Crosby & Stills shamelessly diss Grateful Dead and Jefferson Airplane

[SuperGraceslick]

THE AIRPLANE KICKED BUTT ON BOTH THESE dried up bands!

[artiebarnes]

Stills was incredible back then. All the way up to his 2nd solo album. Pick up both his first and 2nd solo albums. Incredible stuff!

[jamesrwill]

The Dead preferred playing live. It gave them the freedom to do their own thing. They DIDN'T enjoy making albums. It was always too restrictive for them.

Crosby and Stills respect all the musicians in the Dead. They aren't "dissing" anyone here.

[isidro7667]

I think that was pretty mild for typical music biz stuff. I recall reading that Stephen Stills would throw temper tantrums and accuse fellow musicians of sabotaging his career when they didn't play "just right". People in the music biz are much more concerned about becoming rich and famous than they are about any particular cultural movement.

[mconn2112]

Was Stills being a bit of a dick? Sure, but the truth is the dead is no where near CSN as far as technical skill and harmonies. They are a great band, they jam like no other and albums like American Beauty are classics, but Stills is right. They were just being critical of their technical musical skills as bands. All these bands, even though they are from the same era, are from different schools influence and musicality-wise.

[rth7926]

Im a dead fan and I partially agree with what these guys are saying. I think we can all agree their best stuff was their live jams. Im not saying they didnt know how to make a record, but it wasnt their absolute BEST stuff. Still love it though.

[HaraldRed]

Poster knows shit about the 'dead. Educate yourself, try not to look like such a fool next time. kthx.

[KENA429]

they really knocked the Airplane. And they said this in 1969. Just after they said it they came out with Workingmans Dead and American Beauty. 2 of their best albums. Good job Stills and Crosby.

[Chupaskabra45]

ive heard enough bootlegs to know that stills is not far from the truth with that statement

[recoveryphish]

grateful dead

[greeeenmachine]

if you cant tell that the grateful dead dont "have a hard time getting out on tape" you arent listening very hard

[woodledog]

Idle stuio chatter. Nonetheless, nobody in the bands mentioned could hold a candle to Stills on guitar. Not even Jorma. Certainly nobody in the Dead, the most boring band in the history of rock.

[ARollingStone11]

@woodledog

That's really too bad you think that away about the Grateful Dead, which leads me to believe you haven't really listened to them. You're missin' out...

[1999wharfrat]

@woodledog So, what do you think makes Steven better than Jorma or Jerry? Steven is a great player; however, his recordings after he left PBBB seemed more pop oriented. Jerry was going from psych to blues to country to flok and beyond. Jorma was rock and blues. What about the music from the Dead made you think they were boring? Ever go to one of their concerts? Many years they were on the road over 200 days; CSN/CSNY never did. And the Dead played a LOT longer at each gig. What was so boring?

[welcome2myhell]

@1999wharfrat Jorma is/was cool, his acoustic much better than his electric (and I'm a huge Airplane fan). Jerry? A wannabe. The Dead? The "Space Jams"? Boring. Completely, totally boring. Who gives a shit how many times they were "on the road"? I'll say this, the early live stuff (St Stephen, etc) was the best they ever played. But the fucking space jams, lmao pass the bong. Stills is 10x's the guitarist Garcia could ever hope to be.

[1999wharfrat]

@welcome2myhell Great that you don't care how much they played. They had many great players WANT to play with them. Stills did too. What do you find boring about the way Jerry plays? What makes Stills more interesting? Or ten times better than Jerry? Flaming someone without explaining is just throwing crap. Meaningless drivel.

[guitstef71]

e whole haight scene, playing on albums like Rolling thunder, blows against the empire etc. It was an incestous scene, and they all collaborated on each others albums to create the best music they could using each of their individual strengths...CSN being a vocal harmony strong group, while as Stills mentions the Dead where great fuckin MMusicians how is this a DISS???

[guitstef71]

Yeah inappropriate title top say the least...it is well known that Crosby and Stills and Nash (Who Gave Garcia his 72 strat) also helped the Dead organize their vocal parts for their two epic albums Workingmans Dead and American Beauty, of which their help is credited, and if this is 69' then that would stand to reason that they are discussing it as Workingmans came out in early 70. The Dead would be the first to acknowledge their help in producing these, as Garcia was the HOUSE guitarist for th

[OGPuffDaddy]

Seems more complementary. Esspecially Crosby.

[Lotshman]

change the title, that's lame. obviously not the intent

[SCBianchi]

I wouldnt call it a diss so much as a critique and fuck the asshole who asked if he should stop the tape, we were destined to get a good five mins more of what was getting intresting, and in that five mins they might have talked some shit [dude indicated at begining they had about 5 mins of tape left on the reel].

[DeepBlueHeart1221]

while you will never confuse GD with the beatles in the studio, they did produce 2 of the greatest CDs of Americana-folk music ever. Workingmans Dead and American Beauty of course... This coming in 1970, just after this recording banter.. Aside from those CDs, and Anthem of the sun, it's somewhat of a a true statement.

[yossarianhunter]

yeah, the words "they are dynamite musicians" & "i really dug playin' with them" are strong disses...

[biblerockets]

I think they were 100% right on with what they said .

[shakeystearoom]

They were all friends--what they're talking about is the Dead often not coming across the same way in recordings as in live performances. The Springfield had the same problem, which is why Stephen apparently felt he had some insight about it. It wasn't meant as a diss--it was shop talk.

[GoldenSlumbers04]

this is weird. everyone arguing about whose better, csny gd or ja... who cares... they were all counter culture bands and they all helped each other out a whole lot. its not about whose better, its about what they were all doing. their music differs from each others because they are different people, part of the same beautiful movement though

[gbcallahan]

I was never a big druggie nor did I grow up in an area where I got to see a lot of live music, but I still GOT the Dead. And, yeah, I prefer ANTHEM or LIVE to AMERICAN BEAUTY or WORKINGMAN'S. Why they wanted to be CSNY all of a sudden I'll never know. I DO remember being incredibly disappointed with the first CSN album. THIS was a supergroup--noodling on about "Judy Blue Eyes" on the "Marrakech Express"? Nice harmonies, BORING tunes.

[CHANCHOFACE]

@gbcallahan Suite Judy blue eyes is about the harmonies, i personally love that song. That mahakesh song is kinda a throw away though.

[KatjeSF]

Yeah, no harm no foul. Nobody from either the Dead or the Airplane would have been offended. They probably would have had a good laugh.

[grievousangel09]

Are any of you musicians because i think you're all missing the point here? What they're talking about has nothing to do with their personal relationships or even musical taste, it's about musical preference in style of playing. Some music is more fulfilling or even easier to play based on compatibility. The Dead and especially the Airplane had a very specific style based on their own inner musical collaboration. And any outside musician, regardless of caliber, has to contend with that.

[cwrohr03]

If I recall I heard somewhere that Grace Slick was the muse/inspiration for Stills' song "Love the One You're With" after an all-night conversation with her regarding Judy Collins

[weirdfishjacek]

You don't realize that most of their concerts have been recorded, eh?

[rlpoloplaya67]

And for anyone who says "GD was all about live, blah blah blah" ... who the fuck cares? No one from any generation after is going to know about what their live performances were like, except from shitty youtube videos, so why does it matter? Their recordings suck, therefore they suck. What an awful defense for an even worse band. If they have nothing to show for it except for a bunch of aging hipsters passing down the story of "how great the concert was in 69", then what's the fucking point?

[rlpoloplaya67]

This is retarded. To the original poster: Go suck a dick, CSNY had 50 times the talent and success that the Dead or JA EVER had. They deserve to be able to talk shit about them. I can't believe people somehow still enjoy listening to the Dead. i love classic rock from the 60s and 70s but I can't fucking stand the GD; They are the absolute worst band in the best era for rock. Makes sense why they're never on the radio and no one talks about them. BECAUSE THEY FUCKING BLOW and ALWAYS HAVE.

[recreationalChem2]

@rlpoloplaya67 Someone should pack a bowl for this dude.

[rlpoloplaya67]

@recreationalChem2 Lol I did a few bong hits before I wrote that, but I can see your point. I kinda went off a little too much. Let's be honest though, what has GD or JA done in the grand spectrum of music? I can name 50 bands better than both of them, from the same era. They don't deserve recognition, and the fact that the OP called them "2 of the high flying bands of the SF sound era" put me over lol. Stills really deserves to have a massive ego, especially back then. Amazing singer/songwriter

[longlivejerryg]

@rlpoloplaya67

what has GD done in the grand spectrum of music? Dude, you have got to be kidding, That question doesn't even deserve an answer

[phyuckyeu]

@rlpoloplaya67 Stills can sell out the Fillmore if he wants nowadays. Phil Lesh can sell out the Shoreline Ampitheater nowadays if he wishes. And everyone is just as stoned at both shows, so it's not the drugs. They are both good musicians, but one still innovates and plays differents sets every night, the other has a well rehearsed set, and sticks to it. Some people want polish. Some people prefer more of a loose scenario like jazz. Sad that you like 60's music but are still close minded.

[glimmer2158]

Stills probably didn't like the Airplane because of that crazy Grace Slick.

[ipsyglibbon]

It's fairly well-known that David Crosby worked with the Dead vocally during American Beauty and Workingman's Dead sessions. The results are some of the best vocal performances the they ever recorded.

[FrequentlyFried]

it's a compliment to the airplane that they couldn't play with their crazy changes and time signatures..that's what made them so original. Jack and Jorma were awesome. Is Stills the one that sounds so full of himself?

[Hashjihadful]

Just being upfront, kinda of like the Merry Pranksters and Ken Kesey, I am pretty sure that is what the San Francisco scene was all about.

[duckman531]

David and Steven were interested in creating hits. Hit records didn't interest the Dead and the Airplane in the least!

[box1072]

Damn! Why did they stop the tape?!

Love hearing musicians back in the day, talking about other musicians.

Like everyone else has said, this is not a diss. Crosby was mates with them and actually compliments them here.

[NLFilms]

this is as true as neil young hating the southern states

[schach420]

Doesn't sound like that much of an insult to me. "Dynamite musicians but could never get it on tape" sounds like a compliment--even saying that they are underrated. But hey, I don't know if this would have 15,000 views if the poster didn't depict it the way he did.

[breakinknucklesruler]

i heard at one point in early 70s the dead almost got kicked off warner bros label because their music was to loose, and then songs like friend of the devil and ripple came out

[MrGrevy]

They were all great friends, did heinous amounts of drugs together, and Jerry would laugh his ass off if heard this!

[MrGrevy]

They were all great friends, did heinous amounts of drugs together, and Jerry would laugh his ass of if heard this!

[susaninmaine]

thanks for posting - this is a really cool teeny little sliver o history! where'd you find it? I have to agree with the poster, however, who said "I whoever posted this dissing the dead comment, get your head straight." They're not shameless dissing anyone. They want to help--and help they did. They were cool with each other. You might wanna edit the the title---to I imagine yout video gets many hits because the title's so inflammatory :)

[geedus71]

@marklarrr Jesus man, you sound like Stills on a one of his coke-toting rants.

[susaninmaine]

@marklarrr your rant is appropos of what exactly...? the Stones have nothing to do with this clip...

[mjcglf]

They did help them, it was called "Working man's Dead", and "American Beauty". Everyone can hear their influence and The Dead always credited them for it on those two albums, this is no revelation.

[jonzin4jerry]

i agree with will.

[longlivejerryg]

crosby says they're dynamite musicians, stills says he dug it a shitload more playing with the dead than with the airplane, and both want to help them put their sound better on record - where's the dissing? change you frigging video title due

[sirlovemehard]

These idiots are talking about recording. WTF is Anthem Of The Sun? Only one of the most innovative recordings of all time... BTW, Jorma and Jack destroy CSN...

[murphmanin]

all i have to say is who the hell is Crosby and Nash anyway sounds like their just jealous:)~ -----> i'm sure they understand now tho.... ps i know who they are

[Noseheros]

@willruddock doesnt make it pointless cuz u dont agree...I dont either but this is misunderstood, they were all friends

[spacefreely]

the grateful dead themselves would tell you that they didnt like their own studio albums. These guys were just stating a simple fact which is "the dead don't make real good albums." come on, man, whoever posted this dissing the dead comment, get your head straight.

[grasshopprz]

They've all collaborated on shows & albums. This is nonsense.

[musicisart2]

there was zero dissing here_just another "marketing" ploy to get views

[likespinningplanets]

shamelessly dissing? the dead would be the first to tell you that their an awful studio band. theyre all about playing live. therefore thats not offensive

[JoshuaTaylor]

Well, Geez... It takes about 800 bootleg concert recordings to cover the Dead's career, and about 20 to cover CSN (and sometimes Y's) career. Who won out in the end ?

[BuonoBruttoCattivo77]

well its true...the dead are great musicians but they didn't translate their brilliance to records very well. As for the airplane comment I think thats more Stills expressing his view because Cros was super tight with them.

At the end of the day CSN wipes the floor with both of those bands :P

[TheDragonCult]

this sounds staged

[susaninmaine]

@TheDragonCult that's an unusual comment...what would lead you to say that?

[TheDragonCult]

@susaninmaine listen to it a couple times - you'll get it too. You ever notice how a persons personality will slightly change when they're being recorded ? same thing here, like a lot of beatles outtakes and talking - they say things and act a certain way because its being recorded . . . that's all this is, nothing "real" about it

[rymansimon]

the title of this is totally misleading..It is cool because it's from the time period right before Stills and Crosby helped the Dead with their vocal chops and harmony singing for American Beauty.

[NoRosesForMe]

I believe it. I dont doubt this at all. Crosby and the others were richie LA bastards. The Dead were ten times better than these wankers. How many times do ya really want to hear Suite Judy Blue Eyes?? I wish theyd retire and get it over with. ...and I have seen the interviews where Crosby patronized and brown nosed the Dead as if theyre friends. Crosby is a druggie and he's always been arrogant.

[grasshopprz]

@NoRosesForMe He opened for Garcia's 1st show after getting out of the hospital back in 1986. It was Crosby's 1st real gig after he'd gotten out of jail for drug charges in Texas & was playing drug free once he's gotten out of jail.

[susaninmaine]

@NoRosesForMe they obviously have much affection and respect for the Dead...at that time period Crosby and Stills were huge, and they genuinely wanted to help, and they did...that's all this clip shows. Whyare the dead heads getting so bent out of shape - it's all good - Jerry et al lovingly accepted their help and were better off for it - no shame in that!

[blueapollo421]

csn and the dead hung out their members made music together and lived together, your theory doesnt hold water

[flamesounds]

They were friends with those bands and this is just idle studio chatter. Crosby and Stills both played on Dead records and Garcia played on their song,"Teach Your Children" The Airplane recorded Crosby's song "Triad" and I think he played on "Blows Against The Empire."

[bluescommander]

I think the Dead pulled off some fantastic studio albums. American Beauty, anyone?

[songcycle]

I recommend you watch Anthem to Beauty. Anthem of The Sun sessions were happening at around this time; the first LP where they actually tried to create something of what they had live, but still be cohesive.

Hard to do, harder to do on nitrous and Orange Sunshine. Consult the documentary if you think this is an insult.

I believe they were referring to the Airplane's audience. Jorma Kaukonen and Jack Cassady were some of the best musicians in the world at that time, as Crosby points out.

[YogaforCynics]

They're not dissing the Dead or Airplane. Nor are they being sarcastic. They're saying what members of the Dead themselves said over and over--that they're much better live than in the studio and that the Airplane play difficult arrangements, which apparently made them not so much fun to jam with.

[YogaforCynics]

They're not dissing the Dead. They saying what members of the Dead themselves said over and over--that they're much better live than in the studio. They're also not dissing the Airplane, just saying that play unusual arrangements, which apparently made jamming with them difficult.

[NeuferP]

THIS JUST IN: The rock group known as The Grateful Dead were NOT (I repeat) NOT the most effective of studio musicians. This has been confirmed by secret tapes of members of another rock group The Crosby, Stills and Nash.This is also confirmed by Jerry Garcia himself. It is obvious however, that those unfortunate souls unable to attend any Grateful Dead concerts prior to 1975, have no idea what they are talking about. And don't you ever ask them why, if they told you, you would cry. (sigh) bye

[LSommer]

They said it right. The Dead where LOST in the studio.  CSN arranged all the vocal harmonies for AB and WMD.

[NoRosesForMe]

@LSommer Bullshit. If you really believe that you must be smokin crack with Crosby.

[LSommer]

@NoRosesForMe

a bit harsh for a fellow freak man. There is a great Rolling Stone piece from '71 about "the new dead". It covers a lot of the working/living relationship with CSN at that time.

[corky11111222277]

Stephen Stills played "Black Queen" live with The Grateful Dead" in '69 and Jerry is on the 'Deja Vu" album, so "hoopa3" if you thought that posting this was going to give you support for your latent dislike of what I would think you would call "the hippie/druggie bands of San Fran, dude" (peace sign included). You've missed the point and the heart of it completely!!

[drebyrd54]

There was no "dissing" here from CSN, but plenty from people posting here. "Who is better than who" is a matter of personal taste. Arguing about it is like arguing about whether raspberries are better than strawberries. The spirit of the era and the SF scene was one of people finding ways to get together. It wasn't perfect but it really did happen for a while. If you're arguing about this shit you missed it.

[moss824]

CSN admired the DEAD...saying how they r the best the band of all-time...while claiming they (CSN) were the best vocalist!

[MrBluesmaster]

He's no saying the dead or the airplane are bad he's just saying the dead couldn't get the sound they can get live in the studio. The Dead will be the first to tell you that there studio albums are not that great.

[UncleTerry69]

i like this video!

[UncleTerry69]

What song is Stills playing in the background? Sort of sounds like Black Queen, but i can't tell.

Nice belch by Crosby!

[fistfullamacadamias]

After just listening to that, I don't find what they said particularly derogatory toward either band. They compliment the Dead, and comment on the peculiarity of JA's songwriting. Not necessarily a negative, especially if JA feel that they used that to create a unique sound. Both the Dead and Jefferson Airplane were great bands, but CS&N don't have to be jealous of anyone. They're amazing, and I wish there were anyone trying to achieve a similar sound today.

[Callenge1]

@fistfullamacadamias

Funny how some people don't get sarcasm. All these groups were admired by each other. The GD and JA played football against each other in Golden Gate Park. Garcia played the steel pedal guitar in CSN &Y on "Teach Your Children." Kantor & Slick played and sang back-up for the CSN. When they wanted backup, all of them went to the best. And yes, Jimmy Hendrix played backup with some of them. I guess some people have never heard of Winterland.

[murphmanin]

And most of all we're compairing bed time music to old hippy jam/soul

[murphmanin]

They were incredible musicians and they DID get it on tape, it just wasn't in the studio most of the time... It sounds like they're just jealous that the Dead are far more talented in concert and rip 10-15 min variations back to back to back to back.... i think they really needed youtube :) Praise the Tube!

[murphmanin]

It doesn't capture the Dead, Airplane or Phish or the Allmans for that matter.... and Zappa a better song writer? c'mon dude, he's awesome but really, better than the Dead???

[murphmanin]

The Dead and Airplane are by faaar better on the ears than CSN .... who really cares what people sound like on their records thats not who they were trying to be... it was there to reil you in then when you saw em in concert they'd blows yer doors off... just like Phish whom i now love... i NEVER listen to their studio stuff its kinda boring just like CSN.

[jjevans2009]

I think Stills is a total prick, but he's speaking the truth. The Dead hadn't at this time or possibly ever put out a record that really captured what they were about and saying the Airplane wasn't fun to play with because they had a lot of strange time changes isn't really a diss. I'm sure Stills would have hated to play with a guy like Zappa too. But Zappa is a far superior musical talent than Stills or any of the aforementioned bands.

[wallingx]

Stills did alot of cocaine which usually turns people into ego-maniacs who talk alot of shit...i'm hoping this it what it is.... Big fan of the Airplane,the Dead AND CSN(Y)

[prophetdude2]

This is why the Dead were the best at live and csn only lasted about 1/3 of the time the dead did.

[prophetdude2]

wow

[mtopper66]

In 1969, when this was taped, I think they had a point about the Dead not having captured a definitive studio sound yet. Stills does diss the Airplane, but Crosby (who was good, good friends with both the Dead and Airplane) kind of defends them by citing their musical complexity. So, it's really only a diss by Stills on the Airplane. Both men seem to agree that the Dead are great and fun to play with, they just hadn't captured that in the studio yet.

[bobshenix]

"They're dynamite musicians, they just don't know how to get it on tape"

"I dug playin with them a shitload more than the Airplane"

I would not really say they dissed the Grateful Dead at all... everybody and their mother knows the Dead were known for their unbelievable live show. Studio albums not so much (American Beauty is a classic tho)

Airplane sucks, and yes THEY did get kinda dissed, but not the Dead IMO

[Antroid]

psssshhhh, silly you tuber's - they wee all friends with the dead and the airplane.

[gorgeoushammer]

hilarious

[rambleonrose93]

they didnt really diss the dead.

they kinda dissed the airplane though

[airnsmke]

yea this is stupid, hes talking about an obvious problem that the dead have wich is organizing a tight studio album, i think everyone knows this to its not a secret, the grateful dead is built on there live performance, fucking media

[thoughtjewel]

i didn't hear a diss...he said the dead are great musicians and that he prefers playing with the dead than the airplane and that the airplane use weird time changes

[jackhillty]

as paul k once said "ever the stephen stills.."

[charliebubblesoar]

hahaha.. "Should I stop the tape while you guys are chattin' like that?" NOOO! Please don't.

[BostonBreeze]

Priceless, getting to hear the opinions of Crosby & Stills about The Airplane and The Dead..thanks for sharing this!