If you give me your email id, I can send it to you. Would be delighted to get your views on the same.
@711ATOM - Thanks.Ihave the profile. 1 in 90 rise for 360m followed by 1 in 40 fall for 160m.Complexities remain. I need record timings for 1400m and 1600m on outer oval and by how much they are faster than those of inner oval.My broad level conclusion:The time of 3m13.4s with 58kgs even with above gradients is unbelievably fast giving a very very high rating and difficult to believe its authenticity. What is the next best time for 3200m on the same track? More on hearing from you.
@SKSAGAR100 Pt1. - I am having difficulty finding the track records for Kyoto. However for 3200m I'm fairly certain that the second fastest time run on the outer oval is 3:14.1 (Meisho Samson, 2007). The next fastest time is 3:14.4 (Mayano Top Gun, 1997 - Meiner Kitz, 2009). No other times below 3:15. The Tenno Sho is the only 3200m race currently held at Kyoto and I doubt there was a Japanese horse capable of such a time before 1997.
@711ATOM - Thanks. I could not access the right source for the info. I need the following info: The level difference `x` between the 1306m (considered the start of 3200m) and wp, the weight `y` carried by DI, and the course record for 1200m. If `x` is 10m and `y` 56kgs( assummed values) then the TF rating is worked out as 142.If JRA wants to study my system and authenticate it if found in order, I`ll happily send it.
@SKSAGAR100 (Pt1) - Perhaps you have already seen this information, but if you go to the JRA site click "Go Racing" on the nav. bar between "Breeding Sales" and "Contacts". "Racecourses (JRA)" will be the 3rd choice listed; click and there will be a map, go below the map and click "Kyoto Racecourse". Under "Course Overview", a picture of the course, you can choose "Course Details (overview, undulation, etc.)"
@SKSAGAR100 (Pt2) - I believe Deep Impact at 4yrs. would have been carrying 58kg. I haven't yet been able to find the track record for 1200m. I hope that helps.
I have a system of calculating Time form ratings, but if I use that system to evaluate Deep Impact`s rating based on the Tenno Sho win, it works out several points (about 10 )higher than Secretariate`s rating (147). This is absolutely impossible, the only explanation I can think of is either the track at Kyoto is inclined downwards in the last 800 m (the part covered twice), or the timing of 3:13:40 may not be authentic.
@SKSAGAR100 From the JRA - "features a flat home straight of just over 400 meters. The course also is known for its hill laid out over the third and fourth turns, where the track rises from the 1,200-meter mark to the 800 mark, then dips right to the mouth of the stretch. The trip for the Tenno Sho lasts one-and-a-half laps around the oval." The outer oval is 1894m. Go to the JRA site, it has charts with course details (overview, undulation, etc.). How does it effects your figures?
I would love to know what Deep Impact's Timeform rating was. I have a feeling that his final score may have been reduced in light of the Arc affair. IMO his run in the 06 Tenno Sho is one of the all-time greatest ever performances by a thoroughbred. Most trainers would be happy to have a horse than could run 1m sub-1:37. To run two of these consecutively, IMO, ranks right up with Secretariat's Belmont win in terms of peak performances. Yet he didn't even rank +135. Sunday Silence's best son.
@bgardiner2000 I find the WTR and Timeform to be outmoded, biased and silly. On Aug. 26/06 Deep Impact was rated +131, and this was after running 3:13:40 over 3200m. Hurricane Run was rated top older horse at 134 (compare records). According to Timeform El Condor Pasa (top rating 136) was a better horse than Deep Impact. The WTF and Timeform have Nakayama Festa ranked top Japanese horse now at 132, above Buena Vista, Victoire Pisa, and several others. NO ONE in Japan rates him that high!
@711ATOM Absolutely agree. Deep Impact's rating was a farce. The problem with TF is that form outside of America or Europe hasn't in the past been taken that seriously. I think that is starting to change. Northerly, who was one of the finest gallopers Australia has ever produced only received a rating of 129. So You Think is already rated at 131 and has not beaten anything of real substance.
@bgardiner2000 I hope your right about things changing. It drives me crazy what the ratings outfits consider and what they choose to ignore. It's not only outside of Europe and the U.S. (though there is where it's worst). WTR and TF have Quality Road (WTR 128, TF 131) rated above Amer. HOTF Zenyatta (WTR 125, TF). TF has Quality Road rated above Blame, a horse that beat QR twice. QR (a good horse) finished 12th and last to Blame and Zenyatta in the Breeder's Cup Classic!
this was amazing, I absoloutly loved it! And the clips were really cool as well, almost as if they were from a movie or something, with all the unusual angles n such. And the music fit & mixed perfectly.. I actually got a little emotional at then end, and I have no idea why lol. Great job!
@711ATOM - The article has been published in Guest writer`s column of India race and can be accessed there also.
SKSAGAR100 7 months ago
@711ATOM - Many thanks for the highly useful info. reg. sub 3m 15s times.If I can get course record times for 1600m for outer & inner ovals, that will be great. Tentatively I rate Deep Impact @ 142. I have written an article on `Importance of track characterestics in evaluating timeform ratings` If you give me your email id, I can send it to you. Would be delighted to get your views on the same.
Best wishes.
SKSAGAR100 7 months ago
@711ATOM - Thanks.Ihave the profile. 1 in 90 rise for 360m followed by 1 in 40 fall for 160m.Complexities remain. I need record timings for 1400m and 1600m on outer oval and by how much they are faster than those of inner oval.My broad level conclusion:The time of 3m13.4s with 58kgs even with above gradients is unbelievably fast giving a very very high rating and difficult to believe its authenticity. What is the next best time for 3200m on the same track? More on hearing from you.
SKSAGAR100 9 months ago
@SKSAGAR100 Pt1. - I am having difficulty finding the track records for Kyoto. However for 3200m I'm fairly certain that the second fastest time run on the outer oval is 3:14.1 (Meisho Samson, 2007). The next fastest time is 3:14.4 (Mayano Top Gun, 1997 - Meiner Kitz, 2009). No other times below 3:15. The Tenno Sho is the only 3200m race currently held at Kyoto and I doubt there was a Japanese horse capable of such a time before 1997.
711ATOM 8 months ago
@711ATOM - Thanks. I could not access the right source for the info. I need the following info: The level difference `x` between the 1306m (considered the start of 3200m) and wp, the weight `y` carried by DI, and the course record for 1200m. If `x` is 10m and `y` 56kgs( assummed values) then the TF rating is worked out as 142.If JRA wants to study my system and authenticate it if found in order, I`ll happily send it.
SKSAGAR100 9 months ago
@SKSAGAR100 (Pt1) - Perhaps you have already seen this information, but if you go to the JRA site click "Go Racing" on the nav. bar between "Breeding Sales" and "Contacts". "Racecourses (JRA)" will be the 3rd choice listed; click and there will be a map, go below the map and click "Kyoto Racecourse". Under "Course Overview", a picture of the course, you can choose "Course Details (overview, undulation, etc.)"
711ATOM 9 months ago
@SKSAGAR100 (Pt2) - I believe Deep Impact at 4yrs. would have been carrying 58kg. I haven't yet been able to find the track record for 1200m. I hope that helps.
711ATOM 9 months ago
I have a system of calculating Time form ratings, but if I use that system to evaluate Deep Impact`s rating based on the Tenno Sho win, it works out several points (about 10 )higher than Secretariate`s rating (147). This is absolutely impossible, the only explanation I can think of is either the track at Kyoto is inclined downwards in the last 800 m (the part covered twice), or the timing of 3:13:40 may not be authentic.
SKSAGAR100 10 months ago
@SKSAGAR100 From the JRA - "features a flat home straight of just over 400 meters. The course also is known for its hill laid out over the third and fourth turns, where the track rises from the 1,200-meter mark to the 800 mark, then dips right to the mouth of the stretch. The trip for the Tenno Sho lasts one-and-a-half laps around the oval." The outer oval is 1894m. Go to the JRA site, it has charts with course details (overview, undulation, etc.). How does it effects your figures?
711ATOM 10 months ago
I would love to know what Deep Impact's Timeform rating was. I have a feeling that his final score may have been reduced in light of the Arc affair. IMO his run in the 06 Tenno Sho is one of the all-time greatest ever performances by a thoroughbred. Most trainers would be happy to have a horse than could run 1m sub-1:37. To run two of these consecutively, IMO, ranks right up with Secretariat's Belmont win in terms of peak performances. Yet he didn't even rank +135. Sunday Silence's best son.
bgardiner2000 1 year ago
@bgardiner2000 I find the WTR and Timeform to be outmoded, biased and silly. On Aug. 26/06 Deep Impact was rated +131, and this was after running 3:13:40 over 3200m. Hurricane Run was rated top older horse at 134 (compare records). According to Timeform El Condor Pasa (top rating 136) was a better horse than Deep Impact. The WTF and Timeform have Nakayama Festa ranked top Japanese horse now at 132, above Buena Vista, Victoire Pisa, and several others. NO ONE in Japan rates him that high!
711ATOM 1 year ago
@711ATOM Absolutely agree. Deep Impact's rating was a farce. The problem with TF is that form outside of America or Europe hasn't in the past been taken that seriously. I think that is starting to change. Northerly, who was one of the finest gallopers Australia has ever produced only received a rating of 129. So You Think is already rated at 131 and has not beaten anything of real substance.
bgardiner2000 1 year ago
@bgardiner2000 I hope your right about things changing. It drives me crazy what the ratings outfits consider and what they choose to ignore. It's not only outside of Europe and the U.S. (though there is where it's worst). WTR and TF have Quality Road (WTR 128, TF 131) rated above Amer. HOTF Zenyatta (WTR 125, TF). TF has Quality Road rated above Blame, a horse that beat QR twice. QR (a good horse) finished 12th and last to Blame and Zenyatta in the Breeder's Cup Classic!
711ATOM 1 year ago
2歳種牡馬記録の更新、おめでとう！
父の記録を塗り替えるとは・・・。
mitsuoki429 1 year ago
Absolutely Fantastic...
lengua92 1 year ago 3
Amazing horse
Brocksy16 1 year ago
this was amazing, I absoloutly loved it! And the clips were really cool as well, almost as if they were from a movie or something, with all the unusual angles n such. And the music fit & mixed perfectly.. I actually got a little emotional at then end, and I have no idea why lol. Great job!
Pliokota 2 years ago 5