i love this guy. he knows he's up against a party that is not bound to treat him with any respect, and that is as crooked as a barrel of snakes. yet he refuses to play soft with them--- he STANDS UP TO THEM.
@compassionrepublican Drug addiction? We have a few and we deal with it. Check your facts before you post an ignorant remark: U.S. is first in the world in drug use. Atheism? 80% of our population is a member of the national christian church With 45 million poor people (1 in 7) and the banks running everything - what country is an abomination?
@compassionrepublican Drug addiction? We have a few and we deal with it. Check your facts before you post an ignorant remark: U.S. is first in the world in drug use. Atheism? 80% of our population is a member of the national christian church and pay church taxes - thats right taxes to the church. I wonder how many Americans would sign up as Christians if they had to pay taxes? With 45 million poor people (1 in 7) and the banks running everything - what country is an abomination?
The fucking Tea Party Republicans are a bunch of useless rabid dogs who need to be put down, and fast. Democrats get out your guns and face the Republicans down.
Grayson is just another Liberal pussy who got he or she’s ASS kicked by the Tea Party so called “tea baggers”. Let’s see if Obama the messiah will continue to mock the Tea Party with child like name calling.
The messiah after Nov 2, 2010 keeping his mouth closed when it comes to name calling the tea party. NBC, MSNBC will feed your system full of racists hate spin toward patriot Americans. Tea Party is full of middle class patriots.
@Abenkin Chump; I can only wonder how you and long time loser Grayson feel, after all, Sarah Palin and the Tea Party kicked Grayson’s loud mouth ASS Nov 2, 2010. Sad to see the President hold his hand in the air as if he was holding a tea bag mocking the Tea Party patriot American’s with name calling such as “tea baggers”.
Obama’s hand not in the air, no name calling as of Nov 2, 2010.
@xxxmailbin actually I'd propose that the Republicans didn't fare NEARLY as well as they should have given the state of the economy and wars the REPUBLICANS handed over to the country in 2008. So seeing how a certain party is finally making the tough choices that were avoided for 8 years (reduce income via tax cuts to "fund" two necessary wars? hmmm, doesn't sound like good economics to me). That said, the underwhelming "victory" of the Repubs actually looks like a defeat to most people.
FUCK Every single one of you little cunts who are hating on this brilliant man! How bout instead of saying HA HA You lost, how bout you refute his arguments! You CAN'T ! None of you jack offs who are running around these pages trying to laugh at Grayson's loss can refute any of his arguments! Typical rightie tea party morons! Alan Grayson Lost because he is too intelligent for this stupid country! I WELCOME ANY REFUTATIONS!
@Slayerfan84 Hey Chump, Nov 2, 2010 America refuted both you and loud mouth Grayson arguments. I’m not trying to laugh at Grayson’s loss “I am laughing” but something funny just happen “I am laughing at you” Tea Party opened can of whoop ASS.
Listen Chump; Obama care will not help your ASS does nothing to lowers cost or to address America’s health care issues. Keep cheering this loud mouth ASS on with the rest of the Liberals who play the middle class.
Alan, the house has called you back in session this week...
Now clean out your desk !!!! YOUR FIRED ~~~!!!!!!!!
America wants your political career to....DIE QUICKLY !!!!!
Hlaaah...Haaaaa.....haaa...Blahhh...Haaaa......political career to....DIE QUICKLY....Hlaaaa.....HAAAAA....... Pzsttttttttttttt...... PISS ON GRAYSON.
This guy is just about the only hope I have for our country's political system.. too bad there is only one of him. We need more people like Alan Grayson; he proves that it IS possible to be a politician and actually care for the people you represent. I really hope we will get more like him in the years to come.
Roughly 2 million cambodians were killed during a social experiment, or genocide, after our troops left vietnam. So to say our troops did nothing in vietnam is a disgrace. they were on their way to doing something. The troops were never able to use their full force, or to stay and finish what we started. Maybe 2 million would still be alive if we would have stayed.
@Slayerfan84 That would simply create more liberals, it wouldn't give them balls. Maybe more law school graduates. Lawyers are generally liberal and have balls.
The GOP= Health Care? Listen up boy,,, We can't be spending money on something that saves Americans lives! We've got wars to fight! Would you rather spend money on 1,500,000 mammograms or one kick ass, shock & awe Tomahawk Missle?
This fuckin socialist big government sucks under Obama! Now give me my Social Security & Medi-care check, so I can go to the U.S. Post Office and send for my prescription of viagra!
Why did Vietnam go on for over 10 years? Because people argued that if the US gets out, the Vietnamese Communists will take over the countries next to them. But the US did get out after losing over 58,000 soldiers. And guess what? Vietnam to this day is a full blown Communist country and that hasn't made one bit of a difference to the countries in the area. That means the US lost 58,000 for nothing. Absolutely nothing. Tragically the same sad thing is happening in Iraq and Afghanistan.
B.Obamas Health Care Proposal.... Do you support this administration bill?? Visit my youtube profile page and See just why Y0UR points of view means something !
And you think there is freedom in America. These aforementioned soldiers did they die in vain? Oh most certainly so: the sound of the gavel waking them up from murder sleep deep within unruly
Man. Way to stand the ground. Looks like the sit in chair shut ya down though. Oh well. You really should stop using the dead though. Not very nice to use people, dead or alive.
No, the thing that could help save those people exists, but there are powerful forces of misinformation at play that are preventing it from getting to us.
Healthcare exists. Good healthcare, for all citizens, exists in every developed nation except this one. In this country, an insurance company can cancel your health insurance for the "Pre-existing condition" of being the victim of domestic abuse.
Even the American Medical Association is backing healthcare reform.
the republicans remind me of those old witch hunters screaming "blastphamy." If everyone is so hard on about not allowing goverment health care (and i understand why) we should make sure we take away the GOPs own goverment health care paid by us tax payers. let the GOP buy healthcare just like the rest of us . if not then you guys are getting played on both sides.
See the flaw in your reasoning is because members of Congress work to get their health care. What you guys are talking about is just giving it away for nothing. There's a difference between working and being a bum.
I'm not blaming them for the problem I'm just saying they don't deserve to get something for free. It's was their choice to pursue whatever career they did or be the bottom of the workforce and get laid off. If people really valued health care that much they would work themselves to buy it.
What an ignorant statement to make, how old are you?
The problem is in the NUMBER of jobs available. If you took 2 million unemployed ppl, waved a magic wand and made them all college graduates, you would still have that same amt. of ppl unemployed. It may be a different 2 million ppl, but you still end up with the same dilemma.
We need to start holding ourselves accountable for what we've let happen to our country and stop using the lower class as a scapegoat excuse.
Bullshit. You're the one starting the class envy. I blame nothing on the working class. They have decided their paths and I have done nothing to stop them. I wasn't there encouraging them to buy a house they couldn't afford and I sure wasn't there when our government bailed out the banks that made those loans. I don't know if you've looked at the health care bill at all but it basically boils down to tax anyone making more than $500,000. Now THAT is class warfare.
Actually I don't think I made myself clear enough. It is a tax on the rich. The bill is paid for by a 5.4% tax on anyone making more than $500,000 a year or couples who make more than $1,000,000 a year.
Right. I'll ask again. That's not working class to you? When and where did you graduate from with this engineering degree? Because right now, it seems more like you're some spoiled kid, who didn't even have the money to buy a house, or get into debt, whenever all this stuff began. By your age, you would have still been in high school, living with mom and dad when all these "working people" that bought these houses, were buying their houses. Stop loving yourself so much, ok? You're not special
Uh no actually I work as a research assistant right now. I'm going to school. After that I'm going to grad school. I work hard, and as a result, I'm going to be paid accordingly.
Working class is a euphemism for lower class. That means jobs like cashier or garbage man.
And again I'm going to point out that I didn't force people to buy the houses they couldn't afford. It was their choice and it's their responsibility.
So you're a 21 year old TA that is still enrolled in school, hasn't even finished his degree, hasn't been accepted to grad school, and you think you have the right to pass judgement on other people? What's worse, you feel you have the right to call THEM working class? No. Working class means working class. The workers. Period.
By the way, if you haven't graduated, don't call yourself an engineer. There's no garuntee anyone will hire you.
How about you do everyone and yourself a favor and try to be a little less vain. You have no right to pass judgement on people who aren't dependant on others to live. You are most likely still dependant on your parents, student loans, a part time job, grants, scholarships, so on so on. Pretty much what I'm saying is if you don't even have the credit to buy a house, so don't talk shit about people that didn't either and were victims of predatory lending.
I'm not passing judgement. I'm just saying you're not entitled to other people's money. By the way when you say victims you should replace that with people who made bad decisions. The companies may have been after them to get them to sign up but by no means are the people who lost their homes 'victims'.
No. They're victims of fraud. It's funny you say you're not passing judgement then you say they're idiots (you cleaned up the way you've said it though in the past couple of posts, which is good), but still, you're judging.
When leading banks are placing bets against their mortgages, and continuing to tell their loan officers to accept loans from people with no money down and who are not credit worthy, it's fraud. They had more to gain from the insurance than the mortgages.
What bothers me most about you, is you, just like the media, has not pointed a single finger at the banks yet. It's sad you don't know who your real enemy is.
If you give a bum on the street a counterfeit 20, he goes and buys something with it and gets caught and arrested for it, is he a victim? I would say so. You'd probably say he made a "bad decision" by taking the money, but what you keep failing to admit, is there was an intent to profit and decieve by the banks.
What many people don't understand is that the subprime loans alone were not what brought the market down. There is a little known thing (thanks to corporate America keeping it under wraps) known as OTC derivatives.
The subprime loans were the gun. The OTC's were the bullets.
The status of our nation and our planet are a result of MANY things.
World population increasing as resources decline.
Primative countries becoming industrialized, hence requiring a larger piece of the pie.
But until our nation learns one very basic concept, that we must be self sufficient, we will continue down this negative path we are on.
We arent as "rich" as we think we are. We live on credit. We allow MILLIONS of jobs to go overseas, then we wonder why there are so many unemployed ppl in our country.
We allow our wealth to gradually leave, one pair of Nike's at a time, and the only thing besides crops (which are dwindling) that we sell back is OUR LAND.
Actually, I think you're misinformed. This is all wall street talk you're speaking there. We are by far the most valueable producer on this planet. A pair of shoes can go ahead and try to be compared to a silicon waffer, or a boeing, or an oil rig, or who knows what other advanced stuff that we build here, that does require as many people, but more machines. We need to end the fed, stop the inflation, and we can make shoes too..... not sure why you would rathehr make shoes than a plane, but cool
bweazel, in reading most of yuor posts, I think we are on the same page almost entirely.
You seem to understand things such as that there was more to teh subprime ousing issue (like the OTC derivatives, bets on bets that banks made).
My point, was that we sometimes blame those that are out of work too much for our economy when we ourselves are to blame for allowing our industries to leave the country to make the same thing at a cheaper wage scale, then sel it back to us.
medicare/medicaid is 59 trillion in debt and unfunded obligation. how did that happen? congress stole it. they took the money for their constituents and hookers and left us with ious.
this is better then half of the 100+ trillion they have stuck with you to pay, me to pay. your kids. my kids.
by 2018 we are spending $750billion on that debts INTEREST. if spending isn't cut, the economy does not start moving there wont be anything for anybody.
They are Victims of a greed driven Capitalist society. People are stupid (hence why you were born). Corporate America knows this, and EXPLOITS it instead of EDUCATING people on what the right thing to do is. (which is also the Ethical route to take) So, with your Logic, the Investors of Enron are obviously not the victims of scandal because they chose to put their money in a company that appeared financially sound. Once again, Please die. You are an embarrassment to humanity.
OK no actually. I can pretty much guarantee that my parents (and I for that matter) are smarter than you. Some people (i.e. you) are stupid and for some reason enjoy spending their time trolling internet discussions. Why is beyond me but please if you want me to actually respond to your 'argument' you're going to have to clarify the similarity between people buying something they couldn't afford and being defrauded by a business.
Because the BUSINESS in question gave the illusion that it WAS affordable. much the same way Enron made the illusion that investing in their company was safe. My point is that It is unethical, on a business standpoint, to take advantage of a consumer that isn't knowledgeable. And that is more the Organization's fault than the consumer in question.
is it unethical for grayson to stand on the floor of the house reading information from a study long ago discredited?
for that matter, is it unethical for the government to continuiosly lie and decieve you? how many people have they defrauded with social security- it was only gonna cost .o1 cent on every hundred bucks, it will be a privt, acct. etc --5o+ trillion
medicade/care --3o+trillion
just this year, 787BILLION for a bunch of promises that were clearly lies
what is it i am missing?admiration for grayson's theatrics.
insurance at the threat of imprisonment. harry reeds b.s. tactics. increased debt. less freedom. sub standard care.
or is it that i just need to forget the 100 TRILLION $ in debt and obligations congress has amassed through fraud, incompetence and just out right theft and believe they/ll get this right?
are we still on the HOPE and CHANGE thing? because obama is a serial liar and a fraud.
Harry Reid's BS tactics? (you mean like the way he's said, "Well ok I guess we'll take that out too." for the last 6 months?)
Less Freedom? Apparentyly you dont have an HMO, lol.
Debt? Didnt hear anyone complaining when Clinton's record surplus was taken by Bush and pooped away into the biggest deficitin history, in just 8 yrs.
Sub standard care? Apparently you've never been to a VA hospital.
Obama deserves criticism, but its for playing too nice so far.
withholding bill even from his leadership (to say nothing of this long forgotten promise of transparency), instructing dems to cut repubs debate off at 10 minutes,
comparing rebublicans (who have the public support) to those that blocked abolition of slavery
--when it was democrats that opposed abolition and civil rights etc)
BUYING VOTES
that's off the top of my head, but i know there/s more
Americans DID want a GOOD Public Option. Many wanted Single Payer.
But as this bill became more watered down thanks to Repubs protecting the Health Ins comps, and months of ppl getting tired of this, support has dropped.
Heres an example of what Fox will do when reporting a poll:
The question. Do you want Public Option, Single payer or no change?
They'll report the Public Option stat but they wont even mention the Single Payer vote, or that it was even a CHOICE in the poll question.
This is extremely deceiving bcuz essentially the Single Payer ppl are at least in favor of a Public Option, but in the poll results, it doesnt report that.
why can't democrats states their case and step back and let peopLE figure it out>
republicans? they have their tricks and people are aware of them,
this legislation was rushed and hurried every step of the way. OBAMA WAS READY TO SIGN THE OTHER BILL IN AUGUST! even before that. PELOSI SAiD she would SIGN ANYTHING!
insurance stocks have gone UP UP UP. obama has been courting the insurance companies since the summer, remember the fall out? the bill delivers customers to their door step. dean, olbermann...that's what they've been screaming about.
the tea parties, the townhall meetings, floods of phone calls, emails...the more people learned the less they wanted.
-obama has portrayed doctors as cutting off limbs for profit. surgery for profit.
@MetalDove, that's a lot to reply to, and it seems you're putting a few too many words in my mouth, maybe not though.
I'm not saying "closed door meetings" were ok, I'm saying that nobody was screaming that the sky was falling before, but suddenly now they are. And TV crews etc. can be a distraction.
Its like if you question the current administration, you're a "patriot" or a "watchdog", but question the past administration and you're "unpatriotic", not "supporting the troops", etc.
You dont think there is corruption in the Health Care Industry?
Ive not heard Obama say that about doctors, but the initial idea to begin with was just to create competition for the H.I. industry.
The Town Hall meetings, Tea parties, were ignited by fallacy. people are like sheep, they go with the flow, the follow what seems to be the pack. The initial meetings were staged, with health ins employees forming groups that would purposely pretend not to be together.
Sure there were some ppl against it, even many who didnt know what the hell it was they were against yet, but the whole "grass roots" thing isnt what it seems. Unfortunatley, its a monkey see- monkey do world, and it got ppl to the meetings that wouldnt have gone of it wasnt staged to begin with.
The Tea parties, another example of a small group that was nothing until Glenn Beck and Fox decided to promote teh events indirectly every night, on TV. Fox viewers jumped on the bandwagon.
you're desire to characterize millions of individuals in this manner really doesn't cast you in the best light. i'm sure you're a good guy, but you cant advance your ideas effectively with conceit.
i'm not trying to provoke or anger you, but this is a very serious issue for a lot of good people. some of them are gop. some are not but you cant delegitimize a persons feelings and concerns becasue they watch fox
I'mniot delegitimizing them,but I do understand how the words I'm using suggest that. Its just that to me this is so obvious what has happened and many ppl do not see it.
Many of these ppl have good intentions but they are very misinformed on what the truth really is, thanks to the likes of Glenn Beck, Fox News and ppl who just dont like Obama.
It feels all patriotic to be part of this nostalgic movement, they feel like theyre doing good, but its a movement based on misinformation.
--no evidence of tea party or town halls being staged. there was no real central planning. media folks have tried to show that this company or that is behind it all. i had attended "meetings" in march.
your comment about people being sheep is an odd one.
more precisely an arrogant and condescending one. true, most people are not leaders but it's also true that most people don't want to be leaders. most just want to be left alone to live their lives.
The sheep thing applies to all of us at times. We all tend to follow something and thats not neccessarily wrong.
But myself, having been a Fox News viewer, was guilty of not seeing their true colors sooner.
In reference to the meetings, I really dont know what else to say. There was evidence and I honestly cant remember all the details now, but it was definitely real.
Ppl see that and they get riled up themselves, and next thing you know, theyre going themselves then.
The tea parties were virtually unheard of. Fox promoted them by talking about them every night, telling ppl when where they were, Beck was the guiltiest. Ive seen this on Fox with my own eyes.
Its one thing to cover those events, its another to promote them. .
Fox promoted the tea parties and made them what they are now.
Most of them are Fox viewers. Watch how they boo reporters from CNN and other networks when they approach. Theyre Foxonians.
As for the Democrats needing a super duper double majority....NO.
It takes 60 votes and there are 58 Democrats. Obviously the Repub. party is pulling the same ol same ol and all voting all the same, either all Yea or all Nea.
And why would they vote against the industry that pays them MILLIONS of dollars in campaign $.
It's not about Socialism, its not about "our rights" or "Rationing of HC to seniors" its about getting re-elected and not biting the hand that feeds them.
And Lieberman, whose wife works for one of the largest Health Care giants of all, and receives millions from the HI & Pharmaceutical industry is as far as I'm concerned, a Republican. He's corrupt and paid off by the HI comp's. HIS OWN DISTRICT was almost 70% in favor of Public Option and he still votes NO. And its about MONEY.
And yes, unfortunately, Fox and the big faces are very influential bcuz ppl are easily swayed by adept, strategic presentation.
corruption, politics, "back room deals" are nothing new in washington, but you know that simply saying "we're no more corrupt then any congress before us" is a weak defense.
it's not even a defense, it's an admission of guilt...not you personally, of course.
to say nothing that this democratic congress and president have got to be the most self righteous combination EVER
i haven't been insured for at least the last 10 years, i have monthly medical cost that i would love to not have, but i do and its my health. my responsibility.
GAO in their report (which can be downloaded as a pdf)
say that if spending is kept in check, we experience cont. steady growth and fed tax revenues come in at current levels until 2040. in other words best case scenario, minus major reforms
"simulations show that by 2040 federal revenues may be adequate to pay little more than interest on the federal debt."
2040 that's it. i hope the president puts the nations interest first. i dont give a fuck about either party, this is our country.
Oh, I left out Marc Levin: don't listen to any of them (I should start an anonymous group) for 1 month and your brain might return to a normal compassionate level heading functioning organ. Just try it and get back to me in 1 month.
as shocking as this may sound to you i don't listen to savage, beck or limbaugh & since i dont have a tv there's no fox.
that's silliness though, i do take exception with your suggestion that i lack compassion. it could be bluster on your behalf, but you seem to alluding to something specific. can you define compassion for me? because that something i've never been accused of.
Last, but not least. The working class is all of us that work. I don't know what crap they're compressing into your ego, but you are not anymore important than a garbage man or a cashier, just more specialized. If you forget, there are huge garbage pails outside your building that are emptied everyday most likely. If they didn't do that, you couldn't do you're job. So stop being vain, respect everyone, and know everyone serves their role. Your arrogance doesn't help anyone, especially not you.
OK I'm sorry I thought I was talking to someone intelligent. Working class is defined by Wikipedia as people in low skilled jobs. That would be garbageman or cashier. I'm not saying they're not important, it's just that the job they do pays less. They chose that job. If they didn't like that job they wouldn't do it. As simple as that.
An intelligent person would also know someone like you could have written that wikipedia article, really though, who cares what wiki says, don't be an ass man, you may be in their same shoes someday. Don't apologize, just trying to correct you on your arrogant use of the word. The word itself is used many different ways and it's a shame you choose or were taught to use it in a form thats seperates you from and above others. It's shocking to see someone blame this on the people with the least
Please understand these people you were going on about, that bought the houses you didn't force them to buy, were really just pawns in a market scheme. Predatory lending, mixed with deregulation, mixed with credit default swaps (loan insurance), mixed with the intent to defraud. When you take a step back and realize it wasn't their actions, but the bets the bankers placed on their own mortgages, that they were trying to get to fail, you begin to see the bigger picture, or at least I hope you do.
Stop patting yourself on the back for your incomplete degree. All those people you were discussing awhile back may have been hard workers also. The fact is, you don't know. So for you to act like you do is disgusting. We don't need people like you. I'd like to meet the person that made you feel so special about your "achievements" that are achieved by 1000's of others everyday and slap them in the face and tell them what a pathetic, spoiled, arrogant, piece of shit son they raised.
It was MY CHOICE to be at the bottom of the workforce and get laid off? Right, cause the system is so easily manipulated in my favor. You sir are a stain on humanity. I hope someone close to you gets laid off...god forbid you'd have to cancel your XBOX Live account you ignorant bastard. Go die in a fire.
Actually I don't have an XBOX Live account. Why? Because my family chooses to earn more than they spend. I know it's a strange concept but maybe getting a better education or putting in a few more hours would get you somewhere in life.
What if You CAN'T get a better education because your employer WONT give you any more hours? In turn, you COULD have more money than you spend. Is this also my fault? Go die.
the federal government is THE MOST CORRUPT, FRAUDELENT, WASTEFUL, DECEPTIVE, DESTRUCTIVE entity on this planet.
so much so that they have brought the by far richest society in the world to the brink of absolute collapse and failure...satan himself assuages his own guilt by thinking to himself that at least he's not the fed govt.
your jumping to the conclusion that the poor dont work hard and are making generalizing statements that you cant defend. not all people in office worked hard to get there job. and not all poor people are lazy. in the long run if people dont have to pay a huge medical bill and they pay a small tax then they have extra money to put back into the econemy.
You're right that not all rich people work hard and that not all poor people are lazy. But statistically we can both agree that my statement is generally true. By the way your statement is incorrect because actually you would be spending other people's money - and that small tax you talk about is anything but. And by the way what you're talking about is called insurance. You should try buying some.
You lost me at first, but then I remembered I'm talking to a 21 yr old kid that knows it all, and has spoken condescendingly enough to enough others here to imo, not warrant any respect from even someone as nice as myself.
Oh please, take the halo off, you aren't fooling anyone. I've read through the thread and you acted (act) like a typical 21 yr old know it all, except that you ALSO have the added attribute of having apparently majored in snooty, condescending and presumptuous comments about ppl you don't know.
If you're going to talk the way you do, don't get salty when you aren't greeted at teh door with milk & cookies.
No. Not even close. I never threw an attack against anyone here. I simply said you are paid what you are worth. How is that an insult? I respect a garbage man just as much as a cashier and just as much as a businessman. I have not been snooty I'm just pointing out the fact that no one is entitled to someone else's money.
I'm guessing you clicked on my profile and saw a couple 9/11 YouTubes that I saved last night before going to bed. I saved a bunch of them bcuz it's been a while since I've seen the 9/11 footage and It's something we should never forget.
I'm not on board with the 9/11 conspiracies, but I did want to reference a few later, to just see what they had to say. That doesnt make me any more a 9/11 conspirator than John McCain quoting Mao, makes him a Communist.
No, your statement is not generally true. Sure if you go into engineering, you're liable to make a butt-load of money. Does that make you better than a teacher? No. It doesn't make you better than ANYBODY. Or worse, either...
As for insurance, they're out there screwing people over every day, and some die because of it. Pray that you never have a serious illness and have to depend upon the kindness of insurance companies.
Look, asshole... I have no healthcare. I am NOT a bum. I work hard, I'm in school to become a teacher. I have had two people close to me die because of health insurance denials, and my mother is now crippled because her health insurance has denied her a hip replacement surgery that they assured her was covered.
Take your small minded bigoted bullshit and blow it out your ass.
I dont know, but the way it works now is no good, Im willing to give this a try to see if another persons unlce or father doesnt die like this. By the way they gave my unlce 2 months to live and denied him treatment so he went to Mexico and was able to live one year, but he had to go to a 3rd world country because the US Insurance Companies, could care less if he lived.
He had lung cancer, I never saw him smoking but my aunt said he smoked when they met and she told him she wouldnt marry him if he continued to smoke. So he quit in his 20's. I am not sure of the treatments he got because they took him to several places in Mexico. I know one city they took him to that they said had really good doctors and treatments was in Morelia. At one point it looked like he was going to be ok but then he got sick again.
If it was for care. I would support the bill. However the politicians will corrupt the h/c industry even more. They will tax us more and control us through forced vaccinations, eugenics, euthanasia and abortion programs. I really do believe it is bot about any CARE at all.
I dont know that for sure. what is the alternative? My unlce was a great man, he had three girls and treated them all like princeses. Everyone liked him because he was funny guy. I remember the look of defeat and fear of the unknown and the anguish on my cousins faces when another cousin told them he was denied. They didnt think twice and within two weeks researched alterantives, sold everything they owned and moved to mexico. I dont think Insurance comapnies care either, its about profit only
That is a shame. I think we need to pull this reform and put it in some hands that are capable of doing real health reform. Even with the way it is looking I am in fear of the america losing it's liberties. The gov't can not be trusted with this much control. They will only enslave us and disappoint yet again.
Once we render our liberties we will not regain them.
Gen3Benz, I respect that, and in a perfect world, it'd work.
But I also think the whole "Big Govt" thing gets blown out of proportion.
In order for capitalism to work without greed bringing the nation to it's knees, there must be regulations.
OTC Derivatives, which few ppl know about, are a very dangerous Wall Street game (26 trillion a year) It's basically bets on bets on bets, essentially fake money. The subrime loans acted as the gun, but the OTC derivatives were the bullets.
haha republicans squirming .make them all accountable I wish they would show their faces so the whole world can see who they areC-Span needs more cameras in that room so as soon as they open their dumb ass mouth they can zoom right into them
To Republicans, there's unlimited money for wars and Wall Street.
But you try to put one cent towards helping the American people, and they set the Teabaggers on you!
Teabaggers,their repulsive horde of mindless minions, protesting against their own self interests out of ignorance and fear. They are mad as hell but can't really articulate why, and are quick to assemble at the orders of Fox News.
How much does it cost the Tax payers of America to even hear this guy speak? To use the Dems language..what was the carbon foot print for the time he took to speak this nonsense? Lights, other power, paper, travel, etc. I feel like I want to send the US Government a bill every time I hear him, it's like work listening to ignorance. Does anyone know where can I purchase some Government Offsets? I'm good with the carbon, it's the Government we have too much of.
Yeah, its not like anyone gives a shit. Its only americans dying because of the healthcare system right? Poor ones probably. From the way Grayson was babbling on you would think it was important people dying. Lets face it, 90% of the people dying probably voted democrat anyway. Good riddance right?
I don't really get into whether dying people are poor, deserve it, fat, stupid...what ever. Nowhere in the Bible (or any other Religious document) or the Constitution is LIVING guaranteed! Only if you subscribe to an after-life is living guaranteed. Liberal Democrats are pompous, arrogant, Utopian fools...or they are not fools and they just think we are. Also, what if a Republican stood on the House Floor and quoted the number of aborted children in there district? Liberals own death.
Hmm, I think the Declaration of Independence says We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.
Now I know being a led around by the nose conservative, you might not think that is so important.
I'm a liberal independent, and I say conservative Republicans own death, seeing as how you guys seem to get off anytime war is mentioned.
In the past 100 years there has been more time spent at "war" killing other folks under Democrat control than Republican. I'm not even saying it's wrong...it's just true. They don't teach that in public school or R.E.M songs. If politicians would not politicize wars like they did in Vietnam and now....less people would die.
You are the reason your country is doomed. You don't stand together with your fellow americans. You turn on them without remorse. You are a vulture, not an eagle. The america that landed on the moon is dead, killed by the weak and short sighted, strangled by the amoral and uneducated. Such a shame.
Republicans have killed thousands of Americans with their stunts and delay theatrics over the last 8 months. Enough is enough. The American people have spoken and they want health care reform with a strong public option. No more Republican nonsense in the US Senate. Call your Senator and tell him you want health care reform passed in the Senate through the reconciliation process.
I really don't think there is a solution to the heath care problem. This bill will be able to get more ppl ins but premiums, deductibles will continue to rise. MA passed a state run health care programs, similar to this bill, and they pay higher premiums than anyone in the country. Doing nothing will cost billions. Either way, I think working class is screwed. The stimulus package is a joke. We have spent billions to save 600K jobs which I think in inflated. Costs > benefits.
Republicans have killed thousands of Americans with their stunts and delay theatrics over the last 8 months. Enough is enough. The American people have spoken and they want health care reform with a strong public option. No more Republican nonsense in the US Senate. Call your Senator and tell him you want health care reform passed in the Senate through the reconciliation process.
Don't worry. First of all, it probly won't pass the Senate. And if it does, the Repubs have watered it down so much to protect the Health Ins. companies (who pour millions of dollars into the campaign funds of Repub Senators & Reps to vote for THEM...not YOU.) But it's going to be so inefficient, yet still expensive now that now it WILL suck. And 3 or 4 yrs from now, the Repubs can say, "See, we told you it wouldn't work."
It cost over 300,000 dollars to raise a kid. It cost anywhere from 500-1500 to abort. You do the math which is cheaper. Also would you really want to keep a kid that came from some rapist?
ALAN GRAYSON, ladies and gentlemen: champion of the people.
wollam11 3 weeks ago
Let's get those corrupt bastards out of Congress, those repub's are killing this country.
justice79170 1 month ago
Thank you for all that you do Alan, it's nice to have someone in Congress that actually represents the people.
justice79170 1 month ago
Hes is awesome as a congress man. We need him for president or something more powerful.
Gades117 2 months ago
Let the man speak! The dude is fucking awesome.
81laurenjean 2 months ago
i love this guy. he knows he's up against a party that is not bound to treat him with any respect, and that is as crooked as a barrel of snakes. yet he refuses to play soft with them--- he STANDS UP TO THEM.
mochawitch 3 months ago
What a man!
iraaus 3 months ago
@compassionrepublican Drug addiction? We have a few and we deal with it. Check your facts before you post an ignorant remark: U.S. is first in the world in drug use. Atheism? 80% of our population is a member of the national christian church With 45 million poor people (1 in 7) and the banks running everything - what country is an abomination?
Keepholder 3 months ago
@compassionrepublican Drug addiction? We have a few and we deal with it. Check your facts before you post an ignorant remark: U.S. is first in the world in drug use. Atheism? 80% of our population is a member of the national christian church and pay church taxes - thats right taxes to the church. I wonder how many Americans would sign up as Christians if they had to pay taxes? With 45 million poor people (1 in 7) and the banks running everything - what country is an abomination?
Keepholder 3 months ago
WHO ELSE HAD THE BALLS TO DO THIS? I WANT YOU PATHETIC FUCKS TO TELL ME WHO HAD THE BALLS TO SPEAK ON BEHALF OF THE AVERAGE JOE???
deeppurple28 4 months ago
The fucking Tea Party Republicans are a bunch of useless rabid dogs who need to be put down, and fast. Democrats get out your guns and face the Republicans down.
nightowl8936 5 months ago
This guy should have been re-elected, but Obama is frightened of people who want things truly better for the middle class.
HugoBossUnzipped 1 year ago
@HugoBossUnzipped
i am a bit disagree
Grayson is a really great Rep, but he made a blunder by attacking his opponent on Election by using "Taliban Dan" Ad.
he basically alienating some of his own voters. Hope he can learn from that mistake.
ryviuz 1 year ago
Go Allan Go........wish Canadians had someone like you to inspire.
wbhopper 1 year ago
Grayson is just another Liberal pussy who got he or she’s ASS kicked by the Tea Party so called “tea baggers”. Let’s see if Obama the messiah will continue to mock the Tea Party with child like name calling.
The messiah after Nov 2, 2010 keeping his mouth closed when it comes to name calling the tea party. NBC, MSNBC will feed your system full of racists hate spin toward patriot Americans. Tea Party is full of middle class patriots.
Tea Party shows Grayson the exit door.
xxxmailbin 1 year ago
@xxxmailbin I hope you never reproduce
Abenkin 1 year ago
@Abenkin Chump; I can only wonder how you and long time loser Grayson feel, after all, Sarah Palin and the Tea Party kicked Grayson’s loud mouth ASS Nov 2, 2010. Sad to see the President hold his hand in the air as if he was holding a tea bag mocking the Tea Party patriot American’s with name calling such as “tea baggers”.
Obama’s hand not in the air, no name calling as of Nov 2, 2010.
xxxmailbin 1 year ago
@xxxmailbin actually I'd propose that the Republicans didn't fare NEARLY as well as they should have given the state of the economy and wars the REPUBLICANS handed over to the country in 2008. So seeing how a certain party is finally making the tough choices that were avoided for 8 years (reduce income via tax cuts to "fund" two necessary wars? hmmm, doesn't sound like good economics to me). That said, the underwhelming "victory" of the Repubs actually looks like a defeat to most people.
marcrocksout 1 year ago
FUCK Every single one of you little cunts who are hating on this brilliant man! How bout instead of saying HA HA You lost, how bout you refute his arguments! You CAN'T ! None of you jack offs who are running around these pages trying to laugh at Grayson's loss can refute any of his arguments! Typical rightie tea party morons! Alan Grayson Lost because he is too intelligent for this stupid country! I WELCOME ANY REFUTATIONS!
Slayerfan84 1 year ago
@Slayerfan84 Hey Chump, Nov 2, 2010 America refuted both you and loud mouth Grayson arguments. I’m not trying to laugh at Grayson’s loss “I am laughing” but something funny just happen “I am laughing at you” Tea Party opened can of whoop ASS.
Listen Chump; Obama care will not help your ASS does nothing to lowers cost or to address America’s health care issues. Keep cheering this loud mouth ASS on with the rest of the Liberals who play the middle class.
Tea Party sent Grayson packing.
xxxmailbin 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Alan, the house has called you back in session this week...
Now clean out your desk !!!! YOUR FIRED ~~~!!!!!!!!
America wants your political career to....DIE QUICKLY !!!!!
Hlaaah...Haaaaa.....haaa...Blahhh...Haaaa......political career to....DIE QUICKLY....Hlaaaa.....HAAAAA....... Pzsttttttttttttt...... PISS ON GRAYSON.
ASentinel2 1 year ago
This guy is just about the only hope I have for our country's political system.. too bad there is only one of him. We need more people like Alan Grayson; he proves that it IS possible to be a politician and actually care for the people you represent. I really hope we will get more like him in the years to come.
shaashiie 1 year ago 2
What happened to the Constitution? Free Speech? MY ASS!
Slayerfan84 1 year ago 3
Republicans are staunch supporters of free of speech.
As long as it's what they want to hear and it's in their favor.
Such is their idea of liberty.
aggradef 1 year ago 5
Alan Grayson, Anthony Weiner and Howard Dean are the few politicians that have integrity.
alexandreleverrier 1 year ago 4
Thank God for Congressman Grayson. Keep up the good work. We are very proud of you.
lukerosenburgh 1 year ago 5
Thank God for a real Superhero like Alan Grayson, a man of integrity!
voyagernoel 1 year ago 6
Roughly 2 million cambodians were killed during a social experiment, or genocide, after our troops left vietnam. So to say our troops did nothing in vietnam is a disgrace. they were on their way to doing something. The troops were never able to use their full force, or to stay and finish what we started. Maybe 2 million would still be alive if we would have stayed.
pete6785 1 year ago
A Dem with balls. How do we make more of these?
needparalegal 1 year ago 3
@needparalegal Simple, just make at least half of Americans graduate College!
Slayerfan84 1 year ago
@Slayerfan84 That would simply create more liberals, it wouldn't give them balls. Maybe more law school graduates. Lawyers are generally liberal and have balls.
needparalegal 1 year ago
Grayson your the man
DaveU80 1 year ago
The GOP= Health Care? Listen up boy,,, We can't be spending money on something that saves Americans lives! We've got wars to fight! Would you rather spend money on 1,500,000 mammograms or one kick ass, shock & awe Tomahawk Missle?
This fuckin socialist big government sucks under Obama! Now give me my Social Security & Medi-care check, so I can go to the U.S. Post Office and send for my prescription of viagra!
renijohn012270 1 year ago
@renijohn012270 Viagra is British by the way, you don't want none of their Socialized Medicine do you?
Slayerfan84 1 year ago
Why did Vietnam go on for over 10 years? Because people argued that if the US gets out, the Vietnamese Communists will take over the countries next to them. But the US did get out after losing over 58,000 soldiers. And guess what? Vietnam to this day is a full blown Communist country and that hasn't made one bit of a difference to the countries in the area. That means the US lost 58,000 for nothing. Absolutely nothing. Tragically the same sad thing is happening in Iraq and Afghanistan.
PhilistineTheArtLuvr 1 year ago 2
Go Grayson!
DWDave67 1 year ago
GRAYSON FOR President!
treid100182 1 year ago 6
We need more people in congress with guts like Alan Grayson.
mcj3691 1 year ago 5
B.Obamas Health Care Proposal.... Do you support this administration bill?? Visit my youtube profile page and See just why Y0UR points of view means something !
Zorine247 1 year ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
MORON.
msajeff 1 year ago
And you think there is freedom in America. These aforementioned soldiers did they die in vain? Oh most certainly so: the sound of the gavel waking them up from murder sleep deep within unruly
graves. WGH.
itillbeme 2 years ago
that was awesome!
caughtupinthematrix 2 years ago 5
YOU FUCKING ROCK!!!
djspike969fm 2 years ago 7
Go get em GRAYSON!!!!!
vincevince801 2 years ago 33
GRAYSON is the man.
treid100182 2 years ago 45
steel1968, well said, all of it.
TheWarriorsGold 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
I don't know, looks like someone succeeded in shutting that blow-hard Grayson up. :)
TheLDG1981 2 years ago
Well said Steel1968.
IllinoisAvenue 2 years ago
End the war. Period!
BigRedMcCool 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Here's the solution:
Let the registered dumocrats "opt in" on their IRS form this year to your government health scare plague, and go ahead and tax them for it.
AND
Let the Republicans "opt out" on their IRS forms and in doing so they can opt out of having their private insurance TAXED.
Use the taxes you already get from income to cover the uninsured and leave it at that!
Fair enough?
Honestly, you can pay for abortions and skip mamograms etc..for...'them'.
ASentinel2 2 years ago
ur awesome d00d!
aaparicio4 2 years ago
Man. Way to stand the ground. Looks like the sit in chair shut ya down though. Oh well. You really should stop using the dead though. Not very nice to use people, dead or alive.
bweazel 2 years ago
Holy shit, a liberal with some balls. It's about fucking time. Where has this guy been?
dougmanjones 2 years ago
how can you be killed by something that doesn't yet exist?
jellygraph 2 years ago
No, the thing that could help save those people exists, but there are powerful forces of misinformation at play that are preventing it from getting to us.
Healthcare exists. Good healthcare, for all citizens, exists in every developed nation except this one. In this country, an insurance company can cancel your health insurance for the "Pre-existing condition" of being the victim of domestic abuse.
Even the American Medical Association is backing healthcare reform.
TRAyres 2 years ago 6
the republicans remind me of those old witch hunters screaming "blastphamy." If everyone is so hard on about not allowing goverment health care (and i understand why) we should make sure we take away the GOPs own goverment health care paid by us tax payers. let the GOP buy healthcare just like the rest of us . if not then you guys are getting played on both sides.
TheAtheistShelton 2 years ago
See the flaw in your reasoning is because members of Congress work to get their health care. What you guys are talking about is just giving it away for nothing. There's a difference between working and being a bum.
Combat52 2 years ago
Really Combat?
Ok, so for your case to hold water, there must be factories all over the US that are going our of business bcuz nobody wants to work.
What the hell is wrong with ppl in our country?
Nobody sees where the REAL problems are.
We allow are jobs to go overseas and then we blame the entire country's problems on some people who are out of work.
TheWarriorsGold 2 years ago 3
I'm not blaming them for the problem I'm just saying they don't deserve to get something for free. It's was their choice to pursue whatever career they did or be the bottom of the workforce and get laid off. If people really valued health care that much they would work themselves to buy it.
Combat52 2 years ago
What an ignorant statement to make, how old are you?
The problem is in the NUMBER of jobs available. If you took 2 million unemployed ppl, waved a magic wand and made them all college graduates, you would still have that same amt. of ppl unemployed. It may be a different 2 million ppl, but you still end up with the same dilemma.
We need to start holding ourselves accountable for what we've let happen to our country and stop using the lower class as a scapegoat excuse.
TheWarriorsGold 2 years ago 2
Bullshit. You're the one starting the class envy. I blame nothing on the working class. They have decided their paths and I have done nothing to stop them. I wasn't there encouraging them to buy a house they couldn't afford and I sure wasn't there when our government bailed out the banks that made those loans. I don't know if you've looked at the health care bill at all but it basically boils down to tax anyone making more than $500,000. Now THAT is class warfare.
Combat52 2 years ago
Actually I don't think I made myself clear enough. It is a tax on the rich. The bill is paid for by a 5.4% tax on anyone making more than $500,000 a year or couples who make more than $1,000,000 a year.
Combat52 2 years ago
the needs of the many out way the needs of the few or the one.
skinflutey 2 years ago 3
I'm curious, what do you do for a living if you're not "the working class" or "they".
bweazel 2 years ago
I'm an Electrical Engineer.
Combat52 2 years ago
.... And that's not the working class?
bweazel 2 years ago
I said Electrical Engineer, not Electrician.
Combat52 2 years ago
Right. I'll ask again. That's not working class to you? When and where did you graduate from with this engineering degree? Because right now, it seems more like you're some spoiled kid, who didn't even have the money to buy a house, or get into debt, whenever all this stuff began. By your age, you would have still been in high school, living with mom and dad when all these "working people" that bought these houses, were buying their houses. Stop loving yourself so much, ok? You're not special
bweazel 2 years ago
Uh no actually I work as a research assistant right now. I'm going to school. After that I'm going to grad school. I work hard, and as a result, I'm going to be paid accordingly.
Working class is a euphemism for lower class. That means jobs like cashier or garbage man.
And again I'm going to point out that I didn't force people to buy the houses they couldn't afford. It was their choice and it's their responsibility.
Combat52 2 years ago
So you're a 21 year old TA that is still enrolled in school, hasn't even finished his degree, hasn't been accepted to grad school, and you think you have the right to pass judgement on other people? What's worse, you feel you have the right to call THEM working class? No. Working class means working class. The workers. Period.
By the way, if you haven't graduated, don't call yourself an engineer. There's no garuntee anyone will hire you.
bweazel 2 years ago
Not true. My chances of being hired are very very high. Also I'm doing grad school afterward so it doesn't really matter.
Combat52 2 years ago
Pride goeth before a fall. Remember that, ok? Somehow I think it will be very pertinent for you in the future.
bweazel 2 years ago
How about you do everyone and yourself a favor and try to be a little less vain. You have no right to pass judgement on people who aren't dependant on others to live. You are most likely still dependant on your parents, student loans, a part time job, grants, scholarships, so on so on. Pretty much what I'm saying is if you don't even have the credit to buy a house, so don't talk shit about people that didn't either and were victims of predatory lending.
Grow up.
bweazel 2 years ago
I'm not passing judgement. I'm just saying you're not entitled to other people's money. By the way when you say victims you should replace that with people who made bad decisions. The companies may have been after them to get them to sign up but by no means are the people who lost their homes 'victims'.
Combat52 2 years ago
No. They're victims of fraud. It's funny you say you're not passing judgement then you say they're idiots (you cleaned up the way you've said it though in the past couple of posts, which is good), but still, you're judging.
When leading banks are placing bets against their mortgages, and continuing to tell their loan officers to accept loans from people with no money down and who are not credit worthy, it's fraud. They had more to gain from the insurance than the mortgages.
bweazel 2 years ago
What bothers me most about you, is you, just like the media, has not pointed a single finger at the banks yet. It's sad you don't know who your real enemy is.
If you give a bum on the street a counterfeit 20, he goes and buys something with it and gets caught and arrested for it, is he a victim? I would say so. You'd probably say he made a "bad decision" by taking the money, but what you keep failing to admit, is there was an intent to profit and decieve by the banks.
bweazel 2 years ago
What many people don't understand is that the subprime loans alone were not what brought the market down. There is a little known thing (thanks to corporate America keeping it under wraps) known as OTC derivatives.
The subprime loans were the gun. The OTC's were the bullets.
The status of our nation and our planet are a result of MANY things.
World population increasing as resources decline.
Primative countries becoming industrialized, hence requiring a larger piece of the pie.
steel1968 2 years ago
But until our nation learns one very basic concept, that we must be self sufficient, we will continue down this negative path we are on.
We arent as "rich" as we think we are. We live on credit. We allow MILLIONS of jobs to go overseas, then we wonder why there are so many unemployed ppl in our country.
We allow our wealth to gradually leave, one pair of Nike's at a time, and the only thing besides crops (which are dwindling) that we sell back is OUR LAND.
steel1968 2 years ago 2
Actually, I think you're misinformed. This is all wall street talk you're speaking there. We are by far the most valueable producer on this planet. A pair of shoes can go ahead and try to be compared to a silicon waffer, or a boeing, or an oil rig, or who knows what other advanced stuff that we build here, that does require as many people, but more machines. We need to end the fed, stop the inflation, and we can make shoes too..... not sure why you would rathehr make shoes than a plane, but cool
bweazel 2 years ago
bweazel, in reading most of yuor posts, I think we are on the same page almost entirely.
You seem to understand things such as that there was more to teh subprime ousing issue (like the OTC derivatives, bets on bets that banks made).
My point, was that we sometimes blame those that are out of work too much for our economy when we ourselves are to blame for allowing our industries to leave the country to make the same thing at a cheaper wage scale, then sel it back to us.
steel1968 2 years ago
@steel1968
congress & health care
medicare/medicaid is 59 trillion in debt and unfunded obligation. how did that happen? congress stole it. they took the money for their constituents and hookers and left us with ious.
this is better then half of the 100+ trillion they have stuck with you to pay, me to pay. your kids. my kids.
by 2018 we are spending $750billion on that debts INTEREST. if spending isn't cut, the economy does not start moving there wont be anything for anybody.
theMETALDOVE 2 years ago
Excuse my several typos in the last post, I was in a hurry.
steel1968 2 years ago
@steel1968
bush's spending was reprehensible. he was the catalyst to obama. incidentally, obama voted for all of bushs spending billls.
it took barry less then one year to amass greater debt then bush over 8 years.
the CLINTON SURPLUS
THERE WAS NO SURPLUS. ZERO.
he payed down the public debt by "BORROWING" $ from social security in the form of IOUs
the NATL DEBT went up every yr of clinton's presidency. that's correct. spread the word.
(sorry for sounding like such an ass, but y'know)
theMETALDOVE 2 years ago
They are Victims of a greed driven Capitalist society. People are stupid (hence why you were born). Corporate America knows this, and EXPLOITS it instead of EDUCATING people on what the right thing to do is. (which is also the Ethical route to take) So, with your Logic, the Investors of Enron are obviously not the victims of scandal because they chose to put their money in a company that appeared financially sound. Once again, Please die. You are an embarrassment to humanity.
iCore3 2 years ago 3
OK no actually. I can pretty much guarantee that my parents (and I for that matter) are smarter than you. Some people (i.e. you) are stupid and for some reason enjoy spending their time trolling internet discussions. Why is beyond me but please if you want me to actually respond to your 'argument' you're going to have to clarify the similarity between people buying something they couldn't afford and being defrauded by a business.
Combat52 2 years ago
Because the BUSINESS in question gave the illusion that it WAS affordable. much the same way Enron made the illusion that investing in their company was safe. My point is that It is unethical, on a business standpoint, to take advantage of a consumer that isn't knowledgeable. And that is more the Organization's fault than the consumer in question.
p.s. I'm trolling? ....
iCore3 2 years ago
is it unethical for grayson to stand on the floor of the house reading information from a study long ago discredited?
for that matter, is it unethical for the government to continuiosly lie and decieve you? how many people have they defrauded with social security- it was only gonna cost .o1 cent on every hundred bucks, it will be a privt, acct. etc --5o+ trillion
medicade/care --3o+trillion
just this year, 787BILLION for a bunch of promises that were clearly lies
how global warming?
illusion?
theMETALDOVE 2 years ago
Hi, stop listening to Beck, Savage, Limbaugh, for 1 month. Clear your head and brain, perhaps it will start to work again.
jlevinsoul 2 years ago
@jlevinsoul
what is it i am missing?admiration for grayson's theatrics.
insurance at the threat of imprisonment. harry reeds b.s. tactics. increased debt. less freedom. sub standard care.
or is it that i just need to forget the 100 TRILLION $ in debt and obligations congress has amassed through fraud, incompetence and just out right theft and believe they/ll get this right?
are we still on the HOPE and CHANGE thing? because obama is a serial liar and a fraud.
i feel pretty lucid, actually.
theMETALDOVE 2 years ago
If I may intervene.
Harry Reid's BS tactics? (you mean like the way he's said, "Well ok I guess we'll take that out too." for the last 6 months?)
Less Freedom? Apparentyly you dont have an HMO, lol.
Debt? Didnt hear anyone complaining when Clinton's record surplus was taken by Bush and pooped away into the biggest deficitin history, in just 8 yrs.
Sub standard care? Apparently you've never been to a VA hospital.
Obama deserves criticism, but its for playing too nice so far.
steel1968 2 years ago
@steel1968
harry REIDS b.s. tactics...
closed door meetings,
saturday night sessions,
withholding bill even from his leadership (to say nothing of this long forgotten promise of transparency), instructing dems to cut repubs debate off at 10 minutes,
comparing rebublicans (who have the public support) to those that blocked abolition of slavery
--when it was democrats that opposed abolition and civil rights etc)
BUYING VOTES
that's off the top of my head, but i know there/s more
theMETALDOVE 2 years ago
Closed door meetings?
Yes bcuz thats new in congess, lol.
Instructing Dems to cut Repubs debate off at 10 min?
First, Franken didnt need somoene to tell him to do that.
Second, where were you when McCain did the same thing to the Dems? No problem with it then huh?
You wanna talk about buying votes? Whose receiving MILLIONS of dollars from the Health Ins comp's?
REPUBLICANS.
They arent voting for us, theyre voting for the $ that will get them re-elected.
steel1968 2 years ago
Americans DID want a GOOD Public Option. Many wanted Single Payer.
But as this bill became more watered down thanks to Repubs protecting the Health Ins comps, and months of ppl getting tired of this, support has dropped.
steel1968 2 years ago
Heres an example of what Fox will do when reporting a poll:
The question. Do you want Public Option, Single payer or no change?
They'll report the Public Option stat but they wont even mention the Single Payer vote, or that it was even a CHOICE in the poll question.
This is extremely deceiving bcuz essentially the Single Payer ppl are at least in favor of a Public Option, but in the poll results, it doesnt report that.
steel1968 2 years ago
@steel1968
who cares about fox> who cares about msnbc?
why can't democrats states their case and step back and let peopLE figure it out>
republicans? they have their tricks and people are aware of them,
this legislation was rushed and hurried every step of the way. OBAMA WAS READY TO SIGN THE OTHER BILL IN AUGUST! even before that. PELOSI SAiD she would SIGN ANYTHING!
theMETALDOVE 2 years ago
@steel1968
insurance stocks have gone UP UP UP. obama has been courting the insurance companies since the summer, remember the fall out? the bill delivers customers to their door step. dean, olbermann...that's what they've been screaming about.
the tea parties, the townhall meetings, floods of phone calls, emails...the more people learned the less they wanted.
-obama has portrayed doctors as cutting off limbs for profit. surgery for profit.
pelosi screeched "obscene profits"
theMETALDOVE 2 years ago
@steel1968
do democrats need A SUPER DUPER DOUBLE MAJORITY to get THEIR legislation passed? or do we need a whole other branch of govt for them to control.
A NICE POLITBURO, perhaps.
the most charismatic PRESIDENT in decades
< SENATE super majorityCONGRESS
"but its that damn michelle bachman! the weasley guy on fox with the sneaky poll."
the INSURANCE COMPANIES
you know what-the lagging support and ratings of approval for obama, congress and this bill is all to blame on one thing-
BUSH!
theMETALDOVE 2 years ago
@MetalDove, that's a lot to reply to, and it seems you're putting a few too many words in my mouth, maybe not though.
I'm not saying "closed door meetings" were ok, I'm saying that nobody was screaming that the sky was falling before, but suddenly now they are. And TV crews etc. can be a distraction.
Its like if you question the current administration, you're a "patriot" or a "watchdog", but question the past administration and you're "unpatriotic", not "supporting the troops", etc.
steel1968 2 years ago
MetalDove,
You dont think there is corruption in the Health Care Industry?
Ive not heard Obama say that about doctors, but the initial idea to begin with was just to create competition for the H.I. industry.
The Town Hall meetings, Tea parties, were ignited by fallacy. people are like sheep, they go with the flow, the follow what seems to be the pack. The initial meetings were staged, with health ins employees forming groups that would purposely pretend not to be together.
steel1968 2 years ago
Sure there were some ppl against it, even many who didnt know what the hell it was they were against yet, but the whole "grass roots" thing isnt what it seems. Unfortunatley, its a monkey see- monkey do world, and it got ppl to the meetings that wouldnt have gone of it wasnt staged to begin with.
The Tea parties, another example of a small group that was nothing until Glenn Beck and Fox decided to promote teh events indirectly every night, on TV. Fox viewers jumped on the bandwagon.
steel1968 2 years ago
@steel1968
"the whole grass roots thing isn't what it seems"
"monkey see-monkey do"
you're desire to characterize millions of individuals in this manner really doesn't cast you in the best light. i'm sure you're a good guy, but you cant advance your ideas effectively with conceit.
i'm not trying to provoke or anger you, but this is a very serious issue for a lot of good people. some of them are gop. some are not but you cant delegitimize a persons feelings and concerns becasue they watch fox
theMETALDOVE 2 years ago
I'mniot delegitimizing them,but I do understand how the words I'm using suggest that. Its just that to me this is so obvious what has happened and many ppl do not see it.
Many of these ppl have good intentions but they are very misinformed on what the truth really is, thanks to the likes of Glenn Beck, Fox News and ppl who just dont like Obama.
It feels all patriotic to be part of this nostalgic movement, they feel like theyre doing good, but its a movement based on misinformation.
steel1968 2 years ago 2
Comment removed
steel1968 2 years ago
Comment removed
steel1968 2 years ago
I gotta get to bed, I'll reply to any other posts later.
See ya,
68
steel1968 2 years ago
@steel1968
not necessary.
theMETALDOVE 2 years ago
@steel1968
--no evidence of tea party or town halls being staged. there was no real central planning. media folks have tried to show that this company or that is behind it all. i had attended "meetings" in march.
your comment about people being sheep is an odd one.
more precisely an arrogant and condescending one. true, most people are not leaders but it's also true that most people don't want to be leaders. most just want to be left alone to live their lives.
theMETALDOVE 2 years ago
The sheep thing applies to all of us at times. We all tend to follow something and thats not neccessarily wrong.
But myself, having been a Fox News viewer, was guilty of not seeing their true colors sooner.
In reference to the meetings, I really dont know what else to say. There was evidence and I honestly cant remember all the details now, but it was definitely real.
Ppl see that and they get riled up themselves, and next thing you know, theyre going themselves then.
steel1968 2 years ago
The tea parties were virtually unheard of. Fox promoted them by talking about them every night, telling ppl when where they were, Beck was the guiltiest. Ive seen this on Fox with my own eyes.
Its one thing to cover those events, its another to promote them. .
Fox promoted the tea parties and made them what they are now.
Most of them are Fox viewers. Watch how they boo reporters from CNN and other networks when they approach. Theyre Foxonians.
steel1968 2 years ago
@steel1968
--i was ranting more then anything and not trying to put words in your into you mouth. if i it seems so, i apologize.
to be sure there's corruption in the healthcare industry. where ever there is people with money there is corruption.
--you didn't hear obama say that docs were cutting off feet?
it was something to see. the previous week (these were both prime time events) he accused doctors of removing tonsils unnecessarily.
--there is evidence of obama having planted questions.
theMETALDOVE 2 years ago
MetalDove,
As for the Democrats needing a super duper double majority....NO.
It takes 60 votes and there are 58 Democrats. Obviously the Repub. party is pulling the same ol same ol and all voting all the same, either all Yea or all Nea.
And why would they vote against the industry that pays them MILLIONS of dollars in campaign $.
It's not about Socialism, its not about "our rights" or "Rationing of HC to seniors" its about getting re-elected and not biting the hand that feeds them.
steel1968 2 years ago
MetalDove,
And Lieberman, whose wife works for one of the largest Health Care giants of all, and receives millions from the HI & Pharmaceutical industry is as far as I'm concerned, a Republican. He's corrupt and paid off by the HI comp's. HIS OWN DISTRICT was almost 70% in favor of Public Option and he still votes NO. And its about MONEY.
And yes, unfortunately, Fox and the big faces are very influential bcuz ppl are easily swayed by adept, strategic presentation.
steel1968 2 years ago
@steel1968
corruption, politics, "back room deals" are nothing new in washington, but you know that simply saying "we're no more corrupt then any congress before us" is a weak defense.
it's not even a defense, it's an admission of guilt...not you personally, of course.
to say nothing that this democratic congress and president have got to be the most self righteous combination EVER
"change""Change" CHANGE" change"CHanGE"
insurance companies and gop? who and why?
theMETALDOVE 2 years ago
@steel1968
i haven't been insured for at least the last 10 years, i have monthly medical cost that i would love to not have, but i do and its my health. my responsibility.
theMETALDOVE 2 years ago
GAO in their report (which can be downloaded as a pdf)
say that if spending is kept in check, we experience cont. steady growth and fed tax revenues come in at current levels until 2040. in other words best case scenario, minus major reforms
"simulations show that by 2040 federal revenues may be adequate to pay little more than interest on the federal debt."
2040 that's it. i hope the president puts the nations interest first. i dont give a fuck about either party, this is our country.
theMETALDOVE 2 years ago
Oh, I left out Marc Levin: don't listen to any of them (I should start an anonymous group) for 1 month and your brain might return to a normal compassionate level heading functioning organ. Just try it and get back to me in 1 month.
jlevinsoul 2 years ago
@jlevinsoul
as shocking as this may sound to you i don't listen to savage, beck or limbaugh & since i dont have a tv there's no fox.
that's silliness though, i do take exception with your suggestion that i lack compassion. it could be bluster on your behalf, but you seem to alluding to something specific. can you define compassion for me? because that something i've never been accused of.
theMETALDOVE 2 years ago
Last, but not least. The working class is all of us that work. I don't know what crap they're compressing into your ego, but you are not anymore important than a garbage man or a cashier, just more specialized. If you forget, there are huge garbage pails outside your building that are emptied everyday most likely. If they didn't do that, you couldn't do you're job. So stop being vain, respect everyone, and know everyone serves their role. Your arrogance doesn't help anyone, especially not you.
bweazel 2 years ago
OK I'm sorry I thought I was talking to someone intelligent. Working class is defined by Wikipedia as people in low skilled jobs. That would be garbageman or cashier. I'm not saying they're not important, it's just that the job they do pays less. They chose that job. If they didn't like that job they wouldn't do it. As simple as that.
Combat52 2 years ago
An intelligent person would also know someone like you could have written that wikipedia article, really though, who cares what wiki says, don't be an ass man, you may be in their same shoes someday. Don't apologize, just trying to correct you on your arrogant use of the word. The word itself is used many different ways and it's a shame you choose or were taught to use it in a form thats seperates you from and above others. It's shocking to see someone blame this on the people with the least
bweazel 2 years ago
Please understand these people you were going on about, that bought the houses you didn't force them to buy, were really just pawns in a market scheme. Predatory lending, mixed with deregulation, mixed with credit default swaps (loan insurance), mixed with the intent to defraud. When you take a step back and realize it wasn't their actions, but the bets the bankers placed on their own mortgages, that they were trying to get to fail, you begin to see the bigger picture, or at least I hope you do.
bweazel 2 years ago
Stop patting yourself on the back for your incomplete degree. All those people you were discussing awhile back may have been hard workers also. The fact is, you don't know. So for you to act like you do is disgusting. We don't need people like you. I'd like to meet the person that made you feel so special about your "achievements" that are achieved by 1000's of others everyday and slap them in the face and tell them what a pathetic, spoiled, arrogant, piece of shit son they raised.
bweazel 2 years ago
It was MY CHOICE to be at the bottom of the workforce and get laid off? Right, cause the system is so easily manipulated in my favor. You sir are a stain on humanity. I hope someone close to you gets laid off...god forbid you'd have to cancel your XBOX Live account you ignorant bastard. Go die in a fire.
iCore3 2 years ago
Actually I don't have an XBOX Live account. Why? Because my family chooses to earn more than they spend. I know it's a strange concept but maybe getting a better education or putting in a few more hours would get you somewhere in life.
Combat52 2 years ago
What if You CAN'T get a better education because your employer WONT give you any more hours? In turn, you COULD have more money than you spend. Is this also my fault? Go die.
iCore3 2 years ago
the federal government is THE MOST CORRUPT, FRAUDELENT, WASTEFUL, DECEPTIVE, DESTRUCTIVE entity on this planet.
so much so that they have brought the by far richest society in the world to the brink of absolute collapse and failure...satan himself assuages his own guilt by thinking to himself that at least he's not the fed govt.
theMETALDOVE 2 years ago
your jumping to the conclusion that the poor dont work hard and are making generalizing statements that you cant defend. not all people in office worked hard to get there job. and not all poor people are lazy. in the long run if people dont have to pay a huge medical bill and they pay a small tax then they have extra money to put back into the econemy.
skinflutey 2 years ago 2
You're right that not all rich people work hard and that not all poor people are lazy. But statistically we can both agree that my statement is generally true. By the way your statement is incorrect because actually you would be spending other people's money - and that small tax you talk about is anything but. And by the way what you're talking about is called insurance. You should try buying some.
Combat52 2 years ago
At 21, I thought I knew it all too.
steel1968 2 years ago
And at 41 I hope that I don't start believing in conspiracy theories.
Combat52 2 years ago
You lost me at first, but then I remembered I'm talking to a 21 yr old kid that knows it all, and has spoken condescendingly enough to enough others here to imo, not warrant any respect from even someone as nice as myself.
steel1968 2 years ago
Sorry, but I was the one who was keeping it civil. It was you that started the ad hominem attacks.
Combat52 2 years ago
Oh please, take the halo off, you aren't fooling anyone. I've read through the thread and you acted (act) like a typical 21 yr old know it all, except that you ALSO have the added attribute of having apparently majored in snooty, condescending and presumptuous comments about ppl you don't know.
If you're going to talk the way you do, don't get salty when you aren't greeted at teh door with milk & cookies.
steel1968 2 years ago
No. Not even close. I never threw an attack against anyone here. I simply said you are paid what you are worth. How is that an insult? I respect a garbage man just as much as a cashier and just as much as a businessman. I have not been snooty I'm just pointing out the fact that no one is entitled to someone else's money.
Combat52 2 years ago
I'm guessing you clicked on my profile and saw a couple 9/11 YouTubes that I saved last night before going to bed. I saved a bunch of them bcuz it's been a while since I've seen the 9/11 footage and It's something we should never forget.
I'm not on board with the 9/11 conspiracies, but I did want to reference a few later, to just see what they had to say. That doesnt make me any more a 9/11 conspirator than John McCain quoting Mao, makes him a Communist.
steel1968 2 years ago
I just wanted to see what they have to say.
But after reading through this thread, I don't think listening to other people's views and/or empathizing with them is anything you know much about.
steel1968 2 years ago
Blow me.
monroeward 2 years ago
i do have insurance. and im for a single payer system than a split system but a split system is still better than the one we have right now.
skinflutey 2 years ago
No, your statement is not generally true. Sure if you go into engineering, you're liable to make a butt-load of money. Does that make you better than a teacher? No. It doesn't make you better than ANYBODY. Or worse, either...
As for insurance, they're out there screwing people over every day, and some die because of it. Pray that you never have a serious illness and have to depend upon the kindness of insurance companies.
monroeward 2 years ago
Look, asshole... I have no healthcare. I am NOT a bum. I work hard, I'm in school to become a teacher. I have had two people close to me die because of health insurance denials, and my mother is now crippled because her health insurance has denied her a hip replacement surgery that they assured her was covered.
Take your small minded bigoted bullshit and blow it out your ass.
monroeward 2 years ago 4
My unlce dies after he his insurance denied him treatment, the doctors basically told him to go home and die, enjoy his last two months of life.
evromsd 2 years ago
You think it will be any different when the government tells those to sick save or have a waiting list that is to long.
You think there will be a difference?
Sorry about your uncle, RIP
USAPatriot1966 2 years ago
I dont know, but the way it works now is no good, Im willing to give this a try to see if another persons unlce or father doesnt die like this. By the way they gave my unlce 2 months to live and denied him treatment so he went to Mexico and was able to live one year, but he had to go to a 3rd world country because the US Insurance Companies, could care less if he lived.
evromsd 2 years ago
So what did he have and what procedure did he have done?
USAPatriot1966 2 years ago
He had lung cancer, I never saw him smoking but my aunt said he smoked when they met and she told him she wouldnt marry him if he continued to smoke. So he quit in his 20's. I am not sure of the treatments he got because they took him to several places in Mexico. I know one city they took him to that they said had really good doctors and treatments was in Morelia. At one point it looked like he was going to be ok but then he got sick again.
evromsd 2 years ago
If it was for care. I would support the bill. However the politicians will corrupt the h/c industry even more. They will tax us more and control us through forced vaccinations, eugenics, euthanasia and abortion programs. I really do believe it is bot about any CARE at all.
USAPatriot1966 2 years ago
I dont know that for sure. what is the alternative? My unlce was a great man, he had three girls and treated them all like princeses. Everyone liked him because he was funny guy. I remember the look of defeat and fear of the unknown and the anguish on my cousins faces when another cousin told them he was denied. They didnt think twice and within two weeks researched alterantives, sold everything they owned and moved to mexico. I dont think Insurance comapnies care either, its about profit only
evromsd 2 years ago
That is a shame. I think we need to pull this reform and put it in some hands that are capable of doing real health reform. Even with the way it is looking I am in fear of the america losing it's liberties. The gov't can not be trusted with this much control. They will only enslave us and disappoint yet again.
Once we render our liberties we will not regain them.
USAPatriot1966 2 years ago
Gen3Benz, I respect that, and in a perfect world, it'd work.
But I also think the whole "Big Govt" thing gets blown out of proportion.
In order for capitalism to work without greed bringing the nation to it's knees, there must be regulations.
OTC Derivatives, which few ppl know about, are a very dangerous Wall Street game (26 trillion a year) It's basically bets on bets on bets, essentially fake money. The subrime loans acted as the gun, but the OTC derivatives were the bullets.
TheWarriorsGold 2 years ago 2
haha republicans squirming .make them all accountable I wish they would show their faces so the whole world can see who they areC-Span needs more cameras in that room so as soon as they open their dumb ass mouth they can zoom right into them
bladdes210 2 years ago
If you kid is sick with swine fludrink alkaline water
After an abortion drink alkaline water
If your addicted to aspartame thanks for a dumb ass republican rumsfulofshit .drink alkaline water
If you a fat ass ..drink alkaline water when your hungry
Oh yea if you have a disease.drink alkaline water
bladdes210 2 years ago
Partisans are so predictably boring, trite and delusional. Quit launching ad hominem at one another and be adults that discuss.
Speegs23 2 years ago
To Republicans, there's unlimited money for wars and Wall Street.
But you try to put one cent towards helping the American people, and they set the Teabaggers on you!
Teabaggers,their repulsive horde of mindless minions, protesting against their own self interests out of ignorance and fear. They are mad as hell but can't really articulate why, and are quick to assemble at the orders of Fox News.
ProgressiveAction10 2 years ago 3
Very well said ProgressiveAction.
TheWarriorsGold 2 years ago 2
Reform is good but we should not be passing huge bill on Sat nights.
Lanceshizzy 2 years ago 3
How much does it cost the Tax payers of America to even hear this guy speak? To use the Dems language..what was the carbon foot print for the time he took to speak this nonsense? Lights, other power, paper, travel, etc. I feel like I want to send the US Government a bill every time I hear him, it's like work listening to ignorance. Does anyone know where can I purchase some Government Offsets? I'm good with the carbon, it's the Government we have too much of.
ltrain606 2 years ago
Yeah, its not like anyone gives a shit. Its only americans dying because of the healthcare system right? Poor ones probably. From the way Grayson was babbling on you would think it was important people dying. Lets face it, 90% of the people dying probably voted democrat anyway. Good riddance right?
morganbath 2 years ago
I don't really get into whether dying people are poor, deserve it, fat, stupid...what ever. Nowhere in the Bible (or any other Religious document) or the Constitution is LIVING guaranteed! Only if you subscribe to an after-life is living guaranteed. Liberal Democrats are pompous, arrogant, Utopian fools...or they are not fools and they just think we are. Also, what if a Republican stood on the House Floor and quoted the number of aborted children in there district? Liberals own death.
ltrain606 2 years ago
Hmm, I think the Declaration of Independence says We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.
Now I know being a led around by the nose conservative, you might not think that is so important.
I'm a liberal independent, and I say conservative Republicans own death, seeing as how you guys seem to get off anytime war is mentioned.
Maltaim 2 years ago
What Party was in the Presidency during:
WW 1 - Wilson (Democrat)
WW 2 - FDR & Truman (Both Democrats) Truman also dropped the "bomb" on Japan- killed a lot of people
Korean War - Truman (Democrat)
Vietnam War - Eisenhower (Republican) Kennedy (Democrat) Johnson (Democrat) Nixon (Republican) End the war
Persian Gulf War - Bush (Republican)
Current War Iraq & Afghanistan - Bush (Republican)
ltrain606 2 years ago
In the past 100 years there has been more time spent at "war" killing other folks under Democrat control than Republican. I'm not even saying it's wrong...it's just true. They don't teach that in public school or R.E.M songs. If politicians would not politicize wars like they did in Vietnam and now....less people would die.
ltrain606 2 years ago
You are the reason your country is doomed. You don't stand together with your fellow americans. You turn on them without remorse. You are a vulture, not an eagle. The america that landed on the moon is dead, killed by the weak and short sighted, strangled by the amoral and uneducated. Such a shame.
morganbath 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Republicans have killed thousands of Americans with their stunts and delay theatrics over the last 8 months. Enough is enough. The American people have spoken and they want health care reform with a strong public option. No more Republican nonsense in the US Senate. Call your Senator and tell him you want health care reform passed in the Senate through the reconciliation process.
To Hell with Snowe, Lieberman, and Bauchus.
57 Democrats will vote for health care reform
DEMAND A VOTE NOW!
sonyavsystem 2 years ago 2
I really don't think there is a solution to the heath care problem. This bill will be able to get more ppl ins but premiums, deductibles will continue to rise. MA passed a state run health care programs, similar to this bill, and they pay higher premiums than anyone in the country. Doing nothing will cost billions. Either way, I think working class is screwed. The stimulus package is a joke. We have spent billions to save 600K jobs which I think in inflated. Costs > benefits.
swatson42079 2 years ago
Republicans have killed thousands of Americans with their stunts and delay theatrics over the last 8 months. Enough is enough. The American people have spoken and they want health care reform with a strong public option. No more Republican nonsense in the US Senate. Call your Senator and tell him you want health care reform passed in the Senate through the reconciliation process.
To Hell with Snowe, Lieberman, and Bauchus.
57 Democrats will vote for health care reform
DEMAND A VOTE NOW!
sonyavsystem 2 years ago 2
Well said sonyavsystem.
TheWarriorsGold 2 years ago
Don't worry. First of all, it probly won't pass the Senate. And if it does, the Repubs have watered it down so much to protect the Health Ins. companies (who pour millions of dollars into the campaign funds of Repub Senators & Reps to vote for THEM...not YOU.) But it's going to be so inefficient, yet still expensive now that now it WILL suck. And 3 or 4 yrs from now, the Repubs can say, "See, we told you it wouldn't work."
Done correctly, it couldve worked.
TheWarriorsGold 2 years ago
I hope you are right about HR 3962 not passing the senate.
If it does I hope the republicans have "watered down" it enough so I dont pay for anyones abortion.
Gen3Benz 2 years ago
It cost over 300,000 dollars to raise a kid. It cost anywhere from 500-1500 to abort. You do the math which is cheaper. Also would you really want to keep a kid that came from some rapist?
shadowstar134 2 years ago