@freetaught its sad but I think when you were a kid you made up your own personal god in your head which wasn't the true god of the bible. You also have made the mistake of categorizing Christianity as being a religion which i would disagree with. RELIGION- is man trying to get to God, Christianity is God coming to man through Jesus Christ. You should not let your emotions dictate truth. Being an atheist is intellectuality dishonest. Unless u r all knowing u do not know for sure God isn't here.
Thank you so much for this. I am 14, and was raised in much the same way you were. I'm currently very confused on wether I belive in God or not, and this helped me alot :)
understand our Lord and know everything about Him or why things happened/happen, because if we could put the Lord in a "box" and be able to understand everything about Him, what makes Him greater than us? nothing.. so when you cannot understand every little thing, that is not a bad thing. It causes you to have faith(our you can choose to turn away and try to seek a religion in which u can put that god in a box to where u know everything about it and u do not wonder..) another thing you said was
Thanks for responding. My expression of God being in everything was was not uttered with the intention of denoting any expression of pantheism, deism or any like faith; rather, it was an expression of what I took to be God's ever presence, and acknowledgment that all things came from him. The intention behind this video was to present my considerations as they were at the time of my deconversion. Since that time I have encountered nothing but reasons to presume against any Gods existence.
Faith would be but one single problem. I do not assume truths as articles of faith, and nor do Christians most of the time. If someone were to offer you a medicine while sick, or financial adivice, or claim against a friend, or an allegation in a criminal trial, most persons would ask, in these instances, "why should I believe this?". The answer "just have faith" for God is no more a good and sufficient reason for accepting this than in any other case. A giant claim requires greater evidence.
narrow and it doesn't say it is an easy path(obviously) but that is what draws us to the Lord.. He is there to guide us and for us to rely on/turn to.. but if u turned from your faith because it was difficult at times then that is something completely different than turning away because you don't understand the Lord.. we cannot fully in depth
@yaymike23 What mental process allows you to assume the bible to be true...? How can you justify the contradictions within the bible while this same God is "perfect" in all ways?
You're basically saying "well this book is true, and you just did what this book said you would do, therefore this book is true..."
just a couple things.. at one point you state that you believed that your god was in everything.. the cup of coffee, the table.. that is not Christianity .. that is pantheism and that is not what the Christians faith/relationship is , with the Lord. He is not in everything/a physical part of everything. and you say Christianity caused you pain? in the bible it says the path of the righteous is (continued)..
just a couple things.. at one point you state that you believed that your god was in everything.. the cup of coffee, the table.. that is not Christianity .. that is pantheism and that is not what the Christians faith/relationship is , with the Lord. He is not in everything/a physical part of everything. and you say Christianity caused you pain? in the bible it says the path of the righteous is narrow and it doesn't say it is an easy path(obviously) but that is what draws us to the Lord.. He is
That is actually what religions are.. the worst drug.. the worst habit.
I call it "holy smoking".
Sometimes you enjoy it immensely, sometimes you cough your lungs out but whatever you do, you can't drop the "holy cigarette".
Everybody around you is smoking it, making you an outsider if yous top, an outcast, an enemy sometimes. And the worst thing of all.. you "know" if you stop smoking, the "holy cigarette" will hunt you down and make you smoke it in horrific pain for all eternity.
Thank you, thank you, thank you. This video is much needed, and it took serious balls. I respect you immensely. I have been mulling over these things so much lately that I actually aspire to start some kind of online blog chat community to discuss the transition, both the awesome and devastating. Something that excludes people who attack from the religious and non-religious ends of the bully spectrum, so people can reason and mourn through this, and rejoice. Thank you, favorited, already subbed.
(Cont.). . . he doesn't believe in my God? No. In fact, I merely want to help that person realize that the Lord is indeed real and He doesn"t NEED to show us how real He is. We don't deserve it. I mean, doubting Him? Think of a parents whose child denies their own parents. I mean, I would be really upset. But God won't give up on you because you said He isn't real. Is He upset? Yes! Does He want to completely throw you aside as you are living? No! God loves. He loves you! That is why Jesus died.
You believe some idiotic incoherent crap and ignore all the lies and idiocy to be able to stick to your illusion. You justify unjustifiable things using your imagination and other people's irrational idiotic explanations, a simple way to dodge and reject reality.
You know NOTHING about god, you have no proof, you like to believe it because it feels so warm.. but like peeing your pants, the warm feeling is not all that comes with it.
Around 7:24 you mentioned a world without judgment and the you went out to say a place where you don't have to cast silly judgements about others. But remember, the God I believe in is the only judge. He tells us not to judge others. As humans, naturally we judge people without noticing, but we must remeber what the Lord told us. Children of God can accpet people for who they are just as any other person on this earth does. Does it mean we agree with the thought of an athiest say. . .(Cont.)
Ok, look. I have no problem with people that do not believe the same things as me. Now I don't bash on anyones beliefs or non beliefs unless they bash on mine. So therefore basically I am willing to make peace with anyone who is willing to accept me as a Christian, no matter if you are one or not. What I am saying is that why bash on Christians as a whole, when not all Christians force religion down your throat? I am offended that you hate all Christians when I have done nothing to you.
@that1dude10. I'm not sure if this comment was directed toward me or not, but who said they "hate all Christians"? I don't say that, I don't believe that, and I don't even discourage christians from sharing their ideas. That's why I share my own. I think that any person who believes they have good ideas should be eager to share them with any person who is willing to listen. Otherwise you must passively accept the world you inherit. peace!
@903gamefreak Don't worry about this guy. He is on a mission to disprove Christians, which he will never succeed. Even if he changed everybody else, I would fight till the end. But sadly, he will try to do this all of his life and have no success whatsoever and then realize that he isn't so smart after all since you have been destroying him in this whole argument :D
Stupid people like you try to seem smart. Its kind of funny how you devote your life so hard to proving christians wrong, that it must bother you that people are christian. Well guess what, me, and Im sure alot of other people don't give a damn about your theories. So just keep on talking and act like your making a difference. Maybe to your atheist fans who cheer you on like a jr high cheerleading squad. LOL your like a fly buzzing around that tries so hard to get attention, but no 1 cares :D
@that1dude10, Before you attempt to disparage another person's intelligence in text, you might want to work on your grammar a bit. That way you wouldn't lose all of your intellectual credibility at the moment you begin to type.
@that1dude10 - What does happy have to do with it? Happiness comes from lots of sources, and at least one of them is fufillment of self - but when more than half of (pick a first world country), either is, or will be, on anti-depressants, and most of those are theists? I don't think happiness has anything to do with this topic.
And I sure hope you aren't arguing pro "ignorance is bliss".
@PurpleGhost I am happy as ever and I'm Christian. I'm saying that he spends all his time doing this, trying to disprove Christians. If he would just stfu and quit trying to argue, be himself, he would be better off. He can be atheist without trying to argue with people.
@that1dude10 - You /might/ be right about that, but maybe this makes him happier then he would be silent.
I don't really mean you any offense, but your religion as a whole hasn't been very good to humanity. Sure some particular sects and branches have been much better, but until they are the sum of the whole, then you're likely to still have people being jerks to athiests, promting them to do what he is, speak out. He's not actually trying to disprove the whole religion, just the dumbos.
What a wonderful and gutsy testament! - Well done!!
I won't deny that any passionate apologist would describe me as a fairly venomous atheist. - Yet, if approached by anyone going through "a dark night of the soul", I would not push them toward non believe in their entity, but rather through the ruthless intellectual honesty it seems to have required in you. If they can retain that honesty and still believe...so be it.
I'm also glad you pulled no punches. It's not easy- just worth it!
@903gamefreak: Also you don't seem to know what abstract means. What is an abstraction to you? Is my pepsi monster not abstract? We've only just begun our discussion and you are already avoiding my questions. If you do not answer them now, I will respond no further. I count about six base questions so far, plus a few qualification questions.
@903gamefreak: Yes you must explain how you understand possibility, if we are going to have a meaningful discussion, because the way you use "possible" does not seem to be the way I and others do: possible means something could actually be, could actually exist. This is further indicated by your last comment. You say "pepsi is man made". Fair enough, but the issue is whether or not God also is. Men make up gods often. That's why we have so many of them.
@903gamefreak:What does it mean to be "possible" to you?Possibility within the context, or in the realm of what? Is it duelly possible that there are multiple gods rather than one or none?Are eternal Pepsi-can monsters in space possible, if not why not? On what grounds would you exclude possibility? Certainly, you take this liberty. Why have you so certainly expressed that God could not have kids or that can't break its "own rules"? Is God not free? On what basis do you assert these things?
@903gamefreak, God damn iTouch, why do I make so many typos when typing on you. Anyway I don't think god's existence is likely and neither does most of the scientific community. A lack of evidence is just as disproving as evidence that directly disproves something.
@903gamerfreak Oops, hit the wrong button and finished too early (typing on an iTouch is annoying). What I was saying that I don't think the existence of a god (or many gods, not to exclude the polytheistic) is highly unlikely, if not impossible.
@903gamefreak I did look at religion, multiple religions in fact, but none of them appealed to me nor could I see much logic in any of them. Although, to be truly scientific the existence of a god (or gods) is possible, but in my opinion that's shared with most of the scientific community.
@14brannen I (kinda) respectfully disagree. In my opinion god's a lie, religion's a lie, and those who invented the notion of god/religion were either stupid or lying their balls off.
@14brannen I respect everyone of y'all. But the truth is there is an invisible pink unicorn, and she loves you more than anything. We are her children and the invisible pink unicorn is our mother.
You its funny how similar our stories are; my father will turn sixty a few months before I graduate from highschool and I think my transition was much easier than most for two reasons: My parents were too busy with 8 children to make us go to church, when I was little in school the teacher asked what we were and I had no idea what i believed. I asked my mom and she said I was Christian. I had no idea what it really was so I read the entire thing...
...asked many people about it but I was never really convinced; I was only really attracted to the idea of god and many of the moral examples but nothing else seemed to make sense. I had always been logical probably because I was the youngest and smallest and thats how I survived in my house. I was also always extremely curious and Socrates' philosophy made all the sense to me. I questioned everything including authority. I also learned the theory of evolution early on and understood it...
...very well. I then learned the idea the bible gave of Creationism which was one of the most absurd things I had heard. Later what sent me running to athiesm was when I rationally observed people who believed christianity and saw how the comfort, the threat of hell, temptation of heaven drew ppl in. And the only answer I ever got to why somone believed christianity was one word: faith. I hated the word. It was the epitome of ignorance in my mind. It explained nothing.
This vid convinces me that atheists' God is greater than Christians' God lol Because the instant someone points to something and says it' from God, that God ceases to exist. So if you believe that God does not exist, you bring it into-and-out of existence every time you think ... or something ... or not ...
Great advice. My deconversion wasn't nearly as painful as most because although I believed in a god just like everyone else, I wasn't neck deep into religion. It still took a few years to realize almost everyone was believing in a lie. You should make more videos.
@hornerc1 This is the tragedy of going mainstream with atheism. Now it isn't ok to disagree with another atheist. Atheism, to me, more than anything else, is about free speech. If we can't disagree, argue, poke fun, and, yes, even berate each other, we're no better than those other religions. I have the right to call this video bullshit just as much as you have the right to exalt it. But now you're attacking another atheist over free speech. What are you fighting for?
@hornerc1 The funny part of it is, I don't believe in God. Sure, I have an ego. All humans do. But I'm not the one putting my face on youtube, preaching, like a brimstone minister, that you all must "Come walk with me down the lonely road of atheism." Jesus, man, save it for your fucking therapist. I'm all for atheism, but it's a way of life, not a Hollywood melodrama. And even if it is that for you, who the hell cares? Get over yourselves you millionaires, and movie gods, and rock stars.
great man...explains things so well...and he doesn't just insult christians he actually talks to them about there beliefs...I know this might be a dumb reason not to believe in god but when I was a baby, I fell on glass...and I was only 1 year old and my family has no baby picture of me when I had both my eyes...and I never knew how it is to see with two eyes...also ever since I started school other students have picked on me...and looked at me as if I'm some kind of monster.
I am glad this is still here. This shows the empathy that is capable in a mind that rejects a god. god is not the wellspring of goodness, humanity itself is. I am glad to find someone else who can express these thoughts that I have had myself. Deconversion just is not for everyone! If you are an atheist, you are JUST an atheist, and it will come to you. Over time, the BS of the buybull just sinks in, and BAM. Atheism :) Good video, and I give Kudos for your sensitivity to the subject!
The world is a cruel and unfair place. There is no explicit reason for being, no explicit source of life. That there is no meaning in the world, only what we as humans can establish through years of culture. As Nietzsche said Uber-men are those able to look into this void of meaning, take it in and be at peace not having to fall back on whimsical thoughts justice, truth, good and evil or God.
Religious people are simply those who refuse to look into the void, and thus will never achieve peace.
Look disconcertingly into the camera and, behold, we're humanitarians, as if an 8:00 minute video makes any difference when we have nothing to say. And I love the Freudian slip of indoctrination-deconversion at 4:00. We do nothing real with our lives and still find sleep at night to be sound. Conscience is dead.
"I didn't need a timequake to teach me being alive was a crock of shit. I already knew that from my childhood and crucifixes and history books." -Vonnegut
@FallenSparrow So what do you do with your life that is so real? How do you even have face to come here and judge this guy? I would assume that listening to what this guy has to say hits very close to home with you. I don't know you but from your comment it would seem that it hits so close to home that you fear for your eternal soul when his words resonate inside you and you can truly relate to his sentiments. Go ahead and cast judgment. It makes you more akin to the God you worship.
We are Hemingway, Aristotle, Sun Tsu. We are Jesus, Mohamed, Buddha. Vishnu, Ra, and the Beatles. We are God. We are Satan.
Tyler Durden says: "We've all been raised on television to believe that one day we'd all be millionaires, and movie gods, and rock stars. But we won't. And we're slowly learning that fact. And we're very, very pissed off."
And now, thanks to YouTube, we are slowly unlearning that fact. Take this schmuck, or any other, talk about nothing as if it were scripture.
Wow I'm glad I wasn't as indoctrinated as you were when I deconverted, I deconverted when I was 14 just when I was beginning to think God was everything and when I relized that if god was real and everything he is supposed to be the world would not be this way and that the whole institution of religion was not effective and quite arbitrary
Loved the vid. My shift came earlier that yours. I was only 5 when I started picking holes in the priests arguments lol
After that I still had a hope and was willing to accept a "general" deity who did the basics and occasionally popped up.
The Tsunami ended any doubt I had.
I wouldnt even bother arguing with people on here if I were you. Serves no purpose arguing with people who think you are so bad you will go to hell. They just dont get it yet and maybe never will.
Ive come to a conclusion, most athiests, or deconverters, are so confused with the Bible and what it means and says (which is so important in christianity) that i now know why they dont believe. They've got all their facts mixed up and thats why they have a hard time understanding the truth. its not the God factor, becuase it is so easy to have faith with the evidence of the World, how perfect and precise the universe is. but back to the matter at hand, deconverters, need to go to bible college.
Who says that you have to believe in god to point to a verse that shows how ignorant a person is? You said the Jews were never ordered to kill anyone. I guess this is yet another thing that you're wrong about.
You have demonstrated the greatest level of ignorance that I've come across in quite some time. This should make your God very happy. If you choose to believe that you are the center of some imaginary being's universe,
and will be rewarded for denying all things rational, while petitioning it for favors with incantations, more power to you. I guess that I'm just going to have to be content with living in the dull real world, where angels and demons aren't fighting an eternal battle for my soul and where magic doesn't exist. I, however, will waste no further time responding to your childish remarks.
@funkymonkey Thats quite a generalization you are making. What facts do you assert that I as an atheist am mixing up? The world in all its "precision" (or lack thereof) are evidence of nothing more than than the world and your perceived precision of it. Deconverters need to go to bible college? Why? Is God not powerful enough to give them discernment to understand the bible? That seems inconsistent with the christian worldview that if you seek God you will find him.
yeah, but dont you see? times are getting worse and worse, and cant you see the correlation between these times and all of these civil liberties becoming legal and what not? the bible says these things are wrong because they are. no doubt about it. abortion, homosexuality, etc.
back in the day, these issues were not even brought up like they are today and times were better i must say(with these issues). what everyone can do what they want and its ok? that doesnt seem good to me, logically
If you understood history, you would see that we are not living in worse times. Ever read of the Crusades, Salem Witch Trials, or even the bible's accounts of how the Jew's were ordered to pretty much kill everyone who disagreed with, and didn't adhere, to their faith, which God commanded?
Democracy, medical research, the U.S Constitution, the very computer that you now use are all products of Western thought and scientific progress.
It's sad that you have such a bleak view of the world.
HAHA the jews were not ordered to kill. maybe if you understood your history my friend, you would see that times are getting worse no matter what old civil, or cold wars or any wars you bring up. i could bring up the iraq war, or ww2, but thats not what i mean. Yes times are getting better for technology, but morals and ethics are just blowing out the window.
really? homosexuality?? relaly think of that concept..like REALLY thinka but it...man and a man...together.
why would you bring up a verse when you dont even believe in God haha. look at yourself, you turn to God even though you deny him.
im pretty sure you are the antichrist leading people astray. so watch youself becuase you damn youself to hell, God doesnt its your choice. and i dont understand why all atheists bring up verses from the penetuke, like it refers to us...it was totally different cirucumstances. totally different than todays world.
Who says that you have to believe in god to point to a verse that shows how ignorant a person is? You said the Jews were never ordered to kill anyone. I guess this is yet another thing that you're wrong about.
Wow! A Youtube Christian, who lacks the intellectual conviction to post his own videos, judging someone? That's quite a surprise! I'll tell you what--I don't do this very often, but I would like to ask you to post a video explaining precisely how you've come to these conclusions about me. Will you please do this?
@SteveJHenning@SteveJHenning Most atheists have given god a chance. I sure did. There came a point where I had to be honest with myself that the tenets of Christianity were just not something I believed. I tried desperately to believe simply because I was afraid of the consequences of disbelief. In the end I simply couldn't believe. So yeah, I gave god a chance. The problem is, if he exists, he never gave me one. I respect your right to believe as you see fit, but don't judge others.
@funkymonkey slavery is abolished, women and children have more rights than ever, and living conditions have skyrocketed... yep, sure is a nasty world compared to back in the day. Also, homosexuality was accepted in many older societies but recently it's been looked down upon more and more. how do any of these facts support your claim?
It is here that I find cause for such activism, which I assure you does not consume much of my time. Aside from your own spiritual inclinations, you have no greater evidence for your faith than the Muslim has for his. I am dissinclined to accept either faith, as both present the same lack of tangible evidence. Superstition in all it's forms should always be challenged. I meet this challenge within my family and in the public sphere.
If we may put aside Christian for a moment lut us consider Islam which promotes the subjugation of women, slavery, and stoning for sins (not unlike Christianity historically) Is it not a worthwhile enterprise to challenge such a mode of thought? Aside from your own spiritual inclinations, you have no greater evidence to support your faith than the Muslim has to support his.
but you didnt exactly answer my question, why are you doing this? why does it matter if i believe in a God or not when i die to you? it doesnt matter.
Islamic has taken the bible and added and taken away pieces which the bible says not to do. Muhammed has altered it, which makes that religion false. the bible is the first true book of most religions. Mormans, joseph smith, another man who thought he was equal to christ changed the bible. Thats why Christianity stands above these other religions.
before i new Jesus i was a lost soul. But people tend to think that being a Christian is about being happier and me me me. its not, its about God, living for him, giving up things for him and having faith. not now knowing everything and being the happiest man alive. but thats not to say it doesnt bring you joy and happiness. just remember its about Him not you.
My search had little to do with "happiness" and more to do with what is the truth. My search lead me to the truth but away from Christianity.
My continued studies have only strengthened my position that there likely isn't a god. Happiness is irrelevant when it comes to the truth. Good luck in your own pursuit!
Thanks but thats not the only reason i chase God lol. he is the truth, and if material things and things you can only see determines what is truth to you, then i guess good luck to you. i dont need luck.
and one question, why is it you sit behind a camera trying to disprove God like it means anything to you, when us christians are living the athiest life, happy and satisfied. when in the end(in your minds) ultimately, nothing matters once were dead. see, i have a purpose, to bring truth because it matters in the end.
Hey man, thanks for sharing these personal thoughts. I feel like I know you a little better. But having said that, I want to state that God is real. He is still real and He is Love. You may have forsaken Him but God has not. If you think you had a lonely path to your personal quest, realize that Jesus was the loneliest man ever lived. He knows loneliness. You may want to read about him even though you are not a Christian. Anyhow, God bless you, man. God loves you.
It doesn't sound any different than getting over an incredibly hot chic that you must spend time working with, and have become utterly infatuated with, but that isn't interested in you. It's not that you can't let go. It's just that every time you see that body your mind wants nothing more than to try again.
What I cant understand is how people can go through life thinking that some awesome being has nothing more interesting to do than to listen to a lot idiots' vapid lugubrious longings.
The Bible teaches that God has appointed a day of Judgment in which sinners will be condemned. The only way of escape is through a savior. God provided that savior in the person of his son Jesus Christ. Those who turn and believe on him shall be saved:
He that believes on him is not condemned: but he that believes not is condemned already because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God
Turn to God, repent of your sins and believe on Jesus before its too late
3) I do believe we have free will and this can not exist with only physicalism, therefore we must have something immaterial about us which I believe to be a Soul.
4) common near death experiences of people supposedly already dead
5) the fact that the universe is within very precise parameters for the existence of Life.
Lonestar, we have had many interractions already and I have touched on many of these issues in our exchanges and in my videos. Before I address all of these questions again, I have one for you. What would it take for you not to believe in God?
My belief in God in strengthened from the fact that I have freewill and the freedom of thought and I recognize the importance that there is something rather than nothing.I think therefore I am. So even if you eliminated all other arguments for God and shrunk the Universe down to two things
A) a single atom to observe and
B) my unaltered consciousness
My consciousness would look at the single atom and realize the following two things:
A) I do not have the capacity to create that atom (cnt'd)
B) I recognize the freewill in my own consciousness to believe someone else must have created it
So to answer your question: For me personally not to believe in God, you would have to kill me or altar my consciousness to a point where I no longer have freewill to contemplate things freely. Either kill me or eliminate every single piece of matter within the entire Universe so that I would no longer have anything to observe. (cnt'd)
You may say that I have given an unfair answer because I can not be realistically killed in order for you to win the argument and thus our conversation will go on forever. That is true and it may foreshadow that you and I will never agree on this topic as long as I draw a breath but that is my honest answer to your question. What would it take for you to believe in God? Witnessing a miracle firsthand? (cnt'd)
The creation of a seemingly endless Universe? Taking inert materials and creating beings with DESIRE to do things? What would it take for you to recognize that you have true freewill not governed 100% by material influences? I also see that you have already sold your soul on youtube and you are continuing to encourage others to do the same in your altruistic belief that many others will be set free of "superstitious beliefs" such as God. (cnt'd)
I do not know your life history but rejecting religious hypocrisy is very normal and admirable but rejecting your own freewill, your own Soul and God is like throwing the baby out with the bathwater in my opinion.
For in much wisdom comes a lot of heartache. The greater your knowledge, the greater your pain.
Genesis account warns man not to eat of the tree of Knowledge. When humanity does, God curses man with death.
Martin Luther: Reason is the greatest enemy that faith has;it never comes to the aid of spiritual things, but, more frequently than not,struggles against the divine Word,treating with contempt all that emanates from God.
Superstition:is a belief or notion, not based on reason or knowledge. The word is often used pejoratively to refer to supposedly irrational beliefs of others, and its precise meaning is therefore subjective. It is commonly applied to beliefs and practices surrounding luck, prophecy and spiritual beings, particularly the irrational belief that future events can be influenced or foretold by specific, unrelated behaviours or occurrences.
2) Chances of life seem to incredibly good when you consider the size of the universe, its age, and that hydrogen and oxygen are abundant in the universe. But I am neither a scientist nor a mathmatician.
4) Near death experiences mean nothing, because you cannot be "near death". Life and death are states of being. Are NDE any more significant than dreams and hallucinations? To me, it seems that they are all linked to distortions in perception.
5) Refer to question 2. This is not a significant point. Lets consider how people look at the Earth in the same way. Suppose that intelligent life had developed on Mars instead of the Earth under different conditions: likely, Martians would be saying the same thing.
6) You are not a dumb guy. I feel certain that you have explored the notion of irreducable complexity from all angles. So I'm not even going to touch this one. But it's bullshit!
7) The Moral law has evolved and continues to. Morals (though I don't like the word) are based on cooperation that benefits the species survival, empathy, abd reason.
The bible has not taken a stance against pedophilia, slavery, or killing people who believe in others gods. I and many others find these laws to be immoral. Likely you do to. There you have it.If you can demonstrate even one thing that you find to be immoral that could have been done a the time, like pedophila, but the bible says nothing against it, you have just accepted a social moral,
or determined it for yourself. I would also recommend that you read anthropolgy articles, so that you may learn how morals vary from society to society.
8) There are many arguments against your god: Can god create a rock that he humself cannot lift. Does God know our future? Does God know its own future? If the answer is "yes" to both, neither have free will. If god is eternally merciful, people wouldn't be in hell for a minute let alone eternity.
9) Your answer regarding what would cause you not to believe in god is, forgive me for this, absurd. If you are killed then you no longer have the capacity to believe or not believe anything. It seems as if your saying that your mind is closed to the notion that god mught not exist. If a person has alzheimers disease, do they have free will? Is it only your own will that counts or the will of all humanity?
SN: You say that your belief in God is strengthened by there being something rather than nothing. Demonstrate to me that "nothingness" actually exists or ever has. Even the spaces between objects is not nothing. If you cannot prove that there is nothing, then why would you believe that the universe came from nothing?
questions 1,3:There is a differnece between phsicalism/determinism. You seem to be confusion these positions. Do I believe that I have free will or am I constrained by a deterministic universe?I don't know. Theoretically, if I did live in a deterministic universe and felt that I had free will, it would only be an illusion of autonomy.
So what would be the difference? If you were to say, accepting the deterministic view would justfy any actions, then you would be conceding that I have free will to defy the deterministic order. I reason to the best of my capability, and I do not intentionally harm others.
A single particle of matter (atom) does not WANT to do anything. It is just matter, it has no DESIRE or WANTS. Now take a trillion trillion trillion atoms and arrange them into a brain. Do you think that these highly arranged atoms will still ever WANT to do anything whatsoever? Your soul animates your brain to make it WANT to do things. If you do not accept your soul you declare all mankind is automatons with no accountability or freewill.
You say that you do not intentionally harm others and you reason to the best of your capacity. I believe you. But you make videos on youtube professing that God is dead or never existed and sell your own soul for less than 10 dollars and in doing so you encourage others around you to be influenced by your ideas. You desire others to break free from this "superstitious" belief in God. I agree in attacking religious hypocrisy but please don't reject your own Soul and God.
Imagine a fish that has spent his entire life in the water. The fish would ONLY know about "wetness" but would never understand the concept of "wetness" because the fish had never experienced being out of the water. Nothingness is no atoms or electron movement anywhere. We are men, we are not simply observers of men. We know what me actually do and what they OUGHT TO DO. This is why we have the inside knowledge to being a man because we know the difference of actions and OUGHT.
You might say that my mind is closed to not believing in God. I would phrase it as "Once someone is truly awake to the belief in a Divine Creator" and realizes the quicksand we are all stuck in and that God has provided us a path out of the quicksand, that it is extremely difficult to no longer be awake to this belief. I am surprised when I hear that you went through a 3 year deconversion. I do not know what happened to make you lose faith, but I pray that you can one day overcome it.
A cork and rubber ball covered in cowhide flies through the air about sixty feet where it comes into contact with a rapidly revolving stick. The ball bounces off the stick in many different trajectories and eventually finds its way to a leather glove. The ball then flings itself from the glove to another leather glove in the vicinity of a white canvas square. (cont'd)
All of this is true, in a way, but the entire point is missed. The ball, the bat and the bases are not playing baseball. They are the equipment that the players use. It is the players not the equipment that are actually playing the game.
I believe that the person with alzheimers has a brain (the equipment of the Soul) that is not functioning properly.
I believe it is only the will of the individual that God considers. What exactly is the "will of humanity?"
Another difficulty we get if we believe God to be in time is this. Everyone who believes in God at all believes that He knows what you and I are going to do tomorrow. But if He knows that I am going to do so-and-so, how can I be free to do otherwise? Well, here once again, the difficulty comes from thinking that God is progressing along the Time-line like us: the only difference being that He can see ahead and we cannot. (cnt'd)
Well, if that were true, if God foresaw our acts, it would be very hard to understand how we could be free not to do them. But suppose God is outside and above the Time-line. In that case, what we call "tomorrow" is visible to Him in just the same way as what we call "today". All the days are "Now" for him.
Regarding hell, that is a very ambiguous term too. I don't see God punishes us but offers us salvation from consequences for our actions. He is infinitely merciful.
I have not attempted to use the bible in my discussions of God and your soul. I personally do not reject the Bible but I also do not put it forward in my arguments with atheists. Some will claim that I think it is full of flaws but that simply is not true. The bible is not the focus of our discussion and I do not attempt to use it in my arguments for God and your Soul.
"Why should a atheist be moral? The answer is that there is no rational justification for adopting the moral point of view. Private egoism (the view that I will do right if and only if it is in my best interest to do so) is the only motivation for being moral. If I find a moral life satisfying or if doing what society says is moral will help me enjoy the moment, then I will be motivated to be moral on that occasion. But if the demands of morality go against my own personal interests, (cnt'd)
then morality has no rationally justified demand on me."
We exchanged private messages and you informed me that you take into consideration how your actions will impact others. I am assuming you are using the "circle of empathy" argument. Have you considered that atheists break this "circle of empathy" at death because atheist reject an afterlife? As a theists, I believe I will meet you in an afterlife so I NEVER break the circle of empathy.
Also have you considered that these religious hypocrits of which you speak and I assume disgust you will NEVER be held accountable for their actions in your belief system? and as a theist that ALL of these bastards will be brought to justice in an afterlife? I do not consider justice a PUNISHMENT by an angry god but as an unavoidable consequence for man's sin.
If you are referring to the anthropic principle which is a fancy way of saying "It is because it must be so" is the easy way out. In my opinion atheism is a simplistic approach to generating a world view. Believing in God is the most intense decision anyone can ever make and it is extremely demanding and is not the result of a lazy weak minded theist. God says "Be ye perfect" and he provides a pathway for us. It is up to us to accept this and act upon it.
I am sure you have read Michael Behe's books "Darwin's Black Box" and his most recent book "The Edge of Evolution" which is even better. I could claim attempt to be kind in saying that I am not dumb but I believe in something that is bullshit is passive aggressive. You can attempt to shove science and chance into everything I offer as evidence for God but I would offer that it's not bullshit.
regarding "chances of life seem to incredibly good when you consider...." wow...... Matter is matter. An atom is an atom. Atoms, no matter how highly arranged into brains do not WANT to do anything. Atoms do not have DESIRE. Atoms do not LOVE anything. If you believe that life arose by chance from lucky coming together of atoms, then you have killed the true freewill of man and declared it an illusion or a facade.
regarding NDE, I would just offer that there is many eyewitness accounts from doctors who claim the patient was brain dead (no activity) and yet the patient came back to life and can recount every single conversation verbatim that occurred in the room. This is not a fluke incident but it is my understanding that there are many such documented occurrences.
I am not sure the point of these quotes but I will bite.
Regarding Eccliastes, I would also say with wisdom also comes the potential for much greater joy as well.
Regarding tree of knowledge,,, I am not using biblical arguments to discuss the existence of God but since you bring it up, I think you are misstating the situation. God does not CURSE man. It is an inevitable consequence for man's sin.God wants man to be perfect.
I sincerely do not believe reason is the enemy of faith at all.
Sorry if these comments seem svattered; we're dealing with a lot here. I have never been shown any evidence for a soul, so i do not accept that I have one. I have seen no evidence for God, but I do see the great harm that religious belief causes, so i challenge them. I have never declared humans to be automatons. I have already sent you a PM regarding how I determine what is right conduct, so please do not mis-represent me.
I have already addressed my view ofnfree will in these text comments, so I'll not run in circles. Whether or not i would like justice to exist in the universe does not influence the facts.
In any case, the "justice" of your god would be cruel and not based on right conduct--if your god were real. Your god would simply be more powerful, and capable of throwing me in the hell that he created, but this would not make god good. Your view that God exists out side of time seems to agree with my model of no-freewill. So if god knows what we are going to do anyway, we do not have free will, so why are we going through the motions?
When you dismiss god as a superstitious belief like for example bigfoot, my argument is that if bigfoot ever poops out a Universe and grants me free will,I will believe in bigfoot. Until that time, I will believe in God.The common atheist attempt to put bigfoot and God in the same category is avoiding the issue.
1) Existence of the physical Universe
2) Existence if Life(can you imagine what it would take for pure chance to take inert materials and create life that has DESIRE to do things) cntd
It's worth it?Why exactly is it worth it?To live as the pinnacle of evolution (glorified luckily mutated monkey) for a mere 70-80 years free from God, your own Soul, free will, an eternal afterlife and no judgment?You have shed your childish beliefs in mainstream religion and now you are boldly facing the world alone armed with your respect for physical evidence and reasoned logic?How great a feeling it must be to shed all the chains you had holding you back and helping others break thru.
By freeing my mind from superstitiuos beliefs, I am able to embrace the beauty and complexity of life, persue knowledge without discouragement, I do not fear death and judgment, I take responsibility for my own actions, both good and bad, without blaming devils for tempting me of gods for helping me, and I do not pass moral judgement on people who happen to have been born of a different ethnicity or sexual orientation. Freedom from such superstition is a good thing!
I agree one should not believe in superstitious beliefs. God is not a superstitious belief. Embracing the beauty and complexity of life does not depend on rejecting God or your own Soul. Believing in God is the most demanding thing I have ever done. He said "Be ye perfect" and he means exactly that and God does not work in half measures. Believing in God is definitely not a discouragement to pursuing knowledge. That is a lie propagated by Richard Dawkins and the amazingatheist (cnt'd)
who likes to pretend jackoff in front of his camera and talk about penises on his head. As a believer, I also have no fear of death or judgment. I also take full responsibility for my actions, good and bad. I do not blame devils for my actions. I am the judge of no man. I have a right and a responsibility to speak out against views that I deem as harmful to man. You have a right to espouse that man is a glorified monkey and we only have this life and God is dead or never existed. (cnt'd)
I would fight for your right to put forward your views and I do not judge you or anyone but I will also put forward counter views that offer hope and comfort to man. My views are not based on blind faith. There is much evidence to believe in your own Soul and a God. If you choose to reject it, then that is your right to do so. If you believe in physicalism and most atheist do whether they have even thought about it, also have given up on true free will of man.
You as a Christian may indeed support these views also, but you do so in opposition of 2,000 years of Christian tradition.
There is no evidence that you have presented for the soul.
You have mis-represented evolutionary theory, and passive-agressivley dismissed it with your characterizarion.
Also, the theory of Evolution and Atheism have nothing to do with one another, as many Christians accept the theory, and many atheists either do not, or do not know enough about it.
Ok fair enough. The issue is not about Christianity or evolution but is squarely about the question of whether there is a God or even if one has a Soul.
Do you believe that man has true free will?
As an FYI, I am leaving the house for the next couple hours.
Back, just curious, when you write "You as a Christian may indeed support these views also, but you do so in opposition of 2,000 years of Christian tradition.", I simply do not follow you.
From a Christian: good video. I went through a similar experience but I met someone who had answers to all of my questions. This is odd though, why does it matter that anyone is honest? Truly, in Atheism it doesn't. Whether you are bound by chains or free from all burdens under Atheism it doesn't ultimately matter.
Atheism isn't a system of belief, so a statement such as yours doesn't hold water. An atheist is a person who doesn't believe in gods.
So what you say is true "Atheism doesn't matter"--it is not a system of organized belief, thus it has no heirarchical structure of leadership, rules, or doctrine. Being an "atheist "is like being a "dog owner". The term needs nothing further acribed than what it is.
However, it is always a good thing,in my opinion, to seek the truth and accept reality.
"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth."so he made a spiritual sanctuary to house those who were just and righteous. Since heaven is spiritually attributed we can assume it is outside of the time/space continuim so god the creator of heaven and earth must be eternal.
We are classified as members of the great apre family. Higher order mammals have much more complex social structures and emotional develpoment.
Apes (that are non-human) also experience, joy, fear, and pain), just because their brains aren't as advanced doesn't undermine evolution. We can see evolution also on a micro level as your own parents passed on many genetic traits to you.
it takes an extremely ignorent person to look at human anatomy as not being designed. Take a single atom for instance the way in which everything works in harmony with each other. We were designed by a designer.Another thought thats springs to mind is, how is it that in every four corners of the globe the concept of god was conjured up, it because we as humans are spiritual by nature and have a connection with god that cannot be denied.
There was a time when most of the world's poplulation believed that the world was flat--they were wrong.
There have been some 10,000 different gods that have been believed historically; each god myth had its own stories and moral imperatives. Human beings create gods.
Many of these conceptions of god or gods predate yours by thousands of years, and these people believed that they had just as close a relationship with their gods as you claim to have. How fortunate for you that the god of the geographic region and time period that you live in just happens to be the true god myth!
I personally belive god exists outside of time, and that the way our brains were created we can't no matter how much we dwell on the matter comprehend outside side of this, because everything we do evolves around time.
Metaphorically speaking you could think of it like an egg, we have the yoke which is the physical world, the white part which is space/time and the shell which is god/ the heavens.
Regarding,"I find god, who is infinitly more complex, so god must also have a more complex designer."
I often hear this argument from atheists that God must have a more complex creator so therefore God must not exist. The Universe and ourselves exists. That is fact. Atheist will claim that the Universe has always existed and avoid talking about its creation it is intellectual trickery to use that same argument against theists who can not answer the origin of God.
The fact that people have the capability of turning away from Christianity, should be an indication enough that It can't possibly be absolutely true. Sure they may say that people turn away because we humans are infalible and not perfect, but I think that is a cop out.
Wow! My experience was similar except I REALLY didn't want god to be fake. My de-conversion after 16 years of catholicism took about 20 years of spiritual searching, i.e. other christian churches, buddhism, deepak choprah, etc. The more I studied various religions the more I realized they were myths. After years of searching it just finally hit me, I DON'T BELIEVE IN god! I hope other struggling believers see this video, it really explains the thought process of de-conversion well. Thanks!
So you get disappointed with the religions and blame God? Since you have discovered that religions are all made up by man, then it seem hardly fair you blame God. Suggestion, now that you have found out that there are lots of people trying to speak in the instead of God (religions made up by humans), why don't you go straight to God Himself and ask for true direction? I suggest this because it is impossible that there is no meaning for this life.
I think you missed my point. I can't blame god. I don't believe in such a being. When I said that religions were invented by men, I meant the entire concept of a supreme being was invented. I put things like fairies, leprechauns, demons, ghosts, the tooth fairy and god in the same category. I don't believe things without evidence so I will never believe in a god because there will never be any evidence for such a being. Never! Feelings are not proof and wishing won't make it so.
If i were you i'd watch the creation seminars especially vid 7
dustinator4u2000 1 week ago
Your dialogue in this video was very beautifully worded, and it has been a joy for me to watch. Thank you.
iamnotyourface 1 month ago
@freetaught its sad but I think when you were a kid you made up your own personal god in your head which wasn't the true god of the bible. You also have made the mistake of categorizing Christianity as being a religion which i would disagree with. RELIGION- is man trying to get to God, Christianity is God coming to man through Jesus Christ. You should not let your emotions dictate truth. Being an atheist is intellectuality dishonest. Unless u r all knowing u do not know for sure God isn't here.
k12rising 1 month ago
Thank you so much for this. I am 14, and was raised in much the same way you were. I'm currently very confused on wether I belive in God or not, and this helped me alot :)
CreamRocks1 2 months ago
OMFG!!!! I LOVE THIS VIDEO! THANK YOU SOOO MUCH!
KirbyPwnz13 2 months ago in playlist More videos from freetaught
understand our Lord and know everything about Him or why things happened/happen, because if we could put the Lord in a "box" and be able to understand everything about Him, what makes Him greater than us? nothing.. so when you cannot understand every little thing, that is not a bad thing. It causes you to have faith(our you can choose to turn away and try to seek a religion in which u can put that god in a box to where u know everything about it and u do not wonder..) another thing you said was
yaymike23 3 months ago
Thanks for responding. My expression of God being in everything was was not uttered with the intention of denoting any expression of pantheism, deism or any like faith; rather, it was an expression of what I took to be God's ever presence, and acknowledgment that all things came from him. The intention behind this video was to present my considerations as they were at the time of my deconversion. Since that time I have encountered nothing but reasons to presume against any Gods existence.
freetaught 3 months ago
Faith would be but one single problem. I do not assume truths as articles of faith, and nor do Christians most of the time. If someone were to offer you a medicine while sick, or financial adivice, or claim against a friend, or an allegation in a criminal trial, most persons would ask, in these instances, "why should I believe this?". The answer "just have faith" for God is no more a good and sufficient reason for accepting this than in any other case. A giant claim requires greater evidence.
freetaught 3 months ago
narrow and it doesn't say it is an easy path(obviously) but that is what draws us to the Lord.. He is there to guide us and for us to rely on/turn to.. but if u turned from your faith because it was difficult at times then that is something completely different than turning away because you don't understand the Lord.. we cannot fully in depth
yaymike23 3 months ago
@yaymike23 What mental process allows you to assume the bible to be true...? How can you justify the contradictions within the bible while this same God is "perfect" in all ways?
You're basically saying "well this book is true, and you just did what this book said you would do, therefore this book is true..."
Xilosphere 3 months ago
just a couple things.. at one point you state that you believed that your god was in everything.. the cup of coffee, the table.. that is not Christianity .. that is pantheism and that is not what the Christians faith/relationship is , with the Lord. He is not in everything/a physical part of everything. and you say Christianity caused you pain? in the bible it says the path of the righteous is (continued)..
yaymike23 3 months ago
just a couple things.. at one point you state that you believed that your god was in everything.. the cup of coffee, the table.. that is not Christianity .. that is pantheism and that is not what the Christians faith/relationship is , with the Lord. He is not in everything/a physical part of everything. and you say Christianity caused you pain? in the bible it says the path of the righteous is narrow and it doesn't say it is an easy path(obviously) but that is what draws us to the Lord.. He is
yaymike23 3 months ago
no offense, but when you talk about what you went through you sound like you are talking about some drug or strange addiction.
oh...
redbulborb 4 months ago
@redbulborb
That is actually what religions are.. the worst drug.. the worst habit.
I call it "holy smoking".
Sometimes you enjoy it immensely, sometimes you cough your lungs out but whatever you do, you can't drop the "holy cigarette".
Everybody around you is smoking it, making you an outsider if yous top, an outcast, an enemy sometimes. And the worst thing of all.. you "know" if you stop smoking, the "holy cigarette" will hunt you down and make you smoke it in horrific pain for all eternity.
realbojay 4 months ago
Thank you, thank you, thank you. This video is much needed, and it took serious balls. I respect you immensely. I have been mulling over these things so much lately that I actually aspire to start some kind of online blog chat community to discuss the transition, both the awesome and devastating. Something that excludes people who attack from the religious and non-religious ends of the bully spectrum, so people can reason and mourn through this, and rejoice. Thank you, favorited, already subbed.
MariMattie 5 months ago
@MariMattie, Thank you for your kind words. Peace!
freetaught 5 months ago
(Cont.). . . he doesn't believe in my God? No. In fact, I merely want to help that person realize that the Lord is indeed real and He doesn"t NEED to show us how real He is. We don't deserve it. I mean, doubting Him? Think of a parents whose child denies their own parents. I mean, I would be really upset. But God won't give up on you because you said He isn't real. Is He upset? Yes! Does He want to completely throw you aside as you are living? No! God loves. He loves you! That is why Jesus died.
JazmineEbell 5 months ago
@JazmineEbell
If jesus existed he died because he was a human.
You believe some idiotic incoherent crap and ignore all the lies and idiocy to be able to stick to your illusion. You justify unjustifiable things using your imagination and other people's irrational idiotic explanations, a simple way to dodge and reject reality.
You know NOTHING about god, you have no proof, you like to believe it because it feels so warm.. but like peeing your pants, the warm feeling is not all that comes with it.
realbojay 4 months ago
Around 7:24 you mentioned a world without judgment and the you went out to say a place where you don't have to cast silly judgements about others. But remember, the God I believe in is the only judge. He tells us not to judge others. As humans, naturally we judge people without noticing, but we must remeber what the Lord told us. Children of God can accpet people for who they are just as any other person on this earth does. Does it mean we agree with the thought of an athiest say. . .(Cont.)
JazmineEbell 5 months ago
Wow, this is a great video. I never could understand the idea of believing in a God, so this really makes me understand how christians feel.
Krutchtacular 6 months ago
Ok, look. I have no problem with people that do not believe the same things as me. Now I don't bash on anyones beliefs or non beliefs unless they bash on mine. So therefore basically I am willing to make peace with anyone who is willing to accept me as a Christian, no matter if you are one or not. What I am saying is that why bash on Christians as a whole, when not all Christians force religion down your throat? I am offended that you hate all Christians when I have done nothing to you.
that1dude10 7 months ago
@that1dude10. I'm not sure if this comment was directed toward me or not, but who said they "hate all Christians"? I don't say that, I don't believe that, and I don't even discourage christians from sharing their ideas. That's why I share my own. I think that any person who believes they have good ideas should be eager to share them with any person who is willing to listen. Otherwise you must passively accept the world you inherit. peace!
freetaught 3 months ago
@903gamefreak Don't worry about this guy. He is on a mission to disprove Christians, which he will never succeed. Even if he changed everybody else, I would fight till the end. But sadly, he will try to do this all of his life and have no success whatsoever and then realize that he isn't so smart after all since you have been destroying him in this whole argument :D
that1dude10 7 months ago
Stupid people like you try to seem smart. Its kind of funny how you devote your life so hard to proving christians wrong, that it must bother you that people are christian. Well guess what, me, and Im sure alot of other people don't give a damn about your theories. So just keep on talking and act like your making a difference. Maybe to your atheist fans who cheer you on like a jr high cheerleading squad. LOL your like a fly buzzing around that tries so hard to get attention, but no 1 cares :D
that1dude10 7 months ago
@that1dude10, Before you attempt to disparage another person's intelligence in text, you might want to work on your grammar a bit. That way you wouldn't lose all of your intellectual credibility at the moment you begin to type.
freetaught 7 months ago
@freetaught No one gives a damn about proper grammer. Try to seem smart in order to cover the fact that you arent a happy person
that1dude10 7 months ago
@that1dude10 - What does happy have to do with it? Happiness comes from lots of sources, and at least one of them is fufillment of self - but when more than half of (pick a first world country), either is, or will be, on anti-depressants, and most of those are theists? I don't think happiness has anything to do with this topic.
And I sure hope you aren't arguing pro "ignorance is bliss".
PurpleGhost 7 months ago
@PurpleGhost I am happy as ever and I'm Christian. I'm saying that he spends all his time doing this, trying to disprove Christians. If he would just stfu and quit trying to argue, be himself, he would be better off. He can be atheist without trying to argue with people.
that1dude10 7 months ago
@that1dude10 - You /might/ be right about that, but maybe this makes him happier then he would be silent.
I don't really mean you any offense, but your religion as a whole hasn't been very good to humanity. Sure some particular sects and branches have been much better, but until they are the sum of the whole, then you're likely to still have people being jerks to athiests, promting them to do what he is, speak out. He's not actually trying to disprove the whole religion, just the dumbos.
PurpleGhost 7 months ago
@PurpleGhost Well, just saying its not just Christians being jerks to atheists. It works both ways I agree.
that1dude10 6 months ago
@that1dude10 - You are right, it does work both ways. *thumbs up*
PurpleGhost 6 months ago
What a wonderful and gutsy testament! - Well done!!
I won't deny that any passionate apologist would describe me as a fairly venomous atheist. - Yet, if approached by anyone going through "a dark night of the soul", I would not push them toward non believe in their entity, but rather through the ruthless intellectual honesty it seems to have required in you. If they can retain that honesty and still believe...so be it.
I'm also glad you pulled no punches. It's not easy- just worth it!
Tobytrim 8 months ago
@Tobytrim: Thank you!
freetaught 8 months ago
@903gamefreak: Also you don't seem to know what abstract means. What is an abstraction to you? Is my pepsi monster not abstract? We've only just begun our discussion and you are already avoiding my questions. If you do not answer them now, I will respond no further. I count about six base questions so far, plus a few qualification questions.
freetaught 8 months ago
@903gamefreak: Yes you must explain how you understand possibility, if we are going to have a meaningful discussion, because the way you use "possible" does not seem to be the way I and others do: possible means something could actually be, could actually exist. This is further indicated by your last comment. You say "pepsi is man made". Fair enough, but the issue is whether or not God also is. Men make up gods often. That's why we have so many of them.
freetaught 8 months ago
@903gamefreak:What does it mean to be "possible" to you?Possibility within the context, or in the realm of what? Is it duelly possible that there are multiple gods rather than one or none?Are eternal Pepsi-can monsters in space possible, if not why not? On what grounds would you exclude possibility? Certainly, you take this liberty. Why have you so certainly expressed that God could not have kids or that can't break its "own rules"? Is God not free? On what basis do you assert these things?
freetaught 8 months ago
@903gamefreak, God damn iTouch, why do I make so many typos when typing on you. Anyway I don't think god's existence is likely and neither does most of the scientific community. A lack of evidence is just as disproving as evidence that directly disproves something.
USOtaku013666 8 months ago
@903gamerfreak Oops, hit the wrong button and finished too early (typing on an iTouch is annoying). What I was saying that I don't think the existence of a god (or many gods, not to exclude the polytheistic) is highly unlikely, if not impossible.
USOtaku013666 8 months ago
@903gamefreak I did look at religion, multiple religions in fact, but none of them appealed to me nor could I see much logic in any of them. Although, to be truly scientific the existence of a god (or gods) is possible, but in my opinion that's shared with most of the scientific community.
USOtaku013666 8 months ago
@14brannen I (kinda) respectfully disagree. In my opinion god's a lie, religion's a lie, and those who invented the notion of god/religion were either stupid or lying their balls off.
USOtaku013666 8 months ago
I respect everyone of y'all. But the truth is there is a God, and he loves you more than anything. We are his children and God is our father.
14brannen 1 year ago
@14brannen I respect everyone of y'all. But the truth is there is an invisible pink unicorn, and she loves you more than anything. We are her children and the invisible pink unicorn is our mother.
drrobertoboogie97 8 months ago
You its funny how similar our stories are; my father will turn sixty a few months before I graduate from highschool and I think my transition was much easier than most for two reasons: My parents were too busy with 8 children to make us go to church, when I was little in school the teacher asked what we were and I had no idea what i believed. I asked my mom and she said I was Christian. I had no idea what it really was so I read the entire thing...
underballbutter 1 year ago
...asked many people about it but I was never really convinced; I was only really attracted to the idea of god and many of the moral examples but nothing else seemed to make sense. I had always been logical probably because I was the youngest and smallest and thats how I survived in my house. I was also always extremely curious and Socrates' philosophy made all the sense to me. I questioned everything including authority. I also learned the theory of evolution early on and understood it...
underballbutter 1 year ago
...very well. I then learned the idea the bible gave of Creationism which was one of the most absurd things I had heard. Later what sent me running to athiesm was when I rationally observed people who believed christianity and saw how the comfort, the threat of hell, temptation of heaven drew ppl in. And the only answer I ever got to why somone believed christianity was one word: faith. I hated the word. It was the epitome of ignorance in my mind. It explained nothing.
underballbutter 1 year ago
This vid convinces me that atheists' God is greater than Christians' God lol Because the instant someone points to something and says it' from God, that God ceases to exist. So if you believe that God does not exist, you bring it into-and-out of existence every time you think ... or something ... or not ...
mythmanjay 1 year ago
Great advice. My deconversion wasn't nearly as painful as most because although I believed in a god just like everyone else, I wasn't neck deep into religion. It still took a few years to realize almost everyone was believing in a lie. You should make more videos.
hc5831 1 year ago
@hornerc1 This is the tragedy of going mainstream with atheism. Now it isn't ok to disagree with another atheist. Atheism, to me, more than anything else, is about free speech. If we can't disagree, argue, poke fun, and, yes, even berate each other, we're no better than those other religions. I have the right to call this video bullshit just as much as you have the right to exalt it. But now you're attacking another atheist over free speech. What are you fighting for?
FallenSparrow 1 year ago
@hornerc1 The funny part of it is, I don't believe in God. Sure, I have an ego. All humans do. But I'm not the one putting my face on youtube, preaching, like a brimstone minister, that you all must "Come walk with me down the lonely road of atheism." Jesus, man, save it for your fucking therapist. I'm all for atheism, but it's a way of life, not a Hollywood melodrama. And even if it is that for you, who the hell cares? Get over yourselves you millionaires, and movie gods, and rock stars.
FallenSparrow 1 year ago
great man...explains things so well...and he doesn't just insult christians he actually talks to them about there beliefs...I know this might be a dumb reason not to believe in god but when I was a baby, I fell on glass...and I was only 1 year old and my family has no baby picture of me when I had both my eyes...and I never knew how it is to see with two eyes...also ever since I started school other students have picked on me...and looked at me as if I'm some kind of monster.
wescomark65 1 year ago
I am glad this is still here. This shows the empathy that is capable in a mind that rejects a god. god is not the wellspring of goodness, humanity itself is. I am glad to find someone else who can express these thoughts that I have had myself. Deconversion just is not for everyone! If you are an atheist, you are JUST an atheist, and it will come to you. Over time, the BS of the buybull just sinks in, and BAM. Atheism :) Good video, and I give Kudos for your sensitivity to the subject!
scitzz 1 year ago
"Be honest to yourself," this sums up everything. ;)
jeffrman777 1 year ago
The world is a cruel and unfair place. There is no explicit reason for being, no explicit source of life. That there is no meaning in the world, only what we as humans can establish through years of culture. As Nietzsche said Uber-men are those able to look into this void of meaning, take it in and be at peace not having to fall back on whimsical thoughts justice, truth, good and evil or God.
Religious people are simply those who refuse to look into the void, and thus will never achieve peace.
BrootalMetalBanjo 1 year ago
good vid
NORTHERNKONFLIKT 1 year ago
Look disconcertingly into the camera and, behold, we're humanitarians, as if an 8:00 minute video makes any difference when we have nothing to say. And I love the Freudian slip of indoctrination-deconversion at 4:00. We do nothing real with our lives and still find sleep at night to be sound. Conscience is dead.
"I didn't need a timequake to teach me being alive was a crock of shit. I already knew that from my childhood and crucifixes and history books." -Vonnegut
Get over yourself, YouTube.
FallenSparrow 1 year ago
@FallenSparrow So what do you do with your life that is so real? How do you even have face to come here and judge this guy? I would assume that listening to what this guy has to say hits very close to home with you. I don't know you but from your comment it would seem that it hits so close to home that you fear for your eternal soul when his words resonate inside you and you can truly relate to his sentiments. Go ahead and cast judgment. It makes you more akin to the God you worship.
johngeetar 1 year ago
We are Hemingway, Aristotle, Sun Tsu. We are Jesus, Mohamed, Buddha. Vishnu, Ra, and the Beatles. We are God. We are Satan.
Tyler Durden says: "We've all been raised on television to believe that one day we'd all be millionaires, and movie gods, and rock stars. But we won't. And we're slowly learning that fact. And we're very, very pissed off."
And now, thanks to YouTube, we are slowly unlearning that fact. Take this schmuck, or any other, talk about nothing as if it were scripture.
FallenSparrow 1 year ago
Wow I'm glad I wasn't as indoctrinated as you were when I deconverted, I deconverted when I was 14 just when I was beginning to think God was everything and when I relized that if god was real and everything he is supposed to be the world would not be this way and that the whole institution of religion was not effective and quite arbitrary
harryman11 2 years ago
Hey Freetaught.
Loved the vid. My shift came earlier that yours. I was only 5 when I started picking holes in the priests arguments lol
After that I still had a hope and was willing to accept a "general" deity who did the basics and occasionally popped up.
The Tsunami ended any doubt I had.
I wouldnt even bother arguing with people on here if I were you. Serves no purpose arguing with people who think you are so bad you will go to hell. They just dont get it yet and maybe never will.
manchester26m 2 years ago
This is a very thoughtful and passionate video.
nikolka1992 2 years ago
The tough part is finding a social circle. Churches are closely knit.
I say forget the god nonsense and enjoy life!
Ramshobraja 2 years ago
With such a wonderful relationship with yourself, you were very lucky.
objectiveagnostic 2 years ago
Ive come to a conclusion, most athiests, or deconverters, are so confused with the Bible and what it means and says (which is so important in christianity) that i now know why they dont believe. They've got all their facts mixed up and thats why they have a hard time understanding the truth. its not the God factor, becuase it is so easy to have faith with the evidence of the World, how perfect and precise the universe is. but back to the matter at hand, deconverters, need to go to bible college.
funkymonkey 2 years ago
Who says that you have to believe in god to point to a verse that shows how ignorant a person is? You said the Jews were never ordered to kill anyone. I guess this is yet another thing that you're wrong about.
freetaught 2 years ago
You have demonstrated the greatest level of ignorance that I've come across in quite some time. This should make your God very happy. If you choose to believe that you are the center of some imaginary being's universe,
freetaught 2 years ago 5
and will be rewarded for denying all things rational, while petitioning it for favors with incantations, more power to you. I guess that I'm just going to have to be content with living in the dull real world, where angels and demons aren't fighting an eternal battle for my soul and where magic doesn't exist. I, however, will waste no further time responding to your childish remarks.
freetaught 2 years ago 6
@funkymonkey Thats quite a generalization you are making. What facts do you assert that I as an atheist am mixing up? The world in all its "precision" (or lack thereof) are evidence of nothing more than than the world and your perceived precision of it. Deconverters need to go to bible college? Why? Is God not powerful enough to give them discernment to understand the bible? That seems inconsistent with the christian worldview that if you seek God you will find him.
johngeetar 1 year ago
@funkymonkey That would be a true statement! Big thumbs up, and your exactly right!...
driverofsound 9 months ago
yeah, but dont you see? times are getting worse and worse, and cant you see the correlation between these times and all of these civil liberties becoming legal and what not? the bible says these things are wrong because they are. no doubt about it. abortion, homosexuality, etc.
back in the day, these issues were not even brought up like they are today and times were better i must say(with these issues). what everyone can do what they want and its ok? that doesnt seem good to me, logically
funkymonkey 2 years ago
If you understood history, you would see that we are not living in worse times. Ever read of the Crusades, Salem Witch Trials, or even the bible's accounts of how the Jew's were ordered to pretty much kill everyone who disagreed with, and didn't adhere, to their faith, which God commanded?
Democracy, medical research, the U.S Constitution, the very computer that you now use are all products of Western thought and scientific progress.
It's sad that you have such a bleak view of the world.
freetaught 2 years ago
HAHA the jews were not ordered to kill. maybe if you understood your history my friend, you would see that times are getting worse no matter what old civil, or cold wars or any wars you bring up. i could bring up the iraq war, or ww2, but thats not what i mean. Yes times are getting better for technology, but morals and ethics are just blowing out the window.
really? homosexuality?? relaly think of that concept..like REALLY thinka but it...man and a man...together.
funkymonkey 2 years ago
Deuteronomy 13 5-11
freetaught 2 years ago
why would you bring up a verse when you dont even believe in God haha. look at yourself, you turn to God even though you deny him.
im pretty sure you are the antichrist leading people astray. so watch youself becuase you damn youself to hell, God doesnt its your choice. and i dont understand why all atheists bring up verses from the penetuke, like it refers to us...it was totally different cirucumstances. totally different than todays world.
funkymonkey 2 years ago
Who says that you have to believe in god to point to a verse that shows how ignorant a person is? You said the Jews were never ordered to kill anyone. I guess this is yet another thing that you're wrong about.
freetaught 2 years ago
Honestly man, acting like you really care is funny to me. Its not a hard decision when you stop believing if you believed in the first place.
Instead of whatever problems you are having defining who you are and what your faith is, take a chance and give God a chance.
You sound like an emo kid thats way to old to be emo. The athiesm trend will wear off and your going to be crying about something else.
SteveJHenning 2 years ago
Wow! A Youtube Christian, who lacks the intellectual conviction to post his own videos, judging someone? That's quite a surprise! I'll tell you what--I don't do this very often, but I would like to ask you to post a video explaining precisely how you've come to these conclusions about me. Will you please do this?
freetaught 2 years ago
@SteveJHenning @SteveJHenning Most atheists have given god a chance. I sure did. There came a point where I had to be honest with myself that the tenets of Christianity were just not something I believed. I tried desperately to believe simply because I was afraid of the consequences of disbelief. In the end I simply couldn't believe. So yeah, I gave god a chance. The problem is, if he exists, he never gave me one. I respect your right to believe as you see fit, but don't judge others.
johngeetar 1 year ago
@SteveJHenning Like your acting you care right now.
mosaicmaster1 1 year ago
@funkymonkey slavery is abolished, women and children have more rights than ever, and living conditions have skyrocketed... yep, sure is a nasty world compared to back in the day. Also, homosexuality was accepted in many older societies but recently it's been looked down upon more and more. how do any of these facts support your claim?
pcwildcat 2 years ago
It is here that I find cause for such activism, which I assure you does not consume much of my time. Aside from your own spiritual inclinations, you have no greater evidence for your faith than the Muslim has for his. I am dissinclined to accept either faith, as both present the same lack of tangible evidence. Superstition in all it's forms should always be challenged. I meet this challenge within my family and in the public sphere.
freetaught 2 years ago
If we may put aside Christian for a moment lut us consider Islam which promotes the subjugation of women, slavery, and stoning for sins (not unlike Christianity historically) Is it not a worthwhile enterprise to challenge such a mode of thought? Aside from your own spiritual inclinations, you have no greater evidence to support your faith than the Muslim has to support his.
freetaught 2 years ago
but you didnt exactly answer my question, why are you doing this? why does it matter if i believe in a God or not when i die to you? it doesnt matter.
Islamic has taken the bible and added and taken away pieces which the bible says not to do. Muhammed has altered it, which makes that religion false. the bible is the first true book of most religions. Mormans, joseph smith, another man who thought he was equal to christ changed the bible. Thats why Christianity stands above these other religions.
funkymonkey 2 years ago
reminds me of my conversion.
before i new Jesus i was a lost soul. But people tend to think that being a Christian is about being happier and me me me. its not, its about God, living for him, giving up things for him and having faith. not now knowing everything and being the happiest man alive. but thats not to say it doesnt bring you joy and happiness. just remember its about Him not you.
funkymonkey 2 years ago
My search had little to do with "happiness" and more to do with what is the truth. My search lead me to the truth but away from Christianity.
My continued studies have only strengthened my position that there likely isn't a god. Happiness is irrelevant when it comes to the truth. Good luck in your own pursuit!
freetaught 2 years ago
Thanks but thats not the only reason i chase God lol. he is the truth, and if material things and things you can only see determines what is truth to you, then i guess good luck to you. i dont need luck.
funkymonkey 2 years ago
and one question, why is it you sit behind a camera trying to disprove God like it means anything to you, when us christians are living the athiest life, happy and satisfied. when in the end(in your minds) ultimately, nothing matters once were dead. see, i have a purpose, to bring truth because it matters in the end.
funkymonkey 2 years ago
"Atheist Girl vs Christian Girl" - New video on my channel.
atheistfriends 2 years ago
Hey man, thanks for sharing these personal thoughts. I feel like I know you a little better. But having said that, I want to state that God is real. He is still real and He is Love. You may have forsaken Him but God has not. If you think you had a lonely path to your personal quest, realize that Jesus was the loneliest man ever lived. He knows loneliness. You may want to read about him even though you are not a Christian. Anyhow, God bless you, man. God loves you.
JLinnst 2 years ago
Reminds me a lot of my own deconversion.
Atheist001 2 years ago
Very eloquent and impressive - thank you.
1Weemaryanne 2 years ago
scary.... religion is so scary... and pervasive!
I'm fricken lucky I have always escaped the clutches of religion.
Paxmax 2 years ago
It doesn't sound any different than getting over an incredibly hot chic that you must spend time working with, and have become utterly infatuated with, but that isn't interested in you. It's not that you can't let go. It's just that every time you see that body your mind wants nothing more than to try again.
What I cant understand is how people can go through life thinking that some awesome being has nothing more interesting to do than to listen to a lot idiots' vapid lugubrious longings.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
The Bible teaches that God has appointed a day of Judgment in which sinners will be condemned. The only way of escape is through a savior. God provided that savior in the person of his son Jesus Christ. Those who turn and believe on him shall be saved:
John3:18
He that believes on him is not condemned: but he that believes not is condemned already because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God
Turn to God, repent of your sins and believe on Jesus before its too late
ChristianTULIP 2 years ago
3) I do believe we have free will and this can not exist with only physicalism, therefore we must have something immaterial about us which I believe to be a Soul.
4) common near death experiences of people supposedly already dead
5) the fact that the universe is within very precise parameters for the existence of Life.
6) Irreducibly complex organisms
7) Moral law that could not have evolved
8) The golden ratio is found everywhere in nature
There are many more arguments for God.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
Lonestar, we have had many interractions already and I have touched on many of these issues in our exchanges and in my videos. Before I address all of these questions again, I have one for you. What would it take for you not to believe in God?
freetaught 2 years ago
My belief in God in strengthened from the fact that I have freewill and the freedom of thought and I recognize the importance that there is something rather than nothing.I think therefore I am. So even if you eliminated all other arguments for God and shrunk the Universe down to two things
A) a single atom to observe and
B) my unaltered consciousness
My consciousness would look at the single atom and realize the following two things:
A) I do not have the capacity to create that atom (cnt'd)
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
B) I recognize the freewill in my own consciousness to believe someone else must have created it
So to answer your question: For me personally not to believe in God, you would have to kill me or altar my consciousness to a point where I no longer have freewill to contemplate things freely. Either kill me or eliminate every single piece of matter within the entire Universe so that I would no longer have anything to observe. (cnt'd)
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
You may say that I have given an unfair answer because I can not be realistically killed in order for you to win the argument and thus our conversation will go on forever. That is true and it may foreshadow that you and I will never agree on this topic as long as I draw a breath but that is my honest answer to your question. What would it take for you to believe in God? Witnessing a miracle firsthand? (cnt'd)
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
The creation of a seemingly endless Universe? Taking inert materials and creating beings with DESIRE to do things? What would it take for you to recognize that you have true freewill not governed 100% by material influences? I also see that you have already sold your soul on youtube and you are continuing to encourage others to do the same in your altruistic belief that many others will be set free of "superstitious beliefs" such as God. (cnt'd)
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
I do not know your life history but rejecting religious hypocrisy is very normal and admirable but rejecting your own freewill, your own Soul and God is like throwing the baby out with the bathwater in my opinion.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
Eccliastes 1:18
For in much wisdom comes a lot of heartache. The greater your knowledge, the greater your pain.
Genesis account warns man not to eat of the tree of Knowledge. When humanity does, God curses man with death.
Martin Luther: Reason is the greatest enemy that faith has;it never comes to the aid of spiritual things, but, more frequently than not,struggles against the divine Word,treating with contempt all that emanates from God.
freetaught 2 years ago
Superstition:is a belief or notion, not based on reason or knowledge. The word is often used pejoratively to refer to supposedly irrational beliefs of others, and its precise meaning is therefore subjective. It is commonly applied to beliefs and practices surrounding luck, prophecy and spiritual beings, particularly the irrational belief that future events can be influenced or foretold by specific, unrelated behaviours or occurrences.
freetaught 2 years ago
2) Chances of life seem to incredibly good when you consider the size of the universe, its age, and that hydrogen and oxygen are abundant in the universe. But I am neither a scientist nor a mathmatician.
4) Near death experiences mean nothing, because you cannot be "near death". Life and death are states of being. Are NDE any more significant than dreams and hallucinations? To me, it seems that they are all linked to distortions in perception.
freetaught 2 years ago
5) Refer to question 2. This is not a significant point. Lets consider how people look at the Earth in the same way. Suppose that intelligent life had developed on Mars instead of the Earth under different conditions: likely, Martians would be saying the same thing.
6) You are not a dumb guy. I feel certain that you have explored the notion of irreducable complexity from all angles. So I'm not even going to touch this one. But it's bullshit!
freetaught 2 years ago
7) The Moral law has evolved and continues to. Morals (though I don't like the word) are based on cooperation that benefits the species survival, empathy, abd reason.
freetaught 2 years ago
The bible has not taken a stance against pedophilia, slavery, or killing people who believe in others gods. I and many others find these laws to be immoral. Likely you do to. There you have it.If you can demonstrate even one thing that you find to be immoral that could have been done a the time, like pedophila, but the bible says nothing against it, you have just accepted a social moral,
freetaught 2 years ago
or determined it for yourself. I would also recommend that you read anthropolgy articles, so that you may learn how morals vary from society to society.
freetaught 2 years ago
8) There are many arguments against your god: Can god create a rock that he humself cannot lift. Does God know our future? Does God know its own future? If the answer is "yes" to both, neither have free will. If god is eternally merciful, people wouldn't be in hell for a minute let alone eternity.
freetaught 2 years ago
9) Your answer regarding what would cause you not to believe in god is, forgive me for this, absurd. If you are killed then you no longer have the capacity to believe or not believe anything. It seems as if your saying that your mind is closed to the notion that god mught not exist. If a person has alzheimers disease, do they have free will? Is it only your own will that counts or the will of all humanity?
freetaught 2 years ago
SN: You say that your belief in God is strengthened by there being something rather than nothing. Demonstrate to me that "nothingness" actually exists or ever has. Even the spaces between objects is not nothing. If you cannot prove that there is nothing, then why would you believe that the universe came from nothing?
freetaught 2 years ago
questions 1,3:There is a differnece between phsicalism/determinism. You seem to be confusion these positions. Do I believe that I have free will or am I constrained by a deterministic universe?I don't know. Theoretically, if I did live in a deterministic universe and felt that I had free will, it would only be an illusion of autonomy.
freetaught 2 years ago
So what would be the difference? If you were to say, accepting the deterministic view would justfy any actions, then you would be conceding that I have free will to defy the deterministic order. I reason to the best of my capability, and I do not intentionally harm others.
freetaught 2 years ago
A single particle of matter (atom) does not WANT to do anything. It is just matter, it has no DESIRE or WANTS. Now take a trillion trillion trillion atoms and arrange them into a brain. Do you think that these highly arranged atoms will still ever WANT to do anything whatsoever? Your soul animates your brain to make it WANT to do things. If you do not accept your soul you declare all mankind is automatons with no accountability or freewill.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
You say that you do not intentionally harm others and you reason to the best of your capacity. I believe you. But you make videos on youtube professing that God is dead or never existed and sell your own soul for less than 10 dollars and in doing so you encourage others around you to be influenced by your ideas. You desire others to break free from this "superstitious" belief in God. I agree in attacking religious hypocrisy but please don't reject your own Soul and God.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
Imagine a fish that has spent his entire life in the water. The fish would ONLY know about "wetness" but would never understand the concept of "wetness" because the fish had never experienced being out of the water. Nothingness is no atoms or electron movement anywhere. We are men, we are not simply observers of men. We know what me actually do and what they OUGHT TO DO. This is why we have the inside knowledge to being a man because we know the difference of actions and OUGHT.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
You might say that my mind is closed to not believing in God. I would phrase it as "Once someone is truly awake to the belief in a Divine Creator" and realizes the quicksand we are all stuck in and that God has provided us a path out of the quicksand, that it is extremely difficult to no longer be awake to this belief. I am surprised when I hear that you went through a 3 year deconversion. I do not know what happened to make you lose faith, but I pray that you can one day overcome it.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
Regarding alzheimers,
A cork and rubber ball covered in cowhide flies through the air about sixty feet where it comes into contact with a rapidly revolving stick. The ball bounces off the stick in many different trajectories and eventually finds its way to a leather glove. The ball then flings itself from the glove to another leather glove in the vicinity of a white canvas square. (cont'd)
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
All of this is true, in a way, but the entire point is missed. The ball, the bat and the bases are not playing baseball. They are the equipment that the players use. It is the players not the equipment that are actually playing the game.
I believe that the person with alzheimers has a brain (the equipment of the Soul) that is not functioning properly.
I believe it is only the will of the individual that God considers. What exactly is the "will of humanity?"
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
From C.S. Lewis "Mere Christianity"
Another difficulty we get if we believe God to be in time is this. Everyone who believes in God at all believes that He knows what you and I are going to do tomorrow. But if He knows that I am going to do so-and-so, how can I be free to do otherwise? Well, here once again, the difficulty comes from thinking that God is progressing along the Time-line like us: the only difference being that He can see ahead and we cannot. (cnt'd)
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
Well, if that were true, if God foresaw our acts, it would be very hard to understand how we could be free not to do them. But suppose God is outside and above the Time-line. In that case, what we call "tomorrow" is visible to Him in just the same way as what we call "today". All the days are "Now" for him.
Regarding hell, that is a very ambiguous term too. I don't see God punishes us but offers us salvation from consequences for our actions. He is infinitely merciful.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
I have not attempted to use the bible in my discussions of God and your soul. I personally do not reject the Bible but I also do not put it forward in my arguments with atheists. Some will claim that I think it is full of flaws but that simply is not true. The bible is not the focus of our discussion and I do not attempt to use it in my arguments for God and your Soul.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
"Why should a atheist be moral? The answer is that there is no rational justification for adopting the moral point of view. Private egoism (the view that I will do right if and only if it is in my best interest to do so) is the only motivation for being moral. If I find a moral life satisfying or if doing what society says is moral will help me enjoy the moment, then I will be motivated to be moral on that occasion. But if the demands of morality go against my own personal interests, (cnt'd)
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
then morality has no rationally justified demand on me."
We exchanged private messages and you informed me that you take into consideration how your actions will impact others. I am assuming you are using the "circle of empathy" argument. Have you considered that atheists break this "circle of empathy" at death because atheist reject an afterlife? As a theists, I believe I will meet you in an afterlife so I NEVER break the circle of empathy.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
Also have you considered that these religious hypocrits of which you speak and I assume disgust you will NEVER be held accountable for their actions in your belief system? and as a theist that ALL of these bastards will be brought to justice in an afterlife? I do not consider justice a PUNISHMENT by an angry god but as an unavoidable consequence for man's sin.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
If you are referring to the anthropic principle which is a fancy way of saying "It is because it must be so" is the easy way out. In my opinion atheism is a simplistic approach to generating a world view. Believing in God is the most intense decision anyone can ever make and it is extremely demanding and is not the result of a lazy weak minded theist. God says "Be ye perfect" and he provides a pathway for us. It is up to us to accept this and act upon it.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
I am sure you have read Michael Behe's books "Darwin's Black Box" and his most recent book "The Edge of Evolution" which is even better. I could claim attempt to be kind in saying that I am not dumb but I believe in something that is bullshit is passive aggressive. You can attempt to shove science and chance into everything I offer as evidence for God but I would offer that it's not bullshit.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
regarding "chances of life seem to incredibly good when you consider...." wow...... Matter is matter. An atom is an atom. Atoms, no matter how highly arranged into brains do not WANT to do anything. Atoms do not have DESIRE. Atoms do not LOVE anything. If you believe that life arose by chance from lucky coming together of atoms, then you have killed the true freewill of man and declared it an illusion or a facade.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
regarding NDE, I would just offer that there is many eyewitness accounts from doctors who claim the patient was brain dead (no activity) and yet the patient came back to life and can recount every single conversation verbatim that occurred in the room. This is not a fluke incident but it is my understanding that there are many such documented occurrences.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
I am not sure the point of these quotes but I will bite.
Regarding Eccliastes, I would also say with wisdom also comes the potential for much greater joy as well.
Regarding tree of knowledge,,, I am not using biblical arguments to discuss the existence of God but since you bring it up, I think you are misstating the situation. God does not CURSE man. It is an inevitable consequence for man's sin.God wants man to be perfect.
I sincerely do not believe reason is the enemy of faith at all.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
Sorry if these comments seem svattered; we're dealing with a lot here. I have never been shown any evidence for a soul, so i do not accept that I have one. I have seen no evidence for God, but I do see the great harm that religious belief causes, so i challenge them. I have never declared humans to be automatons. I have already sent you a PM regarding how I determine what is right conduct, so please do not mis-represent me.
freetaught 2 years ago
I have already addressed my view ofnfree will in these text comments, so I'll not run in circles. Whether or not i would like justice to exist in the universe does not influence the facts.
freetaught 2 years ago
In any case, the "justice" of your god would be cruel and not based on right conduct--if your god were real. Your god would simply be more powerful, and capable of throwing me in the hell that he created, but this would not make god good. Your view that God exists out side of time seems to agree with my model of no-freewill. So if god knows what we are going to do anyway, we do not have free will, so why are we going through the motions?
freetaught 2 years ago
Comment removed
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
When you dismiss god as a superstitious belief like for example bigfoot, my argument is that if bigfoot ever poops out a Universe and grants me free will,I will believe in bigfoot. Until that time, I will believe in God.The common atheist attempt to put bigfoot and God in the same category is avoiding the issue.
1) Existence of the physical Universe
2) Existence if Life(can you imagine what it would take for pure chance to take inert materials and create life that has DESIRE to do things) cntd
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
It's worth it?Why exactly is it worth it?To live as the pinnacle of evolution (glorified luckily mutated monkey) for a mere 70-80 years free from God, your own Soul, free will, an eternal afterlife and no judgment?You have shed your childish beliefs in mainstream religion and now you are boldly facing the world alone armed with your respect for physical evidence and reasoned logic?How great a feeling it must be to shed all the chains you had holding you back and helping others break thru.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
By freeing my mind from superstitiuos beliefs, I am able to embrace the beauty and complexity of life, persue knowledge without discouragement, I do not fear death and judgment, I take responsibility for my own actions, both good and bad, without blaming devils for tempting me of gods for helping me, and I do not pass moral judgement on people who happen to have been born of a different ethnicity or sexual orientation. Freedom from such superstition is a good thing!
freetaught 2 years ago
I agree one should not believe in superstitious beliefs. God is not a superstitious belief. Embracing the beauty and complexity of life does not depend on rejecting God or your own Soul. Believing in God is the most demanding thing I have ever done. He said "Be ye perfect" and he means exactly that and God does not work in half measures. Believing in God is definitely not a discouragement to pursuing knowledge. That is a lie propagated by Richard Dawkins and the amazingatheist (cnt'd)
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
who likes to pretend jackoff in front of his camera and talk about penises on his head. As a believer, I also have no fear of death or judgment. I also take full responsibility for my actions, good and bad. I do not blame devils for my actions. I am the judge of no man. I have a right and a responsibility to speak out against views that I deem as harmful to man. You have a right to espouse that man is a glorified monkey and we only have this life and God is dead or never existed. (cnt'd)
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
I would fight for your right to put forward your views and I do not judge you or anyone but I will also put forward counter views that offer hope and comfort to man. My views are not based on blind faith. There is much evidence to believe in your own Soul and a God. If you choose to reject it, then that is your right to do so. If you believe in physicalism and most atheist do whether they have even thought about it, also have given up on true free will of man.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
You as a Christian may indeed support these views also, but you do so in opposition of 2,000 years of Christian tradition.
There is no evidence that you have presented for the soul.
You have mis-represented evolutionary theory, and passive-agressivley dismissed it with your characterizarion.
Also, the theory of Evolution and Atheism have nothing to do with one another, as many Christians accept the theory, and many atheists either do not, or do not know enough about it.
freetaught 2 years ago
Ok fair enough. The issue is not about Christianity or evolution but is squarely about the question of whether there is a God or even if one has a Soul.
Do you believe that man has true free will?
As an FYI, I am leaving the house for the next couple hours.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
Back, just curious, when you write "You as a Christian may indeed support these views also, but you do so in opposition of 2,000 years of Christian tradition.", I simply do not follow you.
What specific views are you referring to?
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
From a Christian: good video. I went through a similar experience but I met someone who had answers to all of my questions. This is odd though, why does it matter that anyone is honest? Truly, in Atheism it doesn't. Whether you are bound by chains or free from all burdens under Atheism it doesn't ultimately matter.
OblivionMon 2 years ago
Atheism isn't a system of belief, so a statement such as yours doesn't hold water. An atheist is a person who doesn't believe in gods.
So what you say is true "Atheism doesn't matter"--it is not a system of organized belief, thus it has no heirarchical structure of leadership, rules, or doctrine. Being an "atheist "is like being a "dog owner". The term needs nothing further acribed than what it is.
However, it is always a good thing,in my opinion, to seek the truth and accept reality.
freetaught 2 years ago
"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth."so he made a spiritual sanctuary to house those who were just and righteous. Since heaven is spiritually attributed we can assume it is outside of the time/space continuim so god the creator of heaven and earth must be eternal.
DemeterEuropa 2 years ago
I understand the biblical view, but why do you believe that the biblical view is true?
Why not believe in any of the other world's bibles?
freetaught 2 years ago
Your feelings of fear, pain, joy are all linked with god. I will never believe i evolved from a ape who has no concept of right & wrong.
DemeterEuropa 2 years ago
We are classified as members of the great apre family. Higher order mammals have much more complex social structures and emotional develpoment.
Apes (that are non-human) also experience, joy, fear, and pain), just because their brains aren't as advanced doesn't undermine evolution. We can see evolution also on a micro level as your own parents passed on many genetic traits to you.
freetaught 2 years ago
it takes an extremely ignorent person to look at human anatomy as not being designed. Take a single atom for instance the way in which everything works in harmony with each other. We were designed by a designer.Another thought thats springs to mind is, how is it that in every four corners of the globe the concept of god was conjured up, it because we as humans are spiritual by nature and have a connection with god that cannot be denied.
DemeterEuropa 2 years ago
Actually, you are presupposing that there is a designer based on complexity, this is false reasoning, example:
I find a watch, it is complex therefore it must have a designer.
I find a person, this is 1000's times more complex than a watch, therefore it too must have a designer.
I find god, who is infinitly more complex, so god must also have a more complex designer.
freetaught 2 years ago
This is the ad populum argument, which means that because most people believe something, that it must be true.This is an example of false reasoning.
freetaught 2 years ago
There was a time when most of the world's poplulation believed that the world was flat--they were wrong.
There have been some 10,000 different gods that have been believed historically; each god myth had its own stories and moral imperatives. Human beings create gods.
freetaught 2 years ago
Many of these conceptions of god or gods predate yours by thousands of years, and these people believed that they had just as close a relationship with their gods as you claim to have. How fortunate for you that the god of the geographic region and time period that you live in just happens to be the true god myth!
freetaught 2 years ago
I personally belive god exists outside of time, and that the way our brains were created we can't no matter how much we dwell on the matter comprehend outside side of this, because everything we do evolves around time.
Metaphorically speaking you could think of it like an egg, we have the yoke which is the physical world, the white part which is space/time and the shell which is god/ the heavens.
DemeterEuropa 2 years ago
You believe that but based on what?
freetaught 2 years ago
Regarding,"I find god, who is infinitly more complex, so god must also have a more complex designer."
I often hear this argument from atheists that God must have a more complex creator so therefore God must not exist. The Universe and ourselves exists. That is fact. Atheist will claim that the Universe has always existed and avoid talking about its creation it is intellectual trickery to use that same argument against theists who can not answer the origin of God.
LoneStar1776 2 years ago
Hopefully, you have helped anonymous and anyone else struggling to be honest with themselves. Thank you for sharing.
drumminjim22 3 years ago
Thanks for sharing this story
g206029 3 years ago
I agree with you.
mildpace 3 years ago
The fact that people have the capability of turning away from Christianity, should be an indication enough that It can't possibly be absolutely true. Sure they may say that people turn away because we humans are infalible and not perfect, but I think that is a cop out.
TheAgnosticAspie 3 years ago
Great video!!
farvision 3 years ago
Honest, intelligent, articulate. 5/5
grandpaegg 3 years ago
Wow! My experience was similar except I REALLY didn't want god to be fake. My de-conversion after 16 years of catholicism took about 20 years of spiritual searching, i.e. other christian churches, buddhism, deepak choprah, etc. The more I studied various religions the more I realized they were myths. After years of searching it just finally hit me, I DON'T BELIEVE IN god! I hope other struggling believers see this video, it really explains the thought process of de-conversion well. Thanks!
djangothecat 3 years ago
Hello Djangothecat,
So you get disappointed with the religions and blame God? Since you have discovered that religions are all made up by man, then it seem hardly fair you blame God. Suggestion, now that you have found out that there are lots of people trying to speak in the instead of God (religions made up by humans), why don't you go straight to God Himself and ask for true direction? I suggest this because it is impossible that there is no meaning for this life.
Charlesmof
charlesmof 3 years ago
I think you missed my point. I can't blame god. I don't believe in such a being. When I said that religions were invented by men, I meant the entire concept of a supreme being was invented. I put things like fairies, leprechauns, demons, ghosts, the tooth fairy and god in the same category. I don't believe things without evidence so I will never believe in a god because there will never be any evidence for such a being. Never! Feelings are not proof and wishing won't make it so.
djangothecat 3 years ago
Great message. I went through the same process of dying to beliefs in religious doctrine and being reborn mentally.
Thanks so much for this video!
charismatickj 3 years ago
Great advice, well said. Kudos!
Doubter5 3 years ago
This really is a great message, one I really can relate to.
thequestionmarkofGod 3 years ago