John Allegro Vrs. Gordon Wasson

[Hesrobedinmajesty]

Allegro denounced his faith upon recieving this revelation...

[nushka1313]

John Allegro was training for the Methodist Ministry. So YES he was a Christian.

[christiantaoist]

By the way, Wasson on pgs.74-77 in Persephones Quest states he disagrees with previous statements he had made regarding the mushroom being in the Bible and admits he believes it is the fruit in the garden. I don't understand how this relates to amanita being manna. This doesn't equate with scripture and that alone would be reason enough to remove Allegro from the translating committee. The forbidden fruit of the garden is offered as Manna in the wilderness? How does this equate?

[christiantaoist]

It comes about by the gradual schematization of the impressionistically rendered Italian pine tree in Roman and Early Christian painting, and there are hundreds of instances exemplifying this development-unknown of course to mycologists...What mycologists have overlooked is that the mediæval artists hardly ever worked from nature but from classical prototypes which in the course of repeated copying became quite unrecognizable." This was no opinion of Wassons he simply quoted an authority.

[christiantaoist]

Here is the quote from art historian Erwin Panofsky regarding the fresco in question"...the plant in the fresco has nothing whatever to do with mushrooms...and the similarity with amanita muscaria is purely fortuitous. The Plaincourault fresco is only one example-and, since the style is provincial, a particularly deceptive one-of a conventionalized tree type, prevalent in Romanesque and early Gothic art, which art historians actually refer to as a 'mushroom tree' or in German, Pilzbaum...CONT

[Hashishin13]

I think jesus himself was a representation of Amanitas, but I also think that he was a character in a mushroom cult that uses both of them. I think that cult was arounf before Jesus, probably Moses too. I think that if there is anything visible left of this cult it is either hidden in Catholicism or it is the Masons. The Masons are obsessed with red-blue, everywhere you look in our society the dicotomy is between red and blue.

Red-boldness, courage(like an amanita)

Blue-justice, reason(psilo)

[alchemistoxford]

There are so many fundamental errors in this presentation that it is perfectly useless.

[DecentralizedByGuilt]

@alchemistoxford what you have just said proves that you don't know anything about the topic, the argument between the two. Making you, also a douchebag. Douchebag.

[kobrelly]

The vikings didn't eat Amanita muscaria raw. They discovered its properties when they drank the urine within the bladder of a dead deer that ate the mushroom. The urine of the drinkers was recycled multiple times before the "magical" effects rendered no psychedelic effects.

[kubark123]

Apology for misspelling Jan Irvin's name in my last post.

[kubark123]

Wasson wasn't just a douchebag. He was a self-serving, dishonest, conceited and despicable individual who did all he could to destroy Allegro's reputation. I read Jan Irving's 'The Holy Mushroom' about the so-called 'schism' between Wasson and Allegro. It is enough to make you spit. Thank God that Irving has finally put the record straight.

[DecentralizedByGuilt]

@kubark123 Tottally. :)

[kubark123]

I borrowed Allegro's book, ‘The Sacred Mushroom and the Cross’ from the library some years ago and was both dismayed and astonished to find this great work out of print. I was recently delighted to find it republished in a sparkling new edition. Did Irvin have anything to do with this? If so he is to be congratulated.

[LemonLimeLaughter]

Gordon Wasson was a  a a DOUCHEBAG

[Psychedelic925]

I believe Allegro was going to study to be a Christian Minister before translating the Dead Sea Scvolls but later became agnostic during that time.

[lacherokkideneza]

LANETA SOY MEXICANA Y NO ENIENDO NADA,,, TE AMO MI MAGDALENA SABIBITA SABIA DE MI VIDA,,,,,,,,,

[AlwaysListen2Tee]

John Allegro was Agnostic.. so yeah he was a christian. When he was assigned to decipher he was surrounded by Catholic Priests and he was the only agnostic. Just wanted to correct this part

[diegopunk]

Allegro all da way

<3

[PhrozenCorn]

It's the mushroom.

[123backinyerface]

While everyone is looking up for Salvation, its actually been growing at their feet all along. Life's a trip.

Allegro is still a light in a very dark world. If his book is not in your library, well then its not a library yet.

Great Vid.

[drex48239]

wasnt the manna monatomic gold

[Fladavenue]

MY KINSMAN MAJOR MOLINEUX----

a mushroom tale.

[psillytom]

I've seen a couple of your videos. All terrible. You make waayyy too many "casual connections," and demonstrate a surface understanding (at best) of history, anthropology, and sociology. I have traveled the world on research grants studying these matters, and have lectured on my findings at various universities in Italy, England, and America. I agree that Wasson was a douche, but not for any of the reasons you advance. My advice? Stick to comic books, kid. Your theories are weak and misleading.

[billiardsusa]

your a NICEGUY psillytom

[blackphonetic1]

gord had problems letting go. His fixed frame of mind ,brought about by years of learning by rote, anchored him when at that moment he needed to free his mind.

He exemplified a single attention consciousness, when Marina held naturely a double attention. Single att. anchors and focuses. doub. att. is aware of the body and the focus. it is more inclusive. it brings more intelligence to the present. More god's attention? Maybe?

she was flexible, he wasn't.

[freqazoidiac]

all baby boomers should be prescribed 1gram of A.muscaria every morning and then 3g of psilocybe in the late afternoon. This would give them the ability to pontificate upon their processes of past which have corrupted our living state. The "tree" is clearly mushrooms..since when do cones grow sideways and the stem attaches to the middle of a cone? who is blowing smokescreens of doubt? Oh yeah..the xristians among others. A side note, A.Muscaria taken in small medicinal doses is a cure all.

[kasp84]

thank you for your videos, man!

[EducatedRebellion101]

Wasson was the inside manipulator, stealing the work of Allegro. Research and find out the high level elite ties of Wasson, it can't be just coincidence that he was so close to certain elites, even some so high, many would say Illuminati.

[cesarion29]

MALDITO... nada mas se aprovecho de maria sabina. nunca la apoyo en nada, y la abandono.. MALDITO WASSON.....

[ManNTouch]

the important thing is that you eat the mushroom and leave all speculation and judgement about others reactions to the wayside. Once one gets sucked into namecalling, the message of the plant is lost.

[cartmansucks31]

jesus was a mushroom! preists became "high" and invented the whole story of christ!

sorry christians! you have been HAD! big time!

[GnosticMedia]

You've got quite a few errors in your presentation, and in your analysis of Amanita's effects. You don't have all of your facts straight about Allegro and Wasson either. In fact, someone sent me a very goo trip report last night that debunks many of your claims. I suggest you read Clark Heinrich's book, as well as Carl Ruck's Hidden World. You can also read my latest - The Holy Mushroom, which shows that both were equally used. There is just far to much supporting evidence for both mushrooms.

[LaughingBlood]

I thoroughly enjoyed your interview on RICR about the Holy Mushroom. You ever come across Benny Shannon's work?

[GnosticMedia]

Yes, I've read his book. Great stuff.

[LifeIsABigPuzzle]

Song of Solomon Chapter 2 may be secretly talking about the Amanita Muscaria Mushroom

[Leibo07]

Yes, that was always sooooo puzzling for me, how they (so Wasson & likes) could 'mistake' the amanita for a conipher, in the fresco...

Up till now, however, I did not realise that Wasson was such a christian fella... : [

Thanks for this, it's interesting and YT is really getting somewhere.

[WIGNSWORD]

R. Gordon Wasson was a "douche bag" because he put contingent social mores (in reality optional, meaningless) above the direct experience of bliss & knowledge granted by the cow dung mushroom. He chose to be a puppet rather than a person. Yes, man, he was a DOUCHE BAG!!! (And a victim.)

[WIGNSWORD]

The perfection of the tops on the alleged CONIFER TREE make me think it is A MUSHROOM. It is a Mushroom elaborated. Perhaps Gordon Wasson got sick because he was polluted by the military-industrial-economic complex and the mental-download drugs that come with it. Rest in peace John Allegro! Legalize all entheogens!!

[CosmosPrivateer]

I learn something new every day at YouTube University.

UTUBEU, On line classes are free.

[hottestcarl6]

it has nothing to do with mushrooms. i like mushrooms.

[wind0wninja]

Make a strong tea by brewing it about an hour it will take a couple hours to become efficacious. I'd suggest doing it earlier, about noon. If you have never tried them and you want to reign in the new year with Muscaria then start now with lower doses and work your way up to a full dose. It's said that one must drink then drink again referring to drinking your own piss. I'm not drinking my own piss but I'd think 2-20oz glasses of the brew is a full dose.

[darrylprojectile]

I wouldnt eat jesus, be too chewy by now ad youd have trouble getting sand off the body

[weiliiiiiii]

Dont copy james arthur!!!

[EROCx1]

Lost my interest when searching is Gordon Wasson a D.B.? lame.

[ALLDAYALLENK2]

AGREED.

[briganati]

I heard john Allegro was a methodist that is a christian. Did he become agnostic after interpreting the scrolls?

[Vic333]

Yes.

[narcotect]

nice vid bruv.... didnt know the vikings would go into battle on mushies.... crazy fuckers... not so sure about ninjas though... I might have a read up on it.... peace

[GODLUBE]

do you mean the berzerkers?

[IGKlico]

People who call people douche bags, are to a certain extent douche bags themselves.

[mos619]

People in general are douche bags, some of the time. Well most of the time, but ya know. How much better life would be if we admitted we didn't have a clue and we're completely full of shit in all of our presumptions.

[IGKlico]

We aren't FULL of shit & presumption, some of us simply carry a greater or lesser degree, of shit and presumption. Sort of like agnostics... but I've always considered them to be a little too "on the fence." for my tastes. Also I can make no claim to knowing that life would be any better without them. I consider my brother's claim to "believing 100%" in the Bible, to be ignorant, & arrogant. But I can't say that he or I would be better off without it. Truth is complicated, & slow on unptake.

[UNIONWARE]

There is no need to chop up Gordon Wasson like this. He actually devoted the rest of his life to studying psilocybin mushrooms. He promoted thier widespread use before they were illegal. He has gone as far as to co-wright books with Albert Hoffman. He was the first white man to discover the effects of psilocybin and report them to the new world. His Time Mag article stirred the intrest of Harverd psychologists. If you are true to Mushroom culture, you would give this guy some more credit.

[mushroomjesus]

You're right... but because of him, the psilocybin mushroom isn't connected to Christianity--he could have done it, but he thought the mushroom that grew out of cow manure was "unclean" and being a Protestant in the church, he really didn't want to get a bad rep. and when Allegro came out with his book, Wasson tried to discredit Allegro... I got this info talking to Jan Irvin who wrote "Astrotheology and Shamanism"... the focus is on the Amanita, not the psilocybin thanks to Wasson

[salvinorinman]

Its both and more. Revelation 8 is all about the entheogen "messengers" which is mistranslated as "angels". Its all metaphors.

Aramaic John 6:51

lechem ayn d'an athel pgri hu d'ol aphy cheyuhi d'olam yev an "(Food) (that) (which I) (give) (my body), (is) (for the sake) (the life) (of the world) (give) (I)."

[mushroomjesus]

Did you get that out of "The Sacred Mushroom and the Cross"? Tell us about the Aramaic "Midbar" which was translated as "Wilderness" but it really means "Cow Pasture"... Jan Irvin said it on a talk show... clarify please.

[christiantaoist]

@mushroomjesus midbar is found some 250 times in the scriptures. The Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament says it is used to describe 3 types of country in general; pastureland, uninhabited land, & large areas of land in which oases or cities and towns exist here and there. The wilderness is often described negatively as without grapes, fountains, pools of water, rivers, pleasant places see Ps 78:19 Can God furnish a table in the wilderness? The hebrews herded sheep not cattle. Jans wrong.

[Koolvedge]

Yes, the Amanita. I also do believe that the psylocybins are teacher plants, as is peyote, ayauhasca, and many others. These natural things let us see the truth.

[barbarizzagore]

hey what do you think about Jesus supposedly being born in a stable among the animals? coincidence or what?

[mushroomjesus]

Strange... Krishna was born in a stable being chased by a jealous king--have you seen the documentary "Zeitgeist"? It's 2 hours long and you can watch the whole thing on Google... the best two hours of your life!

[barbarizzagore]

Haven't seen it yet, but now I will, thanks for info :o. I was referring to the common occurence of Panaeolus Subbalteatus in stables, where it grows on animal dung and rotten hay. Now jesus is born in stable and Mary puts him in manger, i.e. on hay. It's not very direct evidence and may be a bit stretched, but he could have also been born at a local mill for example ;-)

[mushroomjesus]

Yeah... it's not really specific what kind of manger it was, I never thought of the relation, but according to John Allegro, the Dead Sea Scrolls were full of messages that were meant to be hidden, and a keen eye can decipher where the entheogens are... nothing is coincidence--good eye!

[DebEspace]

Dude! What a fantastic Fuckin' Video!!!

That was Intense & spot on regading John Allegro! To answer a couple of your questions, Gordon Wasson might wanna see a Conifir Tree...but the rest of us know it's a mushroom.

Oh! & Ninja stuff is also correct...in reference the biggy was the ninth house - the 'Kuji Kiri', though most ninja reputedly Tripped out b4 going on a mission as part of the ritual preperation. one Love...Peace David : )

[DrakeDorosh]

Thank you once again for your good work. Gordon Wasson was a bad man. JP Morgan has caused poverty and suffering world wide. His "bad karma" was revealed to him through the mushroom. Bad people often have bad trips. So I would agree that there is weight to your assertion. Wasson was a dirt bag. The book he and his wife wrote Mush Russia & History sells for $3-4 K !

[DrakeDorosh]

I am reading Allegro's Sacred.. now. Quite a good job of brining linguistics to the people. Still not an easy read. Yet it is amazing. I am proud to own it.

My guess after the part I read is that this is a depiction of the golden bough. That Adam symbolizes the male part of the mushroom and Eve the female cap or vulva base. I believe fig tree is a homonym for mushroom.

[DrakeDorosh]

Interesting that the Adam and Eve in the fresco hold a mushroom cap to dress themselves in the place of the fig leaf. H NS T RGNL MNG T T StR

(Who knows the original meaning to the Story) since the early people wrote with consonants only?

[psychonaut33]

that scares me that morgan had ANYTHING to do with these mushrooms. im sure he played a big part in prohibition of entheogens, just knowing how much of a swindler he really is. Watch "Freedom to Fascism"

[lysergicaddict]

I vote mushroom; they will show you what you are capable of seeing, feeling and knowing with out them.

do not forget to meditate; it is key.

let no mans law stop your hunger to know god; listen only to god, pray for an answer if you feel conflicted about ANYTHING.

[vickihorror]

looks like penises to me! Mushroom is my vote

[psychonaut33]

where do you think circumcision originated from?

[mushroomjesus]

I had voices in my head for a few months and they had me sniff dog shit till it smelled like Roses, and the crazy thing is... in about a minute it did! I wouldn't be surprised if some spirit out there told some "prophet" with voices in his head to snip some skin... I mean Abraham almost killed his son Isaac, right?

[AlwaysListen2Tee]

@psychonaut33 circumcision dates back as far as the Egyptian dynasties

[suckseedorsuckeggs]

@psychonaut33 well,your question is two years old now,but i''l reply anyway.from what i understand,circumcision was a forced imitation ritual that was supposed to be the male version of bleeding from the genitals.one of the main factors of our big three(religions)is to overtake the feminine based pagan religion and replace it with the male dominated ones we have today.the menstrual cycle of the female was seen as divine,as the blood creates life ,so it had alot of goddess symbolism to it

[hailstorm1375]

that is not a picture of a tree.

[carloscantube]

Good shit once again.