House of Cicada SF4 Tournament - Casuals - Somuchdamage (SA) vs UTJ (DH)

[penguinbelly]

Textbook example of Sagat lamness

[Serotonergic]

lol korneabeaner, that is the longest wall of text i've seen on youtube

[tamadrummer3000]

They don't need to nerf Sagat at all. I actually hope they don't tweak any that much. Just like what Machineking said You're always gonna be whining about something. If the game was completely balanced then how boring would that be? I mean would huge comebacks really be all that special anymore? think about it there would be no real inpresive players ppl like tatsu, UTJ, kai, all those players wouldn't have the same hype or need the same necissary skills to win.

[GRRAB]

Really impressive comeback by UTJ in the first round

[shogunofyellow]

Poor Dhalsim. Sagat really needs to be nerfed in Super. The Tiger Shot juggles, the tiny startup time on Uppercut and Knee. Oh yeah, Capcom definitely needs to fix his double High Kick juggle.

[MysticShadow1453]

uppercut has almost twice the startup of shoryu but ya its still retarded

[MachineKing1313]

The only thing Sagat needs nerfed in my opinion is his jumping medium punch. Everything else is pretty good, he is not nearly as OP as some like DSP scream. Akuma in Super Turbo, Sagat in CVS2, and Gill in SF3, that is OP.

[kornbeaner]

Are you kidding the amount of damage Sagat deals to 3/4 of the cast is outrages. Not to mention he has tons of 2 hit juggles that scale poorly compared to other characters in the game. Even Ryu who has tons of priority on his moves isn't as bad. With the exception of his DP I hate how the hit box on that move is and how if it trades with any move its sending that character up in the air to an ultra. But Sagat needs to be nerfed in SSFIV

[MachineKing1313]

Thanks to constant whiners like you, Sagat will be nerfed down to probably mid low tier and then we will have someone else as top tier and then you will bitch about that character being top tier, it is a never ending cycle of crying with you scrubs.

[kornbeaner]

It's not whining it fact. Sagat is the only character considered "S" class. How is that not overpowered. I am not asking for a full nerf. just that his damage be brought down by about 10 - 15%. Other then that Sagat can stay the same chessy bastard he is now. Just about every character has a combo or a link up that does heavy damage, but Sagat is the only character that can rely on his basic moves to get him back in the fight. If that is not a reason to dumb him down a bit, what is?

[MachineKing1313]

Clearly you have not played 3S. Chun-Li is S tier and much more OP than Sagat. If Sagat is as OP as you are suggesting, then why has there been no Sagat championship wins at Evo or SBO? A Sagat player did not even make it to top 16 in EVO and only one made it to top 16 at SBO. If Sagat was as OP as you suggest, we would be seeing Sagat mirror matches all the time like we see Chun-Li mirror matches in 3S.

[kornbeaner]

I just recently started playing third strike just to grasp the difference between the two since I never played it during it's heyday. And from the videos I have seen in youtube, I really with a random search have not seen many if any Chun mirror matches. But back to point the two games are different in a way where the "S" class has a different meaning. The main difference is the parry system, you cannot be cheesy with chun as you can with Sagat, cause of the parry.

[MachineKing1313]

The parry system was not fair in my opinion. How is it fair to parry an entire super and then lose the game? Chip damage options were erased thanks to the parry and the parry drove away about 80% of the players for SFIII.

[kornbeaner]

The reason why I say its fair is because everybody no matter what character they main can practice and learn how to parry in order to be successful at the game. Yes the game had tier list for their character but the parry was the great equalizer it gave you a better chance no matter what tier you character was listed at. There is no such option in SF4. If you main a charge character and play against a shoto you're already at a disadvantage, yes you can Focus a fireball but all you're doing......

[kornbeaner]

at that point is loaning health, if you miss the next focus or get hit after focusing a few fire balls all the health that is on loan will be lost. how is that fair? to lose a large chunk of health over one hit after focusing a few attacks. The parry system required tons of skill to master on its own apart from knowing your character. That the reason why many 3S players didn't stick around the game is complex and now-a-days players want easy to play and understand anything more then that......

[kornbeaner]

is to much. Don't get me wrong SF4 is a fun game and I enjoy playing in fact I have a tourney tomorrow, but as a whole I consider 3S to be a more complete game then SF4, the game requires so much skill to master and be successful. Street fighter 4 requires skill but if you notice top players in just about every part of the world your gonna get the same characters over and over cause those are the character with the proper tools to win at a high level. Yes the SBO winners this year.....

[kornbeaner]

from what I recall where mid-to low class character, I believe they were a Guile/Honda team but SBO is a single game, Single elim tourney there is no room for adjustment, other tourneys here in the states are 2 out of 3 games, double elim, and top level high tier character have a better chance to win at these tourneys. I know here in the states you're never going to see a top honda, Guile, or Dhalsim play take top prize at Evo or any other major tourney cause they simply don't have the tools....

[kornbeaner]

There is alot more skill involved with winning at a high level in 3S. If SF4 had a parry system then things as they are would be fine because their would be a certain way to negate tons of cheap moves and matches would get into who has the best overall skills, in SF4 its very similar in the way of OG SF2 was where skill was involved but certain characters had (mainly guile) an easier time because of the moves available and lack of counters for those moves. That is very similar to how sagat is...

[kornbeaner]

unless you main a shoto in SF4 (which I don't) the match against Sagat is far from even, I can't jump cause then I'd get countered spining HK out of the air, trying to get in on a Sagat who stands on one side and spams fireballs is an exercise in frustration and if you get in all that progress can be lost with a tiger knee or a grab that for some reason launches Sagat's oppoents to the other side of the screen. Chun does not have any of those options in 3S. IMO 3S is what SSF4 should turn into.

[zapikachu]

@kornbeaner For many peopel there is a difference between balanced and "at least fair in someway".I don't think he's saying it's like mvc2 or anything. Nerfing a character is bad I rather appreciate upgrades. Chun-Li, Strider, Wolverine, and Spider-man were all nerfed for mvc2 with their damage and links/cancels. But because of all the new characters, they are degraded too much. I don't want that to happen in this game. Upgrade the rest. That's all.

[kornbeaner]

I agree with upgrading the cast in order make some matches more fair and maybe nerfing is a wrong word but a tweaking needs to take place. Sagat's combos do not seem to follow the rules as every other character they scale poorly in his favor yet he is not health deprived like akuma who also has great links and combos. I have posted this before I think Saga and rye are balanced with each but are favored over the other characters. Other then those two characters the game is very well balanced

[kornbeaner]

I meant Sagat and ryu not saga and rye my phone has auto correct and that's what it did in funny kindve way

[zapikachu]

@kornbeaner sagat doesn't do long link combos liek some others characters and also since his link deal with Special and Super/Ultra moves, it gets scaled differently.

[ChangFromUS]

sagat is such a spammer, dude, knee, knee, knee, knee!!!! only way a sagat can win.

[GamesPlayer1]

0:51 should have used the ultra right there

[sngoku]

I agree but damn it was good thing he didnt that 1st round end was spectacular!

[GamesPlayer1]

i agree

[halogu117]

Wow amazing ending to the first round

[delatroy]

yeh man, mega clutch