Zechariah 12:10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for [his] only [son], and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for [his] firstborn.
----- Ye workers of Satan will get your reward for your lies!
Amazing!A rare admission of truth about the Bible.Now if they can just keep this truth search going they might find much more.For example,start by comparing the Gospel of Mark with the Gospel of Matthew.Compare the two gospels verse by verse and you will see that Matthew copies Mark word for word on over 600 occasions but makes several changes and additions along the way.Then allow your reason to function properly and you will clearly see that Matthew was making corrections to Mark's gospel.
..cont..but the word biblia was specifically generated to give a title to the Latin text that came out of Hippo. It does not reffer to any manuscript or any greek translation but solly to the cannon of the church that came from Hippo.
There is no Greek text that has the word biblia in it, as that would be impossible, as the letters in biblia are Latin and not Greek. The word biblia was first put to use after the council of Hippo in which the church came together and selected from 100's of books what was to be the cannon of the church. It is a transliterazation of the Greek word "βιβλία"(see the Greek lettering) and holds one of the same meanings "books"..cont...
Hayyy, what an adamant character... the council of Hippo collected certain books based on a 'canon'. Which came first? The synod, or the manuscripts? The manuscripts, of course, otherwise, they have nothing to collect. But then the books they were collecting contain the word BIBLIA, so the word Biblia is NOT post Hippo and NOT an invention. It's just that for The First Time, the canonical books gathered as one book was named Biblia, just like the LXX, Torah, etc. People, what do you think?
For my final remark: Is Biblia an invention? See wikipedia's statement of the etimology: The English word Bible is from the Latin biblia, from the same word in Medieval Latin and Late Latin and ultimately from Greek τὰ βιβλία ta biblia "the books" (singular βιβλίον biblion). --- See? The Latin biblia was from the Greek biblia, and was not an invention. The LXX's Ecclesiastes 12:12 contains the word biblia. Thanks again!
So therefore, they gave credit to where credit is due, if the MSS is from Greek then it is fitting to call the 'books' as Biblia as the proper name. Biblia was not an invention, but a Latin adaptation from the Greek Biblia.
The Greek manuscripts were written in Greek, then later about the 4th century Jerome translated it to Latin (a.k.a. Vulgate). The Latin community have the Latin manuscripts but they do not call it in a collective form as 'Libri'. Latins' book is libro, if they do not know that book is biblos in Greek, then it will be for the first time in their hearing to hear Biblia as the name of the 'books' and not Libri. Why Biblia? Because before Latin, the MSS are Greek and biblia was derived from it.
@corkystorky tdude I have said like 5 times now it was a transliteration from the greek..do you understand?...
q 1) Did the word Biblia exist in beofre hippo?...if so please give me the latin quotation of someone using it???
Refuted?...lol...there was no word biblia before hippo this is a historical fact period...if not then please post the use of it before Hippo...I will be waiting.........
@gtepp031387 You are changing your original statements to save your face? Ok that's it, if that's how you put it. Try asking a Greek if the word biblia can be found in their bibles - we're speaking of 'word' in its basic nature, not all the world is Latin.
@corkystorky Words are either written or spoken, neither was the word biblia written nor spoken before the council of Hippo. Niether does the meaning of the Greek tranliterized word have the same meaning as the Latin word. That is becaues the latin word also reffers to the offical and closed cannon, a meaning that the Greek does not have, thus not only is it a different word in letter and sound but in meaning as well!
Mathew 11:11, 3:11, 28:19, John 14:6, 1John 5:6(HS witness),7-8 Gen 1:26,
John 1:1-51 is John's testimony(6-10) of the divinity if Christ. all 51 verses 1:1 referst to Genisis chapter 1. 1:1 the word God is translated from the word Eloheem, which is the plural form Eloah (aka El) Eloah means almighty.
the HS is mentioned in Gen 1:2
Gen 1:3,6,9,11,14,20,24, God spoke
If this guy is right you have to take out 2Tim 3:16 to and the above mentioned verses
1 John 5:7 is even quoted in the early church fathers writings, i.e., in the 2nd century, (Apostolic Fathers, vol.5, page 418); thus, the 'Textus Receptus' Greek New Testament - has it right - and as it is translated in the KJV..
@stevenhamilton9 I have read all of the apostolic fathers sans Shepherd of Hermas over the last two weeks, and I don't recall ever seeing any of them quote this verse. Can you reference me which writing specifically? Thanks.
trinitarians are pagans, they divide god into 3 persons, they believe in 3 gods, not 1. the early christians like Ebonites, the Corinthians, the Basilidians, the Capocratians, and the Hypisistarians never know about trinity doctrine at all. they were not trinitarians..
@VegetaAlby "We believe in one GOD the father the almighty" ~ Catholic creed...we believe Jesus is GOD from GOD eternally begotten of the father, the very LOGOS(mental though of GOD) who was with GOD being GOD in the begging...and the word was GOD...and the word took flesh and dwelt among us.
@VegetaAlby Trinitarians believe in 3 persons and 3 Gods not 1? Somebody needs to learn their history. Trinitarians believe in 1God who has revealed himself in 3 personages not persons. Get it right. 3 personages revealed in the nature of the 1 true God.
@NHBChristianTalk LOL, trinitarians belive in 1 god that consist of 3 seperate person. father, son and the holy spirit. the father is not the son, the son is not the father, But they both are God .. LoL
@VegetaAlby Wow, are you really that ignorant? We do not believe in 3 separate persons and I don't know where you're getting your faulty information but it's funny to see the misrepresentation of the Trinity doctrine, LOL. I never said the Father was the Son, go read my post again because you obviously can't read to understand. I said, ONE God who has revealed himself in THREE PERSONAGES NOT PERSONS like Peter, James and John. You are making the separations like people, WRONG!
@NHBChristianTalk are you referring to THREE PERSONAGES like: Yesterday I revealed myself as batman by wearing the batman uniform, today as superman, and tomorrow will be as The Flash. Is that how it works?
@corkystorky That is funny but no. I am referring to One God by name and title in which the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit share. Three distinct personages, one name. Look up the word personage in Webster if your still confused.
@NHBChristianTalk Personage: 1. a Person of importance or distinction; notable 2. any Person 3. a character in history, play, a novel, etc. --- Based on that def'n, what you said about God revealing himself in 3 personages not persons, can be either 3 separate beings at the same time (like 3 judges of the American Idol), or the example I gave in batman, superman, then the Flash. You rejected the first and the second, but the definition of personage supports either one or both.
@corkystorky Personage: 1. a Person of importance or distinction: Or distinction is what I am going for. Within the nature of the One True God there are 3 distinct personages that have been revealed, the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. Thats it.
@NHBChristianTalk Let me see how it works, how about: 2 atoms of hydrogen and 1 atom of oxygen are 3 distinct atoms, yet together they form what is called water. If Elohiym is like that then the Trinity is a composition of 3 persons united and yet each having their own faculties that distinguishes one from the other, just like a foot and hand and head that forms the one body. I'm not sure if the analogy is close to the Trinity :)
@corkystorky someone said that the word Trinity does not exist in the bible, but I say the essence is there, like, we do not read elsewhere in the bible the words 2 atoms of hydrogens plus 1 atom of oxygen, but which are components of what we read in the bible Water. Christians united I can call Christinity, which is not even in the dictionary. Again, I'm not sure if anything I said make sense :)
@corkystorky You have the right idea. One YHWH by name and title, yet three distinct personages who share that name and title. Not separate people like Peter, James and John but distinct.
The word 'trinity' isn't even Scriptural. Trinity is a manmade doctrine that borrows heavily from pagan sources. Scripture tells us God is One *not* three. Ultimately the trinity doctrine seeks to limit our heavenly Father to merely one-third of the godhead. Isn't it easier to just accept Scripture at Its Word? We have One God, and He can manifest Himself in any form He chooses without needing to be subdivided to fit the manmade doctrines.
@VegetaAlby Jesus is the word of GOD, the LOGOS of the father, he was in the beggging with GOD being GOD. The Spirit is the spirit of the father and the son, in the begging with the father being GOD from GOD, generated by the father alone but sent out by the LOGOS of the father. Jesus says the father is greater then he is, how do you understand this? He spoke to the father on several occasions if he is merly a form of GOD then who is he speaking too?...What your teaching is called Modalism
@gtepp031387 Jesus said the father is greater than me, so the trinity is false, because u guys says that the son the father and the holy spirit are co-equal..
@VegetaAlby The humanity of Jesus is less then the father, but the divinity in the son is not....as Jesus is fully GOD, "In Christ Jesus is the fullness of the divinity"..The divinity is similar to the occurrence when one fire enkindles another. It is not diminished through the enkindling of the other, but remains as it was
@VegetaAlby All the words in your english bible did not come about till the english languide was invented, does that mean there meaning is not in the bible, becaues the word is not?...In fact the word bible, comes from the word biblia and is not found in the bible.
@corkystorky The bible was put together by the church, is what i was saying. Do you see a table of contents in the original books anywhere? Do you think the bible fell from the sky all compiled?...The bible has a history and to deny this is to deny truth, and to deny truth is to deny Jesus. The bible was put together by the holy fathers of old, to deny the holy fathers is to deny the bible.
@gtepp031387 no, that is not how I understood your previous statement ;) I was referring to the word biblos, which is in the bible. Biblia is books, plural I think.
@gtepp031387 that is inconsistent because it's like finding a dog in the planet mars. Use an english dictionary, words are defined in english not latin, but through etimology you get around the nature of words. If you use a latin bible you will see what you are looking for, if you read greek then you will see the equivalent. Sometimes you have to got to reason based on 1+1=2. That attitude will not suit further intelligent conversation, i'm sorry.
@corkystorky Actually you will not see the word biblia in the Latin bible...This is becaues the word biblia is a speacial transliteration of the Greek "βιβλία", it is specific to the version of scripture that came from the council of Hippo. Latin already had a word for book, "liber", which is used in the "biblia"... The bible is a specific compliation that came from the Catholic church, the word biblia did not exist before the council of Hippo.
@gtepp031387 there are many verses in the latin bible that contain the word libri, for books, now biblos (book) biblia (books) all refer to what we know as books which are in different mode of compilations because technology are different from stages or ephoch of history. In Old English they use the word Godspel which is now as Gospel, both referring to the same thing. Not that godspel no longer exist doesn't mean gospel arrived only in our times.
@corkystorky Bud you can rant and rave, kick and scream all you want...it will never change the historical fact that the word biblia was invented to give a title to the compilation of scripture that was put together by the council of Hippo, that was held under St Augsutine in 393 A.D....before which the word biblia did not exist.
@gtepp031387 you have a limited idea of what WORD means. A word is used to convey an idea, this is why speaking in tongues was important in he early church to communicate the gospel. A russian and a chinese may use different words about a unicorn, but the image of a unicorn is the same in their minds. That's how words work, they are processed by the brain to pick up the variable stored in the memory that matches it, otherwise you will not be using a translating device.
@corkystorky lol..dude what is the point of this discussion. My point is valid, the word biblia did not exist before Hippo period. Every version of scripture has a name to it, every one. The Jews have the Tanakh,or the Torah,these are specific compilations of scripture. The apostles used a compilation know as the Septuagint. Even what modern english reffer to as the manuscriptes, all have titles to them, every one. The biblia is more then a manuscripte it is the cannon of the church
@gtepp031387 "biblia is a Latin word, and is not in the bible. Find me the Latin word biblia in the Greek text i dare you???" --- this is what you said. Here's my answer: John 21:25 and 2 Tim.4:13. You cannot invent something that already exists, and besides, what they collected as manuscripts, including the septuagint perhaps, are greek so no wonder they'll adapt the greek word and then added it to their dictionary in the plural nominative case.
@gtepp031387 The Bible is Ta Biblia in Greek, in the neuter gender, nominative and accusative case, in case you don't know how to read Greek. The latin for book is libro, as in the latin vulgate. since the manuscripts were in greek, so naturally they will use biblos instead of libro. Like the book Noli Me Tangere, it was written in Spanish so the title should be in spanish, otherwise if you use a chinese title on that then the Spaniards would not identify the book as spanish. :)
@corkystorky biblos is not a greek word, how could it be it is latin lettering. Biblia is a transliteration of Greek which I have already explained. The word did not exist before the titleing of the cannon produced at Hippo. There was no bible before Hippo and there was no word biblia before Hippo and that is a historical fact. The cannon was yet to be closed untill the church met in council to discuss the matter, and it was dun using the tradition of the Catholic church.
@gtepp031387 "biblos is not a greek word" --- you know words are not limited to writing, words are oral by nature. To say that biblos is not a greek word because it is not wrtten in its greek letters is absurd. If I am Latin and I named a book Biblia, I don't have to write that title in the greek letters because the Latin community who does not know how to read Greek would not understand.
@corkystorky This convo is pointless...the word as spelled B-I-B-L-I-A did not exist untill after the council of Hippo. That is plain historical fact.
@gtepp031387 the reason it will be pointless is because you make premises that are fallacious, like 'biblos is not greek' and 'biblia is not to be found in the greek bible'. Hence you conclusion is not as solid as it is supposed to be because you planted premises that is soundly refuted. I know your point all along, I just wanted to see if you know where your lines of arguments are.
@corkystorky biblio is not Greek it is Latin there is no Grrek word biblio or biblia...Greek words do not use the Latin alphabet smart one. ...The origien of the word Biblia is post Hippo.
@gtepp031387 again, words are conveyed not by letters only. Speaking of origins, the origin of biblia is not post hippo. "Origin", "Invent" "Word" - define them so you'll know what you are talking about.
@corkystorky try asking a grek if the word biblia can be found in there bibles....go ahead search everyone of them you will not find it. Save face??? Your the one talking gibberish.
Again please post anyone in the world that used the word biblia before Hippo??? can't do it then you have shown your self to be wrong. That is veery simple no need to talk gibberish...either the word was used before Hippo or not which one is it?? If it was used before Hippo then please post the source
@gtepp031387 "Anyone in the world?" Okay, the Greeks are part of the world and they will know that in the oldest manuscripts there was the word Biblia (I already posted the verses). The oldest MSS were Before hippo. And I thought you're done wasting your time? Who's talking gibberish :)
@corkystorky Never did a greek use the word Biblia before Hippo, you posted no source. Again quote, and place the quote can be originally found, of someone using the word biblia before hippo....And I am just being silly really this covo is pointless you have been utterly refuted on all grounds, even you know this.
@gtepp031387 then I quote the timothy, and then the greek church for reading 2 Tim. 4:13 - ton failonen on apelipon en Troadi par Karpo erkhomenos fere, kai ta Biblia, malista tas membranas. The greeks use biblia, not a chinese version or latin for the word books that they want to convey "Give me the books" (someone handed a spoon instead of books because the poor Greek doesn't know what biblos is.)
@gtepp031387 "Hey, what are those?" "Can't you see? It's a collection of libros" "Ahh, so it's a libro that contains many libros, so, what do you call that libro?" "Biblia." "Biblia? Never heard of it. What is biblia? It's not Latin of course." "Biblia is books." "Books? We call books Libri, why not use Libri instead, why 'INVENT' a new word?" "Biblia is books in Greek, you know, before we got our Latin MSS, they came from Grk MSS, and Greeks call libros biblia, so there." "Ahh."
@corkystorky This story is just a demonstration, or an 'invention' if you like. Biblia did not come from nowhere, as the word Invent would convey, but a mere adaptation to give the collection of libros a proper name.
@gtepp031387 I actually enjoyed our little sharing. Perhaps it would be different if we speak face to face because I hardly conveyed ideas with limited typing space. Until then, God bless :)
@gtepp031387 the compilation of scriptures is a series of books, and they already have a term to call for that. They don't have to invent something that already exists. They just decided to call it 'Books' (for biblia) other than what it can be called (like The Words of the Prophets, or A Collection of Scriptures, or A Compilation of Narratives, etc.) Biblia is simple and direct. Biblia was not an invention, but a word decided to be used to call the series of books in one fold.
there is no need for these weak doctrines that attempt to sub-divide the godhead in attempts to explain "how" He does it. Trinitarians start dividing up the godhead so that the Father is one person, the Son is a second person, and then the Ruach (spirit) is a third person.
I am convinced one reason why a trinitarian doctrine was incorporated into Christianity was to explain the 'person' of Jesus; to explain how he could be God. That God could take on human form as an earthly Messiah isn't difficult to accept -- afterall, He'd previously supped with Abraham (Gen 18) and He had wrestled with Jacob (Gen 32) *while also in human form*. Our powerful God can manifest Himself in many forms.
Jesus, as Yeshua, does NOT lie & compliments 1 John 5:7, Matt 28:19 & John 10:30 by confirming the existence of the TRINITY in John 14:26!
In following verse HS is (1), God the Father is (2) Jesus is (3)
John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost,(1) whom the Father (2) will send in my name(3), he(1) shall teach you all things, & bring all things to ur remembrance, whatsoever I(3) have said unto u.
Words NOT-IN-THE-Bible R: "Trinity", science, allah, Islam, quran, muslim, Muhammad
St Augutine(perhaps the greatest theologian of all time) quotes from it in 398 A.D....ect If this verse was added it was added very early and without anyone protesting it's usage.
What the guy says at 1:19 is a lie about Ehrman. Ehrman doesn't say you can't get the trinity without it. He's explicitly said on video "you can infer the trinity without it"
If Trinitarian feels that they have to LIE and ADD to the Bible, in a court of law this would make them have NO CREDIBILITY.
But worse:
"If anyone makes an addition to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this scroll; and if anyone takes anything away from the words of the scroll of this prophecy, God will take his portion away from the trees of life"
@mayuhavepeace Add to the Bible?...There is only one bible, that is, the Latin Vulgate(you know the original) and this verse is included in it. It was accepted and cannonized by the united church. It is only modernism to remove this verse that is in the original version of the bible.
@mayuhavepeace I can give you a hundred scholars that disagree! How can it have been added if it was in the ORIGINAL CANNON smart one?
There are 8 early Greek manuscriptes (Greek miniscules 88, 221, 429, 629, 636). Furthermore, there is abundant support for 1 John 5:7 from the Latin translations.
I agree with Dr Wallace on this point. You would think that at the council of nicea (Which was more about who Jesus was than about the trinity) they would have used this scripture if it truly did exist. My question is, why did the church see a need for putting this verse in the bible when the bible teaches very clearly that God is triune?
Actually I would not say that the bible "very clearly" teaches that God is triune. I mean I really cannot see ANY justification for the claim that the Holy Spirit, which is the spirit of God, is depicted as a PERSON. It is quite clear I think that the Spirit of God is the power of God which works in the believer and also is shown as a creative power or essence of God for example in Genesis1:2 or 6:3 but certainly no PERSON.
Surely you must understand that the personification of the holy spirit here is not the same as saying it is a person.
Otherwise how would you take to this:
"But if it is by means of God’s finger I expel the demons..."
In what way is the holy spirit God's FINGER? Also, when the spirit is spoken of as a "helper" (or a tool) in Greek is male gender, EVEN when the helper is FEMALE. But when spirit is on its own, it is neutral gender and is "it".
@mayuhavepeace This guy in this vid is a liar (Greek miniscules 88, 221, 429, 629, 636). proves him wrong! The original bible(Latin Vulgate 382 A.D.) proves him wrong! But even this liar on the vid will not speak against the trinity unlike you. "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word WAS GOD....And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us" John1:1 and John 1:14....GOD the word or GOD the son which ever you like.
@mayuhavepeace "Wherever Jesus is there is the Catholic church...Whoever opposes the bishop does in reality serve the devil" ~ St Ignatius 80-107 A.D. Ordained Bishop by peter in Antioch(where they where first called Christians) understudy of John the apostle, and the child Jesus set in front of his apostles and said unless you become like this child you will not enter the kingdom of heaven. Ignatius willing died for the faith in Rome where he was eaten by Lions.
@VegetaAlby "Jesus did not start the catholic church, its was the roman empire."
The Roman Empire hunted down and killed Catholics untill the year 313, when they llegalized Christianity..Every Pope(I mean every one) untill the 4th century was martryed by the empire....sry but you should do some research before you post.
The poor soul in this video is greatly deceived. He has believed the serpent's lies that "it is not in the earliest manuscripts". This Satanic lie is on almost every page of Satan's NIV Bible!
The Bible says that all scripture is given by inspiration of God.
Only a fool would believe the lies of Satan's theologians over the scripture.
There is no trinity in the Bible, and there is no trinity in 1 John 5:7.
There are 3 ways that God bore witness of the fact that eternal life is in his Son.
Wow...The Apostolic Fathers must have had a time machine, because they qouted I John 5:7 in the first century. Who inspired and preserved the Word of God? God? or Man?
1 John 5:7 doesn't support the Trinity even if IT wasn't FALSIFIED. Jesus is not mentioned in the verse! The SPOKEN & Written word of Yahweh is not a man! Words we speak are not a piece of flesh meat. That's absurd, totally ridiculous and supreme gibberish! Yahweh IS the Father, The SPOKEN & Written word IS the Word, and the Spirit lives inside Yahweh's being. Exodus 24:9-10 proves that Yahweh has a Body of Heaven in His Clearness. He has FEET. And He must have legs to walk with Abraham! LOL
And my point being the spirit is one with YHWH and His Son YAHSHUA HA MASHIACH again he said in Genesis 1:26 OUR image and OUR likeness Yahshua aint GOD yeh hes from GOD he said when you see me you see the father like father like son? get it, Picture Yahshua Black woolly hair Black coloured skin He looked just like his FATHER!!
And dont forget when he left he said you will recieve the helper the spirit from YHWH the Holy spirit so although we say the 3 are 1 it true we all come from the creator but you have to believe on the SON Yahshua he is our SAVIOUR he was given everthing by the FATHER Yahweh
YHWH= Yahweh gave us Yahshua his son his only begotten son rite he Yahshua was Yahwehs secret weapon to redeem mankind to bring us back to our mighty creator YAH hope you are getting this brethren Yahshua was the word who became flesh he was in the begining like he said. Just like abram gave his son as a living sacrafice, but satan didnt know this?? if he did he wouldnt have nailed Yahshua on the cross. Yahshua said it is FINISHED!! HalleluYah And YHWH said lets make man in "OUR" image Dad&Son
Why doesn't Wallace mention the Complutensian Polyglot? It was printed before Erasmus and contains 1 John 5:7. It was printed in Spain and they used many different Manuscripts than what Erasmus used. Wallace claims that it was ADDED to the bible in 1522. That is false. Jerome cites it in his epistle to Eustochium and wants to know why it was excluded (450 A.D.). John Calvin said: see that IT IS FOUND IN THE BEST AND MOST APPROVED COPIES. Calvin and Beza had access to numerous Waldensian bibles.
There is plenty of internal evidence to prove that 1 John 5:7 should be in the Bible. Not to mention there are a number of verses in the new translations that are put in even though they are in the minority of manuscripts. You have to look at the entire picture and 1 John 5:7 DOES belong in God's perfect Word today.
If these people were being "inspired" by God, I wondered, then why did they need to put these words into other people's mouths (in our example, in the mouth of John). Why did they not just openly say "God inspired me and I will add a chapter to the Bible in my name"? Also, why did God need to wait till after the departure of Jesus to "inspire" his "true" nature? Why not let Jesus say it himself?
This is just another attempt to attack the Holy Trinity and fools fall for it. Stand for Jesus or fall for anything. I'd be scared to death if I were some of you coz apparently you don't know Jesus, therefore He doesn't know you. You're just "religious people". Why are you fools so scared that Jesus is infact included in the Godhead, therefore being God? Let's just throw the Bible away and switch to watchtower material like the Jehovah's Witnesses did.
@DeeStinger1 holy trinity is not written in the bible, Jesus is long gone before they teach about the holy trinity, then they add verses to the bible just to justify their claim about the trinity, the bible is been long completed already before they add that teaching for what reason? the bible said do not add or subtract any of the scriptures has been written, rite? so y accept it? it should be discarded out of the bible, coz it confuse man for believing that god is three in one, not only one
@TheLeonguerrero005 The Holy Trinity is all through the Bible even without 1John 5:7. The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are are together and go hand in hand. I believe all scripture is inspired by God. How do we know they're being truthful in saying that passage was added later and isn't supposed to be in there? Satan is slick. I don't trust anything contrary to scripture. The Spirit perfectly comprehends the three in one. The world can't.
@DeeStinger1 satan is tricky thats y they tried to insert that verse hehehe, have u read in the bible the word trinity? even that u had read The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are are together and go hand in hand it doesn't mean that they were 3 in 1 like coffee, hehehe, if the father(god) and Jesus(Christ) r 1 person or entity how come Jesus dont know when the exact tym will he come on this earth again and only the father knows when, do u know something that ur other self dont know? hehehe
@TheLeonguerrero005 You can't seem to discern when Jesus was speaking as a mere man (Son Of Man) vs when He was talking as the Son Of God. The fact that Jesus didn't know the time shows His complete humanity. When He came to earth He left His Godly attributes in Heaven. You sound more like a Jehovah's Witness. You can't grasp the concept of a three in one. Are you one of His or just a pretender (Matt.7:21-23)? Dumb question coz you believe Jesus is a created being. You're not Christian.
@DeeStinger1 hahaha that was funny, son of god rite? being a son means created by his father rite? so who created jesus? his father rite? that is y he is called son! hahaha so there is two gods? 1 who is in heaven and the other 1 came down to be a man? or he just left his godness to heaven while his other half become human and they where talking to each other like a different entity? nice 1, what bible r u reading? that there is two real gods? or god left his other self to heaven? hahaha
@TheLeonguerrero005 God doesn't need or have kids in the same sense that we do. The word trinity is not found, but the meaning is found all throughout the Bible. You'll never get it so I won't even bother talking to you, kid, hehehe. Get Born Again and you'll have the Spirit to lead you into truth. Without the Spirit, you're none of His. You're just a "religious person"
@DeeStinger1 u said "Lets make man in our image"? now God doesn't need or have kids in the same sense that we do, am older than u! hahaha coz u r just born again that is y u think like a kid! and dont know how to count yet, 1+1+1=3 not 1+1+1=1, hahah, think man, dont just listen to wat ur pastor say, read the bible again, u will c wat im talking about, there is only 1 god and that is the Father, he said You shall have no other gods before Me! if Jesus is god, who is his son?
@DeeStinger1 : any way nice talking to u, good luck on ur 3 in 1 belief, or if i were u make it make more if u want, coz David is also called the son of God, and God send 7 holy spirits on revelation, and Adam been born differently like Jesus, ang moses been called God in Exodus, and the king in Tiro, there is a lot that u dont know in the bible, ur just conclude some of ur belief not something u had read in the bible, be satisfied wat the bible teach u dont ever add something that isnt there
@DeeStinger1 and y put that verse in the bible if that kind of thing is already there? if Jesus and the Father is a 1 being or god, who is the Christ or the mediator between god and man? if Jesus is the 1 called god? and Jesus claim that he has a god, the one he called father, do u think the father(god) will call Jesus his God too? to prove that they were equal? god(father) is the creator of all things, jesus(christ) is a creation of god, God(father) give, , jesus(christ) receive all from god
@DeeStinger1 The Spirit perfectly comprehends the three in one. The world can't.? almost all of the Christian i know believe in that kind of theory or teaching, even the whole world thinks that all the Christians believe that Jesus is God, hehehe, how come u said that the world can't? only the true Christian knows who is the real God, the god that Jesus and the apostles teach to the early Christians, and that is the Father the only one true God, not him, coz he is the only 1 Christ, peace
@TheLeonguerrero005 Yes, the Spirit comprehends Trinity, the world doesn't (1Cor.2:14). "Trinity" is not found in scripture. Neither is "Bible". The term is used to describe the triune God - three coexistent, co-eternal Persons who make up God. The Bible teaches that the Father is God, Jesus is God, and that the Holy Spirit is God. There is only ONE God. These three persons of the Triune God (Godhead) took subordinate roles to each other in order to fulfill their redemptive plan for man. Hehehe
@DeeStinger1 ha? yes u can read the father is god, but Jesus is God and Holy Spirit is God, where in the bible have u read it? so y teach Trinity if it is not in the bible? y did Jesus and the apostles did not even mention that word if that is important to mankind to know the composition o god? u r rite about the composition of man coz it is written in the bible, how come the most important thing like trinity of god is not even mention until Constantine declares it, he is not even a Christian
@DeeStinger1 u admitted that the trinity is not in the bible, so y have an idea that Jesus or the apostle did not even mention it? did they know it? if they know it, y not say it or put it in the bible? that is important if it is true rite? 'yes' The Bible teaches that the Father is God but Jesus is God, and that the? where in the bible had u read the phrases "Jesus is God" or "Holy Spirit is God"? u will say that it is the same like trinity, hahahah,
@DeeStinger1 if u r God the almighty, y cant u just forgive man for their sin to u than to come here on earth to be a man just to be killed b4 u forgive them? that doesn't make any sense rite? thats the reason y he created Jesus to give a chance and save man to the wrath of God, not god become a man to be killed by man, heheheh
@TheLeonguerrero005 You yourself are a three in one. Even YOU are made up of a trinity. You have a Soul, (The real you) Body (the manifestation of the real you) and a Spirit (the part of the real you which connects with God). Why can't God be a trinity like you? Are you limiting The Almighty? Didn't He say "Lets make man in our image"?
@DeeStinger1 me are made up of a trinity? so i am God? like u said? hehehehe but i agree to what u have said about the composition of a man, coz it is written in the bible rite, but bcoz it was 3 it is trinity?, coz if it is called trinity, u will c the word trinity in the bible too rite? thats y u have guessed that god is also 3 in 1 too? hahaha, "Why can't God be a trinity like you? Are you limiting The Almighty?
@DeeStinger1 Why can't God be a trinity like you? Are you limiting The Almighty?
ans: coz God said " i am God not man" like Jesus said to 1 of his apostles" here i am touch me it is still me, a spirit doesn't have flesh and bones like a had" and God also said that he can't lie, u said do i limiting the Almighty god, YES, y? can your god lie? he said that there is "no other god like me", so he is only 1 not 3 in 1, coz if thats true, God is a liar, coz u said god became a man, "i am God not man"
The doctrine of the TRINITY is true & established by the bible & Jesus even w/o 1 John 5:7 Example: 1.) Which God can we all see? = Jesus Matt 4:7, 10 & Luke 4:8,12 2.) Which God can we NOT see or die? = God the Father Ex 33:20 3.) Which God IF BLASPHEMED will we NOT be 4given? = Holy Spirit Matt12:31-32 Jesus is God of OT. How else could Jacob say: "... I have seen God face to face, & my life is preserved." -- Gen 32:30 B/c God does NOT lie. "No man hath seen God at any time..." John 1:18
The Father is the only true God (1 Corinthians 8:6)
Do you believe what the Hindu believe and there trinity ?
Do you not know that its not just Muslim that believe in one God but the Jews and did you know Jesus was Jew. Jews always have and always will believe in only One God by Himself with no co-equals Jesus agreed with them when the said this to him (Mark 12:28-34)
Did you know that God name is not Trinity or Allah it is YHWH
@SupernaturalGifts777 . Hi mate, YHWH is the secret name of god. However, more than 2575 times the other name of god was mentioned in the Old Testament it is Elohim and the singular of this word is ELOH . Eloh and ELAH (أله) . Elohim and ALAHOM (اللهم). Quite similar are they ??. If you read some part of the holy Quran you will find out the following : Mohammad was mentioned 4 Times.
There is a difference between the phrase being quoted and having an actual manuscript. Dr. Wallace makes the case that the manuscript for this verse was not available to Erasmus to provide justification for his translation in this verse. The wording of this verse is debated in part because other writings quote this phrase in a format that looks more like the Trinitarian formula Dr. Wallace mentions. 1 Jn. 5:7 does not have the Trinitarian wording found in the earliest manuscripts.
He didn't. An ALLUSION is not a quotation. You are referring to the ALLEGED quotation by Cyprian. Why not check out Wallace's article on that very subject? Furthermore, you have another problem you must explain: how did this VANISH from every single vestige on earth except the Latin, where it began in about the fourth century? This does not speak well for any doctrine of 'preservation.'
This man who is speaking is a blinded fool. 1 John 5:7 does not say anything about a trinity...it speaks of 3 that bear witness of the fact that eternal life is in the Son of God. It also makes perfect sense in the context in which it was written by John. There is no trinity in the Bible; and those who know Jesus Christ know that. And to the saints of God there is no allusion to any triune god in this, or any, verse of scripture. It is only the unlearned and unstable who believe there is...
Zechariah 12:10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for [his] only [son], and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for [his] firstborn.
----- Ye workers of Satan will get your reward for your lies!
Donking595 4 weeks ago
Amazing!A rare admission of truth about the Bible.Now if they can just keep this truth search going they might find much more.For example,start by comparing the Gospel of Mark with the Gospel of Matthew.Compare the two gospels verse by verse and you will see that Matthew copies Mark word for word on over 600 occasions but makes several changes and additions along the way.Then allow your reason to function properly and you will clearly see that Matthew was making corrections to Mark's gospel.
seektruthandwisdom 1 month ago
..cont..but the word biblia was specifically generated to give a title to the Latin text that came out of Hippo. It does not reffer to any manuscript or any greek translation but solly to the cannon of the church that came from Hippo.
gtepp031387 1 month ago
There is no Greek text that has the word biblia in it, as that would be impossible, as the letters in biblia are Latin and not Greek. The word biblia was first put to use after the council of Hippo in which the church came together and selected from 100's of books what was to be the cannon of the church. It is a transliterazation of the Greek word "βιβλία"(see the Greek lettering) and holds one of the same meanings "books"..cont...
gtepp031387 1 month ago
Cyprian quotes 1 John 5:7 fairly clearly "and the three are one"....He lived in circa 250....
TheChaseair 1 month ago
I'll bet you can find an excuse to remove Acts 2:38 and Acts 22:16 and Mark 16:18 too!
atpilot 1 month ago 2
Hayyy, what an adamant character... the council of Hippo collected certain books based on a 'canon'. Which came first? The synod, or the manuscripts? The manuscripts, of course, otherwise, they have nothing to collect. But then the books they were collecting contain the word BIBLIA, so the word Biblia is NOT post Hippo and NOT an invention. It's just that for The First Time, the canonical books gathered as one book was named Biblia, just like the LXX, Torah, etc. People, what do you think?
corkystorky 1 month ago
For my final remark: Is Biblia an invention? See wikipedia's statement of the etimology: The English word Bible is from the Latin biblia, from the same word in Medieval Latin and Late Latin and ultimately from Greek τὰ βιβλία ta biblia "the books" (singular βιβλίον biblion). --- See? The Latin biblia was from the Greek biblia, and was not an invention. The LXX's Ecclesiastes 12:12 contains the word biblia. Thanks again!
corkystorky 1 month ago
So therefore, they gave credit to where credit is due, if the MSS is from Greek then it is fitting to call the 'books' as Biblia as the proper name. Biblia was not an invention, but a Latin adaptation from the Greek Biblia.
corkystorky 1 month ago
The Greek manuscripts were written in Greek, then later about the 4th century Jerome translated it to Latin (a.k.a. Vulgate). The Latin community have the Latin manuscripts but they do not call it in a collective form as 'Libri'. Latins' book is libro, if they do not know that book is biblos in Greek, then it will be for the first time in their hearing to hear Biblia as the name of the 'books' and not Libri. Why Biblia? Because before Latin, the MSS are Greek and biblia was derived from it.
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky tdude I have said like 5 times now it was a transliteration from the greek..do you understand?...
q 1) Did the word Biblia exist in beofre hippo?...if so please give me the latin quotation of someone using it???
Refuted?...lol...there was no word biblia before hippo this is a historical fact period...if not then please post the use of it before Hippo...I will be waiting.........
gtepp031387 1 month ago
@gtepp031387 You are changing your original statements to save your face? Ok that's it, if that's how you put it. Try asking a Greek if the word biblia can be found in their bibles - we're speaking of 'word' in its basic nature, not all the world is Latin.
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky Words are either written or spoken, neither was the word biblia written nor spoken before the council of Hippo. Niether does the meaning of the Greek tranliterized word have the same meaning as the Latin word. That is becaues the latin word also reffers to the offical and closed cannon, a meaning that the Greek does not have, thus not only is it a different word in letter and sound but in meaning as well!
gtepp031387 1 month ago
Comment removed
corkystorky 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Mathew 11:11, 3:11, 28:19, John 14:6, 1John 5:6(HS witness),7-8 Gen 1:26,
John 1:1-51 is John's testimony(6-10) of the divinity if Christ. all 51 verses 1:1 referst to Genisis chapter 1. 1:1 the word God is translated from the word Eloheem, which is the plural form Eloah (aka El) Eloah means almighty.
the HS is mentioned in Gen 1:2
Gen 1:3,6,9,11,14,20,24, God spoke
If this guy is right you have to take out 2Tim 3:16 to and the above mentioned verses
suggesttwo 2 months ago
1 John 5:7 is even quoted in the early church fathers writings, i.e., in the 2nd century, (Apostolic Fathers, vol.5, page 418); thus, the 'Textus Receptus' Greek New Testament - has it right - and as it is translated in the KJV..
stevenhamilton9 3 months ago
@stevenhamilton9 I have read all of the apostolic fathers sans Shepherd of Hermas over the last two weeks, and I don't recall ever seeing any of them quote this verse. Can you reference me which writing specifically? Thanks.
hobopotato 2 months ago
@stevenhamilton9 who exactly of the early church fathers quoted 1 john 5:7, may I know
corkystorky 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@corkystorky "who exactly of the early church fathers quoted 1 john 5:7, may I know?"
1) 200 AD - Tertullian(not a father but still quoted this verse)
2) 250 AD - St Cyprian of Carthage
3) 350 AD - St Priscillian
4) 350 AD - St Athanasius
5) 398 AD - St Augustine...shall I go on?
gtepp031387 1 month ago
trinitarians are pagans, they divide god into 3 persons, they believe in 3 gods, not 1. the early christians like Ebonites, the Corinthians, the Basilidians, the Capocratians, and the Hypisistarians never know about trinity doctrine at all. they were not trinitarians..
VegetaAlby 4 months ago
@VegetaAlby "We believe in one GOD the father the almighty" ~ Catholic creed...we believe Jesus is GOD from GOD eternally begotten of the father, the very LOGOS(mental though of GOD) who was with GOD being GOD in the begging...and the word was GOD...and the word took flesh and dwelt among us.
gtepp031387 4 months ago
@VegetaAlby Trinitarians believe in 3 persons and 3 Gods not 1? Somebody needs to learn their history. Trinitarians believe in 1God who has revealed himself in 3 personages not persons. Get it right. 3 personages revealed in the nature of the 1 true God.
NHBChristianTalk 3 months ago
@NHBChristianTalk LOL, trinitarians belive in 1 god that consist of 3 seperate person. father, son and the holy spirit. the father is not the son, the son is not the father, But they both are God .. LoL
VegetaAlby 3 months ago
@VegetaAlby Wow, are you really that ignorant? We do not believe in 3 separate persons and I don't know where you're getting your faulty information but it's funny to see the misrepresentation of the Trinity doctrine, LOL. I never said the Father was the Son, go read my post again because you obviously can't read to understand. I said, ONE God who has revealed himself in THREE PERSONAGES NOT PERSONS like Peter, James and John. You are making the separations like people, WRONG!
NHBChristianTalk 3 months ago
@NHBChristianTalk are you referring to THREE PERSONAGES like: Yesterday I revealed myself as batman by wearing the batman uniform, today as superman, and tomorrow will be as The Flash. Is that how it works?
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky That is funny but no. I am referring to One God by name and title in which the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit share. Three distinct personages, one name. Look up the word personage in Webster if your still confused.
NHBChristianTalk 1 month ago
@NHBChristianTalk Personage: 1. a Person of importance or distinction; notable 2. any Person 3. a character in history, play, a novel, etc. --- Based on that def'n, what you said about God revealing himself in 3 personages not persons, can be either 3 separate beings at the same time (like 3 judges of the American Idol), or the example I gave in batman, superman, then the Flash. You rejected the first and the second, but the definition of personage supports either one or both.
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky Personage: 1. a Person of importance or distinction: Or distinction is what I am going for. Within the nature of the One True God there are 3 distinct personages that have been revealed, the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. Thats it.
NHBChristianTalk 1 month ago
@NHBChristianTalk Let me see how it works, how about: 2 atoms of hydrogen and 1 atom of oxygen are 3 distinct atoms, yet together they form what is called water. If Elohiym is like that then the Trinity is a composition of 3 persons united and yet each having their own faculties that distinguishes one from the other, just like a foot and hand and head that forms the one body. I'm not sure if the analogy is close to the Trinity :)
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky someone said that the word Trinity does not exist in the bible, but I say the essence is there, like, we do not read elsewhere in the bible the words 2 atoms of hydrogens plus 1 atom of oxygen, but which are components of what we read in the bible Water. Christians united I can call Christinity, which is not even in the dictionary. Again, I'm not sure if anything I said make sense :)
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky You have the right idea. One YHWH by name and title, yet three distinct personages who share that name and title. Not separate people like Peter, James and John but distinct.
NHBChristianTalk 1 month ago
The word 'trinity' isn't even Scriptural. Trinity is a manmade doctrine that borrows heavily from pagan sources. Scripture tells us God is One *not* three. Ultimately the trinity doctrine seeks to limit our heavenly Father to merely one-third of the godhead. Isn't it easier to just accept Scripture at Its Word? We have One God, and He can manifest Himself in any form He chooses without needing to be subdivided to fit the manmade doctrines.
VegetaAlby 4 months ago
@VegetaAlby Jesus is the word of GOD, the LOGOS of the father, he was in the beggging with GOD being GOD. The Spirit is the spirit of the father and the son, in the begging with the father being GOD from GOD, generated by the father alone but sent out by the LOGOS of the father. Jesus says the father is greater then he is, how do you understand this? He spoke to the father on several occasions if he is merly a form of GOD then who is he speaking too?...What your teaching is called Modalism
gtepp031387 4 months ago
@gtepp031387 Jesus said the father is greater than me, so the trinity is false, because u guys says that the son the father and the holy spirit are co-equal..
VegetaAlby 4 months ago
@VegetaAlby The humanity of Jesus is less then the father, but the divinity in the son is not....as Jesus is fully GOD, "In Christ Jesus is the fullness of the divinity"..The divinity is similar to the occurrence when one fire enkindles another. It is not diminished through the enkindling of the other, but remains as it was
gtepp031387 4 months ago
and the word trinity was used 150 years after Jesus by tertullian, why is that? so no one beforde knew nothing about any trinity...
VegetaAlby 4 months ago
@VegetaAlby All the words in your english bible did not come about till the english languide was invented, does that mean there meaning is not in the bible, becaues the word is not?...In fact the word bible, comes from the word biblia and is not found in the bible.
gtepp031387 4 months ago
@gtepp031387 what do you mean biblia is not found in the bible? are you referring to the greek word from which the stem of the word biblia came from?
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky The bible was put together by the church, is what i was saying. Do you see a table of contents in the original books anywhere? Do you think the bible fell from the sky all compiled?...The bible has a history and to deny this is to deny truth, and to deny truth is to deny Jesus. The bible was put together by the holy fathers of old, to deny the holy fathers is to deny the bible.
gtepp031387 1 month ago
@gtepp031387 no, that is not how I understood your previous statement ;) I was referring to the word biblos, which is in the bible. Biblia is books, plural I think.
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky biblia is a Latin word, and is not in the bible. Find me the Latin word biblia in the Greek text i dare you???
gtepp031387 1 month ago
@gtepp031387 that is inconsistent because it's like finding a dog in the planet mars. Use an english dictionary, words are defined in english not latin, but through etimology you get around the nature of words. If you use a latin bible you will see what you are looking for, if you read greek then you will see the equivalent. Sometimes you have to got to reason based on 1+1=2. That attitude will not suit further intelligent conversation, i'm sorry.
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky Actually you will not see the word biblia in the Latin bible...This is becaues the word biblia is a speacial transliteration of the Greek "βιβλία", it is specific to the version of scripture that came from the council of Hippo. Latin already had a word for book, "liber", which is used in the "biblia"... The bible is a specific compliation that came from the Catholic church, the word biblia did not exist before the council of Hippo.
gtepp031387 1 month ago
@gtepp031387 there are many verses in the latin bible that contain the word libri, for books, now biblos (book) biblia (books) all refer to what we know as books which are in different mode of compilations because technology are different from stages or ephoch of history. In Old English they use the word Godspel which is now as Gospel, both referring to the same thing. Not that godspel no longer exist doesn't mean gospel arrived only in our times.
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky Bud you can rant and rave, kick and scream all you want...it will never change the historical fact that the word biblia was invented to give a title to the compilation of scripture that was put together by the council of Hippo, that was held under St Augsutine in 393 A.D....before which the word biblia did not exist.
gtepp031387 1 month ago
@gtepp031387 you have a limited idea of what WORD means. A word is used to convey an idea, this is why speaking in tongues was important in he early church to communicate the gospel. A russian and a chinese may use different words about a unicorn, but the image of a unicorn is the same in their minds. That's how words work, they are processed by the brain to pick up the variable stored in the memory that matches it, otherwise you will not be using a translating device.
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky lol..dude what is the point of this discussion. My point is valid, the word biblia did not exist before Hippo period. Every version of scripture has a name to it, every one. The Jews have the Tanakh,or the Torah,these are specific compilations of scripture. The apostles used a compilation know as the Septuagint. Even what modern english reffer to as the manuscriptes, all have titles to them, every one. The biblia is more then a manuscripte it is the cannon of the church
gtepp031387 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@gtepp031387 "biblia is a Latin word, and is not in the bible. Find me the Latin word biblia in the Greek text i dare you???" --- this is what you said. Here's my answer: John 21:25 and 2 Tim.4:13. You cannot invent something that already exists, and besides, what they collected as manuscripts, including the septuagint perhaps, are greek so no wonder they'll adapt the greek word and then added it to their dictionary in the plural nominative case.
corkystorky 1 month ago
Comment removed
corkystorky 1 month ago
@gtepp031387 The Bible is Ta Biblia in Greek, in the neuter gender, nominative and accusative case, in case you don't know how to read Greek. The latin for book is libro, as in the latin vulgate. since the manuscripts were in greek, so naturally they will use biblos instead of libro. Like the book Noli Me Tangere, it was written in Spanish so the title should be in spanish, otherwise if you use a chinese title on that then the Spaniards would not identify the book as spanish. :)
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky biblos is not a greek word, how could it be it is latin lettering. Biblia is a transliteration of Greek which I have already explained. The word did not exist before the titleing of the cannon produced at Hippo. There was no bible before Hippo and there was no word biblia before Hippo and that is a historical fact. The cannon was yet to be closed untill the church met in council to discuss the matter, and it was dun using the tradition of the Catholic church.
gtepp031387 1 month ago
@gtepp031387 "biblos is not a greek word" --- you know words are not limited to writing, words are oral by nature. To say that biblos is not a greek word because it is not wrtten in its greek letters is absurd. If I am Latin and I named a book Biblia, I don't have to write that title in the greek letters because the Latin community who does not know how to read Greek would not understand.
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky This convo is pointless...the word as spelled B-I-B-L-I-A did not exist untill after the council of Hippo. That is plain historical fact.
gtepp031387 1 month ago
@gtepp031387 the reason it will be pointless is because you make premises that are fallacious, like 'biblos is not greek' and 'biblia is not to be found in the greek bible'. Hence you conclusion is not as solid as it is supposed to be because you planted premises that is soundly refuted. I know your point all along, I just wanted to see if you know where your lines of arguments are.
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky biblio is not Greek it is Latin there is no Grrek word biblio or biblia...Greek words do not use the Latin alphabet smart one. ...The origien of the word Biblia is post Hippo.
gtepp031387 1 month ago
@gtepp031387 again, words are conveyed not by letters only. Speaking of origins, the origin of biblia is not post hippo. "Origin", "Invent" "Word" - define them so you'll know what you are talking about.
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky try asking a grek if the word biblia can be found in there bibles....go ahead search everyone of them you will not find it. Save face??? Your the one talking gibberish.
Again please post anyone in the world that used the word biblia before Hippo??? can't do it then you have shown your self to be wrong. That is veery simple no need to talk gibberish...either the word was used before Hippo or not which one is it?? If it was used before Hippo then please post the source
gtepp031387 1 month ago
@gtepp031387 "Anyone in the world?" Okay, the Greeks are part of the world and they will know that in the oldest manuscripts there was the word Biblia (I already posted the verses). The oldest MSS were Before hippo. And I thought you're done wasting your time? Who's talking gibberish :)
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky Never did a greek use the word Biblia before Hippo, you posted no source. Again quote, and place the quote can be originally found, of someone using the word biblia before hippo....And I am just being silly really this covo is pointless you have been utterly refuted on all grounds, even you know this.
gtepp031387 1 month ago
@gtepp031387 then I quote the timothy, and then the greek church for reading 2 Tim. 4:13 - ton failonen on apelipon en Troadi par Karpo erkhomenos fere, kai ta Biblia, malista tas membranas. The greeks use biblia, not a chinese version or latin for the word books that they want to convey "Give me the books" (someone handed a spoon instead of books because the poor Greek doesn't know what biblos is.)
corkystorky 1 month ago
@gtepp031387 "Hey, what are those?" "Can't you see? It's a collection of libros" "Ahh, so it's a libro that contains many libros, so, what do you call that libro?" "Biblia." "Biblia? Never heard of it. What is biblia? It's not Latin of course." "Biblia is books." "Books? We call books Libri, why not use Libri instead, why 'INVENT' a new word?" "Biblia is books in Greek, you know, before we got our Latin MSS, they came from Grk MSS, and Greeks call libros biblia, so there." "Ahh."
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky This story is just a demonstration, or an 'invention' if you like. Biblia did not come from nowhere, as the word Invent would convey, but a mere adaptation to give the collection of libros a proper name.
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky ...Dunnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn..nn..nn..nn..with this convo...you have got to be either a troll or the sillyest man on the planet.
gtepp031387 1 month ago
@gtepp031387 I actually enjoyed our little sharing. Perhaps it would be different if we speak face to face because I hardly conveyed ideas with limited typing space. Until then, God bless :)
corkystorky 1 month ago
@corkystorky other them showing that you have not a clue this conversation is completely pointless...I am dun wasting my time on it.
gtepp031387 1 month ago
@gtepp031387 the compilation of scriptures is a series of books, and they already have a term to call for that. They don't have to invent something that already exists. They just decided to call it 'Books' (for biblia) other than what it can be called (like The Words of the Prophets, or A Collection of Scriptures, or A Compilation of Narratives, etc.) Biblia is simple and direct. Biblia was not an invention, but a word decided to be used to call the series of books in one fold.
corkystorky 1 month ago
there is no need for these weak doctrines that attempt to sub-divide the godhead in attempts to explain "how" He does it. Trinitarians start dividing up the godhead so that the Father is one person, the Son is a second person, and then the Ruach (spirit) is a third person.
VegetaAlby 4 months ago
I am convinced one reason why a trinitarian doctrine was incorporated into Christianity was to explain the 'person' of Jesus; to explain how he could be God. That God could take on human form as an earthly Messiah isn't difficult to accept -- afterall, He'd previously supped with Abraham (Gen 18) and He had wrestled with Jacob (Gen 32) *while also in human form*. Our powerful God can manifest Himself in many forms.
VegetaAlby 4 months ago
Jesus, as Yeshua, does NOT lie & compliments 1 John 5:7, Matt 28:19 & John 10:30 by confirming the existence of the TRINITY in John 14:26!
In following verse HS is (1), God the Father is (2) Jesus is (3)
John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost,(1) whom the Father (2) will send in my name(3), he(1) shall teach you all things, & bring all things to ur remembrance, whatsoever I(3) have said unto u.
Words NOT-IN-THE-Bible R: "Trinity", science, allah, Islam, quran, muslim, Muhammad
jefeisdguard 4 months ago
The Trinity claims that jesus is God in John 1:1 it rejects Jesus as the Christ
czyztko 5 months ago
Tertullian quotes from this verse in 200 A.D.
St Cyprian quotes from it in 250 A.D.
Priscillian quotes from it in 350 A.D.
St Athinasias also quotes from it in 350
St Augutine(perhaps the greatest theologian of all time) quotes from it in 398 A.D....ect If this verse was added it was added very early and without anyone protesting it's usage.
gtepp031387 5 months ago
What the guy says at 1:19 is a lie about Ehrman. Ehrman doesn't say you can't get the trinity without it. He's explicitly said on video "you can infer the trinity without it"
AR333 6 months ago
So it's not just JWs that point out this.
As they would say in a court of law:
"THIS GOES TOWARDS CREDIBILITY."
If Trinitarian feels that they have to LIE and ADD to the Bible, in a court of law this would make them have NO CREDIBILITY.
But worse:
"If anyone makes an addition to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this scroll; and if anyone takes anything away from the words of the scroll of this prophecy, God will take his portion away from the trees of life"
mayuhavepeace 6 months ago
@mayuhavepeace Add to the Bible?...There is only one bible, that is, the Latin Vulgate(you know the original) and this verse is included in it. It was accepted and cannonized by the united church. It is only modernism to remove this verse that is in the original version of the bible.
gtepp031387 5 months ago
@gtepp031387
Are you kidding? How can you be serious? The video is 100% correct and no modern scholar disputes the FACT. It WAS indeed added.
Maybe because you are NOT a scholar, but an UN-thinking Trinitarian?
There are NO available manuscripts available prior to the Middle Ages.
STILL TRUE TODAY.
So go ahead. It is believing a LIE. So is the Trinity - a LIE that would put a smile on the face of Satan. LOL
mayuhavepeace 5 months ago
@mayuhavepeace I can give you a hundred scholars that disagree! How can it have been added if it was in the ORIGINAL CANNON smart one?
There are 8 early Greek manuscriptes (Greek miniscules 88, 221, 429, 629, 636). Furthermore, there is abundant support for 1 John 5:7 from the Latin translations.
gtepp031387 5 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Harold Camping was RIGHT about May 21, click on my channel to see...
youneekk 7 months ago
I agree with Dr Wallace on this point. You would think that at the council of nicea (Which was more about who Jesus was than about the trinity) they would have used this scripture if it truly did exist. My question is, why did the church see a need for putting this verse in the bible when the bible teaches very clearly that God is triune?
October31st1517 9 months ago
@October31st1517
Actually I would not say that the bible "very clearly" teaches that God is triune. I mean I really cannot see ANY justification for the claim that the Holy Spirit, which is the spirit of God, is depicted as a PERSON. It is quite clear I think that the Spirit of God is the power of God which works in the believer and also is shown as a creative power or essence of God for example in Genesis1:2 or 6:3 but certainly no PERSON.
yozkopf3000 8 months ago
@yozkopf3000 Can you please read Acts 13:2? Not only does it PROVE the Holy Ghost is a PERSON but is also God Himself. Let me know what you think.
October31st1517 8 months ago
@October31st1517
Surely you must understand that the personification of the holy spirit here is not the same as saying it is a person.
Otherwise how would you take to this:
"But if it is by means of God’s finger I expel the demons..."
In what way is the holy spirit God's FINGER? Also, when the spirit is spoken of as a "helper" (or a tool) in Greek is male gender, EVEN when the helper is FEMALE. But when spirit is on its own, it is neutral gender and is "it".
How do you explain IT ???
mayuhavepeace 6 months ago
@mayuhavepeace This guy in this vid is a liar (Greek miniscules 88, 221, 429, 629, 636). proves him wrong! The original bible(Latin Vulgate 382 A.D.) proves him wrong! But even this liar on the vid will not speak against the trinity unlike you. "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word WAS GOD....And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us" John1:1 and John 1:14....GOD the word or GOD the son which ever you like.
gtepp031387 5 months ago
@gtepp031387
Are you a Catholic?
mayuhavepeace 5 months ago
@mayuhavepeace "Wherever Jesus is there is the Catholic church...Whoever opposes the bishop does in reality serve the devil" ~ St Ignatius 80-107 A.D. Ordained Bishop by peter in Antioch(where they where first called Christians) understudy of John the apostle, and the child Jesus set in front of his apostles and said unless you become like this child you will not enter the kingdom of heaven. Ignatius willing died for the faith in Rome where he was eaten by Lions.
gtepp031387 5 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@gtepp031387
You believe in Evolution?
mayuhavepeace 5 months ago
@gtepp031387 Jesus did not start the catholic church, its was the roman empire..
VegetaAlby 4 months ago
@VegetaAlby "Jesus did not start the catholic church, its was the roman empire."
The Roman Empire hunted down and killed Catholics untill the year 313, when they llegalized Christianity..Every Pope(I mean every one) untill the 4th century was martryed by the empire....sry but you should do some research before you post.
gtepp031387 4 months ago
The poor soul in this video is greatly deceived. He has believed the serpent's lies that "it is not in the earliest manuscripts". This Satanic lie is on almost every page of Satan's NIV Bible!
The Bible says that all scripture is given by inspiration of God.
Only a fool would believe the lies of Satan's theologians over the scripture.
There is no trinity in the Bible, and there is no trinity in 1 John 5:7.
There are 3 ways that God bore witness of the fact that eternal life is in his Son.
wordprophet 10 months ago
interesting
volcombmth 11 months ago
Another problem is Matthew 28:19 in ancient verse are not quoted the words: father, son and holy spirit, just ---- in my name.
And the apostles were baptized in the name of Jesus.
TheEl7ohim 11 months ago
Was it not inserted in the century XIII?
TheEl7ohim 11 months ago
Comment removed
TheEl7ohim 11 months ago
Wow...The Apostolic Fathers must have had a time machine, because they qouted I John 5:7 in the first century. Who inspired and preserved the Word of God? God? or Man?
VeryImagesozo 11 months ago
1 John 5:7 doesn't support the Trinity even if IT wasn't FALSIFIED. Jesus is not mentioned in the verse! The SPOKEN & Written word of Yahweh is not a man! Words we speak are not a piece of flesh meat. That's absurd, totally ridiculous and supreme gibberish! Yahweh IS the Father, The SPOKEN & Written word IS the Word, and the Spirit lives inside Yahweh's being. Exodus 24:9-10 proves that Yahweh has a Body of Heaven in His Clearness. He has FEET. And He must have legs to walk with Abraham! LOL
upNyaBizznizz 1 year ago
And my point being the spirit is one with YHWH and His Son YAHSHUA HA MASHIACH again he said in Genesis 1:26 OUR image and OUR likeness Yahshua aint GOD yeh hes from GOD he said when you see me you see the father like father like son? get it, Picture Yahshua Black woolly hair Black coloured skin He looked just like his FATHER!!
murrayoflight 1 year ago
And dont forget when he left he said you will recieve the helper the spirit from YHWH the Holy spirit so although we say the 3 are 1 it true we all come from the creator but you have to believe on the SON Yahshua he is our SAVIOUR he was given everthing by the FATHER Yahweh
murrayoflight 1 year ago
YHWH= Yahweh gave us Yahshua his son his only begotten son rite he Yahshua was Yahwehs secret weapon to redeem mankind to bring us back to our mighty creator YAH hope you are getting this brethren Yahshua was the word who became flesh he was in the begining like he said. Just like abram gave his son as a living sacrafice, but satan didnt know this?? if he did he wouldnt have nailed Yahshua on the cross. Yahshua said it is FINISHED!! HalleluYah And YHWH said lets make man in "OUR" image Dad&Son
murrayoflight 1 year ago
Why doesn't Wallace mention the Complutensian Polyglot? It was printed before Erasmus and contains 1 John 5:7. It was printed in Spain and they used many different Manuscripts than what Erasmus used. Wallace claims that it was ADDED to the bible in 1522. That is false. Jerome cites it in his epistle to Eustochium and wants to know why it was excluded (450 A.D.). John Calvin said: see that IT IS FOUND IN THE BEST AND MOST APPROVED COPIES. Calvin and Beza had access to numerous Waldensian bibles.
TextusReceptusBible 1 year ago
There is plenty of internal evidence to prove that 1 John 5:7 should be in the Bible. Not to mention there are a number of verses in the new translations that are put in even though they are in the minority of manuscripts. You have to look at the entire picture and 1 John 5:7 DOES belong in God's perfect Word today.
REDRAGON12345 1 year ago
what other lies have they put in the King James Bible to prove that false doctrine
clevelandshero23 1 year ago
@clevelandshero23 illogical...begging the question
EastofForever 1 year ago
cool knowledge really enjoy.. thanks for sending me the vid......
teyacapan 1 year ago
If these people were being "inspired" by God, I wondered, then why did they need to put these words into other people's mouths (in our example, in the mouth of John). Why did they not just openly say "God inspired me and I will add a chapter to the Bible in my name"? Also, why did God need to wait till after the departure of Jesus to "inspire" his "true" nature? Why not let Jesus say it himself?
TheLeonguerrero005 1 year ago
This is just another attempt to attack the Holy Trinity and fools fall for it. Stand for Jesus or fall for anything. I'd be scared to death if I were some of you coz apparently you don't know Jesus, therefore He doesn't know you. You're just "religious people". Why are you fools so scared that Jesus is infact included in the Godhead, therefore being God? Let's just throw the Bible away and switch to watchtower material like the Jehovah's Witnesses did.
DeeStinger1 1 year ago
@DeeStinger1 holy trinity is not written in the bible, Jesus is long gone before they teach about the holy trinity, then they add verses to the bible just to justify their claim about the trinity, the bible is been long completed already before they add that teaching for what reason? the bible said do not add or subtract any of the scriptures has been written, rite? so y accept it? it should be discarded out of the bible, coz it confuse man for believing that god is three in one, not only one
TheLeonguerrero005 1 year ago
@TheLeonguerrero005 The Holy Trinity is all through the Bible even without 1John 5:7. The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are are together and go hand in hand. I believe all scripture is inspired by God. How do we know they're being truthful in saying that passage was added later and isn't supposed to be in there? Satan is slick. I don't trust anything contrary to scripture. The Spirit perfectly comprehends the three in one. The world can't.
DeeStinger1 1 year ago
@DeeStinger1 satan is tricky thats y they tried to insert that verse hehehe, have u read in the bible the word trinity? even that u had read The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are are together and go hand in hand it doesn't mean that they were 3 in 1 like coffee, hehehe, if the father(god) and Jesus(Christ) r 1 person or entity how come Jesus dont know when the exact tym will he come on this earth again and only the father knows when, do u know something that ur other self dont know? hehehe
TheLeonguerrero005 1 year ago
@TheLeonguerrero005 You can't seem to discern when Jesus was speaking as a mere man (Son Of Man) vs when He was talking as the Son Of God. The fact that Jesus didn't know the time shows His complete humanity. When He came to earth He left His Godly attributes in Heaven. You sound more like a Jehovah's Witness. You can't grasp the concept of a three in one. Are you one of His or just a pretender (Matt.7:21-23)? Dumb question coz you believe Jesus is a created being. You're not Christian.
DeeStinger1 1 year ago
@DeeStinger1 hahaha that was funny, son of god rite? being a son means created by his father rite? so who created jesus? his father rite? that is y he is called son! hahaha so there is two gods? 1 who is in heaven and the other 1 came down to be a man? or he just left his godness to heaven while his other half become human and they where talking to each other like a different entity? nice 1, what bible r u reading? that there is two real gods? or god left his other self to heaven? hahaha
TheLeonguerrero005 1 year ago
@TheLeonguerrero005 God doesn't need or have kids in the same sense that we do. The word trinity is not found, but the meaning is found all throughout the Bible. You'll never get it so I won't even bother talking to you, kid, hehehe. Get Born Again and you'll have the Spirit to lead you into truth. Without the Spirit, you're none of His. You're just a "religious person"
DeeStinger1 1 year ago
@DeeStinger1 u said "Lets make man in our image"? now God doesn't need or have kids in the same sense that we do, am older than u! hahaha coz u r just born again that is y u think like a kid! and dont know how to count yet, 1+1+1=3 not 1+1+1=1, hahah, think man, dont just listen to wat ur pastor say, read the bible again, u will c wat im talking about, there is only 1 god and that is the Father, he said You shall have no other gods before Me! if Jesus is god, who is his son?
coz god has a son!
TheLeonguerrero005 1 year ago
@DeeStinger1 : any way nice talking to u, good luck on ur 3 in 1 belief, or if i were u make it make more if u want, coz David is also called the son of God, and God send 7 holy spirits on revelation, and Adam been born differently like Jesus, ang moses been called God in Exodus, and the king in Tiro, there is a lot that u dont know in the bible, ur just conclude some of ur belief not something u had read in the bible, be satisfied wat the bible teach u dont ever add something that isnt there
TheLeonguerrero005 1 year ago
@DeeStinger1 and y put that verse in the bible if that kind of thing is already there? if Jesus and the Father is a 1 being or god, who is the Christ or the mediator between god and man? if Jesus is the 1 called god? and Jesus claim that he has a god, the one he called father, do u think the father(god) will call Jesus his God too? to prove that they were equal? god(father) is the creator of all things, jesus(christ) is a creation of god, God(father) give, , jesus(christ) receive all from god
TheLeonguerrero005 1 year ago
@DeeStinger1 The Spirit perfectly comprehends the three in one. The world can't.? almost all of the Christian i know believe in that kind of theory or teaching, even the whole world thinks that all the Christians believe that Jesus is God, hehehe, how come u said that the world can't? only the true Christian knows who is the real God, the god that Jesus and the apostles teach to the early Christians, and that is the Father the only one true God, not him, coz he is the only 1 Christ, peace
TheLeonguerrero005 1 year ago
@TheLeonguerrero005 Yes, the Spirit comprehends Trinity, the world doesn't (1Cor.2:14). "Trinity" is not found in scripture. Neither is "Bible". The term is used to describe the triune God - three coexistent, co-eternal Persons who make up God. The Bible teaches that the Father is God, Jesus is God, and that the Holy Spirit is God. There is only ONE God. These three persons of the Triune God (Godhead) took subordinate roles to each other in order to fulfill their redemptive plan for man. Hehehe
DeeStinger1 1 year ago
@DeeStinger1 ha? yes u can read the father is god, but Jesus is God and Holy Spirit is God, where in the bible have u read it? so y teach Trinity if it is not in the bible? y did Jesus and the apostles did not even mention that word if that is important to mankind to know the composition o god? u r rite about the composition of man coz it is written in the bible, how come the most important thing like trinity of god is not even mention until Constantine declares it, he is not even a Christian
TheLeonguerrero005 1 year ago
@DeeStinger1 u admitted that the trinity is not in the bible, so y have an idea that Jesus or the apostle did not even mention it? did they know it? if they know it, y not say it or put it in the bible? that is important if it is true rite? 'yes' The Bible teaches that the Father is God but Jesus is God, and that the? where in the bible had u read the phrases "Jesus is God" or "Holy Spirit is God"? u will say that it is the same like trinity, hahahah,
TheLeonguerrero005 1 year ago
@DeeStinger1 if u r God the almighty, y cant u just forgive man for their sin to u than to come here on earth to be a man just to be killed b4 u forgive them? that doesn't make any sense rite? thats the reason y he created Jesus to give a chance and save man to the wrath of God, not god become a man to be killed by man, heheheh
TheLeonguerrero005 1 year ago
@TheLeonguerrero005 You yourself are a three in one. Even YOU are made up of a trinity. You have a Soul, (The real you) Body (the manifestation of the real you) and a Spirit (the part of the real you which connects with God). Why can't God be a trinity like you? Are you limiting The Almighty? Didn't He say "Lets make man in our image"?
DeeStinger1 1 year ago
@DeeStinger1 me are made up of a trinity? so i am God? like u said? hehehehe but i agree to what u have said about the composition of a man, coz it is written in the bible rite, but bcoz it was 3 it is trinity?, coz if it is called trinity, u will c the word trinity in the bible too rite? thats y u have guessed that god is also 3 in 1 too? hahaha, "Why can't God be a trinity like you? Are you limiting The Almighty?
TheLeonguerrero005 1 year ago
@DeeStinger1 Why can't God be a trinity like you? Are you limiting The Almighty?
ans: coz God said " i am God not man" like Jesus said to 1 of his apostles" here i am touch me it is still me, a spirit doesn't have flesh and bones like a had" and God also said that he can't lie, u said do i limiting the Almighty god, YES, y? can your god lie? he said that there is "no other god like me", so he is only 1 not 3 in 1, coz if thats true, God is a liar, coz u said god became a man, "i am God not man"
TheLeonguerrero005 1 year ago
jefeisdguard 1 year ago
@jefeisdguard - Thanks for your comment! - J A Show Staff
johnankerberg 1 year ago
@jefeisdguard The doctrine of cerberus (trinity) is not true and it isn't established anywhere in the Bible.
TheGenuineChristian 11 months ago
@TheGenuineChristian
So you believe what the muslims believe?
There is only one God? Monotheism?
So, hmmmm ... tell me which one is the true God to you?
Father, Jesus or Holy Spirit?
Do you believe in the Islamic diety called "allah"?
Why do you mock the Triune diety by calling it by a three-headed dog?
jefeisdguard 11 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@jefeisdguard You will find the answers on my channel. Take care.
TheGenuineChristian 11 months ago
@jefeisdguard
The Father is the only true God (1 Corinthians 8:6)
Do you believe what the Hindu believe and there trinity ?
Do you not know that its not just Muslim that believe in one God but the Jews and did you know Jesus was Jew. Jews always have and always will believe in only One God by Himself with no co-equals Jesus agreed with them when the said this to him (Mark 12:28-34)
Did you know that God name is not Trinity or Allah it is YHWH
SupernaturalGifts777 9 months ago
@SupernaturalGifts777 . Hi mate, YHWH is the secret name of god. However, more than 2575 times the other name of god was mentioned in the Old Testament it is Elohim and the singular of this word is ELOH . Eloh and ELAH (أله) . Elohim and ALAHOM (اللهم). Quite similar are they ??. If you read some part of the holy Quran you will find out the following : Mohammad was mentioned 4 Times.
Moses= 136 Times.
Jesus= 25 times.
Abraham=69.
Noah= 43.
Solomon= 17
David= 16
Job = 4
Thanx mate
oftiti2000 9 months ago
I love you Brother Jonh Ankerberg.
You through GOD THE HOLY GHOST have done such a great work for God.
May you live to be 1000 years old.
Harlan Parrott Sr.
HARLANGENEPARROTT 1 year ago
Awesome!.....Now explain Acts 8:37
sikovit 1 year ago
How did Erasmus add a verse to the bible that was quoted as early as 3rd century?
tonyb408 2 years ago
There is a difference between the phrase being quoted and having an actual manuscript. Dr. Wallace makes the case that the manuscript for this verse was not available to Erasmus to provide justification for his translation in this verse. The wording of this verse is debated in part because other writings quote this phrase in a format that looks more like the Trinitarian formula Dr. Wallace mentions. 1 Jn. 5:7 does not have the Trinitarian wording found in the earliest manuscripts.
johnankerberg 2 years ago
He didn't. An ALLUSION is not a quotation. You are referring to the ALLEGED quotation by Cyprian. Why not check out Wallace's article on that very subject? Furthermore, you have another problem you must explain: how did this VANISH from every single vestige on earth except the Latin, where it began in about the fourth century? This does not speak well for any doctrine of 'preservation.'
Maestrohbill 1 year ago
The matter is simple: if you want to believe in the Trinity, you add the Comma Johanneum. Otherwise, you disregard it. Simple as that.
RK831 2 years ago
easy enough :-)
billoodean 2 years ago
This man who is speaking is a blinded fool. 1 John 5:7 does not say anything about a trinity...it speaks of 3 that bear witness of the fact that eternal life is in the Son of God. It also makes perfect sense in the context in which it was written by John. There is no trinity in the Bible; and those who know Jesus Christ know that. And to the saints of God there is no allusion to any triune god in this, or any, verse of scripture. It is only the unlearned and unstable who believe there is...
wordprophet 2 years ago