OSASMA THE GUN part two--Jihadi Joe vs. McWorld

[phaedress]

I like your take on this.

May I ask you, please, why you refer to God as "Allah" instead of using the language you are speaking in?

Calling Islam's god "Allah" leads to the misaprehension that it is a different deity we are speaking of.

Like saying in France they pray to some strange god they call "Dieu".

Allah is not a name. It is simply (as you certainly know) the arabic word for god.

[normanspinrad]

Well, I don't know how it actually parses in Arabic, but there's a familiar line from the Koran that's always translated "there is no God but Allah, and Mohammed is his Prophet." Point being, "god" is a generic term. Apollo, Zeus, and Loki are also "gods." Seems to me you do need two words.

[phaedress]

You're quoting the pledge whereby a muslim surrenders to god. It is literally "there is no god but god", it is an affirmation of monotheism.

I totally understand how you, as an author, need two words, but you are thus subverting the doctorine as the Muslims themselves understand it and thereby contributing to the false cultural divides.

(Which obscure the real ones I beleive you intend to deal with in your book.)

[normanspinrad]

Ok, I admit I don't read Arabic, so I don't know the original, but that translation doesn't make too much sense. "There are no gods but God," might but you never see that. Monotheism like Christianity or Judaism sure, but the trouble with all 3 religions is the implication "my god is the real one and yours doesn't even exist." This may not be politically correct, but that's the way it's played out historically.

[phaedress]

I had a feeling that is what you were getting at. It's the same god.

Just as the Christians acknowledge the Torah, so the Muslims affirm the stories of the Bible. The 'god of Abraham' is also the god of Jesus and Muhhamad.

I've never understood why this is divisive rather than unifying between the three peoples, but then I am not a middle-eastern man. Perhaps you have to live in a tribal culture.

[Nina998]

@normanspinrad May I reply regarding your comment about the trouble with all 3 religions, the my God is better than your God...In Islam, we believe that the God of Jews is the same as the God of Christians is the same as the God of Muslims, he's one so....we don't say mine is better than yours because we believe he's always been the same from the very beginning of creation...

[kalewaal]

simple america is evil and also devil

[davidshaz20000]

America is the Source of all sorrow and Evil in the world over 100 percent

[PeaceProfit]

(((( Critical*Mass - Peace*Action ))))

One*Billion - Global*Citizens - One*Peace

Act*On - Nov. 2nd - 2008

The World shall Rise*Above the slavery of FEAR

One-Wor*d - WORLD4PEACE

Remembering - y/our - Human*Unity . . .

Change - Our*World - Act*On - Nov. 2nd - 2008

[normanspinrad]

What are you, anyway? An Afghani Muslim who says his country should speak English??

[WonkyDoodle]

Are you talking to me Old man?

[normanspinrad]

I'm talking to you and anyone else who thinks they can make a point by trading insults and invective. Even if you do have a valid point which might convince someone of something, all you do is discredit yourself as a source of anything.

[WonkyDoodle]

Fair point, just block the trolls and let me know when i cross the line old man.

But i still fail to see the relevance this has to my country speaking English???

[normanspinrad]

In keeping with the principle of the First Amendment to the US Constitution, I started this stuff on YouTube with the absolute policy that I will block no one's free speech here, even if they attack me, and will stick to it. Freedom of speech is indivisible.

[WonkyDoodle]

Oh,another question for you Old man.

Personally I prefer to live by laws dictated by God rather than man(who is fallible).

Islamic system of governance - accountability of the leader, to God. He's accountable for his actions not only to the people, but also to God.

Now look at your system. There is no accountability. Bush can lie to the nation, send you into war, be riddle with scandals and still nothing happens. NO accountability.

[dawn1gr]

stupid....ur opinion is the thing that causes this clash...

first thing u have to think is not to choose sides stupid...

[WonkyDoodle]

No, its your belligerent intolerance to other's differing opinions (which you have demonstrated well in this very post) that causes the clash.

[WonkyDoodle]

You really sound like a looney. Honestly get some speaking classes or something.

Oh, and brush up on your ignorance.

Our bottom line, is our bottom line. - HAHA

[dawn1gr]

stupido

[WonkyDoodle]

Calling someone "stupido" is like the kettle calling the pot black.

Run along kid.

[dawn1gr]

there is no god mister...is it really so difficult to understand?

try something to get rid of this stupid idea

dont be afraid there will be no punishment...there is no punisher(its just a comic book hero)lol....really there is nothing after u die...there is something before that...

[WonkyDoodle]

Like I said, run along you silly little boy.

[bobgee1999]

skunk4free: calm down, pigfucker. I don't despise your moronic, disgusting, evil religion any more or less than I despise Christianity, which is equally moronic, disgusting and evil. The uneducated say we should bomb the Middle-east back to the stone age, and that would solve our problems, but obviously it won't; the problem is that the Middle-east is STILL IN the stone age.

[dawn1gr]

stupido

[WonkyDoodle]

i thought it was you whiteys that had the obsession with pigs and pork??

[qarnain06]

Lies,lies,lies and twisted truths. I feel sorry for the man that bases hi life on lies and runours

[dawn1gr]

stupido

[WonkyDoodle]

Yo Norman! Ive caught myself a troll here, posting repetitive comments & cant even spell stupid. What d'ya wanna do with him?

[komotini]

I think perhaps the biggest problem of Islam is that the Koran is accepted as outside History and thus not infuenced by the time it was written. This results to my eyes(the eyes of an unbeleiver)to the entire religion being traped in time. The luck of a Calif does not help either.

[WonkyDoodle]

So what exactly is trapped in time?

Do crimes or sins somehow become acceptable with the passage of time?

You have replaced a quick execution for the death penalty with a slower lethal injection? Or do you think that because it is the death penalty exacted by 'modern' means, its somehow more 'civilised' or 'humane'.

Western society is decaying, and losing what little morals it ever had. Hopefully Islam won't have the same problem, even if it means somehow being stuck in time.

[skunk4free]

whatever! you unholy book is still worse! the only thing it's good for is wiping my ass.

[WonkyDoodle]

If you're Muslim, you should take that comment back, for fear of Allah.

If you're not, then do what you please.

[skunk4free]

they still do what's written in your incest manual AKA unholy bible.

[skunk4free]

well good thing you say that your unholy book is nothing but an out dated pornographic material, although the zionist pigs still apply their so called devine law in raping and slaughtering the Arabs.

[skunk4free]

that shut you the fuck up didnt it punk?!! go read your bible before you point fingers bitch. i can play this game with you all day long and we'll see which book is more dirty how about that?

[skunk4free]

11And this is the thing that ye shall do, Ye shall utterly destroy every male, and every woman that hath lain by man. 12And they found among the inhabitants of Jabeshgilead four hundred young virgins, that had known no man by lying with any male: and they brought them unto the camp to Shiloh, which is in the land of Canaan.

[skunk4free]

THE BIBLE PERMITS MEN TO RAPE AND ENSLAVE UNDERAGE GIRLS!!

Judges 21:10-12

10And the congregation sent thither twelve thousand men of the valiantest, and commanded them, saying, Go and smite the inhabitants of Jabeshgilead with the edge of the sword, with the women and the children.

[skunk4free]

there's no such thing as "Islamicists"! it's called MUSLIMS

[tabasca36]

You are a charlatan and a liar. Why omit the best part of the verse?

"...provided ye seek (them in marriage) with gifts from your property, desiring chastity, not lust. Seeing that ye derive benefit from them, give them their dowers (at least) as prescribed.."[Holy Quran 4:23]

IN Islam, sex is within marriage only. This is not the Talmud which is full of incest and pedophilia, nor is it the Bible with its x-rated material.

[tabasca36]

My harsh language was directed at starcatsher099. normanspinrad, you might have differing views than mine, but I'll always defend your right to voice them. Peace.

[tabasca36]

1400 years ago, to marry a believing slave, the holy Quran necessitates to free her from bondage, ask her permission in marriage, then to pay her a full dowry like any other woman. Read verse 4:25. In Islam, sex is always within the sanctity of marriage.

[tabasca36]

You are in need of urgent psychiatric help.

[normanspinrad]

Me or starcatcher099? Or both?

[tabasca36]

Sorry for the confusion, that was directly addressed to starcatcher099. You are discussing views, that fool is only spewing hate.

[tabasca36]

I respectfully disagree with you on few points:

First, the view of the minority extreme Muslim elements is by no means representative of the entire Muslim community. So neither Bin-Laden nor Zarkawi speak for the majority. So this is not a clash of civilizations.

[tabasca36]

Second, you have erroneously described Islam as anti democracy and modernity which is completely false. Islam is fully compatible with democracy. The Quran calls on Muslims to "(conduct) their affairs by mutual Consultation"[Quran 38:42] And "consult them in affairs" [Quran 3:159] However, although the religious text supports democracy and human rights, many so called "Muslim" leaders don't implement either.

[WonkyDoodle]

Islam does not allow its followers to rule or be ruled by any other system other than the law of God, not the law of man, which is an intrinsic part of western styled democracy.

[Nina998]

@WonkyDoodle What I don't understand is why people attack Muslims for wanting the word of God to be the law. Have they studied or even look it up to see if the word of God is good for Muslims, if it's better than the "Western Democracy"...What Allah has prescribed for all human beings in the Quran is better than any man's plan for what's good for humanity. people just refuse to study it and only point out the misunderstood verses in the quran...try harder next time if u want dialogue

[WonkyDoodle]

@Nina998 "try harder next time if u want dialogue" - Is that directed at me?

[Nina998]

@WonkyDoodle I am sorry, the last sentence was directed to anyone who just points the finger of blame at Islam/quran/Muhammad without researching what they're talking about....it just happened to be the ending of my comment. I didn't mean to attack you...

[illuminatika]

Terrorism is from the bible not the Koran!

Gen.35 [5] and the terror of God was upon the cities that were round about them, and they did not pursue after the sons of Jacob.

Lev.26 [16] I also will do this unto you; I will even appoint over you terror , consumption, and the burning ague, that shall consume the eyes, and cause sorrow of heart: and ye shall sow your seed in vain, for your enemies shall eat it. and MORE!.