@RobDeManc Zeitgeist is trying to dupe us into thinking that Christianity is just a copy of previous pagan religions. Yes people have been worshipping God and other gods since the beginning of humanity, including the sun god, it's all there in the Bible! That does not mean that Christianity is a fake. If you are going to try to prove a point, you have to get your facts right .... and Zeitgeist gets them wrong on so many fronts. Don't be tricked by Zeitgeist!
Jesus would not have wanted this world where billions of people die from hunger as we all sit here arguing about whether Jesus existed. get up from your computer. free your mind help the world for the love of human kind and the planet. please wake up
@RobDeManc People are being misled by the rubbish that is Zeitgiest - that is why this video has been made and published, it's not insecurity on our part it's to help people understand the truth.
@tracyjane221 No. People have been misled by religion for thousands of years. Zeitgiest has just tried to show that, and they've done an admirable job of it.
@RobDeManc an admirable job? sorry?? to say that, you clearly haven't watched the videos properly!!! Mistake No 1 Jesus wasn't born on 25th december so the "fact" that these other gods possibly were is irrelevant, Mistake No 2, there were not 3 magi, we don't know how many there were, there could have been 2 or 4 or 5... the Bible doesn't say so again the links to this are irrelevant.
@tracyjane221 You are taking it too literally. Zeitgeist is trying to show the roots of religious or god like thinking. That it all stems from our ancestors beliefs in the sun as the giver of life, the light of the world etc. The bible may not say when Jesus was born, but the romans replaced their own Dec 25th "sol invictus" celebration, meaning the "unconquered sun" with the birth of jesus. We have been duped. Horus was said to have been reborn each day with the rising sun.
@RobDeManc And as to claims of pagan gods rising from the dead, have a look at the video "Did Jesus Rise from the Dead (Debate)" uploaded by toddtyszka. in this debate Tim Callahan is trying to argue for these stories of pagan gods rising from the dead and he just cannot produce any evidence ... that's because there isn't any! The resurrection stories for these pagan gods all post date Jesus' crucifiction and resurrection. (The video is on my favourites!)
@tracyjane221 Various cultures have celebrated the winter solstice for much longer than christianity, and it is said to be a time of death and rebirth. The ancients had to observe the sunrise for 3 consecutive days before they knew the solstice had passed and the sun was risen again.
Gods do not exist. All religions were created by humans. We live on a planet in space with an infinite amount of planets in every direction. There is life on other planets with similar compositions to our planet. After our star dies, and all of its surrounding planets die, new planets will form that will most likely NOT be able to sustain life. Many humans use religions to give themselves a system for ethics and morals and they should not be taken literally.
who the f*** cares either way? even if one side of the debate WAS right... IT DOESNT MATTER! because in the end, we are all humans! united we stand divided we fall. WTF people, get over yourselves. if you die, the world keeps going...
I was honestly shocked by the story of Lazarus, when it is said that even if the dead were to return and tell them, they would still not believe the truth. But sadly, here we are, in 2011, and even after the disproving done against part 1 of Zeitgeist, people only became angrier in their defense for it... And they say it takes great faith to be CHRISTIAN?! hmm...
Jesus story is fabricated from there stories, that's why it's a story not baste on fact even the church changed the story.. and do you mean to say we celebrate Christmas on the wrong day and the churches let us do it.... whats it like to be brain washed. and a damned rainbow is thing that happened since time began.
@wilo1st Oh dear .. people do get so hung up on minor detail! No one knows the exact date that Jesus was born or even the exact year. He probably was not born on December 25 and not in the year 1AD either. These dates were set about 3 centuries later, chosen as a festival to celebrate Jesus' birth. The Gospels were not interested in His date of birth particularly .. more in the reasons for His birth.
@wilo1st Jesus story is not fabricated, there is plenty of evidence that he was a real human being from contemporary secular sources as well as the Christian and Jewish ones. If you are so sure it is fabricated then please give us the proof.
@wilo1st Adding to Tracy, Christmas was a originally a pagan holiday-when Christianity was spread to the barbarian tribes, as well as other pagans, but mostly the barbarians, the missionaries, to make it easier, told them that they were celebrating the wrong things on these days, and told them more Godly things to celebrate, and December 25 became Christmas. I'm not endorsing this, but, it happened, so now we celebrate Jesus's birth then.
Jesus story is fabricated from there stories, that's why it's a story not baste on fact even the church changed the story.. and do you mean to say we celebrate Christmas on the wrong day and the churches let us do it....
I watched this whole movie and the most important things we should be talking about are: The Mark of the Beast/NWO/13 families AND how do we know that Jesus is with us now?
Zeitgeist is so dishonest it is mostly revealing of Peter Joseph. Truly zeitgeist is a portrait of a young arrogant man who knows his gifts include his slickness, charisma and he is basically telling you, I'm going to trash talk you but I'm so cool it doesn't matter. When I first saw ZG I was upset, then I started researching. I quickly found how much was outright lies.
Zeitgeist didn't say there was no Jesus at all. The devil is in the details people. Religion is amazing, but must be re-examined to include and remember a real connection between man, nature and GOD-- which fundamentally means getting rid of the term nature all-together by declaring that HUMANS ARE NOT SEPARATE FROM GOD AND NATURE. The Holy Spirit is a connective web of spirit. The only grievance we have is that in Christianity there are mixed messages about man being separate or AS ONE.
@100000killstrea Translation: A book composed of astrological stories (that was not the first of many similar books) accurately described the sun passing at its lowest point of the year, three days later it starts passing higher in the sky, thousands of years before ending the age of aries and beginning the age of pisces.
@SillyTickles ahhh but you must agree that stars are predictable-you can use math to determine where they will go and where they have been-this is what the 'wise men' did. Babylonians were famous for it, and Egyptians had a knack for it as well.
@SillyTickles Retard, the gods do but the data doesn't. The EVIDENCE of the gods supposedly rising is post-Christian as they adopted the popular teachings of the new Christian faith. LEARN TO LISTEN SINCE THAT IS CLEARLY SAID RIGHT IN THE SECTION OF THE FILM YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT. And shame on the morons who thumbed up your ignorant comment too.
@SillyTickles Wow... thank you for "sourcelessly" refuting that statement. I was almost convinced that sources mean anything.... whew, that was a close one.
Just because Zeitgeist is bullshit, that doesn't mean that the historical Jesus existed. What compelling evidence is there of the existence of the historical Jesus?
@illuzion30 According to this movie, they say that there are about 20-200 writings about Jesus from other people and that there are only 2 documents on Emperor Titus or somebody named Titus. Titus is accepted to be a real historical figure but Jesus is not, yet there is more record for Jesus than Titus.
(Could be wrong, I might need to watch that part again)
@anythingnew There are 19 pagan writers who wrote about Jesus.Including 26 books of the new testament.He is pretty existent.Also Jewish Talmud wrote on him,and Gnostic gospels too.Believe that.
@MrUrosSrb there you go citing highly criticized study as fact again! you gonna keep running away from debate or just wander like the jews allegedly did making assertions you're unprepared to back up? eunuch.
@acdelong I just want to know.Why do you follow me on every video?What have i done to you?Do you have no life and spent your whole days on youtube trying to prove Jesus is not real?Cant u do something better with your life then attacking something that you say doesnt even exist.Go outside with friends,play ball,hang out with someone or something.This is a friendly advice.
@MrUrosSrb why, no- It's just you, my helpless little martyr! you're my project! you tried to make some claims against something I said, and then refused to offer any evidence for those claims. Now, don't be silly, it would be impossible to prove jesus DIDN'T exist, but that's not my responsibility, it's yours, given your claims. What were his last words again? your contradictory book has at least three versions of them, so answer the question.
@MrUrosSrb truly pathetic, I would argue is trolling around the internet spouting assertions that you have no intention whatsoever of providing evidence for. Pathetic in my opinion would be clamming up and refusing to see the illogic in your assertions when when challenged, yet going elsewhere to parrot those self-same assertions, knowing that you're in point of fact simply telling ghost stories, but claiming them to be true. Pathetic is being intellectually dishonest despite your book's rules.
@acdelong You say that the Bible is full of contradictions, I believe that it is not. Taking the accounts of Jesus death that you mention and his "last words" in the four gospels, then it would be quite true to say that four different people writing different accounts of an event would edit their stories in different ways to suit what they felt was important. The gospels record a conversation that took place over a period of time and all of those quotes can fit into that timescale.
@tracyjane221 I agree with you that the statements made by Jesus are not necessarilly contradictory.I just would wonder what you think of the different times that the gospels have the last supper occuring. In Marks gospel he has the last supper being a passover meal whereas John has it on the day of preparation of the passover. It's obvious John is placing it then for theoligical reasons, but surely this has to impeach its historical reliability when each author is adapting the story to suit.
@schefedog You have obviously done your homework on this but - one day last week my son fell off his bike - he really doesn't do this very often, else he wouldn't get back on but - can I really remember which day it was? I know the passover and the last supper are far more important days in history but do we really need to get so hung up on such small details. This was Jesus last chance to have a meal with his closest friends and to encourage them ahead of the terrible days that would follow.
@schefedog There are many theories as to why St John apparently records this event on a different date to the synoptic gospels, too many to discuss here. I am also not a theologian, just a (well educated) but ordinary Christian. I accept that some of these things I will never understand in my lifetime, but that does not stop me from putting my trust in Jesus. He died for a very good reason - because I mess up - & nothing can pay for my sin better than his death. I pray that u see that too!
@acdelong The last recorded words in each of the gospels are not claimed to be the actual last words of Jesus. In Matthew and Mark it says that after Jesus said "My God, My God, why have you forsaken me?" he then cried out again in a loud voice but it doesn't record what he actually cried out, this could well have been "It is finished" as recorded in John's Gospel. The record of "Into your hands I commit my spirit." will fit somewhere inbetween, it is not contradictory. I hope this helps.
@tracyjane221 these are the alleged accounts of the most important human to ever walk the earth. Why then would his own followers wait until decades after his death to bother writing it down? Now, the obvious copying from Mark and embellishing upon Mark, not to mention the theft of tales from disparate myths to help along the fantasticalness, would suggest a much more logical conclusion: this story followed the same evolution of many other messianic characters through history. i.e. it's fake.
@acdelong for its time, 30 to 60 years before the story of Jesus is written down is not a long time. In those days there was a strong tradition of story telling, which was regarded as good evidence while eye witnesses were still around to pass on the stories. Incidentally the life story of Alexander was not written down for 200 years after his death. It may not have been considered important to write these stories down untill some of the eye witnesses started to die for what they believed!
@tracyjane221 nobody is claiming that alexander was the son of god (at least not anymore), there is a much higher burden of proof for those making supernatural claims than there is for those making relatively believable claims. Eye witnesses are notoriously bad at accuracy, which could explain contradictions within the gospels, but the building of myths is just as likely of an excuse especially in light of documented, stolen story components.
@acdelong I agree that eye witnesses don't get every detail correct - in a court of law, if two eye witnesses have got exactly the same account of events they would be regarded as having colluded. Nobody is ever going to be able to prove to you 100 % the claims about Jesus - that's why it's called faith! However there are some very well reasoned arguments for JC being real and being God. If you really are interested I suggest you try Y-Jesus dot com for these they are long but stick with it!
@acdelong Regarding myths it would be very hard to make up a myth on this scale and publish it when there were still so many eye witnesses about to discredit the story. I would be interested to know the details of the alleged stolen story components - because I know there are things documented/published which have not been well researched and are in fact not true!
@tracyjane221 if, as you say, the corollary stories of other myths are a fabrication of "new atheism", then why would the early church had felt it necessary to concoct the argument that the devil is so darn tricky that he time travelled to plant the acts of jesus into earlier pagan myths to discredit his existence? your conspiracy theory isn't holding up.
@acdelong Time travel in the 1st century? Where do these stories come from? Give me some proof ... otherwise this can also be discredited as New Athiest junk!
@tracyjane221 look up justin martyr- early 2nd century church father. Just before richard dawkins founded the first church of new atheism. So with your discrediting aside, I suppose you're prepared to concede the point?
@acdelong To which of Justin's Apologies do you refer, if you give me the chapter I will happily go away and research this, but for the moment I have to say that I think you misread the text.
@tracyjane221 ch 66. in the first apologetic. We know that mithraism existed before christianity, so Justin, by necessity is asserting time travel. you can lead a horse to water I suppose.
@acdelong You take one sentence from Ch 66 and add assumptions to it to make 2+2 = 66. Justin does not claim time travel or anything of the sort. If you look in Ch 54 of the first apology you will see further explanation. He explains his thoughts: that the demons heard the prophecies about Jesus quoted long before Jesus time (and he quotes a passage from Genesis chapter 49 as an example) and used these to make up myths about Jesus so that people would dismiss Jesus story as just marvellous tales
@acdelong Justin Martyr was explaining that the demons were wanting to deceive and lead astray the human race, a problem that we obviously still have today! I suppose it is testament to the prophets that what they said actually came true: that Jesus did come to earth as a human being and did die on that cross to pay for our iniquities. I shall be forever grateful to Him!
@tracyjane221 actually in chapter 66, he's speaking specifically about the eucharist, which wasn't specifically prophesied in christianity, nor was it common practice for jews- who had prohibition against the drinking of blood. However, no such prohibitions existed in other religions, who did have ritual meals of the nature of what would become "the last supper", recorded as early as 8BC... shared wine and all. So what's more likely- son of magic sky dad or copying your neighbors?
@acdelong Now you are claiming that just because the followers of mithras had a special meal where they shared bread and haoma juice or water (for which in the west wine is substituted) and recited incantations that Jesus was copying this? How absurd. The eucharist follows from the passover meal that the Jews had celebrated for centuries at which they ate (funnily enough) unlevened bread and wine. Jesus used these to try to help his followers understand the sacrifice he was about to become.
@tracyjane221 so jesus, a jew, broke with dietary restriction against the consumption of blood, in celebration of passover no less, all on his own accord? this makes more sense to you than the theft of it from a geographically accessible and contemporaneous ritual that had taken place for centuries? And let's not forget- this is one of the myriad instances of similarities in other, older belief systems, which you wholesale dismiss as "new atheist" invention, which you've implicitly conceded.
@acdelong Jesus and his followers were drinking wine not blood! You again misread the scriptures. "This is my blood of the new covenant which is poured out for you for the forgiveness of sins." This is symbolic speech, not intended to be taken literally, the wine represented Jesus blood which would be poured out a few days later when he died on the cross. It represents a new promise from God, a promise of forgiveness for our sins if we are just prepared to say sorry to God for them - Jesus paid
@tracyjane221 now, I didn't misread your scriptures- you've misread me. I know they weren't drinking actual blood, but what would the likelihood of a jew breaking dietary law symbolically be? Where's that line- is he going to pretend to eat bacon wrapped shrimp next? The passover meal is wildly different than a symbolic sacrifice meal, you're asserting that jesus would appropriate a jewish holy day (kind of a biggie too) and engage in symbolic non-kosher eating practices to boot?
@acdelong Quote "The passover meal is wildly different than a symbolic sacrifice meal" ... Don't you know your Jewish history / festivals? The jews SACRIFICED a lamb at the passover meal to symbolise the angel of death passing over their houses during the 10th plague in Egypt! Jesus, to Christians like me, then became the final passover lamb, the final sacrifice, so that death will passover us, and we can have eternal life with him in heaven.
@tracyjane221 and then they drank the blood of the lamb? in Egypt, where I'm sure there is ample evidence of their presence, and firm documentation exists I assume on the Egyptian side of these rapid fire events?
@acdelong On the topic of Jewish laws, you yourself said that he was breaking a Jewish dietary law? First, in context, the Saducees and the Pharisees had created many useless laws and had entirely cluttered the whole situation with rules-that is not what Christianity is at essence. It's not just a bunch of rules. Jesus is angered with the Pharisees and their brethren for using their position to institute themselves in a place of power.
@100000killstreak um, hey dog- you've not finished up the first pot of shit you stirred up, so get back to that, then we can move on- as it stands now however, I'm not even gonna waste the energy to reply to you unless you maintain some respectability and finish what's been required of you first, okay kiddo?
@tracyjane221 no, bullying would be mocking and teasing, it's an unfortunate fact that often god botherers like to hop subject when pressed for evidence of their claims and I'll not abide it. I have the respect for a person's arguments to a degree to directly address them, which is easy when logic, reason and evidence are on your side, and I expect the same in return- if this guy is going to act like a child with ADD, he will be treated as such.
@acdelong This is some info I found in an article on bullying, I think you should read it: “Bullying can be defined in many different ways. - Bullying consists of 3 basic types of abuse: emotional, verbal, and physical. - It can include verbal harassment, or coercion - name calling, verbal or written abuse - and criticizing the victim on the grounds of .. religion - It typically involves subtle methods of coercion such as intimidation. Your post is pretty intimidating & could show more respect!
@tracyjane221 oh yes, so intimidating to require somebody to finish up with an argument point they failed to follow to conclusion. I suppose that within a magic based world view it seems possible to travel physically through the internet and cause harm, but as it stands now, our little friend is still safely tucked behind a computer screen. This form of communique is a two way street, both he and I are engaging one another, I'm just requiring him to stay intellectually honest.
@acdelong it's so hard to say isn't it - that little 5 letter word - to admit you might have done something wrong and say "sorry"! Is that the wall you're facing, it's nothing to do with reason and logic but more to do with facing up to what you've done and admitting you didn't get it all right? Cos if you can't say sorry to another human being it's going to be pretty hard to say sorry to God. But that's all he asks of us, Jesus has already taken the punishment for us we just have to say sorry!
@tracyjane221 is this now the route you're taking? If you're going to talk facts I'll do that with with you, but if you're wanting to turn this into a character inquiry, you can piss up a rope, because I'm respectful of others only when they decide to be disrespectful, like when somebody wants to make claims and engage in debate/polemic, but then starts losing so they change the subject. It's disrespectful to me, logic, themselves, and the alleged god that allegedly made us. I'll not abide it.
@acdelong I'm sorry, I overstepped the mark - it hurt at least a little didn't it! I still maintain that your comments were bullying, designed to hurt the recipient (it doesn't have to be physical!)
I am however not going to continue this conversation at the moment, not because I've lost - I have lost nothing, I still have my faith, it brings me joy, hope and peace beyond anything that you could possibly understand without it.
@tracyjane221 umm, no, it didn't hurt- because I'm capable of separating ideas from my identity. My comments were not, in fact designed to hurt- they were designed to convey the message of a stern warning that if one isn't willing to engage in a cohesive and honest way, then one should not do the disservice to their argument. I didn't insult anyone. go ahead and read the comment- condescending, yes- insulting, no. You need to grow some thicker skin if you want to sit at the grown up table.
@tracyjane221 Don't pretend that you know what I do and don't understand- it's presumptuous and unseemly. I was once where you are, I was a bible believing christian- but then I followed the command of I peter 3:15 and when proceeding with the honesty that the bible also commands, I was forced to deal with the fact that the bible contains no wisdom that other religions don't contain and that all the supernatural claims are unsubstantiated. Then, I found joy, hope and peace in reason and honesty
@acdelong I also do not believe that God asked us to win arguments, just to sow seeds, I feel that I'm throwing too much seed on the path and I need to go and find some more fertile soil.
This conversation is also making me into something I'm not (not helped by 4 sleepless nights with a poorly child).
One day I hope and pray that you will find a bit more respect to treat others with even when they decide to end a conversation & a more open mindset with which to approach the question of faith.
@tracyjane221 no situation is capable of making us something we're not, it can simply lay bare what we truly are. I have opened my mind, that's how I got here- and away from magic and miracles. faith is not a "question" it is chosen and equivocated blindness. You will get through the sleepless nights. to be honest- I now yearn for my daughter to need comforting at night, and when she does occasionally- nothing can make me feel more fortunate or important than rocking her back to sleep.
@acdelong And even if this was an actual rule, God later commands that it is ok to eat those sorts of foods-he had it in mind all along, and Jesus came to set a new foundation, as the old one had become corrupted.
@acdelong You say that Jesus came and broke Jewish law by symbolically sacrificing himself to the 12 disciples before he literally sacrificed himself for all mankind. Am I interpreting that correctly? He isn't commanding cannibalism, he is foreshadowing his death, and creating a symbol for humans, much like when God created the Rainbow after the great flood, to constantly remind people of God's mercy. Communion is a reminder of God's sacrifice.
@tracyjane221 I'm not saying that you concede the point on the copying of rituals, I'm pointing out that you argued that the argument of ritual copying was predicated by "new atheists", which you've implicitly conceded in your addressing of justin's apologetic- If the "new atheists" hadn't invented the argument yet, what would be the use of the apologetic? That was the whole damn point of bringing up his explanation in the first place, and you've not addressed that fact.
@acdelong - I said the "New Athiests" are "putting around" these lies - I never suggested that they invented all of them! It seems perhaps that some of these suggestions were made in Justin's time and they are being copied again now. NO point conceded.
@acdelong I have favourited a video by Gary Habermas called Are the gospels too late to be considered good history? He is an expert in this field. Yes I agree that some information for the other gospels may have been taken from Mark but I think that you may be being misled about theft of tales from other myths to help the story along. These stories are being put around by the New Athiests etc to discredit the bible but they have no truth about them as this series of videos shows.
Mike Licona, Osiris was resurrected way before Jesus. This is talked about in the Pyramid Texts:
Pyramid Texts Utterance 667
1941b "Oh Horus, this hour of the morning, of this ---THIRD DAY ----, is come, when thou surely passet on to heaven, together with the stars, the imperishable star"
Utterance 556
1382f "this hour of the ---THIRD DAY--- comes, where the father Osiris will be reborn as horus, at the place where the gods are born..."
While why do the Christians keep all the holy books locked up behind cages and try to keep everything a secret everything is kept hush hush I'm glad somebody is asking question.
Shabir Ally destroyed him. Christianity is not pagan-inspired. However, it teaches contradicting concepts, has corrupted texts, and blasphemes the original Abrahamic teachings. The Jesus Christ that Christians worship, is not Yeshua ben Yosef, the Prophet born of the virgin Mary. The trinity is a false doctrine, and Christianity has been spread in barbaric ways. Deceiving its followers in order to maintain them. If you truly read the Bible, you won't be Christian for long.
@deviIstudios Yes, Christianity is a pagan concept, the word pagan = gentile. The word that Jews used for non Jews = Gentile. Therefore, Christians = Pagans.
@changingmyself So a mere term is used in equating doctrines and dogmas as corresponding with "paganism". You need to rework your logic there buddy. I know many Christians who aren't pagans. Atheists are the biggest "Pagans" and filth on this planet. Worshiping worthless currency and meaningless objects, makes me sick.
@deviIstudios No, it isn't the mere use of the term. It is the fact that to the Jews Gentiles= Pagans. Look up the Etymology of the word Pagan. It means FROM THE COUNTRY. IT doesn't mean devil worshippers. What is sad is that Christians use this term the same way racists use the term nigger.
@changingmyself I never claimed that it meant devil worshipers. "The origins of the modern English word "pagan" come from the Latin paganus, an adjective originally meaning "rural", "rustic" or "of the countryside." (Pagan", Encyclopedia Britannica 11th Edition, 1911, Jones and Pennick 1995. p. 01.) The term is unimportant. Anyone who displays excessive affection or worship towards anything conceivable is a pagan in my book. That's all you need to know. This includes Christians.
@deviIstudios So, all atheists are "from the country" because Atheists do not worship or display affection towards anything, so Atheists cannot be Pagans.
You said above, "Christianity is not pagan-inspired" then you turn around and say:
Anyone who displays excessive affection or worship towards anything conceivable is a pagan in my book. That's all you need to know. This includes Christians."
Evidence shows that Christianity IS pagan inspired.
@changingmyself Wow, you missed the main point. "IN MY BOOK". That is obviously my own opinion and not a universal definition. Learn how to read. I could give a fuck about whether or not Christianity was Pagan inspired. All I know is that it is in a terribly corrupted state. I
@deviIstudios WOW, maybe you missed the point, you do not get to create definitions of words,"in my book". What you said means absolutely nothing, why would I care to read what some idiot over the internet thinks if they are not going to go by standard definitions? We have a dictionary for a reason.
@changingmyself What hypocrisy, you were essentially creating your own definition that deviated from what is commonly accepted. Rather than label people as Pagans for their identity, I do it for their actions. You're an idiot for making such a big deal out of an irrelevant subject. We have brains for a reason...
@deviIstudios Using Etyomology isn't making up my own definition and neither is the Pagan = Gentile comparison because that TOO is etymology. I do not lable people PAGANS but YOU DID and I was attempting to get YOU to see that it is a DERAGATORY term. You are a fool for acting as if you are better than anyone else. THAT is hypocrisy. Because YOUR NOT.
@changingmyself Wow, you're arguing the etymology of a word yet you can't even use "you're" in the correct context. Is labeling people worse than labeling an entire theology followed by billions?
"Christianity is a pagan concept"
I could care less about how offensive you think the word "Pagan" is if you can hardly decide what it means. You also need to work on your comprehension. Did you misinterpret the word "essentially"? Or do you need the etymology for that term as well? Fucking idiot.
@deviIstudios WOW, an ad hominem, go figure. The oldest Christians artifact shows that Christianity is pagan. Did you miss the fact that Christians are pagans because the Jewish word for Christians is the word Gentile and Gentile means Pagan? You can gloss over facts all you want, but YOU do not get to make up the definitions of words, THAT IS WHY we have a dictionary. If you want to speak your own language, that is fine, but don't talk to me if you don't know what you are talking about.
@changingmyself That explains the origins of a term but does not negate the fact that it refers to someone who is NOT part of an Abrahamic belief (ie CHRISTIANITY) or one that is polytheistic. I challenge you to look up the word "pagan" in a dictionary and tell me what the most common definition is.
1. one of a people or community observing a polytheistic religion, as the ancient Romans and Greeks
2. a person who is not a Christian, Jew, or Muslim
@deviIstudios Christianity was NOT part of the Abrahamic belief in the first century, thus WHY they were called GENTILES by the Jews. Jews considered themselves the ONLY Abrahamic belief. The CHRISTIANS are the ones that changed the word to include themselves when they joined THEIR god, with the OT god. There were many people that were against that. The Gnostics considered the OT god to be a demiurge.
Why are you behaving so rudely and why don't you take your OWN advice?
@changingmyself I am referring to the term as it is presented in the dictionary, not how it once was used. You are wasting my time with something I honestly don't give a shit about. I know enough about Christian theology to call bullshit without a doubt. I agree that they combined Jesus into being YHWH of the OT. It's a shame really, a bad attempt as well. Too many holes and errors to succeed. The best way to keep followers is to have them practice blind faith.
@deviIstudios I would think it would be common sense that we cannot use the definition of the word Pagan as it is now to describe events that happened 1700-2000 years ago.
As you said, it was a very bad attempt, as is the whole "trinity" which in essense makes Christianity the definition of the word Pagan as we have it today.
You can tie a fish to a dog with a piece of thread, but that doesn't mean the fish is the son of the dog. lol
Shabir Ally destroyed him. Christianity is not pagan-inspired. However, it teaches contradicting concepts, has corrupted texts, and blasphemes the original Abrahamic teachings. The Jesus Christ that Christians worship, is not Yeshua ben Yosef, the Prophet born of the virgin Mary. The trinity is a false doctrine, and Christianity has been spread in barbaric ways. Deceiving its followers in order to maintain them. If you truly read the Bible, you won't be Christian for long.
i must admit i completely bought zeitgeist's part one, but could not find any sources for their information during my research. however, this film answered all my questions and the director's meticulousness is commendable. thank you for your hard work and comprehensive evidence. if i could i'd apologize for all the zeitgeist fanatics. bias is a problem on both sides of the argument, but works like this will at least convince people that value LOGIC and EVIDENCE over personal interests
hahaha look at all the disbelievers of this video. There is PROOF of the zeitgeist lie right in front of your face yet you continue to deny. You're just as mindless as the sheeple whos going to get his mercury vaccine right now. you have 'woken up'... now WAKE UP AGAIN!
@5starGeneral79 Zeitgeist [( tseyt -geyst, zeyt -geyst)] The general moral, intellectual, and cultural climate of an era; Zeitgeist is German for “time-spirit.” For example, the Zeitgeist of England in the Victorian period included a belief in industrial progress, and the Zeitgeist of the 1980s in the United States was a belief in the power of money and the many ways in which to spend it.
The way I see it... Zeitgeist movement wants whats best for all Men, Women and Children. A better system with no need for Jobs, Children will get better Education, everyone is truely free and Equal... If something like this can come true... why would any normal Rational Human being go against something so wonderful?
I wish these people trying to prove zeitghiest wrong were going to be around when the world finally sees the day zeitghiest talks of. The day when we are able to look back at people defending religion and laugh because they were so blinded and brain washed to buy into a system that is so corupt and horribly fake. I wonder what these people would do the day we are able to prove to them how wrongly manipulated they have been.
oh great, so you watched zeitgeist and basically wrote a BS video that is a mere petty come back to the video's critique of religion. it doesn't actually attack faith at any point it attacks the way that religion controls us now, and is used to take money from us whilst crushing independent thought. although its obviously not correct in all its information there is enough in the film to show any forward thinking human being that shit is wrong, bad, evil and needs to change seriously.
@crunchmatch first off i don't see how you can call this video bs unless you didn't watch it. the director cites all his sources and scholars, and quotes them word for word, compared to zeitgeist which does neither and creates facts out of thin air. you should really consider researching some of the claims that zeitgeist made, and where these claims came from. i totally bought part one of zeitgeist until i did some research, and then that whole section fell apart.
@crunchmatch second, zeitgeist uses the claim that christianity is a rehashing of pagan religions as a basis that it was created for the purpose of manipulation. those claims about the rehashing are completely false, as proven here. however, the negative effects of christianity are another topic all together, and i nor the creator of this video dispute that. on a similar note, the misleading tactics of the zeitgeist creators should spark some questions about their underlying motives as well..
If you're trying to debunk or disprove someone's work and then you go and make a video that starts off with an indirect insult at your opponent, then you've just lost a ton of credibility.
@karozans I agree but majority of everything that was claimed in the zeitgeist part one lacks credibility example every savior was born of a virgin, n this is one of the few n rarest times where I agree wit Christian that this movie has false information n claims
zeitgeist has its agenda its trying to feed you and this video has its agenda too. You can't believe either but should just do your own research and believe what you want. Thats it.
The fact stays the same....we need more Love & Compassion to fix what is seriously wrong in this world and it has nothing to do with religion, it has to do with taking care of each other, not allowing people to starve the way they do, loosing their homes & jobs the way they do because of some sad 13 people that are heartless and sitting on top of the world cashing in on everything and allowing the rest to be enslaved and die in the worst imaginable ways right now all over the world.
thank "God" that christien numbers are indecline, due partly to the fact that people are waking up and getting smarter. anyone that refers to a book rewritten by oppressors and kiddy fiddlers as there evidence to refute proven scientific claims.
I have grown up in christian catholic familes and schools. The catholic rituals are straight from pagan rituals and so are the holidays.. wtf.. Jesus' life can only be accounted for up to and just short period after his birth...what happened to the other 30 years? Why is that when it comes to jesus, what must simply believe mans interpretation to be real without any investigation... we must simply have faith that we aren't being lied to.. I'd say most of the Zeitgeist info re-searchable..
So the first 2 minutes, this guys says a book is useless unless it can be taken at face value, and believed to be correct without looking into the subject yourself..
The ancient alien theory can actually make a logical conclusion to why all these religions are similar, because they were not by God but "flying men" or extraterrestrials who came and told them the way. Sadly I believe this idea more than half the religions on earth.
@GenerationEpic90 true, but finding a good Internet source for reliable info about zeitgeist are usually zeitgeist influence. Nothing credible could be really found except the thousands of page titles say Horus n Jesus are the same. All because of these groups calling themselves the zeitgeist movement watering down information, which later becomes true due to the majority making it true which the issue for isreal Bissel/Paul revere comes into play
@LetsLay11 I agree but just to clear up a misunderstanding, the more likely time that Jesus was supposably born was around October September given the events n clues given for the time of the birth
People have to stop going to extremes and being reactionaries! Just because some of the things people believe about Jesus were already in existence before he was born doesn't mean that there wasn't an actual person fitting his description who walked and talked and existed on Earth!
People have to stop going to extremes and being reactionaries! Just because some of the things people believe about Jesus were already in existence before he was born doesn't mean that there wasn't an actual person fitting his description who walked and talked and existed on Earth!
Look up:"Truth about Holidays" posted by dawathm Khalid Yasin "Is Jesus God?", Top 10 Reasons Why Jesus is Not God and Khalid Yasin"The crucifixtion" These are clear, unbiased explanations of the topic that I urge you to view.
The book The World's 16 Crucified Saviors was put out by the ATHEIST press. A more credible sourse for their stories is Jesus Prophet of Islam by Muhammad Ata 'ur-Rahim & Ahmad Thompson, which gives an unslanted and more correct view of Jesus, Arius, Donatus, Lucien and many of the other people mentioned in the book! Further, the book seperates Jesus (the man who actually lived) from "Christ" (the myth - the person people made him out to be) and the research is incredible!
i used to beLIEve in god, but now its getting harder and harder with the bible being used in ways that rape the image of a beautiful man and the things he did, the fact that there are contradictions in both sides is the only refuted proof. thats all. both show no sign of ABSOLUTE truth, without opinion stired in somewhere, the funny thing is, you seem to be more malicious about your side. as christians i figured you would allow a bit of ignorence since that is you recruitment tool.
From the very beginning I can see this is biased and dishonest. I went to a theological school, and I can tell you that even some of the Christian scholars acknowledge that scriptures have been influenced by the mystery religions. For one, study Bishop John Spong. Also, the stories of pagan gods raising from the dead do, in fact, predate Christianity. Research Horus and Krishna to start. Study and think for yourselves, people. No need to be sheep forever.
Notice 99% of people here that don't agree simply attack this with words.( Dumb, Stupid, Foolish) How about some facts to back up your position. People are being lead by their emotions rather then whats real.
How are you guys gonna hate on this guy, just because he is defending his own religion? True, it may not be the point of the Zeitgeist, but it is a part of it...if you thought Christians were gonna let it slander their religion with false facts, and then not respond...wow, just wow.
@xJOExFOxSHOx But whether or not the section on religion is credible isn't important. I'll give you one fact that any educated person would deem indisputable: Religion cannot solve social or economic problems and is therefore socially and economically irrelevant. Religion is based upon faith not facts. It's a self validating paradigm. Religion is governed by its own logic and answers to no higher authority. It disourages its members to educate themselves beyond the limits of its doctrine.
@cleryt1 I would argue that it very much is NOT irrelevant, and can solve many of our problems. Most of what you just said is complete BS. "It discourages members to educate themselves beyond the limits of its doctrine."...what? Where have you ever seen this? Religion brings people together, forms communities. But I guess thats pointless and stupid too, huh? Oh, and fyi, a lot of science(aka YOUR religion) is based on faith.
@xJOExFOxSHOx Doesn't dogmatic religion claim to be the ultimate authority? If your religion has all the answers about human origin then why look any further. What motivation is there to discover and learn and grow if all the answers reside in this one silly book that was written by a man. Religion Brings people together?? Broaden your perspective a little brother. Think about all the killing that has been done in the name of religion. One groups fairy tales are more right than another groups?
@xJOExFOxSHOx You say science is my religion? Science in fundamentally different than any religion in that it acknowledges the difference between fact and theory. And it's theories are open to being disproven. One scientist could come up with some theory on how something works, then another scientist could conduct experiments that disprove that theory, then another scientist could debase that scientists experiments. Science is a constant work in progress. It is the pursuit of knowledge.
@xJOExFOxSHOx Dogmatic religion, however, answers only to its own dogma. It has no validity outside of itself. Religious groups battle it out over who's fairy tales are right and who's fairy tales are just plain silly nonsense. When if you look at the core infrastructure of any dogmatic religion it is based ENTIRELY on faith. Its members strongly assert their beliefs to be true without any sort of credible evidence. Do you think that is a healthy mentality?
@cleryt1 If you are trying to argue that there is no evidence for the validity of Christianity, then you are clearly misinformed or ignorant. But even if there wasn't, how does that detract from society? How does believing in something affect anyone else? What is the agenda of this video? It only provides false facts, attacking the Christian faith. And the church in no way discourages its members from believing in science. You have a false stereotype stuck in your head. Is that healthy?
@xJOExFOxSHOx If you could send me some links to some credible information that proves the earth is only 6000 years old as the bible says I would love to see that. How do you explain dinosaur bones? If you tell me that God put them there to test your faith then this debate is over for I cannot argue with insanity. Maybe the church doesn't discourage believing in science, but many of the stories of the bible conflict with science. and the bible is the ultimate authority to any "good christian".
@xJOExFOxSHOx I'm not very fond of the part on religion in zeitgeist 1 attempting to debase the christian faith. I agree with the reason they want to do away with religion, but I don't feel their methodology was effective. You are right in that simply believing in religion doesn't effect others, but each religion claims that its god is the only true god. Ever heard of the Crusades? The thirty years war? The reconquista? and people are still to this day killing each other over religious conflict.
@xJOExFOxSHOx I just don't really understand how you can truly believe that religion "brings people together" as you said in your previous post. I have to assume that you just aren't aware of all the death and horror that humans have inflicted and are still inflicting on each other in the name of god. Humanity's rate of progression would increase exponentially if we scrap our silly superstitions and focus on studying science and nature.
@cleryt1 I don't get why you think just because you're affiliated with a religion means you reject science...like I said earlier, that's a silly and misconstrued stereotype, and you really need to get over it. Your logic doesn't make sense...if we give up religion, our progression would increase? How did you connect those two? You realize that most scientists/doctors believe in a higher power....
Actually, Jesus did not come for religion.
daVCalpito 4 days ago
Christianity is nothing more than an instrument of political control that keeps the masses enslaved to ignorance. It's all about certainty.
bigpecker251 5 days ago
@RobDeManc Zeitgeist is trying to dupe us into thinking that Christianity is just a copy of previous pagan religions. Yes people have been worshipping God and other gods since the beginning of humanity, including the sun god, it's all there in the Bible! That does not mean that Christianity is a fake. If you are going to try to prove a point, you have to get your facts right .... and Zeitgeist gets them wrong on so many fronts. Don't be tricked by Zeitgeist!
tracyjane221 3 weeks ago 2
Jesus would not have wanted this world where billions of people die from hunger as we all sit here arguing about whether Jesus existed. get up from your computer. free your mind help the world for the love of human kind and the planet. please wake up
ducksbumhole 1 month ago 3
This just shows insecurity. If they were so confident that Zeitgeist is wrong why bother answering it?
RobDeManc 1 month ago
@RobDeManc People are being misled by the rubbish that is Zeitgiest - that is why this video has been made and published, it's not insecurity on our part it's to help people understand the truth.
tracyjane221 3 weeks ago
@tracyjane221 No. People have been misled by religion for thousands of years. Zeitgiest has just tried to show that, and they've done an admirable job of it.
RobDeManc 3 weeks ago
@RobDeManc an admirable job? sorry?? to say that, you clearly haven't watched the videos properly!!! Mistake No 1 Jesus wasn't born on 25th december so the "fact" that these other gods possibly were is irrelevant, Mistake No 2, there were not 3 magi, we don't know how many there were, there could have been 2 or 4 or 5... the Bible doesn't say so again the links to this are irrelevant.
tracyjane221 3 weeks ago
@tracyjane221 You are taking it too literally. Zeitgeist is trying to show the roots of religious or god like thinking. That it all stems from our ancestors beliefs in the sun as the giver of life, the light of the world etc. The bible may not say when Jesus was born, but the romans replaced their own Dec 25th "sol invictus" celebration, meaning the "unconquered sun" with the birth of jesus. We have been duped. Horus was said to have been reborn each day with the rising sun.
RobDeManc 3 weeks ago
@RobDeManc And as to claims of pagan gods rising from the dead, have a look at the video "Did Jesus Rise from the Dead (Debate)" uploaded by toddtyszka. in this debate Tim Callahan is trying to argue for these stories of pagan gods rising from the dead and he just cannot produce any evidence ... that's because there isn't any! The resurrection stories for these pagan gods all post date Jesus' crucifiction and resurrection. (The video is on my favourites!)
tracyjane221 3 weeks ago
@tracyjane221 Various cultures have celebrated the winter solstice for much longer than christianity, and it is said to be a time of death and rebirth. The ancients had to observe the sunrise for 3 consecutive days before they knew the solstice had passed and the sun was risen again.
RobDeManc 3 weeks ago
don't argue! Just watch, think and show zeitgeist 1,2,3 films to everybody:)
burzhui1985 1 month ago
Gods do not exist. All religions were created by humans. We live on a planet in space with an infinite amount of planets in every direction. There is life on other planets with similar compositions to our planet. After our star dies, and all of its surrounding planets die, new planets will form that will most likely NOT be able to sustain life. Many humans use religions to give themselves a system for ethics and morals and they should not be taken literally.
SillyTickles 1 month ago
@SillyTickles Come To My Channel For Proof
ParaPsyopticNerve 1 month ago in playlist More videos from ZeitgeistDebunked
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SillyTickles 1 month ago
who the f*** cares either way? even if one side of the debate WAS right... IT DOESNT MATTER! because in the end, we are all humans! united we stand divided we fall. WTF people, get over yourselves. if you die, the world keeps going...
awolikesguitars 1 month ago
I was honestly shocked by the story of Lazarus, when it is said that even if the dead were to return and tell them, they would still not believe the truth. But sadly, here we are, in 2011, and even after the disproving done against part 1 of Zeitgeist, people only became angrier in their defense for it... And they say it takes great faith to be CHRISTIAN?! hmm...
TheRealChikezie 2 months ago
5:50 Prince of Persia - Sands of Time For The Win. Yeah!!!
giorgiv18 2 months ago
Jesus story is fabricated from there stories, that's why it's a story not baste on fact even the church changed the story.. and do you mean to say we celebrate Christmas on the wrong day and the churches let us do it.... whats it like to be brain washed. and a damned rainbow is thing that happened since time began.
wilo1st 2 months ago
@wilo1st Oh dear .. people do get so hung up on minor detail! No one knows the exact date that Jesus was born or even the exact year. He probably was not born on December 25 and not in the year 1AD either. These dates were set about 3 centuries later, chosen as a festival to celebrate Jesus' birth. The Gospels were not interested in His date of birth particularly .. more in the reasons for His birth.
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@wilo1st Jesus story is not fabricated, there is plenty of evidence that he was a real human being from contemporary secular sources as well as the Christian and Jewish ones. If you are so sure it is fabricated then please give us the proof.
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@wilo1st Adding to Tracy, Christmas was a originally a pagan holiday-when Christianity was spread to the barbarian tribes, as well as other pagans, but mostly the barbarians, the missionaries, to make it easier, told them that they were celebrating the wrong things on these days, and told them more Godly things to celebrate, and December 25 became Christmas. I'm not endorsing this, but, it happened, so now we celebrate Jesus's birth then.
100000killstreak 2 months ago
Jesus story is fabricated from there stories, that's why it's a story not baste on fact even the church changed the story.. and do you mean to say we celebrate Christmas on the wrong day and the churches let us do it....
wilo1st 2 months ago
It is pretty sad that a whore who was afraid to admit to her husband to be that she loved the dick spawned an entire religious belief.
m80kamikaze 2 months ago
these "debunk" videos are put out by the NWO
cheapcape 2 months ago
I watched this whole movie and the most important things we should be talking about are: The Mark of the Beast/NWO/13 families AND how do we know that Jesus is with us now?
anythingnew 3 months ago
Zeitgeist is so dishonest it is mostly revealing of Peter Joseph. Truly zeitgeist is a portrait of a young arrogant man who knows his gifts include his slickness, charisma and he is basically telling you, I'm going to trash talk you but I'm so cool it doesn't matter. When I first saw ZG I was upset, then I started researching. I quickly found how much was outright lies.
cmottes 3 months ago
Zeitgeist didn't say there was no Jesus at all. The devil is in the details people. Religion is amazing, but must be re-examined to include and remember a real connection between man, nature and GOD-- which fundamentally means getting rid of the term nature all-together by declaring that HUMANS ARE NOT SEPARATE FROM GOD AND NATURE. The Holy Spirit is a connective web of spirit. The only grievance we have is that in Christianity there are mixed messages about man being separate or AS ONE.
Deftreaktor 3 months ago
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Deftreaktor 3 months ago
"it is true that accounts of pagen gods arrose from the dead, however none of these pre-date christianity"
Are you retarded? THEY ALL PRE-DATE CHRISTIANITY
SillyTickles 3 months ago 2
@SillyTickles However, the Bible accurately foretold His death, and his resurrection, thousands of years before the actual event.
100000killstreak 2 months ago
@100000killstrea Translation: A book composed of astrological stories (that was not the first of many similar books) accurately described the sun passing at its lowest point of the year, three days later it starts passing higher in the sky, thousands of years before ending the age of aries and beginning the age of pisces.
SillyTickles 2 months ago
@SillyTickles ahhh but you must agree that stars are predictable-you can use math to determine where they will go and where they have been-this is what the 'wise men' did. Babylonians were famous for it, and Egyptians had a knack for it as well.
100000killstreak 2 months ago
@SillyTickles Retard, the gods do but the data doesn't. The EVIDENCE of the gods supposedly rising is post-Christian as they adopted the popular teachings of the new Christian faith. LEARN TO LISTEN SINCE THAT IS CLEARLY SAID RIGHT IN THE SECTION OF THE FILM YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT. And shame on the morons who thumbed up your ignorant comment too.
KeithTruth 2 months ago
@SillyTickles Wow... thank you for "sourcelessly" refuting that statement. I was almost convinced that sources mean anything.... whew, that was a close one.
TheRealChikezie 2 months ago
@SillyTickles He didn't say those pagan gods didn't predate Christianity. He says claims they did rise from the dead came after Jesus.
clairelesley1983 2 months ago 3
Just because Zeitgeist is bullshit, that doesn't mean that the historical Jesus existed. What compelling evidence is there of the existence of the historical Jesus?
illuzion30 3 months ago
@illuzion30 According to this movie, they say that there are about 20-200 writings about Jesus from other people and that there are only 2 documents on Emperor Titus or somebody named Titus. Titus is accepted to be a real historical figure but Jesus is not, yet there is more record for Jesus than Titus.
(Could be wrong, I might need to watch that part again)
anythingnew 3 months ago
@anythingnew There are 19 pagan writers who wrote about Jesus.Including 26 books of the new testament.He is pretty existent.Also Jewish Talmud wrote on him,and Gnostic gospels too.Believe that.
MrUrosSrb 3 months ago
@MrUrosSrb there you go citing highly criticized study as fact again! you gonna keep running away from debate or just wander like the jews allegedly did making assertions you're unprepared to back up? eunuch.
acdelong 3 months ago
@acdelong I just want to know.Why do you follow me on every video?What have i done to you?Do you have no life and spent your whole days on youtube trying to prove Jesus is not real?Cant u do something better with your life then attacking something that you say doesnt even exist.Go outside with friends,play ball,hang out with someone or something.This is a friendly advice.
MrUrosSrb 3 months ago
@MrUrosSrb why, no- It's just you, my helpless little martyr! you're my project! you tried to make some claims against something I said, and then refused to offer any evidence for those claims. Now, don't be silly, it would be impossible to prove jesus DIDN'T exist, but that's not my responsibility, it's yours, given your claims. What were his last words again? your contradictory book has at least three versions of them, so answer the question.
acdelong 3 months ago
@acdelong Pathetic...really...I have no words.'You are my little project''...really sad...
MrUrosSrb 3 months ago
@MrUrosSrb good answer! way to yet again dodge the fact that your magic book is rife with contradictions!
acdelong 3 months ago
@MrUrosSrb truly pathetic, I would argue is trolling around the internet spouting assertions that you have no intention whatsoever of providing evidence for. Pathetic in my opinion would be clamming up and refusing to see the illogic in your assertions when when challenged, yet going elsewhere to parrot those self-same assertions, knowing that you're in point of fact simply telling ghost stories, but claiming them to be true. Pathetic is being intellectually dishonest despite your book's rules.
acdelong 3 months ago
@acdelong You say that the Bible is full of contradictions, I believe that it is not. Taking the accounts of Jesus death that you mention and his "last words" in the four gospels, then it would be quite true to say that four different people writing different accounts of an event would edit their stories in different ways to suit what they felt was important. The gospels record a conversation that took place over a period of time and all of those quotes can fit into that timescale.
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@tracyjane221 I agree with you that the statements made by Jesus are not necessarilly contradictory.I just would wonder what you think of the different times that the gospels have the last supper occuring. In Marks gospel he has the last supper being a passover meal whereas John has it on the day of preparation of the passover. It's obvious John is placing it then for theoligical reasons, but surely this has to impeach its historical reliability when each author is adapting the story to suit.
schefedog 2 months ago
@schefedog You have obviously done your homework on this but - one day last week my son fell off his bike - he really doesn't do this very often, else he wouldn't get back on but - can I really remember which day it was? I know the passover and the last supper are far more important days in history but do we really need to get so hung up on such small details. This was Jesus last chance to have a meal with his closest friends and to encourage them ahead of the terrible days that would follow.
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@schefedog There are many theories as to why St John apparently records this event on a different date to the synoptic gospels, too many to discuss here. I am also not a theologian, just a (well educated) but ordinary Christian. I accept that some of these things I will never understand in my lifetime, but that does not stop me from putting my trust in Jesus. He died for a very good reason - because I mess up - & nothing can pay for my sin better than his death. I pray that u see that too!
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@acdelong The last recorded words in each of the gospels are not claimed to be the actual last words of Jesus. In Matthew and Mark it says that after Jesus said "My God, My God, why have you forsaken me?" he then cried out again in a loud voice but it doesn't record what he actually cried out, this could well have been "It is finished" as recorded in John's Gospel. The record of "Into your hands I commit my spirit." will fit somewhere inbetween, it is not contradictory. I hope this helps.
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@tracyjane221 these are the alleged accounts of the most important human to ever walk the earth. Why then would his own followers wait until decades after his death to bother writing it down? Now, the obvious copying from Mark and embellishing upon Mark, not to mention the theft of tales from disparate myths to help along the fantasticalness, would suggest a much more logical conclusion: this story followed the same evolution of many other messianic characters through history. i.e. it's fake.
acdelong 2 months ago
@acdelong for its time, 30 to 60 years before the story of Jesus is written down is not a long time. In those days there was a strong tradition of story telling, which was regarded as good evidence while eye witnesses were still around to pass on the stories. Incidentally the life story of Alexander was not written down for 200 years after his death. It may not have been considered important to write these stories down untill some of the eye witnesses started to die for what they believed!
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@tracyjane221 nobody is claiming that alexander was the son of god (at least not anymore), there is a much higher burden of proof for those making supernatural claims than there is for those making relatively believable claims. Eye witnesses are notoriously bad at accuracy, which could explain contradictions within the gospels, but the building of myths is just as likely of an excuse especially in light of documented, stolen story components.
acdelong 2 months ago
@acdelong I agree that eye witnesses don't get every detail correct - in a court of law, if two eye witnesses have got exactly the same account of events they would be regarded as having colluded. Nobody is ever going to be able to prove to you 100 % the claims about Jesus - that's why it's called faith! However there are some very well reasoned arguments for JC being real and being God. If you really are interested I suggest you try Y-Jesus dot com for these they are long but stick with it!
tracyjane221 2 months ago 2
@acdelong Regarding myths it would be very hard to make up a myth on this scale and publish it when there were still so many eye witnesses about to discredit the story. I would be interested to know the details of the alleged stolen story components - because I know there are things documented/published which have not been well researched and are in fact not true!
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@acdelong PS I mean what I say about faith in the nicest possible way! It's not intended to cause offence.
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@tracyjane221 if, as you say, the corollary stories of other myths are a fabrication of "new atheism", then why would the early church had felt it necessary to concoct the argument that the devil is so darn tricky that he time travelled to plant the acts of jesus into earlier pagan myths to discredit his existence? your conspiracy theory isn't holding up.
acdelong 2 months ago
@acdelong Time travel in the 1st century? Where do these stories come from? Give me some proof ... otherwise this can also be discredited as New Athiest junk!
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@tracyjane221 look up justin martyr- early 2nd century church father. Just before richard dawkins founded the first church of new atheism. So with your discrediting aside, I suppose you're prepared to concede the point?
acdelong 2 months ago
@acdelong To which of Justin's Apologies do you refer, if you give me the chapter I will happily go away and research this, but for the moment I have to say that I think you misread the text.
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@tracyjane221 ch 66. in the first apologetic. We know that mithraism existed before christianity, so Justin, by necessity is asserting time travel. you can lead a horse to water I suppose.
acdelong 2 months ago
@acdelong You take one sentence from Ch 66 and add assumptions to it to make 2+2 = 66. Justin does not claim time travel or anything of the sort. If you look in Ch 54 of the first apology you will see further explanation. He explains his thoughts: that the demons heard the prophecies about Jesus quoted long before Jesus time (and he quotes a passage from Genesis chapter 49 as an example) and used these to make up myths about Jesus so that people would dismiss Jesus story as just marvellous tales
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@acdelong Justin Martyr was explaining that the demons were wanting to deceive and lead astray the human race, a problem that we obviously still have today! I suppose it is testament to the prophets that what they said actually came true: that Jesus did come to earth as a human being and did die on that cross to pay for our iniquities. I shall be forever grateful to Him!
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@tracyjane221 actually in chapter 66, he's speaking specifically about the eucharist, which wasn't specifically prophesied in christianity, nor was it common practice for jews- who had prohibition against the drinking of blood. However, no such prohibitions existed in other religions, who did have ritual meals of the nature of what would become "the last supper", recorded as early as 8BC... shared wine and all. So what's more likely- son of magic sky dad or copying your neighbors?
acdelong 2 months ago
@acdelong Now you are claiming that just because the followers of mithras had a special meal where they shared bread and haoma juice or water (for which in the west wine is substituted) and recited incantations that Jesus was copying this? How absurd. The eucharist follows from the passover meal that the Jews had celebrated for centuries at which they ate (funnily enough) unlevened bread and wine. Jesus used these to try to help his followers understand the sacrifice he was about to become.
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@tracyjane221 so jesus, a jew, broke with dietary restriction against the consumption of blood, in celebration of passover no less, all on his own accord? this makes more sense to you than the theft of it from a geographically accessible and contemporaneous ritual that had taken place for centuries? And let's not forget- this is one of the myriad instances of similarities in other, older belief systems, which you wholesale dismiss as "new atheist" invention, which you've implicitly conceded.
acdelong 2 months ago
@acdelong Jesus and his followers were drinking wine not blood! You again misread the scriptures. "This is my blood of the new covenant which is poured out for you for the forgiveness of sins." This is symbolic speech, not intended to be taken literally, the wine represented Jesus blood which would be poured out a few days later when he died on the cross. It represents a new promise from God, a promise of forgiveness for our sins if we are just prepared to say sorry to God for them - Jesus paid
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@tracyjane221 now, I didn't misread your scriptures- you've misread me. I know they weren't drinking actual blood, but what would the likelihood of a jew breaking dietary law symbolically be? Where's that line- is he going to pretend to eat bacon wrapped shrimp next? The passover meal is wildly different than a symbolic sacrifice meal, you're asserting that jesus would appropriate a jewish holy day (kind of a biggie too) and engage in symbolic non-kosher eating practices to boot?
acdelong 2 months ago
@acdelong Quote "The passover meal is wildly different than a symbolic sacrifice meal" ... Don't you know your Jewish history / festivals? The jews SACRIFICED a lamb at the passover meal to symbolise the angel of death passing over their houses during the 10th plague in Egypt! Jesus, to Christians like me, then became the final passover lamb, the final sacrifice, so that death will passover us, and we can have eternal life with him in heaven.
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@tracyjane221 and then they drank the blood of the lamb? in Egypt, where I'm sure there is ample evidence of their presence, and firm documentation exists I assume on the Egyptian side of these rapid fire events?
acdelong 2 months ago
@acdelong On the topic of Jewish laws, you yourself said that he was breaking a Jewish dietary law? First, in context, the Saducees and the Pharisees had created many useless laws and had entirely cluttered the whole situation with rules-that is not what Christianity is at essence. It's not just a bunch of rules. Jesus is angered with the Pharisees and their brethren for using their position to institute themselves in a place of power.
100000killstreak 2 months ago
@100000killstreak um, hey dog- you've not finished up the first pot of shit you stirred up, so get back to that, then we can move on- as it stands now however, I'm not even gonna waste the energy to reply to you unless you maintain some respectability and finish what's been required of you first, okay kiddo?
acdelong 2 months ago
@acdelong That is just bullying - leave off please!
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@tracyjane221 no, bullying would be mocking and teasing, it's an unfortunate fact that often god botherers like to hop subject when pressed for evidence of their claims and I'll not abide it. I have the respect for a person's arguments to a degree to directly address them, which is easy when logic, reason and evidence are on your side, and I expect the same in return- if this guy is going to act like a child with ADD, he will be treated as such.
acdelong 2 months ago
@acdelong This is some info I found in an article on bullying, I think you should read it: “Bullying can be defined in many different ways. - Bullying consists of 3 basic types of abuse: emotional, verbal, and physical. - It can include verbal harassment, or coercion - name calling, verbal or written abuse - and criticizing the victim on the grounds of .. religion - It typically involves subtle methods of coercion such as intimidation. Your post is pretty intimidating & could show more respect!
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@tracyjane221 oh yes, so intimidating to require somebody to finish up with an argument point they failed to follow to conclusion. I suppose that within a magic based world view it seems possible to travel physically through the internet and cause harm, but as it stands now, our little friend is still safely tucked behind a computer screen. This form of communique is a two way street, both he and I are engaging one another, I'm just requiring him to stay intellectually honest.
acdelong 2 months ago
@acdelong it's so hard to say isn't it - that little 5 letter word - to admit you might have done something wrong and say "sorry"! Is that the wall you're facing, it's nothing to do with reason and logic but more to do with facing up to what you've done and admitting you didn't get it all right? Cos if you can't say sorry to another human being it's going to be pretty hard to say sorry to God. But that's all he asks of us, Jesus has already taken the punishment for us we just have to say sorry!
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@tracyjane221 is this now the route you're taking? If you're going to talk facts I'll do that with with you, but if you're wanting to turn this into a character inquiry, you can piss up a rope, because I'm respectful of others only when they decide to be disrespectful, like when somebody wants to make claims and engage in debate/polemic, but then starts losing so they change the subject. It's disrespectful to me, logic, themselves, and the alleged god that allegedly made us. I'll not abide it.
acdelong 2 months ago
@acdelong I'm sorry, I overstepped the mark - it hurt at least a little didn't it! I still maintain that your comments were bullying, designed to hurt the recipient (it doesn't have to be physical!)
I am however not going to continue this conversation at the moment, not because I've lost - I have lost nothing, I still have my faith, it brings me joy, hope and peace beyond anything that you could possibly understand without it.
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@tracyjane221 umm, no, it didn't hurt- because I'm capable of separating ideas from my identity. My comments were not, in fact designed to hurt- they were designed to convey the message of a stern warning that if one isn't willing to engage in a cohesive and honest way, then one should not do the disservice to their argument. I didn't insult anyone. go ahead and read the comment- condescending, yes- insulting, no. You need to grow some thicker skin if you want to sit at the grown up table.
acdelong 2 months ago
@tracyjane221 Don't pretend that you know what I do and don't understand- it's presumptuous and unseemly. I was once where you are, I was a bible believing christian- but then I followed the command of I peter 3:15 and when proceeding with the honesty that the bible also commands, I was forced to deal with the fact that the bible contains no wisdom that other religions don't contain and that all the supernatural claims are unsubstantiated. Then, I found joy, hope and peace in reason and honesty
acdelong 2 months ago
@acdelong I also do not believe that God asked us to win arguments, just to sow seeds, I feel that I'm throwing too much seed on the path and I need to go and find some more fertile soil.
This conversation is also making me into something I'm not (not helped by 4 sleepless nights with a poorly child).
One day I hope and pray that you will find a bit more respect to treat others with even when they decide to end a conversation & a more open mindset with which to approach the question of faith.
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@tracyjane221 no situation is capable of making us something we're not, it can simply lay bare what we truly are. I have opened my mind, that's how I got here- and away from magic and miracles. faith is not a "question" it is chosen and equivocated blindness. You will get through the sleepless nights. to be honest- I now yearn for my daughter to need comforting at night, and when she does occasionally- nothing can make me feel more fortunate or important than rocking her back to sleep.
acdelong 2 months ago
@acdelong And even if this was an actual rule, God later commands that it is ok to eat those sorts of foods-he had it in mind all along, and Jesus came to set a new foundation, as the old one had become corrupted.
100000killstreak 2 months ago
@acdelong You say that Jesus came and broke Jewish law by symbolically sacrificing himself to the 12 disciples before he literally sacrificed himself for all mankind. Am I interpreting that correctly? He isn't commanding cannibalism, he is foreshadowing his death, and creating a symbol for humans, much like when God created the Rainbow after the great flood, to constantly remind people of God's mercy. Communion is a reminder of God's sacrifice.
100000killstreak 2 months ago
@acdelong I do not concede that the last supper or passover were copied from other beliefs.
You say that these other ritual meals were recorded as early as 8BC.
The first passover was at least 1441BC! I think that was a little earlier!
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@tracyjane221 I'm not saying that you concede the point on the copying of rituals, I'm pointing out that you argued that the argument of ritual copying was predicated by "new atheists", which you've implicitly conceded in your addressing of justin's apologetic- If the "new atheists" hadn't invented the argument yet, what would be the use of the apologetic? That was the whole damn point of bringing up his explanation in the first place, and you've not addressed that fact.
acdelong 2 months ago
@acdelong - I said the "New Athiests" are "putting around" these lies - I never suggested that they invented all of them! It seems perhaps that some of these suggestions were made in Justin's time and they are being copied again now. NO point conceded.
tracyjane221 2 months ago
@acdelong I have favourited a video by Gary Habermas called Are the gospels too late to be considered good history? He is an expert in this field. Yes I agree that some information for the other gospels may have been taken from Mark but I think that you may be being misled about theft of tales from other myths to help the story along. These stories are being put around by the New Athiests etc to discredit the bible but they have no truth about them as this series of videos shows.
tracyjane221 2 months ago
THIS NOT THE REAL ZEITGEIST MOVIE!
8Zeitgeist 3 months ago
This is where Richard Carrier discusses Osiris resurrection
frontlinedashapologeticsdotcomforwardslashCarrierunderscoreonunderscoreOsirisunderscoredothtml
changingmyself 3 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Mike Licona, Osiris was resurrected way before Jesus. This is talked about in the Pyramid Texts:
Pyramid Texts Utterance 667
1941b "Oh Horus, this hour of the morning, of this ---THIRD DAY ----, is come, when thou surely passet on to heaven, together with the stars, the imperishable star"
Utterance 556
1382f "this hour of the ---THIRD DAY--- comes, where the father Osiris will be reborn as horus, at the place where the gods are born..."
changingmyself 3 months ago
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changingmyself 3 months ago
While why do the Christians keep all the holy books locked up behind cages and try to keep everything a secret everything is kept hush hush I'm glad somebody is asking question.
nsmooth1 3 months ago
Haha Mike Licona...
Shabir Ally destroyed him. Christianity is not pagan-inspired. However, it teaches contradicting concepts, has corrupted texts, and blasphemes the original Abrahamic teachings. The Jesus Christ that Christians worship, is not Yeshua ben Yosef, the Prophet born of the virgin Mary. The trinity is a false doctrine, and Christianity has been spread in barbaric ways. Deceiving its followers in order to maintain them. If you truly read the Bible, you won't be Christian for long.
deviIstudios 3 months ago
@deviIstudios Yes, Christianity is a pagan concept, the word pagan = gentile. The word that Jews used for non Jews = Gentile. Therefore, Christians = Pagans.
changingmyself 3 months ago
@changingmyself So a mere term is used in equating doctrines and dogmas as corresponding with "paganism". You need to rework your logic there buddy. I know many Christians who aren't pagans. Atheists are the biggest "Pagans" and filth on this planet. Worshiping worthless currency and meaningless objects, makes me sick.
deviIstudios 3 months ago
@deviIstudios No, it isn't the mere use of the term. It is the fact that to the Jews Gentiles= Pagans. Look up the Etymology of the word Pagan. It means FROM THE COUNTRY. IT doesn't mean devil worshippers. What is sad is that Christians use this term the same way racists use the term nigger.
changingmyself 3 months ago
@changingmyself I never claimed that it meant devil worshipers. "The origins of the modern English word "pagan" come from the Latin paganus, an adjective originally meaning "rural", "rustic" or "of the countryside." (Pagan", Encyclopedia Britannica 11th Edition, 1911, Jones and Pennick 1995. p. 01.) The term is unimportant. Anyone who displays excessive affection or worship towards anything conceivable is a pagan in my book. That's all you need to know. This includes Christians.
deviIstudios 3 months ago
@deviIstudios So, all atheists are "from the country" because Atheists do not worship or display affection towards anything, so Atheists cannot be Pagans.
You said above, "Christianity is not pagan-inspired" then you turn around and say:
Anyone who displays excessive affection or worship towards anything conceivable is a pagan in my book. That's all you need to know. This includes Christians."
Evidence shows that Christianity IS pagan inspired.
changingmyself 3 months ago
@changingmyself Wow, you missed the main point. "IN MY BOOK". That is obviously my own opinion and not a universal definition. Learn how to read. I could give a fuck about whether or not Christianity was Pagan inspired. All I know is that it is in a terribly corrupted state. I
deviIstudios 3 months ago
@deviIstudios WOW, maybe you missed the point, you do not get to create definitions of words,"in my book". What you said means absolutely nothing, why would I care to read what some idiot over the internet thinks if they are not going to go by standard definitions? We have a dictionary for a reason.
changingmyself 3 months ago
@changingmyself What hypocrisy, you were essentially creating your own definition that deviated from what is commonly accepted. Rather than label people as Pagans for their identity, I do it for their actions. You're an idiot for making such a big deal out of an irrelevant subject. We have brains for a reason...
deviIstudios 3 months ago
@deviIstudios Using Etyomology isn't making up my own definition and neither is the Pagan = Gentile comparison because that TOO is etymology. I do not lable people PAGANS but YOU DID and I was attempting to get YOU to see that it is a DERAGATORY term. You are a fool for acting as if you are better than anyone else. THAT is hypocrisy. Because YOUR NOT.
changingmyself 3 months ago
@changingmyself Wow, you're arguing the etymology of a word yet you can't even use "you're" in the correct context. Is labeling people worse than labeling an entire theology followed by billions?
"Christianity is a pagan concept"
I could care less about how offensive you think the word "Pagan" is if you can hardly decide what it means. You also need to work on your comprehension. Did you misinterpret the word "essentially"? Or do you need the etymology for that term as well? Fucking idiot.
deviIstudios 3 months ago
@deviIstudios WOW, an ad hominem, go figure. The oldest Christians artifact shows that Christianity is pagan. Did you miss the fact that Christians are pagans because the Jewish word for Christians is the word Gentile and Gentile means Pagan? You can gloss over facts all you want, but YOU do not get to make up the definitions of words, THAT IS WHY we have a dictionary. If you want to speak your own language, that is fine, but don't talk to me if you don't know what you are talking about.
changingmyself 3 months ago
@changingmyself That explains the origins of a term but does not negate the fact that it refers to someone who is NOT part of an Abrahamic belief (ie CHRISTIANITY) or one that is polytheistic. I challenge you to look up the word "pagan" in a dictionary and tell me what the most common definition is.
1. one of a people or community observing a polytheistic religion, as the ancient Romans and Greeks
2. a person who is not a Christian, Jew, or Muslim
What are you trying to prove? Fuck off loser.
deviIstudios 3 months ago
@deviIstudios Christianity was NOT part of the Abrahamic belief in the first century, thus WHY they were called GENTILES by the Jews. Jews considered themselves the ONLY Abrahamic belief. The CHRISTIANS are the ones that changed the word to include themselves when they joined THEIR god, with the OT god. There were many people that were against that. The Gnostics considered the OT god to be a demiurge.
Why are you behaving so rudely and why don't you take your OWN advice?
changingmyself 3 months ago
@changingmyself I am referring to the term as it is presented in the dictionary, not how it once was used. You are wasting my time with something I honestly don't give a shit about. I know enough about Christian theology to call bullshit without a doubt. I agree that they combined Jesus into being YHWH of the OT. It's a shame really, a bad attempt as well. Too many holes and errors to succeed. The best way to keep followers is to have them practice blind faith.
deviIstudios 3 months ago
@deviIstudios I would think it would be common sense that we cannot use the definition of the word Pagan as it is now to describe events that happened 1700-2000 years ago.
As you said, it was a very bad attempt, as is the whole "trinity" which in essense makes Christianity the definition of the word Pagan as we have it today.
You can tie a fish to a dog with a piece of thread, but that doesn't mean the fish is the son of the dog. lol
changingmyself 3 months ago
@changingmyself Exactly, there are numerous other reasons exposing that as well.
deviIstudios 3 months ago
Haha Mike Licona...
Shabir Ally destroyed him. Christianity is not pagan-inspired. However, it teaches contradicting concepts, has corrupted texts, and blasphemes the original Abrahamic teachings. The Jesus Christ that Christians worship, is not Yeshua ben Yosef, the Prophet born of the virgin Mary. The trinity is a false doctrine, and Christianity has been spread in barbaric ways. Deceiving its followers in order to maintain them. If you truly read the Bible, you won't be Christian for long.
deviIstudios 3 months ago
christians need the lie and falsification more than any religion because is against nature it has the porpoise they know.
alracgabu 3 months ago
@alracgabu u must be scared that you relize hell is real.
don't be scared repeant NOW!
MegaGangstaparadise 3 months ago
i must admit i completely bought zeitgeist's part one, but could not find any sources for their information during my research. however, this film answered all my questions and the director's meticulousness is commendable. thank you for your hard work and comprehensive evidence. if i could i'd apologize for all the zeitgeist fanatics. bias is a problem on both sides of the argument, but works like this will at least convince people that value LOGIC and EVIDENCE over personal interests
obtsfan 4 months ago
@obtsfan and i'm an atheist.
obtsfan 4 months ago
hahaha look at all the disbelievers of this video. There is PROOF of the zeitgeist lie right in front of your face yet you continue to deny. You're just as mindless as the sheeple whos going to get his mercury vaccine right now. you have 'woken up'... now WAKE UP AGAIN!
3VOLution3NO 4 months ago
Zeitgeist sounds German. I don't trust it already.
5starGeneral79 4 months ago
@5starGeneral79 Zeitgeist [( tseyt -geyst, zeyt -geyst)] The general moral, intellectual, and cultural climate of an era; Zeitgeist is German for “time-spirit.” For example, the Zeitgeist of England in the Victorian period included a belief in industrial progress, and the Zeitgeist of the 1980s in the United States was a belief in the power of money and the many ways in which to spend it.
pana376 4 months ago
Christian appoach AGAIN !! Are you all complete brain washed idiots !
megasparky4 5 months ago
Only morons take Zeitgeist seriously. It's just a nice movie.
SHARKOON752 5 months ago
The way I see it... Zeitgeist movement wants whats best for all Men, Women and Children. A better system with no need for Jobs, Children will get better Education, everyone is truely free and Equal... If something like this can come true... why would any normal Rational Human being go against something so wonderful?
JadaNeedsU 5 months ago
Most annoying accent I've ever heard. Good video though
mykydoo88 5 months ago
I wish these people trying to prove zeitghiest wrong were going to be around when the world finally sees the day zeitghiest talks of. The day when we are able to look back at people defending religion and laugh because they were so blinded and brain washed to buy into a system that is so corupt and horribly fake. I wonder what these people would do the day we are able to prove to them how wrongly manipulated they have been.
AviseLaFin16 5 months ago
oh great, so you watched zeitgeist and basically wrote a BS video that is a mere petty come back to the video's critique of religion. it doesn't actually attack faith at any point it attacks the way that religion controls us now, and is used to take money from us whilst crushing independent thought. although its obviously not correct in all its information there is enough in the film to show any forward thinking human being that shit is wrong, bad, evil and needs to change seriously.
crunchmatch 6 months ago
@crunchmatch first off i don't see how you can call this video bs unless you didn't watch it. the director cites all his sources and scholars, and quotes them word for word, compared to zeitgeist which does neither and creates facts out of thin air. you should really consider researching some of the claims that zeitgeist made, and where these claims came from. i totally bought part one of zeitgeist until i did some research, and then that whole section fell apart.
obtsfan 4 months ago
@crunchmatch second, zeitgeist uses the claim that christianity is a rehashing of pagan religions as a basis that it was created for the purpose of manipulation. those claims about the rehashing are completely false, as proven here. however, the negative effects of christianity are another topic all together, and i nor the creator of this video dispute that. on a similar note, the misleading tactics of the zeitgeist creators should spark some questions about their underlying motives as well..
obtsfan 4 months ago
If you're trying to debunk or disprove someone's work and then you go and make a video that starts off with an indirect insult at your opponent, then you've just lost a ton of credibility.
soonerdave01 6 months ago
@karozans I agree but majority of everything that was claimed in the zeitgeist part one lacks credibility example every savior was born of a virgin, n this is one of the few n rarest times where I agree wit Christian that this movie has false information n claims
8o8riddim 6 months ago
It's pronounced "zy-gyst" you fucking idiot.
teetz18 6 months ago
zeitgeist has its agenda its trying to feed you and this video has its agenda too. You can't believe either but should just do your own research and believe what you want. Thats it.
louistov 6 months ago
The fact stays the same....we need more Love & Compassion to fix what is seriously wrong in this world and it has nothing to do with religion, it has to do with taking care of each other, not allowing people to starve the way they do, loosing their homes & jobs the way they do because of some sad 13 people that are heartless and sitting on top of the world cashing in on everything and allowing the rest to be enslaved and die in the worst imaginable ways right now all over the world.
EvesOriginals 6 months ago
thank "God" that christien numbers are indecline, due partly to the fact that people are waking up and getting smarter. anyone that refers to a book rewritten by oppressors and kiddy fiddlers as there evidence to refute proven scientific claims.
URMyTorment 6 months ago
I have grown up in christian catholic familes and schools. The catholic rituals are straight from pagan rituals and so are the holidays.. wtf.. Jesus' life can only be accounted for up to and just short period after his birth...what happened to the other 30 years? Why is that when it comes to jesus, what must simply believe mans interpretation to be real without any investigation... we must simply have faith that we aren't being lied to.. I'd say most of the Zeitgeist info re-searchable..
cronos122770 7 months ago
So the first 2 minutes, this guys says a book is useless unless it can be taken at face value, and believed to be correct without looking into the subject yourself..
Hmmm?
cronos122770 7 months ago
story's change through out time. the story of "Jesus" is no exception.
jonathan3979701 7 months ago
ok lets suppose you completley prove zeitgiest wrong. Do you have any evidence that YOU are right?
spatch8806 7 months ago
The ancient alien theory can actually make a logical conclusion to why all these religions are similar, because they were not by God but "flying men" or extraterrestrials who came and told them the way. Sadly I believe this idea more than half the religions on earth.
Knirvana795 8 months ago
where can I buy this film who made it who is narrating it? help please
tylrjsph 8 months ago
@GenerationEpic90 true, but finding a good Internet source for reliable info about zeitgeist are usually zeitgeist influence. Nothing credible could be really found except the thousands of page titles say Horus n Jesus are the same. All because of these groups calling themselves the zeitgeist movement watering down information, which later becomes true due to the majority making it true which the issue for isreal Bissel/Paul revere comes into play
8o8riddim 8 months ago
@LetsLay11 I agree but just to clear up a misunderstanding, the more likely time that Jesus was supposably born was around October September given the events n clues given for the time of the birth
8o8riddim 8 months ago
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People have to stop going to extremes and being reactionaries! Just because some of the things people believe about Jesus were already in existence before he was born doesn't mean that there wasn't an actual person fitting his description who walked and talked and existed on Earth!
LIsMRMOTOWN 8 months ago
People have to stop going to extremes and being reactionaries! Just because some of the things people believe about Jesus were already in existence before he was born doesn't mean that there wasn't an actual person fitting his description who walked and talked and existed on Earth!
LIsMRMOTOWN 8 months ago
Look up:"Truth about Holidays" posted by dawathm Khalid Yasin "Is Jesus God?", Top 10 Reasons Why Jesus is Not God and Khalid Yasin"The crucifixtion" These are clear, unbiased explanations of the topic that I urge you to view.
LIsMRMOTOWN 8 months ago
The book The World's 16 Crucified Saviors was put out by the ATHEIST press. A more credible sourse for their stories is Jesus Prophet of Islam by Muhammad Ata 'ur-Rahim & Ahmad Thompson, which gives an unslanted and more correct view of Jesus, Arius, Donatus, Lucien and many of the other people mentioned in the book! Further, the book seperates Jesus (the man who actually lived) from "Christ" (the myth - the person people made him out to be) and the research is incredible!
LIsMRMOTOWN 8 months ago
Sad, so sad.
Hierstaik 8 months ago
Emmanuel = a being, an incarnated Pleiadian from the Pleiades system, a son of Mary and "angel" (also Pleiadian) Gabriel.
Born around 25-27 July. NOT December 25, the birthday of Sol Invictus (Dies Natalis).
True Christianity = Messianic Judaism, 1st-3rd century Christians, Nazarene.
False Christianity = probably all "Christian" religions.
"LORD" - the name of Bhaal/Baal (LORD), a corrupt collective translation by Roman/Catholic officials of Hebrew terms.
exposingthemachine 8 months ago
i used to beLIEve in god, but now its getting harder and harder with the bible being used in ways that rape the image of a beautiful man and the things he did, the fact that there are contradictions in both sides is the only refuted proof. thats all. both show no sign of ABSOLUTE truth, without opinion stired in somewhere, the funny thing is, you seem to be more malicious about your side. as christians i figured you would allow a bit of ignorence since that is you recruitment tool.
cobhcmofo313 8 months ago
From the very beginning I can see this is biased and dishonest. I went to a theological school, and I can tell you that even some of the Christian scholars acknowledge that scriptures have been influenced by the mystery religions. For one, study Bishop John Spong. Also, the stories of pagan gods raising from the dead do, in fact, predate Christianity. Research Horus and Krishna to start. Study and think for yourselves, people. No need to be sheep forever.
truderstaller 9 months ago
pathetic, dumbass, idiot, fool, and many others.
alangname 9 months ago
that's just pathetic! always the same reaction from religious people: no, no, no eeeeeeeee aaaaaaa, eeeeeee aaaaaa, eeeeee aaaaaa
UberTankred 9 months ago
Notice 99% of people here that don't agree simply attack this with words.( Dumb, Stupid, Foolish) How about some facts to back up your position. People are being lead by their emotions rather then whats real.
tharemedybeats 9 months ago
Regarding comments starting at about 6:20.
Virgin girls, don't use a dildo.
According to this 'I can't think for myself unless I refer to my books' account, you'll lose your virginity.
Two peanuts were walking down the street, and one was assaulted.
Onani! (It's Japanese). Go for it. You are still a virgin to me.
Before I had proper sex I masturbated much. Still do.
But does that mean I lost my virginity all by myself?
naganokumas 9 months ago
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naganokumas 9 months ago
Religion is such a joke and the more I hear this guy talk in circles the more I feel sorry for religious people ..... they not know what they do.
slimmworker 10 months ago
Religion is such a joke and the more I hear this guy talk in circles the more I feel sorry for religious people though they not know what they do.
slimmworker 10 months ago
How are you guys gonna hate on this guy, just because he is defending his own religion? True, it may not be the point of the Zeitgeist, but it is a part of it...if you thought Christians were gonna let it slander their religion with false facts, and then not respond...wow, just wow.
xJOExFOxSHOx 10 months ago
@xJOExFOxSHOx But whether or not the section on religion is credible isn't important. I'll give you one fact that any educated person would deem indisputable: Religion cannot solve social or economic problems and is therefore socially and economically irrelevant. Religion is based upon faith not facts. It's a self validating paradigm. Religion is governed by its own logic and answers to no higher authority. It disourages its members to educate themselves beyond the limits of its doctrine.
cleryt1 10 months ago
@cleryt1 I would argue that it very much is NOT irrelevant, and can solve many of our problems. Most of what you just said is complete BS. "It discourages members to educate themselves beyond the limits of its doctrine."...what? Where have you ever seen this? Religion brings people together, forms communities. But I guess thats pointless and stupid too, huh? Oh, and fyi, a lot of science(aka YOUR religion) is based on faith.
xJOExFOxSHOx 10 months ago
@xJOExFOxSHOx Doesn't dogmatic religion claim to be the ultimate authority? If your religion has all the answers about human origin then why look any further. What motivation is there to discover and learn and grow if all the answers reside in this one silly book that was written by a man. Religion Brings people together?? Broaden your perspective a little brother. Think about all the killing that has been done in the name of religion. One groups fairy tales are more right than another groups?
cleryt1 10 months ago
@xJOExFOxSHOx You say science is my religion? Science in fundamentally different than any religion in that it acknowledges the difference between fact and theory. And it's theories are open to being disproven. One scientist could come up with some theory on how something works, then another scientist could conduct experiments that disprove that theory, then another scientist could debase that scientists experiments. Science is a constant work in progress. It is the pursuit of knowledge.
cleryt1 10 months ago
@xJOExFOxSHOx Dogmatic religion, however, answers only to its own dogma. It has no validity outside of itself. Religious groups battle it out over who's fairy tales are right and who's fairy tales are just plain silly nonsense. When if you look at the core infrastructure of any dogmatic religion it is based ENTIRELY on faith. Its members strongly assert their beliefs to be true without any sort of credible evidence. Do you think that is a healthy mentality?
cleryt1 10 months ago
@cleryt1 If you are trying to argue that there is no evidence for the validity of Christianity, then you are clearly misinformed or ignorant. But even if there wasn't, how does that detract from society? How does believing in something affect anyone else? What is the agenda of this video? It only provides false facts, attacking the Christian faith. And the church in no way discourages its members from believing in science. You have a false stereotype stuck in your head. Is that healthy?
xJOExFOxSHOx 10 months ago
@xJOExFOxSHOx If you could send me some links to some credible information that proves the earth is only 6000 years old as the bible says I would love to see that. How do you explain dinosaur bones? If you tell me that God put them there to test your faith then this debate is over for I cannot argue with insanity. Maybe the church doesn't discourage believing in science, but many of the stories of the bible conflict with science. and the bible is the ultimate authority to any "good christian".
cleryt1 10 months ago
@xJOExFOxSHOx I'm not very fond of the part on religion in zeitgeist 1 attempting to debase the christian faith. I agree with the reason they want to do away with religion, but I don't feel their methodology was effective. You are right in that simply believing in religion doesn't effect others, but each religion claims that its god is the only true god. Ever heard of the Crusades? The thirty years war? The reconquista? and people are still to this day killing each other over religious conflict.
cleryt1 10 months ago
@xJOExFOxSHOx I just don't really understand how you can truly believe that religion "brings people together" as you said in your previous post. I have to assume that you just aren't aware of all the death and horror that humans have inflicted and are still inflicting on each other in the name of god. Humanity's rate of progression would increase exponentially if we scrap our silly superstitions and focus on studying science and nature.
cleryt1 10 months ago
@cleryt1 I don't get why you think just because you're affiliated with a religion means you reject science...like I said earlier, that's a silly and misconstrued stereotype, and you really need to get over it. Your logic doesn't make sense...if we give up religion, our progression would increase? How did you connect those two? You realize that most scientists/doctors believe in a higher power....
xJOExFOxSHOx 10 months ago